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Bob Perry's Cool Rowboat

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#1 Tom Ray

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 09:41 AM

OK, enough with dragging this boat through the Uglyboat Admiration mud. It's not ugly and a workboat finish is the right way to start, since that's the way it would end anyway with his intended use.

 

...
I can always weld in a sailing rig. But a good pulling boat will not make a good sailing boat.
Damn it! Now you have me thinking about the next boat.
...



That's why I piped in with what Bolger called the "inevitable chorus."

What a neat rowboat! Let's put a sail on it!

I've thought a lot about your particular small boat problem. That beach of yours is just not boat-friendly. Potential candidates all seemed too fragile and/or too unwieldy. The proposed design looks like a truly useful boat for the purpose. Dragging it around won't hurt it, nor will it be too difficult.

 

Who would have guessed that Bob could look at a boating problem and design a solution all by his little self? ;)



#2 Bob Perry

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 11:33 AM

The first "layer" of my beach is big logs. These get rearranged each winter and serve as a natural bulkhead against the winter waves. Some people clear them. I leave them there. I like them.

.

Then we have sand. The we go to small rocks and the rocks get bigger as you get closer to the water. At low tide there is a band of sand. At a minus low ride there are rocks with barnacles on them. You can wear through the bottom of a Walker Bay lke a pair of cheap shoes.

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#3 Tom Ray

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 11:41 AM

That's a boat-eating beach, Bob. Beautiful, though.

 

Do you have a weight estimate for your boat yet?

 

My old aluminum boat weighs 105 lbs according to the old brochure I found online.

 

800px-Feathercraftbb001.jpg

 

55 years later, still hangin' in there.

 

alum-boat-7-17-13.jpg

 

If you look close, you can see where it fell off the car and got dragged alongside on the highway. It was not even 20 years old at the time.

 

I hope the rest of that paint finishes wearing off soon.



#4 Bob Perry

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 11:47 AM

Tom:

I have 78 sq. ft. of shell and I am hoping to get a finihsed weight of under 115 lbs. but I won't know until we finish the details. Jody found a really cool extrusion he wants to use for the sheer. It will add 15 lbs.

I like your skiff. It has nice lines. 55 years old tells you something about alu.



#5 Tom Ray

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 11:53 AM

I figured that being longer but skinnier, it would probably weigh about what my boat weighs.

 

I put it in the back of my truck and drag it up and down the shore by the concrete ramp. It's not too bad, but I'm thinking of getting it a little trailer. The main reason: I would prefer using my golf cart instead of the truck to go down to the ramp. It's not hard to drag around, but trailer launching is a bit easier.

 

You said in the other thread that you are not allowed to build a dock. Can you build some kind of primitive marine railway or slide?



#6 Bob Perry

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 01:33 PM

No Tom. I can't build anything on the beach. We have a 12' tide range here. There are high tides when the water is up to my lawn and many high tides where the water comes all the way up to the logs essentially leaving no beach. So, if I pulled the boat up onto the logs when not in use there would be times when I did not have far to go to launch it.

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#7 soak_ed

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 01:40 PM

The first "layer" of my beach is big logs. These get rearranged each winter and serve as a natural bulkhead against the winter waves. Some people clear them. I leave them there. I like them.

.

Then we have sand. The we go to small rocks and the rocks get bigger as you get closer to the water. At low tide there is a band of sand. At a minus low ride there are rocks with barnacles on them. You can wear through the bottom of a Walker Bay lke a pair of cheap shoes.

I wish I had that kind of problem in my back yard.  We do have a large pond about 150' from our property, a small rowboat could work there and no big logs or rocks to worry about, just weeds.  I could harness our 2 Labs to it and maybe get on a plane if they were feeling energetic and didn't run out of pond before they had to turn.  BTW, nice little grand sprout too.



#8 Bob Perry

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 01:42 PM

Thanks Soaker. That is my darling granddaughter Violet.



#9 kimbottles

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 03:20 PM

I have exactly the same beach situation as Bob; sand, rocks and beach logs (why would anyone clear out their beach logs!??)

 

I HAVE worn through a Walker Bay dink dragging it up and down the beach. Then I started using PVC pipe rollers. Works well but really takes two people.

 

The Perry PeenPod sounds like a solution. Add me to the customer list.

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#10 Jose Carumba

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 08:30 PM

Here's our old Beach on Fox Island.  It goes out another 100 yds or so on a minus tide. It tears up boats.  We re-glassed our GRP boats a lot.  I used a dolly for my JY-14.  The aluminum skiff was still going strong when we sold the place.

 

Edit:  Sorry the beach is so washed out.

 

Attached File  IMG_1837.JPG   405.18K   52 downloads



#11 smackdaddy

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 09:29 PM

It seems Bob is becoming the authority on origami boat design. That's cool.



#12 Bob Perry

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 09:49 PM

You are going to get me into trouble Smacks. If anyone becoming an authority here on origami it's Rasper.  I'm the one waving the arms and making ridiculous demands. Kind of like a client.



#13 Rasputin22

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 10:47 PM

Did you hear that? A client! Kind of? Well, for me that is close enough. Yes it is odd how this project came to pass, but when the Maestro lays awake at night with an idea keeping him awake, and he calls me the next morning to relate his vision, you pretty much have to pay attention and listen to what the man wants. We are both very engaged at this point in trying to go beyond the bounds of what is know as 'Origami Boats'. Bob can with a phone call get the best in the business when it comes to metal boats, he is in the epicenter of state of the art metal boat design and construction. Sounds like Bob has a lot of interest in his area and it would be great to put these out in 'batches'. I'm more of a West System kind of guy and fully intend to build one of these in epoxy/ply and while it might not have the 'drag it up the rocks' quality but my 'sugar sand' beach out my back door won't be as challenging. Let me or Bob know if you are interested in the ply version. I just sent Bob the latest revisions. 



#14 familysailor

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 11:03 PM

If you could offer it in a kit for homebuilders that could be put together with liquid aluminim that comes in a tube you'd be a hero.

Kinda like the best/worst parts of stitch an glue with metal!

 

Drilling all the holes for the stitching phase might be a bit tiresome.



