Chris in Santa Cruz, CA

Lot Lines and Development Shenanigans - HELP!

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So we moved to the country in 1992 on a fairly busy road but still doable.

To the east of me is the point of a triangle with three parcels. Two parcels are zoned Res Ag 2 which is a single family dwelling and which historically have had working apple orchards. The third parcel which was a rectangle carved out of the larger of the two other parcels was zoned "Diversified Ag" in 1987 and a soil mixing factory was allowed to be set up. It also acts as the sawdust pile for the large redwood lumber company's saw mill up the coast so they don't have to have a "regulated" saw dust pile I guess. Anyway all three parcels were owned by the same family and until 2.5 years ago the other residents in the neighborhood had kept the enlargement of the soil factory under control by denying lot line redraw requests. The other two parcels act as an ag buffer to noisy machinery. Also the business is totally out of line with the land use plan for the area and has been a nuisance the entire time. Their trucking has to go in and out one way and they would periodically start trucks going the wrong way until we all called and complained etc. They tried to just move onto another parcel and ripped out 10 acres of apple trees and the county made them replant them etc. Constant pushing.

2.5 years ago they sold the lock stock and barrel to a canadian multi-national. Somehow without any input from neighbors they got the lot line redrawn which reduced the larger RA2 parcel to 5 acres and land locked it. The took over the paved driveway for that house and then got an easement from their other parcel and now I have a dirt driveway down my fenceline with an extended family in the large landlocked house running at a minimum 10 trips per day. So everything is filthy, I have lost the security and privacy etc. Also they are encroaching on the other parcel and letting the trees die between my house and the soil mixing factory.

What do I do? Sue the company the county of Santa Cruz for reducing my property value? The canadians just shrugged when I told them how horrific an impact their unnecessary new driveway has had on our lives. We just want to move now from the house we were going to retire in. None of the local land use attorney's want to help it seems as they don't want to rock their own boat.

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21 minutes ago, Chris in Santa Cruz, CA said:

 Somehow without any input from neighbors they got the lot line redrawn which reduced the larger RA2 parcel to 5 acres and land locked it.

How were you bale to keep them in check from the lot line revisions in the past?

And did you receive a "A Notice of Opportunity for Public Hearing or Notice of Public Hearing" regarding the lot line revision?

 

 

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49 minutes ago, Chris in Santa Cruz, CA said:

So we moved to the country in 1992 on a fairly busy road but still doable.

To the east of me is the point of a triangle with three parcels. Two parcels are zoned Res Ag 2 which is a single family dwelling and which historically have had working apple orchards. The third parcel which was a rectangle carved out of the larger of the two other parcels was zoned "Diversified Ag" in 1987 and a soil mixing factory was allowed to be set up. It also acts as the sawdust pile for the large redwood lumber company's saw mill up the coast so they don't have to have a "regulated" saw dust pile I guess. Anyway all three parcels were owned by the same family and until 2.5 years ago the other residents in the neighborhood had kept the enlargement of the soil factory under control by denying lot line redraw requests. The other two parcels act as an ag buffer to noisy machinery. Also the business is totally out of line with the land use plan for the area and has been a nuisance the entire time. Their trucking has to go in and out one way and they would periodically start trucks going the wrong way until we all called and complained etc. They tried to just move onto another parcel and ripped out 10 acres of apple trees and the county made them replant them etc. Constant pushing.

2.5 years ago they sold the lock stock and barrel to a canadian multi-national. Somehow without any input from neighbors they got the lot line redrawn which reduced the larger RA2 parcel to 5 acres and land locked it. The took over the paved driveway for that house and then got an easement from their other parcel and now I have a dirt driveway down my fenceline with an extended family in the large landlocked house running at a minimum 10 trips per day. So everything is filthy, I have lost the security and privacy etc. Also they are encroaching on the other parcel and letting the trees die between my house and the soil mixing factory.

 What do I do? Sue the company the county of Santa Cruz for reducing my property value? The canadians just shrugged when I told them how horrific an impact their unnecessary new driveway has had on our lives. We just want to move now from the house we were going to retire in. None of the local land use attorney's want to help it seems as they don't want to rock their own boat.

