Sign in to follow this  
Jules

Russia Helping Bernie?

Recommended Posts

Bernie Sanders briefed by U.S. officials that Russia is trying to help his presidential campaign

Feb. 21, 2020 at 4:16 p.m. EST

U.S. officials have told Sen. Bernie Sanders that Russia is attempting to help his presidential campaign as part of an effort to interfere with the Democratic contest, according to people familiar with the matter.

President Trump and lawmakers on Capitol Hill also have been informed about the Russian assistance to the Vermont senator, those people said, speaking on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive intelligence.

It is not clear what form that Russian assistance has taken. U.S. prosecutors found a Russian effort in 2016 to use social media to boost Sanders’s campaign against Hillary Clinton, part of a broader effort to hurt Clinton, sow dissension in the American electorate and ultimately help elect Donald Trump.

“I don’t care, frankly, who Putin wants to be president,” Sanders said in a statement. “My message to Putin is clear: Stay out of American elections, and as president I will make sure that you do."

No doubt Trump will speak out and tell Putin the same thing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's an old playbook but probably just as effective as the Ukraine ploy.

This is like a Dr Phibes plot.

Will Pete suddenly have cottaging scandal crawl out of the closet?

Warren a Harvard funds misappropriation investigation?

Like this wasn't predictable.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Putin figures Trump has the best odds to win, over a socialist, so of course he is supporting Bernie....

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The interesting question is why did this news break on the eve of  the Nevada  caucus?  Sanders was briefed about it a month ago.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, The Joker said:

The interesting question is why did this news break on the eve of  the Nevada  caucus?  Sanders was briefed about it a month ago.  

Maybe this had something to do with it? DNI was replaced and of course now its Bernie thats getting the help.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My take is they figure Trump will beat Sanders. Like last time, they clearly want Trump in office. He is single handedly dismantling our Intelligence apparatus.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, benwynn said:

My take is they figure Trump will beat Sanders. Like last time, they clearly want Trump in office. He is single handedly dismantling our Intelligence apparatus.

I'm thinking just the opposite, based on the numbers of enthusiastic supporters showing up at Bernie rallies.  Putin may fear Bernie will win so why not create a scandal?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Jules said:

I'm thinking just the opposite, based on the numbers of enthusiastic supporters showing up at Bernie rallies.  Putin may fear Bernie will win so why not create a scandal?

While Bernie's supporters are very enthusiastic, and will surely show up to vote for him, and I will show up to vote for him because he isn't Trump, I don't think he will inspire the more moderate democrats to be as enthusiastic.  Bernie also provides the most material, by claiming to be a democratic SOCIALIST, to be mislabeled as wanting to turn the USA into Cuba, Venezuela or worse, when all he really wants to do is make health care and education available and provide a more equitable compensation rate for American workers, you know, a better USA.  Trump will be successful in scaring the crap out of moderate Democrats though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bernie may be the easiest target. Putin's crew will come up with all sorts of stories and memes for the tools to parrot on FB and forums, including those right here reading this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Joker said:

The interesting question is why did this news break on the eve of  the Nevada  caucus?  Sanders was briefed about it a month ago.  

Perhaps because it was a classified briefing? The leak apparently didn’t come from Bernie. He may be a lot of things, but a GOP style dirty trickster isn’t one of them. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, bridhb said:

While Bernie's supporters are very enthusiastic, and will surely show up to vote for him, and I will show up to vote for him because he isn't Trump, I don't think he will inspire the more moderate democrats to be as enthusiastic.  

So-called moderate dems (actually neoliberal corporatists) have a habit of abandoning any even halfway progressive candidates . . 

Dukakis, Mondale, and etc. 

But they insist that progressives support THEIR candidates. HRC, WJC, etc

Bernie is no more scary than FDR, and has FDR-like issue positions. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, benwynn said:

My take is they figure Trump will beat Sanders. Like last time, they clearly want Trump in office. He is single handedly dismantling our Intelligence apparatus.

My take is that they know Bernie will destroy our economy. (That Bernie is their ideological cousin may play into it too)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Dog said:

My take is that they know Bernie will destroy our economy. (That Bernie is their ideological cousin may play into it too)

The Russian economy is great for Putin (said by Bill Browder to be the richest man in the world) and the oligarchs at the expense of the economic benefit of the country and its lower income people.  Trump modeled his tax cut for the 1% on that.  Remember his Mara Lago crowd speech where he proclaimed he just made everyone there a lot richer?  How much Trump increased the deficit in a time of a "great" economy?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
48 minutes ago, benwynn said:

Bernie may be the easiest target. Putin's crew will come up with all sorts of stories and memes for the tools to parrot on FB and forums, including those right here reading this.

Putin's trolls know well how to get Americans up in a spin.  One group will portray themselves as supporters of one side and another will take the opposite side.  Then they will spin us up until we hate each other.  Look at how successful they have been thus far.  They plant, then sow, the seeds of discord then sit back and enjoy the show.  And we rarely disappoint them.