#15 smackdaddy

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 11:24 PM

Did you hear that? A client! Kind of? Well, for me that is close enough. Yes it is odd how this project came to pass, but when the Maestro lays awake at night with an idea keeping him awake, and he calls me the next morning to relate his vision, you pretty much have to pay attention and listen to what the man wants. We are both very engaged at this point in trying to go beyond the bounds of what is know as 'Origami Boats'. Bob can with a phone call get the best in the business when it comes to metal boats, he is in the epicenter of state of the art metal boat design and construction. Sounds like Bob has a lot of interest in his area and it would be great to put these out in 'batches'. I'm more of a West System kind of guy and fully intend to build one of these in epoxy/ply and while it might not have the 'drag it up the rocks' quality but my 'sugar sand' beach out my back door won't be as challenging. Let me or Bob know if you are interested in the ply version. I just sent Bob the latest revisions. 

 

Ah, now I understand. Rasp - you da man!

 

I was just tossing a bit of a dig toward our old friend, Bob.

 

I can't wait to see this thing with Violet at the paddle!



#16 Bob Perry

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 11:49 PM

 A guy on another site mentioned an alu whaleboat. I didn't think much about it. Then I woke up around 2am and couldn't think of anything else. I wanted to sleep but the idea kept working it's way into my thoughts and by 5am I had it pretty well laid out in the acad in my brain. The only minor question remaining was, could it be done in flat plate. I called Jody early in the morning and asked him if he wanted an adventure in design. He said something that I interprited as "sure". I knew he would. He loves this stuff. Like I do. I laid out the parameters and told him I'd send him a drawing soon . In about three hours Jody started sending me images. He hadn't seen my drawings yet but he has a knack of understanding my design rants. He was 98.5% spot on wirth his first try.

 

He's right. It is good to know the "best in the business". I do and he's one of them.

 

Looks like 120 lbs. since we gussied it up with some trim. Not sure how the oarlocks ( I call them row locks) are going to be handled. Jody found some really Gucci ones with really Gucci prices. I'm still leaning towards a more Popeye look. But after thinking about this detail most of today I think Jody may be right. These images show my rowlock brackets designed to take a vartiety of thole pin holes for different sized rowers. We wil try to stick with the classic 7-11 relationship for rowlocks and seat. Fact is I don't have a fucking clue where the tholepins go but Jody came up with this 7-11 rule and we will go with that for now.

 

I'm pretty excited because nobody builds a boat like this in alu. Of course I want a varnished mahogany planked peapod. I want the new S Class Mercedes too. But a beautiful wooden peapod would get beat to shit on my beach. Better keep it for a salad bar in a nice restaurant. I want a work boat. Maybe I will call mine POPEYE.

 

When I look at it I think it's one of the coolest boats I have ever seen. Rowing a great pulling boat is so satisfying.

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#17 SloopJonB

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 11:59 PM

WTF is the 7-11 rule?



#18 Brodie

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 12:09 AM

Can't wait to see the real thing. Guessing this build will go a little faster than the Francis Lee.

I got hooked on boats (of all types) by a welded aluminum flat bottomed skiff that my grandmother bought from a defunct boys camp. I rowed that boat everywhere when I was a kid. The camp was called Tomahawk so that's what we called the boat. Doesn't get used much any more but is still good as new and nearing 50 years old (builders plate says 1965).

#19 Rasputin22

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 12:09 AM

WTF is the 7-11 rule?

Sorry that Bob and I didn't reveal that little tidbit. In my Googling on the subject of 'oarllock ratio' I came up with numerous references to the '7-11' rule. I followed those leads and came to the conclusion that the centers of the oarlocks should be 11" aft of the aft edge of the seat and 7" higher that the top of the seat. Seems about right and we are going with that tidbit of Internet Wisdom unless someone else refutes that.



#20 Jury Rigged

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 12:11 AM

Some VERY serious eye candy - She's beautiful, Bob (applies to both Ruby and the Peapod)!  



#21 olaf hart

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 12:18 AM

 A guy on another site mentioned an alu whaleboat. I didn't think much about it. Then I woke up around 2am and couldn't think of anything else. I wanted to sleep but the idea kept working it's way into my thoughts and by 5am I had it pretty well laid out in the acad in my brain. The only minor question remaining was, could it be done in flat plate. I called Jody early in the morning and asked him if he wanted an adventure in design. He said something that I interprited as "sure". I knew he would. He loves this stuff. Like I do. I laid out the parameters and told him I'd send him a drawing soon . In about three hours Jody started sending me images. He hadn't seen my drawings yet but he has a knack of understanding my design rants. He was 98.5% spot on wirth his first try.

 

He's right. It is good to know the "best in the business". I do and he's one of them.

 

Looks like 120 lbs. since we gussied it up with some trim. Not sure how the oarlocks ( I call them row locks) are going to be handled. Jody found some really Gucci ones with really Gucci prices. I'm still leaning towards a more Popeye look. But after thinking about this detail most of today I think Jody may be right. These images show my rowlock brackets designed to take a vartiety of thole pin holes for different sized rowers. We wil try to stick with the classic 7-11 relationship for rowlocks and seat. Fact is I don't have a fucking clue where the tholepins go but Jody came up with this 7-11 rule and we will go with that for now.

 

I'm pretty excited because nobody builds a boat like this in alu. Of course I want a varnished mahogany planked peapod. I want the new S Class Mercedes too. But a beautiful wooden peapod would get beat to shit on my beach. Better keep it for a salad bar in a nice restaurant. I want a work boat. Maybe I will call mine POPEYE.

 

When I look at it I think it's one of the coolest boats I have ever seen. Rowing a great pulling boat is so satisfying.

 

7-11 always worked for me.

 

Popeye is a great name

 

"I yams what I yam"



#22 Rasputin22

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 12:34 AM

Thanks Jury and Olaf. She will be a sweet 'ting.



#23 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 01:11 AM

Flyer:

That is very weird.

I have never had an asshole for a client. I have had some odd fellows but they had lots of money and I think lots of money can make you odd and a bit paranoid.

I could tell you stories of amazing generosity from some of my clients. Life changing stuff. I'm not going into details.

 

To begin with, when you start a new custom design project you know you are going to get to know each other very well. You will spend a lot of time together and it is critical that you can communicate. So if there isn't some sense of "we could be friends" I don't think you get the design job.

 

I had one guy come to my office about eight years ago. We talked for a couple of hours. I thought he was an asshole. I laid down my framework for working with him. He went to anotrher well known designer. He ended up suing that designer and pretty much being the reason that designer retired. "I don't need this shit." I was sooooo glad I blew him off in my initial meeting.



