Grande Mastere Dreade

uh, a jib traveller ?

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Makes sense especially high up. Alternative is to run it to the bow or through a whole lot of friction blocks

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16 minutes ago, Grande Mastere Dreade said:

and i have no idea why the jib sheet goes up the mast

jib sheet going up the mast is a low friction way to keep the tension constant across a range of positions on the track.  Other options are either running the jib sheet forward or having a continuous line from traveler end  - car - clew - car - other traveler end. 

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What Hitchhiker said.  Pretty common set up w/ self tacking jibs, been around for years and the sheet going up the mast a ways works well and also common.

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huh

8 minutes ago, Grande Mastere Dreade said:

not on cruisers with a self tacking jib...   

or on any properly fast boat with a jib

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8 minutes ago, Grande Mastere Dreade said:

not on cruisers with a self tacking jib...   

Oh, you will.  You will.

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49 minutes ago, zenmasterfred said:

What Hitchhiker said.  Pretty common set up w/ self tacking jibs, been around for years and the sheet going up the mast a ways works well and also common.

^^^^ This recall racing a Ross 40 mid 80's with this set up, the one minus is they mangled foredeck crew and sym spinakersn so fell ou of favour for a bit.

They are now resurgent on most Hanses for instance without the fugly above deck traveller rather a nicely recessed one. 

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The nice part about a self tacking jib when racing short-handed....

Them:  "Hey -- we're going to engage you in a tacking duel"

Us:  "What, are you stupid?  OK.  Fill your boots"

Them:  "OK.  Foredeck ready?  Tacking.  Break.  TrimTrimTrimTrimTrim."

Us:  "Tacking."

Them:  "Ready about?  Foredeck...make sure the jib doesn't hang up on the shroud...Tacking.  Break.  TrimTrimTrimTrimTrim."

Us:  "Tacking."

Them:  "Ready about?  Try not to override the jib sheet this time.  Tacking.  Break.  TrimTrimTrimTrimTrimTrim."

Us:  "Seriously, I can do this all day.  The other half of the crew hasn't even climbed out of his bunk yet.  Tacking."

 

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It really works like a traveller, although the „sheet“ will be the three or four holes in the clew plate of the jib - not really easy to adjust underway. 

Btw, I don’t see why a sheet up and down the mast should have less friction than one lead to the bow and back. One block each, and the one to the bow doesn’t disturb the airflow. It is, however, an ideal death trap for the bowman. So maybe up-the-mast has more to do with keeping the foredeck clean and therefore you see it more in cruisers. 

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16 minutes ago, Navig8tor said:

^^^^ This recall racing a Ross 40 mid 80's with this set up, the one minus is they mangled foredeck crew and sym spinakersn so fell ou of favour for a bit.

They are now resurgent on most Hanses for instance without the fugly above deck traveller rather a nicely recessed one. 

Ok. Now I’m really curious. Having run a Ross 40 in the US for several years. Which one had self tacking jibs? I gotta guess your talking about NZ boats.  I thought they all had overlapping headsails. I’ve seen the self tacker tracks on Ross 790’s and on 830’s but don’t recall them on the 40.

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8 minutes ago, Que said:

The nice part about a self tacking jib when racing short-handed....

Them:  "Hey -- we're going to engage you in a tacking duel"

Us:  "What, are you stupid?  OK.  Fill your boots"

Them:  "OK.  Foredeck ready?  Tacking.  Break.  TrimTrimTrimTrimTrim."

Us:  "Tacking."

Them:  "Ready about?  Foredeck...make sure the jib doesn't hang up on the shroud...Tacking.  Break.  TrimTrimTrimTrimTrim."

Us:  "Tacking."

Them:  "Ready about?  Try not to override the jib sheet this time.  Tacking.  Break.  TrimTrimTrimTrimTrimTrim."

Us:  "Seriously, I can do this all day.  The other half of the crew hasn't even climbed out of his bunk yet.  Tacking."

