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d'ranger

United States of Conspiracy - Frontline Documentary

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In light of some of the comments lately I decided to post this in it's own thread. Not easy to watch unless you are an Alex Jones Nutjob

https://www.pbs.org/video/united-states-of-conspiracy-1phat1/

It details how Alex Jones went from a loudmouth bullshitter to helping get Trump elected. Not a flattering view of he or Roger Stone. Stone of course if much brighter than Jones and has always been a major manipulator, and Jones with his spittle rhetoric was easy to get onboard.

Truth is whatever you can make people believe.

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5 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

In light of some of the comments lately I decided to post this in it's own thread. Not easy to watch unless you are an Alex Jones Nutjob

https://www.pbs.org/video/united-states-of-conspiracy-1phat1/

It details how Alex Jones went from a loudmouth bullshitter to helping get Trump elected. Not a flattering view of he or Roger Stone. Stone of course if much brighter than Jones and has always been a major manipulator, and Jones with his spittle rhetoric was easy to get onboard.

Truth is whatever you can make people believe.

I don't have 54 minutes right now but I'll watch it and get back to you... 

 

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I have started recording the Frontline docs so I can watch when I have time - never have seen one that wasn't thought provoking and well researched.  Last month the one on the coronavirus - what went wrong is excellent on understanding the events that happened and how we got to where we are now.

While very informative they can also be depressing to see how fucked up some things are.

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Thanks for the heads up.  I don't watch much TV but get Frontline on the DVR, and episodes can be sporadic.

As an aside, I heard some guy on NPR a week or so ago talking about conspiracy theories and the appeal to those who believe them.  Paraphrasing here but it comes down to a basic need to make sense of the world.  And that it can sometimes be difficult to accept a monumental, far reaching event with a relatively small cause.   Big events are more easily accepted with big causes.  Like the assassination of JFK not easily accepted as just the hands of one guy.  Expounding on that he pointed out that while there are conspiracy theories on the shooting of JFK, there are none on the shooting of Ronald Reagan.   Not to minimize Reagan's shooting, but as he was not killed it was not as life changing an event. 

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On 7/29/2020 at 4:08 PM, d'ranger said:

Truth is whatever you can make people believe.

Respectfully disagree . . . 

In fact, that is a central principle of fascist thought - such as it is. 

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2 hours ago, AJ Oliver said:

Respectfully disagree . . . 

In fact, that is a central principle of fascist thought - such as it is. 

I don't think he was saying he agrees with it.  Just describing.

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I always liked this definition:  "Objective truths are always true and can be proven through various empirical tests, including scientific methods.  Metaphysical truths are ideas that people believe are true and act accordingly.  Metaphysical truths are not always objectively true, but often provide some individual advantage if followed."

I stole this example: "All snakes are poisonous" is objectively untrue.  But if you act as if all snakes are poisonous, you (and more importantly, your ancestors) were less likely to die of snake bites and therefore have kids who were subsequently told to 'avoid snakes because they're poisonous'.  Its how humans evolved.  To compensate, our species also contain a subset that absolutely are going to go out and pick up snakes or climb mountains 'just because'.  The truth is that things usually end up badly for that subset but they're important for the group because they continuously test the metaphysical truths.

We are genetically predisposed to chunk knowledge and follow authority.  That's the seat of conspiracy and why it can be so pernicious.  That's also why laundry lists of objectively true facts are so ineffective at fighting conspiracy.  If you're afraid of snakes, I can list out every non-poisonous snake and you're still afraid.  I can site safety statistics on airline flights and you're still not getting on that plane.  I can list out every great achievement of some particular ethnic group and you're still biased against them.

Why would I bother with the above?  Because you can't fight metaphysical truths with objective truths alone.  That's not the way culture works.

Thanks for the link.

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Conspiracy Theories are anything counter to the ministry of misinformation.

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We watched a lot of this. My wife was incredulous at just how retarded, angry, and bigoted, Alex Jones sounds.

I said "He sounds that way to -you- but a lot of people nod their heads and think RIGHT ON!" And of course, a big part of his schtick -always- includes the "lying liberal-biased main stream media" so that people who give him the slightest bit of credibility will turn more and more to him and his elk for "facts." 

But he bit off more than he could chew with the Sandy Hook conspiracy bullshit. His followers went WAY too far and brought down the league of contingency lawyers on all their heads, and of course he's the one with the most money to go after.

I hope he dies poor and still angry.

- DSK

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On 7/29/2020 at 1:08 PM, d'ranger said:

In light of some of the comments lately I decided to post this in it's own thread. Not easy to watch unless you are an Alex Jones Nutjob

https://www.pbs.org/video/united-states-of-conspiracy-1phat1/

It details how Alex Jones went from a loudmouth bullshitter to helping get Trump elected. Not a flattering view of he or Roger Stone. Stone of course if much brighter than Jones and has always been a major manipulator, and Jones with his spittle rhetoric was easy to get onboard.

Truth is whatever you can make people believe.

And people believe what they want to believe. 

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Watched the program this evening on You-Tube 

It is well done. 

By that I mean that it should scare the bejeebers out of any rational life form. 

The irrationality of it is right out of Nazi-style fascism. 

Wonder what Nietzsche would say were he alive. 

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On 7/30/2020 at 6:25 AM, benwynn said:

Thanks for the heads up.  I don't watch much TV but get Frontline on the DVR, and episodes can be sporadic.

As an aside, I heard some guy on NPR a week or so ago talking about conspiracy theories and the appeal to those who believe them.  Paraphrasing here but it comes down to a basic need to make sense of the world.  And that it can sometimes be difficult to accept a monumental, far reaching event with a relatively small cause.   Big events are more easily accepted with big causes.  Like the assassination of JFK not easily accepted as just the hands of one guy.  Expounding on that he pointed out that while there are conspiracy theories on the shooting of JFK, there are none on the shooting of Ronald Reagan.   Not to minimize Reagan's shooting, but as he was not killed it was not as life changing an event. 

I heard the same NPR show on podcast/

Sometimes the need to make sense of the world actually accomplishes just that.

Citizens are programmed to believe whatever they are told to.  How else would 35% of the American voters believe Trump, when they are getting screwed to most?

Any explanation not in line with the official thought police story, is labelled a conspiracy theory.

Many of them are true.

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8 hours ago, astro said:

I heard the same NPR show on podcast/

I watched it last night on You-Tube. 

Very chilling - Jones is evil incarnate. 

But he has not done it alone - hate radio and the Murdoch's set the stage 

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