Jump to content


Luna Rossa 72

How long?

  • Please log in to reply
3206 replies to this topic

#2201 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 08:20 PM

'September boat' makes little sense to me since OR has to train through the same months as the Challengers, and since they ~have to be ~ prepared to race under even higher wind limits (actually quite a lot higher, too) and since we have not seen OR shying away from heavy conditions even in the very early days of Boat2.

I see no indication through either statements or actions that OR has had any plan whatsoever except to be able to race at the very high end. Read that Nevius line again, about how the Italians are pissed off because OR is apparently 'brushing off' LR's press for lighter limits. How much more bluntly could that point be made?

The OR-is-pushing-for-lighter completely unsubstantiated speculation just doesnt stack up, it is apparently just the product of too-fervent imaginations.

IF anyone, GD or whoever, has a big problem with lower limits the that problem for them quite obviously starts with PB. No other team has proposed it.

I've said all along that teams will press for their own interests, imaginary 'cozy relationships' or not.

#2202 Barnyb

Barnyb

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,242 posts
  • Location:New Zealand

Posted 18 May 2013 - 08:21 PM

  •   Despite the AC Panel set in place to look at the Artemis crash in-depth saying that the teams should, "...suspend all sailing in AC72 and AC45 catamarans until the middle of next week," It looks as if Luna Rossa hit the water today. Shiny! 


#2203 nav

nav

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,022 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 08:50 PM

The link was posted earlier, but for the lazy...

 



#2204 Xlot

Xlot

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,674 posts
  • Location:Rome

Posted 18 May 2013 - 08:51 PM

Paging the intrepid MM to the red phone!!!


Mmh ... I suspect the Spring hormones kicked in, and he's off chasing skirts ..

#2205 Scarecrow

Scarecrow

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,559 posts
  • Location:Melbourne, Aus

Posted 18 May 2013 - 08:59 PM

If Luna Rossa don't follow the oracle example and strip the silver off the wing and make it clear ( at least for this training period), then all their talk and bluster about making the boats safer is just that.

#2206 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 09:05 PM

^ You'd think that for safety reasons you'd only need to make the bottom 20' or so clear to be able to see through down to the structure, the way the wing might collapse under almost scenario. LR may be close to there already.

In the photo above with the GG in the background it's good to see a beefy LR boat in the foreground but absent ACRM-mandated help then I hope there was faster support too.

#2207 Boybland

Boybland

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,718 posts
  • Location:Auckland, New Zealand
  • Interests:Flying sea monsters

Posted 18 May 2013 - 09:10 PM

'September boat' makes little sense to me since OR has to train through the same months as the Challengers, and since they ~have to be ~ prepared to race under even higher wind limits (actually quite a lot higher, too) and since we have not seen OR shying away from heavy conditions even in the very early days of Boat2.

I see no indication through either statements or actions that OR has had any plan whatsoever except to be able to race at the very high end. Read that Nevius line again, about how the Italians are pissed off because OR is apparently 'brushing off' LR's press for lighter limits. How much more bluntly could that point be made?

The OR-is-pushing-for-lighter completely unsubstantiated speculation just doesnt stack up, it is apparently just the product of too-fervent imaginations.

IF anyone, GD or whoever, has a big problem with lower limits the that problem for them quite obviously starts with PB. No other team has proposed it.

I've said all along that teams will press for their own interests, imaginary 'cozy relationships' or not.

 

I agree, if ETNZ think they have an advantage in heavier wind they won't care where the call for lighter winds come from they will be against it, as they should be.

From this point forward it's in it to win it for every team and that includes LR and even Artemis.



#2208 Kiwing

Kiwing

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,336 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 09:15 PM

Ah, but are they Italian skirts?

 

Good luck MM !



#2209 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 18 May 2013 - 09:21 PM

 

^ The request has come from LR. There aren't any other advocates for lowering the wind limit thus far. Your point is?
 
Why wouldn't you produce a boat for September if winning a regatta in September was your goal?

.

Great question but it should be directed at GD as he was the one that first threw a hissy fit and coined the term " September boat ".

 

I missed the "hissy fit" completely. Wasn't it only a statement that the boat is designed for the AC rather than the expected LVC conditions? Can't remember...

 

One man's trash is another's treasure.

 

One man's statement of fact is another's hissy fit  :rolleyes:



#2210 kiwi_bob

kiwi_bob

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 99 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 09:29 PM

With this press conference we are listening to half a conversation, in a foreign language and we are not even sure which of the other three teams it's even aimed at (or a combo of teams). Prefer this to silence, but it's all a bit mysterious...
 
Only thing I'll add is it's all very well the competitors fancying zooming about in 33 knots but the people charged with the rescuing responsibility  (divers etc) should also have a say - they have to be out there and function in what will be pretty extreme conditions too.


#2211 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 18 May 2013 - 09:32 PM

'September boat' makes little sense to me since OR has to train through the same months as the Challengers, and since they ~have to be ~ prepared to race under even higher wind limits (actually quite a lot higher, too) and since we have not seen OR shying away from heavy conditions even in the very early days of Boat2.

I see no indication through either statements or actions that OR has had any plan whatsoever except to be able to race at the very high end. Read that Nevius line again, about how the Italians are pissed off because OR is apparently 'brushing off' LR's press for lighter limits. How much more bluntly could that point be made?

The OR-is-pushing-for-lighter completely unsubstantiated speculation just doesnt stack up, it is apparently just the product of too-fervent imaginations.

IF anyone, GD or whoever, has a big problem with lower limits the that problem for them quite obviously starts with PB. No other team has proposed it.

I've said all along that teams will press for their own interests, imaginary 'cozy relationships' or not.

 

I agree, if ETNZ think they have an advantage in heavier wind they won't care where the call for lighter winds come from they will be against it, as they should be.

From this point forward it's in it to win it for every team and that includes LR and even Artemis.

 

Gotta disagree with you Stinger as it is only compulsory to sail in heavy weather during the cup itself, where the weather is expected to be lighter.

On all days leading up to the cup, they can sit out the weather on the docks.

 

This isn't a criticism btw, its simply acknowledging an advantage they have as defender. One which they would have been silly not to exploit.

Certainly if you look at their boats, they are both built with significantly less hull volume which indicates either:

 

1. They have built a boat for lighter airs than ETNZ (aka September boat), or

2. They feel that they need less volume than ETNZ does for the same conditions.

 

Irrespective of which, ETNZ have a boat that should be more resilient in heavy weather, but they look to have paid a price in terms of weight and wetted surface area.

