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I placed a contract on Rebecca


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#201 austin1972

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 04:42 PM

BV, that is awesome.

#202 Bob Perry

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 04:42 PM

Very nice BV.
You are indeed appointed poet laureate of the WLYDO.
That gets you a company car upgrade.

#203 boomer

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 05:05 PM

Indeed...a second calling perhaps...

#204 Beau.Vrolyk

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 05:12 PM

KEEEEWWWWLLLL! I'd like a company car, I hate driving alone. :rolleyes:

Now... back to Rebecca....

Other than massive maintenance, poor sailing performance directly to windward and to leeward, astoundingly good looks, and a lot more rigging than any sane person would want to deal with....

Why do you suppose that folks like Ketches better than Schooners? My own opinion is that the two rigs are equally poor performers (the ketch has a very slight edge), but the Schooner looks so much better. I do think, when I'm a REALLY old fart, as opposed to the old fartlette that I am currently, I would like to have a topsail schooner like this one so I can lord over my grandchildren as they scamper up the rigging.


Posted Image

BV

#205 Bob Perry

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 05:33 PM

Amazing photo BV.
Look at the headstay sag. Jib looks pretty good though.
You can even see the guy at the wheel. I wonder what that feels like.
I can't imagine what skill it took to make cotton sails hold their shape like you see in this pic.
Foresail, whateversail and Mainsail look very good.
I'd like to know what the apparent wind angle is in that shot. I'm assuming they are hard on the wind.

#206 boomer

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 05:34 PM

Had a passion for schooners way back in the day...

Alden #390

Posted Image

#207 Innocent Bystander

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 05:35 PM

KEEEEWWWWLLLL! I'd like a company car, I hate driving alone. :rolleyes:

Now... back to Rebecca....

Other than massive maintenance, poor sailing performance directly to windward and to leeward, astoundingly good looks, and a lot more rigging than any sane person would want to deal with....

Why do you suppose that folks like Ketches better than Schooners? My own opinion is that the two rigs are equally poor performers (the ketch has a very slight edge), but the Schooner looks so much better. I do think, when I'm a REALLY old fart, as opposed to the old fartlette that I am currently, I would like to have a topsail schooner like this one so I can lord over my grandchildren as they scamper up the rigging.


Posted Image

BV


Great prose. You can't be even a little old. You're only two years further from launch than I am and I'm not old!

#208 blackjenner

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 05:36 PM

KEEEEWWWWLLLL! I'd like a company car, I hate driving alone. :rolleyes:

Now... back to Rebecca....

Other than massive maintenance, poor sailing performance directly to windward and to leeward, astoundingly good looks, and a lot more rigging than any sane person would want to deal with....

Why do you suppose that folks like Ketches better than Schooners? My own opinion is that the two rigs are equally poor performers (the ketch has a very slight edge), but the Schooner looks so much better. I do think, when I'm a REALLY old fart, as opposed to the old fartlette that I am currently, I would like to have a topsail schooner like this one so I can lord over my grandchildren as they scamper up the rigging.


Posted Image

BV


I'll just sit here quietly in awe of that photo... <sips coffee>.

#209 Steam Flyer

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 05:41 PM

Posted Image


I nominate BV for poet laureate of SA, all in favor?


More like the Cyrano of SA

++ +++ +++++ +++++++143k
:D

and an attaboy

FB- Doug

#210 Soņadora

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 06:43 PM

Bob

I can tell you what the apparent wind angle is. It's the wind you see on the windex :)

guy at the helm looks like he's really bracing himself. That had to be an incredible experience. Just amazing.

#211 Alpha FB

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 06:44 PM


KEEEEWWWWLLLL! I'd like a company car, I hate driving alone. :rolleyes:

Now... back to Rebecca....

Other than massive maintenance, poor sailing performance directly to windward and to leeward, astoundingly good looks, and a lot more rigging than any sane person would want to deal with....

Why do you suppose that folks like Ketches better than Schooners? My own opinion is that the two rigs are equally poor performers (the ketch has a very slight edge), but the Schooner looks so much better. I do think, when I'm a REALLY old fart, as opposed to the old fartlette that I am currently, I would like to have a topsail schooner like this one so I can lord over my grandchildren as they scamper up the rigging.


Posted Image

BV


I'll just sit here quietly in awe of that photo... <sips coffee>.


How come these old black and white photos are so much better in conveying the sheer majesty of these magnificent boats compared to modern pictures?

For instance, it's nice to see the current pictures of all the J-classes around these days, but the old Beken photos still impress me more...

#212 SereneSpeed

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 06:49 PM

Because you see the sails and the water, not the droplets and the stiching. Your emotion fills in the rest.

/my take

#213 Bob Perry

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 07:07 PM

Imagine what it sounded like to sail a schooner like that. I'll bet it was loud!
You wouldn't even be able to hear the Jimmy Buffet cd.

#214 Courtney K

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 07:08 PM


KEEEEWWWWLLLL! I'd like a company car, I hate driving alone. :rolleyes:

Now... back to Rebecca....

Other than massive maintenance, poor sailing performance directly to windward and to leeward, astoundingly good looks, and a lot more rigging than any sane person would want to deal with....

Why do you suppose that folks like Ketches better than Schooners? My own opinion is that the two rigs are equally poor performers (the ketch has a very slight edge), but the Schooner looks so much better. I do think, when I'm a REALLY old fart, as opposed to the old fartlette that I am currently, I would like to have a topsail schooner like this one so I can lord over my grandchildren as they scamper up the rigging.


Posted Image

BV


I'll just sit here quietly in awe of that photo... <sips coffee>.


As will I. Good plan.

#215 Soņadora

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 07:50 PM

Imagine what it sounded like to sail a schooner like that. I'll bet it was loud!
You wouldn't even be able to hear the Jimmy Buffet cd.


I wonder what the cussing sounded like

#216 SemiSalt

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 08:15 PM

I'd like to know what the apparent wind angle is in that shot. I'm assuming they are hard on the wind.


Looking at the banner on the main topmast, it doesn't look like they are pointing very high. Of course you can't really tell from one picture at one angle. It's not often you see a picture with topsails set that perfectly.

Is it Atlantic?

#217 Bob Perry

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 08:35 PM

Looks like ATLANTIC and you are right. I'd guess 45 degrees apparent at best.
But think of the boat speed.

#218 jackdaw

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 08:36 PM

KEEEEWWWWLLLL! I'd like a company car, I hate driving alone. :rolleyes:

Now... back to Rebecca....

Other than massive maintenance, poor sailing performance directly to windward and to leeward, astoundingly good looks, and a lot more rigging than any sane person would want to deal with....

Why do you suppose that folks like Ketches better than Schooners? My own opinion is that the two rigs are equally poor performers (the ketch has a very slight edge), but the Schooner looks so much better. I do think, when I'm a REALLY old fart, as opposed to the old fartlette that I am currently, I would like to have a topsail schooner like this one so I can lord over my grandchildren as they scamper up the rigging.


Posted Image

BV


When you pull this off, BV, I will EXPECT a trilogy of crossing books, in the manner of WFB. I also expect the quality of the journeys (and prose) will be equal.

