969 replies to this topic

[nixon]

tried a few options with the URL, could not get it embedding either.

[A Florida Redneck]

Camper clearly have a boat speed issue too.
Not as bad as the Farr boat, but off the wind they are not in the top tier.
Don't know if it is the Botin or the team NZL part of the design....
But committees usually don't design the best boats.....
They should go north NOW.
Edit: They ARE!
Edit: And they've gybed back now but north of the fleet.

[coxcreek]

Only the Telephone is faster at the moment otherwise Camper has speed over the rest, who are really slowing. Will Camper gybe North again at the next wind swerve or continue on and eventually stomp the whole fleet?

[A Florida Redneck]

Boats to the south of the fleet are bleeding miles.
Time to go north.

[onimod]

I think we might have just seen first place overall be decided in the last 3 hrs.
The slight lead that G4 was predicted to hold and increase to Lisbon has sadly gone.

[~HHN92~]

They are all trying to get to the yellow streams (arrows), by I.P. Freely........................

Puma is south, pissing it away.

[Cheap Beer]

They are all trying to get to the yellow streams (arrows), by I.P. Freely........................

Puma is south, pissing it away.

Last leg must of gone to their head. "What the hell is going on out there?"

[armchairair]

I wish Livestream had embeddable players. Silly as hell.

Then again, we still run our own front page on a platform from 6 years ago, so I guess I don't have too much to gripe about.

From my daughter who seems to know about these things:

<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Livestream does have embeddable players - they're just hard to find. You have to click on that little paper airplane thingy under the post. When you do, up pops the permalink/embed options or a choice to share on FB/etc. Lvestream/VOR may disable embedding for the Live shows - but who cares, just use the YouTube embed. Unless he's talking about embedding the whole livestream shabang - videos/photos/audio...but that would be very complicated...

Please go to the livestream page and have her post a the code to embed one of the videos here. I have been known to be 'slow' at times.

I have sent your request to her for a code. Hope it will work!

[Mexican]

Camper clearly have a boat speed issue too.
Not as bad as the Farr boat, but off the wind they are not in the top tier.
Don't know if it is the Botin or the team NZL part of the design....
But committees usually don't design the best boats.....
They should go north NOW.
Edit: They ARE!
Edit: And they've gybed back now but north of the fleet.

And maybe they've gybed again. Heading 36 degrees whereas the rest of the fleet is heading due west or there abouts (sans Sanya). Camper is also sailing in a 20 degree westerly shift which makes me think they've gybed.

Mex

[crashdog]

I think they have already missed the opportunity to ride that wind line. Its an interesting decision. Break to the north, where they can at least get some more wind before the high develops around the fleet, or as the high develops stay south and catch the last of the good breeze. I expect Telephonica will not gybe until Groupama does. I know, moto. This is the kind of decision we have seen Tele mess up on recently...

[A Florida Redneck]

Actually, the routing at www.zezo.org suggests the Volvo boats could continue East for a couple more scheds and then work north.
Routing for the trailers in the VORG suggest going north now.
Different timing.

[armchairair]

I wish Livestream had embeddable players. Silly as hell.

Then again, we still run our own front page on a platform from 6 years ago, so I guess I don't have too much to gripe about.

From my daughter who seems to know about these things:

<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Livestream does have embeddable players - they're just hard to find. You have to click on that little paper airplane thingy under the post. When you do, up pops the permalink/embed options or a choice to share on FB/etc. Lvestream/VOR may disable embedding for the Live shows - but who cares, just use the YouTube embed. Unless he's talking about embedding the whole livestream shabang - videos/photos/audio...but that would be very complicated...

Please go to the livestream page and have her post a the code to embed one of the videos here. I have been known to be 'slow' at times.

I have sent your request to her for a code. Hope it will work!

Response from daughter: (things ARE sounding complicated!)

The player has an embed code that works if you're posting it on a blog or a webpage. However, if the forum software recognizes the embed code is a completely different scenario. I wash't aware that this code situation was forum based.
http://www.livestrea...read.php?t=9345
Anyway, I've tested it and inserting/embedding media from here seems to work http://www.livestrea...olvooceanracesd
Although this is only a small portion of the rest of the rest...<br style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0.917969); "><br style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0.917969); ">From what I can suss out, it appears this forum software was released in 2010 - http://community.inv...tions-released/ - and a lot has changed since then!

She says that she will inquire further from her programing co-worker tomorrow. Hope above is helpful.

[Swanno (Ohf Shore)]

Predictor suggests there will be 400 miles seperation in two days time with all boats making big tracks north leaving groupama and tele heading east, converging in 4 days.

Cant see it becoming a reality.

[Varan]

Predictor suggests there will be 400 miles seperation in two days time with all boats making big tracks north leaving groupama and tele heading east, converging in 4 days.

Cant see it becoming a reality.

But it would be interesting.

[coxcreek]

You may not have seen these, from Voile et Voiliers - Botin's Camper, Farr's Abu Dhabi, Kouyourmdjian's (sp) Groupama.

Attached Files

•  VO70 Camper.jpg   51.03K   325 downloads
•  VO70 AbuDhabi.jpg   54.17K   353 downloads
•  VO70 Groupama.jpg   53.76K   268 downloads

[Swanno (Ohf Shore)]

Awesome find

[oioi]

really cool. hadnt realised just how diffrerence the lenght of the boards were. also how much further forward Abu Dhabi carries max beam.

have to say if you asked a 10 year old to sketch a sexy looking skiff, bthey would draw you camper...

[coxcreek]

Yes, all the BS from the Xperts about Camper being blunt up front and throwing huge waves, she's very much the finest of the three in the forward sections.

[ripclaw]

Just looked at the 2D tracker. Abu Dhabi are certainly mixing it up with the big boys and their average speeds are higher than Telefonica and Groupama.