 

Hehe! That is why Solings are tacking about eighteen times on a beat and Dragons exactly once. :lol: 

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20 minutes ago, Hitchhiker said:

Ok. Now I’m really curious. Having run a Ross 40 in the US for several years. Which one had self tacking jibs? I gotta guess your talking about NZ boats.  I thought they all had overlapping headsails. I’ve seen the self tacker tracks on Ross 790’s and on 830’s but don’t recall them on the 40.

Marshall Law used to have one...... raced it about 1985 ish, think Te Rauparaha also.

Raced on 780s as well some had, some didn't as I recall.

Yes we are talking Kiwi boats.

Most of these boats carried overlappers as well.

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16 minutes ago, Navig8tor said:

Marshall Law used to have one...... raced it about 1985 ish, think Te Rauparaha also.

Raced on 780s as well some had, some didn't as I recall.

Yes we are talking Kiwi boats.

Most of these boats carried overlappers as well.

Must have been removed later. 

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Just now, Hitchhiker said:

Must have been removed later. 

Yep think most of them were cause  while they were handy beating your brains out in blow the rest of the time they were a PITA especially on a short course.

I recall were retired from Blocovic (sp)  race after tearing a chunk out of the traveller about the size of the car footprint,  it was blowing a little fresh that particular race.

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I put a 3 metre curved track on the bow of my 9 metre cat, with the forestay and tack on a traveller car.

It enabled close sheeting with an overlapping jib, without compromising the centre cockpit and dodger.

Also adjustable for running / reaching.

Sounds dodgy but, with a fixed inner forestay, sailed 25,000 miles without mishap.

Ok, tore an upper spreader out on a dark, rainy night in the middle of nowhere, a mishap but not related.

I stole the idea from a J-Cat I'd sailed on.

My current tri has a self-tacking jib track from a Soling, works a treat tacking in our tight bay.

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Travelers like that,  or using a rope horse like on a dinghy main, are very common round here,  especially if you sail or race on narrow waters. 

If you are tacking up wind,  you can concentrate on the Race and not worry about getting the sail in.  It's already close hauled when you tack. 

It's a similar reason of the current fashion for blade jibs,  no hauling yards of sail round the mast. 

For myself in my somewhat unusual boat,  I've gone for a club foot jib, with a forward extension to the club pulled upwards to set leach tension. A different method of obtaining the same function. 

None of the ideas are my own I've just used ideas  I thought suitable from other boats. 

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2 hours ago, 10thTonner said:

Hehe! That is why Solings are tacking about eighteen times on a beat and Dragons exactly once. :lol: 

Points about 10deg higher too.

The jib traveller leads on our's go through the deck back to the cockpit, clean and simple. Designed in 1964.............

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Where they don't work is as soon as you easy the sheet it twists like mad. The top half of the sail stops working and you need to rig a reaching sheet, just most cruising boats don't.

 

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I’ve mostly see the line going forward, but that can block the anchor locker, so up the mast is perhaps better for cruisers.

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6 hours ago, European Bloke said:

Where they don't work is as soon as you easy the sheet it twists like mad. The top half of the sail stops working and you need to rig a reaching sheet, just most cruising boats don't.

Unless of course the traveler is curved, in which case you can maintain a really good shape throughout - especially on apparent wind boats that go fast enough where you don't need to ease the sails much in the first place. Hence why the most recent "fast boats" all have self tacking jibs...

On my 4ktsb? Purely a practical purpose, while sacrificing performance...

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a lot of X-Yachts have a similar setup, and the way they do it, the thing attaches to the regular jib car tracks, so it's easy to put on and remove

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what a weird question, wink .... my 4 to 5 shitbox came loaded with one new, curved and up the mast, launched 2006, it's a joy, me thinks prime reason to run it up the mast is that otherwise you have a bit of a problem with sheets going all over the place, but on usage ? hah, as one mentioned already, where others will be pumping and grinding, I simply flick the tiller and that is just it, badabing !

jib is on the selftacker, overlapping genoa is not, but it's an easy switch, what's not to like ?

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