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New Suit Filed in NY


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#1 sca4952

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 10:17 PM

New Suit filed in New York:

African Diaspora Maritime Corporation
v.
Golden Gate Yacht Club
12/12/2011 11-653419 Breach of contract. The defendant has wrongfully denied the plaintiff's application to compete to be a defender of America's Cup - the premier sailing competition in the world - purportedly because it was concerned that the plaintiff might not have the financial wherewithal required. Plaintiff seeks $1 million in damages.

#2 maxmini

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 10:19 PM

Let the games begin .

#3 ~Stingray~

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 10:26 PM

New Suit filed in New York:

African Diaspora Maritime Corporation
v.
Golden Gate Yacht Club
12/12/2011 11-653419 Breach of contract. The defendant has wrongfully denied the plaintiff's application to compete to be a defender of America's Cup - the premier sailing competition in the world - purportedly because it was concerned that the plaintiff might not have the financial wherewithal required. Plaintiff seeks $1 million in damages.

Interesting...

It ~is~ an American corporation, apparently.

http://www.secretary.state.nc.us/corporations/Corp.aspx?PitemId=9857788

#4 sca4952

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 10:31 PM

This should be a link to the summons and complaint:

https://iapps.courts...g==&system=prod

http://iapps.courts....xNo=653419-2011

#5 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 10:44 PM

A few questions at first glance.
1. who is behind the suit ?
2.why referring to the protocol and not to the Deed in NY courts ?
3. Only one million $ ?

SW, any idea ?

#6 KiwiJoker

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:03 PM

A few questions at first glance.
1. who is behind the suit ?
2.why referring to the protocol and not to the Deed in NY courts ?
3. Only one million $ ?

SW, any idea ?


TC, if you have an hour or two the filing is worth reading. I can't see it gaining much traction with the NY Supremes. The litigants are casting their net far and wide. That said, the mesh is fairly small.

African Diaspora Maritime Corporation was only incorporated in North Carolina in October this year, ie, a couple of months ago.

On Page 10 of the filing, it states that ADM is a sailing syndicate founded in 1994 by Charles M Kithcart, a licensed captain with a 20 year career.

Kithcart is apparently unhappy that TFE didn't take him seriously and didn't return his calls. Alleges breach of contract, breech of fiduciary duty, etc.

Action filed by McDermott, Will & Emory LLP, 340 Madison Ave, NY.

#7 HobieAnarchy

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:09 PM

Someone is playing the race card . . .

#8 hobot

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:21 PM

Couldn't afford tank testing?

Posted Image

From his FB page.

#9 KiwiJoker

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:25 PM

A few questions at first glance.
1. who is behind the suit ?
2.why referring to the protocol and not to the Deed in NY courts ?
3. Only one million $ ?

SW, any idea ?


TC, Captain Charles M Kithcart has LinkenIn and Facebook memberships.

Two of his LinkedIn connections are Kim Livingston and Vince Casalaina.

His Facebook page is private unless you ask to join.

The sole photo on the page is presumably CMK, but it is not captioned.

Attached Files



#10 SW Sailor

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:30 PM

That is interesting - the president of the BOD is Charles M Kithcart. Resides in Raleigh as of about April 2010, however previous residence is 422 Valencia Street in SF, about 10 blocks from China Basin.

Not sure why GGYC wouldn't want to accept their challenge - the organisation is on solid financial ground. As of April 30th they had a net worth of $2349.29 and it appears they are on great terms with their bank;

1. Legalcase

a. We have enlisted the help of a lawyer, WalterThompson, of Burke Thompson, on a pro bono basis, to obtain our financialrecords from the Bank of Montreal at Mumford Terminal. We are currentlypetitioning the ombudsman of the Bank of Montreal, with the help of ANSA andACSD, to get that information. Once wehave our bank statements we will be able to conduct a full audit.



Not to mention membership is rock solid;

1. Membershiplist

a. The ADAM membership list has been increased from147 to 243. This is a result ofcollecting information from other spreadsheets in the office and by the signingup of people at our meetings an online. We had about 15 people sign up online.


b. Only 15 people paid their membership for2010. We would like to see that increaseat the Annual General Meeting.

#11 sunseeker

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:32 PM

Did I hear someone say Grifter?

#12 krispy kreme

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:32 PM

That is interesting - the president of the BOD is Charles M Kithcart. Resides in Raleigh as of about April 2010, however previous residence is 422 Valencia Street in SF, about 10 blocks from China Basin.

Not sure why GGYC wouldn't want to accept their challenge - the organisation is on solid financial ground. As of April 30th they had a net worth of $2349.29, and membership is rock solid; 1. Membershiplist

a. The ADAM membership list has been increased from147 to 243. This is a result ofcollecting information from other spreadsheets in the office and by the signingup of people at our meetings an online. We had about 15 people sign up online.


b. Only 15 people paid their membership for2010. We would like to see that increaseat the Annual General Meeting.

With a net worth of $23xx.xx it begs the question of where the funding is coming from for the lawsuit and attorneys.

#13 Finnfart

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:34 PM

A few questions at first glance.
1. who is behind the suit ?
2.why referring to the protocol and not to the Deed in NY courts ?
3. Only one million $ ?

SW, any idea ?


1. Who knows. It could be exactly what it says... an African American empowerment and education foundation that was going to use the AC as a promo for its cause. Much like Shosholoza.

2. They actually refer to both deed and protocol... as convenient for their argument. I think they are going to find this rough sledding. In the eyes of the deed, GGYC has the cup and Diaspora's club would need to wait for a foreign holder to challenge it. But not worrying about that. This is only a protocol issue. If the protocol as drafted gives them entree then there is the crux.

3. It says damages well over a million, but to be determined by jury. Then the go into what they REALLY want: Entry acceptance, DELAY, DELAY, and REMOVAL of TRUSTEE, and A BENFICIARY SHARE OF ALL REAL ESTATE & PROFITS NEGOTIATED BY GGYC.

So now think of who is behind it? Could be anybody from exactly what they say.. to a litigation troll who sees a big payday, to a very disgruntled AC community member covering their bets and exacting their revenge.

It is going to be interesting.

But my bet says that they are going to spend more than they get out of this. Larry will just sail them out past the lay line. And thanks to the 'standing' issue, I don' t think they will be able to stop the Cup... unless GGYC wants a convenient excuse for a delay.

#14 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:43 PM

Thanks KJ, Finnfart and ...SW.

I have difficulty thinking that there is not somebody very close to the AC behind.

With one million basic request I don't think they want to stop the AC but get some money or make some trouble. After all, we are in the AC.

#15 pjfranks

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:50 PM

Thanks KJ, Finnfart and ...SW.

I have difficulty thinking that there is not somebody very close to the AC behind.

With one million basic request I don't think they want to stop the AC but get some money or make some trouble. After all, we are in the AC.


Ahem. They want Larry to pay for everything and get GGYC sacked as trustee amongst other things.

#16 entropy

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:50 PM

Is he a member of GGYC? Isn't that a requirement to defend?

#17 pjfranks

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:52 PM

Is he a member of GGYC? Isn't that a requirement to defend?

If he is he won't be much longer.

#18 kiwi_jon

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 11:58 PM

With a net worth of $23xx.xx it begs the question of where the funding is coming from for the lawsuit and attorneys.