Post the survey of all the parcels and the zoning code.

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Are there no property easements IE: that a driveway needs to be 50 ' from a property line etc?

 Also How did they get a commercial/industrial use permit on an ag/res property?

 I'd say you need to look into the deeds, and regs with the help of the town planner, and a lawyer of your own choosing.

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Here, any zoning change requires posting the date of the hearing and publishing the plan ahead of time.  A Variance requires that plus certified letters to each adjacent neighbor notifying them of when the hearing is, what it's about and where to find the documents.  

Find it hard to understand how the land got reapportioned without a public hearing.  

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I will post stuff but not likely until tomorrow.

How they got the original zoning variance to carve out a new parcel for the soil plant is not know as it was before we got here.

Previous denials of the lot line redraw happened because requests were mailed to all local property owners and we all just checked the "No" box and mailed it back to the county.

Nothing like that happened 2.5 years ago. Definitely no hearings ever.

New road is right next to my fence.

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38 minutes ago, Innocent Bystander said:

Here, any zoning change requires posting the date of the hearing and publishing the plan ahead of time.  A Variance requires that plus certified letters to each adjacent neighbor notifying them of when the hearing is, what it's about and where to find the documents.  

Find it hard to understand how the land got reapportioned without a public hearing.  

In California it varies from county to county, but under normal circumstances, the lot line adjustment process does not require any public hearings or notifications. If there is a question with regard to the legality of the parcels involved, the existence of legal access to the site, or if the proposal requires the processing of a development variation then the lot line adjustment then goes to a variance which requires hearings.

 

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Sounds like a simple lot boundary adjustment and a parcel to parcel granting of an easement.  Neither of those is a big deal and may or may not require much in the way of a public notice.  

But LBAs don't drag zoning classifications with them.  So, unless the uses on the "adjusted" bits of property are still restricted by the residential zoning conditions.  The zone boundary runs across the parcel that grew in size and it now has split zoning.  Not an uncommon circumstance.  

Vehicular access to an industrial use is likely a a violation of the residential zoning, and cannot be granted by a simple easement, in the jurisdictions I work in.

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a lot line adjustment is not the same as a parcel split or parcel combine. To start this project, I would:

 

1) Pull all the planning documents and approvals for the parcels in question and read them;

2) Read the pertinent zoning code and regs;

3) Pull the survey and determine if there are any setback violations for the road;

4) Pull the minutes from the meeting in which they approved the 'lot line adjustment' and determine if there is an Open Meetings Act violation;

5) Pull the easement and review it for any nuggets;

6) Investigate the approving body (Board, ZBA, or Planning Commission) for any connection to the landowner or other parties in interest.

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5 minutes ago, Left Shift said:

 

Vehicular access to an industrial use is likely a a violation of the residential zoning, and cannot be granted by a simple easement, in the jurisdictions I work in.

It's most likely an Ag use

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1 minute ago, MR.CLEAN said:

It's most likely an Ag use

Mmmmm.

Manure piles maybe.  But..sawdust piles?  Probably a judgement call by the local Planning Director or similar.  But you could argue no, unless you really like Nabisco's Oatmeal cookies.

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Typically Ag zoning is quite lenient for things like soil businesses.  The sawdust may be nonconforming, and might provide the best ammo for a private nuisance claim, but only because it is not coming from logs on the property.  There may be an easement or profit recorded against the parcel in favor of the saw mill that should be reviewed.  Probably not a cheap case. 

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14 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

The sawdust may be nonconforming, and might provide the best ammo for a private nuisance claim, but only because it is not coming from logs on the property. 

The fact this has been an accepted in the past and is open and notorious negate the nuisance claim?  Serious question

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I'd just move

You don't want to look out your window and be pissed off every day for the rest of your life.

I'm a Licensed L.S. in CA.

Undoing a clusterfuck like you describe is a high stress, big expensive ordeal with a low probability of success.

Find a better place and enjoy your life.

