Jump to content


Lost Antarctic Sailors, Berserk Sailboat. Questions re there loss.


  • Please log in to reply
59 replies to this topic

#1 bravestdog

bravestdog

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 17 posts
  • Location:San Francisco Bay Area

Posted 08 March 2011 - 04:43 AM

My question is: What type of sailboat would have survived the conditions that they were exposed to, ie 80-90 mph winds, 20 feet seas, frozen ice the size of couches to homes? They were in a steel hull 45 foot sailboat and were presumed lost/sunk at sea. What type of boat did they need to survive those conditions assuming they were holed by a giant piece of floating ice, or blown over...? What type of boat can survive floating ice in 20 foot seas and 80 mph winds?

I am still hoping that they will survive and show up in a few weeks, a little cold and tired, but still bad ass explorers.

This is a continuation of a former posting re the lost sailors of the sailboat Berserk that was lost in the Antarctic a few weeks ago. The original thread was here http://forums.sailin...howtopic=119215

#2 Recidivist

Recidivist

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,485 posts
  • Location:I come from a land down under
  • Interests:sailing, building sailing boats, cruising, racing, day sailing.

Posted 08 March 2011 - 05:01 AM

My question is: What type of sailboat would have survived the conditions that they were exposed to, ie 80-90 mph winds, 20 feet seas, frozen ice the size of couches to homes? They were in a steel hull 45 foot sailboat and were presumed lost/sunk at sea. What type of boat did they need to survive those conditions assuming they were holed by a giant piece of floating ice, or blown over...? What type of boat can survive floating ice in 20 foot seas and 80 mph winds?

I am still hoping that they will survive and show up in a few weeks, a little cold and tired, but still bad ass explorers.

This is a continuation of a former posting re the lost sailors of the sailboat Berserk that was lost in the Antarctic a few weeks ago. The original thread was here http://forums.sailin...howtopic=119215



I'm also very puzzled - a steel hull is (almost) indestructible. I remember Vic Myer's 54' Solo being caught against a concrete wharf in Punta Arenas when a 100 knot storm hit. Her steel hull was pounded almost flat to the centreline, but she she didn't sink. Vic had her craned aboard a ship and taken to Holland where Abeking and Rasmussen rebuilt the entire port side, and she is still afloat today. But 45' isn't a big boat in those waters and maybe she was just overwhelmed.

#3 GRUMPY

GRUMPY

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 27,117 posts
  • Location:Balikpapan, Indonesia
  • Interests:Hobie Miracle 20

Posted 08 March 2011 - 05:03 AM

Lots of those protuding sharp bits on the bergs I think Rick

#4 Recidivist

Recidivist

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,485 posts
  • Location:I come from a land down under
  • Interests:sailing, building sailing boats, cruising, racing, day sailing.

Posted 08 March 2011 - 05:13 AM

Lots of those protuding sharp bits on the bergs I think Rick


Are there though Grumps? I dunno, I only like ice in my drinks. I thought about that, but wouldn't the wave action melt the sharp bits away and blunten them? Any cold water experts here to enlighten us?

The boat looked like a Herman Boro design, or similar. At 45' she would go somewhere around 16 -18 tons I reckon. I'd expect 4.5 mm topsides, 6mm below waterline. That takes a significat can opener. Unless a hatch blew off or something.

AFAIK, most of the adventure charterer boats down that way are aluminium, 60+ footers. If the ice could penetrate a steel hull, why would Skip Novak et al take a risk with alloy when they do it for a living?

#5 ozzy58

ozzy58

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,651 posts

Posted 08 March 2011 - 05:35 AM

at low temperature, many types of steel become brittle and stiff

apparently a factor with the titanic

on the other hand, aluminium is softer and can take more of a pounding without " tearing "

the boat would have been falling off waves ONTO the ice

and a piece of ice the size of your fridge weighs about 4 tonnes

#6 prozak

prozak

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 940 posts

Posted 08 March 2011 - 09:02 AM

You must have a big fridge.

Water weighs 1000kg per m3

My fridge. One of those side by side fridge freezer things is quite big..... but is still only 1m3.

#7 Just Bob

Just Bob

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,045 posts
  • Location:Australia

Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:09 AM

You must have a big fridge.

Water weighs 1000kg per m3

My fridge. One of those side by side fridge freezer things is quite big..... but is still only 1m3.


While I'd like to disagree with 'Ricardo' because he is a fucking dickhead, that doesn't hold a man card and is a lying piece of shit.

The average fridge is only 1m3. Unlike dickheads prozaks claim that a Side by Side is only 1m3.

But if the FUCK HEAD!!! prorak had thought about it he would of realized that Aussie58 was just trying to make a point, not debate the size of a bit of ice, that could sink a yacht.




#8 GRUMPY

GRUMPY

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 27,117 posts
  • Location:Balikpapan, Indonesia
  • Interests:Hobie Miracle 20

Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:21 AM

I flicked on to Discovery last night...bloody whale wars. That Watson wanker had driven his boat into the ice, wind shifted and was blowing the ice back on to the boat. Hull was flexing 5-6" and welds were breaking.

#9 auscat

auscat

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,325 posts
  • Location:Airlie Beach

Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:35 AM

Bit of a hijack but I did a lot of work refairing Solo in 89-90? with all the bog blown off man she had some battle scars.
There was one dent about the size and shape of a rugby ball that always sticks in my mind cause to try and create that in a shop would be damn hard.