[schakel]

A weird post by Yann Riou, the MCM on Groupama, today, on the French version of the Volvooceanrace site. He is pondering the option of going North, all the way to the ice gate!!! I did not even know there was an ice gate on this leg!

See below, with translation.

"
L’option d’une route très nord, qui flirte avec la porte des glaces - synonyme de froid - est toujours possible, mais pas certaine.

Cette porte des glaces se situe au-dessus du 43° N. Etonnant quand on pense que notre port d’attache, Lorient, se situe plus nord que cela. Et même si on ne va pas prétendre qu’il y fait beau et chaud toute l’année, on n’y croise pas beaucoup de glaçons. Au fond d’un verre à l‘heure de l’apéritif, tout au plus!

....

Alors, un petit tour dans ces eaux froides pour Groupama 4 dans les jours qui suivent ? Réponse d’ici peu.
"

<<
The option of a North route, getting close to the ice gate is still possible, but not certain. The ice gate is above 43° N, which is kind of surprising for us, since our home port, Lorient, is further North than that! Even if it is not warm weather all year round overthere, you rarely see ice, other than in your drink.

So a small detour for Groupama towards these cold waters?... You'll get the answer soon...
>>

So, real insight, or pure propaganda to mess up with your competition's mind?...

They are trying to lose! No it's a joke...

[Terrorvision]

Yes, all the BS from the Xperts about Camper being blunt up front and throwing huge waves, she's very much the finest of the three in the forward sections.

It's just a pity that it isn't the forward section that makes it go fast!

[Panoramix]

Actually I've changed my mind, I think that Groupama may catch the weather system ahead. If that's the case it might be breakaway time!

I was wrong, they've fallen behind and need to go North . Telefonica has played it very well, I understand now their strategy (they were covering the North in case they couldn't catch the system). Groupama is 10 NM behind but with so little wind ahead anything can happen.

[Mexican]

Yes, all the BS from the Xperts about Camper being blunt up front and throwing huge waves, she's very much the finest of the three in the forward sections.

It's just a pity that it isn't the forward section that makes it go fast!

Don't talk too soon. A 23 nm gain in one sched. About sail around the bow of Puma and maybe Abu Dhabi too.

Mex

[victor t]

You may not have seen these, from Voile et Voiliers - Botin's Camper, Farr's Abu Dhabi, Kouyourmdjian's (sp) Groupama.

with comments http://chevaliertagl...-design_17.html

[harzak]

Been away sailing without internet for a small day, and now TF's in the lead. So what happened, GPMA didn't catch the train* and now everybody goes north to keep in the wind as long as possible?

* is it correct jargon?

[gybe-ho!]

You may not have seen these, from Voile et Voiliers - Botin's Camper, Farr's Abu Dhabi, Kouyourmdjian's (sp) Groupama.

with comments http://chevaliertagl...-design_17.html

Bloody nice find Fella, great to see the hull shapes described in such a clear fashion. Hats off to Jacques Taglang for the hard work producing the drawings.

[oioi]

telephonica have gybed back east, whilst Abu Dhabi lead the north, but maybe are about to sail out the wind?

fascinating to see how this one plays out, we could see some big separation.

[onimod]

^ the VOR tracker predicts a restart in around 12hrs for the first 5 boats
(although G4 restarts from the back, 9nm behind Tele)

[2Newts]

telephonica have gybed back east, whilst Abu Dhabi lead the north, but maybe are about to sail out the wind?

fascinating to see how this one plays out, we could see some big separation.

ok, this leg is officially NUTS

big smile from me - it's fun to watch. I feel for these guys getting caught watching other boats that used to be behind them do something seemingly crazy and come out on top. Sounds like all the times I have been bested by some weird strategy in the Bermuda race. One of the years that Sinn Fein won the whole thing they went almost 100 miles off the rhumb, in a Cal 40, and won. They started with class 1 (slowest) and finished with class 4 boats.

anyway, if i were a betting man, i'd say that by the time of the mid-ocean restart that it looks like we are about to get, Abu Dhabi will be the leader.

2N

[~HHN92~]

Bungy chord racing on this leg so far, stretch-out and spring back.

[valor]

You may not have seen these, from Voile et Voiliers - Botin's Camper, Farr's Abu Dhabi, Kouyourmdjian's (sp) Groupama.

Very cool. I was in Alicante for the start and got a very close look at all six boats. What struck me were two things which you can see in these drawings. 1) note the forward position of Camper's keel...forward of the dagger boards as well, and 2) notice the angle of the dagger boards. All six boats were different. Some boards angled outwards, some straight in and one even angled inward. The keel location on Camper was the thing that seemed radical to this eye....who has no clue on boat design!

[bruno]

The lines drawings are very nice, but I think they are observed and not issued by the NAs. If they are accurate then I Was struck by the differences in deadrise between the 3, with Farr and Botin seeming at extreme opposites and JK in the middle, though with little dr in the nose. What I recall is that tends to promote early planing.

Yes G4 missed the train.

[smackdaddy]

Those line drawings are great. Very cool

I remember the in-port in Sanya, I think it was, where the commentators were talking about how "bow down" Camper appeared to be in relation to the other boats. To my very untrained eye, it seems obvious that with the beam pushed so far back and the keel forward this "bow down" posture makes a lot more sense.

What would the performance benefit of this kind of weight vs. buoyancy distribution?

[couchsurfer]

...quite the restart!
...what's curious is how according to the weather on the tracker,1pmUtc,Tele gybed from beamreach to DDWFTTW

..not everything is as it seems

[valor]

Those line drawings are great. Very cool

I remember the in-port in Sanya, I think it was, where the commentators were talking about how "bow down" Camper appeared to be in relation to the other boats. To my very untrained eye, it seems obvious that with the beam pushed so far back and the keel forward this "bow down" posture makes a lot more sense.

