262 replies to this topic

[jim lee]

I'm starting a blog on the build for Darts #4 (Bought by our own Hawiifins) And #5 still, as of this writing un-purchased. I have rumors of a least three different people nibbling at it, but none of them have contacted me, so as always.. We'll see.

This time things are going to be a little different. I'm going to write one blog and post links here from time to time and on facebook. Doing two in different formats was a bit tough to manage. Feel free to post comments here though. In fact, please do!



Before the storm

Enjoy!

-jim lee

[hard aground]

Any thoughts to running some time lapse photography in the shop? Would be really interesting to watch the complete build in a couple of minutes as well as your still shots and commentary here. Either way, thanks for your efforts and sharing.

[hawaiifins]

Jim's Christmas sale is a great deal on a great boat. Somebody needs to get in on this. Otherwise I am going to pick the best of the two boat litter! So, do I get this right? The foot rests are the first components fully constructed? Who'd have thought?

[Savage 17]

WOW!!!

Jim - Great for you for selling 4 of the 5 boats planned. I guess I need to re-evaluate sailing as a hobby.... $82,000 - $110,000 for a 25 ft boat!!!!!! Ouch!!!! I will continue to buy used boats.....

Good Luck Nice looking boat....

[gregj1]

I don't know beans about boatbuilding - OK - I know that. A couple of observations inspired by a 25' day sailor that costs north of 100K (four nice cars!) The foot rest is the most complicated piece and results in a lot of rejects - really? It is a bump in the floor that keeps you foot from slipping, I'm sure it's a nice one but, ... Sanding - If I had two guys operating one sander in my furniture shop my consoles would be a lot more expensive.

I'm not knocking the boat or the venture. I just don't get it.

[mcsailor0303]

I want to sail on one, they look like a blast!

Good luck!

[TimFordi550#87]

The foot rest is the most complicated piece and results in a lot of rejects - really? It is a bump in the floor that keeps you foot from slipping, I'm sure it's a nice one but, ...

Hah, wow, that ^ really cracked me up when I read it in the Blog.

Mine are just elongated pyramids and I could not believe what a pain in the ass they were to make and install, assuming one is after a sense of symmetry and with faired-in attachment to the cockpit sole. After waaaay too many hours of filling and sanding I finally said "F it they are just going to get the crap beaten out of them anyway, so why am I spending so much time on these g.d. things?"

Great blog Jim and thanks for letting us be flies on the wall for hulls 4 & 5! Wishing you much success with the next 2 boats.

Attached Files

•  footBUMPS.jpg   27.29K   57 downloads

[RumLine]

I just don't get it.

This is the only smart thing you said.

[usa 917]

Very cool boats. I will be watching

[jim lee]

B25 people, or if you know a B25 person maybe let them know..

Dart rudders are a popular upgrade to the old B25 sailboats. Now, in the next few days, depending on where Tim/Tom are on their list of parts, we are going to do the rudder blades for #4 & #5. If you, as a B25 owner, would like a Dart rudder for your B25 before year after next or so, let us know NOW. Then we can slip you into the queue. Otherwise, you will not be able to get one 'till -after- #4 & #5 Ship.

I only bug you all about this 'cause in the last couple days 2 different B25 owners have contacted me and the whole rudder thing always comes up.

P.S. Thanks for the comments, I think they're great!

-jim lee

[MSA]

Jim,

Could you not use a Foam Triangle and put it in the stack and then infuse?.. A Dart at $60k.. ok, but at $100k +++, orders will dry up.

I like the boat, somethings are just over thought and don't add any real value except for extra build $$$.

[Savage 17]

Jim - If i buy a B25 you can supply me with a new rudder and bowspirt off the dart? It is almost the same boat?


A J70 is $50k out the door with trailer, sails and covers. So, for 3 more feet the Dart will cost me double the J70 price and never have OD racing? I would take a look at what J-Boats did pricing wise Jim. They have 37 boats registered for Key West all in the 1st year

[robalex117]

And the J70 is 3' bigger then the RSK6 and will cost you about double. So whats you point? Smaller boats cost less? I think we all know that.

Jim - If i buy a B25 you can supply me with a new rudder and bowspirt off the dart? It is almost the same boat?


A J70 is $50k out the door with trailer, sails and covers. So, for 3 more feet the Dart will cost me double the J70 price and never have OD racing? I would take a look at what J-Boats did pricing wise Jim. They have 37 boats registered for Key West all in the 1st year

[Vogel515]

You guys need to relax...a lot plays into price and what people are willing to pay. It seems the buyers purchasing Jim's boats are VERY happy with these boats. As long as Jim is producing boats, it's benefiting all of us.

This is great thread, I enjoy following the build of these boats. Keep it up Jim.