McDermott Will & Emery engages in a number of pro bono efforts and states that it is committed to its communities. Through its pro bono and community service program, the firm serves disadvantaged communities and ensures that low-income individuals and families have access to justice. In 2008, the firm devoted more than 94,900 hours to pro bono matters and community service, and more than 70 percent of its lawyers provided pro bono legal services to the poor, to organizations that serve the indigent and to certain not-for-profit organizations and small businesses focused on serving low-income communities.



#19 pjfranks

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 12:03 AM


With a net worth of $23xx.xx it begs the question of where the funding is coming from for the lawsuit and attorneys.


McDermott Will & Emery engages in a number of pro bono efforts and states that it is committed to its communities. Through its pro bono and community service program, the firm serves disadvantaged communities and ensures that low-income individuals and families have access to justice. In 2008, the firm devoted more than 94,900 hours to pro bono matters and community service, and more than 70 percent of its lawyers provided pro bono legal services to the poor, to organizations that serve the indigent and to certain not-for-profit organizations and small businesses focused on serving low-income communities.


Time to call in our resident expert MSP?

#20 KiwiJoker

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 12:06 AM


A few questions at first glance.
1. who is behind the suit ?
2.why referring to the protocol and not to the Deed in NY courts ?
3. Only one million $ ?

SW, any idea ?


1. Who knows. It could be exactly what it says... an African American empowerment and education foundation that was going to use the AC as a promo for its cause. Much like Shosholoza.

2. They actually refer to both deed and protocol... as convenient for their argument. I think they are going to find this rough sledding. In the eyes of the deed, GGYC has the cup and Diaspora's club would need to wait for a foreign holder to challenge it. But not worrying about that. This is only a protocol issue. If the protocol as drafted gives them entree then there is the crux.

3. It says damages well over a million, but to be determined by jury. Then the go into what they REALLY want: Entry acceptance, DELAY, DELAY, and REMOVAL of TRUSTEE, and A BENFICIARY SHARE OF ALL REAL ESTATE & PROFITS NEGOTIATED BY GGYC.

So now think of who is behind it? Could be anybody from exactly what they say.. to a litigation troll who sees a big payday, to a very disgruntled AC community member covering their bets and exacting their revenge.

It is going to be interesting.

But my bet says that they are going to spend more than they get out of this. Larry will just sail them out past the lay line. And thanks to the 'standing' issue, I don' t think they will be able to stop the Cup... unless GGYC wants a convenient excuse for a delay.



All good thoughts.

The Protocol opens the door to ADM if, under Clause 8.3 GGYC "is satisfied they have the necessary resources (including but not limited to financial, human, and technological) and experience to have a reasonable chance of winning the America's Cup Defender Series." Not surprisingly, GGYC wasn't satisfied.

Potential end of story right there.

ADM submitted their $25,000 bank draft and said they were talking to Dave Pedrick among other things. GGYC rejected the application to become a defence candidate.

ADM believes that sketchy history constitutes breach of contract. I'd say that constitutes an admission they were non-starters.

My question is this. If ADM falls over on the breach of contract issue does that shut the door on their various and torturous elements of their breach of fidiciary duty claims? Or is that cat out of the bag? (With apologies in advance for two bad puns in two sentences)

#21 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 12:14 AM

Time to call in our resident expert MSP?


I had the same feeling readinG the title of article 3: " GGYC CONCOCTS A SHAM EXCUSE TO DENY ADM APPLICATION "

#22 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 12:25 AM

I don't know what value has that suits. But one is that it could cost more than one million to the circus. Not sure the sponsors will be willing to invest in an event that is subject the "certainty" of NY courts.
Then they could settle out of courts, unless the entity behing is willing to derail the circus, that is why it would be interesting to know who is really behind.:)

#23 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 12:48 AM

...
It is going to be interesting.

But my bet says that they are going to spend more than they get out of this. Larry will just sail them out past the lay line.


+1 to that, they must surely be underestimating Larry's ability to bring frightening legal fire-power to bear.

The real estate stuff is mildly interesting, we've certainly doshed it around here a lot. The argument all assumes that there is money to be made, that should be shared by all competitors; but that could be hard to prove and could take decades to find out for certain if returns ever covered the investment; and the Port had been soliciting for someone to take those piers on for years already, without success. I suppose if the competitors - and maybe anyone else too - wanted to contribute to the investment, in return for a share of the potential return far down the road, LE may well be open to that! Lol

Maybe GGYC will even just come to an arrangement to let ADM come in and try compete? They won't get Larry to pay for and build their boats though - lol on that one too.


It says GGYC have to respond to it in some form within 20 days, I wonder what that form is required to be? Will be interesting to see the response.

#24 krispy kreme

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 12:56 AM


With a net worth of $23xx.xx it begs the question of where the funding is coming from for the lawsuit and attorneys.


McDermott Will & Emery engages in a number of pro bono efforts and states that it is committed to its communities. Through its pro bono and community service program, the firm serves disadvantaged communities and ensures that low-income individuals and families have access to justice. In 2008, the firm devoted more than 94,900 hours to pro bono matters and community service, and more than 70 percent of its lawyers provided pro bono legal services to the poor, to organizations that serve the indigent and to certain not-for-profit organizations and small businesses focused on serving low-income communities.


Simpson Thacher does pro bono too as do most AmLaw firms:

Commitment to public service and pro bono legal work is a defining characteristic of Simpson Thacher. In 2010, the Firm devoted more than 65,000 hours to pro bono projects, working on matters as diverse as representing individuals seeking asylum in the United States, counseling struggling micro-entrepreneurs, representing environmental organizations seeking to protect endangered species and the nation's wilderness areas, providing corporate and tax counsel to a wide range of non-profit organizations, representing Guantanamo detainees in connection with petitions for writs of habeas corpus, and authoring amicus briefs on constitutional law issues before the Supreme Court of the United States on behalf of civil rights organizations throughout the country. The Firm's commitment to pro bono activities, human rights, and community service is further illustrated by its sponsorship of year-long Public Service Fellowships, Summer Public Interest Fellowships, and externships at several legal services organizations.



Simpson Thacher has handled on a pro bono basis matters involving The Legal Aid Society, the Lawyers Alliance for New York, Legal Services for New York City, Human Rights First, the City Bar Justice Center, inMotion, Inc., the NAACP Legal Defense and Educational Fund, Doctors Without Borders (recipient of the 1999 Nobel Peace Prize), The Apollo Theater Foundation, Law Foundation of Silicon Valley, Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights, the Natural Resources Defense Council, New Visions for Public Schools, Volunteer Lawyers for the Arts, and the Robin Hood Foundation. The Firm has been recognized with awards from such distinguished organizations as The Legal Aid Society, the New York State Bar Association, inMotion, Sanctuary for Families, Volunteers of Legal Service, the United Federation of Teachers, Immigration Equality, Volunteer Lawyers for the Arts, the Puerto Rican Legal Defense & Education Fund, the Lawyers Alliance for New York and the City Bar Justice Center.




#25 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 12:57 AM


...
It is going to be interesting.

But my bet says that they are going to spend more than they get out of this. Larry will just sail them out past the lay line.


+1 to that, they must surely be underestimating Larry's ability to bring frightening legal fire-power to bear.

^
Do you really think the person behind is not aware of that ?

#26 krispy kreme

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 12:57 AM


...
It is going to be interesting.

But my bet says that they are going to spend more than they get out of this. Larry will just sail them out past the lay line.


+1 to that, they must surely be underestimating Larry's ability to bring frightening legal fire-power to bear.