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In britain it would be the defense of 'prescription', but not in the USA.  There is also the concept of 'coming to the nuisance' that, in some states, disqualifies an after-acquiring property owner from a nuisance claim for a use that existed when the plaintiff first purchased.  Again, not sure about Cali as I haven't had any nuisance cases in Cali.

 

 

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6 minutes ago, Dorado said:

 

Undoing a clusterfuck like you describe is a high stress, big expensive ordeal with a low probability of success.

Might have a high probability of success depending on what the research turns up.  That's why you do an eval before judging probability.  You're right about expensive though.  Even if you have a strong case, going up against a big ag business is never going to be cheap.

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Hard path ... fight them with every fiber of your being.

Easy path ... plant a bunch of Golden Bamboo along the lot line. Within a few years and sufficient water it will grow so thick with green and birds that you'll say "neighbors? Oh yah, I forgot about them." Bonus, it will grow into their property and will be a never-ending nuisance for them.

Prudent path ... plant the bamboo and fight them half-heartedly so that the stress you deliver is always greater than the stress you receive.

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5 minutes ago, mikewof said:

Hard path ... fight them with every fiber of your being.

Easy path ... plant a bunch of Golden Bamboo along the lot line. Within a few years and sufficient water it will grow so thick with green and birds that you'll say "neighbors? Oh yah, I forgot about them." Bonus, it will grow into their property and will be a never-ending nuisance for them.

Prudent path ... plant the bamboo and fight them half-heartedly so that the stress you deliver is always greater than the stress you receive.

Bamboo, you sir are evil...I salute you.

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4 minutes ago, Dorado said:

I'd just move

You don't want to look out your window and be pissed off every day for the rest of your life.

I'm a Licensed L.S. in CA.

Undoing a clusterfuck like you describe is a high stress, big expensive ordeal with a low probability of success.

Find a better place and enjoy your life.

I heartily agree with this. Any legal action will be very expensive. And the courts down here are surprisingly provincial. I just went thru the wringer in a easement dispute in neighboring Monterey County. The court had no interest in law, rights or procedure as far as could be determined. The obvious goal of the court was to reach a settlement that split the baby while enriching the lawyers and avoiding any possibility of appeal to real courts in the city. We prevailed, ten years, but it was not worth it. The process will leave you completely disillusioned about the court system.

County offices will have zero interest in your plight. And as slow as molassas.

Sell. Taking a $100,000 loss will leave you ahead of the game.

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Well, there you have it.

Who wants to pay to sit on a hemorrhoid for the next ten years ?

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9 minutes ago, El Boracho said:

The process will leave you completely disillusioned about the court system.

 

You raise interesting points borachero but your cynicism is over the top.  The only part of your statement that is absolutely true about any litigation is above.  Watching the sausage of law get made will disgust most people.

But the system can work properly provided you have the right representation and the resources to do it the way they recommend.  In my experience, the people who feel the most abused by the civil system are those who have (1) ignored competent advice early on in their chosen path; (2) hired a bargain lawyer, or (3) hired a reputed lawyer who did a bad job. 

 

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Evaluation and getting good advice on the $, time, and probability of success sounds like a plan.

If we just moved without doing some due diligence I would wonder.

You would have to see the property. Its an awesome location with lots of out buildings and a pottery studio.

If I could spend 20K to possibly save 100K in home value and I can move out and rent it while its going on? House is paid off. Maybe worth 650K right now in a fire sale. Could rent just the house for 2K per month and we could still have all the outbuildings to visit and make pots and work on vehicles (and store them).

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36 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

 Again, not sure about Cali as I haven't had any nuisance cases in Cali.

Plesae specifey whearre you halve beene a documentted legalle nunsiance so we cane usse you as a referrence.                            :)

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39 minutes ago, mikewof said:

plant a bunch of Golden Bamboo along the lot line.

don't forget the cement barrier sunk on your side .....

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41 minutes ago, Timo42 said:

Bamboo, you sir are evil...I salute you.

As long as the barrier on his side of the bamboo is at least 3' to 4' deep.  Concrete or sheetmetal with NO gaps.  None.  Not even eensy ones.  No gaps.