#10 Gouvernail

Gouvernail

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 21,778 posts
  • Location:Austin Texas
  • Interests:margaritas, hippie chicks, durable flying discs for retriever dog play

Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:46 AM

Exactly how does going out in a boat like that to encounter such conditions different from an attempted suicide??

#11 Just Bob

Just Bob

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,045 posts
  • Location:Australia

Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:54 AM

Exactly how does going out in a boat like that to encounter such conditions different from an attempted suicide??


Its called adventure Gov, just like the person that discovered America, Australia, etc.

Or like anybody that goes and drives on a road, you can not be 100% sure you'll come home.

#12 Presuming Ed

Presuming Ed

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,037 posts
  • Location:London, UK

Posted 08 March 2011 - 11:12 AM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_class

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Polar_class

http://www.tc.gc.ca/...es-msc-2002.pdf

http://www.iacs.org....UR_I_pdf410.pdf

#13 Just Bob

Just Bob

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,045 posts
  • Location:Australia

Posted 08 March 2011 - 11:22 AM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_class

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Polar_class

http://www.tc.gc.ca/...es-msc-2002.pdf

http://www.iacs.org....UR_I_pdf410.pdf


OK you've shown your skills to be able to use google... What is your point.

#14 Just Bob

Just Bob

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,045 posts
  • Location:Australia

Posted 08 March 2011 - 11:31 AM

Could of a bit of ice ripped of a skin fitting?

Could they of the been knocked down and it didn't recover?

Could a container float that far south?

Did a fire occur?

Fuck, so many if, buts and maybes.

Shit happens and I'm sure they didn't want the shit that happened

Just like the pic below

Posted Image


#15 ozzy58

ozzy58

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,651 posts

Posted 08 March 2011 - 03:07 PM

Bob,

add the wind and wave conditions to the above photo

it was an offshore wind ( katabatic ) kicking up waves more than 6 M

those sort of wind waves are very short and steep, and the boat would be falling off the crests

this weather was also blowing the ice from the shore

and not all the bergy bits would have been as small as a fridge

the boat would have difficulty standing up to this under bare rig

and possibly any furled headsails would be flogging, unfurling, self destructing, and possibly leading to destruction of the rig

and it happens so quickly

people from pnw and great lakes might better describe this than I can,

and how apparently ok conditions can become more than 50 knots in around 20 minutes

#16 Rather_Be_Sailing

Rather_Be_Sailing

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 36 posts
  • Location:UK
  • Interests:Stuff.

Posted 08 March 2011 - 03:32 PM


Lots of those protuding sharp bits on the bergs I think Rick

AFAIK, most of the adventure charterer boats down that way are aluminium, 60+ footers. If the ice could penetrate a steel hull, why would Skip Novak et al take a risk with alloy when they do it for a living?


I'm no expert, but I had these exact discussions with a friend of mine who sailed around the world, Adrian Flanagan (alphaglobex). Though I didnt know what he was planning at the time.

Its not exactly straight forward. But I believe that the weight of an Aluminium vessel built for the same strength can be about 35-45% lighter than the equivalent steel boat.

So that also means if you are willing to take the hit on weight you can also build a much stronger alumunimum boat for the same weight as a steel boat.

#17 Navigare

Navigare

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 124 posts
  • Location:Stockholm - Sweden
  • Interests:Sailing?

Posted 08 March 2011 - 06:02 PM

Might have just been icing on rig, guardrails and deck that made the center if gravity to high and she capsized.

#18 ozzy58

ozzy58

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,651 posts

Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:39 PM

with a steel boat , they are always touching up the waterline due to ice

#19 mad

mad

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,043 posts

Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:51 PM



Lots of those protuding sharp bits on the bergs I think Rick

AFAIK, most of the adventure charterer boats down that way are aluminium, 60+ footers. If the ice could penetrate a steel hull, why would Skip Novak et al take a risk with alloy when they do it for a living?


I'm no expert, but I had these exact discussions with a friend of mine who sailed around the world, Adrian Flanagan (alphaglobex). Though I didnt know what he was planning at the time.

Its not exactly straight forward. But I believe that the weight of an Aluminium vessel built for the same strength can be about 35-45% lighter than the equivalent steel boat.

So that also means if you are willing to take the hit on weight you can also build a much stronger alumunimum boat for the same weight as a steel boat.

Be good to see some figures for the above? Guess it depends on it being a yacht or icebreaker, horses for courses.

You may be right about the first 3 words of your post though. ;)

Your welcome. :P

#20 Moonduster

Moonduster

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,369 posts

Posted 08 March 2011 - 11:45 PM

In the context of this discussion, I don't understand your analysis regarding making an alloy yacht "stronger" than a steel yacht by adding more aluminum.

I believe the primary reasons for selecting steel over alloy is that steel is easier to obtain, cut, shape and weld than is alloy. By the time one builds an entire cruising boat, the weight delta between steel and alloy is pretty much in the noise. A home builder can do a steel boat but probably can't do alloy. Alloy also has far more potential for devastating corrosion problems.

Seems to me there are four interesting failure modes to consider - punctured by ice, crushed by impact, destroyed by sea state and sunk by icing.

Steel much better puncture resistance - no way to approach it with aluminium at similar weight. There's a slight chance that one could build a better structure in alloy and survive being crushed by ice, but I believe that's more about hull shape and design principals and could easily be done with either steel or alloy. Damage as a result of sea state shouldn't be a problem for either a well-designed and constructed alloy or steel boat. Both materials have the same vulnerability to icing and it seems like the conditions were perfect for this to occur.