#24 Jose Carumba

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 01:56 AM

True that Bob.

#25 Elegua

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 02:49 AM

Since it's so rough n tuff compared to those effete wooden and plastic peapods, you should weld a small ram on the prow so that others know to keep their distance. 



#26 Steam Flyer

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 02:54 AM

Flyer:

That is very weird.

I have never had an asshole for a client. I have had some odd fellows but they had lots of money and I think lots of money can make you odd and a bit paranoid.

I could tell you stories of amazing generosity from some of my clients. Life changing stuff. I'm not going into details.

 

.... ...

 

I apologize for posting a statement that did not contribute to the thread, as well as being somebody else's business. That was stupid.

 

FB- Doug



#27 steele

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 03:49 AM

2 thoughts for consideration,

 

It might make sense to put in some mounting points for a sliding seat,  the ability to fully use your legs when rowing makes for a much smoother and stronger stroke.

 

At 120 lbs you might be nearing the limit of moving this thing up the beach.  Hauliing it uphill accross sand and rock and over logs when tired at the end of a good row will be a challenge.  Do you have a windlass to mount on the back porch?



#28 kimbottles

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 04:00 AM

2 thoughts for consideration,
 
It might make sense to put in some mounting points for a sliding seat,  the ability to fully use your legs when rowing makes for a much smoother and stronger stroke.
 
At 120 lbs you might be nearing the limit of moving this thing up the beach.  Hauliing it uphill accross sand and rock and over logs when tired at the end of a good row will be a challenge.  Do you have a windlass to mount on the back porch?


Or some retractable wheels? Or cool dolly?

#29 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 04:22 AM

Steele:

I do not want a sliding seat. If I had wanted a sliding seat I would have designed it that way. You can have a sliding seat on yours. Think Popeye.

I have designed this boat for myself. What you see is what I want.

Because it is alu and built as a one off there are all sorts of mods that can be made including a sailing rig if you want that. I do not.

My beach neighbor came over tonight and said he wants a rubber rub rail on his sheer. Fine. He can have it.

 

I have already designed a retracting beach dolly system for the boat. I did that while I lay in bed that night. I'm pretty good at this. Not sure how big the wheels wil have to be. Not sure if I can get by with one wheel.

 

I am also resigned to the possibility that people will come up with ideas to improve on the basic boat so please continue to pepper me with your ideas. You never know. I may act defensively initially but after some time to reflect on the suggestion I may see it's value. I'm like that.



#30 rattus32

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 04:38 AM

7-11 always worked for me.

 

Popeye is a great name

 

"I yams what I yam"

 

I'm about Bob's size and might think about altering that to the 8-12 or 9-13 rule. XL-T and all that.

 

We could probably add another 6" to the oars (rows ;--) ) as well. I grew up rowing (oaring) jon boats and later got a taste of real shells - what a sense of accomplishment when you really knew what each stroke (of an oar - dammit...!) could produce.



#31 floating dutchman

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 05:51 AM

Stick to your guns Bob, you have a great idea, glossing it up with "stuff" will wreak it, make it to hard for one person to drag up and down the rough beach.

The concept it great.

I can see why this boat doesn't exist on the market already:  Not suitable for a motor, won't sail well, won't fit on the deck of a sail boat, etc, etc.

Dang, it's not a boat for "marketing" it's a boat you want.

 

A Yacht designer comes up with a solution to a problem he has, and comes up with this,  How cool is that.

I would have suggested a dory like boat if I was asked,  I guess that's why Bob doesn't ask folk like me.



#32 floating dutchman

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 06:33 AM

Sod it, I'm going to overstep the mark at the risk of telling the expert how to do his job.

 

Bob (said very quietly) have you thought about having the seat going length wise instead of cross wise ( yea, I know, so shoot me for terminology, even spell check couldn't help me there).

 

Would male structure harder to keep light but would (or could) make for a better fishing seating especially if your more than one up.

and you can get the seating just right for how you row.

Storage and flotation, Yea, your job. :)

 

FD



#33 nota

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 07:04 AM

your boat bob

 

 

 

i really like leg rowing

there is so much more power in a leg vs arms

one simple ''seat'' is a skate board

skate boards are also handy when moving batterys or ice blocks

a big  wheeled off road skateboard could work as a dolly on a hard beach too

 

btw I also like cheap home made oars

redwood or western ceder 2x4 cut diagonal to a 1''to 3'' taper

shape the hand-holds and round the tapered end some I used a router with a rounding bit

but a surform file will do it a bit slower as the wood is soft and lite

then cut a blade out of a 5 gal paint bucket but leave a 1'' tab/fence at the bottom tip by cutting into the bottom of the paint bucket

it gives a nice spoon shape and stiffens the blade you can split the ends to insert the plastic or just screw it to the wood

that results a nice 8+ ft oar at $10 a pair about 1/2 the weight of most shop oars too

10 or 12 footers are just as eazy if a few bucks more for the wood



#34 olaf hart

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 07:14 AM

Sod it, I'm going to overstep the mark at the risk of telling the expert how to do his job.

 

Bob (said very quietly) have you thought about having the seat going length wise instead of cross wise ( yea, I know, so shoot me for terminology, even spell check couldn't help me there).

 

Would male structure harder to keep light but would (or could) make for a better fishing seating especially if your more than one up.

and you can get the seating just right for how you row.

Storage and flotation, Yea, your job. :)

 

FD

 

JBE has a boat that size with a longitudinal seat.

I have also done that for a few boats, works well but its a bit hard to keep the boat stable stepping off a dock, all right though off a beach.

I left a gap in the middle of the seat once, it solved that problem.

Easy to put foam blocks under the seat as well, the bouyancy stays relatively high.



#35 zedboy

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 07:51 AM

. Rowing a great pulling boat is so satisfying.

 

At the risk of sounding dumb, is that just a synonym for "good rowing boat" or is "pulling" something more technical?

 

In that direction, can you tell us a little bit about what makes a hull good for rowing?

 

I rowed jon boats all the time as a kid. It was one of my dad's favorite ways of entertaining us. They were not easy to row. Then one time we rented a wooden peapod in Mystic CT and I rowed myself a huge set of blisters. It was a blast, and an awesome perspective on the pretty sailboats in the museum.



