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US Built Viper at Long Beach Boat Show Oct 18-21


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#1 schoonerman

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:05 PM

If you want to see the first Viper off the Peabody, MA production line, we'll be there. A variety of owners will be on hand to talk about the West Coast fleets. Timbo is running the show!

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#2 Timbo

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 05:21 AM

Come on down and chat, I think the build slots are filling up fast. :)

Great boat, lots o fun with the kids, what's not to like?

#3 Streetwise

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 07:39 PM

How many USA Vipers have been built so far?

jason

#4 jkdubs808

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 06:07 AM

Does it have 'Made in the USA' stamped on it?

#5 schoonerman

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 04:47 PM

Hey Jason,

Our US production is currently 3 boats/month and we are sold out through Jan. We can ramp up production to one per week, but the shop is very busy with large dinghy orders too. Canadian orders/inquiries are coming in as a result of NAFTA...woohoo. We have some large demo's coming up in Florida (See banner AD up top 'Fly to Try') Just finished a tuning clinic/regatta in Long Beach and will start the West Coast Circuit in January's Leukemia Cup in AZ.

I have a UK built boat coming to me via container with two K6's (sold), parts, trailers, keels and perhaps a K1 too !!

We are using two identical tools so there's no difference between boats. Most (but not all) USA folks are opting for US built boats. The UK plant is building boats for Europe and OZ. I'm going with a UK boat so I can get a demo in stock before May. Oddly, it's more affordable to get a container full of boats to the West Coast from the UK than it is via ground shipping from MA. It's a big country.

Dubs...the USA boats are US flagged :-D

#6 Mambo Kings

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 10:43 PM

See banner AD up top 'Fly to Try'


In their marketing wisdom, the webgineers at Sailing Anarchy make the banner ad disappear when we open a thread....so unless I close this thread, I have no idea to which banner you refer.

#7 fastyacht

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 11:29 PM

Dubs...the USA boats are US flagged :-D

]

So they are good to go for my new Old Saybrook to Orient Point sailing passenger ferry service.

#8 Ship o' Fools

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 06:53 PM

What is the beginning hull number for the first MkIII boat? Is there a particular sail number grouping for US built boats or some way to easily determine where a boat was built?

#9 Mambo Kings

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 07:12 PM

What is the beginning hull number for the first MkIII boat? Is there a particular sail number grouping for US built boats or some way to easily determine where a boat was built?


There is not a formal distinction between Mark I, II and III. It is more a slang used by Viperers to distinguish between different periods of build.
Mark 1 is any boat built before Rondar.
Mark II are boats built by Rondar out of the Performance Boats Molds that they inherited.
Mark III are boats built by Rondar out of molds built by Rondar.

The first MarkII boat was hull#70 which is owned by the Rowlinsons in Ontario.(note that 61-66 are GBR reg'd but they were late Mark1s laid in USA and assembled in UK)
Any MarkIII is easy to distinguish because when Rondar built molds they widened the hull deck/flange to ensure a better bond between hull and deck. The hull diminsions are identical but you can recognize the distinctive inset deck at the transom creating a "sugar scoop" look. See picture above.

For location of build,AFAIK class hands out numbers in the order that they are built, but the reg # on transom should state country of origin....GBR or USA. Not sure what hull# BITUSA is, Spinn would know, but they are well in 200s now.

#10 wpbeardsley

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 07:55 PM

What is the beginning hull number for the first MkIII boat? Is there a particular sail number grouping for US built boats or some way to easily determine where a boat was built?

To answer the first part of your question, I think the hull numbers for the three categories mentioned by Mambo Kings are something like this (approximately):
10-66: Mark I
70-105 (approx on the end of the series, class veterans might be able to say with more certainty): Mark II
106 - 179: Mark III
180 - present: Mark IV (i.e., boats built out of the new molds in the US and UK that have slightly larger cockpit lockers, slightly less aggressive non-skid on rails and a couple of other minor tweaks that do not appear to make a major difference).

#11 Ship o' Fools

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 08:52 PM

Thanks for the responses.

#12 Timbo

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 01:56 AM

BITUSA is # 187, 1st Mark IV built in the states.

#13 6924

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 04:46 PM

well done !

