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Key Waste

Rule 55 trash environment pollution waste key west race week

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#1 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:46 AM

Key West Race Week Chairman Peter Craig last week further cemented his reputation as the most out-of-touch race officer we know, issuing a NOR amendment that directly contradicts the kind of environmental responsibility so embraced by not only ISAF, US Sailing, the America’s Cup and basic common sense, but by dozens of the sport’s newest sponsors and supporters.

We’re talking about Craig’s amendment last week of Rule 55, the prohibition against tossing trash into the water that ISAF clarified earlier this year as including sail stops – rubber bands or wools. NOR Amendment No. 1 suspends this ban, specifically allowing both “elastic and wool bands” to be discarded into the pristine, federally-controlled No Discharge Zone of the Florida Keys.

There’s been plenty of discussion of Rule 55 already, but even the most pollution-loving dickbag would agree that tossing dozens of rubber bands into some of America’s most environmentally sensitive waters ain’t the right thing to do. And biodegradable wool stops are no solution at all; maybe suitable for racing out in the ocean, but a few dozen big boats just a couple of miles offshore throwing dozens of wool stops into the sea at every mark rounding is not only nasty for the reefs; it’s against both Federal and Florida Law, with major fines and penalties.   We’ve all seen the required pollution placards on our boats, specifically telling everyone that trash doesn’t go in the water; did you really think the laws that keep you from throwing coffee grounds or orange peels into the sea somehow allow you to toss rubber bands or rope strips into the same water? And what does the USCG think about all this? Is it really possible that KWRW included this info on their Marine Event Permit?

The biggest new source of sponsorship for the sport worldwide is coming from either clean energy/green manufacturing companies or businesses looking to associate themselves with the environmentally friendly image that sailing represents. And here comes Key Waste, screwing not only the reefs, but also the hundreds of events, classes, and organizations that have worked so hard to create awareness and educate sailors and the public on being good custodians of our playground on the water.

What do you think of this policy? Should we just tell the reefs, wildlife, EPA, and USCG to harden the fuck up, or does Key West Chairman Peter Craig need to man up and tell his competitors to learn to set a kite without training wheels? You can comment here, or e-mail the organizers here.


Edited by MR.CLEAN, 31 December 2013 - 03:17 AM.
proofreading


#2 frozenhawaiian

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:18 AM

you guys seriously have your panties all up in a bunch about this? 



#3 Footlong

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:19 AM

I love Key West Race Week.  Wish I was going.



#4 dcbsheb

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:30 AM

Hey, Clean, no offense, but this come directly from the NOR of the S2H race that you are currently covering,

"RRS 55: Is amended to allow for the banding/tying of spinnakers for the purpose of hoisting."

I didn't see any mention of this in your intro to the weeklong stay on Tasmania or during your coverage of the start about how ashamed you are of Aussies for littering their waters.

If your gonna call a spade a spade....

#5 DA-WOODY

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:32 AM

anyone have a pad right on the beach open for a week for less than #1,799.99 ?????  :lol:



#6 frozenhawaiian

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:33 AM

Hey, Clean, no offense, but this come directly from the NOR of the S2H race that you are currently covering,

"RRS 55: Is amended to allow for the banding/tying of spinnakers for the purpose of hoisting."

I didn't see any mention of this in your intro to the weeklong stay on Tasmania or during your coverage of the start about how ashamed you are of Aussies for littering their waters.

If your gonna call a spade a spade....

 

 

clean and ed don't have some personal issue with that race officer so he gets a pass, ya know, some people are just more equal than others and all that.....



#7 Footlong

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:34 AM

Hey, Clean, no offense, but this come directly from the NOR of the S2H race that you are currently covering,

"RRS 55: Is amended to allow for the banding/tying of spinnakers for the purpose of hoisting."

I didn't see any mention of this in your intro to the weeklong stay on Tasmania or during your coverage of the start about how ashamed you are of Aussies for littering their waters.

If your gonna call a spade a spade....

That's awesome.



#8 dcbsheb

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:36 AM

anyone have a pad right on the beach open for a week for less than #1,799.99 ?????  :lol:


Dude, what the....?

Really?

#9 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:36 AM

you guys seriously have your panties all up in a bunch about this? 

 

FWIW, the basis for this story was written by a one-design owner who was disgusted with the amendment and told me he will not be competing at KW if they do not withdraw the amendment.  It is the third email I got about the amendment from participants in the fleet, so, yeah - I guess there are plenty of panties in quite a few bunches.  Do you really think rubber bands on the reef is acceptable?  How about condoms?  How about plastic wrap?  



#10 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:37 AM

Hey, Clean, no offense, but this come directly from the NOR of the S2H race that you are currently covering,

"RRS 55: Is amended to allow for the banding/tying of spinnakers for the purpose of hoisting."

I didn't see any mention of this in your intro to the weeklong stay on Tasmania or during your coverage of the start about how ashamed you are of Aussies for littering their waters.

If your gonna call a spade a spade....

I'm going to, right now.

 

I don't condone it at all, not one bit, though there is quite a difference between a NDZ/sensitive reef environment and near-shore distance both in common sense and under MARPOL.



#11 frozenhawaiian

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:41 AM

you guys seriously have your panties all up in a bunch about this? 

 

FWIW, the basis for this story was written by a one-design owner who was disgusted with the amendment and told me he will not be competing at KW if they do not withdraw the amendment.  It is the third email I got about the amendment from participants in the fleet, so, yeah - I guess there are plenty of panties in quite a few bunches.  Do you really think rubber bands on the reef is acceptable?  How about condoms?  How about plastic wrap?  

 

fair enough, but rubber bands and bits of cotton or wool thread rank pretty low on the scale for me compared to the assholes that dump their trash overboard or pump out their holding tanks just outside the marinas, ya know, the many derelict cruisers that bum around down south. 