The real estate stuff is mildly interesting, we've certainly doshed it around here a lot. The argument all assumes that there is money to be made, that should be shared by all competitors; but that could be hard to prove and could take decades to find out for certain if returns ever covered the investment; and the Port had been soliciting for someone to take those piers on for years already, without success. I suppose if the competitors - and maybe anyone else too - wanted to contribute to the investment, in return for a share of the potential return far down the road, LE may well be open to that! Lol

Maybe GGYC will even just come to an arrangement to let ADM come in and try compete? They won't get Larry to pay for and build their boats though - lol on that one too.


It says GGYC have to respond to it in some form within 20 days, I wonder what that form is required to be? Will be interesting to see the response.

A flurry of motions to dismiss I'd imagine.

#27 Sailing My Cubicle

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:12 AM

McDermott is pretty good firm. It's not some Jacoby & Meyers ambulance chasing outfit. So either they're doing this pro-bono or somebody has some cash to burn. I'm not sure if firms of that size handle many matters on contingency basis. Not ruling that possibility out; but considering the demand is a min of $1mil and standard contingency is 33%, I'm thinking that there must be a deep pocket somewhere because MDW&E will likely burn through $333,000 of billables in short order.

#28 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:16 AM


+1 to that, they must surely be underestimating Larry's ability to bring frightening legal fire-power to bear.

^
Do you really think the person behind is not aware of that ?

I guess we should assume so, but it's harder to guess how far they can afford to press it. If there's a Koch behind it, it would surprise me; although an affidavit he filed in support of GGYC did contain similar charges against EB, so who knows?

No longer have it handy but thinking back: was this filed in NY County Court, or NYSC? edit: never mind, it must have been NYSC

#29 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:18 AM

Still not seeing any news articles, but I bet they will be all over the place starting soon!

#30 KiwiJoker

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:27 AM

Where's Cory E. Friedman when we need him!

#31 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:55 AM

Kind of interesting, from 1994
http://www.highbeam....1P2-886008.html

A fourth defender syndicate - this one to be composed primarily of black sailors - has set its sights on the America's Cup next year. The African Diaspora Maritime team was formed to provide black sailors with the opportunity to compete for the Cup, according to syndicate head Charles Kithcart.

"The syndicate will feature the first …" (registration required)

#32 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:56 AM

Wow - I thought this one was going to disappear! Got lots of info and had a loooong chat with CK back in April, will post in a couple hours when I am done with Mer time.

#33 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 02:19 AM

https://mobile.twitter.com/#!/cmkchip/status/50526574801457152

North Carolina Boat Buildersboatbuilders.us/north-carolina…
who amoungst nc builders can build the new america's cup boats? charleskithcart@yahoo.com
4:57am - 23 Mar 11 via Tweet Button

#34 KiwiJoker

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 02:21 AM

Kind of interesting, from 1994
http://www.highbeam....1P2-886008.html

A fourth defender syndicate - this one to be composed primarily of black sailors - has set its sights on the America's Cup next year. The African Diaspora Maritime team was formed to provide black sailors with the opportunity to compete for the Cup, according to syndicate head Charles Kithcart.

"The syndicate will feature the first …" (registration required)


Short, three graf story, includes this quote: ""The syndicate will feature the first African-American skipper in America's Cup history," he said. "We're out to make history, and to teach history."

#35 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 02:24 AM

This was from someone working with Kithcart on April 19th:

African Diaspora Maritime is an effort mounted from North Carolina to have a black team in the America’s Cup. It complied with all of the registration procedures and has not yet been vetted. The vetting process should have been finished already. Plenty of details on that process can be provided, however, know that a dialogue between Golden Gate Yacht Club and African Diaspora Maritime resumed on 4.14.11. Charles Kithcart received a letter from the Commodore of GGYC last Friday afternoon indicating that they did not believe African Diaspora Challenge would ever have adequate resources to be an America's Cup team. You will have to get the exact wording from Charles and you should respect Charles' efforts right now. He is working with counsel to determine his next move...and there is a lot a stake.

#36 Xlot

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 02:39 AM

This was from someone working with Kithcart on April 19th:

... It complied with all of the registration procedures and has not yet been vetted. The vetting process should have been finished already ... Charles Kithcart received a letter from the Commodore of GGYC last Friday afternoon indicating that they did not believe African Diaspora Challenge would ever have adequate resources to be an America's Cup team


Well, should GGYC be looking for affidavits confirming how rigorous, unbending and impartial their vetting process was (from original CoR onwards), I'm sure there'll be plenty of volunteers :lol:

#37 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 02:51 AM

^ An obvious volunteer might be the VC guy, whose failed attempt is even mentioned as a supporting example in ADM's complaint.

#38 fubaru

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 03:28 AM

It's official now, the Silly Season has begun...

#39 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 03:40 AM

You mean, real AC without gag order ? :D

#40 Finnfart

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 03:43 AM



...
It is going to be interesting.

But my bet says that they are going to spend more than they get out of this. Larry will just sail them out past the lay line.


+1 to that, they must surely be underestimating Larry's ability to bring frightening legal fire-power to bear.

^
Do you really think the person behind is not aware of that ?


Being aware of it, and understanding the implications are very different things. Many think that being right (assuming they are right... which they almost always think they are) will somehow overcome the financial might of the opponent.

Mistaken they usually are.

That is why I at least, found the AC33 legal wranglings so much fun. Evenly matched fighters playing the legal game as hard as it can be played. Don't think this one will be that much fun... unless Koch or Turner or Bertarelli joined the ADM team.

#41 ~HHN92~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 04:06 AM

It's official now, the Silly Season has begun...


Well, where will Kurt Busch land, will David Reutimann get the 22 Penske car, maybe Brian Vickers? Will Steve Addington fare better with Tony Stewart than with Kurt B? How about Darian Grubb with Denny Hamlin? What about the changes at RCR?



Oh, sorry...wrong silly season..................................

#42 KiwiJoker

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 04:11 AM




...
It is going to be interesting.

But my bet says that they are going to spend more than they get out of this. Larry will just sail them out past the lay line.


+1 to that, they must surely be underestimating Larry's ability to bring frightening legal fire-power to bear.

^
Do you really think the person behind is not aware of that ?


Being aware of it, and understanding the implications are very different things. Many think that being right (assuming they are right... which they almost always think they are) will somehow overcome the financial might of the opponent.

Mistaken they usually are.

That is why I at least, found the AC33 legal wranglings so much fun. Evenly matched fighters playing the legal game as hard as it can be played. Don't think this one will be that much fun... unless Koch or Turner or Bertarelli joined the ADM team.


Ya gotta believe that MW&E are well aware of the legal implications and by extension the financial ones. Reading the filing it is far from certain that they grasp the multiple sailing-related complexities -- Cup tradition, precedent, history, skill levels in sailing, sailing team management, design, logistics, testing, depth of resources required, to name just a few.

#43 dogwatch

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 04:26 AM

It's official now, the Silly Season has begun...


Is it? Not sure. This could be a "pay me off and I'll go away" but on the whole I think they genuinely want to create a team, even if some (perhaps many) would regard that as hard to take seriously. I've quite mixed feelings. On the one hand, the almost exclusively white face of sailing causes me some anguish. Conversely, the reality is that these guys would clearly have their arses comprehensively kicked. Talk about running before you can walk. Or is someone going to tell me there's a couple of dozen world-class African-American sailors I've somehow never heard of? If there are not, is setting a team up for certain failure on an epic scale really advancing the situation?