Therefore, for ETNZ to accept a lowering of the wind range in the AC itself makes ZERO sense to me and makes limited sense to accept a reduction in the LVC.

 

Certainly, reducing the limits to 20 knots is nucking futs.

I don't know if Bertelli is simply posturing for other concessions or what.

But if he is genuinely not comfortable racing his boat in more than 20 knots, he needs to keep good his promise and withdraw from the cup.

 

Seems to me though, that little will change and that the same three challengers will line up under much the same protocol come July.



#2212 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 09:46 PM

^ Largely agreed, and GD has already said that he thinks OR's finer bows will be one of the factors making OR faster upwind for drag reasons.

But again: whether anyone 'expects' September to be light, very heavy, or mostly in-between, you can safely bet your last dollar that OR is willing, designed and prepared to race at the heavy end no matter what GD might imagine. OR will train in that, and in stronger than CSS conditions, to prepare for it.

As several posters have suggested, it's not necessarily even the case the lighter is safer. Foils, and their positive-lift action in bearaways, might be best when under full power if and when you have the high-end ones installed.

20 knots for a top end would greatly change all the parameters at far too late a stage in the game. Would be extremely surprised to see any besides LR propose it, let alone vote for it.

#2213 waterboy42

waterboy42

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 247 posts
  • Location:Auckland or Bay of Islands

Posted 18 May 2013 - 09:53 PM

'September boat' makes little sense to me since OR has to train through the same months as the Challengers, and since they ~have to be ~ prepared to race under even higher wind limits (actually quite a lot higher, too) and since we have not seen OR shying away from heavy conditions even in the very early days of Boat2.
I see no indication through either statements or actions that OR has had any plan whatsoever except to be able to race at the very high end. Read that Nevius line again, about how the Italians are pissed off because OR is apparently 'brushing off' LR's press for lighter limits. How much more bluntly could that point be made?
The OR-is-pushing-for-lighter completely unsubstantiated speculation just just doesnt stack up, it is apparently just the product of too-fervent imaginations.
IF anyone, GD or whoever, has a big problem with lower limits the that problem for them quite obviously starts with PB. No other team has proposed it.
I've said all along that teams will press for their own interests, imaginary 'cozy relationships' or not.

I agree, I think it is more about GD's gamesmanship and trying to needle RC / Oracle off the water in any way possible.
TNZ has learned from the best (especially Dennis Conner) that winning on the water is just part of the contest the battle is waged on every front on and off the water. Mind games are a key tool.
At one stage (probably when DC insisted core samples were drilled in our new boat KZ7) Dennis would have been one of the most despised men in NZ, now he is a hugely popular figure...
I think NZ public grew to appreciate the history, high stakes & intrigue of the cup and even to appreciate the mind games.

Nothing puts a smile on GD's face quicker than getting a rise out of Russell.

LE & RC want high wind ranges for broadcaster certainty, they would be crazy to have a boat not capable of sailing in that wind range.
If I understand correctly, light winds in Sept are anything but guaranteed. There's no reason ETNZ couldn't mode boat 1 for higher wind and make b2 a September boat also. Assuming (but not certain) that you can change your boat during a series, they could sail b1 right up to the LVC final (also assuming they make the final) and preserve b2 for LV final & AC if successful.

#2214 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 09:57 PM

^ Bingo.

Hence RC's comments on stage w GD recently in Auckland when he chastised GD's 'September Boat' comments. RC asked him exactly when he'd become such an expert about OR2's capabilities now, let alone in the boat's future.

#2215 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 18 May 2013 - 10:05 PM

^ Largely agreed, and GD has already said that he thinks OR's finer bows will be one of the factors making OR faster upwind for drag reasons.

But again: whether anyone 'expects' September to be light, very heavy, or mostly in-between, you can safely bet your last dollar that OR is willing, designed and prepared to race at the heavy end no matter what GD might imagine. OR will train in that, and in stronger than CSS conditions, to prepare for it.

As several posters have suggested, it's not necessarily even the case the lighter is safer. Foils, and their positive-lift action in bearaways, might be best when under full power if and when you have the high-end ones installed.

20 knots for a top end would greatly change all the parameters at far too late a stage in the game. Would be extremely surprised to see any besides LR propose it, let alone vote for it.

 

Okie, so now we are on the same page as I don't believe OR have "bet the farm" on light conditions.

For me the term "September boat" is about having a boat moded more towards light winds which is what OR has done.

 

FWIW I don't think having finer bows will win this cup for OR. The cup will be won on foil design, manoeuvrability and wing design IMHO.

At this stage it is reasonable to believe that ETNZ leads the foil design race, but there really isn't enough to suggest anything else.



#2216 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 10:10 PM

I think the shit just hit the fan!

AC34, here we come.

edit, Si, what happened to your post, was responding to that; good line by Bundock

#2217 WetHog

WetHog

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,414 posts
  • Location:Annapolis, MD USA

Posted 18 May 2013 - 10:16 PM

I think the shit just hit the fan!

AC34, here we come.

edit, Si, what happened to your post, was responding to that; good line by Bundock


Can you paraphrase the mysterious post you responded too. I be intrigued.

WetHog

#2218 icupusa

icupusa

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 103 posts
  • Location:San Francisco | New York
  • Interests:The water and everything that goes in it

Posted 18 May 2013 - 10:20 PM

Prada says We are sailing and are

 

                http://acworldseries...-up-pradas.html



#2219 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 10:24 PM

FWIW I don't think having finer bows will win this cup for OR. The cup will be won on foil design, manoeuvrability and wing design IMHO.

Agreed. Finer bows may very well help upwind as GD says; but his contention that they will hurt OR in 'downwind' has yet to be proven and other factors will matter more anyway.

What a bunch of knuckleheads, I can't wait for the start gun.

#2220 Rohanoz

Rohanoz

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,490 posts
  • Location:Australian East Coast
  • Interests:A bad day sailing is still better than a good day at work.

Posted 18 May 2013 - 10:31 PM

And in flaunting the 'no-sail' directive, it appears the review committee have taken a similar level of stature and powers to the UN...

What will happen, will happen.
Bring on the 72's!

#2221 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 10:33 PM

Prada says We are sailing and are
 
                http://acworldseries...-up-pradas.html

Why do you keep posting links to your own site, that contain material already pointed to long ago at the source sites?

Bonus points for the answer to this: How many sites and twitter accounts and SAAC names do you use, and for what reasons are there so many?