Whatever they could do with Bernie they can do with any other candidate.  Pete is gay.  Liz is an out-of-touch elite.  Joe is losing it.  Amy is a whiny bitch.  Mike is a rich prick.  It doesn't matter who ends up going against Trump, they are going to attack.  Trump is their guy and they will do everything in their power to make sure he wins in 2020.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Dog said:

My take is that they know Bernie will destroy our economy. (That Bernie is their ideological cousin may play into it too)

:lol: If you actually want spending reined in, thats what’ll happen under a President Sanders, because you’ll be back on the Fiscal Responsibility Express.

but what Russia really likes about Bernie us hatefuln divisive dumbass clowns spewing shit like “destroy our economy”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Mismoyled Jiblet. said:
35 minutes ago, Dog said:

My take is that they know Bernie will destroy our economy. (That Bernie is their ideological cousin may play into it too)



Dog is one stupid motherfucker.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, Dog said:

My take is that they know Bernie will destroy our economy. (That Bernie is their ideological cousin may play into it too)

Yeah! Bernie's socialisitical plans will make the deficit SKYROCKET!!

oh wait....

- DSK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Ishmael said:

Dog is one stupid motherfucker.

He's working for the man, the RICH man that is.  Them rich types is scared shitless what Bernie will do to their tax windfall.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's quite obvious that the Russians are "helping" Bernie to help Trump win re-election.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Mrleft8 said:

It's quite obvious that the Russians are "helping" Bernie to help Trump win re-election.

I remember polls in 2016 showing Bernie trouncing Trump by something like 15 points.  Hell, Bernie might win back some of the voters who jumped over to Trump when Hillary got the DNC nod.

I fully expect if the DNC fucks with the primaries like they did last time (and signs indicate they already are), many of the new recruits Bernie has brought in will sit out the general election.  It's a perfect recipe for Trump to win again.  They have to let the voters decide.  If they don't, in the words of someone far more educated about these things than I, "It will be decades before the Democratic Party recovers." 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Jules said:

I'm thinking just the opposite, based on the numbers of enthusiastic supporters showing up at Bernie rallies.  Putin may fear Bernie will win so why not create a scandal?

They would prefer Bernie over Biden, who was VP during our efforts to foment color revolutions within the Russian sphere. He even dispatched his own son to the Ukraine. Bernie shows no signs of being interested in mucking around with empire building. The Russians know Trump is a useful idiot but the Russians know that idiots are problematic bedfellows. The hatred Trump spawns in people is being linked to Russia, making them sort of a Boogie Man in the collective American mind.  

  I'm confident the Russian were aware of the perils, for them, to be active in US politics. It's highly likely the combination of losing the Ukraine and having to fight for a warm water port along with the need to keep us out of the Levant so they could stabilize the place made them feel compelled to accept the risk and downsides. Our policy in the Levant had become utterly incoherent so I don't particularly blame them for that. They share borders close to that nut-house and have a large Muslim population.  

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, Mark K said:

Bernie shows no signs of being interested in mucking around with empire building.

He's shown pretty active disinterest for a long time, something I've admired about him for a long time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The main problem with most people analyzing Russia's behavior is in thinking they are focused on the US and not their own local interests. Putin knows Russia is damn near an oil well with a flag, an economy the size of Canada, and few seem to be capable of viewing how our actions in turning nations in their economic sphere against them is, to them, a massive threat. Jumpin' Jesus on a pogo stick, the Ukraine is Russia's bread basket! The site of one of their most proud battles in WW2 was Sevastopol. Taking that away from Russia would be on a par with taking the Alamo away from Texas...if the Alamo had been worth anything.  Since that is not the case it's much much more.     

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, Mark K said:

I'm confident the Russian were aware of the perils, for them, to be active in US politics.

I believe Putin's interest in meddling in the 2016 election was to prevent Hillary from winning.  She came very close to getting him ousted in 2011. 

Some cybersecurity experts said the DNC hack was due to Putin's hatred for Hillary.  From everything I have read since Hillary's 2011 criticism of Putin's reelection then, it seems those cybersecurity experts were right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Jules said:

I believe Putin's interest in meddling in the 2016 election was to prevent Hillary from winning.  She came very close to getting him ousted in 2011. 

Some cybersecurity experts said the DNC hack was due to Putin's hatred for Hillary.  From everything I have read since Hillary's 2011 criticism of Putin's reelection then, it seems those cybersecurity experts were right.

Hatred is just fear with a mask on, but in this I'm not seeing the mask.  Just fear.  The neocons are terrifying because they are shocked, simply shocked, when Russia doesn't enthusiastically embrace the vision of Russia that the neocons have concocted for it: Just another 2nd-rate nation.  

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Dog said:

 they know Bernie will destroy our economy

that's just homogenized bullshit, turd burglar. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, The Joker said:

The interesting question is why did this news break on the eve of  the Nevada  caucus?  Sanders was briefed about it a month ago.  

Russia, are you listening?

Patience Tovarisch, your handlers gave you the troll question, they will provide you with the troll answer at the appropriate time......

Kerching kerching....

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Dog said:

My take is that they know Bernie will destroy our economy. (That Bernie is their ideological cousin may play into it too)

My take is that Russia knows Bernie will stand up to them..... Anything to keep lapdog Trump in play and keep running up the US deficit towards bankruptcy.