#36 floating dutchman

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:19 AM

olaf, Gap in the seat, if Bob even considers the the length wise seat, He'll sort that stuff out, Have you seen what he does for a living? :lol: Also, long wise seat messes with legs for a pure rowing boat.

 

Another random thought,  hand holds for dragging up and down the beach,  I'd think that hand holds want to be where you'd naturally take some weight of the boat when dragging,  I know you're intending to build to take the scraping but it grates against the nerves for a boat lover to not at least take some of the pain off the hull. 

 

I'll shut up now.



#37 Autograph

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 09:10 AM

For knocking about, I like long narrow blades for the oars. Not as fast as short blades on sculls, but a lot easier on the muscles, as they are far less on an off, and an easier motion of the oar as it comes out of the water partially when rowing in a cross sea. Also, no need to feather them going upwind. Purists be fuct.

The local workboats had very simple crutches, simply a single steel thole pin sticking out off the gunnel, and a fixed ring welded to a plate bolted to one side of the square section oar. No option to move the oars in or out, or feather, but lovely to be able to let go of the oars any time, to tend fishing gear or drink etc, without having to bring the oars aboard. The oars just float in the water, adding a little stability, until you need them. The oars are usually behind the pin, but when the muscles tire, you can flip the oars over to the front of the pin, shortening the distance between rower and oars, and use a different group of muscles for a bit. Wanky leisure crutches will just look wrong on this boat.

Oh, and it needs cup holders too. And a big assed golfing umbrella, for wanking along downwind.

#38 Tom Ray

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 10:26 AM

If you could offer it in a kit for homebuilders that could be put together with liquid aluminim that comes in a tube you'd be a hero.

Kinda like the best/worst parts of stitch an glue with metal!

 

Drilling all the holes for the stitching phase might be a bit tiresome.

 

I could entertain myself drilling holes, if you want them the size of a .17 HMR bullet. ;)
 



#39 Tom Ray

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 10:34 AM

Steele:
I do not want a sliding seat. If I had wanted a sliding seat I would have designed it that way. You can have a sliding seat on yours. Think Popeye.
I have designed this boat for myself. What you see is what I want.
Because it is alu and built as a one off there are all sorts of mods that can be made including a sailing rig if you want that. I do not.
My beach neighbor came over tonight and said he wants a rubber rub rail on his sheer. Fine. He can have it.
 
I have already designed a retracting beach dolly system for the boat. I did that while I lay in bed that night. I'm pretty good at this. Not sure how big the wheels wil have to be. Not sure if I can get by with one wheel.
 
I am also resigned to the possibility that people will come up with ideas to improve on the basic boat so please continue to pepper me with your ideas. You never know. I may act defensively initially but after some time to reflect on the suggestion I may see it's value. I'm like that.

 
I'm very interested in your dolly system.
 
Your beach gives me nightmares. I like my little boats because I can launch them anywhere. Anywhere except your beach. Or Kim's, it turns out, but he has a dock.
 
I don't have any bright ideas for your boat, but I like this one:

Another random thought, hand holds for dragging up and down the beach...

I would weld those in place AFTER dragging it around a bit.

My skiff's little foredeck has a rounded aft edge that is much better for dragging it uphill than the bow handle.

OK, I do have one idea: the other day when I was getting towed home, I looked at a hole we punched just forward of that rounded aft edge. It was put there to pick up the boat with a davit, since we didn't really trust the bow handle for that job.

I thought about using it to attach the tow line, but the hole we punched is very jagged on the fwd edge and would eat a line quickly. So my thought is: make your lifting/dragging handles tow-boat friendly. We towed the boat home by its bow handle. I'm going to modify that hole or put a big shackle in it or something because the bow handle is really not all that strong and I'd rather not tow from it again.

#40 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 01:07 PM

Floater:

I have been thinking of a dory type for years. Hard to "express myself" in a dory hull form. But I considered it.

 

Handholds? Why? I have this 4" wide "sidedeck" with a trim piece on it going all way around the boat. You can grab the boat there. I did think this out.

 

Longitudinal seat could work. I like the idea but I have this clever idea for an athwartships seat that is convex and uses it's supports for hull frames. A longitudinal seat would not help me with framing. But I will kleep it in the bc akj mof my mind. Many thanks for that suggestion.

 

I have stem and stern "posts" out of .25" plate and I will drill a hole in each maybe put a .5" dia. alu pin thru the hole for a "cl;eat" for towing.

The more elaborate the boat gets the heavier it gets.

 

I say "pulling boat" because I liike the wayb it sounds. It sounds serious. "Row boat" sounds like a kid's toy.

 

What makes a good pulling boat? Look at the drawings. That's what makes a good pulling boat., Do I really need to talk about it when you can see it for yourselves? My ideas are all there naked for you to see.

 

Autograph: I feather as a reflex. Not sure I could row today without feathering. Can you provide a photo of the thole pin arrangement you talk about?



#41 Tom Ray

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 01:33 PM

Are those pieces that stick out and hold the oarlocks going to be hinged or fixed?

 

Where will the oars sit when at rest?



#42 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 01:52 PM

Tom:

Those oarlock brackets will be fixed IF we end up going that way. Why would I hinge them?

The oars will sit resting up against the side of my house when the boat is at rest.  Ha!



#43 SemiSalt

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 01:52 PM

A lot of little boats have a handhold worked into the breastplate. It may be nothing more than a comfortable round under the aft edge. 

 

John Welsford's advice on oarlock placement for one of his boats:

 

Rowlocks should be positioned 325mm aft of the after edge of the rowers seat, and 200mm above the seat level.

 

That would be the 7 7/8  - 12 3/4 rule. That's for a particular boat, not general advice.

 

Since Bob is a big guy, I wouldn't err on the small side. Anyway, I bet Bob will sit on the seat and try out the geometry before the permanent installation.



#44 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 02:08 PM

SemI:

Exactly. I'll mock up the rowing position before any drilling gets done. Being alu changes in seat geometry will be reltively easy if required.

 

We already have a round trim piece on the edge of the deck. That will be our "handhold". It continues around breast hook and fanny hook. It shows clearly on the 3D model.