WIthout a lot more information, it's pretty hard to say what happened. The offshore wind should have greatly reduced the odds of being crushed. I'd guess that sea state didn't do them in - its just so rare to hear of a small boat breaking up due to wave and wind action - although the crew could easily have been swept overboard or a boarding wave could have damaged a hatch and filled the boat.

It's my understanding from reading the various articles that the owner of the boat was ashore, off on a trip inland. That suggests that the crew on board might not have been as knowledgable in terms of heavy weather, survival storm considerations - especially icing. My guess is that they were down below riding out the weather and the boat iced up and rolled over.

#21 Recidivist

Recidivist

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,485 posts
  • Location:I come from a land down under
  • Interests:sailing, building sailing boats, cruising, racing, day sailing.

Posted 09 March 2011 - 03:40 AM

My guess is that they were down below riding out the weather and the boat iced up and rolled over.


From the articles, it seems the weather was indeed phenomenal, but is this realistic? With a deep ballast keel, surely the amount of icing would have to be very considerable to roll the boat. If she was being swept by waves, wouldn't the accumulated ice on deck and low down be melted away again by the salt water? And what could you do about icing high in the rig anyway? I've seen photos of boats sunk by ice in Scandinavia, but they were moored. I haven't heard of boats underway being rolled and sunk in that way (although there may be a reason we don't hear about it).

A sailing trip to Antarctica (and doubling the Horn under sail) is on my bucket list, so I'm keen to pick up knowledge about this stuff.

#22 Cisco

Cisco

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 177 posts
  • Location:Chile

Posted 09 March 2011 - 06:02 AM


My guess is that they were down below riding out the weather and the boat iced up and rolled over.

I've seen photos of boats sunk by ice in Scandinavia, but they were moored. I haven't heard of boats underway being rolled and sunk in that way (although there may be a reason we don't hear about it).



Trawlers in the White Sea and thereabouts have been sunk by icing compromising their stability while at sea and it is an acknowledged risk to big ships . The risk is such that quite a few pages are devoted to the problem in 'The Mariners' Handbook' and similar publications... none of which I have to hand just now.

The ship shown on her beam ends and sinking earlier in the thread had only a small hole in her hull, unfortunately it breached her sewage holding tank and she down flooded through the heads in the passo accomodation.... they were truly in the shit....



#23 David R Stone

David R Stone

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 31 posts
  • Location:Maya-Maya, Batangas, Philippines
  • Interests:Maya-Maya Yacht Club
    Authorized producer of C-Maps

Posted 10 March 2011 - 02:16 AM

S/Y "Berserk" spent about 10 days at Maya-Maya Yacht Club, Inc on its way to New Zealand and the Antartic. They arrived late one evening and had sailed from a port in the South Eastern Coast of Russia. My recollection is that Jarle (Charlie), who is a real character, had departed Russia in quite a hurry as a member of the crew had got into some problems with officialdom.

On the voayage Jarle accepted various "paying guests" of which one was a woman who had never sailed before. Just thuink of that! Russia to the Philippines as a first voyage and then with three strong young men(!!)

Naturally very happy to learn that Jarle is safe and feel so sad at the loss of the three (3) crew members and "berserk" . May they R.I.P.

For the record Jarle displayed all the good points of a cruising skipper. He cared for his vessel and crew; organized and perfected preventative maintenance; had a clear vision of what he intended to achieve; a commercial eye for what he was undertaking AND (fom a marina operator's point of view!) paid his bills promptly and willingly.

We know he will bounce back and naturally we hoe to see him again at MMYC ------------TEAM MAYA-MAYA

#24 ozzy58

ozzy58

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,651 posts

Posted 10 March 2011 - 02:51 AM

The bigger boats, skip novak's pelagic(s), spirit of sydney, and peter blake's old boat ( I forget the name )

all have 4 or more watertight bulkheads

does anyone know if this is the case for " Berserk " ?

#25 Rylix

Rylix

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 1 posts

Posted 16 March 2011 - 10:45 PM

First interview with Jarle Andhøy.
http://www.sail-worl...ing-tank./81283

He goes into detail about the bulkheads also.

#26 Terrafirma

Terrafirma

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,528 posts

Posted 17 March 2011 - 12:45 AM

S/Y "Berserk" spent about 10 days at Maya-Maya Yacht Club, Inc on its way to New Zealand and the Antartic. They arrived late one evening and had sailed from a port in the South Eastern Coast of Russia. My recollection is that Jarle (Charlie), who is a real character, had departed Russia in quite a hurry as a member of the crew had got into some problems with officialdom.

On the voayage Jarle accepted various "paying guests" of which one was a woman who had never sailed before. Just thuink of that! Russia to the Philippines as a first voyage and then with three strong young men(!!)

Naturally very happy to learn that Jarle is safe and feel so sad at the loss of the three (3) crew members and "berserk" . May they R.I.P.

For the record Jarle displayed all the good points of a cruising skipper. He cared for his vessel and crew; organized and perfected preventative maintenance; had a clear vision of what he intended to achieve; a commercial eye for what he was undertaking AND (fom a marina operator's point of view!) paid his bills promptly and willingly.

We know he will bounce back and naturally we hoe to see him again at MMYC ------------TEAM MAYA-MAYA


Sounds like Jarle did not sail this voyage with all the good points of a cruising skipper according to the article below. I don't know personally but reading this article sends alarm bells off for me.

An extensive air and sea search found no trace of the 14-metre Berserk, which disappeared in minus 12-degree Celsius waters on February 22 except for its damaged life raft.

