jimg

Looking for boat

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I'm looking for my next small boat.  I have a large cruiser that satisfies my cruising needs, but I need something for a small local lake for Portsmouth/PHRF racing.  I had a Holder 20 which was fun, but had a terrible rating, and I wasn't always able to find crew.  So I sold it and bought a Weta, and at 70yo with a failing back, I found I was not agile enough to sail it.  I've owned a C15 and Vanguard15 as well, and I can't kneel, so they would be difficult now.  At 220lb, I'm not competitive in a Laser or the like.

Is there such a thing as a single handed boat that's big enough for the wife on occasion, somewhat competitive, that can be sailed from a sitting position?  I really thought the Weta was the answer...maybe I should just row around in a coffin.

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Maybe not easy to find since out of production for many years but I had 2 (at different times) Harpoon 5.2 - the 2nd one I removed the cabin top which made it so much more comfortable, made by Boston Whaler so built like a tank, large cockpit, bench seats. There is one in our area that does very well in Portsmouth class although usually DH. I enjoyed them and could easily SH and have had as many as 5 to daysail in light air.  There is also a 4.7 I have only seen from a distance but looks similar just smaller.

 

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6 hours ago, d'ranger said:

Maybe not easy to find since out of production for many years but I had 2 (at different times) Harpoon 5.2 - the 2nd one I removed the cabin top which made it so much more comfortable, made by Boston Whaler so built like a tank, large cockpit, bench seats. There is one in our area that does very well in Portsmouth class although usually DH. I enjoyed them and could easily SH and have had as many as 5 to daysail in light air.  There is also a 4.7 I have only seen from a distance but looks similar just smaller.

 

The Harpoon 5.2 is a sweet little boat and it has a kite as well 

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My local lake is pretty steady 12-20 knots once the wind comes up.  It hasn't had any water for the last few years, but hopefully that will change.  

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1 hour ago, Rum Runner said:

Everyone complains about their rating? Is anything rated properly?

No

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14 minutes ago, Rum Runner said:

Then race one-design.

Yes.If you lose you lose 

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6 hours ago, ROADKILL666 said:
12 hours ago, d'ranger said:

Maybe not easy to find since out of production for many years but I had 2 (at different times) Harpoon 5.2 - the 2nd one I removed the cabin top which made it so much more comfortable, made by Boston Whaler so built like a tank, large cockpit, bench seats. There is one in our area that does very well in Portsmouth class although usually DH. I enjoyed them and could easily SH and have had as many as 5 to daysail in light air.  There is also a 4.7 I have only seen from a distance but looks similar just smaller.

 

The Harpoon 5.2 is a sweet little boat and it has a kite as well 

Well, looky here

https://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/boa/d/rainier-1977-boston-whaler-harpoon-52/7152015040.html

Dunno how far this is from the OP but, speak of the devil, and he appears! Usually, when somebody says "I want a boat like XYZ" there are many suggestions of what would be just -perfect- for the circumstances (and some, not) but impossible to find.

With that in mind, plus looking at boat ads is fun, how about this?

https://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/boa/d/stanwood-sf-pelican/7151080558.html

The SanFran Bay Pelican is a much much bigger boat than it's 12' length implies. It's not a light-air rocket, and it's very unconventional. A friend of mine built one, and loved it, and I sailed it around quite a bit including camping with 2 other people and a big dog. I did not, and still don't, understand how a hull that is basically a box can drive thru a chop the way it does, but it's a nice sailing boat when the wind >7~8.

FB- Doug

I just have

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Hey Jim, what is it about the Weta that doesn't work for you?  Is it just uncomfortable for your back to not have a backrest?  Would the new self tacking sail maybe give you less to have to deal with and up your enjoyment level? I have just installed new shrouds with handles on them that are nice to hang on to when out on the tramp.

I find my Weta quite comfortable, but that is in comparison to squeezing 6'4" of me into my Sunfish:-)

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16 hours ago, jimg said:

I'm looking for my next small boat.  I have a large cruiser that satisfies my cruising needs, but I need something for a small local lake for Portsmouth/PHRF racing.  I had a Holder 20 which was fun, but had a terrible rating, and I wasn't always able to find crew.  So I sold it and bought a Weta, and at 70yo with a failing back, I found I was not agile enough to sail it.  I've owned a C15 and Vanguard15 as well, and I can't kneel, so they would be difficult now.  At 220lb, I'm not competitive in a Laser or the like.