[MSA]

Vogel,

SA (unfortunately?) is the reason Jim has sold boats. I wish there was a plethora of sailors lining up at Jim's doors wanting to buy boats at $100k.
He has taken advice from people here, others have take the praise as gospel and put their money where their mouth is, that's great!

You don't see too many $100k cars selling but you do see a lot (in comparison) @ $50-65k driving out of the showroom. All with "similar" features and get the job done while looking smart and impressing the new owner..

It's all constructive advice. Its not like we are calling it a Mac 26 or anything....

[jim lee]

I'm not trying to compete with the Mac-J people. There is no way on earth I ever could. It would be like competing with China built products on price point. They are huge, we are a few guys out in the sticks in a rented shop.

I started this because no one would make the boat I wanted. And, it looked like I had all the bits available to give it a shot. So I did.

And what did I find out? No one makes the boat I wanted 'cause its really tough! And tough means expensive. But that's ok, 'cause the Dart really is the boat I want. They are not perfect, but they are as close to it as we know how to build 'em. The entire design cycle of the Dart project was all about doing everything over the top as best as we could. Don't like the stereo systems available? Lets design our own! Don't like the cheesy LEDs offered on the market today? Lets make insanely cool ones and hang the cost! Who makes the best deck hardware? Harken? Fine, do it all in Harken! What's the best core to use? Corecell? Cool lets go with that! Its been a total blast creating this sailing machine and not giving a rats ass about anything but physical constraints and current tech. levels.

I doubt I'll ever be able to do it again..

But that is what the Dart is all about. Its the best little sport cruiser we know how to build. They cost what they cost. If people understand what it is and are willing to pay, that's great! Because although I complain a lot, I'm really having the time of my life building them. When we run out of people that will to pay what it costs to build, that's fine too. I'll build the last one for myself and be on my merry way.

And before I forget : Today's blog update.

P.S. I know I'll fight this 'till my dying day. The Dart is NOT a B/25. They don't share any parts at all. But, Dart rudders do make great upgrades to B/25s.

-jim lee

[hawaiifins]

Out here, we have 1 Antrim/Ultimate 27, 1 Sonoma 30 (there used to be two, but one famously sank this summer), 1 Humboldt 30, 1 Santa Cruz 27, and so on. Obviously, one design is not much of a factor in boat choices. The reason for buying this boat? The same reason Jim is making it: it's the best boat of it's size, with the best build quality, performance and comfort factor I could find. Are we paying more for it than, say, a J80? Probably. We're definitely paying more than a used one. That's what happens when one buys a new boat built by a couple of American craftsmen along with the ubiquitous shop kid, rather than a boat off an assembly line.

We (I include myself in this) seem to want two contradictory things: quality products built carefully by professionals at foreign import prices. You can get one or the other, but not both. I am getting a boat built by someone I trust at a price I can afford- I can't wait to see more of it in the days ahead.

This is likely my last sailboat, so I don't worry too much about resale, either. What I do care about is that it's fun, quick, and built to last. And I really like that new boat smell, too. Oh yeah, I also want to beat the Great Red Shark in our local beer cans

[Great Red Shark]

Good luck with that.

[Ryley]

Out here, we have 1 Antrim/Ultimate 27, 1 Sonoma 30 (there used to be two, but one famously sank this summer), 1 Humboldt 30, 1 Santa Cruz 27, and so on. Obviously, one design is not much of a factor in boat choices. The reason for buying this boat? The same reason Jim is making it: it's the best boat of it's size, with the best build quality, performance and comfort factor I could find. Are we paying more for it than, say, a J80? Probably. We're definitely paying more than a used one. That's what happens when one buys a new boat built by a couple of American craftsmen along with the ubiquitous shop kid, rather than a boat off an assembly line.

We (I include myself in this) seem to want two contradictory things: quality products built carefully by professionals at foreign import prices. You can get one or the other, but not both. I am getting a boat built by someone I trust at a price I can afford- I can't wait to see more of it in the days ahead.

This is likely my last sailboat, so I don't worry too much about resale, either. What I do care about is that it's fun, quick, and built to last. And I really like that new boat smell, too. Oh yeah, I also want to beat the Great Red Shark in our local beer cans

Hah. I'm surprised given your parameters, you didn't support your local designer AND a quality overseas build. That being said, I am sure you'll love your Dart.

[jim lee]

Some more little part pix. Now a lot to show.

Build log

-jim lee

[hawaiifins]

Thanks for the update. Now, get back to work, man! Get back to work!

[Raked aft \\]

Jim,

before you wax up the deck mould you should cut in a couple nice self draining beer holders !!

That'll sell #5 fo sure.

[hyerstay]

Jim, let me know if you need any help with your Mac!

[hawaiifins]

Jim,

before you wax up the deck mould you should cut in a couple nice self draining beer holders !!