#12 DA-WOODY

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:42 AM

anyone have a pad right on the beach open for a week for less than #1,799.99 ?????  :lol:


Dude, what the....?

Really?

 

If Clean and a few of those who follow along got a Chuckle - it was worth the post  ;)

 

welcome back from where ever you were 



#13 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:45 AM

Anyone notice if the Fastnet amends 55 too?  



#14 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:50 AM

Front page updated with S-H info.



#15 dcbsheb

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:53 AM

How about the basic principles in the very beginning of the RRS? I'm pretty sure the organizers of both the S2H and KWRW both thought long and hard before choosing to ammend/delete rule 55. If you enforce RRS 55 as written and as explained by ISAF, it just creates a shitstorm for the big boats. I would hope your M24 friends would u veterans this.

#16 dcbsheb

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:58 AM

Front page updated with S-H info.


+1 to you.

At least you stand up for what you believe in. I didn't understand the point of the rule when it was written, and I don't think you will ever see organizers of big boat events ever get on board with this.

#17 DA-WOODY

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 04:06 AM

Front page updated with S-H info.


+1 to you.

At least you stand up for what you believe in. I didn't understand the point of the rule when it was written, and I don't think you will ever see organizers of big boat events ever get on board with this.

 

 

how about the Big Boat Series ?



#18 Swanno (Ohf Shore)

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 04:12 AM

I would think that one big wet cloud, causing drains to flood, would send more shit into the ocean that one regattas worth of kite banding.



#19 Yogurt

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 04:22 AM

Whats better, a few pieces of natural wool or 1000's m2 of shredded nylon, Cuban fibre and god know what else are in sails!!!



#20 matrix

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 04:45 AM

Get off KWRW's back already!  It's one of this countries premier regattas. Your coverage of S2H was really enjoyable, you did a great job without finding things to knock them on.  Now go do the same at KWRW!  Forgive and Forget, get back to what you do and what we like, please.



#21 us7070

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:09 AM

natural rubber (a plant product) and wool are pretty biodegradable.

 

it seems dumb to worry about spinnaker bands of biodegradable material.., yet still allow race boats to use outboards or diesels and to pump human waste overboard - which is done on all ocean races

 

what about throwing apple cores overboard on the ocean?

 

it seems like that's prohibited, but pumping human waste overboard isn't...



#22 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:10 AM

Front page updated with S-H info.


+1 to you.

At least you stand up for what you believe in. I didn't understand the point of the rule when it was written, and I don't think you will ever see organizers of big boat events ever get on board with this.

 

Even if it is not wrong to you, you do realize it is completely and totally illegal right?



#23 sunseeker

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:15 AM

Is Peter Craig a grifter?

#24 Derek Grebe

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:20 AM

surely Federal Law trumps the RRS?

 

report the fuckers to the feds



#25 sammy_cda

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:27 AM

I'm heading to Key West in a couple of weeks.  I could stay home and go play in the landfill if I wanted to see trash.  Keep it clean racers.



#26 cruzer

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:43 AM

If.... all the racers and the organizations can agree that competitors cannot use their engines to 'cheat' when sailing the race, it would seem like they could just agree to follow this rule also. No harm as long as they all obey the same rules.....

 

And, why on earth cannot these folks use top-furling A-Sails? That evolving type of sail handling gear seems to be changing the way everyone uses "spinnakers"...

As for standard kites, why not just let 'em all use snuffers? I note that boats like mine use a snuffer for ocean races like the Pacific Cup, and the crews do not seem to suffer any permanent mental harm for doing so. (?)

:)



#27 matrix

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:56 AM

Where was your concern and outrage for the "totally illegal" actions while at S2H.  Seemed like a love fest there.

Is this not really about your hatred of KWRW, honestly it seems like it.  How much coverage are you going to offer

this regatta.  Personally I am not using rubber bands for a lot of reasons and I like taking care of our environment but 

stopping a few tiny rubber bands, I don't know.  Really hoping you guys offer the good coverage this regatta demands.



#28 Somebody Else

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:04 AM

I've already filed for a patent on spinnaker stops made from kelp.

 

It's the catch-and-release of sail stops, if you will.

 

Anybody got a problem with kelp being left in the ocean?



#29 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:09 AM

We haven't covered KW since they made it clear they didn't want us there, and since the big OD fleets went away.  I'm stoked that many of my friends are getting to sail it in a huge J/70 fleet though -  it may be the best venue in the world for one-design windward/leeward racing.

 

 None of that has anything to do with the fact that a boat owner sent me an outraged e-mail about Amendment 1, and when I asked around, others weren't happy either.  And if you have read SA much, you'll know we are pretty serious about conservation; frankly anyone who makes their living on the water would be a total moron to not be serious about taking care of it.  Does anyone like to shit where they eat?

 

We have very openly explained what our problem with KWRW and Premiere Racing is, but that has exactly zero to do with the report on the front page, or this thread.  We will hopefully have Sailors for the Sea and 11th Hour Racing weigh in on this issue as well, and we have a ton of respect for what they have done in the past few years to actually help improve the environment as well as to help sailing continue to foster the green image that is so valuable to its growth and success.

 

As for the S2H, I have an interview with the CYCA commodore tomorrow and on my list of things to ask him are 1) Rule 55 and 2) Multihulls.  Whether you think this is about a personal vendetta or a real issue doesn't really concern me. 

 

I am glad you are not using rubber bands, and I am also aware that the major sailmakers are all working on velcro or other solutions to the banding issue.  Things are going in the right direction, bit by bit.

 

 

 

 

 

Where was your concern and outrage for the "totally illegal" actions while at S2H.  Seemed like a love fest there.

Is this not really about your hatred of KWRW, honestly it seems like it.  How much coverage are you going to offer

this regatta.  Personally I am not using rubber bands for a lot of reasons and I like taking care of our environment but 

stopping a few tiny rubber bands, I don't know.  Really hoping you guys offer the good coverage this regatta demands.