What would the performance benefit of this kind of weight vs. buoyancy distribution?

Camper has a "knuckle" in the stern of the boat, underwater running the width of the transom. I believe this is cause for some of the "bow down" effect.....similar to a trim tab effect but it is part of the hull and not adjustable.

[~HHN92~]

They keep chsing the pressure from the low but it seems to stay just out of reach. Group looked like they had it for a while, Tele got some of it, Camper dug out to get some, and AD seems to have taken a whack at it too.

If one of them ever really hooks into it they will be gone. C'mon Kenny.

[Panoramix]

The leg is becoming completely bizarre, G4 must be really annoyed. I think that in "real terms", Abu dhabi is first followed by camper and Puma.

For Groupam vs Telefonica it is clear as mud, I am not sure what Telefonica is trying to do now, are they still trying to catch the wind ahead? Groupama has gybed too late and is clearly trying to limit damage now, they must have missed the wind by a few hours only, if they had caught it, they would have made an unbelievably lucky breakway with all the others stuck behind!

[MR.CLEAN]

HTML is disabled for posters because of the ease with which nasty code can screw with the site. We can do it though. Test:

[MR.CLEAN]

I'm pretty sure they use the SD feed for only the in-port and race starts. That's the only thing that is working as an embedded player.

[Panoramix]

The leg is becoming completely bizarre, G4 must be really annoyed. I think that in "real terms", Abu dhabi is first followed by camper and Puma.

For Groupam vs Telefonica it is clear as mud, I am not sure what Telefonica is trying to do now, are they still trying to catch the wind ahead? Groupama has gybed too late and is clearly trying to limit damage now, they must have missed the wind by a few hours only, if they had caught it, they would have made an unbelievably lucky breakway with all the others stuck behind!

From the wind direction and it speed, It looks like Telefonica has managed to catch the weather system. If they stay with it, they've basically won the leg!

[oioi]

1337890851[/url]' post=']

From the wind direction and it speed, It looks like Telefonica has managed to catch the weather system. If they stay with it, they've basically won the leg!

and the race?

[Kenny Dumas]

Big gamble by Tele. If they don't jibe back soon, they're committed to first or last and I doubt they can stay with it. Why take such a huge flyer when you're leading overall? My vote: bad call, jibe ho!

[Heriberto]

I see very little risk compared to the reward for Tele. The way I read it, If the tail of the low stalls and they hook in, they are gone. If they miss it, the angles of the high for them and the other boats will put the fleet back together in a relatively unchanged position.

That said, it is a very long shot, and I don't think they will hook in.

[~HHN92~]

Anybody look back by Miami? Would have been great if they had some of that a couple of weeks ago.

Looks like they're chasing the tail of that system. Tele taking a gamble to get there, which right now looking at everybody's speed, is not a bad gamble at this point.

[Pierre S]

G4 missed the train and now Telefónica is baling out of the easterly option too.

[Swanno (Ohf Shore)]

Geez, Abu Dhabi is doing well at the moment!

In 4 days the tracker has ABD, CAM, PUM, GRP, TEL and SAN but with only 65 miles between 1st and last, at 20 knots that could go either way.

[Mexican]

G4 missed the train and now Telefónica is baling out of the easterly option too.

It's all gone to custard for Telefonica. Less breeze from a bad direction adds up to at least 3 more scheds of pain.

This makes things interesting...

Mex

[Panoramix]

From the wind direction and it speed, It looks like Telefonica has managed to catch the weather system. If they stay with it, they've basically won the leg!

and the race?

Ah well, they've now missed the train!

They are now going North, I think that the real ranking is AD - Camper - Puma - G4 - Telefonica.

G4 is in trouble, they need Puma or Camper behind!

[Mexican]

I see very little risk compared to the reward for Tele. The way I read it, If the tail of the low stalls and they hook in, they are gone. If they miss it, the angles of the high for them and the other boats will put the fleet back together in a relatively unchanged position.

That said, it is a very long shot, and I don't think they will hook in.

That's not quite the way it's playing out at the moment

[Tunnel Rat]

Currently there is a 70° difference in wind angle between Tele and the rest. Wind speed is not that different, but Tele are VMG running and pointing high, the others are beam reaching straight at the barn door.

If they finish in their current positions (assuming that Tele do get dropped) Abu - Camp - Puma - Gpma - Tele - Sanya then Camper will be the leader with 6 points between 1st and 4th! A good result for the interest levels.

However it seems that there are still several shake up opportunities between here and Lisbon.

Great spectator stuff from 10,000 miles away!

[onimod]

Puma and Camper must be getting sick of the sight of each other by now.

[Mexican]

Currently there is a 70° difference in wind angle between Tele and the rest. Wind speed is not that different, but Tele are VMG running and pointing high, the others are beam reaching straight at the barn door.

If they finish in their current positions (assuming that Tele do get dropped) Abu - Camp - Puma - Gpma - Tele - Sanya then Camper will be the leader with 6 points between 1st and 4th! A good result for the interest levels.

However it seems that there are still several shake up opportunities between here and Lisbon.

Great spectator stuff from 10,000 miles away!

2,200 nm to go. The first 4 boats are within 10 nm of each other WRT distance to the finish. Close!

[umpire]

They don't seem to be very happy on G4 this morning

http://www.cammas-gr..._equipe_507.jsp

[Heriberto]

I see very little risk compared to the reward for Tele. The way I read it, If the tail of the low stalls and they hook in, they are gone. If they miss it, the angles of the high for them and the other boats will put the fleet back together in a relatively unchanged position.

That said, it is a very long shot, and I don't think they will hook in.

That's not quite the way it's playing out at the moment

I was looking forward a little further than that. but I didn't expect Tele to continue going east when it meant going south of 95-100 degrees. If you look at the tracks, when they got headed, nobody dug into it south of 90 degrees.