"GGYC"'s problem is that having freely adjusted the protocol with the understandable objective of drumming up enough ACWS to not look entirely ridiculous, it's hard to articulate an objective reason why one cash-less wannabe team is more or less worthy than another.

Interesting.....and well timed given there is no sailing to talk about and I imagine we are bored with BA's tantrum by now.

#44 SW Sailor

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 04:34 AM

Well he wasn't an active member of GGYC when he left the area in April '10.

He's got a good legal team but a tough case. Apparently they do about 90K hours of pro bono work for disadvantaged organizations each year.

The demands are actually pretty funny - two free AC 45's, the ability to schedule the 2012 ACWS events, postpone the whole event if needed, OR's AC 72 design, a time advantage in a defender series, removal of GGYC as trustee, etc. Not too much at all. They should just ask for the cup and half of LE's worth, they'd have a better chance of getting it. Their are also other key omissions they apparently overlooked in their zealousness to overtake the AC world.

My guess is when the NYSC reads the complaint and what they are asking for the case will be considered a frivolous law suit and has the potential to be tossed.

But on a positive note for them it does look like they have a rock solid crew lined up;

Attached Files



#45 ~HHN92~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 04:50 AM

Seriously now, can this even be considered as something more than frivolous?

A couple of hours for the lawyers to prepare a submission showing what more viable, even if not fully funded, challengers look like should cure this cold.

If it is justified to hand these guys all they want, would that not point to LE already handing all the entered teams everything they wanted? If so, then that would eliminate any question of all the teams not making it to the starting line in 2013.

Seems mighty thin.





#46 SW Sailor

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 04:57 AM

And here's the "B" team - Spithill's got to be worried at this point;

Attached Files



#47 SW Sailor

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:07 AM

And hell, look at their war room, these people are serious AC contenders;

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#48 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:36 AM

An early attempt to connect some dots.. probably just a strike-out.

The guy who is on the complaint but without a signature signed, is Henry Christensen III and he had a long partnership with
Sullivan & Cromwell, see
http://www.mwe.com/i...cf559ee6e98.cfm

Which rings a small bell.. From http://www.sail-worl...y.cfm?Nid=63271

Far from trying to get the heat turned down on the legal action, the Swiss club have appointed a new firm of lawyers to represent them on the various actions, engaging Sullivan & Cromwell, their third in two years of litigation.

#49 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:37 AM

ac breaking



right there, in black and white



The ever-diligent AC Anarchists have once again broken a big AC story, this time of a lawsuit filed on Monday in New York against Golden Gate Yacht Club by a strange little North Carolina Nonprofit called the Africa Diaspora Maritime Corporation. The suit alleges that GGYC prevented ADMC from entering the AC World Series on an arbitrary and capricious basis by citing a sham excuse for their rejection, and seeks in excess of one million dollars in damages for this count. The complaint also alleges GGYC breached its fiduciary duties as Trustee of the America’s Cup by that rejection, and asks the court to compel GGYC to accept ADMC’s entry, reschedule the ACWS and the America’s Cup, and jump through a bunch of other hoops to allow them to compete.



GGYC addressed the suit in a statement we received a few minute ago. “GGYC was served today with a complaint filed in the Supreme Court, County of New York, alleging breach of fiduciary duty, among other baseless claims. We believe the lawsuit is utterly without merit and that GGYC will prevail.”



We spoke with Charles Kithcart, the head of the Diaspora organization, back in April when he was fighting to enter the AC. He had a clever and ambitious plan to bring an African-American team into the pearly-white AC air, and while he had no money to speak of, he claimed to have numerous black sailors and philanthropists interested in becoming part of the effort if they became a bona fide Challenger, and Kithcart claimed he had substantial government support for a North Carolina-based Challenge. Back then, Kithcart believed he was being screwed, while GGYC representatives claimed to have done everything possible to help the Diaspora enter the AC. Whether his claims are baseless or not, we’ve got to hand it to the guy for fighting the good fight and having a good goal. Like it or not, in these days of the 99%, there’ll be an awful lot of interest in a storyline that includes something like “billionaire bans African-American yacht racing team from America’s Cup.



But after poring over the suit, and the notes from our investigation back in April, we’re struggling to see how Kithcart can actually get a court to compel GGYC to accept his entry – and Ellison isn’t really the kind of guy to pay someone off just to make them go away, even if it is in his own best PR interest.



But that’s not all Kithcart’s going for, and the case might not be such a loser after all. The dude is pissed, and he wants the Court to go as far as giveing GGYC the flick as Trustee – and he might have just found a way to do it.



Starting on page 20, the Complaint devotes quite a bit of time to an issue that never quite sat well with us: SF real estate. Kithcart rightly points out how the Protocol goes to great lengths to explain exactly how teams will share in the revenue produced by the Cup, yet the reality on the ground is that the biggest chunk of revenue to flow to the interconnected web of companies running Ellison’s Cup comes not from TV or sponsor or intellectual property deals – it comes from long term waterfront real estate leases and property transfers from SF to the Bank of Larry. And of course, those deals are specifically excluded from any revenue sharing with any of the beneficiaries of the Trust, even though representatives of the Trustee negotiated them.



We think a court could reasonably conclude that the real estate deals are ‘self-dealing’ by GGYC, which would be clearly impermissible under New York law as a violation of a Trustee’s duties. The deals are public knowledge, and GGYC will have to somehow argue that they don’t represent the kind of behavior that NY law prohibits from Trustees. As the complaint points out:



“GGYC is strictly forbidden from using its possession of the Cup…to stage AC34 in a manner that directly benefits itself, or any of its members…or any third party…Such transactions are void ab initio [‘void from the start’ - ed]…and any gain must be accounted for and turned over to the trust.”





There’s plenty more to this story, and of course the place to watch it all unfold is AC Anarchy. Did someone complain that the five-month hiatus from racing would be boring? Not a chance.





#50 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:44 AM

^ Not bad.

But I'm sure Kithcart is more than welcome to invest in those sinking piers too! :)

#51 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:48 AM

It says GGYC have to respond to it in some form within 20 days, I wonder what that form is required to be? Will be interesting to see the response.


GGYC has to file an Answer, which is a formal response to the allegations, basically a point-by-point refutation of the Complaint.

#52 dogwatch

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:50 AM

An early attempt to connect some dots.. probably just a strike-out.


So your theory is that a lawyer who is involved in this claim used to work for a firm that used to work for SNG and therefore that EB must be the money behind it.

#53 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:55 AM


An early attempt to connect some dots.. probably just a strike-out.


So your theory is that a lawyer who is involved in this claim used to work for a firm that used to work for SNG and therefore that EB must be the money behind it.

Hey now, at least it was an effort to connect dots. That this one led that way doesn't prove anything; and I later realized he left S&C in 2007 anyway, so it likely is a strikeout.

Am not the first to suggest there's bigger interests behind this. And am surely not the last one who will draw possible connections to muse about.

#54 SW Sailor

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 06:02 AM

This was from someone working with Kithcart on April 19th:

African Diaspora Maritime is an effort mounted from North Carolina to have a black team in the America's Cup. It complied with all of the registration procedures and has not yet been vetted. The vetting process should have been finished already. Plenty of details on that process can be provided, however, know that a dialogue between Golden Gate Yacht Club and African Diaspora Maritime resumed on 4.14.11. Charles Kithcart received a letter from the Commodore of GGYC last Friday afternoon indicating that they did not believe African Diaspora Challenge would ever have adequate resources to be an America's Cup team. You will have to get the exact wording from Charles and you should respect Charles' efforts right now. He is working with counsel to determine his next move...and there is a lot a stake.