That'll sell #5 fo sure.

Say, that would be cool for #4, too!

Thanks for the update. Now, get back to work, man! Get back to work!

[jim lee]

Its not the Mac so much as Filemaker. I run everything here on 8.5 FIlemaker. This version won't print using snow leopard and, from what I read, I'm hosed. "Upgrade to Filemaker V12". I think its a bit of a scam but, whatever. I have gotten way more than my $500 of use out of the program, so I submitted and paid the tax for a new copy.

Beer holders would be neat, like the old SC boats. Geoff has been pushing me for a long time to mold an ice chest into the cockpit floor between the traveler and companionway door. But you can drive yourself crazy generating engineering modifications. Like hawaiifins says, time to get back to work.

-jim lee

[Matt B]

Like this.

Attached Files

•  hein cooler compressed.jpg   24.05K   41 downloads

[jim lee]

That's the ticket! I bet that's the bees knees!

Now even more fun. The shop truck just acquired a wonderful rod knock on today's search for cheeseburgers. One second we're heading down the highway, "Hey, we're loosin' power.. Sounds funny. Running in odd patterns? One cylinder sounds louder than the others. Oh oh, real loud now! Managed to limp into Jim Betts' place in granny low. They had much fun at our expense. But did loan us a truck in the end.

-jim lee

[Mr. Starbuck]

Like this.

I have an anchor locker on the stbd side that just got a new lease on life... Not all that large but good enough for some beer.

[Kirwan]

In the design business we have this saying:

"Fast (delivery), Cheap, Good: Pick any two."


Most people pick Fast and Cheap; this is why China has gotten all the business.

[Matt B]

That's the ticket! I bet that's the bees knees!

The Bees Knees. Yes it is. In that photo there are five cases of beer and ten bags of ice, with lots of room to spare. It doubles as life raft storage when not full of beer. It also holds Chicago Based Bowman.

[hawaiifins]

That's the ticket! I bet that's the bees knees!

The Bees Knees. Yes it is. In that photo there are five cases of beer and ten bags of ice, with lots of room to spare. It doubles as life raft storage when not full of beer. It also holds Chicago Based Bowman.

Stop distracting Jim. It's bad enough that he takes time at noon to get cheeseburgers when he should be building Dart #4.

[jim lee]

Quick update with some pix

Only 12 days left for the Pre-Christmas sale price on Dart #5..

-jim lee

[casc27]

Its not the Mac so much as Filemaker. I run everything here on 8.5 FIlemaker. This version won't print using snow leopard and, from what I read, I'm hosed. "Upgrade to Filemaker V12". I think its a bit of a scam but, whatever. I have gotten way more than my $500 of use out of the program, so I submitted and paid the tax for a new copy.

Beer holders would be neat, like the old SC boats. Geoff has been pushing me for a long time to mold an ice chest into the cockpit floor between the traveler and companionway door. But you can drive yourself crazy generating engineering modifications. Like hawaiifins says, time to get back to work.

-jim lee

Filemaker? You poor bastard. And you just paid $$ to prolong the agony!

[casc27]

Extra beer and ice goes in the bilge. If you want to talk about a design flaw, the Moore 24 bilge sump is too narrow to fit a beer can. The only thing wrong with those boats. What were they thinking?

[hawaiifins]

Extra beer and ice goes in the bilge. If you want to talk about a design flaw, the Moore 24 bilge sump is too narrow to fit a beer can. The only thing wrong with those boats. What were they thinking?

What in the world is "extra" beer? Please stop using contradictory terms!

[jim lee]

Many years ago I had an old, it was old even then, Cal T/2. Same hull as the even older Cal 27. These had a really deep sump into the fin keel. Perfect for holding Ice & Beer, or so we thought. Returning from the 1991 Windjammer race? From Santa Cruz to SF Bay area, we had the brilliant idea to pack the keel full of ice & beer. What a disaster! Beating up the coast, slam bam, all the cans broke, all the ice melted.. Yuch!

-jim lee

[jkdubs808]

Great to see # 4&5 being built! My g/f and I keep going back to a Dart when we talk about boats we want. Something we can race then shift gears and take it cruising in the Bahamas. Has all aspects that we desire in a boat. And something we would consider doing double handed transpac (something we're dreaming about doing) in as it seems to be a well built boat.

Glad to hear #4 is going to my home state of Hawaii! Hopefully it will be out there next summer when I'm visiting home and maybe talk hawaiifins (as soon as I figure out who they are lol) into taking my girl and I for a sail.

It would be great to see how the Shark goes against a Dart.....

[casc27]

Many years ago I had an old, it was old even then, Cal T/2. Same hull as the even older Cal 27. These had a really deep sump into the fin keel. Perfect for holding Ice & Beer, or so we thought. Returning from the 1991 Windjammer race? From Santa Cruz to SF Bay area, we had the brilliant idea to pack the keel full of ice & beer. What a disaster! Beating up the coast, slam bam, all the cans broke, all the ice melted.. Yuch!