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6 minutes ago, Left Shift said:
49 minutes ago, Timo42 said:

Bamboo, you sir are evil...I salute you.

As long as the barrier on his side of the bamboo is at least 3' to 4' deep.  Concrete or sheetmetal with NO gaps.  None.  Not even eensy ones.  No gaps.

I spportte tehe "no gapps" plan , bamboone ist insiddeouse, it nevere resttes.........                                                  :)

Common, singit withe me......

 

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1 minute ago, Snaggletooth said:

I spportte tehe "no gapps" plan , bamboone ist insiddeouse, it nevere resttes.........                                                  :)

The plant equivalent of rust.  

No if you could get beavers to eat bamboo, you'd have pretty close to a perpetual motion machine. 

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That first $20,000 will be spent in a flash. You are in a sad situation.

We had the best representation and followed all advice. Just drew the wrong judge.

It has been twelve years now. Our related zoning and building code complaints to the county have gone nowhere. The county completely agrees with us but has no resources for enforcement. The best they can do is “Red Tag” and send letters to the neighbor. We are not going to sue the county. And the county is not going to sue the neighbor.

Dismal. Move or just put up with it until your neighbors die or move away.

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1 hour ago, mikewof said:

Hard path ... fight them with every fiber of your being.

Easy path ... plant a bunch of Golden Bamboo along the lot line. Within a few years and sufficient water it will grow so thick with green and birds that you'll say "neighbors? Oh yah, I forgot about them." Bonus, it will grow into their property and will be a never-ending nuisance for them.

Prudent path ... plant the bamboo and fight them half-heartedly so that the stress you deliver is always greater than the stress you receive.

Too bad Kudzu does not do well in California...  :D

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1 minute ago, nacradriver said:

Too bad Kudzu does not do well in California...  :D

Kudzu ist notte as pragmactic as bamboone.....................                           :)

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Too control bamboo all you have to do his cut the new shoots, it only gets out of control if you leave it do it’s own thing 

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34 minutes ago, Chris in Santa Cruz, CA said:

Evaluation and getting good advice on the $, time, and probability of success sounds like a plan.

If we just moved without doing some due diligence I would wonder.

You would have to see the property. Its an awesome location with lots of out buildings and a pottery studio.

If I could spend 20K to possibly save 100K in home value and I can move out and rent it while its going on? House is paid off. Maybe worth 650K right now in a fire sale. Could rent just the house for 2K per month and we could still have all the outbuildings to visit and make pots and work on vehicles (and store them).

Or....  just thinking out loud here... take that $20K to sub divide and maybe build 25 McMansions... gawd knows that shit will sell quick in Corralitos, and then let them take on the fight while you chill in your new crib in Soquel enjoying low property taxes under Prop 60/90...

 

 

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6 minutes ago, Snaggletooth said:

Kudzu ist notte as pragmactic as bamboone.....................                           :)

Kudzu doesn't surf!!!

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3 minutes ago, nacradriver said:

Kudzu doesn't surf!!!

"Doint worrey, welle halve this kudzu cleande up and reddye fiorre us in a jiffey, dointe you worrey."

Kilgore.jpg

:)

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24 minutes ago, El Boracho said:

That first $20,000 will be spent in a flash. You are in a sad situation.

We had the best representation and followed all advice. Just drew the wrong judge.

It has been twelve years now. Our related zoning and building code complaints to the county have gone nowhere. The county completely agrees with us but has no resources for enforcement. The best they can do is “Red Tag” and send letters to the neighbor. We are not going to sue the county. And the county is not going to sue the neighbor.

Dismal. Move or just put up with it until your neighbors die or move away.

From what I understand the only thing they can red tag is the structure itself... and that is only if the structure has illegal additions (work with out permits) where the owner has neglected to comply to the notices, or there was a fire, earthquake, flood/mudslide deeming the property uninhabitable...

 

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5 minutes ago, Snaggletooth said:

"Doint worrey, welle halve this kudzu cleande up and reddye fiorre us in a jiffey, dointe you worrey."

