48 replies to this topic

[dylan winter]

three minutes in

you have to admire the way these guys push their boats to the limit and beyond

watch the bowman

[Shaggy]

Impressive. Oracle should probably ask for some pointers........

[Mud sailor]

Pointer #1 have a real tow boat!

[Murphness]

Barge yacht? Anyone have any experience on one? What do the use as ballast?

[Bob Perry]

That is amazing!

[Presuming Ed]

If in doubt, let it out. Especially when ducking.

[couchsurfer]

...funny thing about the dutch**,,,they all skipped class when the benefits of reefing and pointy bows were discussed!

.....amazing how 'dry' it was when righted,,I would have thought it would have been rather -swamped-








........**...don't worry,me's 1/2 dutch

[Somebody Else]

0:40 - Now THAT's what I call a bendy rig!!!

[mcsailor0303]

Those boats are crazy! Reminds me of a pregnant slow motion A-Scow!

[Delta Blues]

What's it rate?

[DSYHS]

I sail those. Racing is intense. Most skippers are incredible characters. These "skûtsjes" as they are called rely purely on form stability. No ballast, maybe a few 100 kg's for trimming the ass out, depending on model. To qualify as skutsje, she has to built between 1890 and 1930 in friesland for transporting freight on the inland waterways.

What they rate... they sail in two classes, less than 17,10 between stem and stern and over 17,10 with a max of 20,62. The ships are equalized with an allowed sail area rule. Under 13 knots you sail circles (wide circles, manouvring is a challenge) around anything except state of art racers.

my team (blatant promotion): www.facebook.com/skutsje-emanuel

I've been thinking about a write up for some time.

Note: all racing skutsjes are adapted to survive capsizes without sinking, and for steel ex-workboats extremely light.

a beefy tug is present at all races, as they go over pretty often. righting sequence: account for crew. release halyards, take up slack on boom lift, tow rope over high side and tied to mast. take up slack on leeboard halyards. thumbs up to tug skipper and hold on...

[dylan winter]

I sail those. Racing is intense. Most skippers are incredible characters. These "skûtsjes" as they are called rely purely on form stability. No ballast, maybe a few 100 kg's for trimming the ass out, depending on model. To qualify as skutsje, she has to built between 1890 and 1930 in friesland for transporting freight on the inland waterways.

What they rate... they sail in two classes, less than 17,10 between stem and stern and over 17,10 with a max of 20,62. The ships are equalized with an allowed sail area rule. Under 13 knots you sail circles (wide circles, manouvring is a challenge) around anything except state of art racers.

my team (blatant promotion): www.facebook.com/skutsje-emanuel

I've been thinking about a write up for some time.

Note: all racing skutsjes are adapted to survive capsizes without sinking, and for steel ex-workboats extremely light.

bloody good you Dutch guys

I for one want to see more urls for films of these guys in action

are there any on-board ones on the web

I love video and want to see more

Dylan

[DSYHS]

Many pics on our FB for a start.

here some mediocre onboard stuff:



with capsize and righting at the end

[postpast]

So Dutch Barge racers aways have a beefy tug present and can right a god knows how heavy barge in two minutes flat.
Meanwhile at the America's Cup.....

[DSYHS]

Thats about right yeah. weight ranges between 13 for light small ones to 23 metric tons btw. Sailarea around 160m2 = give or take a few 1600 sqft

[PBO]

capsize in what...15knts?

[HASYB]

Yep, used to race them too quite extensively, its quite common that they capsize.
Spectacular boats to sail, lots of sail, no engines, crowded small lakes and canals.

http://www.google.nl...IAs7a0QXOv4HgAg

[walterbshaffer]

fun video - your camera is whacked, though

[DA-WOODY]

I sail those. Racing is intense. Most skippers are incredible characters. These "skûtsjes" as they are called rely purely on form stability. No ballast, maybe a few 100 kg's for trimming the ass out, depending on model. To qualify as skutsje, she has to built between 1890 and 1930 in friesland for transporting freight on the inland waterways.