"If we can't hold a heading above 90 degrees and X pressure, it's game over for this flyer.".

The situation is fluid and complicated and there are lots of twists and turns yet to come.

[Cyrille Hydrogene]

They don't seem to be very happy on G4 this morning

http://www.cammas-gr..._equipe_507.jsp

Not very happy is an understatement...

There is an amazing video showing how gutted the G4 guys were when they learned yesterday they had lost huge ground and were left behind in little to no wind:

http://youtu.be/nxtMNufc3sc

Again, it's surprising to see Groupama's communication being so frank about the mood in the boat. Good for us anyway.

[crashdog]

I see very little risk compared to the reward for Tele. The way I read it, If the tail of the low stalls and they hook in, they are gone. If they miss it, the angles of the high for them and the other boats will put the fleet back together in a relatively unchanged position.

That said, it is a very long shot, and I don't think they will hook in.

That's not quite the way it's playing out at the moment

I was looking forward a little further than that. but I didn't expect Tele to continue going east when it meant going south of 95-100 degrees. If you look at the tracks, when they got headed, nobody dug into it south of 90 degrees.

"If we can't hold a heading above 90 degrees and X pressure, it's game over for this flyer.".

The situation is fluid and complicated and there are lots of twists and turns yet to come.

Telefonica appears to have a decision problem in these circumstances. Too bad, I thought they had the grip on this time.

[2Newts]

Wow, Groupama Puma and Abu Dhabi tacked due north!

I suppose they figure that they will go up and around the coming high, versus Tele and Camper figuring that they are ok letting the high pass over the top of them if they are still ahead of the other 3 when the front arrives after the high.

Risks either way. Yikes.

Best leg yet.

2N

[Panoramix]

They don't seem to be very happy on G4 this morning

http://www.cammas-gr..._equipe_507.jsp

Not very happy is an understatement...

There is an amazing video showing how gutted the G4 guys were when they learned yesterday they had lost huge ground and were left behind in little to no wind:

http://youtu.be/nxtMNufc3sc

Again, it's surprising to see Groupama's communication being so frank about the mood in the boat. Good for us anyway.

Well I would rather say it is surprising that some teams are not so frank. From a commercial perspective, they are on the water to promote their sponsor who want some exposure whether it is good news or bad news from a sailor perspective.

Sponsors know that their team can't win every time and whatever the result they need the ROI to justify the expense, a bit of drama is quite good for them. Ups and downs and suspense are not necesarily bad as people are more likely to check out what's going on.

[Kenny Dumas]

I like Puma's position: Guard the north but work east in the pressure. Very interesting race and good to see Tele behind but still in the hunt.

[roca]

They don't seem to be very happy on G4 this morning

http://www.cammas-gr..._equipe_507.jsp

Not very happy is an understatement...

There is an amazing video showing how gutted the G4 guys were when they learned yesterday they had lost huge ground and were left behind in little to no wind:

http://youtu.be/nxtMNufc3sc

Again, it's surprising to see Groupama's communication being so frank about the mood in the boat. Good for us anyway.

groupama communication has been great since the beginning, so I am not surprised at all. They have the best communication both for quality and quantity, they post twice a day and explainfranckly what happens and how they feel. I must admit that quality out of puma is good too. The livestream interview to kenny from the ocean was great, he also explaind well the facts for the passionate and expert followers.

Speaking about the bad mood and not pretending everything is fine is also a better way to go over it and limit damages, with less mental energy. Go ask abu dahbi about...

It seems we are in the "best leg yet" since many weeks now and many legs ;
this race is awesome, I really hope they do not ruin all with stpd changes.

is it already time to ask the one hour updates? groupama now getting the extreme north choice...other thrill for us lucky follower

[Lexpat]

I don't get what Groupama is doing , but again i'm not Cammas .

[~HHN92~]

Looks like Abu and Puma may get a lift, and cross Camper with the header. Geez, looks like an in-port race at this point with all the tacking.

[couchsurfer]

Looks like Abu and Puma may get a lift, and cross Camper with the header. Geez, looks like an in-port race at this point with all the tacking.

..yeh really,,,a 3000 mile in-port race

[Heriberto]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left to go, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

[couchsurfer]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left below, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

..good points.
...I'd think it's safe to assume that extra sail was along for all the legs,,and probably proved quite 'handy' at times
...I also wonder how the sail 'credits' are doing?

[~HHN92~]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left below, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

..good points.
...I'd think it's safe to assume that extra sail was along for all the legs,,and probably proved quite 'handy' at times
...I also wonder how the sail 'credits' are doing?

To my eye some of those were looking pretty tired.

[armchairair]

I'm pretty sure they use the SD feed for only the in-port and race starts. That's the only thing that is working as an embedded player.

Final follow up from daughter:

From what (co-worker) told me - forums, especially old forums (as I think I said, I think this one hasn't been updated since 2010) will strip iframes from the posts/code - because in the past they weren't used for helpful/useful things like videos.
So no - I don't think that within the SA forums they'll be able to embed anything other than the SD Livestream videos - which doesn't include the live posts that have been coming straight from the boats.
I have no idea if updated versions of the forum software would even support it.
This is totally not in my realm of expertise.

[crashdog]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left below, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

..good points.
...I'd think it's safe to assume that extra sail was along for all the legs,,and probably proved quite 'handy' at times
...I also wonder how the sail 'credits' are doing?

Really, do we have to go through this all over again? We know that Tele sailed with no extra sails on Leg 4, that is, they sailed the leg with the maximum 10 sails allowed. What they did was to measure in the 2nd storm jib as a staysail and leave the max sized staysail on the dock. We don't know for certain that they sailed the prior legs with 10 sails, but its seems likely that they sailed according to how they interpreted the rules which was not that they were allowed 11 sails on board, but that they were allowed to measure in storm jibs as staysails. So, no, its not safe to assume...