#45 Tucky

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 02:51 PM

FWIW, noticed a discussion of flotation in the other thread. I bought the PT 11 manual last night (thinking of building one for me and the grandchildren:-), and noticed in the info about the boat a lot of discussion about flotation and USCG suggestions, which sounded a lot like requirements, if you are selling plans or kits or boats. Things have seemingly changed a lot, in the small boat resale world.

 

I know you are just building for yourself, but what are the issues for small boat flotation- just curious.



#46 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 02:56 PM

Tuck:

I have not looked at "regulations". I'm thinking twice the weight for flotation. I'll have a chat with Russel and get his views on that.



#47 Tom Ray

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 03:05 PM

Tom:

Those oarlock brackets will be fixed IF we end up going that way. Why would I hinge them?

The oars will sit resting up against the side of my house when the boat is at rest.  Ha!

 


They stick out and might mar the side of Kim's boat. I don't row, so if that's a stupid thought I'm sure you'll let me know. ;)

 

I mean "at rest" as in "Bob is aboard, but his hands have a camera in them because his granddaughter is being extremely cute."



#48 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 03:10 PM

Tom I knew exactly what you meant and I have no idea. I suspect they'll dangle over the side with the blades floatng in the drink. Somethings you just have to wait and find out. It will have a lot to do with what oarlock system we go with.

Fact is I'm not designing the boat as a tender for Kim's big boat. I'll bet Kim will have a fender or two. I'm sure if he sees me approaching at ramming speed he'll find those fenders quickly. I'm looking at the Gaco oarlock system from Australia.

 

If I go with the Gaco system (nice name) I may eliminate the brackets and just mount the oarlocks right into the side deck leaving the rail clean. Save weight. Save dough.. Preserve the sweet, unbroken sheerline.

 

Or, if Kim is concerned, I'll use one of my two Walker Bays.



#49 Tom Ray

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 03:31 PM

If you leave it with those fixed "ears" sticking out on the sides, it will make it a bit harder to roll it over on land. There is something to be said for sturdy parts that are fixed in place, though.

 

Another non-rower type question. I have a convex mirror for watching water skiers. Will you mount one to see where you're going? Mine slips in a small plastic mount and is stored unless someone is skiing.



#50 BayGal

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 03:36 PM

Sliding and able to row like a crewing scull makes rowing much faster easier and more ergodynamic. 

 

How about a flip down thing on the stern where a rubber wheel can be flipped down on the beach so can make the land portion easier think like a kayak cart



#51 Tom Ray

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 03:38 PM

...

I say "pulling boat" because I like the way it sounds. It sounds serious. "Row boat" sounds like a kid's toy.

...

 


Sorry I called Popeye a rowboat in the thread title, Bob.

 

I think any boat that does not have a job is a toy. Nothing wrong with it. The Sliver is a really big, really cool toy. Popeye's a toy. Its only job is to make you happy. That's a toy, even if it doesn't also make your granddaughter happy! ;)



#52 Tom Ray

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 03:40 PM

...

 

How about a flip down thing on the stern where a rubber wheel can be flipped down on the beach so can make the land portion easier think like a kayak cart

 


That's the way I think too, but Bob's beach has daunting logjams and rocks that would make normal wheels just things that snag on the many obstacles.



#53 SemiSalt

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 04:02 PM

Sliding and able to row like a crewing scull makes rowing much faster easier and more ergodynamic. 

 

I read somewhere that long distance rowers have given up sliding seats. Endurance is more about oxygen and less about muscle.



#54 Trickypig

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 04:18 PM

Hey Bob, can you bring it to the next Rendezvous so we can use it in the rowing competition?  :)



#55 TheFlash

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 04:22 PM

it's very cool. If you get there, I'm more of a ply/glass guy myself, and a kit from that well know fella up near you would be handy.



#56 miscut jib

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 04:28 PM

Any idea of the weight for ply/glass? Similar ballpark? It's half tempting, but the leave and forget about it and it'll be just fine aspect of aluminum is a bit attractive



#57 ICBT

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 04:39 PM

Sliding and able to row like a crewing scull makes rowing much faster easier and more ergodynamic. 

 

I read somewhere that long distance rowers have given up sliding seats. Endurance is more about oxygen and less about muscle.

 

Re: Oarlocks -- These are the bee's knees. http://www.paddlesan...OBRA-OAR-LOCKS/ They're not too pricey and will last forever. And they're made in Oregon, you can just call Sawyer up and tell them what you're doing, and they'll work with you. Great guys. (and they make great oars).

 

Re: Oarlock location -- beware of putting the oarlock on the gunwale, if only because you want to make sure the rowing geometry works out, and the oarlock pivot point is probably the most important part of that measurement. It has a lot to do with how long your oars are going to be. There's a boatload (pun intended) of info out there about proper rowing geometry, depending on how nerdy you want to get.

 

Re: Oarlock bases (riggers) sticking out -- Yeah, it makes tying up to another boat difficult. You might end up investing in some large fenders (but then you have these huge fenders kicking around). Or you can just pull up alongside and toss the beers over a few feet of water.

 

Re: sliding seats -- On the ocean rowboat we had sliding seats. We only slid ~ 6 inches, mostly because a little leg break relieves the stress on your back with that much load. In a boat like this, you're not going to get that much out of your legs anyways (other than just being more tired). Besides, then you wouldn't have a "rowboat". You'd have a sculling boat. And then all those damn rowers will tell you how you're doing it wrong.

 

Beautiful little boat. I'd order one if I had the space.



#58 viktor

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 05:13 PM

it's very cool. If you get there, I'm more of a ply/glass guy myself, and a kit from that well know fella up near you would be handy.

 

+1 Even just a good set of plans to work from would be good. Also interested in the weight difference,but your working on YOUR boat now so that can all weight :)  Very nice looking  pulling boat Bob.



#59 steele

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 05:59 PM

This is a somewhat similar idea to give you an option in wood,

 

Attached File  wherry.jpg   43.94K   19 downloads

http://www.clcboats....erry.html?jcs=1

 

Still 100 lbs and not has durable.  I have used this company before for their kayak kits and found them to be very good.