#219 SemiSalt

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 08:43 PM

Looks like ATLANTIC and you are right. I'd guess 45 degrees apparent at best.
But think of the boat speed.


A Google Images search on Atlantic Schooner returns the very same picture (among others), so I guess it is. It was taken back in the era of big negatives.

#220 Steam Flyer

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 09:02 PM


Looks like ATLANTIC and you are right. I'd guess 45 degrees apparent at best.
But think of the boat speed.


A Google Images search on Atlantic Schooner returns the very same picture (among others), so I guess it is. It was taken back in the era of big negatives.


Yep, that's Atlantic.
I had a big poster of that pic on my wall for years, it was sold under the title 'ATLANTIC just after the start of her 1905 record-setting TransAtlantic race'.

Has nothing to do with recognizing the pic, but we refueled from her in Norfolk several times. That hull was extremely impressive even when you could only see her front half. My father told me what vessel she was (or used to be) and I thought he was BSing at the time.

FB- Doug

#221 Soņadora

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 09:17 PM

I have a model of Atlantic sitting on my desk. It's sails are perfectly shaped.

plastic

#222 sculpin

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 10:19 PM

I tend to lie about it, depending who I'm talking to. Thankfully my wife understands so we talk honestly. She likes it too.

PS Dutchy I have been meaning to say, I DO love the 2 legged Hefelant.

Is he named Eric the Half an Elephant?

#223 Tucky

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 11:44 PM

Somebody liked that picture so much he built a new one-

http://www.schooner-...c-pictures.html

I can only imagine the contract on that boat.

#224 Beau.Vrolyk

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:11 AM

ATLANTIC it is. I have only built two models of boats in my life, both plastic. They were ATLANTIC (43" long apx) and BLUENOSE (32" long apx). They both lived on my mothers china breakfront and were crushed in the Silmar Earthquake that happened in the mid-60s in LA. As Tucky has pointed out, a Dutch guy built an exact replica of ATLANTIC (exterior rig and hull shape). She was a William Gardner design, and for her Atlantic Record setting run in the Kaiser Cup of 1905, which I believe lasted until 1988, she was skippered by Captain Charlie Barr. Her best day's run (noon to noon, none of this any old 24 hours stuff) was 341 miles, a record that also stood for quite a while.

I don't know if the story is really true, but it is said that the owners were aboard for the Kaiser Cup race; they were expecting a bit of "yachting". However, Captain Barr hooked onto a low pressure system and drove ATLANTIC so hard that the owners were "weeping and begging that he shorten sail". Instead, he had the owners locked in their cabins and kept pressing ahead. One crew is reported to have said that they didn't see the leeward rail of the boat for 8 days! Other descriptions of the quarter wake imply that she was actually doing something near hull speed, which should have been about 16-18 knots. She held that speed for extended periods on a tight reach, thus the day's run number.

There is a great web site from the Dutch guy who built the full size replica here. I must admit, there are only a few things I genuinely covet in life, and ATLANTIC is one of them. It is so terrific that she's been re-built! It is even better than they didn't screw with the design. I saw her sailing in the Med and the crew was fearful of hoisting all 18,500 square feet of upwind sail area in only 15k of wind. Supposedly, during her Atlantic record crossing, she was carrying everything but the topsails in 30k and loving it.

Bob, the jibs are really wonderful given the cloth of the time and the way they are cut to accommodate the jib-stay sag. But, what amazes me is the leach tension that they must have had to hold the Fore, Main and Mizzen (the big one in the back is the mizzen on a 3 masted schooner, at least that's what I was taught by Shorty a full rigged ship's captain.) in the shape you see there! Imagine the blocks and tackle to pull that leach tension in!! YIKES!!

The web site is here. And be sure to have a look at the photo gallery in which the replica is sailing with modern sail cloth. The modern cloth doesn't look as good as the old cotton!

BV

#225 kimbottles

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:03 AM

ATLANTIC it is. I have only built two models of boats in my life, both plastic. They were ATLANTIC (43" long apx) and BLUENOSE (32" long apx). They both lived on my mothers china breakfront and were crushed in the Silmar Earthquake that happened in the mid-60s in LA. As Tucky has pointed out, a Dutch guy built an exact replica of ATLANTIC (exterior rig and hull shape). She was a William Gardner design, and for her Atlantic Record setting run in the Kaiser Cup of 1905, which I believe lasted until 1988, she was skippered by Captain Charlie Barr. Her best day's run (noon to noon, none of this any old 24 hours stuff) was 341 miles, a record that also stood for quite a while.

I don't know if the story is really true, but it is said that the owners were aboard for the Kaiser Cup race; they were expecting a bit of "yachting". However, Captain Barr hooked onto a low pressure system and drove ATLANTIC so hard that the owners were "weeping and begging that he shorten sail". Instead, he had the owners locked in their cabins and kept pressing ahead. One crew is reported to have said that they didn't see the leeward rail of the boat for 8 days! Other descriptions of the quarter wake imply that she was actually doing something near hull speed, which should have been about 16-18 knots. She held that speed for extended periods on a tight reach, thus the day's run number.

There is a great web site from the Dutch guy who built the full size replica here. I must admit, there are only a few things I genuinely covet in life, and ATLANTIC is one of them. It is so terrific that she's been re-built! It is even better than they didn't screw with the design. I saw her sailing in the Med and the crew was fearful of hoisting all 18,500 square feet of upwind sail area in only 15k of wind. Supposedly, during her Atlantic record crossing, she was carrying everything but the topsails in 30k and loving it.

Bob, the jibs are really wonderful given the cloth of the time and the way they are cut to accommodate the jib-stay sag. But, what amazes me is the leach tension that they must have had to hold the Fore, Main and Mizzen (the big one in the back is the mizzen on a 3 masted schooner, at least that's what I was taught by Shorty a full rigged ship's captain.) in the shape you see there! Imagine the blocks and tackle to pull that leach tension in!! YIKES!!

The web site is here. And be sure to have a look at the photo gallery in which the replica is sailing with modern sail cloth. The modern cloth doesn't look as good as the old cotton!

BV


I had heard that when the owner begged Charlie to reduce sail he said "Sir, go below with the women, you hired me to win this race and win it I will!"

#226 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:12 AM

From the "L Frances Herreshoff Reader", the chapter "Captain Charlie Barr",is as pleasant a read as any....

It so happened that about the year 1909 there was a slight financial panic....so several of our racing yachts did not go into commission that spring.One of these was the crack sloop Avenger...a yacht I had raced on the previous two seasons....the owner decided to put her into commission before the New York Yacht Club Cruise...that summer,strange to say,Capt. Barr was unemployed,so the Avenger's owner made a contract with him to put her in commission...to sail her in the Astor and King's Cup Races....no doubt Capt. Barr hired me along principally because he wanted someone to talk to in the evenings and though I would be an appreciative listener...Those evenings on Avenger with Capt. Barr were about the pleasantest of my whole life....these talks with Capt. Barr were monologues,sometimes three or four hours long,told in a pleasant and quiet way....as the story went along,each question was answered automatically and the whole description so clear that the scene seemed distinctly before me,with each yacht in her place up to the final climax at the finishing mark.