[Panoramix]

I don't get what Groupama is doing , but again i'm not Cammas .

I think that he is trying to position himself ahead of the high which is forming now to get a lift in 24hours. A bit risky IMHO, they risk the high catching them up! Puma is more extreme in its tactic!

[Panoramix]

Really, do we have to go through this all over again? We know that Tele sailed with no extra sails on Leg 4, that is, they sailed the leg with the maximum 10 sails allowed. What they did was to measure in the 2nd storm jib as a staysail and leave the max sized staysail on the dock. We don't know for certain that they sailed the prior legs with 10 sails, but its seems likely that they sailed according to how they interpreted the rules which was not that they were allowed 11 sails on board, but that they were allowed to measure in storm jibs as staysails. So, no, its not safe to assume...

Yes but beyond discussing their good faith, they were advantaged from interpreting the rules this way and it show in their results now!

[SailBlueH2O]

Bold move by Puma (northern departure).....wind angles will pay huge dividends soon~~~

[ET1]

Really, do we have to go through this all over again? We know that Tele sailed with no extra sails on Leg 4, that is, they sailed the leg with the maximum 10 sails allowed. What they did was to measure in the 2nd storm jib as a staysail and leave the max sized staysail on the dock. We don't know for certain that they sailed the prior legs with 10 sails, but its seems likely that they sailed according to how they interpreted the rules which was not that they were allowed 11 sails on board, but that they were allowed to measure in storm jibs as staysails. So, no, its not safe to assume...

Yes but beyond discussing their good faith, they were advantaged from interpreting the rules this way and it show in their results now!

Bullshit! 36 hours before the discussion was wether they would hook on a front and go off like a rocket. Now as this didn´t work they are slow because they do not have a stay sail on top like they had when they were winning. what´s that all about? There are so many possibilities why they are where they are at the moment. you should shut up and think before talking.
Wait 24 hours then talk again but not long gone shit.

[coxcreek]

Here you go:

Shunned by the American public, the stopover in Miami (Florida) of the Volvo Ocean Race has not been by international actors of offshore racing, together gathered for a sort of G20. Just before the start of the seventh stage to Lisbon, a summit meeting has helped to refine the contours of the next round the world race, which will start in autumn 2014. Volvo Cars and Volvo Group have confirmed their support, but - according to our informations - required two minimum requirements : at least eight boats at the start (they are only six this year), and a real cost reduction. One can easily imagine that the reliability aspects (hull, rigging ...) was also discussed and weighed in the balance.

Exit the VO 70 !

After 60 ORMA trimarans replaced by MOD70, and pending the decision of the IMOCA (26 June), which is working on the possibility of a one design (maybe Farr ?) to succeed the current 60 feet, the next Volvo Ocean Race will be run with... one design.

According to our sources, and according to the specification which provides a drastic reduction of costs, it will be a shorter boat - 60 to 65 feet (as against 70 now), but probably around 62 feet - the heavier and sturdy, less shipping and teammates.

It seems clear that there has not been much consultation with architects in vogue for this future "Volvo One Design" : it is the legendary Farr Yacht Design who will sign the new boat, combined with four considered shipyards : Multiplast in France for bridges, Decision in Switzerland for various strutural elements, Persico in Italy and Green Marine in England for assembly. Masts, rudders and daggerboards are under discussion.

Juan Kouyoumdjian not included

It is interesting that the two boats being designed by Bruce Farr in the Volvo Ocean Race 2012-2013 - Abu Dhabi and Sanya - occupy the last two places overall for the moment.

It is also interesting to note that Abu Dhabi was built by Italian shipyard Persico in Bergamo, who has long worked with the New Zealand designer based in Annapolis, United States.

And it is interesting to note that the French-Argentinean Juan Kouyoumdjian, who designed Telefonica, Groupama 4 and Puma - respectively first, second and fourth of the Volvo right now !- was not approached. This may seem surprising. The rumors of a firm's exclusive contract between Artemis and Juan Yacht Design for the next America's Cup (the AC72 will be launched soon) and that could havie influence the Volvo organizers, are swept by Juan K him-self. «This has absolutely nothing to do, told us Juan Kouyoumdjian, rather surprised by this decision, but as usual affable and without any aggression. I have not been consulted by the organizers of the race.» And adds : «To contribute to the effort of declining budgets, I suggested to Knut Frostad to offer my plans for future VO 70 to build, thus limiting the costs only to the improvement and development of the boats as agreed, including a structural point of view. But it seems that my mail has remained on his desk.»

Some skippers unhappy

Although the one-design is attractive, and should not alter the intensity of this global race, the race has certainly put together this "design package" with Farr Yacht Design and the four sites mentioned above. However, a key player in the Volvo Ocean Race, which requested anonymity, said loud and clear : "I have difficulty understanding the process of Frostad and his staff in this matter. Everyone agrees that Farr is a great architect, but now its boats are exceeded. So, in addition to a boat shorter and heavier is not really going in the right direction !"

He also said that several skippers currently engaged in the Volvo Ocean Race would be unhappy with the choice of architect and the monotype, which no longer permit the development of vessels, appendages, rigs... all these innovations that are also salt of ocean racing and one of its most exciting, whether in IMOCA 60, the Volvo Ocean Race and the Transat 6.50.

North sails reduced from 32 to 22 ?

These skippers do not like the sricte one design on the sails, which is confirmed by Bruno Dubois, vice-president of North Sails Europe, invited to the symposium in Miami, and we interviewed on his return from Florida : "We are finalizing a proposal for future sails monotypes. Five of the six boats in the Volvo Ocean Race are veiled North, and we do not sail or monotypes, this will not change our purpose, that of reliability and performance. Much in the last Volvo, as in the Vendee Globe, we had experienced trouble (delamination due to faulty fabric, ed), as this year, after 41,000 miles and four equators already crossed, sails in 3 DI eEtra Kevlar gave every satisfaction." And Dubois added : "In any event, a race with only six boats is not profitable for a sailmaker, but good in terms of image."

