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Best Olympic Sailing Commentary EVER


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#1 Duke Nukem

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 12:49 AM

Saw this gem via Reddit:

Irish Olympic Laser Start Sequence


#2 PeterHuston

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:01 AM

Saw this gem via Reddit:

Irish Olympic Laser Start Sequence


That was hysterical. Steven Spielberg as RC Chair....classic!

#3 Former MDR Vandal 1

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:07 AM

Saw this gem via Reddit:

Irish Olympic Laser Start Sequence



Single greatest sailing video ever ...

If you ever wonder what everyone else in the world thinks of sailing, just play this a few times.

To paraphrase Jack Lemon -- "This is the good video, the Glenngary Video."

Perfection.

PS -- the comment about Belarus -- "poor performance on the water and a questionable human rights record on shore..." It sounds like he is describing me ... Fucking the best video ever.

#4 NYBOZO1

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:11 AM

Love it!

#5 Duke Nukem

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:12 AM

"We have a beam of 1.37M--it's controversial."

#6 Amati

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:29 AM

Fookin eh!

#7 coyotepup

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:43 AM

Well, he did call the skipper that port-tacked the whole fleet a dickhead. So he's onto something there.

#8 the_abandoned_brane

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:49 AM

dickhead.

#9 Bunchofgrapes

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:07 AM

There's the Aussie's....you hear them before you see them...hahahaplop

#10 OKMLSAIL

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:09 AM

Awesome

#11 Punani Jackson

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:09 AM

Saw this gem via Reddit:

Irish Olympic Laser Start Sequence


Outstanding! Thank you for sharing.

#12 SPORTSCAR

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:19 AM

That commentary is about what we would expect from the local coverage network, Channel 9, here in Australia who so far have broadcast not one nano-second of a sport in which Aus are looking likely to win at least 3, possibly 4 medals.

But wait: This just in a few minutes ago:

"Staying up?

Are you staying up until 11pm tonight? You should be. Channel Nine has suddenly realised that, without sailing, they have no winners so they are televising all Australian medal races live. That means you can catch Tom Slingsby going for gold at 2pm British time, which is 11pm in the eastern states and 9pm in Perth."

Can't wait to hear who they have for expert commentary. Such well known sailing luminaries as Ken Sutcliffe, Karl Stefanovic and Eddie McGuire will no doubt make it an absolute misery to listen to, but hey, at least we'll get to see it.Maybe they could hire that Irish guy to liven it up with insightful commentary?

#13 Evo

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:26 AM

Can't wait to hear who they have for expert commentary. Such well known sailing luminaries as Ken Sutcliffe, Karl Stefanovic and Eddie McGuire will no doubt make it an absolute misery to listen to, but hey, at least we'll get to see it.Maybe they could hire that Irish guy to liven it up with insightful commentary?


ha...it will be this guy again

Posted Image

ok...so not much different from Karl Stefanovic really

#14 ocs

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:35 AM

That commentary is about what we would expect from the local coverage network, Channel 9, here in Australia who so far have broadcast not one nano-second of a sport in which Aus are looking likely to win at least 3, possibly 4 medals.

But wait: This just in a few minutes ago:

"Staying up?

Are you staying up until 11pm tonight? You should be. Channel Nine has suddenly realised that, without sailing, they have no winners so they are televising all Australian medal races live. That means you can catch Tom Slingsby going for gold at 2pm British time, which is 11pm in the eastern states and 9pm in Perth."

Can't wait to hear who they have for expert commentary. Such well known sailing luminaries as Ken Sutcliffe, Karl Stefanovic and Eddie McGuire will no doubt make it an absolute misery to listen to, but hey, at least we'll get to see it.Maybe they could hire that Irish guy to liven it up with insightful commentary?

I have a few rowing mates who are seething at James Brayshaw's calling.

#15 Flatbag

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:37 AM


Can't wait to hear who they have for expert commentary. Such well known sailing luminaries as Ken Sutcliffe, Karl Stefanovic and Eddie McGuire will no doubt make it an absolute misery to listen to, but hey, at least we'll get to see it.Maybe they could hire that Irish guy to liven it up with insightful commentary?


ha...it will be this guy again

Posted Image

ok...so not much different from Karl Stefanovic really


So that's what DoRag looks like. Kinda figures.

#16 Rolfe'd

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 03:06 AM

"Watch your fockin head!" - what it's like to teach Learn to Sail

#17 fan

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 03:13 AM

That was awsome would totally rather listen to that.

#18 Stubby

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 03:16 AM

Fucking great, love your work Duke. Can we exempt the usual greeting here?

