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JimBowie

Die! Die! Die!

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7 hours ago, Liquid said:

How about this one word: Corinthian - it was magical while it lasted! How much did a grinder make on a 12M during the golden age of the AC? A team shirt with 3 hots and cot? Now that grinder makes over $100K/year?

I was a ' yachting domestic' and bowman for my summer job during high school and college (the 70's-80's) on wester LIS and made ~$200/week. I was the only paid position on the boat. The notion of making a real career out of racing back then just didn't seem feasible, I only saw a career in super yachting/captaining, my father quickly smashed that dream... Biggest regret in my life!

Today, the runner trimmer makes $$$! And a sail costs as much as a luxury car...

I campaigned an I14 on the west coast, 10+ years ago, for a few years, even that was expensive!

Spot on. I seem to remember from a drama-documentary at the time that Bondy’s boys on A2 were on 20 Aussie dollars a day

 

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Olson 40 was actually an IOR boat, rated about 36.

On Saturday, it was blowing about 15, and we had just the lapper and full main flying. Sailing 9-10.5 knots boat speed all afternoon.

IMG_6353.jpeg

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By the way, this Olson 40 is little work to sail, relatively easy to fix, and a lot of fun!

Most of the time, its just my wife and me. And I do all the work on the boat -- everything but cleaning the bottom.

So while it is certainly true a lot of boats take a lot of work to own and sail, I have been able to get this one so nothing is hard.

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49 minutes ago, carcrash said:

Olson 40 was actually an IOR boat, rated about 36.

On Saturday, it was blowing about 15, and we had just the lapper and full main flying. Sailing 9-10.5 knots boat speed all afternoon.

IMG_6353.jpeg

IMG_6354.mov

Sorry but that in no way resembles the classic fat middle, skinny end IOR classic plastics of late 70s.  Not even close.  The Olson might rate under IOR, but so would a Melges 32.

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These were both from the 70s.  Cool for their day.  But like the title says: Die! Die! Die!

 

 

141240-e-medblue-0.jpg

IOR.jpg

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4 minutes ago, JimBowie said:

These were both from the 70s.  Cool for their day.  But like the title says: Die! Die! Die!

I'd enjoy a weekend on either of those....

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6 minutes ago, JimBowie said:

These were both from the 70s.  Cool for their day.  But like the title says: Die! Die! Die!

 

 

141240-e-medblue-0.jpg

IOR.jpg

Having grown up on the Aesthetic of earlier times, the IOR shapes of my young sailing years were both fascinating and confusing.
https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/seidelmann-299

This one I distinctly remember as archetype:

https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/seidelmann-299

seidelmann_299_drawing.jpg

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The fact that people are still banging on about IOR boats in 2020 shows how old and crusty SA keyboard warriors are, for fucks sake this is rest home ramblings while sucking soup through straws.  So many threads on old boats from "back in the day" Far fucking out, piss off over to the WBF where you belong.

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Just now, toad said:

The fact that people are still banging on about IOR boats in 2020 shows how old and crusty SA keyboard warriors are, for fucks sake this is rest home ramblings while sucking soup through straws.  So many threads on old boats from "back in the day" Far fucking out, piss off over to the WBF where you belong.

LOL. As far as I am concerned, the last gasp of IOR was Maxis and specifically Whitbread '93.

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23 minutes ago, toad said:

The fact that people are still banging on about IOR boats in 2020 shows how old and crusty SA keyboard warriors are, for fucks sake this is rest home ramblings while sucking soup through straws.  So many threads on old boats from "back in the day" Far fucking out, piss off over to the WBF where you belong.

Awww, snowflake, don't be angry!  It's not your fault that nothing is nearly as interesting in today's sailing world as Grand Prix IOR racing was in ours.  I'm sure you have a lovely shelf full of participation awards in your mom's basement, from a lot of really scary 2-hour races on a cookie-cutter sport boat.  There's no shame in that. 

Here's some crayons and a puppy to help you feel better...

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What killed it was the developing expectation that the owner paid for everything and everyone got paid.  I was guest of an owner at a regatta and it was obscene, owner shouts the team to a restaurant each night and they order expensive wines, three courses and then go back to the hotel for free beers.

My father in law did the 79 Admirals cup and the crew worked on the boat, did fundraisers and paid their own way and are all still mates to this day.  These days it is expected to be flown in, accommodation and meals and get paid.  Thus the owner thinks he has to spend up big on the boat to recoup his investment and suddenly there are only a few boats with a chance of winning and mostly are TP52's.

Drives people away when you have to be a squillionare to have a chance

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It drives away the crew too. I was invited to come down for a Farr 40 regatta, but was then offered a nice stipend. Realized it would now be work. I didn’t really want that as I would never be good enough to make any sort of living at it, and I already had work. I didn’t need work on the weekend.

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18 minutes ago, Raz'r said:

 I already had work. I didn’t need work on the weekend.

Yeah.  And that goes both ways. 

For years I ran my own rigging shop, because it gave me the ability to earn my money doing something I enjoyed, while giving me the freedom to shutter the shop and go racing during the season.  Made good money and worked with some great owners, some of which invited me to race on the boat as well as work on it.