I've already filed for a patent on spinnaker stops made from kelp.

 

It's the catch-and-release of sail stops, if you will.

 

Anybody got a problem with kelp being left in the ocean?

use jellyfish tentacles



#30 rmgeis

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:33 AM

I remember seeing this hoohaw about a year ago with the rubber bands. Why don't you all put a bunch of velcro around the kite, tie them all to 1/8 inch nylon and reel the whole mess in after the kite is up?



#31 red_sky_sf

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 07:24 AM

There are lots of polution sources that need attention and they should be handled in priority order. Last year at this time I did a delivery from SF to Ensenada. We rounded conception around midnight on Dec 31.  From sunrise all the way down to SD there were balloons floating on the water in surprising density. ISAF should work on this larger issue and tackle spin bands once balloons are no longer dumped on the sea and helium is no longer tossed into the air.



#32 Boatleg

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 08:12 AM

Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.



#33 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 08:23 AM

Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.

 

J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.

 

It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.



#34 floating dutchman

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 09:07 AM

natural rubber (a plant product) and wool are pretty biodegradable.
 
it seems dumb to worry about spinnaker bands of biodegradable material.., yet still allow race boats to use outboards or diesels and to pump human waste overboard - which is done on all ocean races
 
what about throwing apple cores overboard on the ocean?
 
it seems like that's prohibited, but pumping human waste overboard isn't...

Yea, Sailors should use the same toilet that the marine life use!

#35 Bill's Sock Puppet

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 09:12 AM

As the leading authority for the sport, the International Sailing Federation promotes and supports the protection of the environment in all sailing competitions and related activities throughout the world.


This statement is in the ISAF RRS, the USSailing RRS and the ISAF Case Book.  It seems pretty clear that the perceived image that the sport of sailing wants to portray is that we are environmentally friendly.
 
Just HTFU and say "the use of rubber bands and wool ties will not be tolerated."
 
Rule 55 is not a stupid rule, and a small amount of garbage is not acceptable.
 
Nobody says, "We really wanted to go to Key West but they won't let us intentionally put trash in the water."
 
The 2013-2016 RRS was published by ISAF in June 2012; that's 18 months to figure it out.
 
What's the big fucking deal?  Level the playing field.  If it is clear to the competitors that banding spinnakers is illegal then people will come up will solutions.  Every boat 40 foot and bigger will have an idea, some better than others, by the end of the week everyone will have a working solution.
 
Problem solved, anything short of that and is just kicking the can.



#36 Boatleg

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 09:13 AM

Agree it should be restricted to degradable wool, no need for elastic. If you ban something you should come up with a good solution how to deal with kites. It would be very effective to ban cars for instance, but not realistic, so solutions are sought in a more practical way, like cleaner engines, etc. Same should be done here and not lift this out of proportion.
As for the quality of QKW in relation to its size and quality of its competitors I feel it fully reflects the condition of US sailing. Bit too rich to blame Peter C for that. You just got a grudge and you can not get over it somehow. For a journalist this is a professional mistake. Try to stay fair when at work. I am not suggesting that you should spend your leisure time with him. Keep up the good work.



#37 Vang Tang

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 09:13 AM

I've eaten a rubber band once, came out just fine on the other end. I'm actually chewing on wool yarn right now.  I read a medical article about a boy ingesting about 1/2 cup of gasoline. He died. 

 

Faux outrage is so easy to spot. Hate Hate Hate!



#38 sunseeker

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 09:52 AM


Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.
 
J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.
 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.

How about cigarette butts? Are boats with smokers starting to carry ashtrays? I hope so.

#39 forss

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 10:58 AM

How many big boats are there that use rubber bands?

Or every 20 footer need them in USA?

#40 bbr

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:14 PM

 

Front page updated with S-H info.


+1 to you.

At least you stand up for what you believe in. I didn't understand the point of the rule when it was written, and I don't think you will ever see organizers of big boat events ever get on board with this.

 

Even if it is not wrong to you, you do realize it is completely and totally illegal right?

 

Singlehanded ocean racing is illegal too, but you're not complaining about it... I suppose you've never done anything illegal in your life, eh?



#41 kent_island_sailor

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:15 PM

Wasn't it dengue fever or something last time :rolleyes:

Clean - you can be totally correct and totally wrong at the same time.

Throwing crap in the water is not good.

S2H threw stuff in the water and you didn't notice at the time.

SA and KWRW have a long history of screwing with each other.

So.......even though I am sure you are 100% correct about the email you got and sailors upset, it is 100% impossible for this to look like anything but the "what did they do THIS time" annual bash ;)



#42 dcbsheb

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:21 PM

 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.


Are you stepping off your ride on a TP 52 or a 70'er when you walk down below and see a big spool of yarn, or are you bitching the whole time that they are breaking the law?

You also mention SA's ties to environmentally friendly organizations. Do you drink from plastic water bottles, or do you carry your own refillable bottle when you're out on the water and encourage others to do the same? I would think this is a much larger problem, especially here in the US, and a better platform for you to spew your 'holier than thou' attitude.

#43 brourke

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:21 PM

Banning two stroke engines in favor of 4 stroke engines would have a much bigger impact on the environment than wool bands. Problem is smaller boats like 2 stroke engines due to weight savings. There are way bigger problems to solve than a bit of wool from a relatively small number of big boats (most boats under 40' don't band their spinnakers).

#44 kent_island_sailor

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:27 PM

This is kind of like Fox News discovering Barrack Obama did not make sure every sign was recycled after the election :rolleyes:



#45 Bill's Sock Puppet

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:33 PM

natural rubber (a plant product) and wool are pretty biodegradable.

Just because it is biodegradable doesn't mean it happens magically fast.
 