Kilgore.jpg

:)

I love the smell of Kudzu in the morning

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2 minutes ago, nacradriver said:

From what I understand the only thing they can red tag is the structure itself... and that is only if the structure has illegal additions (work with out permits) where the owner has neglected to comply to the notices, or there was a fire, earthquake, flood/mudslide deeming the property uninhabitable...

No grading plan or permit. No plan or permit for retaining wall. Development on slopes over 30% without permit. Construction in Coastal Zone. Public water system without health permit or inspection. Streambed alteration. No water appropriation. Etc, etc. No structure needed.

But no serious enforcement. Our in the remote provinces they rely on self-compliance.

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Do you smelle that?  

6 minutes ago, nacradriver said:

I love the smell of Kudzu in the morning

Apologieses to CISCCA, i halve hade to muche fun in theise threade, sorrey to deraille threade............              :)

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55 minutes ago, El Boracho said:

That first $20,000 will be spent in a flash. You are in a sad situation.

We had the best representation and followed all advice. Just drew the wrong judge.

It has been twelve years now. Our related zoning and building code complaints to the county have gone nowhere. The county completely agrees with us but has no resources for enforcement. The best they can do is “Red Tag” and send letters to the neighbor. We are not going to sue the county. And the county is not going to sue the neighbor.

Dismal. Move or just put up with it until your neighbors die or move away.

Or employ your God given second amendment right to shoot the hell out  of them every time they threaten you by driving too close to your castle.

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16 minutes ago, El Boracho said:

No grading plan or permit. No plan or permit for retaining wall. Development on slopes over 30% without permit. Construction in Coastal Zone. Public water system without health permit or inspection. Streambed alteration. No water appropriation. Etc, etc. No structure needed.

But no serious enforcement. Our in the remote provinces they rely on self-compliance.

Got it...  work with no permit... I take it you have you called the Coastal Commission...

 

 

 

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50 minutes ago, nacradriver said:

Got it...  work with no permit... I take it you have you called the Coastal Commission...

Yes, the area is in a Local Coastal Plan so it is handled locally. But work stopped with the Red Tag. Thankfully. But nothing after that. Plaintiff is incapable of getting permits by way of stupidity, un-cooperation and a streak of libertarianism.

The most effective action our part was a complaint to the Game Warden. They take stream damage seriously. Showed up unannounced at the plaintiff’s door with a weapon, in full camo and bullet-proof vest. And they followed up on the permit enforcement. That worked nicely. Phoning in trespass to the sheriff got nowhere. They didn’t even show up. When they did a week later we were essentially told that having a dead body or shots fired might cause more effort on their part. And nearer the highway as the bloated doughnut eater wasn’t well adapted to the terrain. Seriously.

Since then I made significant efforts in creating an insane violent persona for myself. The neighborhood thrives on gossip. Made sure they know I can make the five hundred yard shot from my easy-chair down to their trespass and I might be crazy enough to try it. Cameras and motion sensors.

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12 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

In britain it would be the defense of 'prescription', but not in the USA.  There is also the concept of 'coming to the nuisance' that, in some states, disqualifies an after-acquiring property owner from a nuisance claim for a use that existed when the plaintiff first purchased.  Again, not sure about Cali as I haven't had any nuisance cases in Cali.

 

 

Point of clarification for others who find this thread - prescriptive use still exists in the New England states, as does acquiescence, both of which can cause nonconforming or nuisance uses to become protected. 

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16 hours ago, Left Shift said:

Mmmmm.

Manure piles maybe.  But..sawdust piles?  Probably a judgement call by the local Planning Director or similar.  But you could argue no, unless you really like Nabisco's Oatmeal cookies.

 

16 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

It's most likely an Ag use

 

16 hours ago, Left Shift said:

Mmmmm.

Manure piles maybe.  But..sawdust piles?  Probably a judgement call by the local Planning Director or similar.  But you could argue no, unless you really like Nabisco's Oatmeal cookies.

 

16 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Typically Ag zoning is quite lenient for things like soil businesses.  The sawdust may be nonconforming, and might provide the best ammo for a private nuisance claim, but only because it is not coming from logs on the property.  There may be an easement or profit recorded against the parcel in favor of the saw mill that should be reviewed.  Probably not a cheap case. 