#2222 KiwiJoker

KiwiJoker

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,748 posts
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 18 May 2013 - 10:37 PM

The take by Nevius at the SF Chronicle

http://www.sfgate.co...nds-4527275.php

 

SWS will like this.  Proof positive that his hometown has another homegrown expert like Dana J.  



#2223 Monster Mash

Monster Mash

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,725 posts
  • Location:SF Bay Area

Posted 18 May 2013 - 11:26 PM

Luna Rossa is launching and recovering without rudders.

Does TNZ do the same?

 

DSC_0032_zpse3e489f2.jpg



#2224 Barnyb

Barnyb

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,242 posts
  • Location:New Zealand

Posted 18 May 2013 - 11:31 PM

L’AC72 Luna Rossa è uscita questa mattina per un primo allenamento nella baia di San Francisco. Le condizioni di vento leggero (3 nodi), in progressivo aumento fino a 12 nodi, hanno consentito all’equipaggio di effettuare un significativo numero di manovre.

This morning the Luna Rossa AC72 sailed for the first time in the bay of San Francisco. The light winds (3 knots), that increased up to 12, allowed the crew to carry out an extensive number of maneuvers.

Attached Files



#2225 Rohanoz

Rohanoz

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,490 posts
  • Location:Australian East Coast
  • Interests:A bad day sailing is still better than a good day at work.

Posted 18 May 2013 - 11:32 PM

^
Pretty sure they do. That's why there aren't too many shots of their rudders and Ts on the hard.

Related lifting question...
Do OR fit the bow brace before lifting out of the water? Or is it only when the rig is being removed?

#2226 Monster Mash

Monster Mash

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,725 posts
  • Location:SF Bay Area

Posted 18 May 2013 - 11:46 PM

From B2 first launch day

Not sure if its SOP or not.

 

DSC_0017_zps8be48c78.jpg



#2227 Terry Hollis

Terry Hollis

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 877 posts
  • Location:Auckland New Zealand

Posted 18 May 2013 - 11:46 PM

Luna Rossa foiling on the San Francisco Bay
  • © Luna Rossa/Carlo Borlenghi

    LunaRossaSF13cb_05714.jpg
  •  

 

More pics here ..

 

http://luna-rossa-ch...n-francisco-bay



#2228 the paradox of thrift

the paradox of thrift

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,375 posts
  • Location:Mos-Vegas
  • Interests:I like sailing

Posted 18 May 2013 - 11:50 PM

I love it. GO LUNA ROSSA! It's great to see them out on the water again.



#2229 Enzedel 92

Enzedel 92

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,776 posts

Posted 18 May 2013 - 11:55 PM

WTH?  PB flys in, throws out a grenade and now LR foiling on SF bay?

 

haha.



#2230 Monster Mash

Monster Mash

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,725 posts
  • Location:SF Bay Area

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:02 AM

^

Didn't PB say he came here for a yacht race, not a tv show. :P



#2231 Enzedel 92

Enzedel 92

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,776 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:03 AM

Surly, where are you!!!!?????



#2232 ADCAT

ADCAT

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 170 posts
  • Location:San Francisco
  • Interests:Whirled Peas

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:13 AM

They did look shiny though, got some video on my phone but have no idea how to post it. As soon as the wind picked up they headed home, which is a shame because it has turned out to be a warm ,mellow day on SF Bay.



#2233 zillafreak

zillafreak

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 375 posts
  • Location:Newport Beach

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:24 AM

Now we're talking..back to boat porn! Nice foiling for a claimed 3-12 knots breeze.



#2234 Tornado-Cat

Tornado-Cat

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,704 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:27 AM

Luna Rossa foiling on the San Francisco Bay

  • © Luna Rossa/Carlo Borlenghi

    LunaRossaSF13cb_05714.jpg
  •  

 

 

 

http://luna-rossa-ch...n-francisco-bay

Nice foiling with no twist in SF with 8 kts of wind :)



#2235 icupusa

icupusa

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 103 posts
  • Location:San Francisco | New York
  • Interests:The water and everything that goes in it

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:35 AM

PRADA LUNA ROSSA  CARLOS VIEW 

http://www.icupusa.c...rada-flys-/cm8j

 

 

@SINGRAY YOU HAVE THESE ? 



#2236 NZL3481

NZL3481

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 691 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:40 AM

'September boat' makes little sense to me since OR has to train through the same months as the Challengers, and since they ~have to be ~ prepared to race under even higher wind limits (actually quite a lot higher, too) and since we have not seen OR shying away from heavy conditions even in the very early days of Boat2.
I see no indication through either statements or actions that OR has had any plan whatsoever except to be able to race at the very high end. Read that Nevius line again, about how the Italians are pissed off because OR is apparently 'brushing off' LR's press for lighter limits. How much more bluntly could that point be made?
The OR-is-pushing-for-lighter completely unsubstantiated speculation just just doesnt stack up, it is apparently just the product of too-fervent imaginations.
IF anyone, GD or whoever, has a big problem with lower limits the that problem for them quite obviously starts with PB. No other team has proposed it.
I've said all along that teams will press for their own interests, imaginary 'cozy relationships' or not.

I agree, I think it is more about GD's gamesmanship and trying to needle RC / Oracle off the water in any way possible.
TNZ has learned from the best (especially Dennis Conner) that winning on the water is just part of the contest the battle is waged on every front on and off the water. Mind games are a key tool.
At one stage (probably when DC insisted core samples were drilled in our new boat KZ7) Dennis would have been one of the most despised men in NZ, now he is a hugely popular figure...
I think NZ public grew to appreciate the history, high stakes & intrigue of the cup and even to appreciate the mind games.

Nothing puts a smile on GD's face quicker than getting a rise out of Russell.

LE & RC want high wind ranges for broadcaster certainty, they would be crazy to have a boat not capable of sailing in that wind range.
If I understand correctly, light winds in Sept are anything but guaranteed. There's no reason ETNZ couldn't mode boat 1 for higher wind and make b2 a September boat also. Assuming (but not certain) that you can change your boat during a series, they could sail b1 right up to the LVC final (also assuming they make the final) and preserve b2 for LV final & AC if successful.

You may find that boat 1 has been re-moded for September.



#2237 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:43 AM

^^ Okay - First time for me. Great Carlo B photos and yes, a nice presentation of them.