#60 Brodie

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 06:33 PM

No sliding seat - as a long time sliding seat rower I cringe every time I see suggestions to put a sliding seat rig in boats that are too short, too heavy, or the wrong shape. A while back I acquired an abandoned Gloucester Gull that had been converted to sliding seat. I've rowed a "normal" one and they row very nicely with a good turn of speed. Can't imagine any good reason to mess up a boat like that with a sliding seat. Sliding seats produce tremendous pitching moments that require volume in the bow and stern to keep the boat from wasting all the rowers energy in pitching. Need length and narrow beam to reduce resistance so that you can get some reasonable glide for your effort - sculling is a low cadence thing, if the boat won't glide out on the recovery then you have to increase the stroke rate to keep her moving and you wear yourself out. More efficient to use fixed seat where you can turn over the oars more quickly with less effort.

IMO, if the boat makes an audible bow wave when rowing sliding seat, then you're pushing the limits. True sculling boats are silent at any speed.

#61 Rasputin22

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 06:39 PM

No sliding seat - as a long time sliding seat rower I cringe every time I see suggestions to put a sliding seat rig in boats that are too short, too heavy, or the wrong shape. A while back I acquired an abandoned Gloucester Gull that had been converted to sliding seat. I've rowed a "normal" one and they row very nicely with a good turn of speed. Can't imagine any good reason to mess up a boat like that with a sliding seat. Sliding seats produce tremendous pitching moments that require volume in the bow and stern to keep the boat from wasting all the rowers energy in pitching. Need length and narrow beam to reduce resistance so that you can get some reasonable glide for your effort - sculling is a low cadence thing, if the boat won't glide out on the recovery then you have to increase the stroke rate to keep her moving and you wear yourself out. More efficient to use fixed seat where you can turn over the oars more quickly with less effort.

IMO, if the boat makes an audible bow wave when rowing sliding seat, then you're pushing the limits. True sculling boats are silent at any speed.

 

 

Great points and observations Brodie, thanks! Bob scoffed at my initial mention of a sliding seat, little wonder. 



#62 Brodie

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 06:44 PM

I love sliding seat rowing - one of the best aerobic exercises out there. I still have my oars, maybe someday I'll find a nice Maas Aero relatively cheap and start rowing again. I rowed on the Charles in Boston for several years, amazing experience. But the boats are really only good for one thing - to go fast in a straight line. They excel at that, and suck at anything else.

#63 BGD

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:01 PM

Sorry, can't tell from the renderings but any thought to having enough room for some crab pots between the gunwales?



#64 view at the front

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:25 PM

This is a somewhat similar idea to give you an option in wood,

 

attachicon.gifwherry.jpg

http://www.clcboats....erry.html?jcs=1

 

Still 100 lbs and not has durable.  I have used this company before for their kayak kits and found them to be very good.

 

I have a beach much like Bob's, and currently keep the skiff out in the bay with a retrieval system.  I like the looks of the wherry above, but need something a bit more robust to carry a couple of crab pots like BGD suggests.



#65 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:34 PM

We are getting to a point here in this thread where I am being asked questions I have already answered.,

 

No sliding seat because I don't want one. Simple as that. I have rowed shells and I have rowed wherries. No sliding seat. Thanks for you interesting comments on that Brods.

Crab pots are a must. We crab every weekend during the season. This peapod is 15' LOA. If I can find room in my 7'6" Walker Bay for a crab pot I think I can find room in the peapod.

 

ICBT:

I'll look at that Oregon company. I like Oregon. I can drve there. Thanks for the tip.

 

Miscut:

I will concentrate on getting the alu boat built for now. Build options can be looked at later.

 

I am already thinking about a flip down beach wheel. That has been ion the mix since the first night.

 

I have another builder interested in a "icense" thanks to CA.

 

Tom:

You can call it a rowboat. I probably will.



#66 Rasputin22

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:48 PM

Sliding and able to row like a crewing scull makes rowing much faster easier and more ergodynamic. 

 

How about a flip down thing on the stern where a rubber wheel can be flipped down on the beach so can make the land portion easier think like a kayak cart

 

You mean wheels like this?

 

At-Speed-cropped.jpg



#67 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:51 PM

Yes. Exactly.



#68 Rasputin22

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:57 PM

Got a new nautical term for consideration. 'Forcola' Anyone ever heard of one? 

 

Big+Morso+4.jpg

 

It is the single outrigger/thole pin for a Venetian Gondola. Bob just sent me a great sketch that  was sent to him as a suggestion on how to make the outriggers for the oarlocks could fold as well as be adjustable fore and aft. It showed a 'thole pin' and I hadn't heard that one in a while, but the 'Focula' looks like a thole pin on steroids. The root word must be 'fulcrum'. 



#69 Ishmael

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 09:16 PM

No sculling notch? No yuloh?

 

IMGP3037b.jpg

 

I suppose you could always weld on another oarlock anywhere you wanted.



#70 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 09:41 PM

Rasp:

I took high school Latin and I think the root word is "foc".

 

Like "Foc that thing looks weird."



#71 view at the front

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 09:45 PM

Well said.

 

What I forgot to say earlier is:  That pulling boat is beautiful.



#72 Bob Perry

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 09:53 PM

Viewster:

Many thanks for that. I'll give the lion's share of the credit to the man behind the 3d models, Rasper.



#73 Bulbhunter

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 10:09 PM

Sliding and able to row like a crewing scull makes rowing much faster easier and more ergodynamic. 

 

How about a flip down thing on the stern where a rubber wheel can be flipped down on the beach so can make the land portion easier think like a kayak cart

 

You mean wheels like this?

 

At-Speed-cropped.jpg

This is a parade in Northern CA where the contestants need to pedal their bike across the marina then they do a road course.



#74 JBE

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 10:25 PM

Love the boat Bob , I have visions of those logs being co opted into a sort of rescue boat launch , jump in the boat at the top and head off for a nantucket sleigh ride on land.

 

 Olaf , that boat is actually a Carrington university boatbuilding hull.I finished it off and changed it to row and sail  and outboard as you've probably seen. The class builds them cedar strip and then laminates ribs in as well for the exercise. At various times they sell em off  to one of the class or on our ebay equivalent.

 Its been a great  sort of 'special' tender for us  when cruising the coast and I do like the fore and aft thwart, because it centres everyone and you get perfect trim with various numbers of passengers.. Must be pretty well built because its been picked up and rolled down the beach by wind gusts on two seperate occasions, outboard an all.

 I'm very grateful to whoever mentioned the 7/11 rule before. I know the 11 part( the rule I know is  is 10 to 12 in depending) but something they got wrong with this boat is the thwart is too high relative to the gunwhale and I've been progressively raising the oarlocks to get closer to the 7 ( as it turns out).