Wool, for instance takes 1-5 years to decompose.
 
In fact wool is a problem worldwide.  Best efforts to speed the process of the decomposition of wool involve adding Ca(OH)2 [ Calcium Hydroxide ] and heating the wool to 80ºC or the use of DAP [Diimmonium Phosphate - H9N2OH4P] applied as an aqueous spray.
 
"Natural"  rubber bands left in nature for less than a year all degraded to the point of breaking.  Sulfur is added to natural rubber to give it the characteristic elasticity making it useful. Sulfur will tend to react with oxygen over time and this oxidation process pulls the sulfur back out of the rubber, making it significantly weaker and less elastic. Tests were conducted to determine how long rubber bands would last in sand and in a fresh water river. The experiment suggests that a useful rubber band lifetime of less than a year would be expected in fresh water.  After that it is "just a strip of useless rubber." Microbial degradation of natural rubber has been investigated for 100 years. It became obvious that bacteria, as well as fungi, are capable of degrading rubber and that rubber biodegradation is a slow process
 
Sadly, wool and rubber don't magically melt away.



#46 Just a Skosh

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:43 PM

Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.

 

J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.

 

It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.

 

And on April 30, 2013 you wrote

 

"Because our sport doesn’t have enough rules, enough regulations, enough officious bullshit, now we are being told that rubber bands used to band spinnakers are a violation of Rule 55: A competitor shall not intentionally put trash in the water.

How awesome. The sport has officially crawled up it’s own ass."

 

http://sailinganarch...30/nanny-state/

 

So either you've changed your heart and had a come to jesus moment with the realities of throwing trash in the water, or you're just taking the opportunity to bash this event because of a personal vendetta.  Oh wait, you don't have a personal vendetta with them, you're pissed off at them on behalf of all sailors everywhere.  Douchetard.



#47 d-nozzle

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:57 PM

 

Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.

 

J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.

 

It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.

 

And on April 30, 2013 you wrote

 

"Because our sport doesn’t have enough rules, enough regulations, enough officious bullshit, now we are being told that rubber bands used to band spinnakers are a violation of Rule 55: A competitor shall not intentionally put trash in the water.

How awesome. The sport has officially crawled up it’s own ass."

 

http://sailinganarch...30/nanny-state/

 

So either you've changed your heart and had a come to jesus moment with the realities of throwing trash in the water, or you're just taking the opportunity to bash this event because of a personal vendetta.  Oh wait, you don't have a personal vendetta with them, you'r pissed off at them on behalf of all sailors everywhere.  Douchetard.

priceless. 



#48 dcbsheb

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:59 PM


Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.
 
J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.
 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.
 
And on April 30, 2013 you wrote
 
"Because our sport doesnt have enough rules, enough regulations, enough officious bullshit, now we are being told that rubber bands used to band spinnakers are a violation of Rule 55: A competitor shall not intentionally put trash in the water.
How awesome. The sport has officially crawled up its own ass."
 
http://sailinganarch...30/nanny-state/
 
So either you've changed your heart and had a come to jesus moment with the realities of throwing trash in the water, or you're just taking the opportunity to bash this event because of a personal vendetta.  Oh wait, you don't have a personal vendetta with them, you'r pissed off at them on behalf of all sailors everywhere.  Douchetard.

^^^This^^^

Explains the tone he uses in the FP article. It's whichever side of the isle serves his purpose more.

Clean, I don't knock you for standing up for what you believe in. You have a large pulpit, and people listen when you speak. Just remember that we will also disect every word you type. So be prepared to back your actions.

#49 nardito

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:07 PM

Really want to waste your and our time to discuss about few elastic bands.....?? 

I am living in Italy ,this is what I see every morning http://www.youreport...rifiuti-palermo

 If you really care about enviromnment look at the big Picture , and make a petition on SA for  USA  to ratify the Kyoto Protocol about dangerous emission , USA and Alaska are the only countries in the world not to have yet ratifiet this treat......

Climate changes makes hundreds thousands dead people every years.

Think about !

We wanna come to Key West to enjoy our time and not to be bother in endless discussion about few wool or elastic band!



#50 Footlong

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:10 PM

We're planning an "occupy RW" series of threads during KWRW. 

Stay tuned.



#51 YOOHOO

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:22 PM

Nobody uses rubber bands you stupid publicity seeking whore!



#52 interested party

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:26 PM

So the guys in the big boats need the bands, and the guys in the little boats don't. Where are the guys in the little boats peeing? Are they peeing in buckets and bringing the buckets in to shore to empty them in the interest of conservation?



#53 billy backstay

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:41 PM

This is kind of like Fox News discovering Barrack Obama did not make sure every sign was recycled after the election :rolleyes:

 

yes!! spot on!!



#54 RumLine

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:42 PM

you guys seriously have your panties all up in a bunch about this? 

 

FWIW, the basis for this story was written by a one-design owner who was disgusted with the amendment and told me he will not be competing at KW if they do not withdraw the amendment.  It is the third email I got about the amendment from participants in the fleet, so, yeah - I guess there are plenty of panties in quite a few bunches.  Do you really think rubber bands on the reef is acceptable?  How about condoms?  How about plastic wrap?  

 

What asshole is using condoms to band their kites??



#55 doghouse

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:56 PM

Key West Race Week Chairman Peter Craig last week further cemented his reputation as the most out-of-touch race officer we know, issuing a NOR amendment that directly contradicts the kind of environmental responsibility so embraced by not only ISAF, US Sailing, the America’s Cup and basic common sense, but by dozens of the sport’s newest sponsors and supporters.

We’re talking about Craig’s amendment last week of Rule 55, the prohibition against tossing trash into the water that ISAF clarified earlier this year as including sail stops – rubber bands or wools. NOR Amendment No. 1 suspends this ban, specifically allowing both “elastic and wool bands” to be discarded into the pristine, federally-controlled No Discharge Zone of the Florida Keys.