#19 spectator

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 04:01 AM

I think that' twas the voice of a certain Timmy from a counrty with lots of green covering it's land. If it's him, good on him. He knows a thing or two about olympic sailing, fur fuck sake.

#20 albanyguy

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 04:49 AM

"Staying up?

Are you staying up until 11pm tonight? You should be. Channel Nine has suddenly realised that, without sailing, they have no winners so they are televising all Australian medal races live. That means you can catch Tom Slingsby going for gold at 2pm British time, which is 11pm in the eastern states and 9pm in Perth."


Like +1000




#21 cosmicsedso

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 06:00 AM


"Staying up?

Are you staying up until 11pm tonight? You should be. Channel Nine has suddenly realised that, without sailing, they have no winners so they are televising all Australian medal races live. That means you can catch Tom Slingsby going for gold at 2pm British time, which is 11pm in the eastern states and 9pm in Perth."


Like +1000




The fact that we (AUS) have only ONE Gold medal so far probably makes it newsworthy...
I too shudder to think who will do the commentary, expert or not.
Please not Tessa....

I have an alternative though.

The BBC coverage is available if you have 'ExpertShield' loaded and connected. Its free to download, Mac or PC, and gives you a British IP address so you can access any of the BBC's Eight Olympic channels including ONE just for sailing. And there are NO ad breaks!! Where would you insert an ad break in a medal race anyway? Might be worth watching 9 to see...

HOWEVER
I wouldnt use a pc you value or do banking on.
It is jerky with lots of buffering (could be my ADSL) but the commentary is passable with expert commentary fron Shirley Robertson.
It was a bit of a hassle to set up 'ExpertShield' but I have now watched 2 nights of Olympic sailing LIVE so its well worth it. Expect to be sleep deprived for the next week!

When I was a lot younger you would have to wait for about 3 months Seacraft magazine to find out what happened at the Olympics.
I love technology!

Fav Olympic quote from the 9 team so far "This track is twisty and turny" Eddie McGuire (twice)

and the emoticons for the rag :) :D

#22 albanyguy

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 06:53 AM

Cosmic - I'll have the bbc site, via ExpatShield, ready and waiting as a backup in case 9 cock it up. The feed on 9 will come from the BBC feed so we'll be watching the same thing. Whether 9 put have an Aussie voice commentating remains to be seen. Guess we'll have to wait n see.

For the non-Aussies here a certain aussie facebook site called "Channel 9's Olympics coverage sucks" now apparently has over 100,000 likes.

http://www.smh.com.a...0803-23l6s.html

We're not just grumpy about only having 1 Olympic gold to date.

#23 Andrew P

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 07:42 AM

[/quote]


I wouldnt use a pc you value or do banking on.
It is jerky with lots of buffering (could be my ADSL) but the commentary is passable with expert commentary fron Shirley Robertson.
It was a bit of a hassle to set up 'ExpertShield' but I have now watched 2 nights of Olympic sailing LIVE so its well worth it. Expect to be sleep deprived for the next week!

When I was a lot younger you would have to wait for about 3 months Seacraft magazine to find out what happened at the Olympics.
I love technology!

Fav Olympic quote from the 9 team so far "This track is twisty and turny" Eddie McGuire (twice)

and the emoticons for the rag :) :D
[/quote]

Make sure you don't download any toolbars by mistake that put a trojan/virus on the PC.


#24 SPORTSCAR

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 07:59 AM

Favourite Channel Nine-ism was this morning when the talking head said of U-Bolts win:
"They say lightning never strikes twice in the same place - well it has here, except it's not the same place"
And to think they actually get paid for babbling out shit like that!

#25 cosmicsedso

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:00 AM

Make sure you don't download any toolbars by mistake that put a trojan/virus on the PC.
[/quote]

I wondered why I had new and really annoying toolbars. Good advice
I'll take any advice to remove them........

#26 cosmicsedso

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:02 AM

Favourite Channel Nine-ism was this morning when the talking head said of U-Bolts win:
"They say lightning never strikes twice in the same place - well it has here, except it's not the same place"
And to think they actually get paid for babbling out shit like that!


There have been some absolute gems.
But its so easy to just turn the sound down you miss them....

#27 dumper

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:10 AM

I cant for the love of me, figure out who cock coq is

#28 Bill E Goat

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:27 AM

I cant for the love of me, figure out who cock coq is


Cook Islands

http://www.london201...helema-1092731/

#29 Evo

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:45 AM

Favourite Channel Nine-ism was this morning when the talking head said of U-Bolts win:
"They say lightning never strikes twice in the same place - well it has here, except it's not the same place"
And to think they actually get paid for babbling out shit like that!


they're making Foxtel look good.