#2238 Tornado-Cat

Tornado-Cat

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,704 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:46 AM

That is what we can call good advertisement and communication for Prada in the US



#2239 the paradox of thrift

the paradox of thrift

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,375 posts
  • Location:Mos-Vegas
  • Interests:I like sailing

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:48 AM

^

Didn't PB say he came here for a yacht race, not a tv show. :P

 

Yes. A regatta. Fancy that.



#2240 icupusa

icupusa

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 103 posts
  • Location:San Francisco | New York
  • Interests:The water and everything that goes in it

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:51 AM

Prada says We are sailing and are
 
                http://acworldseries...-up-pradas.html

Why do you keep posting links to your own site, that contain material already pointed to long ago at the source sites?

Bonus points for the answer to this: How many sites and twitter accounts and SAAC names do you use, and for what reasons are there so many?

First answer post when i get them second I cant get into my Winged account as explained in my first icup post third answer isailmedia group has several let me see if I can  list them all for you now 

Twitter 

1. @isailmedia

2. @acws45 

3. @icupusa

 

Tumblr.

4  http://acworldseries.tumblr.com/

 

As i sad i couldnt retrive my winged account only active one I use on SA . after waiting for a reset i opened new account because I could not reset .

 

How many points 



#2241 Sean

Sean

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,291 posts
  • Location:Sag Harbor, NY

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:55 AM

There's been a lot of talk about "September" sailing being significantly lighter than July/August. Anybody have actual historical data for the course area? All I could find was from the airport, but I suspect conditions may be different there. At the airport, for what it's worth, there seems to be only a couple mph difference in average velocity from August to September. From http://weatherspark....a-United-States

Attached Files



#2242 icupusa

icupusa

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 103 posts
  • Location:San Francisco | New York
  • Interests:The water and everything that goes in it

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:57 AM

^^ Okay - First time for me. Great Carlo B photos and yes, a nice presentation of them.

Thank you , its been a on going project been little busy cleaning from sandy The fact is its easier to share photos with a link and alot easier on SA servers .on the medium questions Im trying develop  a app for our imedia page prototype seen here http://www.icupusa.com/#!imedia/ct74



#2243 ro!

ro!

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,191 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:09 AM

^^ Okay - First time for me. Great Carlo B photos and yes, a nice presentation of them.

Thank you , its been a on going project been little busy cleaning from sandy The fact is its easier to share photos with a link and alot easier on SA servers .on the medium questions Im trying develop  a app for our imedia page prototype seen here http://www.icupusa.com/#!imedia/ct74

Nice...
But please don't forget to send them to spinbot, so that he can post them on his forum....

#2244 Tornado-Cat

Tornado-Cat

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,704 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:17 AM

There's been a lot of talk about "September" sailing being significantly lighter than July/August. Anybody have actual historical data for the course area? All I could find was from the airport, but I suspect conditions may be different there. At the airport, for what it's worth, there seems to be only a couple mph difference in average velocity from August to September. From http://weatherspark....a-United-States

I am sure that our bay specialist the SWallower wil provide us with more specific data



#2245 Kiwing

Kiwing

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,336 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:29 AM

You may find that boat 1 has been re-moded for September.

 

You may find B1 re-moded for LVC !



#2246 eric e

eric e

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,451 posts
  • Location:the far east

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:33 AM

The idea of lowering wind limits is naive, unfair and exactly the sort of non-decision I would expect the non-independent review sham to come up with. I don't know why PB is bringing it up. Both boats that have gone over went over well, well inside the wind limits. The only boat that we know that has sailed up to the wind limit - ETNZ - seemed to have quite a good time. This is because they have quite a safe boat. A1 and OR1 were not good boats. 

 

So what can the review say - we are going to halve the wind limit so the rickety boats some competitors have made will be safe? Because over 15 knots, two boats have proved that they are not. It looks like OR2 has joined LR and ETNZ in producing a good boat. Hopefully AR2 will be as well. 

 

It's not about wind limits - it's about having a good enough boat for the job. Lots of people on this site knocked the ENTZ approach, saying it was all muscle and no sophistication. Their design is so far the only one that has stood up.

+1



#2247 Tornado-Cat

Tornado-Cat

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,704 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:35 AM

BTW, LR is the best boat for strong wind: stiff whit lots of volume in the bows.



#2248 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:37 AM

You may find that boat 1 has been re-moded for September.

 

You may find B1 re-moded for LVC !

 

I find it terribly doubtful that they would re-mode boat 1 for September when B2 is far closer to a September boat than B1.

So yeah, I agree with Kiwing. If they remode boat 1, it will likely be for LVC.

 

But doG (and ETNZ) only know



#2249 hoom

hoom

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,879 posts
  • Location:Orkland

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:38 AM

OK, I don't get it :unsure:

 

Demands better safety support: helicopters divers etc.

Then goes out foiling during the requested stand down period.

 

 

On the one hand, under 12kt foiling with only jib up is pretty impressive.

Shows confidence that the ETNZ design isn't going to implode on first contact with The Bay (dun dun dah!).

Arguably insensitive & in conflict with request for better safety measures but also if they felt ready & confident in their boat they shouldn't miss out on competitive advantage of getting there before ETNZ.



#2250 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:49 AM

OK, I don't get it :unsure:

 

Demands better safety support: helicopters divers etc.

Then goes out foiling during the requested stand down period.

 

 

On the one hand, under 12kt foiling with only jib up is pretty impressive.

Shows confidence that the ETNZ design isn't going to implode on first contact with The Bay (dun dun dah!).

Arguably insensitive & in conflict with request for better safety measures but also if they felt ready & confident in their boat they shouldn't miss out on competitive advantage of getting there before ETNZ.

 

Off his meds it would seem.



#2251 SW Sailor

SW Sailor

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,445 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 04:25 AM

Luna Rossa foiling on the San Francisco Bay

  • © Luna Rossa/Carlo Borlenghi

    LunaRossaSF13cb_05714.jpg
  •  

 

More pics here ..

 

http://luna-rossa-ch...n-francisco-bay

 

Was out on the water this morning in the same area - saw them tooling around back and forth east of Alcatraz ~ 9:30 in glass like conditions. Later saw them head for the gate and eventually the city front in search of pressure. As of ~ 11:00 they were on the city front and not foiling in 8 knots of wind, as we sailed right by them about three times.

 

Good to see them on the water.

 

Where again are all those posters that were preciously screaming about how unfair wind limits are?



#2252 NZL3481

NZL3481

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 691 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 05:16 AM

 

You may find that boat 1 has been re-moded for September.

 

You may find B1 re-moded for LVC !

 

I find it terribly doubtful that they would re-mode boat 1 for September when B2 is far closer to a September boat than B1.

