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Beneteau First 40.7

Beneteau keel problems Buy Beneteau First 40.7 used

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#1 BalticSeaSailor

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Posted 07 August 2014 - 01:47 PM

Hey guys

I've heard from the First 40.7's "Barracuda" and "Cheeki Rafici", which losed their keels.
Now i want to ask: Can i buy this boat used with trust ?
What do Beneteau against the keel problems ?
Why did the ships losed their keels and how can i prevent it?

#2 6924

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Posted 07 August 2014 - 02:15 PM

leave 40.7 on jackstands

#3 radicalmove

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Posted 07 August 2014 - 04:20 PM

The 40.7 bashing that has gone on here is a little over the top.  Don't

forget 2 of these things took the Kenwood Cup by storm in a very windy

regatta, and I think one sailed on its bottom to get there. Not to mention

all of the 40.7s that have been sailing around without incident all over the

world for a while now. 

 

Sure these are not brick shithouses, so to speak.  But I think if you find one

that looks like it has been well maintained, get a very good surveyor to

inspect it thoroughly, and pay particular attention to the hull to keel area,

and make all recommended repairs, and annually inspect the boat and fix

things that need fixing, you should not have problems sailing around the

Baltic and coastal Europe. 

 

Would it be ideal for a multi year circumnavigation out of the reach of boatyards

and competent repair folks, probably not.  There are sailboats built specifically

for that type of use. 

 

But for a better performing cruiser / racer, the 40.7 has checked a lot of boxes

for a lot of sailors and continues to do so, especially at a price point.  I have no

financial interest in these boats, but have sailed on a number of them over the

years, and have had lot of fun.  Good Luck



#4 huwp

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 01:24 PM

'Fruit Machine' is now 'As Good As It Gets' and recently resold in Sydney I believe after very successful sailing in Adelaide (much modified as it was) And has done plenty of miles.

Another 40.7 (modified) also won a S2H and there are plenty of others still hanging around.

I'm not saying they are ideal, and not excusing the failure of a few, but they were/are a successful boat  in general.

My suggestion..... have it surveyed like you should any other boat, and decide based on that rather than rumour and innuendo here.



#5 IrieMon

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 03:18 PM

The Search function is your friend.....

 

http://forums.sailin...da#entry4563787



#6 Drop Bear.

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 07:49 PM

Are 40.7's good value?

 

Have to be very cheap these days to be a good buy.

 

 

Get the First 40.



#7 SCANAS

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 02:36 AM

Didn't Barracudda run aground first?

#8 Danziger

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Posted 17 August 2014 - 05:16 PM

Three Sisters did third on the ORC Worlds at the Baltic a fortnight ago. There are many other 40.7 still around racing very successfully all over the world. And many more are used for family cruising and occasional club racing like I do.

 

The keel debate is vital and it is the duty of the owner to maintain the boot and keep it in a safe shape. Cheeki Rafiki has been a commercial charter boat, heavily used and lost the keel in heavy weather with an unclear history of previous damage. Barracuda ran aground, any other modern GRP CR/Race could have lost the keel in this accident.

 

Before the 40.7 I owned a 1ton. I removed the keel and bolt it back three times in the 15 years of ownership. I will do so with my 40.7. The keel-mounting design is not weaker or even flaky compared to other 40 footer. On the contrary, the 40.7's keel mounting is designed with strong stringers and does not look weak at all. But one must keep in mind that many 40.7s on the market are workhorses receiving no mercy when raced. So its always a good idea to have a competent surveyor have a look before you pull the trigger.

 

---

 

IMHO, the amenities of the 40.7 are the very good up-wind performance in comfort, the very well thought out and spacious cockpit layout, the cruisy interior and the powerful rig. You can sail her very well only with a jib even in race mode (IRC/ORC), no genoa required. But you need inhaulers installed for a good beat performance. 

 

Her downsides are the leaky deck which can be fixed when overhauling the railing stanchions mountings. Those stanchion mountings are cruiser-grade and get broken by a racing crowd in a heart beat. The wheel's drive shaft is weak, at least for the JP3 models and should be up-graded. The wheel's spokes are prone to lose contact to the wheel.

 

Otherwise a safe family cruiser and good race-boat.

 

Hans



#9 jzk

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Posted 17 August 2014 - 07:30 PM

The 40.7 is a nice boat.  If you are worried, have someone check the bolts.



#10 JxD

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Posted 18 August 2014 - 11:02 AM

Whatever you do dont get the shallow draft option.. that thing tracks like a derailed train falling of a bridge...

theres a reason those boats are cheap, I would opt for something more solid or newer!



#11 Danziger

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Posted 18 August 2014 - 12:13 PM

Whatever you do dont get the shallow draft option.. that thing tracks like a derailed train falling of a bridge...

theres a reason those boats are cheap, I would opt for something more solid or newer!

 

The shallow version still has 1.90m. There are many C/R in the size range of the 40.7 which race very successful with a "shallow" draught of 2m, e.g. the new Dehler 38. I would say the 2.40m version sails better upwind but downwind?... I've got the 2.4m version but I#m sure the "shallow" keel version is not a bad sailboat.

 

The reason why these boats can be purchased for clearly under 100k EUR is the fact that most of these offerings are either beaten-up charter workhorses or owner race boats that don't receive love anymore because the boss is looking for a new toy. 

 

40.7s are currently a bargain, even the good ones. But the european market in general is pretty much down the drains. Please check the prices for something "solid" like HR or X-Yachts. IMX-40s can be bought now under 110k, there are offerings around 80k. And a new Dehler 38 can be purchase for 180k race-ready. Go figure.