We do not see how North could be absent of this competition, whatever the solution chosen ! We also know that, again in order to slow inflation of budgets, and the cost of the sails held this year, the organizers aim to see the total number of sails going from 32 (15 before and 17 during the race) to a total number between 22 and 25 in 2014.

Prices of construction within 50%

By the way, what will the construction's price for a Volvo One Design ? The figures for the current prototypes are respectively a little over 5 millions euros for Telefonica, around 6 millions for Groupama and... 9 millions for Abu Dhabi, designed by Farr.

There are rumors that the organizers of the Volvo predict, with the Farr OD, a construction budget divided by two - but if you take the huge cost of Abu Dhabi as a refence, that would mean around 4,5 millions euros ! Juan Kouyoumdjian, who confirms these figures, found that the difference with the boats he has designed this year is finally slight compared to the total budget of a team (around 750,000 euros for Telefonica, the "cheaper" ) in boats that are necessarily more regressive.

In fact, the organizers of the next race would like to offer to Volvo a "package" containing two stop-overs less, a one design boat (or two for larger teams) and teams less numerous. A famous Volvo sailor (four races), who also prefers to remain anonymous, says that it is "a very big risk" : "Insofar as the leitmotiv of Volvo is to have at least eight teams in 2014, with these new measures, the VOR could antagonize teams like Telefonica and Groupama, which a priori were ready to go for the next edition". Elements of response on June the 28th, during the stopover in Lorient.

One thing is certain : one design in major offshore races is more relevant than ever, and lobbies are working at full between organizers, architects, builders and classes, whether for the future of the Volvo Ocean Race or Vendee Globe. Bruce Farr, one of the most successful architects of the world, is not about to give up in front of Verdier-VPLP or Kouyoumdjian !

Juan K, who is also ready to start building the future of IMOCA 60 for the Spanish Iker Martinez for the next Barcelona World Race (he already has his sponsor, Mapfre), is suspended from the decision of the IMOCA ... and could see his boat die if the idea of launching a pre-study on the creation of a one-design 60-foot IMOCA prevailed in June.

Needless to say finally that Bruce Farr is of course also in the race to draw the possible future IMOCA one design, if the class members vote in this way in a few weeks. Answers on the 26^th of June for the Vendee Globe, and on the 28^th for the Volvo.

Voiles et Voiliers

[Panoramix]

Really, do we have to go through this all over again? We know that Tele sailed with no extra sails on Leg 4, that is, they sailed the leg with the maximum 10 sails allowed. What they did was to measure in the 2nd storm jib as a staysail and leave the max sized staysail on the dock. We don't know for certain that they sailed the prior legs with 10 sails, but its seems likely that they sailed according to how they interpreted the rules which was not that they were allowed 11 sails on board, but that they were allowed to measure in storm jibs as staysails. So, no, its not safe to assume...

Yes but beyond discussing their good faith, they were advantaged from interpreting the rules this way and it show in their results now!

Bullshit! 36 hours before the discussion was wether they would hook on a front and go off like a rocket. Now as this didn´t work they are slow because they do not have a stay sail on top like they had when they were winning. what´s that all about? There are so many possibilities why they are where they are at the moment. you should shut up and think before talking.
Wait 24 hours then talk again but not long gone shit.

During drag races they aren't as fast as they used to be. Puma and Groupama can now nearly match their speed on a reach when they were bleeding miles before.

[shanghaisailor]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left below, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

..good points.
...I'd think it's safe to assume that extra sail was along for all the legs,,and probably proved quite 'handy' at times
...I also wonder how the sail 'credits' are doing?

Really, do we have to go through this all over again? We know that Tele sailed with no extra sails on Leg 4, that is, they sailed the leg with the maximum 10 sails allowed. What they did was to measure in the 2nd storm jib as a staysail and leave the max sized staysail on the dock. We don't know for certain that they sailed the prior legs with 10 sails, but its seems likely that they sailed according to how they interpreted the rules which was not that they were allowed 11 sails on board, but that they were allowed to measure in storm jibs as staysails. So, no, its not safe to assume...

Crashdog you are so right and it is funny how gormless misinterpretation becomes fact. Telefonica carried the correct number of sails on each leg. What they were protested for was carrying a sail as a sail with one designation (staysail) when it should have had a different designation (storm jib)Sailgate was a non event - the International Jury stated that Telefonica had no case to answer therefore case closed - unless you are an armchair sailor

See on the water

Shaghai Sailor

[Heriberto]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left below, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

..good points.
...I'd think it's safe to assume that extra sail was along for all the legs,,and probably proved quite 'handy' at times
...I also wonder how the sail 'credits' are doing?

Really, do we have to go through this all over again? We know that Tele sailed with no extra sails on Leg 4, that is, they sailed the leg with the maximum 10 sails allowed. What they did was to measure in the 2nd storm jib as a staysail and leave the max sized staysail on the dock. We don't know for certain that they sailed the prior legs with 10 sails, but its seems likely that they sailed according to how they interpreted the rules which was not that they were allowed 11 sails on board, but that they were allowed to measure in storm jibs as staysails. So, no, its not safe to assume...

Crashdog you are so right and it is funny how gormless misinterpretation becomes fact. Telefonica carried the correct number of sails on each leg. What they were protested for was carrying a sail as a sail with one designation (staysail) when it should have had a different designation (storm jib)Sailgate was a non event - the International Jury stated that Telefonica had no case to answer therefore case closed - unless you are an armchair sailor

See on the water

Shaghai Sailor

If it wasn't an advantage, why do it?

They haven't dominated since.

I'm not sure about WHY there is a relationship. Only pointing out it exists. I have nothing against Telefonica: they deserve mucho respecto.