So yeah, I agree with Kiwing. If they remode boat 1, it will likely be for LVC.

 

But doG (and ETNZ) only know

Maybe, but given boat 1 may not be here before the start of LVC, it would appear unlikely that would be the case, particularly when they have to then put the boat together when it arrives. I would have thought they may take a bit of a calculated risk in modifying boat 1 to be the next generation boat and use NZA as the fall back position if it didn't work which is what they did back in 95 with 32 & 38.

 

Without doubt ETNZ are the benchmark when it comes to sailing in big breeze. By their own admission they need to improve down the wind range more so than anywhere else.

 

There is no way boat 1 will be sailing in 6 weeks time. NZA will be the boat they take into the start of the LVC.



#2253 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 19 May 2013 - 05:38 AM

 

 

You may find that boat 1 has been re-moded for September.

 

You may find B1 re-moded for LVC !

 

I find it terribly doubtful that they would re-mode boat 1 for September when B2 is far closer to a September boat than B1.

So yeah, I agree with Kiwing. If they remode boat 1, it will likely be for LVC.

 

But doG (and ETNZ) only know

Maybe, but given boat 1 may not be here before the start of LVC, it would appear unlikely that would be the case, particularly when they have to then put the boat together when it arrives. I would have thought they may take a bit of a calculated risk in modifying boat 1 to be the next generation boat and use NZA as the fall back position if it didn't work which is what they did back in 95 with 32 & 38.

 

Without doubt ETNZ are the benchmark when it comes to sailing in big breeze. By their own admission they need to improve down the wind range more so than anywhere else.

 

There is no way boat 1 will be sailing in 6 weeks time. NZA will be the boat they take into the start of the LVC.

 

But could it be sailing in 11 weeks when the LVC actually starts to matter? I'm not saying this is the case, just offering a possible scenario



#2254 fireball

fireball

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 709 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 05:49 AM

Why wouldn't the Italians go sailing? The conditions were perfect for their first sail in SF.

 

The review committee has no teeth. It just has an advisory role. This is going to be a bit of mess: the teams will use the review committee to bolster their case when it suits them -  and completely ignore it when it doesn't.



#2255 NZL3481

NZL3481

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 691 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 06:12 AM

 

 

 

You may find that boat 1 has been re-moded for September.

 

You may find B1 re-moded for LVC !

 

I find it terribly doubtful that they would re-mode boat 1 for September when B2 is far closer to a September boat than B1.

So yeah, I agree with Kiwing. If they remode boat 1, it will likely be for LVC.

 

But doG (and ETNZ) only know

Maybe, but given boat 1 may not be here before the start of LVC, it would appear unlikely that would be the case, particularly when they have to then put the boat together when it arrives. I would have thought they may take a bit of a calculated risk in modifying boat 1 to be the next generation boat and use NZA as the fall back position if it didn't work which is what they did back in 95 with 32 & 38.

 

Without doubt ETNZ are the benchmark when it comes to sailing in big breeze. By their own admission they need to improve down the wind range more so than anywhere else.

 

There is no way boat 1 will be sailing in 6 weeks time. NZA will be the boat they take into the start of the LVC.

 

But could it be sailing in 11 weeks when the LVC actually starts to matter? I'm not saying this is the case, just offering a possible scenario

I have no doubt the boat will be sailing in 11 weeks. The only place ETNZ have to prove their credentials is in the lower wind ranges where practically everyone else has been training, including OR.

 

My understanding is boat 1 has undergone significant surgery to become a medium air upwind boat. If it was an LVC boat, I'm not sure the changes to the boat would be as significant.



#2256 SW Sailor

SW Sailor

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,445 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 06:40 AM

Why wouldn't the Italians go sailing? The conditions were perfect for their first sail in SF.

 

The review committee has no teeth. It just has an advisory role. This is going to be a bit of mess: the teams will use the review committee to bolster their case when it suits them -  and completely ignore it when it doesn't.

 

They certainly seemed to think so today - no hesitation to hit the water.

 

How about those 20 knot wind limits ?

 

They must be in collusion with TNZ :)



#2257 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 19 May 2013 - 07:50 AM

I have no doubt the boat will be sailing in 11 weeks. The only place ETNZ have to prove their credentials is in the lower wind ranges where practically everyone else has been training, including OR.

 

My understanding is boat 1 has undergone significant surgery to become a medium air upwind boat. If it was an LVC boat, I'm not sure the changes to the boat would be as significant.

 

Hmmm, I just find it odd that they would make mods to boat 1 to make it their light wind boat when it is the boat that is currently moded most towards heavier conditions.

Why not re-mode boat 2 which would need fewer mods???



#2258 DA-WOODY

DA-WOODY

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 24,313 posts
  • Location:I'm in Sunny..-. Warm..& ..Dry San Diego . and your not :-)
  • Interests:Prime + 1 3/4

    COUGARS COUGARS & More COUGARS

Posted 19 May 2013 - 08:01 AM

There's been a lot of talk about "September" sailing being significantly lighter than July/August. Anybody have actual historical data for the course area? All I could find was from the airport, but I suspect conditions may be different there. At the airport, for what it's worth, there seems to be only a couple mph difference in average velocity from August to September. From http://weatherspark....a-United-States

 

 

I dunno on OCT.5th I could barely open the West door on the upper level (west end) of GGYC to step out

 

I could not believe the lack of white caps (Incoming Flood & Wind)

 

this is one of the vid's I shot

 

Friend of mine came in from Media Boat SOAKING - SHIVERING w Blue Lips :o Fack That !!!!!! I suggested he go get checked out (He's on here)

 

Anyway check out the Vid from OCT - 5 - 2012  AC-45s / FRISCO :)

 

and figure the wind speed from the speed of the boats (the Vid does the Wind No Justice)

 



#2259 DA-WOODY

DA-WOODY

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 24,313 posts
  • Location:I'm in Sunny..-. Warm..& ..Dry San Diego . and your not :-)
  • Interests:Prime + 1 3/4

    COUGARS COUGARS & More COUGARS

Posted 19 May 2013 - 08:14 AM

NOT to hex LR but going out on times like these are the times you likely shall regret

 

Oh ya Yer Up to It an ALL

 

But Just like when your Mom said "I don't think you should do that Today"

 

Sure as Shit "THAT" is when you twist your ankle (or Whatever)

 

Jus sayin



#2260 Terry Hollis

Terry Hollis

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 877 posts
  • Location:Auckland New Zealand

Posted 19 May 2013 - 08:30 AM

I have no doubt the boat will be sailing in 11 weeks. The only place ETNZ have to prove their credentials is in the lower wind ranges where practically everyone else has been training, including OR.