In 1905 he took temporary command of Atlantic to sail her in the German Emperor's Ocean Race,which started from Sandy Hook and finished at the Lizard in England.....there are strange stories told about Capt. Barr on this race,and one is that soon after the start he drove the owner into his stateroom and kept him there throughout the race,but Capt. Barr's version of the incident was about as follows:

"One night there came up a good beam breeze and I determined to see what the Atlantic could do on a reach,and when I had everything drawing well,the owner came to me asked me to shorten sail,to which I said,"Sir,you hired me to try and win this race and that is what I'm trying to do."...."after we won the race he was as pleased as any of us."....

However,Capt.Barr said," the Atlantic had too little freeboard to drive hard and that,together with her low deck line and high bulwarks,she carried a lot of water on deck."..."Yes," he said. "I had to wear hip boots most of the time at the steering wheel." Which makes me think he drove Atlantic pretty hard,and most anyone would have wanted to take in sail....

#227 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:56 AM

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#228 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:58 AM

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#229 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:00 AM

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#230 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:22 AM

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#231 austin1972

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:40 AM

Wow! That is my definition of 'Powerboat'.

#232 Kent H

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:58 AM

http://yachtpals.com...ntic-yacht-9173

#233 Paps

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:57 AM

Yes a magic yacht indeed and what I would give to have a sit down chat with Charlie Barr, a legend indeed.

Re the old cotton sails looking better than the "new" ones I fear looks can be deceptive. The cotton sails tended to stretch out to their containments meaning they almost always "looked" full and smooth to luff, leach and foot. While photogenic this is not very efficient and while the modern sails may look less attractive I think they would give more drive and a better indication of what trim was required. They would also I think respond far more to said trim. Imagine the cotton sail as a balloon full of water, which ever direction you try to contain it, it merely displaces somewhere else.

That said I totally agree with Beau on the incredible skill of the sailmakers of the day in compensating for various things including forestay sag. An almost lost art.

#234 floating dutchman

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:13 AM

Looks like ATLANTIC and you are right. I'd guess 45 degrees apparent at best.
But think of the boat speed.


I'm seeing tight reach (80 to 85 or so off true).
I'm looking at the waves and the sail trim and the stern wave, what did I miss? looked obvious to me.


foot note, glad you fellas like the thingy in the sig-line. pity we can't put those thingies as an avatar, like I wanted to.

Oh well. my avartar is personal and I'll keep it for now.

#235 kimbottles

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:50 PM

From the "L Frances Herreshoff Reader", the chapter "Captain Charlie Barr",is as pleasant a read as any....

It so happened that about the year 1909 there was a slight financial panic....so several of our racing yachts did not go into commission that spring.One of these was the crack sloop Avenger...a yacht I had raced on the previous two seasons....the owner decided to put her into commission before the New York Yacht Club Cruise...that summer,strange to say,Capt. Barr was unemployed,so the Avenger's owner made a contract with him to put her in commission...to sail her in the Astor and King's Cup Races....no doubt Capt. Barr hired me along principally because he wanted someone to talk to in the evenings and though I would be an appreciative listener...Those evenings on Avenger with Capt. Barr were about the pleasantest of my whole life....these talks with Capt. Barr were monologues,sometimes three or four hours long,told in a pleasant and quiet way....as the story went along,each question was answered automatically and the whole description so clear that the scene seemed distinctly before me,with each yacht in her place up to the final climax at the finishing mark.

In 1905 he took temporary command of Atlantic to sail her in the German Emperor's Ocean Race,which started from Sandy Hook and finished at the Lizard in England.....there are strange stories told about Capt. Barr on this race,and one is that soon after the start he drove the owner into his stateroom and kept him there throughout the race,but Capt. Barr's version of the incident was about as follows:

"One night there came up a good beam breeze and I determined to see what the Atlantic could do on a reach,and when I had everything drawing well,the owner came to me asked me to shorten sail,to which I said,"Sir,you hired me to try and win this race and that is what I'm trying to do."...."after we won the race he was as pleased as any of us."....

However,Capt.Barr said," the Atlantic had too little freeboard to drive hard and that,together with her low deck line and high bulwarks,she carried a lot of water on deck."..."Yes," he said. "I had to wear hip boots most of the time at the steering wheel." Which makes me think he drove Atlantic pretty hard,and most anyone would have wanted to take in sail....


I think we can accept LFH's version as the facts.

#236 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:14 PM

I would like to note that this was the beginning of a gale that lasted for three and a half days....not only was there water on deck,but a bit of water was sloshing around the main saloon,which the owners guests found troublesome...as the gale continued on sail was reduced,but only enough to keep her on her feet...the racing had been close till the gale,and Capt. Barr wanted to put some distance on the fleet...which they did,gaining about a 200 mile lead....one other note they took the circle route,with Capt.Barr checking constantly with his navigator Frederick Hoyt...in taking this route,they had to watch for icebergs...one of the icebergs they skirted was close to half a mile long and close to 300 feet high.

of note: the Avenger was bought that season before the Astor Cup Race by Alexander Cockran,who later ordered the schooner Westward from LFH's father.

Posted Image

#237 Bob Perry

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:27 PM

FD:
You are missing the fact that all the sails are trimmed as hard as possible. They are most definately hard on the wind in that photo.

Paps:
My comment had nothing to do with the "smoothness" of the cotton sails. My comment had everything to do with the shape of the sails.

#238 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:38 PM

L. Frances Herreshoff had the pleasure of showing Mr. Cockran the Avenger....

"Then one morning a very pleasant young gentleman came alongside in a small steam yacht and requested to be shown Avenger.Fot some reason or the other,Capt.Barr thought I should do the honors,so I showed the gentleman everything aloft and below,from bowsprit cone to clew outhaul,and must have shown it with the enthusiasm that I felt for the fine vessel,for the next morning when Capt. Barr came out with the mail,he said,"I have a telegram saying the Avenger has been sold to Alexander S. Cockran and that he will be here immediately.Did you ever hear of Mr. Cockran?" "No," said I,but when he came aboard later,he turned out to be the gentleman I had shown the yacht to the previous day....

During the next several evenings,Capt. Barr continued his stories about racing abroard in Navahoe and Ingomar,and Mr Cockran became very interested.Although neither Capt. Barr nor I realized Mr.Cockran was a wealthy man,he soon signified that he would like to own a yacht that could race in Europe....and the outcome he ordered Westward from my father."


Scroll down to the PDF on Westward...it is to large to add as an attachment.
https://www.google.c...w=1920&bih=1084

#239 Tucky

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:56 PM

I think we can accept LFH's version as the facts.


He never let a fact get in the way of a good story, now did he, gentle reader?

I love reading LFH, and would give anything to be the crew serving drinks and cigars and standing in the corner while Charlie Barr and he talked. Reading him as a youth is one of the big reasons I sail a simple boat ( and the fact that he understood the trimaran when it had only really been described fits too).