All that being said, there is also the issue of "fugitive emmissions " (dust) that are heavily regulated in my region. Any heavy traffic area here needs regular sweeping and/or watering for dust suppression.  Travel areas, loading areas and production areas are all controlled via ordnance. 

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16 hours ago, nacradriver said:

Or....  just thinking out loud here... take that $20K to sub divide and maybe build 25 McMansions... gawd knows that shit will sell quick in Corralitos, and then let them take on the fight while you chill in your new crib in Soquel enjoying low property taxes under Prop 60/90...

 

 

You make sense. I thought of putting two illegal ADU's on the property (convert the studio and the storage unit) and just becoming a slum lord. Main house plus two other renters. $6K per month easy and just let it roll ad infinitum in the family trust.

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2 hours ago, warbird said:

 

 

 

All that being said, there is also the issue of "fugitive emmissions " (dust) that are heavily regulated in my region. Any heavy traffic area here needs regular sweeping and/or watering for dust suppression.  Travel areas, loading areas and production areas are all controlled via ordnance. 

When they started the soil business the neighbors immediately drove them to move their compost pile to another location (Marina Landfill site). The sawdust piles are immense. The canadians kept repeating "wood chips" to me when we spoke in my driveway to no avail. Heartless capitalists.

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Just now, Chris in Santa Cruz, CA said:

When they started the soil business the neighbors immediately drove them to move their compost pile to another location (Marina Landfill site). The sawdust piles are immense. The canadians kept repeating "wood chips" to me when we spoke in my driveway to no avail. Heartless capitalists.

IIRC Any airborn particulate sourced from the site is a fugitive emmission and perhaps if all else fails you can at least get steps to prevent that nuisance.  Just trying to be helpful. 

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US to Canadian dollar is good now.   Could you buy the timber company?

Can't be all that much, right?

A simple go fund me campaign, and get VWAP to employ some talent for video content and done!

None of that silly bamboo (awesome idea IMHO ;-) or lawsuit nonsense.

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21 minutes ago, warbird said:

IIRC Any airborn particulate sourced from the site is a fugitive emmission and perhaps if all else fails you can at least get steps to prevent that nuisance.  Just trying to be helpful. 

I appreciate all suggestions and help no matter where they come from. Thanks.

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3 minutes ago, Chris in Santa Cruz, CA said:

I appreciate all suggestions and help no matter where they come from. Thanks.

Best of luck.  Crappy thing to deal with.

Don't give up too much of your sanity.  You only get so many minutes on this earth, and some things are not worth that cost.  Some are though.  

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Any chance the "soil mixing factory" is a variance from "Diversified Ag?"  If so, is there any change the variance was restricted to the owner it was issued to and therefore not transferrable on sale?

Along the lines of that others have said could it be shown that the volume of saw dust far exceeds the capacity of the soil mixing business so as to reclassify the operation as a storage facility subject to other restrictions?

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32 minutes ago, LakeBoy said:

Any chance the "soil mixing factory" is a variance from "Diversified Ag?"  If so, is there any change the variance was restricted to the owner it was issued to and therefore not transferrable on sale?

Along the lines of that others have said could it be shown that the volume of saw dust far exceeds the capacity of the soil mixing business so as to reclassify the operation as a storage facility subject to other restrictions?

2 years after the ownership change and the online map still shows that parcel with the zoning variance and now its larger. As far as the country is concerned they transferred the variance to the new owner and then swapped land from one parcel to the other and the now larger parcel does not indicate it is mixed use.

The soil factory was a chicken farm beforehand. All the coops are still there.

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22 hours ago, Chris in Santa Cruz, CA said:

 

If I could spend 20K to possibly save 100K in home value and I can move out and rent it while its going on? House is paid off. Maybe worth 650K right now in a fire sale. Could rent just the house for 2K per month and we could still have all the outbuildings to visit and make pots and work on vehicles (and store them).

If you supplied him or her with all the pertinent documents, I imagine a good real estate lawyer could spend 5 or 6 hours to investigate and come back to you with a plan.  