The Berserk yacht was attempting to mark the centenary of Norwegian explorer Ronald Amundsen's South Pole expedition.

Meanwhile, two survivors of the mission were reported to have reached safety after a 20-hour drive across the ice on quad bikes to catch the last flight out of Antarctica of the southern hemisphere summer.

They aborted the expedition after hearing that the Berserk had disappeared. No more aircraft will be able to land to supply scientists working at research bases in Antarctica until the end of the year.

Antarctic New Zealand chief executive Lou Sanson was quoted saying the whole expedition was beyond understanding: 'It just seems all the protocols and safety principles operating in Antarctica have been broken.'

Sanson said the two survivors, named as mission leader Jarle Andhoy, 34, and Samuel Massie Ulvolden, 18, were suffering from frostbite and exhaustion after driving for nearly 20 hours to reach New Zealand's Scott Base.

Sanson said the men were flying to Christchurch on a United States aircraft and would be met by Norwegian diplomats based in Australia. He said it was up to the Norwegian government to deal with them.

“I don't think Norwegian authorities knew about it. The US government didn't know about it and the New Zealand government didn't know about it.”

He said under New Zealand law anyone heading that far south needed a permit from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade. He said the trip to the South Pole was not a wise decision.

”It was very unusual to be attempting a 1600km trip to the South Pole on motorbikes. It is minus 20 there. On the Polar Plateau it is minus 30. You get wind chill up to minus 70. These guys were 220km towards the pole and still had over 1200km to go.

HMNZS Wellington conducted a search in the Ross Sea in 180km/h winds and was damaged. The Sea Shepherd Conservation Society ship Steve Irwin also searched, using its helicopter and a boat.

They found a life raft from the missing yacht but it was damaged and empty. The storm which probably claimed the yacht was the worst for 20 years and may have caused a breakout of a huge slab of ice from the McMurdo ice shelf, Sanson said.

The missing men were named by Stuff as Robert Skaane, 34, Tom Gisle Bellika, 36, and Leonard Banks, 32 from South Africa.

#27 SeaGul

SeaGul

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 219 posts
  • Location:Oslo Norway
  • Interests:Fast multis and bikes and...

Posted 26 January 2012 - 10:08 AM

A new Berserk is on the sail back to Antarctica til find answers and to pay respekt to the dead.

Jarle and his companion from last trip- and two more - is on a new boat they bought in New Zealand - while the navy wants to stop them - because they dont have permissians like last time.


... but they are true vikings and anarcists...

#28 Tom Ray

Tom Ray

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 26,127 posts
  • Location:Punta Gorda FL
  • Interests:~~/)/)~~

Posted 26 January 2012 - 10:59 AM

A new Berserk is on the sail back to Antarctica til find answers and to pay respekt to the dead.

Jarle and his companion from last trip- and two more - is on a new boat they bought in New Zealand - while the navy wants to stop them - because they dont have permissians like last time.


... but they are true vikings and anarcists...


Maybe a new thread titled "This is Insanely Dangerous Again" is in order?

#29 SeaGul

SeaGul

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 219 posts
  • Location:Oslo Norway
  • Interests:Fast multis and bikes and...

Posted 26 January 2012 - 02:35 PM

Well how dangerous - I dont know - the boat is an 54feet steelboat - quite comfortable - and they made som adjustments for this trip.

Now it seems they are out of New Zealands water - and in international waters.

Will be press conference tonight - right before the 2. episode of the TV-series that is the story about last years trip - in all that was a trip that everthing went bad - first one crew member - an profiled Hells Angels member - got into trouble in Russia - and was almost killed but survived - and now will be on the press conference. And other crew member later fell en the water in a harbour during a party session and almost drowned together with a local girl - all that happend before they got to Antarctica where the real problem started.

#30 Ryley

Ryley

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,046 posts
  • Location:Boston, MA
  • Interests:Sailing, Photography, Sailing, Mountain Biking.. did I mention sailing?

Posted 03 February 2012 - 11:56 PM

A new Berserk is on the sail back to Antarctica til find answers and to pay respekt to the dead.

Jarle and his companion from last trip- and two more - is on a new boat they bought in New Zealand - while the navy wants to stop them - because they dont have permissians like last time.


... but they are true vikings and anarcists...


And kidnappers apparently...

Norwegian yachtie nearing Antarctic territory
Updated at 9:18 am today
Norwegian adventurer Jarle Andhoy expects to reach the outer limits of Antarctic territory at 60 degrees south on Sunday.
The man will then decide whether to push forward to McMurdo Sound or turn back because of heavy pack ice.
Mr Andhoy is trying to find traces of his support vessel Berserk which sank in February last year with three crew during his bid to reach the South Pole.
His lawyer has told Norwegian media that Mr Andhoy is aware of the possibility of breaching Antarctic regulations if he moves, unauthorised, into its territory.
His shipmates include an unidentified New Zealand man who was carrying out repairs aboard the yacht Nilaya when it left Auckland abruptly on 23 January this year.



#31 DRIFTW00D

DRIFTW00D

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,315 posts
  • Location:Blue Water Area Great Lakes

Posted 04 February 2012 - 04:11 AM

Its the ice above the water line that forms on anything as the wind blows spray past in below freezing conditions thats the one thing will make life difficult in a hurry. Boats become Top heavy and the icing adds weight sinking the hull deeper. Soon the ice makes the lines stiff and unable to be moved through the blocks. Sails will hold the shape of the opposite tack frozen in the shape the were in when the icing started. Working lines, changing sails, reefing, walking on deck is almost not possible. Don't ask me how I Know. I would not go down there for fun on anything less then one of our big red ice breakers.