Russia is a corrupt Dictatorship disguised as a Socialist Republic. USA is about to become a corrupt Dictatorship disguised as a Capitalist Democracy for fear of becoming a (true) Socialist Republic....... Keep spreading the disinformation and fear Comrade Dog.....

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, Mark K said:

Hatred is just fear with a mask on, but in this I'm not seeing the mask.  Just fear.  The neocons are terrifying because they are shocked, simply shocked, when Russia doesn't enthusiastically embrace the vision of Russia that the neocons have concocted for it: Just another 2nd-rate nation.

I see Putin as doing the job he was hired to do, doing it quite well actually. What I've read, he's rather popular internally. All that said and agreed to, Russia is another 2nd-rate nation, maybe 3rd rate. He's a strong man presenting a muscular image but governing something of a Potemkin village. Russia's per capita GDP is $25,763, 57th and they are 77th in inequality.

As for Hillary, I've never bought your view of her as a NeoCon. Much of what she did was responding to events.

Putin comes to power in roughly 1999. W looks deeply into his eyes and gets used like a wet rag despite Condi Rice being a Russia specialist. Obama gets inaugurated in 2009 and Hillary gets confirmed as Secretary of State. She's there for 4 years. There was the Russian reset after W's naïveté turned disastrous handling of the relationship.

After that it was responding to events. Hillary didn't foment the Libyan civil war and she didn't foment the Ukrainian revolution which didn't even happen when she was Secretary of State.

Hillary's not a neocon. Susan Rice is not a neocon. Nuland is married to one. Big whoop. Susan Rice's son is the president of the Stanford Republican club.

i need a better def'n of what a neocon is and better evidence that Hillary is that. I just think of her as a hawk. Anyways, we've been over this territory before.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Mark K said:

The site of one of their most proud battles in WW2 was Sevastopol.

Russia was never ever ever ever going to lose control of Sevastopol without a war - the shooting hot kind.  I think you are absolutely correct.

I am somewhat curious about 'tactically' what is different between Russians supporting Bernie and Republicans bashing Democrats.   What are the Russians actually doing differently that they couldn't achieve simply with with soft money donations?  And how could those donations change the race compared to the money Bloomberg is already putting in?  Why put their finger prints anything at this particular moment?  That seems very sloppy from Mr. Putin.  Very sloppy indeed.  Unless the point was to just stay in the conversation for some reason. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, Olsonist said:

I see Putin as doing the job he was hired to do, doing it quite well actually. What I've read, he's rather popular internally. All that said and agreed to, Russia is another 2nd-rate nation, maybe 3rd rate. He's a strong man presenting a muscular image but governing something of a Potemkin village. Russia's per capita GDP is $25,763, 57th and they are 77th in inequality.

As for Hillary, I've never bought your view of her as a NeoCon. Much of what she did was responding to events.

Putin comes to power in roughly 1999. W looks deeply into his eyes and gets used like a wet rag despite Condi Rice being a Russia specialist. Obama gets inaugurated in 2009 and Hillary gets confirmed as Secretary of State. She's there for 4 years. There was the Russian reset after W's naïveté turned disastrous handling of the relationship.

After that it was responding to events. Hillary didn't foment the Libyan civil war and she didn't foment the Ukrainian revolution which didn't even happen when she was Secretary of State.

Hillary's not a neocon. Susan Rice is not a neocon. Nuland is married to one. Big whoop. Susan Rice's son is the president of the Stanford Republican club.

i need a better def'n of what a neocon is and better evidence that Hillary is that. I just think of her as a hawk. Anyways, we've been over this territory before.

We were actively working to foment color revolution in Ukraine. Nuland was in charge of that project and working under Hillary's control.  

  Neocons are defined by their actions and views, not by party affiliation. Hillary was McCain's favorite Democrat for a reason. They saw eye to eye on the US's role in the world. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, cmilliken said:

Russia was never ever ever ever going to lose control of Sevastopol without a war - the shooting hot kind.  I think you are absolutely correct.

I am somewhat curious about 'tactically' what is different between Russians supporting Bernie and Republicans bashing Democrats.   What are they actually doing differently that they couldn't achieve simply with with soft money donations?  And how could those donations change the race compared to the money Bloomberg is already putting in?  Why put their finger prints anything at this particular moment?  That seems very sloppy from Mr. Putin.  Very sloppy indeed.

 

 

They are using social media which is apparently a very powerful persuader of the opinion of  those who dwell there.  Most of us here are not totally involved or addicted to social media, or meme culture.  But I heard a woman on NPR talking about this yesterday, on my afternoon commute, and it is an extremely powerful tool, when used the way the Russians did in 2016, and no doubt are using the same tactics now.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, cmilliken said:

Russia was never ever ever ever going to lose control of Sevastopol without a war - the shooting hot kind.  I think you are absolutely correct.

I am somewhat curious about 'tactically' what is different between Russians supporting Bernie and Republicans bashing Democrats.   What are they actually doing differently that they couldn't achieve simply with with soft money donations?  And how could those donations change the race compared to the money Bloomberg is already putting in?  Why put their finger prints anything at this particular moment?  That seems very sloppy from Mr. Putin.  Very sloppy indeed.