'there sure is alot at stake, but I'm not sure how they missed including all of the OR team members as part of the settlement, they seem to have included everything but them and LE's underware.





#55 SW Sailor

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 06:29 AM

An early attempt to connect some dots.. probably just a strike-out.

The guy who is on the complaint but without a signature signed, is Henry Christensen III and he had a long partnership with
Sullivan & Cromwell, see
http://www.mwe.com/i...cf559ee6e98.cfm

Which rings a small bell.. From http://www.sail-worl...y.cfm?Nid=63271

Far from trying to get the heat turned down on the legal action, the Swiss club have appointed a new firm of lawyers to represent them on the various actions, engaging Sullivan & Cromwell, their third in two years of litigation.


Aside from Christensen, EB did hire S&C as the final firm to represent him just prior to Valencia.

I had the pleasure of sitting next to SNG's attorney and his wife on the flight from Madrid to Valencia, and had some very entertaining conversation in which it was apparent they had no idea what had transpired or what the current issues were at the time. They also had no idea that they were the third firm to be hired by EB, and when I brought it up their was a distinct lull in the conversation. As I recall they guy was really pompus in the Madrid airport as well as on the flight to Valencia, mocking the business class service upgrade the whole flight.

Don't know that there is a current connection, but their certainly was at the time.

#56 SW Sailor

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 06:51 AM

The S&C attorney's name was Robert Giuffra - and per this post he was also hired by UBS. Maybe just a coincidence or a referral from an old friend Posted Image

link


#57 dogwatch

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:00 AM

And hell, look at their war room, these people are serious AC contenders;


Explain to me please, as a GGYC member, because I seem to be slow of understanding here, what it is that you find so amusing about that particular photograph?

#58 Surf City Racing

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:17 AM

Why do you figure GGYC turned them down? It'd one hell of a human interest story, good PR, and another boat on the line.

#59 dogwatch

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:27 AM

Why do you figure GGYC turned them down?


Possibly because they'd have spend time and money running a defender series against a no-hoper. Especially time. That assumes however that they'd get to build an AC72 which seems unlikely. My interpretation is more that they want to be ACWS players.

I think you are right about the positive human interest angle.

#60 Surf City Racing

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:33 AM


Why do you figure GGYC turned them down?



I think you are right about the positive human interest angle.



Awww, It could've been huge, and probably worth the trouble! Now it can be spun so many different ways, which is sure to happen. I guarantee that someone is going to bring up race...then the socioeconomics, then...

A good (or even not so good) PR team could've made some "pull yourself from the bootstraps" story, and won big.

#61 kiwi_jon

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 08:53 AM

That is interesting - the president of the BOD is Charles M Kithcart. Resides in Raleigh as of about April 2010, however previous residence is 422 Valencia Street in SF, about 10 blocks from China Basin.

Not sure why GGYC wouldn't want to accept their challenge - the organisation is on solid financial ground. As of April 30th they had a net worth of $2349.29 and it appears they are on great terms with their bank;

1. Legalcase

a. We have enlisted the help of a lawyer, WalterThompson, of Burke Thompson, on a pro bono basis, to obtain our financialrecords from the Bank of Montreal at Mumford Terminal. We are currentlypetitioning the ombudsman of the Bank of Montreal, with the help of ANSA andACSD, to get that information. Once wehave our bank statements we will be able to conduct a full audit.



Not to mention membership is rock solid;

1. Membershiplist

a. The ADAM membership list has been increased from147 to 243. This is a result ofcollecting information from other spreadsheets in the office and by the signingup of people at our meetings an online. We had about 15 people sign up online.


b. Only 15 people paid their membership for2010. We would like to see that increaseat the Annual General Meeting.


Oh wow. They have 50 less members than GGYC.

Membership

Over three hundred members strong, the Golden Gate Yacht Club welcomes both sail and power boaters and their crew to its membership ranks. In addition, non-boat owners are also welcome as affiliate members. Golden Gate Yacht Club, home of the America's Cup and home port of ORACLE Racing, provides bar and dining service with dazzling views of San Francisco Bay, the Golden Gate Bridge, Alcatraz, and Marin.


How many of those memberships and monthly fees are still paid for by Oracle Racing? I know at one stage it was around 90.

At least ADAM is solvent. I seem to recall that GGYC was more than $400,000 in the hole and about to be chucked out of the clubhouse by SF due to overdue back rents just prior to challenging for AC31.

#62 seis

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 10:15 AM

Images of final requests pages.

Posted Image


Posted Image

#63 Albatros

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 10:23 AM

one can't but remark that in one clean move these guys have outdone our sockwarrior MSP bigtime, ADM - MSP : 1-0 :P

#64 porthos

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 12:24 PM


It says GGYC have to respond to it in some form within 20 days, I wonder what that form is required to be? Will be interesting to see the response.


GGYC has to file an Answer, which is a formal response to the allegations, basically a point-by-point refutation of the Complaint.


GGYC could also file a pre-Answer motion, such as a motion to dismiss, a motion to strike, or a motion for a more definitive statement. Seeing the first two wouldn't surprise me.

#65 pjfranks

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:28 PM



It says GGYC have to respond to it in some form within 20 days, I wonder what that form is required to be? Will be interesting to see the response.


GGYC has to file an Answer, which is a formal response to the allegations, basically a point-by-point refutation of the Complaint.


GGYC could also file a pre-Answer motion, such as a motion to dismiss, a motion to strike, or a motion for a more definitive statement. Seeing the first two wouldn't surprise me.

IMO any of the options you propose would make GGYC look shifty.

#66 pjfranks

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:30 PM

one can't but remark that in one clean move these guys have outdone our sockwarrior MSP bigtime, ADM - MSP : 1-0 :P

Surely MSP must think Christmas has come early this year?

#67 Sailabout

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:35 PM

GCYC just needs to have a swimming test to enter
game over

#68 LoopyGirdleSniffer

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:44 PM

GCYC just needs to have a swimming test to enter
game over


And that means what exactly??

#69 porthos

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:50 PM




It says GGYC have to respond to it in some form within 20 days, I wonder what that form is required to be? Will be interesting to see the response.


GGYC has to file an Answer, which is a formal response to the allegations, basically a point-by-point refutation of the Complaint.


GGYC could also file a pre-Answer motion, such as a motion to dismiss, a motion to strike, or a motion for a more definitive statement. Seeing the first two wouldn't surprise me.

IMO any of the options you propose would make GGYC look shifty.


There are rules of civil procedure that govern a lawsuit and all parties must adhere to them. Under those rules, the Plaintiff has the obligation to draft a proper complaint. If they have not -- and there are arguably deficiencies in this Complaint -- then there is nothing shifty about a Defendant insisting that the Plaintiff meet its pleading obligations by filing a pre-Answer motion. Edit: that said, MW&E is a very good firm and drafted a good Complaint, albeit one that looks designed more for public relations than for a court proceeding. I would bet all the money in my pocket against all the money in your pocket that MW&E is doing this on a pro-bono basis.

Your opinion doesn't surprise me.