Sod it, I'm going to overstep the mark at the risk of telling the expert how to do his job.

 

Bob (said very quietly) have you thought about having the seat going length wise instead of cross wise ( yea, I know, so shoot me for terminology, even spell check couldn't help me there).

 

Would male structure harder to keep light but would (or could) make for a better fishing seating especially if your more than one up.

and you can get the seating just right for how you row.

Storage and flotation, Yea, your job. :)

 

FD

 

JBE has a boat that size with a longitudinal seat.

I have also done that for a few boats, works well but its a bit hard to keep the boat stable stepping off a dock, all right though off a beach.

I left a gap in the middle of the seat once, it solved that problem.

Easy to put foam blocks under the seat as well, the bouyancy stays relatively high.



#75 philsboat

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 11:20 PM

Great boat Bob!

One thing I would like is an adjustable foot brace,Maybe sliding on an aluminum "T" channel.

 

Phil



#76 Steam Flyer

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 11:54 PM

No sliding seat - as a long time sliding seat rower I cringe every time I see suggestions to put a sliding seat rig in boats that are too short, too heavy, or the wrong shape. A while back I acquired an abandoned Gloucester Gull that had been converted to sliding seat. I've rowed a "normal" one and they row very nicely with a good turn of speed. Can't imagine any good reason to mess up a boat like that with a sliding seat. Sliding seats produce tremendous pitching moments that require volume in the bow and stern to keep the boat from wasting all the rowers energy in pitching. Need length and narrow beam to reduce resistance so that you can get some reasonable glide for your effort - sculling is a low cadence thing, if the boat won't glide out on the recovery then you have to increase the stroke rate to keep her moving and you wear yourself out. More efficient to use fixed seat where you can turn over the oars more quickly with less effort.

IMO, if the boat makes an audible bow wave when rowing sliding seat, then you're pushing the limits. True sculling boats are silent at any speed.

 

 

Great points and observations Brodie, thanks! Bob scoffed at my initial mention of a sliding seat, little wonder. 

 

Thanks from here too, never thought about the bow wave but that's a good point.

 

However I have rowed a number of sliding seat boats that would be on the wrong side the scale, and just because a boat has a sliding seat doesn't mean you need to rack it full throw on every stroke.

 

There's been a big renaissance in kayaks, makes sense for some. For anything other than white water acrobatics, or taking small light boats around marginal waters, rowing is much more efficient & effective. It's also a subtle skill, and very rewarding as well as good exercise. One of the points is to match the stroke to the boat, the load, and the water conditions. I'm not a great oarsman by any means but I know a little and am still in decent shape. Rowing is one of those no-wind sailing class activities, the students can learn to feather, to steer, to scull, to boat-oars with just the right timing and give just the right kick to come alongside smoothly... most of them just want to try to row really really hard & show off though.

 

FB- Doug



#77 Bob Perry

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:02 AM

I have no interest in rowing hard and showing off. I just want a reasonable return for my efforts at the oars. I don't want to have to fight a pig of a boat with every stroke.

I once rowed a Whitehall from the Fremont bridge to Mercer Island and back. I had nothing else to do and I thought it would be fun. It was. Sort of.



#78 olaf hart

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:09 AM

Kayaks or rowboats, its a Zen thing.

Just there in the present, a steady rhythm, its the closest I can come to meditation.



#79 Bob Perry

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:17 AM

We bought two fancy cf kayaks years ago. I even had an extra cockpit put in mine for my dog.  I just never warmed up to kayaking. Neither did the dog. Maybe its the sitting position. Maybe its the confinement. Maybe its facing forwards. I have no idea. But it's not for me. Try to imagine Popeye in a kayak. Doesn't work.

 

Phil:

I agree. Got to have foot braces.



#80 view at the front

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:49 AM

Bob

 

I have a aluminum/SS fabricator that lives next to me on the beach (we share crab pots and skiffs) that is enamored with your project.  I'll send you a PM with his info.

 

Ron



#81 Trickypig

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:56 AM

Bob I like the simplicity of the Popeye. Proper skookum and nice lines my shipwright says.

 

I'm wondering what weight you've used in your calculations for the coxswain Violet?

 

Here's a canoe on our dock. It feels light enough for one to pick up. I was interested by the pressed panel in the turn of the bilge.

 

Attached File  IMAG0578.jpg   56.41K   34 downloadsAttached File  IMAG0579.jpg   116.49K   34 downloadsAttached File  IMAG0580.jpg   70.51K   20 downloads



#82 Five Guys Named Moe

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 01:25 AM

No Tom. I can't build anything on the beach. We have a 12' tide range here. There are high tides when the water is up to my lawn and many high tides where the water comes all the way up to the logs essentially leaving no beach. So, if I pulled the boat up onto the logs when not in use there would be times when I did not have far to go to launch it.

Any sea run cutthroats out there Bob?



#83 Salazar

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 01:37 AM

Miscut:

 

I am already thinking about a flip down beach wheel. That has been in the mix since the first night.

 

Bob, here is a possible source for wheels, bearings and stub axles for the for the beach wheel.  These are the wheels used on the Seitech Dollys.  A pair of the A style have no problems carrying a Laser II (at about 175 lbs I think) over pretty rough beaches.

 

http://www.apsltd.co...olly-parts.aspx

 

4582.jpg



#84 Jose Carumba

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 01:57 AM

My son took a friend's aluminum Grumman canoe an a river trip while in scouts. They got caught by a sweeper and bent the canoe nearly 90 degrees. They got the canoe to shore and bent it back around a tree, beat it roughly back into shape, taped the holes where the hull creased and cracked with duct tape and finished the rest of the trip. I brought it into the shop and had the guys patch the cracks and smooth out the wrinkles and returned it to the owner. He still has it and uses it.

I have a Seitech dolly with the fat tires and it worked really well on our beach. Those plastic bearing are easy to rinse out after use.

#85 Bob Perry

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:05 AM

Tricky:

I visited the lovely Violet today and I have to revise my weight study,. She now weighs 28 lbs. I figured 25 lbs., She is a growing Viking Princess.

 

Somehow those fat, black ballooooon tires are not what I feature hanging off the stern of my peapod. Be like a dog with a Klingon.