-jim lee

It only works for daysailing in milder conditions. But I suppose you could have drunk the bilge water?!?!?

[hawaiifins]

Jkdubs808: you're on the list for a ride. Why not snatch up hull #5? Double handed Transpac in a Dart? I couldn't! I shouldn't! But...hmmm...the boat has to get here anyway, and.... GET THEE BEHIND ME SATAN!!!

[JumpingJax]

Extra beer Essential survival provisions and ice goes in the bilge. If you want to talk about a design flaw, the Moore 24 bilge sump is too narrow to fit a beer can. The only thing wrong with those boats. What were they thinking?

Fixed

[greeng]

Many years ago I had an old, it was old even then, Cal T/2. Same hull as the even older Cal 27. These had a really deep sump into the fin keel. Perfect for holding Ice & Beer, or so we thought. Returning from the 1991 Windjammer race? From Santa Cruz to SF Bay area, we had the brilliant idea to pack the keel full of ice & beer. What a disaster! Beating up the coast, slam bam, all the cans broke, all the ice melted.. Yuch!

-jim lee

This cracks me up. I still have a T/2. It's a sleeper - I surprise new boats all the time. Of course I'm usually the only one racing.

[jim lee]

Good lord! that brings back memories. Your right they are sleepers. Ours was a high wind PHRF killing machine. We used to run it with only a 85% North jib, no main and just dominated the beer can circuit with the thing. Granted we were racing a bunch of liveaboards.. Fun times!

-jim lee

[jim lee]

Replying to myself, how sad..

Pester you anarchy Some more pix.

-jim lee

[Steam Flyer]

Good lord! that brings back memories. Your right they are sleepers. Ours was a high wind PHRF killing machine. We used to run it with only a 85% North jib, no main and just dominated the beer can circuit with the thing. Granted we were racing a bunch of liveaboards.. Fun times!

-jim lee

Racing liveaboards is fun. The times I've done it, the tactician would call to tack so we could follow the smell of bread and/or cookies baking.

FB- Doug

PS- don't worry about talking to yourself; don't worry about answering yourself. It's when you tell yourself that you should shut up because you're wrong, you don't know what you're talking about... that is when you should worry

[hawaiifins]

Jim- in one of your pictures I see a WWII-ish army truck (Wiley's Overland?) in the background. What the story on it? It looks really cool, like everything else in your shop. By the way, another SA thread is talking about inside steering stations. Is it too late for Dart #4 to have one of those?

[jim lee]

Anything is possible. Indoor steering stations are great for cold, snow and drinking hot Cocoa in blizzards. When the snow line hits the ocean in Hawaii, we'll be installing one for you.

The truck.. Its a 1953 Dodge M37 3/4 ton truck. My son named it Theodore. I found it on the internet and bought it on a whim. The wife wanted the kids to learn a little about wrenching on cars and had suggested I go find an old one (pre smog) they could learn on. So, instead of getting something boring, I picked up Theodore. I taught the older two how to drive it. Crash box, manual everything, pump the brakes once to use 'em. And then I showed them mud..



That's the kids discovering they joys of a 4x4 in mud. (All of them in there)


Doing donuts..

Sadly, Theodore now has one heck of a rod knock. I guess the kids will be learning how to rebuild Army truck engines.

-jim lee

[hawaiifins]

That is one awesome ride. I really like seeing kids out in the elements with big grins on their faces, instead of inside twiddling their thumbs on some video game. I guess that's the reason for the Dart, isn't it? Spinning around in the mud while grinding gears through a crash box tranny--- not many of kids get to grow up doing stuff like that anymore.

[jim lee]

No, I sure don't see kids playing with machine like that much these days. When I was growing up, I had access to and old WWII army truck to play with. I had loads of fun on that old machine. I could double clutch before I had my driver's license.

Anyway, back to business. Here's a build link for everyone.

Enjoy!

-jim lee

[hobot]

You're gonna need a bigger shop!

[hard aground]

So............ after you complete hull#5, what are your plans for the molds?

[jim lee]

Well, if someone bought #5 and someone wants to buy #6, I guess we'll make more. Why do you ask?

-jim lee

[hard aground]

Just curious. If Santa would re-evaluate he might realize that I really was nice and not naughty and would bring me hull#5 for Christmas. Merry Christmas Jim, all the best and keep up the good work.

[hawaiifins]

Better hurry to get in on a good deal. I've got to tell you, these guys at LCD are wonderful to deal with. Every few days I come up with some questions I either didn't think of before or that were prompted by the build photos. Jim is very patient with an owner who knows nothing about boat building and who has likewise purchased a boat sight unseen. When I read the "time to throw in take towel" thread, before it morphed into shouting match about Afghanistan, I was thinking to myself that wanting to downsize the program is exactly why I went for the Dart.