#32 sailingk8

sailingk8

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,308 posts
  • Location:The Swamp

Posted 05 February 2012 - 12:31 PM

The new boat he took south looks like a Roberts 532
http://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/local-news/6308920/Norwegians-may-be-headed-for-Antarctica-MNZ

Posted Image

#33 Estar

Estar

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,467 posts

Posted 05 February 2012 - 02:04 PM

The new boat he took south looks like a Roberts 532


It's an Alan Mummery design.

#34 Foghorn77

Foghorn77

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,058 posts

Posted 05 February 2012 - 03:58 PM

Where does Jarle get all of his money? Movie rights?

#35 sailingk8

sailingk8

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,308 posts
  • Location:The Swamp

Posted 05 February 2012 - 05:44 PM


The new boat he took south looks like a Roberts 532


It's an Alan Mummery design.

I stand corrected.
http://www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/54-steel-allan-mummery/67857

#36 Estar

Estar

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,467 posts

Posted 05 February 2012 - 06:17 PM

for our kiwi members . . .what does "plate to category 6 survey" mean/imply? Is that a tough or easy standard?What does it mean for plate thickness and watertight bulkheads/

Is this the definition "IMCA Category 6 Within three miles of land and not more than three miles’ radius from either the point of departure to sea or the seaward boundary of protected waters. "

#37 Ryley

Ryley

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,046 posts
  • Location:Boston, MA
  • Interests:Sailing, Photography, Sailing, Mountain Biking.. did I mention sailing?

Posted 05 February 2012 - 07:08 PM

Wow so all we care about is the kind of boat, not that he left with an unplanned passenger and without any permissions. Cool anarchy :)

#38 trenace

trenace

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,282 posts
  • Location:Ocala, FL

Posted 05 February 2012 - 07:14 PM

If I read right the boat that was lost had a bottom of 1.5 inch steel. Jeez.

There wasn't a mention of the thickness at waterline or topsides.

To me the big question mark in the story is, Why did the remaining crew phone and in essence say, "Everything's great, but by the way we're departing without you" let alone why did they do this knowing a bad storm was coming and they were at an anchorage apparently considered safer than being at sea?


And further, with the EPIRB going off only a few miles after this apparently-completely-voluntary things-are-fine-here unscheduled departure?

#39 Dawg Gonit

Dawg Gonit

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,055 posts
  • Location:Channel Islands (oxnard), Calif

Posted 05 February 2012 - 09:58 PM

After reading this book, I think anyone sailing in to the Icy Polar regions in a small boat is nuts.

Posted Image

#40 Estar

Estar

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,467 posts

Posted 05 February 2012 - 10:12 PM

To me the big question mark in the story is, Why did the remaining crew phone and in essence say, "Everything's great, but by the way we're departing without you" let alone why did they do this knowing a bad storm was coming and they were at an anchorage apparently considered safer than being at sea?


And further, with the EPIRB going off only a few miles after this apparently-completely-voluntary things-are-fine-here unscheduled departure?


We only have Jarle's word that's what they said on the phone and he has already changed his story a couple times.

There are NO safe all weather anchorages in the Ross sea. That's clearly stated in the Antarctic pilot and agreed by every professional who has ever been there.

Per first hand reports from people who were at the station, they were anchored in the channel, just outside town/station less than a day before the storm hit and moved to Backdoor bay initially. I suspect that's when they talked to Jarle. Not later when they left Backdoor in the storm.

Here is a chart of the anchorage. They were anchored in "backdoor bay" (I have marked on the chart in red), and got a forecast on 60kts sustained with much higher gusts from the SE (I have marked in yellow). That is all confirmed in one of the official reports on the incident (google "The Berserk Incident, Ross Sea").

Attached File  beserk anchorage.jpg   279.23K   140 downloads

Any prudent skipper would have left Backdoor bay with that forecast as its directly open to the SE. The choice would have been to try to get to open sea or re-anchor around in "Horseshoe Bay". I think I would have tried for Horseshoe, as being at sea in 60kts with heavy ice would be horrifying, but horseshoe is certainly not all all weather anchorage - open to the NE and swept by katabatic winds from two directions. This was just a no win situation. Below is google map showing where the epirb went off, 8 miles from Horseshoe.

Attached File  berserk.jpg   223.96K   122 downloads

Really only one of two things could have happened to the boat - either a weld popped and it flooded quite quickly or the rig iced and it capsized in the strong winds and down flooded thru an unsecured opening.

Wow so all we care about is the kind of boat, not that he left with an unplanned passenger and without any permissions. Cool anarchy :)


Well, none of that is news. He's basically never gotten proper permission for anywhere he's gone, and he has basically always had undeclared or ilegal or crew.

The new boat is the news. Its a lovely looking boat. I was just curious how strong it was - up to wintering in the ice or not?

#41 eric e

eric e

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,513 posts
  • Location:the far east

Posted 06 February 2012 - 11:13 PM

1 mystery solved

the missing kiwi is a 150kg maori warrior with face tattoos who wanted to be on the trip so he hid in the anchor locker...
http://www.stuff.co....es-polar-waters

#42 V-15_Frenchie

V-15_Frenchie

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 652 posts
  • Location:France?

Posted 07 February 2012 - 03:38 PM

After reading this book, I think anyone sailing in to the Icy Polar regions in a small boat is nuts.