 

Soft money, if truly soft, can be used for anything, even for bashing Russia, and the Russians aren't rich enough to just toss Saudi level wads around.  Trolls can be directed and guided,  and guided by their corps of truly outstanding propagandists.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, billy backstay said:

 

They are using social media which is apparently a very powerful persuader of the opinion of  those who dwell there.  Most of us here are not totally involved or addicted to social media, or meme culture.  But I heard a woman on NPR talking about this yesterday, on my afternoon commute, and it is an extremely powerful tool, when used the way the Russians did in 2016, and no doubt are using the same tactics now.....

Democrats and Republicans aren't using social media?  They just look at what happened in 2016 and said 'darn it batman, we'll get em next time??'  This incredibly powerful tool that can swing elections.. shame we can't use it...  Or that Dems/Republicans don't lie and mislead in political ads?

The biggest identified threat in 2016 was 'suppression of the black vote'.  That might help "I've fallen to 4th and can't get up" Joe Biden but how does that help Bernie against Bloomberg or any of the candidates that are actually - you know - threatening him?

7 minutes ago, Mark K said:

Soft money, if truly soft, can be used for anything, even for bashing Russia, and the Russians aren't rich enough to just toss Saudi level wads around.  Trolls can be directed and guided,  and guided by their corps of truly outstanding propagandists.  

Right.. so Troll are being directed.  But how - and more importantly why -  do you need to help Bernie in a way that isn't already the focus of lots and lots of money and effort from other forces in the race?  Practice?  That's all I can come up with and false flags.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, cmilliken said:

Right.. so Troll are being directed.  But how - and more importantly why -  do you need to help Bernie in a way that isn't already the focus of lots and lots of money and effort from other forces in the race?  Practice?

 

I thought I already posted this, but some believe that Putin believes that Bernie, the Socialist, has the least chance of beating Trump, compared to the other candidates, on offer. So, they are supporting Bernie to help Trump win again, and continue to disrupt our faith in our "fair" NOT, election system, and government overall.  I for one, would seriously consider moving to Canada, or somewhere, except for being tied down, by children here in the US and rental properties, that I need to personally manage.  If I can sell them in tax free exchanges and convert to dividend paying REIT's, I may very well consider getting the fuck out of here, for Europe, Central or South America, or ??  Unless the next election brings some sanity back to America..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, billy backstay said:

I thought I already posted this, but some believe that Putin believes that Bernie, the Socialist, has the least chance of beating Trump, compared to the other candidates, on offer. So, they are supporting Bernie to help Trump win again, and continue to disrupt our faith in our "fair" NOT, election system, and government overall.

I'm taking your thesis at face value.  That the Russians do want Bernie to win.

What I'm wondering is why they would feel the need to get involved now?   BERNIE IS WINNING.  He's leading in the polls, and opening up double digits in some of the recent ones.  The 'moderate lane' is a clusterfuck between Bloomberg/Klobuchar/Biden/Buttigeig and Warren got a whopping 1% bump from punking Bloomberg.  Being caught 'helping Bernie' might sew some general distrust in election security but getting caught it's ABSOLUTELY not going to help Bernie win.  People will, predictably, run AWAY from Bernie which they (the Russians) supposedly want.

Russians aren't stupid.  They're good enough at US electoral politics that they apparently helped an absolute long shot thread an incredible series of unlikely events and win the presidency.  But they ham-hand this?  To support a guy who's actually starting to run away from the field?   I don't get that logic.  The risk dramatically outweighs any benefits.  Maybe they're not that smart after all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Mark K said:

We were actively working to foment color revolution in Ukraine. Nuland was in charge of that project and working under Hillary's control.  

  Neocons are defined by their actions and views, not by party affiliation. Hillary was McCain's favorite Democrat for a reason. They saw eye to eye on the US's role in the world. 

We have a long history with Ukraine, going back to buying their nukes. Was H a NeoCon for that?

Anyways, we disagree on definitions. I see NeoCons not as defined by their stated views but rather as defined politically, as a faction of the Republican coalition. Moreover, as time war on, they became defined by their foreign associations, Israel and KSA. I saw Hillary as a hawk but not a NeoCon. Consequent to that, Netanyahu and the princes didn't like her because they couldn't manipulate her the way they could the NeoCons.

Riddle me this. If Hillary is the arch NeoCon you say she is then why do Republicans (and our elk) hate her so? Neoconism was the dominant view for 8 years in the previous administration.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, AJ Oliver said:

So-called moderate dems (actually neoliberal corporatists) have a habit of abandoning any even halfway progressive candidates . . 

Dukakis, Mondale, and etc. 

But they insist that progressives support THEIR candidates. HRC, WJC, etc

Bernie is no more scary than FDR, and has FDR-like issue positions. 

Lots of Americans regard FDR as one of histories greatest villains.

The ignorance is STRONG on that stuff.

My own great aunt was one of them - wife of a banker living in Carmel talking about how FDR destroyed the American way.