Someone mentioned our local designer, who I assume is good guy Jim Donovan. He hasn't been local for about two years and I wonder if I can call the builder of his GP 26 very often and ask, "what's that thingy for?" Likewise, the Dart might (or might not) be a tough sale at $120,000. At $89,000, including a custom trailer, I believe it's a fair value for a fun boat built by some quality folks. I'd love to see some more of these in the water, somewhere.

Besides, it's a lot of fun looking at pics every few days and saying, "hey look! We've got a rudder. Boxes of Harken stuff. A cooler lid!"
So tell Santa, "the Dart is right over there and you're in my way." Start slapping something-not someone- take up a chorus of "Waltzing Matilda," march out into the night with a can of Red Hook IPA in your hand and write the check!

[jim lee]

Hey thanks for that! It also includes wireless speed/depth and a Yamaha outboard brand new in box. Everyone always forgets those bits. And its only $84k, not $89k.

Snapper agreed to come up with some special price for sails on these two Darts, but he's been really quiet since. Maybe we'd better rattle his cage a little?

Here's the shutting down over the holidays update.

Merry Christmas everyone!

-jim lee

[Pog]

Thanks for the continued updates, if I had the coin I would be upgrading from my 37 year old T-bird, oh well I can dream at least. Have a good holiday break and we look forward to more updates in 2013.

[jim lee]

So Pog, what kind if coin adjustments would you need to pick up Dart #5?

Here's a couple pix as proof we're still alive and kicking for 2013.



Trimming trailer bunks, and..



Stuffing rudder blade shells.

Happy new year everyone!

-jim lee

[Flying Fish]

Stop posting and finish the rudders. Spring is almost here

[hawaiifins]

And no trips looking for cheeseburgers when you should be bagging hulls and decks.

[jim lee]

Cheeseburgers are vastly important. Key item..

-jim lee

[Flying Fish]

I will mail some. Back to work

[postpast]

American Craftsmanship 101

[Para Bellum]

What's the typical rigging time if trailering a Dart?

[jim lee]

It varies a lot, I can give you the typical steps..

Install windex (How many time I've forgotten this..)
Undo the bungies and whatever else is holding the strings to the mast and the mast to the mast chocks.
Lift back of mast and slide in the mast crutch to hold the back up.
Slide the mast back and hook it to the tabernacle. There's a hinge pin that slides in.
Tie one jib sheet to the end of the forestay.
Run one jib halyard back to its halyard winch, hook to forward U bolt on bow.
I typically take the end of the jib sheet around the front of the truck. Tim Tom are in cockpit ready to lift mast.
Tim Tom lift mast up as far as they can, I pull forward as fast as I can. About the time they can't lift anymore I have enough angle to finish.
Zoop! Mast up! Shrouds snap tight 'cause we leave them set up when we drop the mast.
Tension the jib halyard that you set up earlier to hold the mast forward.
Bring headstay back, untie jib sheet and connect to rear U bolt on bow.

Mast is now up. Remove mast chocks.

Trailer launching? ( Paul's better at this than I am. )

Extend trailer tung.
Set up keel crane and bring up the keel to max height.
Undo straps that hold boat on trailer.
Roll boat in water 'till it floats off trailer.
Tie up somewhere that its 6' deep and lower the keel down.
Bolt in keel.
Remove keel crane.
Install rudder & OB
Install boom, run the remaining lines (Including backstay)..

GO sailing.

Crane launching (We do it this way)

Bolt keel block around keel in cabin. 6 bolts and wing nuts.
Hook lifting bridle to shrouds and back stay U-Bolts.
Remove the straps that hold the boat to the trailer.
Crane the boat off the trailer into the water. (the keel block is holding the keel in the up position)
Hook crane to top of keel. There's a strap for this included.
Lift keel off the keel block and remove the keel block.
Lower keel, bolt in place.

Install rudder & OB
Install boom, run the remaining lines (Including backstay)..

GO sailing.

Hope this helps!

-jim lee

[Flying Fish]

Para Belum - I have an old fashioned Dart (a B25 - I can see Jim typing as he reads this comparison!) and I have found you spend more time waiting for the help to arrive and untying all the lines you secured the mast with than actually raising it. the mast is small, light, hinged and goes up easily and quickly.

I leave the mast up, boom on and park it at the marina as I am sure almost all do. It takes me about 30 minutes to launch but half of that time is devoted to a cigar and a beer(s). It does take me about 30 minutes to retrieve but I do everything by myself including folding sails, coiling lines, removing the engine (I take it home) picking up all the empties. My crew needs to get home asap and I would rather have a beer and enjoy the sail home and clean it myself rather than do it on the way in. If you were efficient you could do both ends in 15 minutes each with no problem.