[clamslapper]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left below, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

..good points.
...I'd think it's safe to assume that extra sail was along for all the legs,,and probably proved quite 'handy' at times
...I also wonder how the sail 'credits' are doing?

Really, do we have to go through this all over again? We know that Tele sailed with no extra sails on Leg 4, that is, they sailed the leg with the maximum 10 sails allowed. What they did was to measure in the 2nd storm jib as a staysail and leave the max sized staysail on the dock. We don't know for certain that they sailed the prior legs with 10 sails, but its seems likely that they sailed according to how they interpreted the rules which was not that they were allowed 11 sails on board, but that they were allowed to measure in storm jibs as staysails. So, no, its not safe to assume...

Crashdog you are so right and it is funny how gormless misinterpretation becomes fact. Telefonica carried the correct number of sails on each leg. What they were protested for was carrying a sail as a sail with one designation (staysail) when it should have had a different designation (storm jib)Sailgate was a non event - the International Jury stated that Telefonica had no case to answer therefore case closed - unless you are an armchair sailor

See on the water

Shaghai Sailor

If it wasn't an advantage, why do it?

They haven't dominated since.

I'm not sure about WHY there is a relationship. Only pointing out it exists. I have nothing against Telefonica: they deserve mucho respecto.

I attribute it to basic karma. Sail-gate. AIS-gate in the Malacca Strait. Taking-on-food-and-having-the-bottom-scrubbed-while-parked-at-Cape-Horn-gate. None of these was purely accidental. I think their second place finish in Itajai -- close but no cigar, boys -- was the beginning of the end for them. The Force is just not there now -- they haven't had their boot on anyone's throat since Itajai. BTW why are they so inept at in-port races compared to the other guys? I mean, Iker knows a thing or two about dinghy sailing, and I would have guessed that they would have their way with the fleet in the buoy races.

[couchsurfer]

I attribute it to basic karma. Sail-gate. AIS-gate in the Malacca Strait. Taking-on-food-and-having-the-bottom-scrubbed-while-parked-at-Cape-Horn-gate. None of these was purely accidental. I think their second place finish in Itajai -- close but no cigar, boys -- was the beginning of the end for them. The Force is just not there now -- they haven't had their boot on anyone's throat since Itajai. BTW why are they so inept at in-port races compared to the other guys? I mean, Iker knows a thing or two about dinghy sailing, and I would have guessed that they would have their way with the fleet in the buoy races.

...I guess sailing the wrong course and hitting the mark is part of the karma attack then

[whispers]

i wonder how much difference the sail cards that abu and sanya have will make in the legs to come?

[onimod]

i wonder how much difference the sail cards that abu and sanya have will make in the legs to come?

In terms of what exactly - ROI minimisation?
I'm pretty sure both campaigns have pretty much reached the "sail what you've got" stage.

[whispers]

all i was asking is there is a maximum number of sails to be used, being that sanya and abu will not have completely rooted their sails as they havnt sailed all the legs i was wondering if this would be advantageous and how much. perhaps i shouldnt post pissed and you may understand

[thetruth]

I think by being last and second to last they are rooted anyways?

all i was asking is there is a maximum number of sails to be used, being that sanya and abu will not have completely rooted their sails as they havnt sailed all the legs i was wondering if this would be advantageous and how much. perhaps i shouldnt post pissed and you may understand

[whispers]

yes rooted they are, would be good for the sponsors to win a few legs though, just was thinking of the performance differences with newer sails

[thetruth]

They are all new made by Mike Sanderson in his loft in Auckland. The rigging he uses (three replacments now) was made by his company in Spain

yes rooted they are, would be good for the sponsors to win a few legs though, just was thinking of the performance differences with newer sails

[GBH]

yes rooted they are, would be good for the sponsors to win a few legs though, just was thinking of the performance differences with newer sails

New sails? Will make a huge difference! Don't forget that not all the sails are built before the race, so the more cards you have left along the race period the more you can optimize a specifically tailored sail for the ever fewer remaining legs. On high performance boats then differences between new ( and lighter cos they don't have to do many miles ) sails to an old and well used = shagged sail will be knots.

Abu Doggi is a full on pooch, probably helped along a bit by new sails, but at the moment have been smart on their tactics to get in the lead. Expect to see them ground down though.

And so Farr get the one design nod eh? No surprise there with the way they will 'offer' their services! Ah well, will be dog eat dog next race then:)

[thetruth]

Go Jamie Boag

yes rooted they are, would be good for the sponsors to win a few legs though, just was thinking of the performance differences with newer sails

New sails? Will make a huge difference! Don't forget that not all the sails are built before the race, so the more cards you have left along the race period the more you can optimize a specifically tailored sail for the ever fewer remaining legs. On high performance boats then differences between new ( and lighter cos they don't have to do many miles ) sails to an old and well used = shagged sail will be knots.

Abu Doggi is a full on pooch, probably helped along a bit by new sails, but at the moment have been smart on their tactics to get in the lead. Expect to see them ground down though.

And so Farr get the one design nod eh? No surprise there with the way they will 'offer' their services! Ah well, will be dog eat dog next race then:)

[~HHN92~]

Well, it looks like they all missed the tiger's tail. Should we look back to the west or northwest for the next wind phase of the race?

[bulbouskeel]

i wonder how much difference the sail cards that abu and sanya have will make in the legs to come?

In terms of what exactly - ROI minimisation?
I'm pretty sure both campaigns have pretty much reached the "sail what you've got" stage.

For sure. Can you imagine Ian Walker or Mike Sanderson's call to their sponsor to shell out for a new sail? They have both sucked so much tailpipe in this race that it's profoundly embarrassing. Especially ADOR with a no-expense-spared campaign. Give the money to homeless shelters or cancer research or whatever.