Ideology is always more important than actual results.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Olsonist said:

We have a long history with Ukraine, going back to buying their nukes. Was H a NeoCon for that?

Anyways, we disagree on definitions. I see NeoCons not as defined by their stated views but rather as defined politically, as a faction of the Republican coalition. Moreover, as time war on, they became defined by their foreign associations, Israel and KSA. I saw Hillary as a hawk but not a NeoCon. Consequent to that, Netanyahu and the princes didn't like her because they couldn't manipulate her the way they could the NeoCons.

Riddle me this. If Hillary is the arch NeoCon you say she is then why do Republicans (and our elk) hate her so? Neoconism was the dominant view for 8 years in the previous administration.

 

It's not "ham handed" at all.  They are all in for Bernie, because Trump has the best chance of beating him, over the others...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Gouvernail said:

 

That will scare the pant's off latte libs . Martin Luther King is comfortably dead.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, atyourcervix said:

dearpoliticalofficerbernard-1287051.jpg

 

b5jzuwhhlhi41.jpg

Openly. Hey..I think that's my son :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, atyourcervix said:

Great.  Cunty McCuntface breeds.

Scary innit? :D 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, billy backstay said:

It's not "ham handed" at all.  They are all in for Bernie, because Trump has the best chance of beating him, over the others...

I can't figure out their calculus but you might be right. In any case, I see Bernie, Warren, Buttigieg, Klobuchar and Biden as patriots. I see Shitstain as a treasoner.

I supported Bernie in 2016 in the primary because he was a progressive liberal as am I. I supported Hillary in the general because she was a patriot who worked her ass off. I'd rather a patriotic centrist who worked her ass off over a Manchurian candidate who would sell out his country for a fuck. Republicans have no excuses for supporting that piece of shit. It showed and shows their character.

I can support pretty much any of the Democratic candidates. I'm torn between Bernie and Warren. But I can vote for Buttigieg, Klobuchar or Biden.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This thread is direct proof that Putin is winning.  How many here trust anyone?  Dog must be ecstatic.  Bonus time?

I’d think Trump backers would be upset that Putin would back Sanders, unless they have been informed this is a feint, which seems to be the case.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, benwynn said:

Bernie may be the easiest target. Putin's crew will come up with all sorts of stories and memes for the tools to parrot on FB and forums, including those right here reading this.

 

8 hours ago, Dog said:

My take is that they know Bernie will destroy our economy. (That Bernie is their ideological cousin may play into it too)

See?

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54 minutes ago, atyourcervix said:

dearpoliticalofficerbernard-1287051.jpg

 

b5jzuwhhlhi41.jpg

Did I fucking call this in post #10 or what?

You are all welcome.  

Edited to add:  atyourlabiaminora, make sure and downvote this.  We all know you are a cunt, but a reminder never hurts.

  • Like 3
  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, benwynn said:

Did I fucking call this in post #10 or what?

You are all welcome.  

Edited to add:  atyourlabiaminora, make sure and downvote this.  We all know you are a cunt, but a reminder never hurts.

'cept Russia/Putin hasnt done shit to interfere with Bernie's campaign.  Please cite the actual source of the information. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, atyourcervix said:

'cept Russia/Putin hasnt done shit to interfere with Bernie's campaign.  Please cite the actual source of the information. 

Oh, sweet Jesus!  That’s just piling on!

:lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, atyourcervix said:

'cept Russia/Putin hasnt done shit to interfere with Bernie's campaign.  Please cite the actual source of the information. 

Please kiss my rosy red ass.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Amati said:

Oh, sweet Jesus!  That’s just piling on!

:lol:

When it comes to idiots, he likes to take to the next level.  It's an art form to him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If there's any report that Russia may want Bernie to win it allows trump to negate that result.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, cmilliken said:

Democrats and Republicans aren't using social media?  They just look at what happened in 2016 and said 'darn it batman, we'll get em next time??'  This incredibly powerful tool that can swing elections.. shame we can't use it...  Or that Dems/Republicans don't lie and mislead in political ads?

The biggest identified threat in 2016 was 'suppression of the black vote'.  That might help "I've fallen to 4th and can't get up" Joe Biden but how does that help Bernie against Bloomberg or any of the candidates that are actually - you know - threatening him?

Right.. so Troll are being directed.  But how - and more importantly why -  do you need to help Bernie in a way that isn't already the focus of lots and lots of money and effort from other forces in the race?  Practice?  That's all I can come up with and false flags.

I'm only saying that it's plausible the Russians could want to see Bernie be the nominee, but I'm not convinced they are doing that or am sure of how they are doing it. For some reason this leak of intell doesn't contain details. I am curious why it does not as well. What op could the Russian be doing which reporting it reveals sources and methods? Moreover, not revealing it comes close to abetting it.  

   "Need" is not required, "want" is sufficient. As in Trump not needing to raw-dog a porn star or fill his pockets with money from his charity fund.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Olsonist said:

We have a long history with Ukraine, going back to buying their nukes. Was H a NeoCon for that?