Posted Image


Interesting - I didn't know of that book but read Alvah Simon's book North to the Night and felt otherwise. I'm adding your book to the reading list!

#43 eric e

eric e

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,513 posts
  • Location:the far east

Posted 10 February 2012 - 08:44 AM

A bizarre "Wild Viking" explorer illegally heading to Antarctica claims New Zealand's refusal to spend extra money looking for his colleagues who disappeared in McMurdo Sound last year cost them their lives.

Norwegian Jarle Andhoey, 34, is sailing a 16-metre steel yacht Nilaya south after he was forced out of Auckland two weeks ago for illegally entering New Zealand.

He is trying to reach McMurdo Sound where last year his yacht Berserk disappeared with the loss of three men.

They were lost in a storm while Andhoey and teenager Samuel Massie were on quad bikes trying to drive to the South Pole.

Andhoey had earlier claimed a navy ship, HMNZS Wellington, had ordered Berserk out of shelter and into McMurdo Sound just ahead of a storm. The navy firmly denied this.

Andhoey said he would look for Berserk and the men.

A New Zealander described only as a 150-kilogram tattooed Maori was also aboard the yacht, now believed to be in the Southern Ocean.

Oslo daily Ostlands-Posten, translated from Norwegian, quoted Kyrre Merge who spoke daily with Andhoey by satellite phone.

He said Andhoey believed Berserk had been swept away to a part of McMurdo not searched by HMNZS Wellington and the Sea Shepherd boat Steve Irwin.

Andhoey said that three days after the McMurdo Sound storm last year, the weather cleared and the yacht could have been seen in satellite images.

But he said the images would have cost a lot of money and New Zealand refused to spend it.

Ostlands-Posten said Andhoey now planned to stay in McMurdo Sound for as long as it took to find Berserk, "even if it takes a hundred years".

The Norwegian Broadcasting Corporation reported today that Television New Zealand was sending a crew to McMurdo Sound next week to track Andhoey

http://www.stuff.co....-slams-NZ-again



#44 eric e

eric e

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,513 posts
  • Location:the far east

Posted 11 February 2012 - 11:58 PM

.................................."

Busby's uncle, Dan Noble, was not surprised his nephew was on board. He called Busby an "adventurous" type. One of Busby's nieces described him as a Rastafarian who had been boating before.

Pene said Noble befriended Andhoy last year. "He knew [Andhoy] from the accident. They became quite close. They'd been planning to make a journey back there."

One Viaduct Harbour employee who met Andhoy last month said the Norwegian was a "loony".

Andhoy's feats included sailing round the notorious Cape Horn single-handedly at age 19 and embarking on an Arctic voyage in 2002, for which he was fined after failing to take out maritime insurance."

...................................


http://www.nzherald....jectid=10784986

#45 KiwiJoker

KiwiJoker

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,748 posts
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 12 February 2012 - 08:58 PM

A bizarre "Wild Viking" explorer illegally heading to Antarctica claims New Zealand's refusal to spend extra money looking for his colleagues who disappeared in McMurdo Sound last year cost them their lives.

Norwegian Jarle Andhoey, 34, is sailing a 16-metre steel yacht Nilaya south after he was forced out of Auckland two weeks ago for illegally entering New Zealand.

He is trying to reach McMurdo Sound where last year his yacht Berserk disappeared with the loss of three men.

They were lost in a storm while Andhoey and teenager Samuel Massie were on quad bikes trying to drive to the South Pole.

Andhoey had earlier claimed a navy ship, HMNZS Wellington, had ordered Berserk out of shelter and into McMurdo Sound just ahead of a storm. The navy firmly denied this.

Andhoey said he would look for Berserk and the men.

A New Zealander described only as a 150-kilogram tattooed Maori was also aboard the yacht, now believed to be in the Southern Ocean.

Oslo daily Ostlands-Posten, translated from Norwegian, quoted Kyrre Merge who spoke daily with Andhoey by satellite phone.

He said Andhoey believed Berserk had been swept away to a part of McMurdo not searched by HMNZS Wellington and the Sea Shepherd boat Steve Irwin.

Andhoey said that three days after the McMurdo Sound storm last year, the weather cleared and the yacht could have been seen in satellite images.

But he said the images would have cost a lot of money and New Zealand refused to spend it.

Ostlands-Posten said Andhoey now planned to stay in McMurdo Sound for as long as it took to find Berserk, "even if it takes a hundred years".

The Norwegian Broadcasting Corporation reported today that Television New Zealand was sending a crew to McMurdo Sound next week to track Andhoey

http://www.stuff.co....-slams-NZ-again


Even allowing for misplaced journalistic enterprise in reporting this story it is still pretty clear that Andhoey appears to believe that NZ authorities, probably any national authorities, owe him and his ship some kind of infinite duty of care. This despite the disdain for authority he has shown on repeated occasions.

I've never been comfortable with the US Coast Guard's legal ability to prevent "manifestly unsafe voyages." And yet in this case it appears that noone here gave him a second glance before either voyage. Perhaps they should have!

#46 eric e

eric e

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,513 posts
  • Location:the far east

Posted 26 February 2012 - 02:38 AM

Lawyer Nils Jorgen Vordah said he had talked to Andhoy via satellite phone. The sailor said that he and his crew have given up on the search for his missing yacht and are preparing to sail through a 200 nautical mile ice-belt.

http://www.stuff.co....tarctica-search

#47 highndry

highndry

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 476 posts
  • Location:Brisbane, Australia
  • Interests:inshore / offshore, cruising, travel, retirement

Posted 26 February 2012 - 02:43 AM

maybe they will be there for the winter ?