 

Moe:

No cutthroat at this time But I hooked whopping big silver yesterday on 6 lb. test. I was using my blue Castmaster and basically going through the motions when WHAM! This Silver was as big in section as a football. I had him on for less than ten seconds. Fucking barbless single hook. He hit about 25' off the beach.

 

Frontster:

I'll PM you. More intertested builders is a good thing.



#86 Tom Ray

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:18 PM

Miscut:

 

I am already thinking about a flip down beach wheel. That has been in the mix since the first night.

 

Bob, here is a possible source for wheels, bearings and stub axles for the for the beach wheel.  These are the wheels used on the Seitech Dollys.  A pair of the A style have no problems carrying a Laser II (at about 175 lbs I think) over pretty rough beaches.

 

http://www.apsltd.co...olly-parts.aspx

 

4582.jpg

 


I have been thinking about making a dolly for my skiff instead of buying it a trailer. Could not use it on the road, but the boat fits (sorta) in the back of the truck.

 

Fat tires are essential on a soft surface, but nothing smooths bumps like wheel diameter. A friend wanted a wheelbarrow with a bigger wheel diameter and a low center of gravity and came up with this:

 

slide-n-glide.jpg

 

I've been thinking of something like a sailboat dolly, but with bike tires to roll over bumps easier.



#87 sailman

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:33 PM

Bob, an option for you is one down on our beach.  Our neighbor's  sank a post in above the high tide line with a winch and they have a seitech dolly for their dinghy.  Whether they land at low or high tide they can just grab the dolly and winch the boat right up the beach.  With those logs there I'm sure you could work out an anchor point.



#88 Bob Perry

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 01:17 PM

Sailman:

That's a system we had here 35 years ago. I had forgotten all about it. It would mean removing the winch from the anchor log each fall as the logs tend  to get rearranged during the winter strms and high tides. No problem.

But that is a very good idea. I already have a kayak dolly that I'm pretty certain will work.

 

Thanks. I'll give that some careful thought.



#89 PATSYQPATSY

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 02:47 PM

The thing I always disliked about aluminum boats is the noise they make as you move around in them.  Perhaps a clever way of distributing "solid" flotation may aleviate some of the banging and clanging thereby allowing you and the little one to better sneak up on that tri-colored heron.

 

Tuck:

I have not looked at "regulations". I'm thinking twice the weight for flotation. I'll have a chat with Russel and get his views on that.



#90 TheFlash

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 02:56 PM

hydro turf...



#91 Steam Flyer

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:58 PM

Bob, an option for you is one down on our beach.  Our neighbor's  sank a post in above the high tide line with a winch and they have a seitech dolly for their dinghy.  Whether they land at low or high tide they can just grab the dolly and winch the boat right up the beach.  With those logs there I'm sure you could work out an anchor point.

 

 

If you're moving the boat over logs and softball+ sized rocks, a sledge might be better than a dolly.

 

The wheel was a huge advance in technology and civilization has certainly gone far with it, but primitive situations still call for pre-civilization engineering

B)

 

FB- Doug



#92 Rasputin22

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:22 PM

A sledge hammer? What, you going to bust up the rocks and smash down the logs? Sounds like a lot of work... Pretty primitive though.



#93 BGD

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:38 PM

Bob - I love the look of this design.  I'm curious on rocker...what do you have planned?  I know from canoes, the difference in even 1-2" of rocker on a 16'ish boat can be huge.  I also remember those old Grumman aluminum canoes had a small keel riveted or welded on.  I never knew if that was integral to the construction or solely for tracking...hopefully you won't need one with the origami style construction and welds.

 

Rasper - Any application for 3D printing here?  You could save on Scotch tape...

 

Look forward to seeing the progress!



#94 Jose Carumba

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:40 PM

UHMW keel shoe.  Rugged.  Slides nicely.

 

Edit: Heavy



#95 Steam Flyer

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:45 PM

A sledge hammer? What, you going to bust up the rocks and smash down the logs? Sounds like a lot of work... Pretty primitive though.

 

Good exercise though.

I'm thinkin a little bit less cave man. Scroll forward a few millenia

 

 

life-in-ancient-egypt-5.jpg

 

"Sledge" is a like a sled, only more for brute work. Pile on rocks, logs, boat, whatever.

 

If you go for the ox-drawn optional propulsion pkg, don't be a dick like the guy in the picture though. This did not end well for him.

 

FB- Doug



#96 Bob Perry

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:46 PM

BGD:

I think I have posted enough images to show the rocker we have. Not sure how you would like me to measure the exact amount of rocker. It's a lot more than most Whitehall models but I also have that centerline backbone plate. My intention now is to have the backbone follow the canoe body and drop down aft for a small skeg for tracking. I'm comfortable with that.

 

UHMW shoe would work,,,,,,, and add weight. I'll think about it.

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#97 Salazar

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:47 PM

I also remember those old Grumman aluminum canoes had a small keel riveted or welded on.  I never knew if that was integral to the construction or solely for tracking...hopefully you won't need one with the origami style construction and welds.

 

I think the keel on the Grumman was more about stiffening the hull skin and partially for protection of hull skin when dragging over rocks.  I have a 1957 (or so) Princecraft 12' Aluminium Utility Boat that my Dad gave me when he no longer was using it.  It has three of those keels, one full length and one more each side about half way from the centre to the chines that are only about 1/3 the length of the boat. This boat would oil can like crazy planing without these to stiffen the hull.



#98 Rasputin22

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:49 PM

I've been looking at extrusion catalogs and came across this little beauty that might have promise as the keel/stem on the PeenPod.  

 

I've  made some progress on the flotation tanks and seat/thwart fore and aft adjustment and even a practical easily removeable oarlock outrigger out of aluminum pipe that fits the nature of the boat. 

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#99 Bob Perry

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 05:11 PM

Hmmmmmm,,,,,,Will that extrusion get me the taper profile I want on the ends of the backbone plate. I do not want a constant reveal. I want sculpture. I want people to look and say,"Wow, I wonder how he thought of that?"

 

Waaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh! I want my sculpture!



#100 BGD

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 05:28 PM

Thanks Bob.  I'd like to get better at pulling some of the design details from those renderings.  She looks like she'll still spin fairly easily even with the small skeg for tracking.  I like the utility of the moderate rocker...you don't need to run Class III whitewater but also don't need to row a 2000m Olympic course.  Like a F-150 of skiffs.






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