Is there such a thing as a single handed boat that's big enough for the wife on occasion, somewhat competitive, that can be sailed from a sitting position?  I really thought the Weta was the answer...maybe I should just row around in a coffin.

Check out the new Tartan 245

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6 hours ago, jimg said:

 It hasn't had any water for the last few years, but hopefully that will change.  

landsailing_argentina_Lonely_Planet-5a09

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On our gusty lake, capsizing is not remote (I'm 1 for 1 in the Weta) and there's too much risk of breaking one of the many titanium parts in my back.  I've spent the last five years either having or recovering from three spine surgeries.  Maybe I'll just crew on the U20 or work R/C.  The Harpoon looks pretty mundane, but maybe that's my new normal.

I have a Ranger 33 on the S. Oregon coast and I got used to winning every race I entered. The Ranger actually has a fair rating. I voluntarily lowered my rating 20 sec/mi so there wasn't a weekly slaughter.  Actually I think I was 62 wins in 63 races only because I missed a mark.  Probably why the yacht club folded...along with the tsunami.  Not the most competitive fleet!

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So my take is you are looking for competitive, fast and comfortable. Probably going to need to pick 2 as we are all still searching for the perfect boat. 

hmmm, that could be a foiling RC with matching lakeside Laz-y-boy recliner. 

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i like the First 18 except it seems like an expensive Holder 20 with rigging improvements.

our club has no OD except laser, and I'm too big to be competitive if I was agile enough.

I'm sailing this week so won't be reading forums for awhile.

thanks for the ideas.

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C-scow

Big singlehander, can take passengers if you like, can be fun or even scary or just sedately ride around.

Not so great for more open waters and big waves, though

FB- Doug

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I looked at the Zap, and after reading the thread about them, it doesn't sound right.  Supposedly no so easy to single-hand, and did I mention the target needs to be trailer launched.  The First 18 looks an awful lot like an expensive upgrade to my old Holder 20, but 5x the price.  Maybe a used market will develop in a few years.

I know I'm being pretty picky.  Will typically see 12-18 knots, 1' wind waves, solo 230lb sailor with limited flexibility.

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Skud 18 is a great boat for singlehanding or with one or two crew.  We have a local one that I have sailed on.  SKUD stands for “Skiff of Universal Design I believe. It mostly is used as a Paralympic boat but it really is universal as a small sportboat. You can change bulbs on the keel fin depending on the sailing you want to do.  Has self taking jib and single line spinnaker launch/ retrieval system.  Twin rudders and it tracks like it is on rails.

52B240FC-CBCF-4C77-A0D8-BD97C2DD8439.jpeg

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On 7/11/2020 at 11:05 PM, boatcat65 said:

Flying Scot. 19', 850 lbs, 190 square feet sail, 200 square foot spinny.  Single hand or up to 8.  Planes on a reach in 12 knots.  PHRF 204.  https://flyingscot.com/about-fs/

JohnSkoog.jpg

Charlie don't surf

And Flying Scots don't plane

And even if they did, how could you tell?

FB- Doug

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3 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

Charlie don't surf

And Flying Scots don't plane

And even if they did, how could you tell?

FB- Doug

Ouch....OK, not a fan.  But for some reason they built more than a few of them /sarc.  Great family boat or for the guy with a lot of friends.  Plays well with two to eight.  Easy and stable but not a total dog.

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5 hours ago, boatcat65 said:

Ouch....OK, not a fan.  But for some reason they built more than a few of them /sarc.  Great family boat or for the guy with a lot of friends.  Plays well with two to eight.  Easy and stable but not a total dog.

OK that was harsh. Sorry.... I've sailed Scots a fair bit, the main thing I dislike about them is the halyard wires and winches.  Matter of personal taste, a lot of people like them and I am all in favor of people sailing boats they like.

FB- Doug

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Capri 18 looks easy to sail. 
 

However, this X-21 is a great choice. 
 

83 year old guy day sails one here every day and double hand races the beercan series and wins constantly. Fast boat that has a deep, comfortable Cockpit.

 

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SVBA4OOIUJ4KTMSHWYQZRYLP7I.jpg

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On 7/8/2020 at 11:40 PM, jimg said:

I'm looking for my next small boat.  I have a large cruiser that satisfies my cruising needs, but I need something for a small local lake for Portsmouth/PHRF racing.  I had a Holder 20 which was fun, but had a terrible rating, and I wasn't always able to find crew.  So I sold it and bought a Weta, and at 70yo with a failing back, I found I was not agile enough to sail it.  I've owned a C15 and Vanguard15 as well, and I can't kneel, so they would be difficult now.  At 220lb, I'm not competitive in a Laser or the like.