There’s been plenty of discussion of Rule 55 already, but even the most pollution-loving dickbag would agree that tossing dozens of rubber bands into some of America’s most environmentally sensitive waters ain’t the right thing to do. And biodegradable wool stops are no solution at all; maybe suitable for racing out in the ocean, but a few dozen big boats just a couple of miles offshore throwing dozens of wool stops into the sea at every mark rounding is not only nasty for the reefs; it’s against both Federal and Florida Law, with major fines and penalties.   We’ve all seen the required pollution placards on our boats, specifically telling everyone that trash doesn’t go in the water; did you really think the laws that keep you from throwing coffee grounds or orange peels into the sea somehow allow you to toss rubber bands or rope strips into the same water? And what does the USCG think about all this? Is it really possible that KWRW included this info on their Marine Event Permit?

The biggest new source of sponsorship for the sport worldwide is coming from either clean energy/green manufacturing companies or businesses looking to associate themselves with the environmentally friendly image that sailing represents. And here comes Key Waste, screwing not only the reefs, but also the hundreds of events, classes, and organizations that have worked so hard to create awareness and educate sailors and the public on being good custodians of our playground on the water.

What do you think of this policy? Should we just tell the reefs, wildlife, EPA, and USCG to harden the fuck up, or does Key West Chairman Peter Craig need to man up and tell his competitors to learn to set a kite without training wheels? You can comment here, or e-mail the organizers here.

 

Fuck off you idiot.



#56 billy backstay

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:57 PM

 

you guys seriously have your panties all up in a bunch about this? 

 

FWIW, the basis for this story was written by a one-design owner who was disgusted with the amendment and told me he will not be competing at KW if they do not withdraw the amendment.  It is the third email I got about the amendment from participants in the fleet, so, yeah - I guess there are plenty of panties in quite a few bunches.  Do you really think rubber bands on the reef is acceptable?  How about condoms?  How about plastic wrap?  

 

What asshole is using condoms to band their kites??

 

 

Sorry, mate;  I bought the wrong size, and they were too small.  What else wouild I use them for?? LOL



#57 Conny71

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:21 PM

Have some respect for yourself Clean. Find a real issue to banter about. Asshat.



#58 bottlerocket

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:25 PM

"we still don’t understand how, in this day and age, anyone thinks tossing rubber bands or synthetic fiber over the side is any different than a cigarette butt or a plastic wrapper."

 

Your logic is messed up.    Throwing cigarette butts and plastic wrappers off a boat when there is clearly an easier, cleaner option makes no sense.   And equating that with tossing rubber bands or synthetic fiber makes less sense.



#59 Footlong

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:35 PM

 

you guys seriously have your panties all up in a bunch about this? 

 

FWIW, the basis for this story was written by a one-design owner who was disgusted with the amendment and told me he will not be competing at KW if they do not withdraw the amendment.  It is the third email I got about the amendment from participants in the fleet, so, yeah - I guess there are plenty of panties in quite a few bunches.  Do you really think rubber bands on the reef is acceptable?  How about condoms?  How about plastic wrap?  

 

What asshole is using condoms to band their kites??

I have some spare extra larges if you want them.



#60 Footlong

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:36 PM

Peter Craig must love all this free advertising.  I thought there were rules regarding "buy an ad".



#61 justa1

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:37 PM

Way to go Clean.  Keep rooting for the death of one of the USA's best events because Premiere Racing doesn't kiss the water you think you walk on. 

 

What a loser.

 

 



#62 mad

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:42 PM


 


Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.
 
J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.
 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.
 
And on April 30, 2013 you wrote
 
"Because our sport doesnt have enough rules, enough regulations, enough officious bullshit, now we are being told that rubber bands used to band spinnakers are a violation of Rule 55: A competitor shall not intentionally put trash in the water.
How awesome. The sport has officially crawled up its own ass."
 
http://sailinganarch...30/nanny-state/
 
So either you've changed your heart and had a come to jesus moment with the realities of throwing trash in the water, or you're just taking the opportunity to bash this event because of a personal vendetta.  Oh wait, you don't have a personal vendetta with them, you'r pissed off at them on behalf of all sailors everywhere.  Douchetard.
priceless. 
Key West yet again gets a free pimpin from Clean. :)

#63 Boatleg

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:50 PM

I feel we shall not fly in the crews to race at Key West at all. Staying at  home is environment friendliest thing we can do.

And also the best for the mind, stay away as far as possible from places where this is seen as a serious debate.

Powerboat racing is fine in KW, sports fishing is fine in KW losing tons of lead each year and killing animals for fun, driving around without a purpose burning gallons of fuel is fine at KW, drinking yourself silly and puking all over the place is fine at KW, burning meat on a charcoal barbecue is great fun at KW, etc etc etc. But a dozen wool bands to safely hoist your kite and not risk shredding it all over the ocean nor risk the safety of the guys on the deck is not fine at KW...

Get a life......



#64 sunseeker

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:51 PM

Really want to waste your and our time to discuss about few elastic bands.....?? 

I am living in Italy ,this is what I see every morning http://www.youreport...rifiuti-palermo

 If you really care about enviromnment look at the big Picture , and make a petition on SA for  USA  to ratify the Kyoto Protocol about dangerous emission , USA and Alaska are the only countries in the world not to have yet ratifiet this treat......

Climate changes makes hundreds thousands dead people every years.

Think about !

We wanna come to Key West to enjoy our time and not to be bother in endless discussion about few wool or elastic band!

 

Was it over when the German's bombed Pearl Harbor?  Hell no!  It's not over until we say it is over....

 

Question:  when did Alaska become a a country?



#65 Snaggletooth

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:55 PM

Question:  when did Alaska become a a country?

Ist beene theire foure loungue time.