 

My understanding is boat 1 has undergone significant surgery to become a medium air upwind boat. If it was an LVC boat, I'm not sure the changes to the boat would be as significant.

 

Hmmm, I just find it odd that they would make mods to boat 1 to make it their light wind boat when it is the boat that is currently moded most towards heavier conditions.

Why not re-mode boat 2 which would need fewer mods???

 

Surely a re-mode of b2 would cost them sailing time and if the re-mode was unsuccessful they would have two slow boats ..

 

To me it is more logical to rebuild b1 .. it is done by Cooksons so it can be quite extensive and will amount to b3 .. In the meantime they have a fast boat for the LV series and can keep their options open about which boat they will use in the AC .



#2261 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 19 May 2013 - 08:35 AM

 

I have no doubt the boat will be sailing in 11 weeks. The only place ETNZ have to prove their credentials is in the lower wind ranges where practically everyone else has been training, including OR.

 

My understanding is boat 1 has undergone significant surgery to become a medium air upwind boat. If it was an LVC boat, I'm not sure the changes to the boat would be as significant.

 

Hmmm, I just find it odd that they would make mods to boat 1 to make it their light wind boat when it is the boat that is currently moded most towards heavier conditions.

Why not re-mode boat 2 which would need fewer mods???

 

Surely a re-mode of b2 would cost them sailing time and if the re-mode was unsuccessful they would have two slow boats ..

 

To me it is more logical to rebuild b1 .. it is done by Cooksons so it can be quite extensive and will amount to b3 .. In the meantime they have a fast boat for the LV series and can keep their options open about which boat they will use in the AC .

 

Whilst I am dubious, I hope you're right Terry



#2262 nav

nav

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,022 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 10:56 AM

I have no doubt the boat will be sailing in 11 weeks. The only place ETNZ have to prove their credentials is in the lower wind ranges where practically everyone else has been training, including OR.

 

My understanding is boat 1 has undergone significant surgery to become a medium air upwind boat. If it was an LVC boat, I'm not sure the changes to the boat would be as significant.

 

:)
 



#2263 nav

nav

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,022 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 11:02 AM

Luna Rossa is launching and recovering without rudders.

Does TNZ do the same?

 

DSC_0032_zpse3e489f2.jpg


 

 

DSC_0079_zps508fe6b6.jpg

 

 

I wonder if they'll pimp their dolly into a high lift like OTUSA so they can leave the rudders in?
 



#2264 nav

nav

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,022 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 11:52 AM

Latest in the Prada line..

6497a5_70cbe677c640e562071e4dc428a97784.

 © Luna Rossa by Carlo Borlinghi - all rights reserved

 

Silver armour on a silver steed - very retro

 

AACA2002ArmorHorse1.jpg



#2265 nav

nav

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,022 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:03 PM

935589_596216930402724_895653167_n.jpg

 

942793_596216950402722_443872322_n.jpg

 

923046_596217000402717_2101110201_n.jpg

 

486873_596217063736044_1388907007_n.jpg

 

946883_596217033736047_1189377140_n.jpg

all photos © Luna Rossa by Carlo Borlenghi - all rights reserved



#2266 nav

nav

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,022 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:07 PM

947117_596217263736024_1670518357_n.jpg

 

487439_596217183736032_1559460044_n.jpg

 

935323_596217283736022_1877802697_n.jpg

 

942840_596217133736037_1144228386_n.jpg

 

934055_596217367069347_1262864183_n.jpg

all photos © Luna Rossa by Carlo Borlenghi - all rights reserved https://www.facebook...&type=1



#2267 eric e

eric e

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,451 posts
  • Location:the far east

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:04 PM

947117_596217263736024_1670518357_n.jpg

 

she's a good looking boat

 

the red goes well with the bridge

 

the silver with the sky



#2268 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:31 PM

Agreed, still looks really great after the mods.

Are there any photos from yesterday of them foiling on the stbd foil?

#2269 zillafreak

zillafreak

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 375 posts
  • Location:Newport Beach

Posted 19 May 2013 - 01:39 PM

Atsa one gooda looking boat ima gonna tell you.



#2270 ~Stingray~

~Stingray~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,760 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 02:02 PM

Agreed, still looks really great after the mods.

Are there any photos from yesterday of them foiling on the stbd foil?

A: Yes, third photo down at http://www.sail-worl...isco-Bay/109611

#2271 Love2Sail

Love2Sail

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 388 posts
  • Location:Iowa city, Iowa

Posted 19 May 2013 - 02:58 PM

So the fact that LR went out sailing yesterday tells me two things.

A ) The review committee is no more than a show.
B ) The teams know what caused the accident and are comfortable (at least LR) with sailing their boats on SF bay.

IMHO

#2272 Monster Mash

Monster Mash

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,725 posts
  • Location:SF Bay Area

Posted 19 May 2013 - 04:50 PM

That Luna Rossa is one magical boat.

Here she is foiling in SF Bay with all her aero fairings.

 

LunaRossaSF13cb_057141_zps6d4fa3d4.jpg

 

And here she is during recovery without all her aero fairings. 

DSC_00102_zpsedea9b88.jpg



#2273 ~HHN92~

~HHN92~

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,130 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 05:02 PM

^^ maybe they are taken off so the rudders can be pulled?



#2274 Monster Mash

Monster Mash

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,725 posts
  • Location:SF Bay Area

Posted 19 May 2013 - 05:10 PM

^^ maybe they are taken off so the rudders can be pulled?

 

Bingo !



#2275 88 Tornado Crew

88 Tornado Crew

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 26 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 05:20 PM

Removable fariings so they can attach the haul out straps.



#2276 Monster Mash

Monster Mash

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,725 posts
  • Location:SF Bay Area

Posted 19 May 2013 - 05:33 PM

Removable fariings so they can attach the haul out straps.

 

I think its for rudder access. 

My pictures of the lifting harness don't show anything connected to the rear beam.



#2277 Monster Mash

Monster Mash

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,725 posts
  • Location:SF Bay Area

Posted 19 May 2013 - 05:37 PM

There was a LOUD bang when they first took up the tension on the lifting harness.  One of those O'shit moments.

They sent a crew up to take a look then lowered the harness and regrouped.

It must not have been anything serious because they hooked up again and recovered LR.