Anyways, we disagree on definitions. I see NeoCons not as defined by their stated views but rather as defined politically, as a faction of the Republican coalition. Moreover, as time war on, they became defined by their foreign associations, Israel and KSA. I saw Hillary as a hawk but not a NeoCon. Consequent to that, Netanyahu and the princes didn't like her because they couldn't manipulate her the way they could the NeoCons.

Riddle me this. If Hillary is the arch NeoCon you say she is then why do Republicans (and our elk) hate her so? Neoconism was the dominant view for 8 years in the previous administration.

Can't conflate Republican with neo-con. That was all but true during the Reign of Bush's Deciderer but not now. Now you can see Max Boot as a regular contributor to MSNBC slamming Trump, who the neo-cons absolutely despise. Max fucking Boot, who to this day thinks invading Iraq was entirely justified and the right thing to do. 

 Many of the neo-cons are also Zio-cons, but not all. It's key to getting support from our Evangelicals so most of those have an R behind their names. The borders are a big fuzzy. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, benwynn said:

 

See?

 

If Putin's purpose is disruption, and it is, he will intervene on behalf of the most disruptive candidate. In 2020 that's Bernie, in 2016 it was Trump.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, benwynn said:

Did I fucking call this in post #10 or what?

You are all welcome.  

Edited to add:  atyourlabiaminora, make sure and downvote this.  We all know you are a cunt, but a reminder never hurts.

Young Australians supporting Bernie is real though.

They've grown up in a global world.

It's been going on ever since Clinton/Bernie and even before. My nephew  worked in Obamas Campaign office in the states.I don't know how he swung that but.. He's a young Lawyer with connections :rolleyes:

 

From all over Australia, a small and young volunteer army of Bernie supporters are sending thousands of texts a day to the American public, urging them to back Senator Sanders in the Democratic Party primaries.

The primaries being held around the country from now until July will decide who goes up against President Trump in the November presidential election.

With only a few days before the first one in Iowa, Sanders has hit the front, or is at least running neck-and-neck with Joe Biden.

https://www.abc.net.au/triplej/programs/hack/young-australians-are-texting-americans-to-vote-bernie/11915404

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Dog said:

If Putin's purpose is disruption, and it is, he will intervene on behalf of the most disruptive candidate. In 2020 that's Bernie, in 2016 it was Trump.

I think Putin's purpose is to get someone elected who has no clue as to what the fuck he is doing. 

We learned this week that the DNI was canned for revealing the truth.  I can't think of anything Bernie could offer Putin that even cones fucking close.  Putin is KGB. This is his gravy train. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, Dog said:

If Putin's purpose is disruption, and it is, he will intervene on behalf of the most disruptive candidate. In 2020 that's Bernie, in 2016 it was Trump.

You are thinking checkers while Putin is playing chess.  Trump? Sure as he is putty in Putin's hands but the idea of disruption is to sow discord as much as possible - so they post pro and negative stuff on just about everything.  Black lives matter. Blue lives matter, the purpose being to keep everyone riled up and hating each other.

In 2016 it was win/win for Putin - Trump wins and it's off to the races, Hillary wins? They run with rigged election, illegals voting and all the other Hate Hillary topics that were working. Turn the populace against her, nothing gets done and she is a 1 term potus.

Wait!!! Hold the presses!!!! Are you saying there might be some truth to Russian intervention in the US elections? Shit, next up climate change may be real.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, Mark K said:
4 hours ago, Olsonist said:

We have a long history with Ukraine, going back to buying their nukes. Was H a NeoCon for that?

Anyways, we disagree on definitions. I see NeoCons not as defined by their stated views but rather as defined politically, as a faction of the Republican coalition. Moreover, as time war on, they became defined by their foreign associations, Israel and KSA. I saw Hillary as a hawk but not a NeoCon. Consequent to that, Netanyahu and the princes didn't like her because they couldn't manipulate her the way they could the NeoCons.

Riddle me this. If Hillary is the arch NeoCon you say she is then why do Republicans (and our elk) hate her so? Neoconism was the dominant view for 8 years in the previous administration.

Can't conflate Republican with neo-con. That was all but true during the Reign of Bush's Deciderer but not now. Now you can see Max Boot as a regular contributor to MSNBC slamming Trump, who the neo-cons absolutely despise. Max fucking Boot, who to this day thinks invading Iraq was entirely justified and the right thing to do. 

 Many of the neo-cons are also Zio-cons, but not all. It's key to getting support from our Evangelicals so most of those have an R behind their names. The borders are a big fuzzy. 

I enjoy watching you two and the "depends on what the definition of neocon is" thing but I have a question.

For a Russian who wants a warm water port and likes to eat, what's the practical difference between a neocon and a hawk?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Shortforbob said:

Young Australians supporting Bernie is real though.

They've grown up in a global world.

It's been going on ever since Clinton/Bernie and even before. My nephew  worked in Obamas Campaign office in the states.I don't know how he swung that but.. He's a young Lawyer with connections :rolleyes:

 

From all over Australia, a small and young volunteer army of Bernie supporters are sending thousands of texts a day to the American public, urging them to back Senator Sanders in the Democratic Party primaries.

The primaries being held around the country from now until July will decide who goes up against President Trump in the November presidential election.