#70 porthos

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 01:51 PM

GCYC just needs to have a swimming test to enter
game over


And with that comment, you've shown yourself to be both a racist and an idiot. Well done.

#71 RedlinerKT

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 02:04 PM

"...and while he had no money to speak of, he claimed to have numerous black sailors and philanthropists interested in becoming part of the effort if they became a bona fide Challenger..."

Can anyone say cart before the horse?? Love it.

#72 Albatros

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 02:09 PM


one can't but remark that in one clean move these guys have outdone our sockwarrior MSP bigtime, ADM - MSP : 1-0 :P

Surely MSP must think Christmas has come early this year?

Don't know about that, the ADM claim makes him look utterly silly, and if anything real would come out of it, big if, it will at the same time expose him for the gasbag he seems to be. And in worst case somebody else might reap the rewards he was after.
Unless of course ADM & MSP is some kind of a variation on the Black & White Red minstrel show ?

yep, silly season is at full swing, great ! B)

#73 ~HHN92~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 02:21 PM

"...and while he had no money to speak of, he claimed to have numerous black sailors and philanthropists interested in becoming part of the effort if they became a bona fide Challenger..."

Can anyone say cart before the horse?? Love it.


Interest is one thing, commitment is another. I think the court would want to see something firm, a letter of intent, something to say if the challenge were accepted that there would be a commitment to the endeavor.

Anyone can say they have an 'interest'............................

edit: just read through the paper posted above. Obviously whoever wrote this has not done theri homework. I think the ACWS schedule, as we know it, is already public knowledge, for one thing. It sounds too much like an overreach by someone who does not understand the game, less the land deals.

#74 mad

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 03:07 PM


GCYC just needs to have a swimming test to enter
game over


And that means what exactly??

File it under "racist asshole" <_<

#75 porthos

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 03:27 PM


"...and while he had no money to speak of, he claimed to have numerous black sailors and philanthropists interested in becoming part of the effort if they became a bona fide Challenger..."

Can anyone say cart before the horse?? Love it.


Interest is one thing, commitment is another. I think the court would want to see something firm, a letter of intent, something to say if the challenge were accepted that there would be a commitment to the endeavor.

Anyone can say they have an 'interest'............................

edit: just read through the paper posted above. Obviously whoever wrote this has not done theri homework. I think the ACWS schedule, as we know it, is already public knowledge, for one thing. It sounds too much like an overreach by someone who does not understand the game, less the land deals.


Correct. Someday intentions of participating in the America's Cup do not make one a viable challenger, or even an unviable challenger with a decent chance of becoming one, such that GGYC's decision to deny ADM's application was not a breach. Perhaps more importantly, if the court concludes that ADM was not a viable challenger and had little prospects of becoming one -- which I think is very likely -- then ADM very likely does not have standing to state the real estate-based claims in the Complaint, and there goes the rest of the Complaint.

#76 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 04:24 PM

they seem to have included everything but them and LE's underware.

Would that be considered vaporware or malware?

#77 Tony-F18

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 04:28 PM

Shareware?

#78 ccruiser

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:18 PM


That is interesting - the president of the BOD is Charles M Kithcart. Resides in Raleigh as of about April 2010, however previous residence is 422 Valencia Street in SF, about 10 blocks from China Basin.

Not sure why GGYC wouldn't want to accept their challenge - the organisation is on solid financial ground. As of April 30th they had a net worth of $2349.29 and it appears they are on great terms with their bank;

1. Legalcase

a. We have enlisted the help of a lawyer, WalterThompson, of Burke Thompson, on a pro bono basis, to obtain our financialrecords from the Bank of Montreal at Mumford Terminal. We are currentlypetitioning the ombudsman of the Bank of Montreal, with the help of ANSA andACSD, to get that information. Once wehave our bank statements we will be able to conduct a full audit.



Not to mention membership is rock solid;

1. Membershiplist

a. The ADAM membership list has been increased from147 to 243. This is a result ofcollecting information from other spreadsheets in the office and by the signingup of people at our meetings an online. We had about 15 people sign up online.


b. Only 15 people paid their membership for2010. We would like to see that increaseat the Annual General Meeting.


Oh wow. They have 50 less members than GGYC.

Membership

Over three hundred members strong, the Golden Gate Yacht Club welcomes both sail and power boaters and their crew to its membership ranks. In addition, non-boat owners are also welcome as affiliate members. Golden Gate Yacht Club, home of the America's Cup and home port of ORACLE Racing, provides bar and dining service with dazzling views of San Francisco Bay, the Golden Gate Bridge, Alcatraz, and Marin.


How many of those memberships and monthly fees are still paid for by Oracle Racing? I know at one stage it was around 90.

At least ADAM is solvent. I seem to recall that GGYC was more than $400,000 in the hole and about to be chucked out of the clubhouse by SF due to overdue back rents just prior to challenging for AC31.


So what exactly is your point? That at one time before GGYC found a sponsor with a "substantial" net worth who could, and did, fund several America's Cup campaigns under their burgee, that they were a economically marginal sailing organization? Let's assume that is it - Seems like ADM has not taken that first step, the one GGYC took before it challenged - either accumulated sufficient wealth or found a wealthy sponsor. Without that they cannot compete, and while we can all get our quixotic juices flowing, and go tilt among the windmills, without that they cannot possible fund a campaign or maintain a challenge. Let them do what GGYC was able to do, before it challenged for the first time - nail down the funding necessary to actually put on a challenge for the right to defend.

#79 One eye Jack

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:19 PM

1323820375[/url]' post='3506026']

1323820247[/url]' post='3506020']
Is he a member of GGYC? Isn't that a requirement to defend?

If he is he won't be much longer.


Is he even a member of a recognized yacht club at all...And hope he has deep pockets..Going against Ellison is like trying to sue the United States..They just break you and your attorney..Here somebody wants to play in the puddle, when all others are playing in the ocean...

#80 SW Sailor

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 06:20 PM



That is interesting - the president of the BOD is Charles M Kithcart. Resides in Raleigh as of about April 2010, however previous residence is 422 Valencia Street in SF, about 10 blocks from China Basin.

Not sure why GGYC wouldn't want to accept their challenge - the organisation is on solid financial ground. As of April 30th they had a net worth of $2349.29 and it appears they are on great terms with their bank;

1. Legalcase

a. We have enlisted the help of a lawyer, WalterThompson, of Burke Thompson, on a pro bono basis, to obtain our financialrecords from the Bank of Montreal at Mumford Terminal. We are currentlypetitioning the ombudsman of the Bank of Montreal, with the help of ANSA andACSD, to get that information. Once wehave our bank statements we will be able to conduct a full audit.



Not to mention membership is rock solid;

1. Membershiplist

a. The ADAM membership list has been increased from147 to 243. This is a result ofcollecting information from other spreadsheets in the office and by the signingup of people at our meetings an online. We had about 15 people sign up online.


b. Only 15 people paid their membership for2010. We would like to see that increaseat the Annual General Meeting.


Oh wow. They have 50 less members than GGYC.

Membership

Over three hundred members strong, the Golden Gate Yacht Club welcomes both sail and power boaters and their crew to its membership ranks. In addition, non-boat owners are also welcome as affiliate members. Golden Gate Yacht Club, home of the America's Cup and home port of ORACLE Racing, provides bar and dining service with dazzling views of San Francisco Bay, the Golden Gate Bridge, Alcatraz, and Marin.


How many of those memberships and monthly fees are still paid for by Oracle Racing? I know at one stage it was around 90.

