Pokey uh da LBC 48 #1 Posted August 12 Pretty cool video from Facebook... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AnotherSailor 174 #2 Posted August 12 wow, I would not have guessed that would actually work! Cool Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pokey uh da LBC 48 #3 Posted August 12 And if it worked with that old rig and heavy construction, imagine how well you could make it work with modern tech. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
carcrash 301 #4 Posted August 12 Wind powered airplane!! I would not have expected that would ever work. Flying lifted by water is one thing -- water is so much more dense, generating the power to lift is clearly easier. For example, flying on Mars will be very hard, flying on Titan (moon of Saturn) will be very easy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hitchhiker 507 #5 Posted August 12 Ummm. Isn’t that a glider being towed by a car? What am I missing here? The sails are just dragging through the air. 8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MisterMoon 228 #6 Posted August 12 4 minutes ago, Hitchhiker said: Ummm. Isn’t that a glider being towed by a car? What am I missing here? The sails are just dragging through the air. The luffing standing lug is a clue. Also at the end of the video you can see a car far off in the distance going down the beach at the same pace as the 'airplane'. Coincidence? I think not. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AnotherSailor 174 #7 Posted August 12 5 minutes ago, Hitchhiker said: Ummm. Isn’t that a glider being towed by a car? What am I missing here? The sails are just dragging through the air. Ugh, Ok, I see it now. Bummer! Back to reality... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pokey uh da LBC 48 #8 Posted August 12 Not clear if it's being towed. It may be, but the leading car may also be filming the flight, like the guy standing in front of the camera is doing. Either way, it looks to be a fairly serious experiment. Filming such a stunt back in the day would probably be pretty expensive. I guess the real question is, can the horizontal speed generated by a vertical wing/sail, be converted into enough horizontal lift to get a glider airborne. Or does the drag prevent the craft from reaching takeoff speed. Finding the answer would be an fun project for an amateur model builder. Or a simple thought experiment for a properly educated individual (sadly not me). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sail4beer 1,695 #9 Posted August 12 I’ll check Snopes for this one! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KC375 1,509 #10 Posted August 12 1 hour ago, Hitchhiker said: Ummm. Isn’t that a glider being towed by a car? What am I missing here? The sails are just dragging through the air. And next you are going to say infinite motion machines don't work Such a party pooper Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snaggletooth 2,454 #11 Posted August 12 21 minutes ago, Sail4beer said: I’ll check Snopes for this one! Wase he the avitatore? Avitatrix? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MisterMoon 228 #12 Posted August 12 53 minutes ago, Pokey uh da LBC said: Not clear if it's being towed. It may be, but the leading car may also be filming the flight, like the guy standing in front of the camera is doing. Either way, it looks to be a fairly serious experiment. Filming such a stunt back in the day would probably be pretty expensive. I guess the real question is, can the horizontal speed generated by a vertical wing/sail, be converted into enough horizontal lift to get a glider airborne. Or does the drag prevent the craft from reaching takeoff speed. Finding the answer would be an fun project for an amateur model builder. Or a simple thought experiment for a properly educated individual (sadly not me). It can't work for the same reason a shallow bodied sailboat hull with no foils can't sail to windward. You've got to have low drag way to resist leeway. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shaggy 575 #13 Posted August 12 But can it go DDW faster than the wind?? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
apophenia 126 #14 Posted August 12 The new RRS drops all restrictions on outriggers, so everyone should be flying this time next year! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McGyver 35 #15 Posted August 13 21 hours ago, shaggy said: But can it go DDW faster than the wind?? I was scrolling down waiting for that question to show up... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alphafb552 275 #16 Posted August 13 Looking at it from a physics standpoint, it would not be possible, since the motion of a sailing boat (or cart for that matter) is derived from the balance of the drive from the sails vs the lateral resistance offered by the keel (or wheels, or skates) Once in the air, there is no force to provide lateral resistance, so the drive of the sails will just push the plane to leeward Sorry guys... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alphafb552 275 #17 Posted August 13 24 minutes ago, alphafb552 said: Looking at it from a physics standpoint, it would not be possible, since the motion of a sailing boat (or cart for that matter) is derived from the balance of the drive from the sails vs the lateral resistance offered by the keel (or wheels, or skates) Once in the air, there is no force to provide lateral resistance, so the drive of the sails will just push the plane to leeward Sorry guys... Having said that, there is no reason why you couldn't build up speed on the ground until you have enough speed to achieve lift off, get it off the ground then release the sheets and see how far you can glide... That may be exactly what we are seeing! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NaClH20 34 #18 Posted August 13 Pulled from the Owls Head Transportation Museum website. Looks exactly alike so I’m going to guess these planes are one and the same. Going to also guess that that is original film of the event (they note in the description the use of a car to tow it airborne!). Would love to know where the film came from... The internet is a wonderful place, sometimes. 1930 Domenjoz Glider (Original) PHOTOS John Domenjoz, former Bleriot test pilot, flight instructor and world-wide barnstormer, arrived at Old Orchard Beach, Maine in 1929 to test the possibility of sail power for aircraft. The glider was assembled in the hangar of pioneer Maine aviator Harry M. Jones. Although the glider was reportedly able to achieve an altitude of 200’-300’ when towed by an automobile, the sails gave no propulsive power. Modern tests and analysis have proven that it would be aerodynamically impossible for this oddity to fly independently. We will probably never know if Domenjoz’s intent was pure carnival or serious. Domenjoz abandoned the glider in 1930; in 1974, it was rescued and donated to OHTM, and has been fully restored. See also OHTM’s Standard J-1, painted in Harry M. Jones’ colors, and our 1909 Blériot Type XI Monoplane representation. The 1914 Blériot XI Domenjoz used for barnstorming is on display at the Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum. Specifications: Span 41’, length 29’, weight 500-600 lbs. Donated by Evelyn Lake and Donald Lake. Accession no. 1984G04 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AnotherSailor 174 #19 Posted August 13 On 8/12/2020 at 11:40 AM, shaggy said: But can it go DDW faster than the wind?? That is exactly what happens on ice boats. You alway sheet in because you go faster than the wind. But that doesn't mean this thing can fly on its own accord... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shaggy 575 #20 Posted August 13 BTW, that was in reference to one of the most gassbag threads on this site.. Ever... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
El Boracho 1,344 #21 Posted August 13 3 hours ago, alphafb552 said: Looking at it from a physics standpoint, it would not be possible, since the motion of a sailing boat (or cart for that matter) is derived from the balance of the drive from the sails vs the lateral resistance offered by the keel (or wheels, or skates) Once in the air, there is no force to provide lateral resistance, so the drive of the sails will just push the plane to leeward Sorry guys... Sailplanes have gravity to work against. Updraft of air against gravity gives forward motion.. Take away gravity and the sailplane slows and drifts with the air currents... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stumblingthunder 563 #22 Posted August 14 21 hours ago, alphafb552 said: Looking at it from a physics standpoint, it would not be possible, since the motion of a sailing boat (or cart for that matter) is derived from the balance of the drive from the sails vs the lateral resistance offered by the keel (or wheels, or skates) Once in the air, there is no force to provide lateral resistance, so the drive of the sails will just push the plane to leeward Sorry guys... It looks like he had salvaged an etheric rudder from a crashed vessel and modified it to behave as a centerboard, providing the “bite” necessary for sails to work. https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Etheric_rudder Unfortunately , the device was not able to be replicated, as 1920s technology could not create a similarity sized device or its power source. - Stumbling 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Omer 34 #23 Posted August 14 Watch the gentle breeze and waves coming onshore. There is no way this craft can generate enough power with those low aspect ratio sails on a beam reach to travel at a speed to take off. Especially with the sails probably tacked on the wrong side. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
condor 4 #24 Posted August 14 Pokey, you need a boat. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AnotherSailor 174 #25 Posted August 14 20 hours ago, shaggy said: BTW, that was in reference to one of the most gassbag threads on this site.. Ever... I hope it has nothing to do with the 3rd dimension Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hobot 1,535 #26 Posted August 14 On 8/12/2020 at 10:41 AM, Pokey uh da LBC said: Finding the answer would be an fun project for an amateur model builder. Or a simple thought experiment for a properly educated individual (sadly not me). In places that i'll not admit to being at, I've heard whispers saying that if you say the name Doug Lord three times he will appear. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shaggy 575 #27 Posted August 14 Oh geez... Here we go again.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