#240 Alpha FB

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:05 PM

Posted Image


Now Atlantic is not a bad looking boat by all means, but Westward, ah Westward is in another league entirely....

sigh... :wub:

#241 Slick470

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:07 PM

So on the subject of sails. With the original Atlantic flying cotton sails, and from the pictures of the new one it looks as though they are a more modern material, probably dacron, do you think they upgraded the rigging and structure to handle the less giving and stretchy materials?

I hear every once and a awhile about an older boat getting new hi tech lines and string sails and now nothing gives except for the deck hardware.

#242 Tucky

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:11 PM


Posted Image


Now Atlantic is not a bad looking boat by all means, but Westward, ah Westward is in another league entirely....

sigh... :wub:


. . . . . . . . . and somebody liked her a lot too.

http://www.schooner-eleonora.com/CFDOCS/cmsout/admin/index.cfm?GroupID=128&meID=41&Lang=2

#243 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:16 PM


I think we can accept LFH's version as the facts.


He never let a fact get in the way of a good story, now did he, gentle reader?

I love reading LFH, and would give anything to be the crew serving drinks and cigars and standing in the corner while Charlie Barr and he talked. Reading him as a youth is one of the big reasons I sail a simple boat ( and the fact that he understood the trimaran when it had only really been described fits too).


No doubt...I couldn't get enough of LFH after reading the Wizard of Bristol, and ended up scouring Shorey's Bookstore until I had everything written by him....The Complete Cruiser was a favorite that I read more then a few times...what better way to while away my time on the ferry ride to work.

Tucky...check out the PDF in the link above.

#244 Bob Perry

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:49 PM

Modern sails need modern rigging.

Kim was there when this happened. ATALANTA, the 73' Tripp ketch had been refitted and had a new set of sails, The first time we hardened up the bolts on the main outhaul track let go in series like shotgun shells. I can't recall exactly but as I recall there were 6-.5" dia. ss bolts holding that track to the boom. Tyhey could have been .625" dia. The loads imposed by the new main were far and above anything that track would have seen with the old main.

#245 kimbottles

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:52 PM


I think we can accept LFH's version as the facts.


He never let a fact get in the way of a good story, now did he, gentle reader?

I love reading LFH, and would give anything to be the crew serving drinks and cigars and standing in the corner while Charlie Barr and he talked. Reading him as a youth is one of the big reasons I sail a simple boat ( and the fact that he understood the trimaran when it had only really been described fits too).


LFH's writings are the reason the Sliver design is being kept very simple.

#246 kimbottles

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:01 PM

Modern sails need modern rigging.

Kim was there when this happened. ATALANTA, the 73' Tripp ketch had been refitted and had a new set of sails, The first time we hardened up the bolts on the main outhaul track let go in series like shotgun shells. I can't recall exactly but as I recall there were 6-.5" dia. ss bolts holding that track to the boom. Tyhey could have been .625" dia. The loads imposed by the new main were far and above anything that track would have seen with the old main.


Yup, they just started popping out of the boom with the new Fraser Sails and the down under pro crew members (including Fraser himself) just calmly added some strapping around the boom and we sailed on to win that Swiftsure race. I think that was the same race where John Guzzwell cooked up a wonderful stew for dinner. We had a ton of fun sailing on that vessel.

Thanks for the memory Bob.



I think we can accept LFH's version as the facts.


He never let a fact get in the way of a good story, now did he, gentle reader?

I love reading LFH, and would give anything to be the crew serving drinks and cigars and standing in the corner while Charlie Barr and he talked. Reading him as a youth is one of the big reasons I sail a simple boat ( and the fact that he understood the trimaran when it had only really been described fits too).


No doubt...I couldn't get enough of LFH after reading the Wizard of Bristol, and ended up scouring Shorey's Bookstore until I had everything written by him....The Complete Cruiser was a favorite that I read more then a few times...what better way to while away my time on the ferry ride to work.

Tucky...check out the PDF in the link above.


Boomer, which ferry?

#247 Slick470

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:06 PM

Bob and Kim, Great story. I love stuff like that.

From a designers perspective, would you start all over and probably end up beefing up everything to handle the additional loading? If that is the case with a yacht like that, I wonder how different the design ended up being from the original, especially with all those sails and the added contributions across the whole yacht.

#248 SemiSalt

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:07 PM

This is way, way off topic, but there was a thread recently that mentioned cruising through Newport, RI. I was reminded of LFH's description of (IIRC) the NYYC fleet in Newport. He described the sequences of morning guns and flags that announced the uniform of the day and whatnot.

In particular, I remember that he said any females sailing with the fleet would stay below decks until 8am because the menfolk would be bathing in the nude. I presumed this meant bathing in the crystal clear waters of Newport harbor.

I wouldn't suggest trying that now in our neo-nakedness-phobic society.

#249 viktor

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:08 PM

What a wonderful hijack,couldn't happen to a nicer thread :) Thanks all,please carry on.

#250 Tucky

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:15 PM

This is way, way off topic, but there was a thread recently that mentioned cruising through Newport, RI. I was reminded of LFH's description of (IIRC) the NYYC fleet in Newport. He described the sequences of morning guns and flags that announced the uniform of the day and whatnot.

In particular, I remember that he said any females sailing with the fleet would stay below decks until 8am because the menfolk would be bathing in the nude. I presumed this meant bathing in the crystal clear waters of Newport harbor.

I wouldn't suggest trying that now in our neo-nakedness-phobic society.


I'd be worried as much about the water in a few harbors, too, just sayin'- might be more than shrinkage-



#251 Bob Perry

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:18 PM

Kim:
Wrong!

That was the race when I was appointed "cook". We had pre- preprared meals all ready to be heated. It was easy. When dinner time came and I began to serve the food we discovered that we had no plates. But we did have a few Dixie cups. So we had braised chicken breasts served vertically in paper cups that we had to recycle through the crew along with recycled plastic forks. It was less than elegant but tasty.

The funniest part of it was after the race I was talking to a crew member off another boat. He said, "We saw you after you rounded the mark, We saw bright lights beaming out of the hull ports and imagined you were below sitting around the big table, enjoying a gourmet meal with china pates and silverware." Or something like that. As I recall the guy who was supposed to stock the boat for the race just didn't think about eating utensils and plates. Details.

Slick:
ATALANTA is a big immensely strong boat with a very stiff mast and very heavy standing rigging. I am not aware of any other major failures other than the outhaul due to the new sails. Maybe Kim has some stories. I think if you did that boat today, and you wouldn't for a variety of reasons, you would probably go with lighter rigging and a bendier rig.

#252 Slick470

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:26 PM

I guess i was thinking more on a boat like Atlantic with that many more newer type sails. Especially when given the opportunity to re-create a new version but trying to keep it as faithful to the original as possible. At what point do you decide that it will look the same, sail pretty close to the same, but the structure needs to be a different animal?

#253 kimbottles

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:30 PM

Kim:
Wrong!

That was the race when I was appointed "cook". We had pre- preprared meals all ready to be heated. It was easy. When dinner time came and I began to serve the food we discovered that we had no plates. But we did have a few Dixie cups. So we had braised chicken breasts served vertically in paper cups that we had to recycle through the crew along with recycled plastic forks. It was less than elegant but tasty.


How could I have forgotten that??

#254 Soņadora

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:41 PM

I guess i was thinking more on a boat like Atlantic with that many more newer type sails. Especially when given the opportunity to re-create a new version but trying to keep it as faithful to the original as possible. At what point do you decide that it will look the same, sail pretty close to the same, but the structure needs to be a different animal?


Maybe Bob could draw you up Jakatan with long overhangs and a big bowsprit ;)

#255 Slick470

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:49 PM

I don't think we need to go that far Sons, although that could be kinda cool. It's just a curiosity really. I've been remodelling my house for the past year or so and some of the asthetic decisions I made playing architect gave me some headaches when playing structural engineer given the changes in load paths and increases in loads. Especially in how those affected the existing structure of the house. It's all relative I suppose, but interesting to me.

#256 Slim

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 04:05 PM

I don't think we need to go that far Sons, although that could be kinda cool. It's just a curiosity really. I've been remodelling my house for the past year or so and some of the asthetic decisions I made playing architect gave me some headaches when playing structural engineer given the changes in load paths and increases in loads. Especially in how those affected the existing structure of the house. It's all relative I suppose, but interesting to me.

There's always the Cherubini 48.

#257 Soņadora

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 04:21 PM

There's always the Cherubini 48.

:wub:

#258 SemiSalt

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 04:27 PM

If you click on the picture of Westward, it enlarges a little. You can just make out what might be a line of reef points on the main.

I didn't notice right away that the foot of the foresail extends beyond the boom, so it has to be sheeted in on each tack.

#259 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 04:39 PM

In the PDF link on Westward,I had to chuckle when Mr. Cockran asked Capt. Barr,how he might prevail upon Nathanael Herreshoff to design and build a schooner that could cross the Atlantic and race in Europe....Barr's advice was,"All you have to do is run up to Bristol and tell Nathanael,you want a yacht for that purpose and be sure you don't tell him how to design her,for if you do,he will probably not take the order."

#260 kimbottles

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 04:50 PM

Slick:
ATALANTA is a big immensely strong boat with a very stiff mast and very heavy standing rigging. I am not aware of any other major failures other than the outhaul due to the new sails. Maybe Kim has some stories. I think if you did that boat today, and you wouldn't for a variety of reasons, you would probably go with lighter rigging and a bendier rig.


We sailed her REALLY HARD several times without any other failures (we did bend the boom in a wild gibe off of Mexico once, but it was just a slight bend and it came out fairly easily.)

During that force ten storm I have mentioned in other threads we were charging along under double reefed main alone and we really should have put in the third reef, but no one wanted to go forward to do it, so we stayed with the double and just went really fast but with no damage. We also should have dumped the main and set up the small jib and mizzen (maybe a reefed mizzen) but by the time we really needed to do it it was just too hard with a short crew. Lesson learned: shorten sail before you need to when it is just a delivery.

Boats can always take more than the crew can take.....

#261 Tucky

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 05:08 PM

Tucky...check out the PDF in the link above.


Thanks, I just read it. I have an old book on Britannia and I'm struck by the fact that both these boats were sunk at the request of their owners. You don't see much of that these days, unless insurance is involved.

#262 kimbottles

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 05:18 PM

Hey! What happened to the seriously cool pile driver photos??

#263 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 06:12 PM

Didn't want to clutter up the thread.

#264 Tucky

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 06:23 PM

Didn't want to clutter up the thread.....


So you are worried about cluttering a thread that began with a proud lie followed by an amusing and slow reveal of a bunny (including my short attention span being called out by Sons- he of the low apparent wind IQ); continued with denials and deletes, and digressions into garage sales, salon vs. saloon and the sexual habits of italian auto executives of a certain age, as well as their taste in flooring; further excursions including testimonials to a fine yacht broker, poems of varying quality and form from haiku to limerick with sarcasm, dramatic irony, metaphor, bathos, puns, parody, litotes and satire (a point to anyone who can identify this allusion), an epic poem from BV, and then the history of great yachts with chapters on Atlantic and Westward as well as fulminations on the increased loads modern sails can put on a yacht or its rigging.

All this including photos, lines plans, diagrams and descriptions of every sort . . . . . . .

And you didn't want to clutter. A more polite man never was. No offense meant.

#265 Timo42

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 06:26 PM


Didn't want to clutter up the thread.....


So you are worried about cluttering a thread that began with a proud lie followed by an amusing and slow reveal of a bunny (including my short attention span being called out by Sons- he of the low apparent wind IQ); continued with denials and deletes, and digressions into garage sales, salon vs. saloon and the sexual habits of italian auto executives of a certain age, as well as their taste in flooring; further excursions including testimonials to a fine yacht broker, poems of varying quality and form from haiku to limerick with sarcasm, dramatic irony, metaphor, bathos, puns, parody, litotes and satire (a point to anyone who can identify this allusion), an epic poem from BV, and then the history of great yachts with chapters on Atlantic and Westward as well as fulminations on the increased loads modern sails can put on a yacht or its rigging.

All this including photos, lines plans, diagrams and descriptions of every sort . . . . . . .

And you didn't want to clutter. A more polite man never was. No offense meant.


Nice summation, I was thinking the same thing. :P The only thing this doesn't have is recipes.

#266 Slim

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 06:30 PM

Posted Image

#267 SemiSalt

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 06:33 PM

After that straight line, someone had to...

Attached File  2012-09-13_1431.png   24.61K   19 downloads

#268 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 06:39 PM

How about some more old shots from back in the day by Beken

Westward

Posted Image

Susanne
Posted Image

Posted Image

#269 hobot

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 07:16 PM



Didn't want to clutter up the thread.....


So you are worried about cluttering a thread that began with a proud lie followed by an amusing and slow reveal of a bunny (including my short attention span being called out by Sons- he of the low apparent wind IQ); continued with denials and deletes, and digressions into garage sales, salon vs. saloon and the sexual habits of italian auto executives of a certain age, as well as their taste in flooring; further excursions including testimonials to a fine yacht broker, poems of varying quality and form from haiku to limerick with sarcasm, dramatic irony, metaphor, bathos, puns, parody, litotes and satire (a point to anyone who can identify this allusion), an epic poem from BV, and then the history of great yachts with chapters on Atlantic and Westward as well as fulminations on the increased loads modern sails can put on a yacht or its rigging.

All this including photos, lines plans, diagrams and descriptions of every sort . . . . . . .

And you didn't want to clutter. A more polite man never was. No offense meant.


Nice summation, I was thinking the same thing. :P The only thing this doesn't have is recipes.


I thought of Boomer when I saw this the other day!

Posted Image

#270 Soņadora

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 07:31 PM

How about some more old shots from back in the day by Beken

Westward

Posted Image

Susanne
Posted Image

Posted Image


"ok you guys, let's get ready to gybe"

"fuck you"

(reprise :))

#271 El Crapitano

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 07:42 PM

The only thing this doesn't have is recipes.


So here's a recipe:

Ingredients
1 lb ground buffalo
1 large onion
1 large eggplant
1 large zucchini
1 hot pepper
1 small can of tomato paste
1 lemon

In a large frying pan make 6 stacks of (starting from the bottom) 1/2" thick onion slice, a buffalo pattie, 3/4" eggplant slice, 1/2" zucchini slice. Mix the tomato paste and juice from the lemon in 1-1/2 cups of water and pour over the stacks. Chop up the hot pepper and toss it into the mix. Simmer for half and hour. Serve over basmati rice or with grilled pita bread.

#272 Tucky

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 07:45 PM

Look at the spinnaker pole in the bottom one- it must be 90 feet long- and there are sails in front of sails and I think I see something rolled up coming off the foremast.

Lotta cotton.

No winches and it looks like the crew are all piled in the stern keeping the bow up. Wooden ships and iron men indeed.

That is a serious wake bow and stern.

Attached File  1906-Suzanne-1911-Beken.jpg   680.81K   7 downloads

#273 El Crapitano

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 07:46 PM

Westward

Posted Image

Susanne
Posted Image


Some of those sails have wrinkles bearing an uncanny likeness to a bad boob job. Makes the Atlantic's pix all the more impressive.

#274 SemiSalt

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 07:54 PM

"ok you guys, let's get ready to gybe"

"fuck you"


If I recall correctly, an America's Cup course from that era was 25 miles out, 25 miles back, or a triangle once-around. Not a lot of emphasis on maneuvers.

#275 kdh

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 07:59 PM

I remember that he said any females sailing with the fleet would stay below decks until 8am because the menfolk would be bathing in the nude. I presumed this meant bathing in the crystal clear waters of Newport harbor.

I wouldn't suggest trying that now in our neo-nakedness-phobic society.


I always go in sans unless there is any chance of frightening children. I went in the water at Tarpaulin Cove with bunch of guys bare-ass and for one of the guys my age it was his first time. Hard for me to imagine that.

#276 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 08:00 PM




Didn't want to clutter up the thread.....


So you are worried about cluttering a thread that began with a proud lie followed by an amusing and slow reveal of a bunny (including my short attention span being called out by Sons- he of the low apparent wind IQ); continued with denials and deletes, and digressions into garage sales, salon vs. saloon and the sexual habits of italian auto executives of a certain age, as well as their taste in flooring; further excursions including testimonials to a fine yacht broker, poems of varying quality and form from haiku to limerick with sarcasm, dramatic irony, metaphor, bathos, puns, parody, litotes and satire (a point to anyone who can identify this allusion), an epic poem from BV, and then the history of great yachts with chapters on Atlantic and Westward as well as fulminations on the increased loads modern sails can put on a yacht or its rigging.

All this including photos, lines plans, diagrams and descriptions of every sort . . . . . . .

And you didn't want to clutter. A more polite man never was. No offense meant.


Nice summation, I was thinking the same thing. :P The only thing this doesn't have is recipes.


I thought of Boomer when I saw this the other day!

Posted Image


Hobot...The "winter tour" as we call it of the San Juans...We replaced the round cushions on the those dolphins at San Juan,the winter after you finished the floating dolphins with us for Orcas Island....we had one our big tugs,with us on that tour,and lucky we did...because Hurlen drove those fender pile out of plumb,leaning into the dolphin...so we used the tug with some two and half inch line to pull the pile away, to replace the cushions...the skipper was giving her all she's got,and the guys said, "it couldn't be done"...."besides it was to dangerous"...Lonnie Treadway looked at me and smiled..."shall we show them old man"...I looked at him and smiled,"who you calling old man." That was the last stop on our tour,sleeping on the rig was getting old and we wanted to get home..."boys,let some old men show you how it's done"....we did some crazy shitt that day....had a bunch of lookyloos on the ferry boats...and the state inspector saying,you can't do that....that got Lonnie and my blood a going..."say HUH,Phuck You"...then when the ferry was in, the inspector didn't want us crawling up and down the fenders replacing the bad bolts....Lonnie looked at me,"did you hear something"..."nope," I replied....we had one other old time pilebuck,Steve Ericson with us, working the top,and keeping the inspector at bay and the young bucks punking us hardware...like I said we did some crazy shitt that day,and we were jamming,finished the dolphins on both sides that day....all the screaming and crawling around like a bunch of monkeys...at the end of the day,everyone was smiling...because we were all going home.

#277 kdh

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 08:10 PM

Now Atlantic is not a bad looking boat by all means, but Westward, ah Westward is in another league entirely....

sigh... :wub:


Saw Eleonora, a Westward replica, at the Herreshoff museum where they had a reception. A treat.

http://www.yachteleonora.com/

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#278 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 08:39 PM

Steve Ericson drilling and Perry Ward doing a dolphin furring & upgrade at the Port Townsend Dock.

This was directly after the old diesel electrics were pulled out of service...wish we had Perry Ward on that "winter tour."
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Preparing to level the dolphin with heavy chain
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My old bud Willy Price(wished he was on the winter tour that year,but him and Memo would have been fighting) directing pile driving always made a job fun and got it done.
Willy's old man Bill Price was my boss back in the day,Steve Ericson guiding the pile and my son Rob as our apprentice.
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Willy welding and Steve connecting up the fender pile.
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#279 kimbottles

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 08:54 PM

some people have very cool jobs...!

#280 Tom Ray

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:00 PM



Didn't want to clutter up the thread.....


So you are worried about cluttering a thread that began with a proud lie followed by an amusing and slow reveal of a bunny (including my short attention span being called out by Sons- he of the low apparent wind IQ); continued with denials and deletes, and digressions into garage sales, salon vs. saloon and the sexual habits of italian auto executives of a certain age, as well as their taste in flooring; further excursions including testimonials to a fine yacht broker, poems of varying quality and form from haiku to limerick with sarcasm, dramatic irony, metaphor, bathos, puns, parody, litotes and satire (a point to anyone who can identify this allusion), an epic poem from BV, and then the history of great yachts with chapters on Atlantic and Westward as well as fulminations on the increased loads modern sails can put on a yacht or its rigging.

All this including photos, lines plans, diagrams and descriptions of every sort . . . . . . .

And you didn't want to clutter. A more polite man never was. No offense meant.


Nice summation, I was thinking the same thing. :P The only thing this doesn't have is recipes.


It's still lacking the French Toast girl too. Tucky's summary is outstanding.

#281 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:08 PM

You know what I always like about my sons...I never have to tell them,"get to work."
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Willy doing his best rendition of,"Hammering Man"
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Rarely did we see poor quality pile like this back in the day...on this little repair job,had more then a few like this....drove the pile on this job with a 100 year old 1909 #2 Vulcan air hammer.
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#282 Bob Perry

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:20 PM

Jeezus Boomer: You are totally mucking up Reis's thread!
There won't be any more room for poems.

Thanks, love the pile driving pics.
Nice nail.

#283 Beau.Vrolyk

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:23 PM

Boomer,

I was at The Museum in Bristol and chatting with one of the big-wigs there. We were discussing Atlantic vs Westwardand he had an interesting supposed-quote from Captain Nat. It went something like "Atlantic is fast because she was built like a bull and can take much more than her crew can survive. Westward is faster because she has grace and is much lighter. The north Atlantic will favor the schooner of the same name, mine will favor anyplace any reasonable person would want to race sailing yachts." I think that pretty well sums up the difference between the boats. I think Atlantic out weighed Westward by almost 2:1.


Slick,

Our little sloop started out with Dacron sails and a track for the mainsail clew attachment atop the carbon boom. The shift from Dacron to Spectra ended the life of the track, and there are some stripped out holes where bolts pulled out of the boom. We've now shifted from Spectra to 3Di (a combination of Carbon other Arimids fibers. We've gone from a small nylon strap around the boom to hold the clew down to a wide dyneema strap. In addition, we've increased the size of the blocks, lines and backing bolts on almost everything from the Vang through the jib tack, halyards and sheets. So far, we've blown the vang off the mast - a small shackle that serves as a "fuse" disappeared in a puff of stainless steel smoke. I've installed fuses in other places too, hoping to avoid damage when the loads hit. Interestingly, the static loads aren't the problem. It's the shock loads when the boat pounds or the mainsail slats that break things.

The modern version of Atlantic has allow lower masts and spruce topmasts, lighter and stronger than the original. The owner didn't want to use carbon, despite its successful application in a number of J-Class sloops. As a result, her rig is probably well suited to Dacron sail cloth but may be too light to take the extra shock loads of spectra or carbon.


There is a great book: Atlantic, The last Great Race of Princes by Scott Cookman which I would highly recommend.

#284 Beau.Vrolyk

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:42 PM

Boomer,

I sailed on what I think is an Alden #390, ARCTURUS, that used to belong to General Patton and is now in Auckland, NZ. She is a sweet ride!

Beau



#285 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:44 PM

Schooner's schooning along is easier on the eyes...but what the hey, probably some of you haven't seen these...

Time to pull pile and a lovely morning for it....

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Everything's hooked up and we're ready to extract some pile....

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#286 Bob Perry

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:54 PM

Christmas cards for men.

#287 reis123

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:55 PM

BV, my poetry rings true for the people, yours, the accolades of SA. Be careful what you wish for, it just might come come true. Malice is a sin boys, no offense intended. See you on the water!

#288 olaf hart

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:02 PM

BV, my poetry rings true for the people, yours, the accolades of SA. Be careful what you wish for, it just might come come true. Malice is a sin boys, no offense intended. See you on the water!



#289 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:04 PM

Boomer,

I was at The Museum in Bristol and chatting with one of the big-wigs there. We were discussing Atlantic vs Westwardand he had an interesting supposed-quote from Captain Nat. It went something like "Atlantic is fast because she was built like a bull and can take much more than her crew can survive. Westward is faster because she has grace and is much lighter. The north Atlantic will favor the schooner of the same name, mine will favor anyplace any reasonable person would want to race sailing yachts." I think that pretty well sums up the difference between the boats. I think Atlantic out weighed Westward by almost 2:1.


Slick,

Our little sloop started out with Dacron sails and a track for the mainsail clew attachment atop the carbon boom. The shift from Dacron to Spectra ended the life of the track, and there are some stripped out holes where bolts pulled out of the boom. We've now shifted from Spectra to 3Di (a combination of Carbon other Arimids fibers. We've gone from a small nylon strap around the boom to hold the clew down to a wide dyneema strap. In addition, we've increased the size of the blocks, lines and backing bolts on almost everything from the Vang through the jib tack, halyards and sheets. So far, we've blown the vang off the mast - a small shackle that serves as a "fuse" disappeared in a puff of stainless steel smoke. I've installed fuses in other places too, hoping to avoid damage when the loads hit. Interestingly, the static loads aren't the problem. It's the shock loads when the boat pounds or the mainsail slats that break things.

The modern version of Atlantic has allow lower masts and spruce topmasts, lighter and stronger than the original. The owner didn't want to use carbon, despite its successful application in a number of J-Class sloops. As a result, her rig is probably well suited to Dacron sail cloth but may be too light to take the extra shock loads of spectra or carbon.


There is a great book: Atlantic, The last Great Race of Princes by Scott Cookman which I would highly recommend.


I read that as well,Beau....Barr said she was fast enough in any weather to win over the great German schooners,with the exception of the "Queen" in light airs...so he wrote Nat Herreshoff, " I had the men take a ton of ballast out of the bow...then had the men shift 1/2 a ton from aft forward,to bring her back on trim."...he went on to say, "it seemed impossible to get her down to 96 feet unless we take more lead out...and since she has done so well,there does not seem a need to do it."...."Meteor and Germania on a close reach can do us from 12-15 secs per mile if the wind is strong enough,but on no other point of sail...We have outrun them in all kinds of weather and the same to windward.We have outreached them from close to wide in everything but strong hard winds."

#290 Beau.Vrolyk

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:08 PM

Reis - really? Seriously, you're writing poetry for "the people". Well, I must say I'm impressed - what poetry was that, what you've posted here? Excuse my surprise, I had thought the rubbish that was posted on this site was a long long way from reaching "the people", whomever they are.

I must say, I've no idea what it is that you think I've wished for. But I am actually really excited if something that I've wished for is going to come true! That would be terrific! Or, perhaps, you meant that in a hurtful and sarcastic way. That would be sad. I haven't ever wished for things I don't really want, so I think I'm safe. But thanks for warning me.

I actually don't think "malice" is listed as a sin. Where that so, the number of sinners would probably be nearly infinite and would most certainly include everyone here, all the members of most organized religions and without doubt every sailor I've ever sailed with. But, if you've got a book or two that actually says that malice is a sin, I'm all ears. The sins I know of are Lust, Gluttony, Greed, Sloth, Wrath, Envy and Pride. Of course, this list is pretty much proof positive that every sailor any of us has ever known is a sinner - but I think we all knew that. Anyway, the source is: http://en.wikipedia....ven_deadly_sins

I'm glad we'll see you on the water. But I've only one question. How the hell will I know which person is you? You see, unlike a lot of us, I can't figure out who you are. So, as much as I'd like to see you on the water and congratulate you on the purchase of a beautiful schooner, I don't know who you are. I suppose that it'll be obvious soon enough, as you'll be the person who owns Rebecca and all will be revealed.

Good luck and see you on the water,

Beau






#291 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:13 PM

Boomer,

I sailed on what I think is an Alden #390, ARCTURUS, that used to belong to General Patton and is now in Auckland, NZ. She is a sweet ride!

Beau



Yes the ARCTURUS!....I believe Patton sailed her to Hawaii with his wife before the war....you know her history,eh....probably more then I...time for a breather to watch the vid....Thank You!

#292 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:33 PM

Christmas cards for men.


Indeed...they worked hard,so a full English breakfast I cooked for them in the morning(our deck engineer was a great guy,but his cooked skills were so so) and roast,turkey,or ham with all the fixin's,and one full course Mexican or Oriental dinner a week....get their work done and ahead of schedule, and out of there with an extra half hour or so of pay a day,especially if we worked through the night and into the wee hours of the morning.

#293 Jose Carumba

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:36 PM

Those big manson cranes are amazing. We used them to launch our boats before we got the 350 ton Travelift. Were you involved in any of those lifts Boomer?

#294 reis123

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:53 PM

Reis - really? Seriously, you're writing poetry for "the people". Well, I must say I'm impressed - what poetry was that, what you've posted here? Excuse my surprise, I had thought the rubbish that was posted on this site was a long long way from reaching "the people", whomever they are.

I must say, I've no idea what it is that you think I've wished for. But I am actually really excited if something that I've wished for is going to come true! That would be terrific! Or, perhaps, you meant that in a hurtful and sarcastic way. That would be sad. I haven't ever wished for things I don't really want, so I think I'm safe. But thanks for warning me.

I actually don't think "malice" is listed as a sin. Where that so, the number of sinners would probably be nearly infinite and would most certainly include everyone here, all the members of most organized religions and without doubt every sailor I've ever sailed with. But, if you've got a book or two that actually says that malice is a sin, I'm all ears. The sins I know of are Lust, Gluttony, Greed, Sloth, Wrath, Envy and Pride. Of course, this list is pretty much proof positive that every sailor any of us has ever known is a sinner - but I think we all knew that. Anyway, the source is: http://en.wikipedia....ven_deadly_sins

I'm glad we'll see you on the water. But I've only one question. How the hell will I know which person is you? You see, unlike a lot of us, I can't figure out who you are. So, as much as I'd like to see you on the water and congratulate you on the purchase of a beautiful schooner, I don't know who you are. I suppose that it'll be obvious soon enough, as you'll be the person who owns Rebecca and all will be revealed.

Good luck and see you on the water,

Beau




Thoughtful comments BV, unexpected and, well, measured and thoughtful, so one might be cool with that. You will know me soon enough, and happily so... like you, and many here, well, those without malice or being vindictive, I share a love of sailboats and of, far more importantly, a love of the sea and those that love her, too. Which means sailing, for those that the sea is no passing fancy...

#295 Tucky

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:06 PM


Christmas cards for men.


Indeed...they worked hard,so a full English breakfast I cooked for them in the morning(our deck engineer was a great guy,but his cooked skills were so so) and roast,turkey,or ham with all the fixin's,and one full course Mexican or Oriental dinner a week....get their work done and ahead of schedule, and out of there with an extra half hour or so of pay a day,especially if we worked through the night and into the wee hours of the morning.


Keep digressing, please keep digressing, that is the best place for this thread now.

#296 boomer

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:28 PM

Those big manson cranes are amazing. We used them to launch our boats before we got the 350 ton Travelift. Were you involved in any of those lifts Boomer?


You would be using the heavy lift crew from Manson's yard...back in the day,that would have been Lonnie Wangen(retired to Wenatchee) and crew or Bill Teasdale(retired,Bill bought a 50' and did the Bahaha last year and headed for the south Pacific) or Bill Hobson and crew and a couple fill in field foremen and crew.

The #24 which was the primary heavy lift derrick barge,the secondary heavy lift derricks barges, depending on if they are not in Alaska or California, would have either the Haakon,Njord,Norseman,Scandia,Viking and occasionally if when they're in the NW the Valhalla or Valkyrie.

In the mid 90's till '02 Lupie Vargus was heavy lift foreman, till he took a job at the apprenticeship training center,followed by my good bud Jeff Stillwell(retired & lives close by, we still sail together),then Steve or Tom Ericson(retired to Joyce and spends a lot of time on the Straits or beyond Tatoosh fishing),the last few years the heavy lift foreman has been a revolving door of whoever is available in the yard.

Pat McGary whom I'm sure you know, kept Dragonfly in your yard for a spell after retiring.

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#297 kdh

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:38 PM

Boomer, Bob's "christmas cards for men" is it. So cool.

BV, Are there any "big-wigs" in Bristol? They're a sunset ride for me so I do it a lot. I've only met Halsey, and he was down-to-earth, if maybe a bit justifiably dismissive, but not aloof in the least. Was interested in my boat more than I. I'm sure he has some stories but he didn't tell me any.

Rhode Island is a bit of a mystery even to a Massachusetts yankee. Bristol has that great slave-trade history that no one talks about. Brown University was built on it.

#298 reis123

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:47 PM

John Alden, N. Benjamin's inspiration for his schooners, was for, at least a time, located at 148 State Street, in Boston, where I worked, a generation or two later, I love stuff like this.

#299 Beau.Vrolyk

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 12:50 AM


Reis - really? Seriously, you're writing poetry for "the people". Well, I must say I'm impressed - what poetry was that, what you've posted here? Excuse my surprise, I had thought the rubbish that was posted on this site was a long long way from reaching "the people", whomever they are.

I must say, I've no idea what it is that you think I've wished for. But I am actually really excited if something that I've wished for is going to come true! That would be terrific! Or, perhaps, you meant that in a hurtful and sarcastic way. That would be sad. I haven't ever wished for things I don't really want, so I think I'm safe. But thanks for warning me.

I actually don't think "malice" is listed as a sin. Where that so, the number of sinners would probably be nearly infinite and would most certainly include everyone here, all the members of most organized religions and without doubt every sailor I've ever sailed with. But, if you've got a book or two that actually says that malice is a sin, I'm all ears. The sins I know of are Lust, Gluttony, Greed, Sloth, Wrath, Envy and Pride. Of course, this list is pretty much proof positive that every sailor any of us has ever known is a sinner - but I think we all knew that. Anyway, the source is: http://en.wikipedia....ven_deadly_sins

I'm glad we'll see you on the water. But I've only one question. How the hell will I know which person is you? You see, unlike a lot of us, I can't figure out who you are. So, as much as I'd like to see you on the water and congratulate you on the purchase of a beautiful schooner, I don't know who you are. I suppose that it'll be obvious soon enough, as you'll be the person who owns Rebecca and all will be revealed.

Good luck and see you on the water,

Beau



Thoughtful comments BV, unexpected and, well, measured and thoughtful, so one might be cool with that. You will know me soon enough, and happily so... like you, and many here, well, those without malice or being vindictive, I share a love of sailboats and of, far more importantly, a love of the sea and those that love her, too. Which means sailing, for those that the sea is no passing fancy...


Well, Reis, I'd certainly like to see Rebecca well taken care of, well sailed, and well loved.

See you on the water.

BV

#300 Beau.Vrolyk

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 12:55 AM

Boomer, Bob's "christmas cards for men" is it. So cool.

BV, Are there any "big-wigs" in Bristol? They're a sunset ride for me so I do it a lot. I've only met Halsey, and he was down-to-earth, if maybe a bit justifiably dismissive, but not aloof in the least. Was interested in my boat more than I. I'm sure he has some stories but he didn't tell me any.

Rhode Island is a bit of a mystery even to a Massachusetts yankee. Bristol has that great slave-trade history that no one talks about. Brown University was built on it.


kdh,

The Big Wigs I was talking with were folks associate with The Museum board or sr. staff. I must say that The Museum makes my fingers itch to get in and fix up a lot of those boats. I keep wondering, each time I go back, when they'll find a real patron and start restoring a lot of wonderful boats. For the cost of one of the J-Class boats, some rich person could restore the lot of them to perfection.

BV




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