#66 Guinness

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:56 PM

hmmm, didn't think there were this many people willing to consciously make worse what is already bad. Nobody will say that sailing is an environmentally friendly sport, but unnecessarily throwing what is basically plastic in the water  (Yeah, anyone out here actually using wool? get real.) is a whole different ballgame. it is simple to develop some different systems to banding that are not discarded into the ocean, and i have been working on some with a few dedicated sailmakers in the sport. 

 

but since everyone here is saying it is already bad why not add $250 to the entry fee, to offset carbon emissions and help profile sailing as a sport that intends to show ways that we can make it better instead of worse. it doesn't even have to be a flat fee, the smaller boats obviously have smaller budgets (well outside the M32 i guess).

 

the point is, we make use of what nature provides it and it would be in everyone's best interest to be of the mindset to try and make it better, not yell at change.

 

if anyone is interested in seeing what we have been trying to do, come and talk to me, i'll be at Key West just message me for the details.



#67 Pitbull

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:03 PM

why not use Vicryl (polyglactin 910) or Polydioxanone? both use in degradable sutures...very rapidly degraded....just a thought

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vicryl

 

http://en.wikipedia....i/Polydioxanone



#68 Gray Ghost

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:05 PM

The cynicism is breathtaking.  

 

Racing sailors purchase large vehicles to tow their boats and carry their gear, and think nothing of driving hours or days, or flying, to an amateur competition which has no purpose and no benefit except the pleasure of the individual competitors.  We purchase large boats, made with petroleum derivatives, aluminum (which ultimately came from an unsightly polluting aluminum mine and electricity-gobbling smelter), and -- gasp -- LEAD, which boats have no purpose but their owners' personal pleasure.  The boats are manufactured using processes which release highly toxic organic solvents and other atmospheric pollutants.  The boats are so specialized that they cannot be used for any practical purpose such as to carry cargo, or passengers.  They can be used only to race against other boats (sometimes only against other IDENTICAL boats).  They use for propulsion sails (made from petroleum derivatives) which are essentially disposable, because after just a few uses they have lost a few percentage points of speed and therefore are no longer useful.  Not to mention the expensive powerboats used for race support, and all that gasoline and diesel fuel!  And the valuable waterfront real estate can go largely unused most of the year, in order to be available for a few weekends in the summer!  

 

The value of the resources, the human labor, and the opportunity cost, which go into even a single one-week regatta is huge, in the many hundreds of thousands of dollars.  It's quantifiable, measurable wealth, expended on sport.  All that wealth, all that effort, which go into a single regatta, could be directed instead towards actually improving our environment.  But it isn't.  It is directed to the personal pleasure of a few dozen or a few hundred sailors.

 

And then some of those same people have the nerve to criticize me -- and potentially disqualify me from the race -- if I throw a rubber band overboard.  Wow.  Just wow.

 

The whole environmental consciousness trend in sailing is nothing but window dressing intended to obscure the basic fact that sailing is a rich man's sport which is completely consumptive.

 

And I have nothing against rich men.  I love racing sailboats.  I am not going to apologize for my sport.  It is what it is.  But let's not deceive ourselves.  The Rule 55 ban on throwing trash overboard has little if any relationship to actually doing any good for the earth.  To quote the unidentified "member of the US Sailing Rules Committee" who defended Rule 55 in a later post reproduced on the front page: "...this rule is in part about image – and that’s a good thing. Sailing faces a hell of a lot of challenges, and one of our selling points is the fact that we don’t need to consume much carbon or produce that much trash to do what we do....."

 

I hope he really believes that sailors "don't need to consume much carbon or produce that much trash to do what we do," because if he had thought through just how much consumption and production of trash occurs just to enable a single regatta, then I would say that's one of the most cynical remarks I have ever read.



#69 Gray Ghost

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:10 PM

Hilarious that Mr. Clean and SA are on a high horse about a few rubber bands and pieces of yarn when Clean just traveled literally halfway around the globe in order to -- get this - provide coverage of the Sydney-Hobart race for a free website -- that is, to provide coverage which by definition nobody is willing to pay to read.  

 

The resources expended, and the inevitable environmental damage done, by Clean simply in order to make his trip to Australia, dwarf by several orders of magnitude any damage which could be imagined as a result of rubber bands and yarn at Key West Race Week.

 

Clean, if you really care about the environment, just stay home.  



#70 GME

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:11 PM

Amendment 3 is up on the yacht scoring website. You can all simmer down now. And for those who won't be in KW.... Feel free to continue the rantings about how it should be run and how it is dead and how you could make it so much better if only you were in charge.

#71 Hobie Dog

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:18 PM

Wasn't it dengue fever or something last time :rolleyes:

Clean - you can be totally correct and totally wrong at the same time.

Throwing crap in the water is not good.

S2H threw stuff in the water and you didn't notice at the time.

SA and KWRW have a long history of screwing with each other.

So.......even though I am sure you are 100% correct about the email you got and sailors upset, it is 100% impossible for this to look like anything but the "what did they do THIS time" annual bash ;)

You my friend are spot on! Sums it all up nicely...

 

OK now back to your Clean/Anarchist/KWRW annual pissing contest... :lol:



#72 mad

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:19 PM

How many miles did Clean fly in the last 12 months?

#73 smv

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:21 PM

Great. When the sailmakers finish working on it, and bring it to the boat, I'll quit banding. Till then I don't need 15 guys (including the owner - and the crew chief) looking at me wondering why the fuck we have a couple hourglasses in our kite while our competitions kite pops open perfectly from bottom to top as they roll us. I don't hate the environment, but it's my job to make sure that thing goes up clean and I'm going to continue to make sure it does. 

 

That's on the big boat.

 

As it happens, I will be at KWRW this year, on a 40ish, boat - and we'll do our hoists without bands. On a boat that size I don't really expect problems, but again, if I were racing a big boat there - as I did all last season, I'd have to just ignore the rule along with everyone else. 