#30 (p)Irate

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 10:10 AM

So how come the Irish can do something like this but Roy and HG, who did it so much better, are now restricted by "IOC Protocols"? Search for Flatbag, and not the anarchist above, if you want an idea.

#31 DryArmour

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 11:53 AM

That was excellent. Great way to start my Monday at 4:50AM. Thanks for posting the video...

#32 dreadom

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 12:10 PM

"it's the beginning of the race. I got it wrong....unfortunately We don't have anymore time here"
Could be the channel 9 commentary.

#33 atefooterz

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 12:56 PM

BBC commentary !!!! = YES

#34 Bill E Goat

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:04 PM

Steven Spielberg and Tim henman on the start boat an eclectic mix of film and sport

#35 atefooterz

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:31 PM

Free 2 air 1080 GEM of laser match racing :rolleyes:

#36 dudette

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 01:31 PM

Hilarious.

#37 wheezr

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:35 PM

I guess this is what my wife was watching this morning. She kept looking over at me and laughing.


"More dick heads on the beach watching".

#38 I Am The Stig

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:38 PM

That was excellent. Great way to start my Monday at 4:50AM. Thanks for posting the video...



This

#39 Wild Rover

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 04:47 PM

I'd like to hear a Honey Badger version of this.

#40 Ryley

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 04:50 PM

"it's the beginning of the race. I got it wrong....unfortunately We don't have anymore time here"
Could be the channel 9 commentary.


I thought this video was lifted directly from NBC with Bob Costas trying to fake an Irish accent. "..unfortunately we don't have any more time here. now back to equestrian synchronized water polo"

#41 Clove Hitch

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:02 PM

Saw this gem via Reddit:

Irish Olympic Laser Start Sequence


awesome! SA should hire him

#42 Hobie Dog

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 06:33 PM

"Mind your head." :lol:

#43 The Main Man

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 06:42 PM

Still killing myself laughing, that is priceless!

#44 Clove Hitch

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 07:11 PM

Still killing myself laughing, that is priceless!


"lots of fuckers have turned out to watch what is actually a very, very boring sport indeed"

"We have a beam of 1.37-- that's controversial" haha

#45 smackdaddy

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 07:32 PM

Gold.

Must be schmokin'.

#46 jerseyguy

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:38 PM


"it's the beginning of the race. I got it wrong....unfortunately We don't have anymore time here"
Could be the channel 9 commentary.


I thought this video was lifted directly from NBC with Bob Costas trying to fake an Irish accent. "..unfortunately we don't have any more time here. now back to equestrian synchronized water polo"

Was at a meeting once upon a time when the NCAA was discussing emerging sports for women. The subject of equestrian came up. Guy sitting next to me, long known as the class clown, leans over, and in all mock seriousness asks: "do they use the same horses for water polo as they do for equestrian?" Whatever I was drinking exited my nose.

#47 Bitpitch

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:45 PM

unfrigginbelievable....you just gotta love it.

#48 Delta Blues

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 09:15 PM

"I wouldn't mind finishing up with her." (lady with the binoculars)

#49 Dino

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 09:38 PM

Very funny... The guy who did that is a member of the cast of "Hardy Bucks". It's a tv show set in a small town in the west of Ireland. It's hilarious.

#50 fish

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 09:42 PM

Nothing sailing related.. but search youtube for "hardy bucks" if you want more from the same people.

Example : Irish driving test...
http://www.youtube.c...h?v=CWtwMMcHB24

Warning; this may not make any sense if you are not familiar with the west of ireland

#51 fish

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 09:44 PM

Hi Dino. You just beat me to it!! J

#52 spectator

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 11:46 AM

Very funny... The guy who did that is a member of the cast of "Hardy Bucks". It's a tv show set in a small town in the west of Ireland. It's hilarious.


Are you sure it's a member of Hardy Bucks?

I'm fairly sure it was a guy who may or who not have done his own fair share of going around the buoys in a slightly bigger boat in similar circumstances.

#53 jasenj1

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 03:53 PM

The local morning radio show played clips from this this morning. They sounded like they more than half thought it was serious.

And I see the video has been taken down due to the IOC having a rather large stick up their hindquarters. There's NO laughing at the Olympics!


- Jasen.

#54 Ryley

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 03:55 PM

Page not found

Sorry, "Boats" was deleted at 11:36:43 Tue Aug 7, 2012.
Vimeo has removed or disabled access to the following material as a result of a third-party notification by International Olympic Committee claiming that this material is infringing: Boats.
Return to the previous page



Asses.