 

For cruising I would prefer the 40.7 over an IMX-40 any day.

 

Hans



#12 arr4ws

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Posted 18 August 2014 - 12:14 PM

Whatever you do dont get the shallow draft option.. that thing tracks like a derailed train falling of a bridge...
 

 

uh? yes its more tippy than a a full keel , but a derailed train ? fuck no.

 

and i was sailing on one yesterday.

 

boat is solid , well built, lots of support on many active community. Many are still winning when racing and its one hell of a boat for cruising. If you can find one for a good price , youll love it.

 

Dont listen to all the haters here , anyway there isnt 1 good brands on sailinganarchy.



#13 JxD

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Posted 18 August 2014 - 01:59 PM

Whatever you do dont get the shallow draft option.. that thing tracks like a derailed train falling of a bridge...
 

 

uh? yes its more tippy than a a full keel , but a derailed train ? fuck no.

 

and i was sailing on one yesterday.

 

boat is solid , well built, lots of support on many active community. Many are still winning when racing and its one hell of a boat for cruising. If you can find one for a good price , youll love it.

 

Dont listen to all the haters here , anyway there isnt 1 good brands on sailinganarchy.


Did you sail the shallow draft version? It is tippy as fuck, and very hard to keep in the groove.. The interior is well laid out, but the boat reeks of cheap.. and when you enter one its not hard to understand why it cost 150k US less than higher quality european yachts from new... 

 

Whatever you do dont get the shallow draft option.. that thing tracks like a derailed train falling of a bridge...

theres a reason those boats are cheap, I would opt for something more solid or newer!

 

The shallow version still has 1.90m. There are many C/R in the size range of the 40.7 which race very successful with a "shallow" draught of 2m, e.g. the new Dehler 38. I would say the 2.40m version sails better upwind but downwind?... I've got the 2.4m version but I#m sure the "shallow" keel version is not a bad sailboat.

 

The reason why these boats can be purchased for clearly under 100k EUR is the fact that most of these offerings are either beaten-up charter workhorses or owner race boats that don't receive love anymore because the boss is looking for a new toy. 

 

40.7s are currently a bargain, even the good ones. But the european market in general is pretty much down the drains. Please check the prices for something "solid" like HR or X-Yachts. IMX-40s can be bought now under 110k, there are offerings around 80k. And a new Dehler 38 can be purchase for 180k race-ready. Go figure.

 

For cruising I would prefer the 40.7 over an IMX-40 any day.

 

Hans


How other shallow draft cruisers perform has very little to do with the performance of the bendy 40.7... 


My experience sailing  a shallow draft 40.7 is that it tracks really poorly on all angles.. rolls and rounds up downwind, and very hard to keep going straight and fast upwind.

Yes its a buyers-market at the moment.. all the more reason to steer clear of the cheapest entrylevel options! 

Id take the imx or x-40  over the 40.7 anyday.... was it a First 40... hmm then i would sing a different tune..



#14 TheFlash

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Posted 18 August 2014 - 02:25 PM

Ok, what about the Jeanneau version of the First 40? Problem is cast keel so its BIG.

alternative would be a light air used J130.

use would be sf bay, cali coastal race/cruise. Short handed race and famiky of 4 cruise. Budget all in about $200k. Dehler 41 CR also on the list and drafts only 2m or so.

#15 arr4ws

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Posted 18 August 2014 - 03:46 PM

J/130 is an amazing machine... but beware of deck moisture..



#16 ropetrick

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Posted 18 August 2014 - 06:17 PM

J/130 is an amazing machine... but beware of deck moisture..

It is a J Boat, of course the deck is wet. That's why it's for sale.



#17 inquiring Mind

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Posted 18 August 2014 - 11:21 PM

What is just as important as the keel bolts is the hull-to-keel joint.  That joint can be made invisible and remain that way for years if the boat is not grounded or otherwise flailed about.  If there is no obvious crack, you are good to go. 



#18 gqchicago

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 02:57 AM

Yes, it (Barracuda) ran aground and eventually broke up and sank while being pounded in large surf.    Has absolutely nothing to do with the build quality of the boat, just to set the record straight.  



#19 cms

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 08:53 AM

Jeanneau version of the First 40???? You've been on the pan galactic gargle blasters again!



#20 Balder

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 08:53 AM

I think the 30 40.7's at the China Cup provide a lot of data points. No keels lost in 7 years and these boats only go out under charter as they are owned by the Cup itself and several also go down for the Hainan race. So the skippers obviously push the boats hard when they are used.

 

They are maintained by the dealer. I will ask the service manager what if they are paying any extra special attention to the keels and what problems he has seen with the fleet.



#21 SCANAS

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 10:33 AM

Yes, it (Barracuda) ran aground and eventually broke up and sank while being pounded in large surf.    Has absolutely nothing to do with the build quality of the boat, just to set the record straight.  


That's what I thought. Couldn't remember the full story.

#22 TheFlash

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 09:37 PM

Jeanneau version of the First 40???? You've been on the pan galactic gargle blasters again!

Why not?  Standard First 40 (IRC optimized boat) with crappy keel. 

 

$175k for basically a brand new boat vs. $140k for a 15 year old J130 that needs new standing rigging.

 

I think I would prefer the J130 sailing ability to do nice high averages over distance, and be easy to double hand, but the Admiral liked the Bene.






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