.......... it's almost MARCH !

#48 One eye Jack

One eye Jack

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,186 posts
  • Location:Reno,Nv. San Francisco Bay , Santa Cruz,Ca. Tahoe,Nv
  • Interests:Sailing. I shot a man in Reno.. Just to watch him die..

Posted 26 February 2012 - 04:14 AM

1330224204[/url]' post='3600674']
maybe they will be there for the winter ?

.......... it's almost MARCH !


This guy is from up above..to him March is almost spring..this guy is one frickin loser...looks like to much meth...

#49 edelweis

edelweis

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 568 posts

Posted 26 February 2012 - 11:26 AM

maybe they will be there for the winter ?

.......... it's almost MARCH !


not much sea ice yet around Mc.Murdo / Ross Sea (at 12:00h in picture)

Posted Image

#50 snaerk

snaerk

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,938 posts
  • Location:High latitudes
  • Interests:sea and snow and ice

Posted 01 March 2012 - 03:20 AM

Post 45:
<Andhoy now plan to stay in McMurdo Sound for as long as it took to find Berserk, "even if it takes a hundred years">

Post 46:
<Didn't find anything. Leaving.>

- - - - They dont make a hundred years like they used to - - - -

This is trivial and on ly a dick would point it out but It would be interesting to list the not at all trivial things he's changed his story about.

It's a perfect way of being controlversial

People can stop loooking when they find the versinof the story that suits how they want to paint him in there fantazy, hero or zero

Evryones entitled to there own opinions but this guy crafts his own facts

#51 snaerk

snaerk

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,938 posts
  • Location:High latitudes
  • Interests:sea and snow and ice

Posted 01 March 2012 - 03:37 AM

To me the big question mark in the story is, Why did the remaining crew phone and in essence say, "Everything's great, but by the way we're departing without you" let alone why did they do this knowing a bad storm was coming and they were at an anchorage apparently considered safer than being at sea?

And further, with the EPIRB going off only a few miles after this apparently-completely-voluntary things-are-fine-here unscheduled departure?


He must ahve noticed the date on the SMS is not the same day they EPRIB was triggered (21st vs 22nd)

He's gone quite about this - I thought it was just becuase it gets in the way for him to fit the kiwi captin of the Welington in the frame as being the culpret,

but I jhust had enother think -maybe he's noticed that the SMS could be read a diffrent way (there usuly abreviated):::

hear goes:::


Maybe the SMS actually meant 'Leaving FOR Horshoe Bay" ;;; not leaving FROM

What iks your thinking? (sorry for my spelling)

#52 snaerk

snaerk

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,938 posts
  • Location:High latitudes
  • Interests:sea and snow and ice

Posted 01 March 2012 - 05:21 AM

hmm - Ive just remmemberd something from an intervew Andhøy gave before it was clear what happend to Bærserk, wehn he was still on the ice.

I was remyndered becuase in trenaces post he points out "they were at an anchorage apparently considered safer than being at sea" and Jarle keeps repeating thys.

BUT thats not what Jarle was saying a yaer ago.

Then he sed that the captin he left on Bærserk was a true sailer , one who realysed that sometyjms the safest place to face a storm was on the high seas.

He was rite to say that then and eny true sailer knows that, but now he is singing a tune for lanlubbers and twitter biids: the land is safety, lyke youre mohters skerts.

So.... whne he thout it sutes his hartfelt wish (and his reputation) he says the media one thing and now he says the contreary becuase it didnt turning out so well.

And this way the captin of the kiwi waarskip can be the giver of bad advyse if you want to be nyce or the nasty OGRE who force them evacuate into storm teeth if you dont lyke waarskips captjns.

#53 snaerk

snaerk

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,938 posts
  • Location:High latitudes
  • Interests:sea and snow and ice

Posted 14 March 2012 - 06:57 AM

So now he is haveing damadge to his rig and heading for a no-named Argentina base on teh antartic penisnula.

To repare and refuel.

Dose he think the bases carry spare deisel to supply him?

Do we go back to the bad olt times when peeple like David Lewis treet bases like a boteyard and suppermakret?

#54 eric e

eric e

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,513 posts
  • Location:the far east

Posted 02 April 2012 - 01:23 AM

The self-proclaimed Norwegian "Viking" Jarle Andhoey, who made an unauthorised yacht trip to Antarctica, has been detained on his yacht by the Chilean navy.

Andhoey's yacht Nilaya was intercepted by a Chilean navy vessel yesterday and its sailing permit was suspended.

The yacht, with the crew on board, was escorted to a Chilean naval base and was now being guarded by navy staff.<br style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; "> <br style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; ">His lawyer, Nils Jorgen Vordahl, was advised of the action yesterday. Vordahl said Andhoey, 34, had not been given any reason for the detention, other than it was due to a New Zealand request.

"He informed me that the navy ship had forced him into Puerto Williams navy base. He tried to figure out if it was some kind of misunderstanding and maybe we could fix it," Vordahl said.

"He hasn't been presented with any documents that would give him a reason why he has been arrested."

Vordahl said Andhoey was "upset" and wanted to know why he could not leave.

"He wants some kind of document that shows that it has been initiated from New Zealand, so he is waiting for that."<br style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; "> <br style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; ">A Ministry of Foreign Affairs (Mfat) spokeswoman said it was their understanding that Andhoey had not been arrested.