I leave the keel lift mechanism on land as it has many sharp edges and I do not want anyone cut or my sail ripped. If on board someone could raise the keel while I get the trailer and save even more time. the Dart may have an improved mechanism but I rely on old equipment

bottom line - if you have any help at all it is quick and easy. Much easier than wet sanding bottom paint while it is still snowing. I will never go back to a wet slip again.

[jim lee]

I did a blog update tonight. No big parts started, we're still making small bits.

Clicky Enjoy!

-jim lee

[hobot]

Kelp cut-ter, Kelp cut-ter.....

[hawaiifins]

Kelp cut-ter, Kelp cut-ter.....

Don't worry, Jim. I won't be needing one of those. A whale avoidance system and shark repellent might be useful. Actually, after announcing the sale of my existing boat and the purchase of Dart #4, it's the sharks that live on the land that have been the most troublesome...

[Para Bellum]

Thanks for the answers Jim and Flying Fish. Great boat.

[Snapper]

Kelp cut-ter, Kelp cut-ter.....

Yes please! Hobot - go over to Jim's and show 'em how to do it! [sound of Jim gnashing teeth]

[Whatstheword]

Kelp cut-ter, Kelp cut-ter.....

Don't worry, Jim. I won't be needing one of those. A whale avoidance system and shark repellent might be useful. Actually, after announcing the sale of my existing boat and the purchase of Dart #4, it's the sharks that live on the land that have been the most troublesome...

Not to mention the future trouble to be caused by the Great Red Shark.

[hawaiifins]

Kelp cut-ter, Kelp cut-ter.....

Don't worry, Jim. I won't be needing one of those. A whale avoidance system and shark repellent might be useful. Actually, after announcing the sale of my existing boat and the purchase of Dart #4, it's the sharks that live on the land that have been the most troublesome...

Not to mention the future trouble to be caused by the Great Red Shark.

Yeah, but I'm going to have LED touch lights and a cool stereo.

[Pog]

Call Brad at Fitzgerald Racing here in San Diego to see if he can help with the kelp cutter, he makes the best ones in the world so there is no sense in reinventing the wheel.

[jim lee]

Midweek blog update just to proove we're still working on this. Update Link.

I was out sick all last weeks so I came back to a full digital camera and stories about what went down while I was out.

I''ll check out Fitzgerald Racing.

-jim lee

[postpast]

Good Work, Bump

[jim lee]

Another update with small parts & rudders. Build Log update

The hope is that after this we should be able to start working on the liners, decks & hulls.

Kelp cutters : I told Snapper if his customer would commit to a Dart, we'd commit to developing a kelp cutter. All I heard from them was crickets..

-jim lee

[jackdaw]

Yeah, but I'm going to have LED touch lights and a cool stereo.

Jim,
I gotta ask about the simple stereo... why did you guys do that?? For 10 bucks more a customer can have the waterproof, ipod enabled Fusion MS-RA200. Its about the same size, but has full ipod (not just USB charging + audio in) integration, FM, weather and VHF receive, etc etc. Maybe it was fun to do but it doesn't seem like your business.


http://www.starmarinedepot.com/Fusion+MS-RA200+Marine+Radio+AM-FM.html?gclid=CKn896OClrUCFYxDMgodRGMA3A

[jim lee]

I'm not surprised you wonder, most people don't understand.

I hate "features". I see features as glitter to draw in the gullible.

I will go out of my way to avoid features in any product I use. Our stereos & lights are prime examples. We build them from the highest quality parts we can find no matter the cost. They only do what they are designed to do, do it extremely well and are extremely simple to use. We have a following of customers that "get it" and go nuts for this stuff. Much of our stereo market is actually from The Netherlands and Canada, not so much the USA. Most Americans just don't "get it". Its sad, but from what I can tell, that's our culture.

All the stuff we're doing at Left Coast follows the same path. Highest quality, hang the cost and focus on what the product should be able to do. Like the Dart, its not cheap. Most people don't want to pay? Too bad, a few "get it" and they go totally nuts for it.

When Mark (Dart #3) asked Paul (Dart #2) about how the Dart Handled and was constructed, Paul told him it was one of the easiest boats to sail and the best built production boat he'd ever seen.

After Mark received Dart #3, one of his locals asked him what he thought. Here's a cutting from the e-mail Mark sent back.

Almost every boat I have owned was purchased new. The Dart 26 It is by far the best built boat I have ever purchased (compared to my former Beneteau 40.7 and J92 – two of the most reputable production boat builders worldwide). Most certainly one of the fastest and most family friendly in its class. The level of workmanship and quality of materials is unsurpassed. This is not going to be a mass production model boat. This being the case, it will retain its value beyond most others in its class long-term.