#55 smackdaddy

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 04:01 PM

The video got twatted by the sail?

#56 vegavexity

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 04:40 PM

Can somebody please find another copy of that clip? The Olympic police took it down on Vimeo

#57 Racing the NorthWest Passage

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 04:57 PM

Deleted. BOO!

#58 Tiller Man

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 05:24 PM

The fooking video got twatted by the Olympic Police. They look like eejuts.

#59 Speed Freak

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 05:56 PM

Any word on another copy?... Or has Olympic Big Brother put the kibosh on all internet channels?

#60 Bitpitch

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 06:06 PM

what anal pompous dicks

#61 Bakunin

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 06:20 PM

Can somebody please find another copy of that clip? The Olympic police took it down on Vimeo


http://freakshare.com/files/e8nds4mc/110715240.mp4.html

#62 Hobie Dog

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 07:01 PM

Can't get there, site is blocked. Somebody has to have it and post it on U Tube.

#63 CarlC

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 07:18 PM

Can we hide this somewhere, away from the fekkers at the XXX?

Best video of the year, by far.

http://gawker.com/59...london-olympics

#64 Editor

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:26 PM

the video is no longer available. i am hearing the ioc made that happen....

Attached Files



#65 Mike Hunt

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:30 PM

Try here - Linky

#66 Editor

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:35 PM

i just found another source - it is back on the so-called fp...

#67 BalticBandit

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 12:26 AM

Attached File  OlympicsNBC.gif   41.44K   22 downloads

#68 jerseyguy

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 12:55 AM

Attached File  OlympicsNBC.gif   41.44K   22 downloads

If NBC was broadcasting the Mars rover, the delay would be weeks since there would be little to no commercial interest in it.

#69 'moondance44

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 01:58 AM

http://www.liveleak....=510_1344196881

#70 Student_Driver

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 02:06 AM

Can this be for real ..or is it a spoof... I love it...''someone has to win this race and the clock is running out'.... Funniest thing I've seen in years...

#71 zerothehero

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 02:39 AM

it's funnier the second time, me thinks

#72 duncan

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 02:46 AM

Olympic horn

#73 Jangles13

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 03:30 AM

Another source...

http://www.thatvideosite.com/v/5852

EDIT: apparently his name is Fran Higgins, and indeed from Hardy Bucks. His response to the removal of the video from Vimeo: http://audioboo.fm/boos/912374-the-ioc

#74 olshitsky

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 03:42 AM

Another source...

http://www.thatvideosite.com/v/5852

EDIT: apparently his name is Fran Higgins, and indeed from Hardy Bucks. His response to the removal of the video from Vimeo: http://audioboo.fm/boos/912374-the-ioc


the response is just as good. IOC = Illuminati of Cunts

#75 shanghaisailor

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 05:47 AM

Of course the IOC / ISAF took it down - they wouldn't want anyone to think they had a sense of humour now would they!!

Appart from being funny ( I can't remember laughing at a sailing video since Malcolm McKeag and "Splash" - yes, I am that old)

On a serious note, ISAF should play the video multiple times and learn just how difficult our sport is to understand and that, yes, there probably are people who could get that confused seeing the start of a race and notice even the comedian didn;t attepmt to mis-commentate the actual race.

C'mon ISAF/IOC the video isn't PC but put it back up - put yer own bleeps in it but in the meantime "Mind yer head"

Classic

SS

#76 stranded

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 07:33 AM

what the IOC ( unts ) expect us to accept .


- - - Crumbs from a group of people ensconced in a castle in switzerland, accepting brown paper bags and selling restrictive tv rights.

- - - For an event that is , in the main, funded by the member countries TAXPAYER' s contributing to the development of their competing athletes.

It is time their administration was rotated


or shared by the member cuntrees


these games show just how out of touch the ioc royal family has become



- - - and do not start me about all the subjectively judged QUASI " sports "


for example, why cannot AMATEUR boxing borrow from fencing and use pressure pads to confirm scoring hits ?


some of this smells a bit like soccer 's ( another swiss castle dwelling administration )

reluctance and resistance to adopt goal mouth technology used by almost every other ball game


why ?

#77 Swanno (Ohf Shore)

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 07:45 AM

love it

Attached Files



#78 DKras

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 08:22 AM

http://www.mostwatch...ing-commentary/


Saw this gem via Reddit:

Irish Olympic Laser Start Sequence



#79 Dale dug a hole

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 08:25 AM

love it


Attached File  untitled.jpg   45.33K   20 downloads

Happy to help out an Aussie

#80 eric e

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 12:29 PM


Saw this gem via Reddit:

Irish Olympic Laser Start Sequence


That was hysterical. Steven Spielberg as RC Chair....classic!


