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Oracle tactics


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#1 alpha

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Posted 08 September 2013 - 11:46 PM

Not too impressed with the tactics on Oracle. They had a nice lead in race three and then threw in an extra tack to chase ETNZ to the starboard boundary. ETNZ tacks and Oracle lets them go. Two extra tacks to let them go. Just giving it away.

 

That got ETNZ back in the race and just close enough for Oracle to forget that they couldn't force ETNZ to tack back onto starboard when they where at the boundary. By the time Oracle realized what was going on they had to throw in a bad tack and the wrong time and race over.

 

It's less about tacking speed and acceleration and more about not making dumb mistakes.

 

The crowning moment was Oracle tacking away when they where bow out and in front of ETNZ. You don't win races like that.



#2 mustang__1

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 03:21 AM

anyone else get the feeling that their first mark tactics, ie: inside and try to draw a foul, is because they know ETNZ is faster and they need either get ahead or early or try and draw a foul to win? of course, race4 seems to indicate maybe a little different in breeze, but that was my inclination after the first 3... 



#3 insider

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 04:15 AM

anyone else get the feeling that their first mark tactics, ie: inside and try to draw a foul, is because they know ETNZ is faster and they need either get ahead or early or try and draw a foul to win? of course, race4 seems to indicate maybe a little different in breeze, but that was my inclination after the first 3... 

No, it is because it costs them nothing to have a go in that situation and that situation will be available every time that they are the inside boat.



#4 L124C

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 06:57 AM

anyone else get the feeling that their first mark tactics, ie: inside and try to draw a foul, is because they know ETNZ is faster and they need either get ahead or early or try and draw a foul to win? of course, race4 seems to indicate maybe a little different in breeze, but that was my inclination after the first 3...

No, it is because it costs them nothing to have a go in that situation and that situation will be available every time that they are the inside boat.
Really? I haven't see it pay off one time, including in the LV, with the exception of AC race 4. I still don't understand why NZ headed up so far to allow it to work then.
Seems that if NZ stays to windward just enough to avoid a penalty, they take the windward mark. Hell, they even made up the deficit WITH a penalty in race 3. JS definitely seems to like the Leeward position though, wich seems to suit DB just fine.

#5 insider

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 07:06 AM

 

anyone else get the feeling that their first mark tactics, ie: inside and try to draw a foul, is because they know ETNZ is faster and they need either get ahead or early or try and draw a foul to win? of course, race4 seems to indicate maybe a little different in breeze, but that was my inclination after the first 3...

No, it is because it costs them nothing to have a go in that situation and that situation will be available every time that they are the inside boat.
Really? I haven't see it pay off one time, including in the LV, with the exception of AC race 4. I still don't understand why NZ headed up so far to allow it to work then.
Seems that if NZ stays to windward just enough to avoid a penalty, they take the windward mark. Hell, they even made up the deficit WITH a penalty in race 3.

If they are overlapped when they enter the zone (and IMHO Oracle is the faster boat reaching) then it will pay every time. 

 

Especially if they push them up past the mark as then the boundary comes into play for the first gybe. Strong move and if they can nail their TOD and starting every time then they will do it every time.



#6 Mark K

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 07:07 AM

 I haven't seen an overlap at the first mark before today. 

 

 That luff poked ETNZ up, and while they were still going up, OR got on with bearing away, and they got themselves a nice little bit of separation with it. No-luff would have resulted NZ being able to round down tight with them and just to weather.  

 

 Not that they wouldn't have loved to get a foul, or anything, but that didn't strike me as being the primary reason. 



#7 insider

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 07:12 AM

 I haven't seen an overlap at the first mark before today. 

 

 That luff poked ETNZ up, and while they were still going up, OR got on with bearing away, and they got themselves a nice little bit of separation with it. No-luff would have resulted NZ being able to round down tight with them and just to weather.  

 

 Not that they wouldn't have loved to get a foul, or anything, but that didn't strike me as being the primary reason. 

Exaclty this ^^^^



#8 powdermonkey

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 07:26 AM

IMHO, oracle messed up in race 3 by going round the wrong mark at mark 2 if they'd selected the right hand mark they'd have protected the right and been in tide relief at the cone, rather than going into foul tide and handing the advantage to the kiwis

#9 nav

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 07:40 AM

^ JS seems more confident to 'flick his boat about' - even in the middle of a rounding (they took this to extremes in their in-house practice). He got away with it but there was a bit of bows under that could become a problem, maybe?

 

The coordination onboard is critical to staying up and keeping the minimum speed through a manoeuvre high, my guess is that ETNZ were more hesitant to jink and then fall off around the mark immediately - as they were thrown off in their timing by JS's attack - even though they had seemed to leave more room than in R3, hoping to avoid another penalty.

 

At the speeds they are doing the whole mark rounding/penalty situation seems a bit of a lottery, even seems unclear to the crews exactly what's going on!



#10 Titan Uranus

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 08:13 AM

IMHO, oracle messed up in race 3 by going round the wrong mark at mark 2 if they'd selected the right hand mark they'd have protected the right and been in tide relief at the cone, rather than going into foul tide and handing the advantage to the kiwis

yeeeaaahhh! That's what I thought to.

Also the starboard tack advantage is huge in these boats and covers a huge area or ocean for the port boat to Get around. Probably 65+ metres If both are even before the cross.




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