With only a few days before the first one in Iowa, Sanders has hit the front, or is at least running neck-and-neck with Joe Biden.

https://www.abc.net.au/triplej/programs/hack/young-australians-are-texting-americans-to-vote-bernie/11915404

Might be better if they helped out on this Australian issue...

Quaden Bayles: Bullied Australian boy leads out all-star rugby team

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-51599121

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, Plenipotentiary Tom said:

I enjoy watching you two and the "depends on what the definition of neocon is" thing but I have a question.

For a Russian who wants a warm water port and likes to eat, what's the practical difference between a neocon and a hawk?

  First off those things aren't mutually exclusive. There was a think tanker a long time ago that thought the US should pick a small country every decade or so and beat the snot out of it in order to maintain international street-cred. Luttwig or something like that. The name escapes me. That person is a hawk but not a neo-con. Neo-cons are concerned with ideology, IMO. They feel they are saving people, mostly. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Mark K said:

  First off those things aren't mutually exclusive. There was a think tanker a long time ago that thought the US should pick a small country every decade or so and beat the snot out of it in order to maintain international street-cred. Luttwig or something like that. The name escapes me. That person is a hawk but not a neo-con. Neo-cons are concerned with ideology, IMO. They feel they are saving people, mostly. 

 

I thought a Neo-con was a new age greedy criminal, but perhaps I got that mixed up with something else.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, Mark K said:

  First off those things aren't mutually exclusive. There was a think tanker a long time ago that thought the US should pick a small country every decade or so and beat the snot out of it in order to maintain international street-cred. Luttwig or something like that. The name escapes me. That person is a hawk but not a neo-con. Neo-cons are concerned with ideology, IMO. They feel they are saving people, mostly. 

 

That's a monumentally stupid idea. Sorry to see we've adopted it. I guess.

Anyway, my point was that the label wouldn't make much difference to a Russian who wants a warm water port and food.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Mark K said:

Can't conflate Republican with neo-con. That was all but true during the Reign of Bush's Deciderer but not now. Now you can see Max Boot as a regular contributor to MSNBC slamming Trump, who the neo-cons absolutely despise. Max fucking Boot, who to this day thinks invading Iraq was entirely justified and the right thing to do. 

 Many of the neo-cons are also Zio-cons, but not all. It's key to getting support from our Evangelicals so most of those have an R behind their names. The borders are a big fuzzy. 

I do conflate them. We disagree. Now, I'll admit that Shitstain has no use for them now only because he doesn't need them for any electoral purposes. But that just means they're unloved Republicans without a home. Cheney is still going to vote for Shitstain.

Christopher Hitchens also thought it was a good idea. That was a head scratcher. And yes, fellow Cal alum Max Boot never liked Shitstain and even endorsed Hillary. Not from a NeoCon POV but rather from a What The Fuck Is Wrong With These People POV:

https://foreignpolicy.com/2016/11/06/this-lifetime-gop-voter-is-with-her-why-republicans-should-vote-for-hillary-clinton/

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2016/10/30/comey-fbi-clinton-trump-scandals-lying-women-max-boot/93009718/

Zio-cons. Good word but I prefer the older term, Israel First. If you check with those Evangelicals with the Rs, you'll find they don't criticize the Sheiks much. Hence the swallowing of Iraq was behind 9/11. I think Republicans are very obedient and believe what they're told. I think NeoCons like to be the ones doing the telling.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, benwynn said:

When it comes to idiots, he likes to take to the next level.  It's an art form to him.

Dont be a dipshit and answer my question.   The post article claimed that both trump and sanders were informed of russian tampering.  WHO informed them and worse....WHO leaked to the press that they were informed?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Plenipotentiary Tom said:

For a Russian who wants a warm water port and likes to eat, what's the practical difference between a neocon and a hawk?

 I know it wasn't addressed to be but ..  To me, the difference is degree, scope, and justification.

---------------------------

A hawk wants a drone strike.  A neocon want a drone campaign.

A hawk wants a strong military.  A neocon wants a strong military AND police force.

A hawk want a 'strong homeland'.  A neocon wants a 'strong homeland so that they can shape the world into a better place'.

One is more reactive and fearful.  The other is more proactive and determined.

One is a vegetarian, the other is a vegan.

One is more conservative, the other is more authoritarian.

As Mark said, there's a 'self-righteous ideology' built into the neocon argument that's absent from a hawk.

--

I can agree to disagree with a hawk.  I understand their fears.  I have a much harder time finding common ground with a neocon. Fundamentally, I find the 'force for good' and 'force for evil' argument too subjective.  I'd rather minimize force.

To your specific question - the hawk will sell more weapons to Germany or Poland and try and arm other allies around Crimea to contain expansion.  They MIGHT have even considered selling weapons to Ukraine before the little green men landed.  The Neocons will do all of the above AND foment unrest by starting up protest groups AND supplying weapons and arms to counter insurgencies AND and and and ...Hawks and Neocons have a lot in common until they dont.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, atyourcervix said:

Dont be a dipshit and answer my question.   The post article claimed that both trump and sanders were informed of russian tampering.  WHO informed them and worse....WHO leaked to the press that they were informed?

was it a secret?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/bernie-sanders-briefed-by-us-officials-that-russia-is-trying-to-help-his-presidential-campaign/2020/02/21/5ad396a6-54bd-11ea-929a-64efa7482a77_story.html

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Dog said:

My take is that they know Bernie will destroy our economy. (That Bernie is their ideological cousin may play into it too)

Like the debt?  Like incredibly ridiculous medical costs?  Like income stratification not seen since 1920s?