The Government had not requested his arrest, she said, though the Chilean authorities were made aware of New Zealand's concerns about Nilaya's unauthorised expedition to the Ross Sea region.

The Customs Department had asked Oceania Customs members and the Chilean Customs to notify New Zealand of any sightings of the yacht.

The Mfat spokeswoman said the Government appreciated Chile's help with a search for any information held on the yacht about the trip.

The New Zealand embassy in Chile has made contact with New Zealander Busby Noble and were providing consular assistance.

Andhoey left New Zealand in the Nilaya three months ago with several others, including Noble, while planning his polar expedition.

The yacht's crew then spent several weeks sailing around Antarctica, looking for any trace of Andhoey's former yacht Berserk.<br style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; "> <br style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; ">That yacht sank during a fierce storm in the Ross Sea on February 22 last year, with the loss of three crew.

http://www.stuff.co....ndhoey-detained

#55 Billy O

Billy O

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 298 posts
  • Location:Michigan
  • Interests:Time travel without incurring a ratings penalty, Babes, Budweiser and Pizza.

Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:26 AM

Ice vs. Steel......................hmmmm


Titanic?

#56 amperrin

amperrin

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 278 posts
  • Location:Mill Valley, CA

Posted 02 April 2012 - 04:36 AM


Lots of those protuding sharp bits on the bergs I think Rick


Are there though Grumps? I dunno, I only like ice in my drinks. I thought about that, but wouldn't the wave action melt the sharp bits away and blunten them? Any cold water experts here to enlighten us?


I have just returned to the Northern Hemisphere having spent 14 months in South Georgia as the boating officer for British Antarctic Survey and previous to that 6 months at Rothera on the Peninsula. We were operating year round with glass rigid inflatables and 30 foot aluminium hull pilot launches. The glaciers around base are retreating at a rate of 1 meter per day across the entire ice front leaving a tremendous amount of bergy bits, brash ice and icebergs floating around. The ice that calves can be incredibly sharp and while an iceberg might be rounded off by wave and wind action they also have a tendancy to roll and to break up resulting in sharp edges and smaller pieces of ice. At night we would run with radar and that did a good job of showing up the larger bits of ice however, we were constantly running an ice light in front of the vessel. Even during the day it is easy to hit large pieces of black ice which is the very old ice which has compressed to such an extent that it is crystal clear unlike the newer ice which is still full of air. Ice in general is hard to read - bergs and ice faces have a tendancy to just crumble without any forewarning. If you hit ice it is no different to hitting a piece of rock.

Hope that answers your questions...

#57 eric e

eric e

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,513 posts
  • Location:the far east

Posted 03 April 2012 - 09:40 PM

A yacht that made an unauthorised visit to Antarctica captained by a self-proclaimed "viking" is under detention in Chile because its New Zealand stowaway has no passport, Norway's Dagbladet reported today.

Jarle Andhoy, 34, has been sailing a 16-metre steel yacht, Nilaya, that he purchased in Auckland late last year.

Early this year he used it to sail to near where his previous yacht, Berserk, had disappeared in a storm with the loss of three men in February last year.

A New Zealander, Busby Noble, 53, stowed away aboard the yacht.

Andhoy did not find any trace of Berserk last month so left the Ross Sea and announced he was sailing to South America.

Dagbladet said Nilaya had been at the Chilean naval base of Puerto Williams, south of Chile, since Sunday.

The head of the department of international affairs in Punta Arenas, Edilio Gazitua Catalan, said the police were interested in the five people on the yacht.

"All on board have documents in order, except for one person from New Zealand."

He said the Chilean Foreign Ministry and the New Zealand Embassy in Santiago were working to resolve the issue.

Nilaya will stay in the navy base until the issue is resolved.

Andhoy has renamed Nilaya, calling it Berserk after his lost yacht.

http://www.stuff.co....-yacht-in-Chile

#58 duncan

duncan

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,116 posts
  • Location:Brooklyn
  • Interests:.25% above prime

Posted 04 April 2012 - 12:55 AM

My respects to those lost.

Let beserk be beserk. If they don't do it who will

#59 stranded

stranded

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 687 posts
  • Location:Brisbane
  • Interests:cruising, racing, inshore and offshore

Posted 04 April 2012 - 03:03 AM

I don't think the Chileans would need a piece of paper from the kiwis to act

if the skipper has " allowed " someone to sail on the boat without passport or seaman's papers

....... and authorities share information and contribute to watch lists continuously

#60 eric e

eric e

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,513 posts
  • Location:the far east

Posted 09 April 2012 - 09:51 PM

Chilean authorities have released a Norwegian yacht and its crew, including a Kiwi, that were being held after they sailed from Auckland to Antarctica without permission.

Norwegian Jarle Andhoy, 34, used the yacht Nilaya to sail to the Ross Sea in a bid to venture near where his previous yacht, Berserk, had disappeared in a storm with the loss of three men in February last year. New Zealander Busby Noble, 53, was onboard for the latest trip.

Andhoy renamed Nilaya as Berserk and sailed to South America after his fruitless bid to find remains of his previous yacht.

The Chilean Navy arrested the yacht on March 31 and held it at the Puerto Williams naval base in southern Chile.

Norway's VG Nett website said Andhoy and the yacht were freed earlier today.

A spokesman for the yacht, Rune Olsgaard, said the self proclaimed Vikings were now celebrating "in true Berserk style".

Andhoy has previously said he wanted to sail around Cape Horn to Argentina.

http://www.stuff.co....wegian-and-Kiwi




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users