Send me a PM if you would like a referral.  This is not a solicitation.

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Can you post a drawing with dimensions or a Google earth highlighted ...that would be very helpful

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10 hours ago, sshow bob said:

Point of clarification for others who find this thread - prescriptive use still exists in the New England states, as does acquiescence, both of which can cause nonconforming or nuisance uses to become protected. 

cheers bob. In what jurisdiction is prescription a valid defense to a private nuisance claim?

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1 hour ago, LakeBoy said:

Any chance the "soil mixing factory" is a variance from "Diversified Ag?"  If so, is there any change the variance was restricted to the owner it was issued to and therefore not transferrable on sale?

Along the lines of that others have said could it be shown that the volume of saw dust far exceeds the capacity of the soil mixing business so as to reclassify the operation as a storage facility subject to other restrictions?

These ideas are why you have to pull the permit history and review all the title work before figuring out options.

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6 minutes ago, Gissie said:

Set fire to the woodchip pile one night.

that occurred to me when I read it 

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23 hours ago, Dorado said:

I'd just move

You don't want to look out your window and be pissed off every day for the rest of your life.

I'm a Licensed L.S. in CA.

Undoing a clusterfuck like you describe is a high stress, big expensive ordeal with a low probability of success.

Find a better place and enjoy your life.

I'm the Australian equivalent of an LS in my neck of the woods.

 

Fully agree with the above. The $$ and stress are not worth it, just sell and move on.

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10 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

cheers bob. In what jurisdiction is prescription a valid defense to a private nuisance claim?

In Maine I know, and I believe in MA, NH.  I think in VT.

Not absolute. There are preemptive rules about blasting in Maine for example. But farm odors are an example of the availability of a prescriptive defense. 

I don't think that prescription would apply in the OP example, even here. 

In Maine, acquiescence would likely be a defense simpler to prove on the right facts. 

We would phrase coming to the nuisance as assumption of the risk of injury from the nuisance but that doctrine is alive and well, even if the emitter is briefly dormant. People moving near a gravel pit that resumes a permitted use, for example.

Whole different set of laws addressing gun ranges. 

Very fact specific. I am nobody's lawyers etc. 

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thanks for the clarification.  Michigan had to enact Right To Farm Act to prevent private nuisance suits from bothering legitimate farmers because most of those old defenses are no longer available.

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15 hours ago, Gissie said:

Set fire to the woodchip pile one night.

That chip pile is already cooking deep inside......

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15 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

thanks for the clarification.  Michigan had to enact Right To Farm Act to prevent private nuisance suits from bothering legitimate farmers because most of those old defenses are no longer available.

We still have a lot of very old law here.  Pre-revolution colonial law is still good here on certain real estate issues, for example - particularly relating to the legal status of roads.  

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22 hours ago, warbird said:

IIRC Any airborn particulate sourced from the site is a fugitive emmission and perhaps if all else fails you can at least get steps to prevent that nuisance.  Just trying to be helpful. 

 

21 hours ago, Chris in Santa Cruz, CA said:

I appreciate all suggestions and help no matter where they come from. Thanks.

I worked in a dusty industry and spent hundreds of hours driving a water spray truck for dust suppression on the gravel roads and a sweeper on the paved roadways including the public highway where customer trucks tracked dust and/or sand.  The attachment is just a primer or example. It should not be hard to get those regulations enforced.

https://www.valleyair.org/busind/comply/PM10/compliance_PM10.htm

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6 hours ago, warbird said:

 

I worked in a dusty industry and spent hundreds of hours driving a water spray truck for dust suppression on the gravel roads and a sweeper on the paved roadways including the public highway where customer trucks tracked dust and/or sand.  The attachment is just a primer or example. It should not be hard to get those regulations enforced.

https://www.valleyair.org/busind/comply/PM10/compliance_PM10.htm

Much appreciated.

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7 hours ago, sshow bob said:

We still have a lot of very old law here.  Pre-revolution colonial law is still good here on certain real estate issues, for example - particularly relating to the legal status of roads.  

I imagine doing a big title review for a development is a fucking nightmare there.  

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