Most boat companies around here have gone bust. We don't build very fast, but we've been booked solid since early last summer. I have people asking about stuff that I don't know where we're going to get the time to build it. We've run out of Stereos, we've run out of lights, we have parts but very little manpower left to build the stuff.

I was tired of glitzy cheap stuff. So Left Coast was a reaction to that. Highest quality, easiest to use. And yes, the market we're catering to is very small.

-jim lee

[jackdaw]

I was tired of glitzy cheap stuff. So Left Coast was a reaction to that. Highest quality, easiest to use. And yes, the market we're catering to is very small.

If you're happy and its paying the bills, carry on.

[Bow Monkey]

Yeah, but I'm going to have LED touch lights and a cool stereo.

Jim,
I gotta ask about the simple stereo... why did you guys do that?? For 10 bucks more a customer can have the waterproof, ipod enabled Fusion MS-RA200. Its about the same size, but has full ipod (not just USB charging + audio in) integration, FM, weather and VHF receive, etc etc. Maybe it was fun to do but it doesn't seem like your business.


http://www.starmarinedepot.com/Fusion+MS-RA200+Marine+Radio+AM-FM.html?gclid=CKn896OClrUCFYxDMgodRGMA3A

You're actually worried about the radio? With as open as Jim's been with the builds on each boat, I'm sure if the buyer said "hey Jim, when you build mine, please use XYZ stereo, I'll pay the extra ten bucks difference," it'd be no problem.

[jim lee]

I don't think he's worried about getting one of our stereos in his Dart. It was more along the lines of "Your a boat builder, why are you building stereos?" kinda' thing. A perfectly valid question. In a previous life, I built and sold high performance boat parts, along with custom made chocolate candy.

I kinda' miss the chocolate candy.

-jim lee

[Bow Monkey]

I don't think he's worried about getting one of our stereos in his Dart. It was more along the lines of "Your a boat builder, why are you building stereos?" kinda' thing. A perfectly valid question. In a previous life, I built and sold high performance boat parts, along with custom made chocolate candy.

I kinda' miss the chocolate candy. :)/>

-jim lee

Fair enough. Love the boat, by the way. Having spent a lot of my life on a B25 and a Laser 28, I think you've hit the perfect mix, even with a crappy stereo!

[postpast]

Bad stereo? You guys must know nothing about boat building! From the Pic's and description the hull and rest looks dead easy. (sarcasm, if you didn't notice)

[jim lee]

Bad stereo? No no no.. You have the wrong idea. We use one of these palm sized stereos as the sound system in our 4800sq ft shop. Delightful little things.

Anyway, back to business, we have a small build log update. For those of you following this.

Enjoy!

-jim lee

[jim lee]

Replying to myself, how sad. And some people think lightweight 20+ foot cruising sailboats are what the American market needs. Its odd how they need these boats, but don't actually purchase them.

Anyway back to business again..

Today's build log update.

-jim lee

[F-18 5150]

Thanks Jim love the updates

[il1395]

Ditto - love the updates.

[hawaiifins]

Great update. I am starting to see parts that look like part of a boat (rather than appendages, such as the keel and rudders). What were the objections to the hatch? Structural or aesthetic? I am especially concerned if the designer said no from an engineering point of view. No doubt, any time you put an hole of that size in something, you have to strengthen it somewhere else- kind of like convertibles weighing more than the same model car with a fixed roof. Light and ventilation are great, but not at the expense of
creating a weakened foredeck near the mast tabernacle. Maybe some SAers have thoughts about this. Love to hear 'em. If I say J70 for no reason whatsoever will that get the conversation started....? I know... the hatch will make the Dart faster than a J70 upwind and a Viper downwind...

So, back to the question- what do you guys think (about the HATCH!)?

[jim lee]

You actually typed J70 & Viper in the same post?! That's living on the edge! I'd actually considered adding a few un-confirmable claims to draw LS over here. Then he could bash the hell out of us and draw the masses over to see the fights.

Leif said that a hatch would be ok, but not to put it into the mold because most wouldn't want it. I mean to ask him his thoughts on the idea IF I can get in touch with him.

-jim lee

[BobJ]

Fins, do you plan to do any races which use (or borrow from) the ISAF OSR's? If so you might need a forward hatch.

It caused a problem for awhile with a local JS9000, until the rules got changed.

[notallthere]

I vote yes for the hatch. A nice small one like that will be great for ventilation and light, but not take up the whole fordeck.

[hawaiifins]

Fins, do you plan to do any races which use (or borrow from) the ISAF OSR's? If so you might need a forward hatch.

It caused a problem for awhile with a local JS9000, until the rules got changed.