I don't know if anyone follows bicycle racing, but there's a fantastic '70s documentary called "Stars & Watercarriers". A guy who finishes mid-pack in the Tour de France crosses the finish line of the final stage, throws his bike in the trunk and drives home. No ceremonies. No one who gives one single shit. He may have suffered like a dog but his performance was mediocre at best. That is, I predict, more or less how things will be for ADOR and Sanya crewmembers in Galway.

[rtrs]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left to go, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

+1 observation

[Te Kooti]

A guy who finishes mid-pack in the Tour de France crosses the finish line of the final stage, throws his bike in the trunk and drives home. No ceremonies. No one who gives one single shit. He may have suffered like a dog but his performance was mediocre at best. That is, I predict, more or less how things will be for ADOR and Sanya crewmembers in Galway.

Do any of you guys know what the Vice Mayor of Sanya thinks about his "investment?" (and the return thereon).

Is there any chance they will race again?

[Mr. Fixit's brother,, Mr. Fixit]

A guy who finishes mid-pack in the Tour de France crosses the finish line of the final stage, throws his bike in the trunk and drives home. No ceremonies. No one who gives one single shit. He may have suffered like a dog but his performance was mediocre at best. That is, I predict, more or less how things will be for ADOR and Sanya crewmembers in Galway.

Do any of you guys know what the Vice Mayor of Sanya thinks about his "investment?" (and the return thereon).

Is there any chance they will race again?

From what Sanderson said in his interview, Sanya recruited him and acknowledged no real chance for podium results. He indicated this was a learning step with future VOR's in the plan. China's economy certainly seems able to support it.

[couchsurfer]

Do any of you guys know what the Vice Mayor of Sanya thinks about his "investment?" (and the return thereon).

Is there any chance they will race again?

I'm pretty sure the chinese are VERY happy with the results(of their investment),and the exposure the world has had to their fine city and it's name

...if there's still some sail credits available,using them could prove quite a bonus to their exposure,and further fulfill their -only- objective in this whole game

[couchsurfer]

1600UTC.......how in heck did the fleet manage to get stuck in the centre of the high-quite an accomplishment

.....I know there'll be many more start-ups in this 3000mile 'in-port',
,,,but I'm liking what this finish order would do to turn the scoring upside-down! ,,,go Sonya!
Abu Dhabi Ocean Racing
Racing
2
PUMA Ocean Racing by BERG
Racing
3
CAMPER with Emirates Team NZ
Racing
4
Groupama sailing team
Racing
5
Team Telefónica
Racing
6
Team Sanya
Racing

[bruno]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left to go, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

+1 observation

You are choosing an explanation of relative loss of performance rather than improvement by the others for narrowing or eliminating the gap. These are supposed to be the best racers in the world, one might think that they are capable of learning and improving vis a vis the competition. But don't let that interfere with a good story. I think that all the teams have shown gains and losses in performance relative to the others over the course of the months.

[couchsurfer]

I think the biggest story going on is how far Telefonica's stock has fallen since winning the Sanya inport race. Without their extra sail, they would have been fourth in Aukland (Camper should have been given redress for that robbery), and if Groupama hadn't dismasted on the doorstep of Itajai, Telefonica would have been third in Leg 5, Aside from Leg 5, they haven't done better than last among the JK boats since Sanya, and they seem to be making questionable decisions again. At least the air of invincibility is gone.

Did "Sailgate" cost them their mojo?

It looks like there are plenty of restarts left to go, so they can still come out like heros, but the aura is gone.

+1 observation

You are choosing an explanation of relative loss of performance rather than improvement by the others for narrowing or eliminating the gap. These are supposed to be the best racers in the world, one might think that they are capable of learning and improving vis a vis the competition. But don't let that interfere with a good story. I think that all the teams have shown gains and losses in performance relative to the others over the course of the months.

..there's certainly a wide variety of reasons that Tele looks less stellar than the early days

[~HHN92~]

1600UTC.......how in heck did the fleet manage to get stuck in the centre of the high-quite an accomplishment

.....I know there'll be many more start-ups in this 3000mile 'in-port',
,,,but I'm liking what this finish order would do to turn the scoring upside-down! ,,,go Sonya!
Abu Dhabi Ocean Racing
Racing
2
PUMA Ocean Racing by BERG
Racing
3
CAMPER with Emirates Team NZ
Racing
4
Groupama sailing team
Racing
5
Team Telefónica
Racing
6
Team Sanya
Racing

U G L Y - you ain't got no alibi...Ugly....Ugly....Uuuuuuglyyyyy!

Must be some superior routing.............................and they all have the same package.

[valor]

1600UTC.......how in heck did the fleet manage to get stuck in the centre of the high-quite an accomplishment

.....I know there'll be many more start-ups in this 3000mile 'in-port',
,,,but I'm liking what this finish order would do to turn the scoring upside-down! ,,,go Sonya!
Abu Dhabi Ocean Racing
Racing
2
PUMA Ocean Racing by BERG
Racing
3
CAMPER with Emirates Team NZ
Racing
4
Groupama sailing team
Racing
5
Team Telefónica
Racing
6
Team Sanya
Racing

U G L Y - you ain't got no alibi...Ugly....Ugly....Uuuuuuglyyyyy!

Must be some superior routing.............................and they all have the same package.

G4 using different routing software

[nemme]

This leg is turning out to be way more fascinating than I would have guessed. Though the lead/order will change several times before the fleet make it into Lisbon, if the current order stands the overall scoreboard would look like this:

176 - Puma
175 - Telefonica
173 - Groupama
172 - Camper
104 - Abu Dhabi
32 - Sanya

So, not just leg restarts but a potential race restart. Great stuff.

[twomasts]

Why would you need one designs when the racing is this close?

[Heriberto]

Why would you need one designs when the racing is this close?

$$$$

If you can't win on the race course, win in the boardroom.