#2278 waterboy42

waterboy42

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 247 posts
  • Location:Auckland or Bay of Islands

Posted 19 May 2013 - 06:46 PM

So the fact that LR went out sailing yesterday tells me two things.A ) The review committee is no more than a show.B ) The teams know what caused the accident and are comfortable (at least LR) with sailing their boats on SF bay.IMHO



In some ways I agree with LR's actions.

1) If you really want to honour the memory of a sailor, isn't the best way to go sailing?

2) I'm not sure if LR believe they can beat ETNZ (unless they have some advantages in foil technology).
If this is the case then Artemis is their main competitive focus. It's more fun being LVC runner up in history books than nowhere. All that the delay is doing for them is rewarding their main competitor for their ineptitude and giving them a catch up chance.

3) It's a great way to send a message to the review committee that these boats work fine.

#2279 maxmini

maxmini

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,974 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 07:38 PM

Looks like they are off and running strong which is great to see.LR is obviously  on a mission and every day they are on the water that their number one challenge, Emirates, isn't is a benefit.



#2280 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 19 May 2013 - 07:42 PM

There was a LOUD bang when they first took up the tension on the lifting harness.  One of those O'shit moments.

They sent a crew up to take a look then lowered the harness and regrouped.

It must not have been anything serious because they hooked up again and recovered LR.

 

 

Hope they didn't shag their main beam like AR did when first hitting the bay :unsure:



#2281 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 19 May 2013 - 07:45 PM

So the fact that LR went out sailing yesterday tells me two things.A ) The review committee is no more than a show.B ) The teams know what caused the accident and are comfortable (at least LR) with sailing their boats on SF bay.IMHO



In some ways I agree with LR's actions.

1) If you really want to honour the memory of a sailor, isn't the best way to go sailing?

2) I'm not sure if LR believe they can beat ETNZ (unless they have some advantages in foil technology).
If this is the case then Artemis is their main competitive focus. It's more fun being LVC runner up in history books than nowhere. All that the delay is doing for them is rewarding their main competitor for their ineptitude and giving them a catch up chance.

3) It's a great way to send a message to the review committee that these boats work fine.

 

If you believe what Jimmy said about OR having never observed LR beating ETNZ in a matchup, then their chances of beating ETNZ are pretty low.

That said, presumably LR will add some "bits" to their boat before the LVC starts.



#2282 maxmini

maxmini

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,974 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 07:55 PM

So the fact that LR went out sailing yesterday tells me two things.A ) The review committee is no more than a show.B ) The teams know what caused the accident and are comfortable (at least LR) with sailing their boats on SF bay.IMHO



In some ways I agree with LR's actions.

1) If you really want to honour the memory of a sailor, isn't the best way to go sailing?

2) I'm not sure if LR believe they can beat ETNZ (unless they have some advantages in foil technology).
If this is the case then Artemis is their main competitive focus. It's more fun being LVC runner up in history books than nowhere. All that the delay is doing for them is rewarding their main competitor for their ineptitude and giving them a catch up chance.

3) It's a great way to send a message to the review committee that these boats work fine.

 

 

LR would not be out there as early as possible if they didn't think they had a shot at their real challenge ET.

 

Everyone including the review committee knew the boats work fine in a max of 12 kts and flat water.



#2283 K38BOB

K38BOB

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,453 posts
  • Location:Bay Area

Posted 19 May 2013 - 08:36 PM

^
Pretty sure they do. That's why there aren't too many shots of their rudders and Ts on the hard.

Related lifting question...
Do OR fit the bow brace before lifting out of the water? Or is it only when the rig is being removed?

The brace is to hold the prodder up wo headstay...so its fitted when no headstay



#2284 K38BOB

K38BOB

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,453 posts
  • Location:Bay Area

Posted 19 May 2013 - 08:42 PM

Why wouldn't the Italians go sailing? The conditions were perfect for their first sail in SF.

 

The review committee has no teeth. It just has an advisory role. This is going to be a bit of mess: the teams will use the review committee to bolster their case when it suits them -  and completely ignore it when it doesn't.

The USCG reads recommendations and issues marine event permits



#2285 Rohanoz

Rohanoz

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,490 posts
  • Location:Australian East Coast
  • Interests:A bad day sailing is still better than a good day at work.

Posted 19 May 2013 - 10:11 PM


^
Pretty sure they do. That's why there aren't too many shots of their rudders and Ts on the hard.

Related lifting question...
Do OR fit the bow brace before lifting out of the water? Or is it only when the rig is being removed?

The brace is to hold the prodder up wo headstay...so its fitted when no headstay

Tnx. Just had me wondering about the lack of a similar thing on the ETNZ and LR boats.
Artemis had the upside down one, so obviously the kiwi design has inherent static strength built in.

#2286 nav

nav

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,022 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 11:30 PM

 


^
Pretty sure they do. That's why there aren't too many shots of their rudders and Ts on the hard.

Related lifting question...
Do OR fit the bow brace before lifting out of the water? Or is it only when the rig is being removed?

The brace is to hold the prodder up wo headstay...so its fitted when no headstay

Tnx. Just had me wondering about the lack of a similar thing on the ETNZ and LR boats.
Artemis had the upside down one, so obviously the kiwi design has inherent static strength built in.

 

 

LR has 2 of these mounted for each haul out...

921054_495408073846705_743304714_o.jpg



#2287 RMac

RMac

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 493 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 11:31 PM

I haven't had much of an opinion of LR aside from a) me likey shiny, B) root for them when in Naples but I find it pretty bizarre and obnoxious that the syndicate head first makes public comments talking about how the event isn't safe, and rides the accident with AR to get his voice heard, and then goes out sailing right after the official group concerned with the accident says don't sail for a few he takes the boat out.  



#2288 the paradox of thrift

the paradox of thrift

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,375 posts
  • Location:Mos-Vegas
  • Interests:I like sailing

Posted 19 May 2013 - 11:38 PM

I haven't had much of an opinion of LR aside from a) me likey shiny, B) root for them when in Naples but I find it pretty bizarre and obnoxious that the syndicate head first makes public comments talking about how the event isn't safe, and rides the accident with AR to get his voice heard, and then goes out sailing right after the official group concerned with the accident says don't sail for a few he takes the boat out.  

 

Did you watch the press conference?



#2289 hoom

hoom

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,879 posts
  • Location:Orkland

Posted 19 May 2013 - 11:50 PM

I think its for rudder access.

I don't think so, the top of the stock is forward of the main beam & steering rods go through the front fairing.