At least ADAM is solvent. I seem to recall that GGYC was more than $400,000 in the hole and about to be chucked out of the clubhouse by SF due to overdue back rents just prior to challenging for AC31.


So what exactly is your point? That at one time before GGYC found a sponsor with a "substantial" net worth who could, and did, fund several America's Cup campaigns under their burgee, that they were a economically marginal sailing organization? Let's assume that is it - Seems like ADM has not taken that first step, the one GGYC took before it challenged - either accumulated sufficient wealth or found a wealthy sponsor. Without that they cannot compete, and while we can all get our quixotic juices flowing, and go tilt among the windmills, without that they cannot possible fund a campaign or maintain a challenge. Let them do what GGYC was able to do, before it challenged for the first time - nail down the funding necessary to actually put on a challenge for the right to defend.

KJ is just being an idiot for the sake of being an idiot. He didn't even want his team to enter AC34 but he backs this group because they are "solvent", yet they have to bring an attorney on to get their bank records. I guess a phone call or visit didn't work. These people are snubbed by their own bank. What does that tell you ?

A social club vs a Yacht Club ? Got it.

A balance of $2843.29 ? That's almost enough to buy foulies for a crew of 5.

15 dues paying members ? They could have 5000 members and if only 15 pay dues that won't cover Gatorade and sandwiches for an AC45 crew of 5 for two weeks practice.

Sure thing.








#81 SW Sailor

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 06:34 PM


"...and while he had no money to speak of, he claimed to have numerous black sailors and philanthropists interested in becoming part of the effort if they became a bona fide Challenger..."

Can anyone say cart before the horse?? Love it.


Interest is one thing, commitment is another. I think the court would want to see something firm, a letter of intent, something to say if the challenge were accepted that there would be a commitment to the endeavor.

Anyone can say they have an 'interest'............................

edit: just read through the paper posted above. Obviously whoever wrote this has not done theri homework. I think the ACWS schedule, as we know it, is already public knowledge, for one thing. It sounds too much like an overreach by someone who does not understand the game, less the land deals.


IT appears their point is because they believe their campaign, if you want to call it that, was wronged and that the ACWS and the AC should be rescheduled to meet their needs.

Seems reasonable to me, along with all the other requests Posted Image

#82 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:15 PM

Back to trying to connect dots.. and quite possibly another strikeout...

Remember the (since failed) ARGO challenge and the effort to put a handicapped team into AC34? The lady who was pushing for it was a Lynn Fitzpatrick. That (the Argo effort) is unremarkable as a link to this African Diaspora effort; except for them both being about representing the 'under-represented' in AC sailing, and perhaps also for them both having applied but having been rejected. Curiously (I'm sure nobody else watched the whole darn thing back when I posted it) - Lynn F specifically mentioned African Americans (among others) in a fundraising appeal she gave in San Diego. Video, at 7:00

"There are 40 million African Americans in the United States. Probably a billion on the continent and half a billion as part of the diaspora."

Seems entirely possible that Lynn (a San Francisco resident involved in sailing circles, just as was apparently Kithcart until recently) may be in support of, or even already behind, the ADM syndicate effort. Would be interesting her take on it, although she's expressed some fairly wild ideas at times regarding AC34 - some of them also included in that video. Iirc there's a couple other, more complete recordings of her talk out there somewhere too in case anyone cares to find them. I think Dixie also interviewed her at some point, and in that one she talked about wanting to postpone the ACWS, and the AC34 until 2014 or even 2015?

#83 porthos

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:33 PM

Back to trying to connect dots.. and quite possibly another strikeout...

Remember the (since failed) ARGO challenge and the effort to put a handicapped team into AC34? The lady who was pushing for it was a Lynn Fitzpatrick. That (the Argo effort) is unremarkable as a link to this African Diaspora effort; except for them both being about representing the 'under-represented' in AC sailing, and perhaps also for them both having applied but having been rejected. Curiously (I'm sure nobody else watched the whole darn thing back when I posted it) - Lynn F specifically mentioned African Americans (among others) in a fundraising appeal she gave in San Diego. Video, at 7:00

"There are 40 million African Americans in the United States. Probably a billion on the continent and half a billion as part of the diaspora."

Seems entirely possible that Lynn (a San Francisco resident involved in sailing circles, just as was apparently Kithcart until recently) may be in support of, or even already behind, the ADM syndicate effort. Would be interesting her take on it, although she's expressed some fairly wild ideas at times regarding AC34 - some of them also included in that video. Iirc there's a couple other, more complete recordings of her talk out there somewhere too in case anyone cares to find them. I think Dixie also interviewed her at some point, and in that one she talked about wanting to postpone the ACWS, and the AC34 until 2014 or even 2015?


I think you are over-thinking this. Occam's Razor can apply here.

#84 pjfranks

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:59 PM





It says GGYC have to respond to it in some form within 20 days, I wonder what that form is required to be? Will be interesting to see the response.


GGYC has to file an Answer, which is a formal response to the allegations, basically a point-by-point refutation of the Complaint.


GGYC could also file a pre-Answer motion, such as a motion to dismiss, a motion to strike, or a motion for a more definitive statement. Seeing the first two wouldn't surprise me.

IMO any of the options you propose would make GGYC look shifty.


There are rules of civil procedure that govern a lawsuit and all parties must adhere to them. Under those rules, the Plaintiff has the obligation to draft a proper complaint. If they have not -- and there are arguably deficiencies in this Complaint -- then there is nothing shifty about a Defendant insisting that the Plaintiff meet its pleading obligations by filing a pre-Answer motion. Edit: that said, MW&E is a very good firm and drafted a good Complaint, albeit one that looks designed more for public relations than for a court proceeding. I would bet all the money in my pocket against all the money in your pocket that MW&E is doing this on a pro-bono basis.

Your opinion doesn't surprise me.

I'm not interested in your bet. It appears ADN have a good legal team.

#85 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 08:01 PM

Some are wrong here, as for the VC case, it is not a case about how strong the challenger is, but if GGYC respected the protocol and the Deed.
It looks like the persons behind ADAM have been reading SA. ;)

#86 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 08:25 PM

MW&E is a very good firm and drafted a good Complaint, albeit one that looks designed more for public relations than for a court proceeding.


And don't you think it's one of the most important point in an MC Cup being the basis of a a circus relying on sponsors ?

#87 entropy

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 08:43 PM

These guys are not trying to be a challenger. The deed doesn't say much about the Defender, except the defender has to pick a boat before the start of the first race. The NYYC's trials were: You guys race some races, and we'll motor over and tell you when you are done. As I recall, back in the day, the Yacht Club Cruise was even considered.

The deed gives challengers some rights... the Defender is selected by the defending club. Unless NC is a different country all of a sudden, quit referring to ADM as a potential challenger. They aren't and cannot be.

#88 pjfranks

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 08:47 PM

These guys are not trying to be a challenger. The deed doesn't say much about the Defender, except the defender has to pick a boat before the start of the first race. The NYYC's trials were: You guys race some races, and we'll motor over and tell you when you are done. As I recall, back in the day, the Yacht Club Cruise was even considered.

The deed gives challengers some rights... the Defender is selected by the defending club. Unless NC is a different country all of a sudden, quit referring to ADM as a potential challenger. They aren't and cannot be.


Wrong.