 

I am glad you are not using rubber bands, and I am also aware that the major sailmakers are all working on velcro or other solutions to the banding issue.  Things are going in the right direction, bit by bit



#74 dcbsheb

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:24 PM

Amendment 3 is up on the yacht scoring website. You can all simmer down now. And for those who won't be in KW.... Feel free to continue the rantings about how it should be run and how it is dead and how you could make it so much better if only you were in charge.

I don't think Clean's head will fit through the airplane door now that Peter Craig has heard his rant and amended the amendment.

#75 Pitbull

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:27 PM

maybe i am hallucinating, but i vaguely recall long ago...chutes that were packed in little bags and the whole kit was hoisted about halfway then popped  open...the little bag... on a string was retrieved for use again...or the "bag" was built in to the chute itself?

 

mumbles a bit and goes back to sleep



#76 amro

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 04:14 PM

Once again sailing anarchy becomes sailing angrily. There is more damage done by drug and caffeine residue pissed into the oceans by us. Sharks are bad enough. Imagine a shark hopped up on a few espressos. On the other hand, salmon could now be naturally fortified with vitamins and minerals.

#77 Callahan

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 04:54 PM

Alan needs a new nickname. Mr. Clean is out.  Rubber Band Man sounds about right.  https://www.youtube....h?v=kKbADFJOCkU



#78 Ragtime

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:01 PM

Seriously? The whole sport of sailing is unnecessary for human existence to continue and results in tons of copper in the water, volatile organics in the air, not to mention unwanted children born 9 months after major regattas and we are worried about grams of wool or rubber in the water??? My dog sheds that much daily without a second thought for the environment he is shedding into. 

 

I vote we allow only pure virgin rubber bands. I'm betting the rubber trees in the Amazon drip 10,000X as much rubber daily into the environment with no ill effects. How about using f'ing seaweed? Now that I think of it, I would be tempted to try it just to see if we could draw a RC Protest and watch the idiots debate whether seaweed was OK or not. Probably would depend on whether it was locally sourced, trucked unnecessarily to the race venue and/or post harvest processed...

 

No kudos to the PRO backing down on the issue. Same to any sponsor that got a bunch in their panties. And Clean, of all the environmental and health topics in sailing, this is the one to go mental on? 

 

Here's a dose of reality: Racing wastes more petrochemicals than dudes sport fishing in a Hatteras 65. They burn 1-2 gallons per mile, $5-$10/mile. Racing to Hawaii trashes at least 30% of a $150,000 suit of sails, all made of petrochemicals and human labor. That's $45,000 +/-, or $20/mile worth of the stuff. Ever look at it that way while swearing at those assholes in the stink potter as they go by? 

 

Or another view.  If you stayed home and watched sports on your LED TV, you would use $5 of electricity in a year, but instead you take 5-20 tons of boat out to play. If you really cared about the environment, get back on the couch.

 

This topic is pseudo-environmentalism to the max. Climb back into your ostensibly not polluting Prius and go home.



#79 Centurion

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:05 PM

maybe i am hallucinating, but i vaguely recall long ago...chutes that were packed in little bags and the whole kit was hoisted about halfway then popped  open...the little bag... on a string was retrieved for use again...or the "bag" was built in to the chute itself?

 

mumbles a bit and goes back to sleep

 

That was the Etchells.



#80 kent_island_sailor

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:42 PM

We didn't bank the chute that I can recall on a Hunter 54. Maybe that was why it was a PITA sometimes :rolleyes:



#81 crashtestdummy

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:45 PM

What's wrong with biodegradable yarn?



#82 Footlong

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:46 PM

What's wrong with biodegradable yarn?

Nothing



#83 Shaggy

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:49 PM

Funny, with all the wimpering and whining going on in this thread about clean and his windmills, it looks like he won....  

 

Good On ya Clean!!!!!

 

Keep it up...  



#84 us7070

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:52 PM

What's wrong with biodegradable yarn?

Nothing

 

natural rubber/latex is a plant product and is entirely biodegradeable - it is a naturally occurring substance

 

i wouldn't be surprised if it degrades faster than wool



#85 kent_island_sailor

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:52 PM

Question - How many "big boats" are down there now anyway? Is it all J-70s and J-80s or ???



#86 movable ballast

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:56 PM


Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.
 
J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.
 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.



How about cigarette butts? Are boats with smokers starting to carry ashtrays? I hope so.

Most smokers I know ash in the ocean but the buys go in the pocket to be thrown away properly later.

#87 Pitbull

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:01 PM

Funny, with all the wimpering and whining going on in this thread about clean and his windmills, it looks like he won....  

 

Good On ya Clean!!!!!

 

Keep it up...  

Really?....what exactly did he "win"....? this is a mojor victory of what?...ego?



#88 Snaggletooth

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:02 PM

 

 


Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.
 
J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.
 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.



How about cigarette butts? Are boats with smokers starting to carry ashtrays? I hope so.

Most smokers I know ash in the ocean but the buys go in the pocket to be thrown away properly later.

None of youre frends live NY.



#89 SA Lurker

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:08 PM

How many miles did Clean fly in the last 12 months?

 

Nothing GREEN about Clean.

Alan's carbon footprint in travel alone for the past year is extraordinary.

It would be interesting to know what, if anything, he does to try to offset his individual contribution to the burden on the environment

Perhaps he imagines that faulting others for their perceived environmental sins will garner him some credit.



#90 Shaggy

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:09 PM

Funny, with all the wimpering and whining going on in this thread about clean and his windmills, it looks like he won....  

 

Good On ya Clean!!!!!

 

Keep it up...  

Really?....what exactly did he "win"....? this is a mojor victory of what?...ego?

Ego, yes, maybe a major award????  