What they rate... they sail in two classes, less than 17,10 between stem and stern and over 17,10 with a max of 20,62. The ships are equalized with an allowed sail area rule. Under 13 knots you sail circles (wide circles, manouvring is a challenge) around anything except state of art racers.

my team (blatant promotion): www.facebook.com/skutsje-emanuel

I've been thinking about a write up for some time.

Note: all racing skutsjes are adapted to survive capsizes without sinking, and for steel ex-workboats extremely light.

a beefy tug is present at all races, as they go over pretty often. righting sequence: account for crew. release halyards, take up slack on boom lift, tow rope over high side and tied to mast. take up slack on leeboard halyards. thumbs up to tug skipper and hold on...

your likes went UP

but you talk like Kiwis & Ozzie's (can't make out the words)

I see you are a nOOb - Do you have a Wife or Girlfriend ??


OH And Welcome and Thank's for bringing something NEW (to here)

[dylan winter]

Many pics on our FB for a start.

here some mediocre onboard stuff:



with capsize and righting at the end

I speachless

this is wonderful

Dylan

[DA-WOODY]

What's the water/air temp (in something we can understand PLZ)

[DSYHS]

water around 18 degrees C in summer, Air 20-25 degrees C. -> you'll live.

I followed the whole BS of ACWS sailing as a spectator sport closely.
The origin of the races we do, lies in the fact that in summer, the skippers didn't have a lot of work (and had a hard knock life anyway) . in the first half of the 20th century, local barowners organised the races with big cash prizes for the winners. which, of course they spent the same night. Whole villages lined the shores of the inland lakes to watch the "vigilante" skippers race for the honour of their village. an example:

[DA-WOODY]

water around 18 degrees C in summer, Air 20-25 degrees C. -> you'll live.

Argg Kiwi again

when I was in Auckland and the weather came up we aggreed to keep it to "Hot" - "Warm" - "OK" - "Cool" - "Cold"

Great that you can communicate in more than 1 Language !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[LeoV]

And actually unstayed masts Very modern boats. Profiled daggerboards, movable longitudional.
MOre vid, genral:
http://www.youtube.c...utsjesilen&aq=f

I raced on the bigger brothers,
search for strontrace on google, yep it means shitrace.

The dutch french and english really race their older boats, hardcore.

[dylan winter]

And actually unstayed masts Very modern boats. Profiled daggerboards, movable longitudional.
MOre vid, genral:
http://www.youtube.c...utsjesilen&aq=f

I raced on the bigger brothers,
search for strontrace on google, yep it means shitrace.

The dutch french and english really race their older boats, hardcore.

smack racing Colne



barge racing

Medway

[DSYHS]

Leo, you of all peaople should know, we for sure race with stays...

real vissermanaken sail with unstayed masts

[DSYHS]

fun video - your camera is whacked, though

post produced image stabilization.

[Pinching]

Those guys look pretty serious. Baltoplate bottom, or just clean because the lake is fresh?

[DSYHS]

indeed, mostly heavily faired race bottoms with high tech coatings.

[LeoV]

Leo, you of all peaople should know, we for sure race with stays...

real vissermanaken sail with unstayed masts

If you look at it from Perry's point, its almost unstayed. The stays are there, but do not really much.
And originally they were unstayed till the spar became older and they added some hoops and shrouds.. Or at least that is what my grandfather said, who owned one for his peat transport business before ww2
But I have to confess, I was in the scene 15 yrs ago. What they are upto now with modern stuff, I do not know.

Good to let non barge fans see this stuff, so lets not hairsplit, they are stayed ... LOL.
Sailing those beasts in 25 knots or more is impressive. Still have the scars visible on my hands...

How many Skutsjes are there now racing, taking the original and the open class together ?

[KiwiJoker]

water around 18 degrees C in summer, Air 20-25 degrees C. -> you'll live.

Argg Kiwi again

when I was in Auckland and the weather came up we aggreed to keep it to "Hot" - "Warm" - "OK" - "Cool" - "Cold"

Great that you can communicate in more than 1 Language !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Woody, it's my duty to inform you that the USA is the obvious dirty holdout on the global move go metric.