#89 DA-WOODY

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    COUGARS COUGARS & More COUGARS

Posted 14 December 2011 - 09:00 PM

didn't the same thing happen to SA with the failed SA-AC Chalange ?????

clASS Action ????

every sock puppet could receive up to 50cents (and that's more sense than they started out withPosted Image)

#90 SimonN

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 09:02 PM

This is tghe ultimate irony. When a half crazed member of a high profile ethnic minority community came on here with mad schemes to bring down legal hell on EB/SNG/Alinghi, he was greeted with open arms and given total support by the GGYC/OR fanboys. He fell from grace because he did nothing. Now we have a member of a high profile ethnic minority community actually taking action against the trustee of the Cup, the very same people are reacting rather differently. Payback is a bitch :D

What's maybe more funny is that this time, while some of the suit is clearly a case of throwing everything and anything at it, the issue of BOFD due to the property deal is a real humdinger. I am at a loss to understand why the property deal isn't included in the overall accounts for sharing any profit with the teams. If there isn't going to be a surplus from the property deal, or even a loss, then it is only right that it can be offset against other revenues. It is hard to make a case for it being seperate. We all know whatr is really going on, with LE taking a risk in funding the Cup and taking the property deal as his payoff for that risk. In many ways that isn't unreasonable, except it is against the DOG. I have a funny feeling this will run and run. No idea who will win, but that part of the case is anything but frivelous.

#91 Sailer X

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 10:08 PM


they seem to have included everything but them and LE's underware.

Would that be considered vaporware or malware?


Wetware.

Only kidding, Larry

#92 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 10:58 PM

"Any organized Yacht Club of a foreign country, incorporated, patented, or licensed by the legislature, admiralty, or other executive department, having for its annual regatta on ocean water course on the sea, or on an arm of the sea, or one which combines both, shall always be entitled to the right of sailing a match for this Cup, with a yacht or vessel propelled by sails only and constructed in the country to which the Challenging Club belongs, against any one yacht or vessel constructed in the country of the Club holding the Cup."

We could have a new and interesting case.:)


#93 ~Stingray~

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 11:18 PM

^ How does your bold have anything to do with ADM?

GGYC, "the Club holding the Cup," will for certain use "one yacht or vessel" to Defend the Cup.. it just won't be one built and sailed by ADM, unless there's a great effing deal more behind that effort than is apparent so far.

Think about it: It is in GGYC's and OR's best interests for there to be a strong Defender Selection Series. I expect they wish that there ~had been~ something, almost anything, to suggest ADM could step up and be competitive to the OR campaign. But all we can find is a non-profit company behind it, registered in only October. The suit filed mentions almost nobody by name and doesn't even quote them. Couldn't the supposed designer guy have at least vetted for their potential?

Since I think the SF real estate stuff is barely palatable even to an LE, and since ADM is not asking or offering to take on a long term share of the risks in it, then: it's hard to know what on earth ADM is even trying to accomplish. Is it the 'boat park' in North Carolina they mention? Someone should get hold of that NC public official for comment; presumably he has nothing to hide and can talk freely about wth that part is all about? edit:could be this guy, 'Secretary J. Keith Crisco NC Department of Commerce' seen here.

#94 WetHog

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 12:32 AM

Now we got some drama. Sure my love of the AC33 court crap was non-exsistant, but with the AC45 circus not really getting me excited to this point this shit is better than nothing. I did think it was a tad shaddy that no viable US syndicates came forward to compete against OR, and I'm not saying this African trust thingy is a viable syndicate, but this suit explains things a bit to me. Should be good.

WetHog :ph34r:

#95 ~Stingray~

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 12:56 AM

Batten Down the Hatches! New Litigation Storm Brewing Over America's Cup

Jan WolfeContactAll Articles

December 14, 2011

In the run-up to the last edition of the America's Cup yacht race, the players seemed to spend more time in court than on the water. Now there's new trouble on the high seas, featuring McDermott Will & Emery with fresh claims on behalf of a jilted racing team and Boies Schiller & Flexner in a reprise role for the Golden Gate Yacht Club.

(requires registration)


#96 Tornado-Cat

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 01:01 AM

SR, I agree with some of your arguments, we don't know much about ADM, but where does the Deed, or even the protocol mention that a defender selects a competitor depending on his assessment of finance of the competitor ? Clearly any competitors of the defenders country has right to participate if they follow the proper process. All ADM is asking is GGYC to respect his duties.

Amusing too that GGYC refused the 25 000 $ because fees were not mentioned and lack of a signatures. Pretty much the same scenario when they refused to select TNZ as CoR.

I just find it strange that they did not attack the deal with CNR as a BOFD.

#97 Surf City Racing

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 01:02 AM

Since I think the SF real estate stuff is barely palatable even to an LE, and since ADM is not asking or offering to take on a long term share of the risks in it, then: it's hard to know what on earth ADM is even trying to accomplish.


Ask yourself who's really behind the lawsuit. This whole thing reeks of a sham! This is the same law firm that was involved in the last GGYC lawsuit, I believe. Same MO, sneaky lawyer trick serving papers right before the holidays.

Really, there are only two possibilities, and they've both been mentioned in this thread...one back on page two. Wait until we find out who it is.

Can't talk now, have to go meet someone about a developing story!

Posted Image

#98 ~HHN92~

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 01:30 AM

SR, I agree with some of your arguments, we don't know much about ADM, but where does the Deed, or even the protocol mention that a defender selects a competitor depending on his assessment of finance of the competitor ? Clearly any competitors of the defenders country has right to participate if they follow the proper process. All ADM is asking is GGYC to respect his duties.

Amusing too that GGYC refused the 25 000 $ because fees were not mentioned and lack of a signatures. Pretty much the same scenario when they refused to select TNZ as CoR.

I just find it strange that they did not attack the deal with CNR as a BOFD.


Read the DoG, read it real closely.

There is nothing, not a word, about anyone submitting to be a defense candidate for the holder of the Cup. Therefor there cannot be a BoFD case against the trustee for not following the DoG. Selecting the defender yacht is at the descretion of the defending club.

If I understand how the NYYC handled it, if someone wanted to be a defense candidate then they would submit to the club to send a boat up to race the club's boats.

There have been a few boats over the years that were not NYYC boats that won the defender 'selection' series (not a ladder event like a match race series). It was always a selection, which Royal Perth found out was a better way than having a knock-out series that may eliminate the fastest boat.

So there is nothing to see here, move along..........................

#99 ~Stingray~

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 01:37 AM

SR, I agree with some of your arguments, we don't know much about ADM, but where does the Deed, or even the protocol mention that a defender selects a competitor depending on his assessment of finance of the competitor ?


Well it's in the Protocol, that they rely on as being legit for other arguments, and they even try emphasize it for some reason.

Attached File  Review.jpg   303.47K   20 downloads

The 'modern' Deed says nothing about alternate defender boats so it is left to MC to define by a 'Protocol' - like in as above. It's much the same as dealing with multiple challengers but less 'problematic' in some ways.

Can't wait to see Friedman's take on it, cause after a third reading it still looks a little bizarre to me. What are they really asking for at this stage? They can't be serious about some of it - I mean 'Geez' - lol. Where is that guy anyway?

#100 dogwatch

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 01:40 AM

This is the same law firm that was involved in the last GGYC lawsuit, I believe.


Don't think so. I think you'll find the "connection", such as it is, is that the lawyer previously worked for a firm which previously worked for SNG.

I know there are those who like to see EB lurking in every shadow but so far there is not evidence of that.




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