#91 Fiasco 1

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    Anarchy is not about a lack of rules.

    Its about a lack of rulers.

Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:11 PM

 

What's wrong with biodegradable yarn?

Nothing

 

natural rubber/latex is a plant product and is entirely biodegradeable - it is a naturally occurring substance

 

i wouldn't be surprised if it degrades faster than wool

What come on!  Mix up some of that yarn with your mashed potaoes and let us know how it works out. That's what the local Seafood  will be dining on.



#92 movable ballast

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:11 PM


 


 



Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.
 
J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.
 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.

How about cigarette butts? Are boats with smokers starting to carry ashtrays? I hope so.

Most smokers I know ash in the ocean but the buys go in the pocket to be thrown away properly later.
None of youre frends live NY.

True...

#93 Pitbull

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:24 PM

 

Funny, with all the wimpering and whining going on in this thread about clean and his windmills, it looks like he won....  

 

Good On ya Clean!!!!!

 

Keep it up...  

Really?....what exactly did he "win"....? this is a mojor victory of what?...ego?

Ego, yes, maybe a major award????  

Attached Files



#94 USA190520

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:28 PM

What about all the hair clean has left clogging storm drains and choking ecosystems?

What about that? The last shower he stepped out of looked like it was wearing a sweater...that can't be good

#95 A CheeseHead

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:33 PM

So the guys in the big boats need the bands, and the guys in the little boats don't. Where are the guys in the little boats peeing? Are they peeing in buckets and bringing the buckets in to shore to empty them in the interest of conservation?

 

Some years back the local YC had a marine railway for hauling E scows out.  The local city council member was watching one Sunday, saw water draining from the drain plugs at rear of the boats being hauled out, and hollered "OMG, they're draining their holding tanks on the shore!"  One sailor yelled back "Hell, lady, we just whiz over the side!"

Ever wonder what female dinghy sailors are doing when, between races, thay jump over the side, hold onto the gunwale for a bit, then climb back aboard?

 

Jeez, will you dipsh*ts get serious?  The ISAF adopted a rule.   Follow it, or stop racing.  Hell, most of you don't really race, you just go sailing with a bunch of other boats and have not a clue what any of the rules say.  Says a retired PRO & Protest Chair.



#96 MoMP

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:54 PM

 


Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.
 
J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.
 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.

How about cigarette butts? Are boats with smokers starting to carry ashtrays? I hope so

Actually, those who care, tear off the cherry and paper and pocket the filter.
 



#97 Pitbull

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:57 PM

 

 


Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.
 
J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.
 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.

How about cigarette butts? Are boats with smokers starting to carry ashtrays? I hope so

Actually, those who care, tear off the cherry and paper and pocket the filter.
 

Real men don't use filters...they field-strip n eat the butt when done...so the enemy wont know their position?



#98 rdoedens

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:59 PM

For all the obvious faults and hypocrisy of this particular rule, it is a very good thing that we are finding ourselves doing more navel gazing with respect to the environment in our sport than we have in the past.

 

Gone are the days (I hope) when you would toss dead batteries overboard when they drained so as to reduce weight. Gone are the days (I hope) when cans, bottles and the like are tossed overboard when emptied. For those who still don't give a damn, a rule like this serves as a reminder that we can make a difference and our attitudes must change. The percentage of man-made flotsam that washes up on our shores is growing at an alarming rate. The Great Pacific Garbage Patch didn't just appear out of nowhere. It grew one plastic bottle (and one rubber band) at a time.

 

To that end, there is so much more that racers can do to lessen Their impact on the environment. As ridiculous as it may seem to be prohibited from tossing a few ounces of rubber bands into the ocean, it is a (small) start. No doubt race committees would like to do more but if the elimination of rubber bands is going to cause near-riots, what do you think will happen when they introduce truly substantive environmental regulations. The poor buggers would fear for their lives, no doubt.

 

I race on the Great Lakes where overboard discharge is illegal and year after year I see weight-conscious rocket-sleds head out on 2- 4 day long distance races with nothing more than a porta-potti aboard to serve the mandatory black-water holding needs of a hearty crew of 6 - 8. Yet, to even consider eliminating these crowd-pleasers from the race would be unthinkable so instead, race-committees choose not to ask for evidence of or to mandate the holding capacity of any vessel. You don't have to be a rocket-scientist to figure out what happens on days 2 through 4 (although it does introduce a possible alternate use for the mandatory through-hull plugs). 

 

Good on any race-committee that has the courage and conviction to introduce and enforce any regulations (however small) that get us moving in the right direction. We have a long way to go yet so suck it up whiners and just figure out how to hoist a chute without throwing crap into the sea. And once you have figured that one out, start thinking about how to make sure that nothing leaving the dock ends up in the water. Enough already.



#99 USA190520

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 07:04 PM


 



Not very clean to fight a personal grudge over an issue that was never there till ISAF got their big feet into the smallest of puddles ever seen on earth. If Clean or ISAF want a cleaner planet please tackle some real issues... And do not try to distroy a perfectly fine regatta just because for some silly reason you have fallen out with the organizer. You should be bigger than that.

it's not like we can destroy a regatta that already took itself from one of the world's biggest down to 128 boats, 100 of which are J/boats.
 
J would actually be smart to just turn it into a J/fest.  I'd bet the farm that there would be more boats on the line next year if they did.
 
It is NOT COOL TO THROW RUBBER BANDS IN THE WATER.  I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise, but keep at it if you like.
How about cigarette butts? Are boats with smokers starting to carry ashtrays? I hope so
Actually, those who care, tear off the cherry and paper and pocket the filter.
 

how many young impressionable fish have started smoking anyway?

#100 Left Hook

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 07:04 PM

Anyone need another for key west? I'll be down there after the feeder race anyways and promise I can get a kite to the top of the mast fast enough that you won't even need bands!







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