[dylan winter]

racing shots from a pro cameraman

[Life Buoy 15]

Little wonder they sell pot in the coffee shops!
Very cool vids thanks guys.

[Tranquilo]

Barge yacht? Anyone have any experience on one? What do the use as ballast?

The original "Jacht" came from theese kind of vessels>

[PATSYQPATSY]

Kind of gives a new meaning to mark room. Is rubbing racing or do folks incur penalties for banging. I like the use of fenders to give mark room. Looks exciting.

[Foreverslow]

Barge yacht? Anyone have any experience on one? What do the use as ballast?

The original "Jacht" came from theese kind of vessels>

but J-24s did not, as this puppy didn't sink after getting rolled over. ;<) ;<)

[Icebear]

Interesting paper on developing a VPP for skutsje.
http://www.hiswasymp...ert Keuning.pdf

8 knots reaching in 17 knots TWS.

Similar Frisian eel boats (palingaken) sailed across the North Sea to London carrying 20,000 lbs of live eels.

Crew: a skipper and two mates.

http://www.dehelling...ndex.php?page=1

[mitchellsailor]

3 guys on the rudder! thanks for the the post

[R Booth]

Nice video. Where are the dykes?....

[DSYHS]

Kind of gives a new meaning to mark room. Is rubbing racing or do folks incur penalties for banging. I like the use of fenders to give mark room. Looks exciting.

You have two different leagues. the between villages competition and the 'open' competition for which the skipper does not have to be from frisian freight skipper's descendance. we sail in the latter competition, governed by the normal RRS with the 720 penalty reduced to 360. protests are often setled on the dock. Damage must of course be avoided, but is also accepted as part of the game. sometimes it gets messy.

i think some 70 vessels are more or less optimized for racing.

[dylan winter]

I just want to say

I have really loved watching these films

and to see the crowds and the TV coverage

brilliant..... just brilliant



mind you

the old vendee is not without its pleasures either

[atoyot]

Nice video. Where are the dykes?....

I bet you wouldn't mind being the one with his finger inserted to seal the crack.

[DRIFTW00D]

The righting tugs seem crazy close. But engine thrust is hitting the hull as the righting line is towed. Simple physics at work. AC 72s need a 50 knot big ass prop tug boat. Whats out there to meet this new need????

Edited by DRIFTW00D, 14 November 2012 - 12:52 PM.

[DSYHS]

the closeness of the tug, indeed is the eating of the pudding when righting these bitches. Righting with a long line seems to give a lot more damage to rigging, sails leeboards etc.

[Kraftwerk]

Ballsy.

[DSYHS]

We flipped ours this sunday. Pushing hard with too much mainsheet on @ 70 degrees TWA, a gust hit, pinning us at 90 degrees twa with sheet way too tight. Letting go made boom hit the water and there you go. We were also on extremely shallow water, around 80cm. The lee board probably also caught the bottom. pics and vids on our facebook-> www.facebook.com/skutsje-emanuel

[phillysailor]

"We were also on extremely shallow water, around 80cm" Is that the purpose of the crew on the leeward side, with the measuring stick... depth meter, as it were?

 

Amazing, racing in, what, less than 30" with 60' boats? Wow. What happens to the rig after capsizing that shallow? 

[DSYHS]

Leeward side crew indeed measures depth for the leeboard trimmer to adjust leeboard depth. max depth is around three metres, minimum depth is 50 cm, 

The rig was fine. I guess that's the advantage of wooden masts. It all flexes nicely. the 'wand' on which the windvane stands was bent. A few blows and some weld tacks quickly solves that.

For the righting method with the little crane, the headstay has to be disconnected. The mast is properly secured below deck with serious hardware, but still kinda hairy.

[Pokey uh da LBC]

Great stuff. Possibly the most insperational thread in SA history.

 

And gives an entirely positive spin on the term "barging". I've almost totaly forgotton about the Blue vs. Camalot debacle.