It got weird in a few instances.  With some owners it seemed like there was an expectation that, if I was part of the crew, I'd "donate" my time and skills to the campaign.  I mean, I don't at all mind pitching in on work parties and deliveries and such, but, I remember one time in particular we broke a halyard, and when we got back to the dock the owner handed it to me and said "can you take care of this and get it back on the boat before the next race?".. and it was clear he wasn't expecting a quote, he was expecting a freebie.  The assumption was that the next time I came to the boat a new halyard would magically appear and a bill would never be presented.  It put me in an awkward spot... I mean... was I supposed to "donate" the wire, the line, the splice, etc. out of my own pocket?  Along with what would be, for any other boat, billable time?  If I did hand him a bill, would I be screwing up my spot on the boat? Had I really earned a spot by sailing, or was I just a useful fool?  It got awkward enough that I decided I needed to separate "work" from racing, and ended up finding a different way to earn my living.

I always thought it was interesting that the crew of Kialoa paid their own travel expenses to get to/from wherever the boat was.  Although Kilroy could, unquestionably, have covered the tab, he didn't.  If nothing else, it underscored that racing on the Long White Canoe was a privilege earned, not a job hired (for most of them.  Bruce Kendall being the obvious exception)

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7 minutes ago, sledracr said:

It got weird in a few instances.  With some owners it seemed like there was an expectation that, if I was part of the crew, I'd "donate" my time and skills to the campaign

He only gets to do that once., did he expect a sail maker to repair stuff for free.  I would have said I'll do it at cost this time

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46 minutes ago, Bill E Goat said:

He only gets to do that once.

Yeah.  I know that now. Back then, I was 17, running my own business, didn’t know shit about how the world worked, and was irresistibly drawn to fast boats.

I eventually figured out that some people are just snakes. (Ask me sometime about the lawyer that wanted to trick out his Etchells....)

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4 hours ago, fastyacht said:

seidelmann_299_drawing.jpg

The archtypical pumpkin seed planform. Hydrodynamically it would just as soon go through the water sideways as straight ahead. die die die

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On 5/3/2020 at 6:54 PM, mad said:

??
Not sure where you’re heading with that one

Massive testicles is all.

On 5/3/2020 at 6:58 PM, mad said:

50 knot blast out by the Needles was entertaining, especially with full main, #3 and no sea-room. :P

Seriously, tell us more than just "50 knot blast...full main..."

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5 hours ago, sledracr said:

Awww, snowflake, don't be angry!  It's not your fault that nothing is nearly as interesting in today's sailing world as Grand Prix IOR racing was in ours.  I'm sure you have a lovely shelf full of participation awards in your mom's basement, from a lot of really scary 2-hour races on a cookie-cutter sport boat.  There's no shame in that. 

Here's some crayons and a puppy to help you feel better...

Let me paraphrase;

Back in the day we used to tail wire ropes with our teeth, use our balls as winch handles and if something broke no-one would hesitate cutting out a length of their intestine to tie off it off in 40 knots in the southern ocean. A the end of our watch we would skull fuck each other, drink 2 bottles of rum and get back up for another 4 hours just the hell of it.

 

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4 hours ago, Black Sox said:

Massive testicles is all.

Seriously, tell us more than just "50 knot blast...full main..."

my guess: it ended with no main...

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3 hours ago, toad said:

Let me paraphrase;

Back in the day we used to tail wire ropes with our teeth, use our balls as winch handles and if something broke no-one would hesitate cutting out a length of their intestine to tie off it off in 40 knots in the southern ocean. A the end of our watch we would skull fuck each other, drink 2 bottles of rum and get back up for another 4 hours just the hell of it.

 

....and I just don't understand why sail-racing isn't as popular as it used to be...!

Cheers,

               W.

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13 hours ago, shanghaisailor said:

Spot on. I seem to remember from a drama-documentary at the time that Bondy’s boys on A2 were on 20 Aussie dollars a day

 

Sounds about right,  I think that is what I was offered after the '86 World 12s.  The Kookaburra lot were trying much harder they offered $250/week!

Like someone else said above,  I had a job to make money & sail for the love of it.  I looked at the 6 week Worlds Campaign,  thought about that being the next 12 months+,  and wasn't sure I would still love doing it,  so I knocked back both trials.

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10 hours ago, Bill E Goat said:

What killed it was the developing expectation that the owner paid for everything and everyone got paid.  I was guest of an owner at a regatta and it was obscene, owner shouts the team to a restaurant each night and they order expensive wines, three courses and then go back to the hotel for free beers.

My father in law did the 79 Admirals cup and the crew worked on the boat, did fundraisers and paid their own way and are all still mates to this day.  These days it is expected to be flown in, accommodation and meals and get paid.  Thus the owner thinks he has to spend up big on the boat to recoup his investment and suddenly there are only a few boats with a chance of winning and mostly are TP52's.

Drives people away when you have to be a squillionare to have a chance

A fckn men what he said.  Too many young guns think they're America's Cup calibre studs-on-water and expect all the glory with none of the guts.  Why I'm getting out of the pickle-dish game.

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9 hours ago, Somebody Else said:

The archtypical pumpkin seed planform. Hydrodynamically it would just as soon go through the water sideways as straight ahead. die die die

Even for then those boats were absurdly beamy - 10' would have been archetypal

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At the moment we are locked down and have been for 5 weeks, feel like a lot more. I usually race every week like going to church. Right now Ill take a fat rolling broaching hole digging IOR grader if I could just get out there and go sailing!

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