Sorry, "Boats" was deleted at 11:36:43 Tue Aug 7, 2012.

Vimeo has removed or disabled access to the following material as a result of a third-party notification by International Olympic Committee claiming that this material is infringing: Boats.


i'm disliking these olympic media nazis more and more

thank you, found it

the man's an ejet

http://www.liveleak....=510_1344196881

#81 bye bye

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 12:36 PM

You could get more or less exactly the same commentary on more or less any TV channel anywhere ... except RTE who thankfully drafted in Prof to cover the medal races with Irish interest. As a result RTE had the best sailing coverage at the games and the best I've see outside of the match racing world championships!

#82 Presuming Ed

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 12:50 PM

But did he bet on the result?


(Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted Image)

#83 eric e

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 01:28 PM

and after the take down

our irish commentator has a few words about censorship

http://audioboo.fm/boos/912374-the-ioc

from the front page

#84 bye bye

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 01:29 PM

Don't know but I did! Had an Anslie at 3/1, an Annalise + Slingsby double on at 3/1 and an Anslie + Mills + Percy treble at 40/1. Was a bit disappointed by the last 200m of the Star race to say the least!!

#85 schakel

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 01:31 PM

That was extremely funny,

The comment of what he said was the race but was only the start. Bwhahahah
And then even better... he is so pissed they took away his documatary he swears some thing you wouldn't wish your worst enemy,
Political and sailing technics incorrect. And women-sexism comment. Well perhaps not so funny after all...

#86 Sailing My Cubicle

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 01:43 PM

Total "Streisand Effect" here - if the IOC hadn't shut down the video, then people would have eventually forgotten about it. 'Cept for maybe every 4 years or whenever someone starts another "Why doesn't sailing get more tv time" thread.

Now, the story has evolved from a harmless & funny video to yet another example of the heavy handed and out of touch IOC control of the media.

#87 Tittravate

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 01:58 PM

Great Vid!!! I can see why the IOC tight-asses would take down the video...they didn't want to pay our Irish friend to be their future commentator!

#88 The Main Man

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 02:42 PM

They clearly have no sense of humour. :angry:

#89 Bob Perry

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 02:51 PM

I really like that commentary. I thought it was very funny. Can't see the harm in that.
Maybe that guy could call the women's beach volleyball games.

#90 Bitpitch

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 05:24 PM

what a bunch of nazi dicks...jeez can't they grow up

#91 Winever

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 10:05 PM

Too funny! Whatever the official word I'm betting Jobson at least is laughing his ass off! Well done Viper!

Cheers, Win ever.

#92 Tranquilo

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 01:16 AM

ESPN needs to hire this guy for the AC.

#93 Pewit

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 07:50 AM

For better quality viewing than ExpatShield (and fewer annoying ads and pop-ups) try HDTVPlayer which has all 24 BBC channels and you can throttle the stream if you have poor bandwidth (try disconnecting other devices from you broadband connection to improve quality).

Follow this thread on the Whirlpool forums for details

#94 Damp Freddie

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 10:40 AM

it's a feckin' spoof ya daft feckers.

Richard Head and Hugh Janus to the committee boat please.

The olympic horn has sounded.

#95 capt araldite

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 11:20 AM

I wish they would bring this guy out here at Christmas for the TV coverage of the Sydney-Hobart race start, he would do a much better job than the usual TV "experts" and we may get hear more than just "Wild Oats" :lol:

#96 (p)Irate

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 12:21 PM

I wish they would bring this guy out here at Christmas for the TV coverage of the Sydney-Hobart race start, he would do a much better job than the usual TV "experts" and we may get hear more than just "Wild Oats" :lol:

We don't need him. Remember The Dream with Roy & HG? And that was an Australian Network TV show not an internet bandit Started at Atlanta96 then Sydney then the Illuminati of Cunts took it down. Now they could do an S2H call.

The Coodabeen Champions once did a live call from Constitution Dock after the race. Corrected Time? What's that? Well you know, when you don't have enough time, or you have too much time, and you say if only I had more time or they had too much time and then it all gets sort of, corrected. So, what does it really mean? Dunno.

On other IOC dominance, Wil Anderson's Gruen Sweat, a TV show examining advertising and marketing to do with the Olympics found that they were prevented from showing not only footage from the 2012 Games, but any footage from any Olympics ever!! This includes 1936. And who came up with the idea for the torch relay? IOC's mate Adolf Hitler (not Adolf Dassler, that's another story).




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