#2290 Terry Hollis

Terry Hollis

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 877 posts
  • Location:Auckland New Zealand

Posted 19 May 2013 - 11:58 PM

I haven't had much of an opinion of LR aside from a) me likey shiny, B) root for them when in Naples but I find it pretty bizarre and obnoxious that the syndicate head first makes public comments talking about how the event isn't safe, and rides the accident with AR to get his voice heard, and then goes out sailing right after the official group concerned with the accident says don't sail for a few he takes the boat out.  

 

It is not clear to the general public that the "official group" is just a toothless adviser .. by defying them in that way LR are making the point a little clearer .. At the end of the day the contestants make the rules .



#2291 NZL3481

NZL3481

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 691 posts

Posted 20 May 2013 - 12:13 AM

947117_596217263736024_1670518357_n.jpg

 

she's a good looking boat

 

the red goes well with the bridge

 

the silver with the sky

Lets hope they can create history by being the worlds first AC72 not to end up on its roof in San Francisco!



#2292 KiwiJoker

KiwiJoker

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,748 posts
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 20 May 2013 - 01:27 AM

I haven't had much of an opinion of LR aside from a) me likey shiny, B) root for them when in Naples but I find it pretty bizarre and obnoxious that the syndicate head first makes public comments talking about how the event isn't safe, and rides the accident with AR to get his voice heard, and then goes out sailing right after the official group concerned with the accident says don't sail for a few he takes the boat out.  

 

It is not clear to the general public that the "official group" is just a toothless adviser .. by defying them in that way LR are making the point a little clearer .. At the end of the day the contestants make the rules .

 

Terry, you say "toothless adviser" as if it were some kind of defect. Not an exact parallel but in most countries Coroners have the responsibility of investigating and recommending but not much more.

 

The key role of the panel is to make findings on fact and make recommendations. Not only is it not within their remit but it is beyond their pay grade to make and enforce substantive changes.

 

And, once they have reported, it's as you say, up to the contestants and ACEA/ACRM to implement any changes.



#2293 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 20 May 2013 - 01:34 AM

^

I don't think much will be changed other than extra safety gear etc...

I also think that if Mr Bertelli draws a line in the sand over 20 knots of wind, he will be shit outta luck.



#2294 Terry Hollis

Terry Hollis

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 877 posts
  • Location:Auckland New Zealand

Posted 20 May 2013 - 01:41 AM

 

I haven't had much of an opinion of LR aside from a) me likey shiny, B) root for them when in Naples but I find it pretty bizarre and obnoxious that the syndicate head first makes public comments talking about how the event isn't safe, and rides the accident with AR to get his voice heard, and then goes out sailing right after the official group concerned with the accident says don't sail for a few he takes the boat out.  

 

It is not clear to the general public that the "official group" is just a toothless adviser .. by defying them in that way LR are making the point a little clearer .. At the end of the day the contestants make the rules .

 

Terry, you say "toothless adviser" as if it were some kind of defect. Not an exact parallel but in most countries Coroners have the responsibility of investigating and recommending but not much more.

 

The key role of the panel is to make findings on fact and make recommendations. Not only is it not within their remit but it is beyond their pay grade to make and enforce substantive changes.

 

And, once they have reported, it's as you say, up to the contestants and ACEA/ACRM to implement any changes.

 

It was not my intention to indicate that "toothless adviser" was a defect .. what I am trying to say is that the general public and ignorant journalists do not know how the AC works .. LR is helping to educate them ..



#2295 knarly34

knarly34

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,260 posts
  • Location:New Zealand

Posted 20 May 2013 - 01:53 AM

947117_596217263736024_1670518357_n.jpg

 

she's a good looking boat

 

the red goes well with the bridge

 

the silver with the sky

Quite easily one of the most slickest graphic jobs on an AC boat ever.

 

True Italian class.

 

Rock on Luna Rossa even though I am an ETNZ supporter, LR kicks ass in a whole different way



#2296 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 20 May 2013 - 02:04 AM

^ Regardless of how their boats have performed, they have always looked the shizzle



#2297 Indio

Indio

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,712 posts
  • Location:Auckland

Posted 20 May 2013 - 02:06 AM

 

 

I haven't had much of an opinion of LR aside from a) me likey shiny, B) root for them when in Naples but I find it pretty bizarre and obnoxious that the syndicate head first makes public comments talking about how the event isn't safe, and rides the accident with AR to get his voice heard, and then goes out sailing right after the official group concerned with the accident says don't sail for a few he takes the boat out.  

 

It is not clear to the general public that the "official group" is just a toothless adviser .. by defying them in that way LR are making the point a little clearer .. At the end of the day the contestants make the rules .

 

Terry, you say "toothless adviser" as if it were some kind of defect. Not an exact parallel but in most countries Coroners have the responsibility of investigating and recommending but not much more.

 

The key role of the panel is to make findings on fact and make recommendations. Not only is it not within their remit but it is beyond their pay grade to make and enforce substantive changes.

 

And, once they have reported, it's as you say, up to the contestants and ACEA/ACRM to implement any changes.

 

It was not my intention to indicate that "toothless adviser" was a defect .. what I am trying to say is that the general public and ignorant journalists do not know how the AC works .. LR is helping to educate them ..

Quite a few Anarchists as well read into the Review Committee brief what they wanted to.



#2298 8Y8

8Y8

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 375 posts
  • Location:Pittwater AUS

Posted 20 May 2013 - 02:25 AM

^ Regardless of how their boats have performed, they have always looked the shizzle

 

The italian way, you seem to be able to find the worlds best and the worst example of the the same thing (anything) in their country  :rolleyes:



#2299 zillafreak

zillafreak

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 375 posts
  • Location:Newport Beach

Posted 20 May 2013 - 02:28 AM

^ Regardless of how their boats have performed, they have always looked the shizzle

Shizzle my nizzle, LR kicks ass. La bella Luna vero. 



#2300 jaysper

jaysper

    Anarchist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,364 posts
  • Location:Wellington

Posted 20 May 2013 - 02:38 AM

^ Regardless of how their boats have performed, they have always looked the shizzle

 

The italian way, you seem to be able to find the worlds best and the worst example of the the same thing (anything) in their country

 

Ducati motorbikes being the perfect example. Particularly those manufactured pre-nineties.

They look, sound and feel beautiful to ride.

 

But they are clearly a 9 to 5 bike, with that being the odds that they will start tomorrow.

Leave them out in the rain and those odds drop dramatically.






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users