Is there such a thing as a single handed boat that's big enough for the wife on occasion, somewhat competitive, that can be sailed from a sitting position?  I really thought the Weta was the answer...maybe I should just row around in a coffin.

Are you going to keep it in the water or trailer? 

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On 7/8/2020 at 11:40 PM, jimg said:

I'm looking for my next small boat.  I have a large cruiser that satisfies my cruising needs, but I need something for a small local lake for Portsmouth/PHRF racing.  I had a Holder 20 which was fun, but had a terrible rating, and I wasn't always able to find crew.  So I sold it and bought a Weta, and at 70yo with a failing back, I found I was not agile enough to sail it.  I've owned a C15 and Vanguard15 as well, and I can't kneel, so they would be difficult now.  At 220lb, I'm not competitive in a Laser or the like.

Is there such a thing as a single handed boat that's big enough for the wife on occasion, somewhat competitive, that can be sailed from a sitting position?  I really thought the Weta was the answer...maybe I should just row around in a coffin.

Get an H-Boat.

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I'd prefer in the water, but dry sailing works if I can launch the boat with a 1500lb rated tow vehicle.  Also prefer a retractable keel.

I looked at the 2.4m,  but I couldn't find a Portsmouth or PHRF rating for it.  I have a choice of a centerboard fleet or keelboat fleet.

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@jimg Jim, I am 71 and also sail on a lake. In your situation, I would go for a keel boat. When you say you prefer a retractable keel, is that if you're trailering/dry sailing? If not, a few keel boat ideas:

Until 2015, I sailed a J22, which is a sweet sailing boat. I found that when the wind got much above 10 or 12 knots, single-handing got a little dicey unless I reefed. Although it has a small cabin, which is nice for a nap or to get out of the weather, it's really a daysailer. 

I wanted something a bit larger, less dependent on crew weight, good sailing characteristics, simple, and with overnighting or weekending accommodations. The H-Boat (27' 3200 lbs.)has really fit the bill. 

Pearson Ensign also comes to mind.

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Ahh, the venerable Ensign.

Rated 235 around here which cleans up on Wednesday night races. 

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Camping/napping on the boat is not important at all.  Being able to single hand in 18 knots is.  The Holder 20 had a lot going for it except the single handing part, which is the same problem with the Ensign.

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1 minute ago, jimg said:

Camping/napping on the boat is not important at all.  Being able to single hand in 18 knots is.  The Holder 20 had a lot going for it except the single handing part, which is the same problem with the Ensign.

Why would single handing the Ensign be a problem?

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No problem singlehanding and Ensign in 25 knots if your smart and don’t use the Genoa and go with the blade jib Roy Krauss designed for the boats in the early 80’s. I had a 2008 Ensign that had neither hiking straps or a tiller extension and I sailed the shit out of it for a year during snow storms, rain and lots of high west winds.

Can’t think of another small keelboat that can do what the ol’ Lead Sled can do. 

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On 7/25/2020 at 10:02 AM, VWAP said:

SVBA4OOIUJ4KTMSHWYQZRYLP7I.jpg

That's a Bongo, pretty fun boat to just sail around on. Not exactly slow either. You can set it up as either a traditional sloop (I believe with a self tacking jib) or as a main and gennaker style. Very fun in breeze with the beam.

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I couldn't find any images/videos of a single handed Ensign.

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That’s because they are generally raced with 4 and large Genoa and spinnaker. 
 

Of course, these pics were taken of me and the twin sailing-not solo, but very easy to do. Plus, when it’s nap time you throw an anchor out and have 8’ Long benches to rest on.

4638C31B-1DA8-4DBE-8C90-2BE2EC3C35A5.jpeg

9F8ED564-5D2F-4A0B-A6A8-3F1B65890D93.jpeg

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12 hours ago, Tubes said:

That's a Bongo, pretty fun boat to just sail around on. Not exactly slow either. You can set it up as either a traditional sloop (I believe with a self tacking jib) or as a main and gennaker style. Very fun in breeze with the beam.

I was also thinking of the Bongo. I have never sailed one, but it seems ergonomically a good choice for sailors with back issues.

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