#14 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 06:05 PM


See banner AD up top 'Fly to Try'


In their marketing wisdom, the webgineers at Sailing Anarchy make the banner ad disappear when we open a thread....so unless I close this thread, I have no idea to which banner you refer.


Working on it

#15 schoonerman

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 06:07 PM


See banner AD up top 'Fly to Try'


In their marketing wisdom, the webgineers at Sailing Anarchy make the banner ad disappear when we open a thread....so unless I close this thread, I have no idea to which banner you refer.



http://www.rondarboats.com/us/anarchy

It's the Fly.Try.Buy program. Several events you can fly in and sail a Viper. We'll pay your airfare!

ps, I hear SA is rolling out new software this coming weekend :-D

#16 schoonerman

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 06:23 PM


What is the beginning hull number for the first MkIII boat? Is there a particular sail number grouping for US built boats or some way to easily determine where a boat was built?

To answer the first part of your question, I think the hull numbers for the three categories mentioned by Mambo Kings are something like this (approximately):
10-66: Mark I
70-105 (approx on the end of the series, class veterans might be able to say with more certainty): Mark II
106 - 179: Mark III
180 - present: Mark IV (i.e., boats built out of the new molds in the US and UK that have slightly larger cockpit lockers, slightly less aggressive non-skid on rails and a couple of other minor tweaks that do not appear to make a major difference).


Peter has this nailed...

Rondar's first boat was the Mark II #70
Rondar rebuilt the tooling (as the first tool was dead) for the Mark III. Some minor upgrades, hull flange, etc. First Mark III was #103.

This winter Rondar built plugs and two identical, wide flange, tools....one for the USA and another for the UK. This could be called a Mark IV I guess. Quite a few minor upgrades. Bigger cockpit lockers (read HUGE) sitting on bezels so they are water tight. New non-skid patterns, some flanging matting, slight angle changes to better accommodate hardware, penske board backing plates, some slight rounding in the spinnaker launcher, new keel tool built to the class specifications, new top and bottom plate inserts, anodized keel cap with a relocated hoisting eye to better align with the hoisting load, 6:1 keel hoist, beefier keel inserts...that's all that's coming to mind, though I'm sure there's a dozen others that I've forgotten (damn the 70's). Like Peter says, nothing of consequence or speed, just to make life easier for our customers.

Boats coming out of Peabody look DAMN fine too !

#17 ultraracer613um

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 06:34 PM

The first MK 3 was 102. Felipe and i took delivery of 102 and 103 at the same time (charleston race week 2009).

This is the first i've heard of any new keel tool. It is my understanding that keels have not changed, and although new keel tooling is being considered it has not been purchased yet. Could you confirm? I believe you may mean "keel template" but since fairing keels is not allowed, i'm not sure what good it does at this point.




What is the beginning hull number for the first MkIII boat? Is there a particular sail number grouping for US built boats or some way to easily determine where a boat was built?

To answer the first part of your question, I think the hull numbers for the three categories mentioned by Mambo Kings are something like this (approximately):
10-66: Mark I
70-105 (approx on the end of the series, class veterans might be able to say with more certainty): Mark II
106 - 179: Mark III
180 - present: Mark IV (i.e., boats built out of the new molds in the US and UK that have slightly larger cockpit lockers, slightly less aggressive non-skid on rails and a couple of other minor tweaks that do not appear to make a major difference).


Peter has this nailed...

Rondar's first boat was the Mark II #70
Rondar rebuilt the tooling (as the first tool was dead) for the Mark III. Some minor upgrades, hull flange, etc. First Mark III was #103.

This winter Rondar built plugs and two identical, wide flange, tools....one for the USA and another for the UK. This could be called a Mark IV I guess. Quite a few minor upgrades. Bigger cockpit lockers (read HUGE) sitting on bezels so they are water tight. New non-skid patterns, some flanging matting, slight angle changes to better accommodate hardware, penske board backing plates, some slight rounding in the spinnaker launcher, new keel tool built to the class specifications, new top and bottom plate inserts, anodized keel cap with a relocated hoisting eye to better align with the hoisting load, 6:1 keel hoist, beefier keel inserts...that's all that's coming to mind, though I'm sure there's a dozen others that I've forgotten (damn the 70's). Like Peter says, nothing of consequence or speed, just to make life easier for our customers.

Boats coming out of Peabody look DAMN fine too !