Oh boy, let's see a real populist who's policies favor people.  How is your take on that?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, benwynn said:

I think Putin's purpose is to get someone elected who has no clue as to what the fuck he is doing. 

We learned this week that the DNI was canned for revealing the truth.  I can't think of anything Bernie could offer Putin that even cones fucking close.  Putin is KGB. This is his gravy train. 

I don't think Putin really believes he can get a favored candidate elected, his purpose is disruption. But if he could what would Bernie offer....

For starters an end to fracking and the curtailing of domestic energy production. This would harm our domestic gdp and raise global energy prices lifting his gdp bigly. 50% of his gdp is energy.

Perhaps a return to the Obama administration policy against the sale of arms to Putin's neighbors.

A softer line against Russian allies like Iran and less American centric foreign policy generally.

And then there is the harm Bernie's socialism would do domestically. An administration hostile to business and one that would grant all government benefits to anyone who crosses the border.

A president Bernie Sanders is Vlad Putin's wet dream.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, Gouvernail said:

 

This scares the shit out of the greedy assholes who still want more.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jules said:

This scares the shit out of the greedy assholes who still want more.

OFGS.... It's 2008 all over again. Government can't deliver what they expect, couldn't then and can't now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Dog said:

OFGS.... It's 2008 all over again. Government can't deliver what they expect, couldn't then and can't now.

FREE SHIT!!! YEET!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Dog said:
1 hour ago, Jules said:

This scares the shit out of the greedy assholes who still want more.

OFGS.... It's 2008 all over again. Government can't deliver what they expect, couldn't then and can't now.

You have a really crappy memory. 2020 is nothing at all like 2008

And why do you say "government can't deliver," are you worried about the deficit??

- DSK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

You have a really crappy memory. 2020 is nothing at all like 2008

And why do you say "government can't deliver," are you worried about the deficit??

- DSK

The rhetoric in that add is the same bullshit we heard in 2008.

It's not your fault, the man is keeping you down but candidate X will make it right. It never ends.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, Dog said:

OFGS.... It's 2008 all over again. Government can't deliver what they expect, couldn't then and can't now.

And trump delivering tax cuts to the rich and running up the deficit can?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, Dog said:

The rhetoric in that add is the same bullshit we heard in 2008.

It's not your fault, the man is keeping you down but candidate X will make it right. It never ends.

It might be "the same bullshit you heard" but it's not what was said. The problem is that you only see/hear what you want to

That, and you're a lying fascist asshole.

If you Trumpettes succeed in making King Donald, what will you do when he starts killing you followers? Continue to lie, to make excuses, and pray on your knees that you and your family isn't next on his list?

- DSK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

It might be "the same bullshit you heard" but it's not what was said. The problem is that you only see/hear what you want to

That, and you're a lying fascist asshole.

If you Trumpettes succeed in making King Donald, what will you do when he starts killing you followers? Continue to lie, to make excuses, and pray on your knees that you and your family isn't next on his list?

- DSK

If Trump wins a second term he will join the vast majority of presidents that served a second term.   It does not make him a king simply a two term president.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, The Joker said:

If Trump wins a second term he will join the vast majority of presidents that served a second term.   It does not make him a king simply a two term president.  

Trump is the only President who has, as a matter of regular practice, defied the Constitution.

He's the only President who has deliberately enacted policies to the detriment of the country, and publicly threatened his political opponents with death

He is not really the President of the USA, he's the mob boss of the ruling junta of the USA. He does not want to be President, he doesn't know or care what it means to be President.

- DSK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If Trump wins a second term, he will act like, if not outright declare himself King.  Or Mob Boss, or Dictator for life. 

We've already lost the system of checks and balances that might prevent that, both the Senate and Judicial branches have been bullied into submission. 

 

All Hail Fat King Donald! (Or Else!)

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, The Joker said:

If Trump wins a second term he will join the vast majority of presidents that served a second term.   It does not make him a king simply a two term president.  

What's this all about then?

Lying to you is he?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

Trump is the only President who has, as a matter of regular practice, defied the Constitution.

He's the only President who has deliberately enacted policies to the detriment of the country, and publicly threatened his political opponents with death

He is not really the President of the USA, he's the mob boss of the ruling junta of the USA. He does not want to be President, he doesn't know or care what it means to be President.

- DSK

And after he wins in 2020 you will have one silver lining.   You and the media can start calling him a lame duck on November 4th 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, The Joker said:

And after he wins in 2020 you will have one silver lining.   You and the media can start calling him a lame duck on November 4th 

Who do you think Trump will murder first, journalists or Democrats or "disloyal" followers like Jeff Sessions?

- DSK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites