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Catalina 36

Why do Riggers like Profurl?

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I'm planning to replace the roller furler on my Catalina 36 over the winter this year and the two riggers I've gotten quotes from so far both recommended Profurl Classic.

 

The online comments regarding Proforl seem to be more mixed than for the brands I was considering (Harken, Furlex). I have gotten some positive feed back on Profurl but am still unconvinced its the way to go. I haven't seen as many (any?) negative comments on Harken or Furlex that I can think of.

 

We are primarily crusiers and generally its just my wife and I aboard so reliablity is our primary concern, however we do want to be able to roll in some of our 150 when the wind kicks up and still have some shape. (The sail has foam luff strips to help there).

 

So what do the Anarchists think of Profurl?

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I'm planning to replace the roller furler on my Catalina 36 over the winter this year and the two riggers I've gotten quotes from so far both recommended Profurl Classic.

 

The online comments regarding Proforl seem to be more mixed than for the brands I was considering (Harken, Furlex). I have gotten some positive feed back on Profurl but am still unconvinced its the way to go. I haven't seen as many (any?) negative comments on Harken or Furlex that I can think of.

 

We are primarily crusiers and generally its just my wife and I aboard so reliablity is our primary concern, however we do want to be able to roll in some of our 150 when the wind kicks up and still have some shape. (The sail has foam luff strips to help there).

 

So what do the Anarchists think of Profurl?

 

Great for cruising. I never had an issue with mine and it required zero maintenance (45ft cat). Not the best for racing boats as they are pretty heavy but great for cruisers.

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I'm planning to replace the roller furler on my Catalina 36 over the winter this year and the two riggers I've gotten quotes from so far both recommended Profurl Classic.

 

The online comments regarding Proforl seem to be more mixed than for the brands I was considering (Harken, Furlex). I have gotten some positive feed back on Profurl but am still unconvinced its the way to go. I haven't seen as many (any?) negative comments on Harken or Furlex that I can think of.

 

We are primarily crusiers and generally its just my wife and I aboard so reliablity is our primary concern, however we do want to be able to roll in some of our 150 when the wind kicks up and still have some shape. (The sail has foam luff strips to help there).

 

So what do the Anarchists think of Profurl?

 

 

I'm probably a cynical a-hole - but perhaps the riggers get the better discount from Profurl??

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the only negative thing i've heard about profurl is the weight. however, there is no such thing as a good upwind shape from a partially furled sail... foam luff or otherwise...

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I'm planning to replace the roller furler on my Catalina 36 over the winter this year and the two riggers I've gotten quotes from so far both recommended Profurl Classic.

 

The online comments regarding Proforl seem to be more mixed than for the brands I was considering (Harken, Furlex). I have gotten some positive feed back on Profurl but am still unconvinced its the way to go. I haven't seen as many (any?) negative comments on Harken or Furlex that I can think of.

 

We are primarily crusiers and generally its just my wife and I aboard so reliablity is our primary concern, however we do want to be able to roll in some of our 150 when the wind kicks up and still have some shape. (The sail has foam luff strips to help there).

 

So what do the Anarchists think of Profurl?

 

 

I'm probably a cynical a-hole - but perhaps the riggers get the better discount from Profurl??

 

We'll we're on the same wavelength. Anyone care to confirm or deny?

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Profurls roll nicely, but I think they are too heavy for

anything but a heavy blue water cruiser.

I do not know if others have had this problem,

but I have found it very difficult to hoist a sail on

most of the Profurl equipped boats I have encountered.

The upper swivel seems to drag on the extrusion when hoisting.

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As a rigger - tho I havent installed a Profurl lately, so cant compare costing. Profurls are heavier, & have been known to have a lot more friction/resistance to turning. Also - NOTHING is 'sealed' in the marine environment, I've had to replace a few bearing sets.

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I've got an older R25 on my S2. Probably about 15+ years old.

 

For sure it can be hard to furl. They have improved the drum cage design.

 

I haven't had any issues hoisting or dropping the head sail but last nite it got seized up some how. I turned the drum a bitvand the sail dropped easily. Not sure why it did that.

 

Also have not had any halyard wrap problem.

 

Rick

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I would seriously consider a Facnor if I was you. We had a ProFurl and when we replace it this winter it's going to be with a Facnor.

 

http://www.facnor.com/

 

See if you can find boats with both and try before you buy. I tried the Facnor on a friends boat and was really impressed.

 

Good luck!

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I'm a rigger and I deeply dislike Profurl. I've had customer service issues and fit issues where I've had to re-work joints to get the things together. The manual sucks, and they roll hard. As a sailmaker we hate them because the wrap stop allows very little latitude in luff length. #6 luff tape goes up hard but #5 makes me nervous in serious conditions. Neither one fits properly. Buy a Harken, get it installed by someone who knows what they're doing, install a halyard restrainer no matter what anyone says, and I assure you that you will be satisfied.

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I took the profurl off my old boat and chopped it into pieces before putitng in the dumpster so no fool would hurt themselves fishign it out and putting in on ther boat. Replaced with a Harken.

 

I can say I've done a direct comparison between units on the same boat, same inventory of sails, and the Harken unit puts the Proful to shame in every way but price. It furls better on the first day and after a few years. It is better made. The extrusion joints are a better transition with less luff tape wear. The foil is vastly better in shape and weight. The upper swivel on the Harken is "longer", but the drum's size efficiency makes up for it. The upper swivel is a thing of beauty; the Profurl ones don't last nearly as long, and it is a royal pain to remove a Profurl drum to then slide off the upper swivel and send it for replacement bearings.

 

This is all based on the 2.5 generation Harken. The newer version seems even better.

 

New boat came with a furlex. Jury still out for me on how much I like it. Contemplating simply removing it and putting on a Harken if I don't find myself liking the Furlex soon. The Harken was that good on the old boat.

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#6 luff tape goes up hard but #5 makes me nervous in serious conditions. Neither one fits properly. Buy a Harken, get it installed by someone who knows what they're doing, install a halyard restrainer no matter what anyone says, and I assure you that you will be satisfied.

 

Total 100% agreement. #5 can pull out. #6 is a bitch to hoist. It wants #5 but the opening is too big. Get a Harken! I put a MarkIV unit 1 on my boat last season. Perfect.

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20 years ago I would have considered Profurl, but the luff groove and feeder are evil, the antiwrap spaceship fouls spinnaker halyards, hard to turn,etc. Harken works well but I don't like replacing extrusions that are glued together. Furlex has the best complete package and always has parts available.

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Hello Catalina 36,

 

As the guys mentioned on the previous posting, Profurl is a very good unit and it is definitively more cruising than racing oriented.

 

Most of the cruisers out there have crossed the Atlantic carrying a Profurl on their rig, so they have proven good on the cruising field.

 

Another very good option, both price and performance wise, are the new line of Harken furlers and on your particular case you need a Cruising Unit I if your headstay is no larger than 5/16" (which I doubt).

 

Give me a call if you need to chat about it.

 

Best,

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Got to agree with Rod here. The Harken Cruising furler may best suit your needs if you don't do any racing and don't need a unit that will convert to a twin groove racing foil. It lacks the bells and whistles of a Mark IV, e.g. the tack fitting doesn't swivel, but works well for the type of sailor that puts the Genny up at the beginning of the season and takes it down when the boat gets put away.

 

I'm in Annapolis, pm me if you have questions.

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Got to agree with Rod here. The Harken Cruising furler may best suit your needs if you don't do any racing and don't need a unit that will convert to a twin groove racing foil. It lacks the bells and whistles of a Mark IV, e.g. the tack fitting doesn't swivel, but works well for the type of sailor that puts the Genny up at the beginning of the season and takes it down when the boat gets put away.

 

I'm in Annapolis, pm me if you have questions.

 

Yeah I'm a cruiser, but a racer at heart, even though you pretty well described me above. Since there is not a huge price differential in the crusing unit and MKIV, I'd opt to pay a bit more and get the extra torlon bb's, free tack, etc, etc.

 

I looked very closely at Harken (crusing and MKIV) and Furlex at the Annapolis boat show and have read all the comments I could find online from sailors using those brands. If it comes to to doing a self install I'm leaning towards Furlex since it comes with the new forestay and going with Harken if I can get a rigger to quote me what I want vs. what they want to sell.

 

Of the big 4 (Harken, Furlex, Shaeffer(sp?), and Profurl), Profurl comes out last in my mind, and Shaeffer is out on price. While there are quite a few Profurl supporters, you just don't find the negative comments about the other 3 that you do about Profurl. Finally, I don't believe in permantly sealed anything, especially not steel ball bearing that are subject to heavy loads in a marine environment. If the bearings were quick and simple for an owner to replace, the scales might tip differently for me, but that does not appear to be the case.

 

Thanks to everyone thats offered comments, on and off line. I really appreciate the input both pro and con and I realize other folks my prioritze things differently.

 

The search continues....

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Profurl are a simpler furler and are easy to use install your self or replace parts. The harken furlers are a more racing based furler. i would recomend a Pro furler for all cruising and i have cruised and raced with both.

 

As for the price that riggers buy them for both rigging companys i have worked for get the same discount on harken or profurl.

 

Hope this helps.

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While Harken has a good unit both we install both the MKIV and Cruising you can get a better deal with someone like Bamar or Adalo and get a great furler for half the price if you are only cruising.

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... I thought Profurl recently lowered their "retail" price and also lowered the discount to riggers in an effort to make the smoke and mirrors price look somewhat more palatable.

 

20 years ago, Profurl was known as the furler built like a tank. Their extrusion connections take up 100% of the torque between extrusions when furling. I don't know of any changes to their classic system since then that could have changed their image except for maybe hype or lake of customer service. The furling at the dock is stiffer than the systems with Torlon bearings but in the open ocean full of breeze, the Profurl meets the needs and furls/reefs smooth. The luff grooves are not meant to be Tuff Luff smooth either, they are built tight for a reason. Sure, there are some issues regarding maintenance but that being said, over the last 25 years, there's not one furling system mentioned here that hasn't passed through my hands for repair...

 

I like Profurl, Harken, Schaefer, Facnor and even Furlers like the Cruising Design Flexible Furler and Hood's LD Series for certain applications (I think your boat originally had the Hood 810 LD) but for your Catalina 36, get a Furlex. The systems come in a kit with everything you're going to need. The customer service is great and you'll be happy in the end no questions.

 

The specs of your boat suggest (if you have the tall rig) the Furlex 208-15 but you probably have a 5/8" pin at the stem which will require the 308-15. Check into that.

 

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any questions...

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+1 on the prev. post.

I rig in nz, see all the brands mentioned above in need of love. Many problems are instalation based, but a good deal have been abused in some way by the user+electric winch+inattention combination. :rolleyes:

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+1 on the prev. post.

I rig in nz, see all the brands mentioned above in need of love. Many problems are instalation based, but a good deal have been abused in some way by the user+electric winch+inattention combination. :rolleyes:

 

Fuck off & welcome to SA

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IMO Profurl are at the lower end of the furler market, heavy, tight, corrossion loving, difficult to work on...whaa, whaa. That retarded halyard wrap stop! I'd be embarrassed to put that in the kit

 

Harken, Furlex etc have a better product (depending on the specific application) that is better designed, better made etc

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So we're making progress and have in hand quotes for a Harken product from a local outfit of acceptable reputation. They actually provided quotes for both the MKIV and Cruising Unit, and quoted both the Unit 1 and Unit 2 since my boat is right on the break point so I could weigh all the options.

 

So far I've got one opinon from a CS36 owner that a MKIV Unit 1 is fine for my boat and one opinon from a Tartan 37 owner that I should go for the Unit 2. Neither of them cared for the Crusing Unit though there have been a couple of folks suggest I consider it.

 

From a budget perspective the MKIV Unit 1 would be my perference and I don't think I want to spring for the Unit 2. The Cruising Unit 2 is in the same price point so it comes down to sizing the unit proplerly.

 

The question now comes down to should I upgrade to the Unit 2 for a C36 TR?

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I believe I replied to you on the Catalina 36 mailing list that I have a MkIII Unit 2 on my standard rig Cat. 36. I would not go smaller, particularly with the extra 2' of mast you have. The cruising unit would be fine, but I don't like the round extrusion. If I didn't have the Harken already installed, I'd look at a Bamar as my second choice.

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Yeah I'm a cruiser, but a racer at heart, even though you pretty well described me above. Since there is not a huge price differential in the crusing unit and MKIV, I'd opt to pay a bit more and get the extra torlon bb's, free tack, etc, etc.

 

I looked very closely at Harken (crusing and MKIV) and Furlex at the Annapolis boat show and have read all the comments I could find online from sailors using those brands. If it comes to to doing a self install I'm leaning towards Furlex since it comes with the new forestay and going with Harken if I can get a rigger to quote me what I want vs. what they want to sell.

I had the Harken Mk IV put on the Sabre two years ago and have had no issues. Used a Naptown rigger (Southbound Cruising or something like that, if I remember correctly) at a decent price. PM me if you want to know more - I'd have to dig up the contact info.

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I believe I replied to you on the Catalina 36 mailing list that I have a MkIII Unit 2 on my standard rig Cat. 36. I would not go smaller, particularly with the extra 2' of mast you have. The cruising unit would be fine, but I don't like the round extrusion. If I didn't have the Harken already installed, I'd look at a Bamar as my second choice.

 

 

Thanks. I'm not sure how close the MKIII and MKIV are but assume they are very similar. I suspect most folks would take Harken's recommendation to heart, but I'm analytical by nature so appreciate the addtional data points. That's two folks that have the Unit 2 on similar/same type boat and are satisfied against 1 with a Unit 1 that's also satisfied.

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Harken is simply a great company. We have one on our boat and it has worked very well. A buddy has one on his C&C 41 that he accidently ground off the end of the extrusion. We payed hell trying to get it back on the extrusion at seasons end, buggering it up in the process. He sent it back to Harken and they refurbed it at no cost. Mind you this is an older boat and certainly the the unit was not warranteed by then but Harken still repaired it at no cost. Gotta tell you, Harken is my gear supplier of choice, period.

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After much thought, research, consideration of trustworthy riggers my area and analysis of my cash position, I have decided to go with a Profurl LCI 32 for my C36. I really would have liked to go with the Harken MKIV, but just could not rationalize the cost differential given my expected use for this boat. Most Harken owners I talked with and every rigger I requested quotes from, indicated I should use the Harken Unit 2. That was also the first thought that went through my head when I looked at the units at the boat show so, I took that input to heart, and in the final analysis I couldn't rationalize the $1K cost increase over the Profurl. The Harken Unit 1 was in the same price range as the Profurl, but the risk of buying undersize, over rode the attraction of the MKIV's features. I also felt the Profurl would be a better choice in the long run than the Harken Cruising Unit based on input from Harken proponents.

 

While I expect the Profurl may well have issues with the sealed bearings eventually, it likely won't happen in the near future and if it does the bearings can be replaced. In the mean time, we'll have a furler capable of reefing thats proven rugged and reliable which is more than I can say for the POS Hood unit thats on the boat now. I'm pretty comfortable the Profurl will be more than up to the bay sailing currently on my horizon and the coastal crusing I hope to someday be able to do.

 

I appreciate the input from the gang of anarchists that took time to share their experience.

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Riggers like Profurl, because they never get come backs on the product. They sell the product, and customer never has a problem. The system is bullet proof. It uses a High Carbon steel bearing, which is sealed. Often people say, oh the seal will fail, and the bearing will rust. True, but no more a problem than the ball bearing in your car wheel, that certainly does far more revolutions in a year than your furler. All you have to ask yourself, is when you are out there in a blow, and you need to get rid of the sail. Would you rather have a plastic bearing (Harken) a stainless Steel bearing (Furlex) (As we all know, stainless steel is no bearing material. who has ever screwed up a Noresman fitting... Stainless steel on stainless steel is a very bad idea. )

 

Just look at the big charter companies, look at what brand of furler they choose. much like rental cars, the equipment gets hammered. (probaly even more so)

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Riggers like Profurl, because they never get come backs on the product. They sell the product, and customer never has a problem. The system is bullet proof. It uses a High Carbon steel bearing, which is sealed. Often people say, oh the seal will fail, and the bearing will rust. True, but no more a problem than the ball bearing in your car wheel, that certainly does far more revolutions in a year than your furler. All you have to ask yourself, is when you are out there in a blow, and you need to get rid of the sail. Would you rather have a plastic bearing (Harken) a stainless Steel bearing (Furlex) (As we all know, stainless steel is no bearing material. who has ever screwed up a Noresman fitting... Stainless steel on stainless steel is a very bad idea. )

 

Just look at the big charter companies, look at what brand of furler they choose. much like rental cars, the equipment gets hammered. (probaly even more so)

 

I've had the same luff tape issues with profurl. #5 is to small #6 is to big. Furlex is #1 Reefrite #2

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