#18 Timbo

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 07:09 PM

Ultra, we just passed a rule to fair the keel to the class approved profile. The new keel tooling will match that profile.

New wording in the rules:

3.4 The keel foil may be faired after September 30, 2012, subject to the following:
The keel foil may be faired only to match the Class provided Viper 640 keel template and over the section from 50 mm above the top of the keel bulb to 25 mm below where the keel exits the hull when in the lowered position, must: A, meet that shape within plus 2 mm or minus 1 mm as measured on each side of the keel foil: B, the distance from the keels leading edge to its trailing edge measured perpendicular to the leading edge and parallel to its centerline shall be between 350 mm and 359 mm: C, and the keel foil trailing edge minimum thickness is 3 mm. The faired keel foil may be subject to inspection at any time after fairing for compliance with these tolerances and dimensions.

#19 ultraracer613um

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 08:14 PM

Cool. So no tooling yet, but good that we can straighten them out. Where can i get a template?

Ultra, we just passed a rule to fair the keel to the class approved profile. The new keel tooling will match that profile.

New wording in the rules:

3.4 The keel foil may be faired after September 30, 2012, subject to the following:
The keel foil may be faired only to match the Class provided Viper 640 keel template and over the section from 50 mm above the top of the keel bulb to 25 mm below where the keel exits the hull when in the lowered position, must: A, meet that shape within plus 2 mm or minus 1 mm as measured on each side of the keel foil: B, the distance from the keels leading edge to its trailing edge measured perpendicular to the leading edge and parallel to its centerline shall be between 350 mm and 359 mm: C, and the keel foil trailing edge minimum thickness is 3 mm. The faired keel foil may be subject to inspection at any time after fairing for compliance with these tolerances and dimensions.



#20 Timbo

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 03:25 AM

Do you know anyone on the Tech Committee?? ;)

#21 schoonerman

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 02:42 PM

Cool. So no tooling yet, but good that we can straighten them out. Where can i get a template?


Ultra, we just passed a rule to fair the keel to the class approved profile. The new keel tooling will match that profile.

New wording in the rules:

3.4 The keel foil may be faired after September 30, 2012, subject to the following:
The keel foil may be faired only to match the Class provided Viper 640 keel template and over the section from 50 mm above the top of the keel bulb to 25 mm below where the keel exits the hull when in the lowered position, must: A, meet that shape within plus 2 mm or minus 1 mm as measured on each side of the keel foil: B, the distance from the keels leading edge to its trailing edge measured perpendicular to the leading edge and parallel to its centerline shall be between 350 mm and 359 mm: C, and the keel foil trailing edge minimum thickness is 3 mm. The faired keel foil may be subject to inspection at any time after fairing for compliance with these tolerances and dimensions.


New keel tool is in production as I type this. Thanks to Milanes Foils for an outstanding job. The old tool had all sorts of defects but as you know, foil tools are expensive to build. In the long run it will pay itself off in saving labour hours, particularly with the number of orders in the que now.

Damn, I knew Filipe's boat was the first Mark III, just couldn't remember the number. (Once again, damn the 70's) Thanks Jeffe.

Yeah....who IS on the TC Timbo ;-)

#22 RockHead

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 04:08 PM

Most importantly, existing fleets are growing with new Viper sales to CA, NY, CT, RI & MA, and new fleets are gathering steam with Vipers going to FL, VA & IL.

The breathless anticipation and analysis paralysis due to the J/70 and VX seems to have broken. I think 2013 is going to be a big growth year for the Viper, much like after the M20 and SB20 actually debuted. I find it amusing that the Viper is now in some ways the safe, established choice for many. Or at least those who find the J flavor a bit staid for a sportboat. I think we're starting to see peoples eyes opened to sportboats, in no small part due to the J/Boats entry into the mix, as some here predicted. J/boats will sell plenty of 70's but enough people will look at the concept and like it, then look at the alternatives like the Viper. The one-design sportboat segment is only going to pick up steam in the US over the coming years...

#23 schoonerman

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 02:14 PM

Hoorah Bubba. True words.

I have a friend who's a J dealer. He said he just can't be bothered selling J70's as there's no money, comparatively in the sale. He sells LOTS of boats other than J's too.

The J is a good boat...it certainly has it's critics (check out the J forum), as does the Viper and every other boat that's ever been dreamed, made or sailed.

Here's a deck for a West Coast boat being built...#190

Posted Image

I want to install a cabin sole locker in the aft recess like SteveO's Shaw 650 to keep the beer cool :-D

I'm the strongest proponent for us leading the way in sportboats by installing beer holders into the seat tanks....like a Santa Cruz 50!

#24 GIBY

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 05:07 PM

Schooner, any chance we can get a look at the new larger lockers? I'm curious to see how much bigger they are.

#25 schoonerman

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 06:51 PM

Schooner, any chance we can get a look at the new larger lockers? I'm curious to see how much bigger they are.


The f'n things are huge. I'll ask Timbo to snap a phone pic. I think they are about 3 feet long. The are a nice bonding element now and the hatch bezel and tempress hatches keeps them completely dry...trust me, I put a LOT of water in #187 in the SF NOODS :-D

#26 Timbo

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 10:05 PM

I want to install a cabin sole locker in the aft recess like SteveO's Shaw 650 to keep the beer cool :-D

I'm the strongest proponent for us leading the way in sportboats by installing beer holders into the seat tanks....like a Santa Cruz 50!


Sort of like these? :) Attached File  beer holders.JPG   340.72K   64 downloads

I think the lockers are about 300% larger... before a 12 pack filled them up.. now 1 can get a 30can regatta box in each side.

#27 Mambo Kings

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 01:55 AM

Cool. Good that we can straighten them out. Where can i get a template?



Didn't the "Thing" end up with Ultra after he flicked off his bulb?

No template, long board or Bible is going to redeem the "Thing". That Thing sir, is beyond any mortal help.

#28 Port Tack Start

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 06:12 AM

Hoorah Bubba. True words.

I have a friend who's a J dealer. He said he just can't be bothered selling J70's as there's no money, comparatively in the sale. He sells LOTS of boats other than J's too.

The J is a good boat...it certainly has it's critics (check out the J forum), as does the Viper and every other boat that's ever been dreamed, made or sailed.

Here's a deck for a West Coast boat being built...#190

Posted Image


By far one of the best looking viper decks built yet...

#29 RockHead

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 08:21 AM


Schooner, any chance we can get a look at the new larger lockers? I'm curious to see how much bigger they are.


The f'n things are huge. I'll ask Timbo to snap a phone pic. I think they are about 3 feet long. The are a nice bonding element now and the hatch bezel and tempress hatches keeps them completely dry...trust me, I put a LOT of water in #187 in the SF NOODS :-D

You can EASILY fit a 3' wooden paddle into the new lockers. With room to spare. For lots of beer.

Hmm... I'm thinking we should use about a 2" foam core for the lockers!

#30 ultraracer613um

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 04:01 PM

Nice, yes ... We will start referring to it as the "thing"

I already have about 4 hours invested in it with a longboard. I've resolved myself to attacking it with a 6" grinder an twenty grit. Much easier to shape foam.



Cool. Good that we can straighten them out. Where can i get a template?



Didn't the "Thing" end up with Ultra after he flicked off his bulb?

No template, long board or Bible is going to redeem the "Thing". That Thing sir, is beyond any mortal help.



#31 Timbo

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 05:44 PM


Schooner, any chance we can get a look at the new larger lockers? I'm curious to see how much bigger they are.


The f'n things are huge. I'll ask Timbo to snap a phone pic. I think they are about 3 feet long. The are a nice bonding element now and the hatch bezel and tempress hatches keeps them completely dry...trust me, I put a LOT of water in #187 in the SF NOODS :-D

Here is a phone snap. Standard 16oz water bottle for scale at the far end..

Attached File  Lockerbox.jpg   45.24K   54 downloads



#32 schoonerman

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 05:59 PM

Here's the underside of deck #190. You can see that size matters when it comes to cockpit lockers.

Timbo. I LOVE the foam idea. I'm requesting that option on #200 (the Timbo edition) and we'll run a small drain pipe into the keel well :-D

Posted Image

#33 Timbo

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 06:23 PM

I like the centerline esky idea, the Schooner Bin....

#34 schoonerman

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:15 PM

Here's #190, before attaching the deck, that will be heading West soon.

Navy Blue hull....f'n gorgeous !!!

Attached File  #190 hull.jpg   89.52K   47 downloads

#35 WCB

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:23 PM

Good looking hull!!




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