If I read the OSR correctly this is necessary for a boat over 28 ft LOA beginning with hulls built in 2014. The races I'd do are Cat 4 types, though I don't believe ISAF rules apply to our beer cans. I will check. Thanks for the tip.

[Great Red Shark]

Just like many Santa Cruz 27s that were originally built without a foredeck hatch ( like Dr. Pete's) it means one less place to leak. Just like the windows in the 1D35 ( none ) - and as a crew on Ross Field's first Whitbred 60 "Yamaha", ( up doing Kenwood in about '94 ) said to me when I asked about no the windows, ports or hatches aside from the main and fore, - " Holes are heavy, mate."

[dolphinmaster]

You actually typed J70 & Viper in the same post?! That's living on the edge! I'd actually considered adding a few un-confirmable claims to draw LS over here. Then he could bash the hell out of us and draw the masses over to see the fights.

Leif said that a hatch would be ok, but not to put it into the mold because most wouldn't want it. I mean to ask him his thoughts on the idea IF I can get in touch with him.

-jim lee

In pure conspiracy mode, he is probably paid by J-Boats. He seems to be very effective at being a spoon.

[hawaiifins]

You actually typed J70 & Viper in the same post?! That's living on the edge! I'd actually considered adding a few un-confirmable claims to draw LS over here. Then he could bash the hell out of us and draw the masses over to see the fights.

Leif said that a hatch would be ok, but not to put it into the mold because most wouldn't want it. I mean to ask him his thoughts on the idea IF I can get in touch with him.

-jim lee

In pure conspiracy mode, he is probably paid by J-Boats. He seems to be very effective at being a spoon.

I'm a spoon? Oh, wait; that was meant for LS. Now, damnit man, about the forepeak hatch?! What do ya think?

[dolphinmaster]

You actually typed J70 & Viper in the same post?! That's living on the edge! I'd actually considered adding a few un-confirmable claims to draw LS over here. Then he could bash the hell out of us and draw the masses over to see the fights.

Leif said that a hatch would be ok, but not to put it into the mold because most wouldn't want it. I mean to ask him his thoughts on the idea IF I can get in touch with him.

-jim lee

In pure conspiracy mode, he is probably paid by J-Boats. He seems to be very effective at being a spoon.

I'm a spoon? Oh, wait; that was meant for LS. Now, damnit man, about the forepeak hatch?! What do ya think?

Make it round,............ wait, wait, what was the question?

[jim lee]

Paul, #2 says no hatch, no leaks. Leif hasn't replied.

Here's an update, link. Not a lot to show, its mostly finishing up liners as you've seen and taking the big breath before starting on Hawaiifins' deck.


-jim lee

[hawaiifins]

Paul, #2 says no hatch, no leaks. Leif hasn't replied.

Here's an update, link. Not a lot to show, its mostly finishing up liners as you've seen and taking the big breath before starting on Hawaiifins' deck.


-jim lee

A deck! Hey guys, I'm getting a deck!! I can't wait to sit on it next month when I travel to Anacortes to see my boat...err...deck.
By the way, Jim: my sailmaker, Fuzz Foster at North, needs to know the length of the sprit. You told me once, but I forgot.

[jim lee]

I'll take a look at the numbers for the sprit tomorrow. Have your sail makers already been to measure Dart #1? Sneaky..

Paul & April of Dart #2 sent me some pix and race results from this last weekend. Results link.

Lets see if the pix link through..












They were racing with some pretty zippy boats and pulled second over all. Pretty good showing!

-jim lee

[hawaiifins]

Great shots of a fine looking vessel. Everyone over here is anxious to see it live and in person! Yep- Fuzz of North Sails Hawaii is Ninja-like. Actually, he called the PNW/Seattle loft, who was headed nearby anyway and got some measurements for us. In terms of the regatta, a Catalina something or other at 222 and a Ker at -12 in the same ratings division is a pretty wide band! What is impressive is how it did against the Betts boat for boat. A long race and only 2+ minutes behind in elapsed time isn't too shabby. Not that I plan to take racing the Dart seriously... yeah, right....

[dolphinmaster]

Great shots of a fine looking vessel. Everyone over here is anxious to see it live and in person! Yep- Fuzz of North Sails Hawaii is Ninja-like. Actually, he called the PNW/Seattle loft, who was headed nearby anyway and got some measurements for us. In terms of the regatta, a Catalina something or other at 222 and a Ker at -12 in the same ratings division is a pretty wide band! What is impressive is how it did against the Betts boat for boat. A long race and only 2+ minutes behind in elapsed time isn't too shabby. Not that I plan to take racing the Dart seriously... yeah, right....

Ditto on "trailing" the Sierra 26 by only 2. Good job Jim and Paul and April. With the Tiger brainchild just around the corner from, you the PNW may just become the Worldwide center of the understated, kick some bootay sailboat incubation region.