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RE: Stupid Mexico Races


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#1 OHAWHO

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 08:39 PM

It seems to me that two weeks of time spent sailing to Puerto Vallarta is difficult for both owners and crew. The costs of not being at work, further distance to deliver the boat, and even more food to provide for the race add up. The creation of NHYC and BYC's Cabo races are the answer to this problem. After dwindling entries in the traditionally more competitive SDYC Puerto Vallarta race:

2000 37 Entries
2002 33 Entries
2004 22 Entries
2006 15 Entries
2008 19 Entries

and dwindling entries in the more cruising oriented Del Rey Yacht Club Puerto Vallarta race:

2001 37 Entries
2003 24 Entries
2005 22 Entries
2007 14 Entries

these new Cabo races are simply what the market forces have created. With almost 40 boats entered in this years BYC Cabo race and 19 in the Puerto Vallarta race you can see that the market has a stronger demand for the shorter distance race.
The most too ever in the SDYC Puerto Vallarta/Manzanillo is 42 and the most to ever enter in the DRYC Puerto Vallarta race is 37 a strong indication that the people racing in the Cabo race would likely not sail to Puerto Vallarta.
Trying to create some communistic race that unites both fleets is ideal but the desires of people who race to Puerto Vallarta races (possibly MEXORC or other indications) are different from those who sail to Cabo.

#2 inquiring Mind

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 08:47 PM

It seems to me that two weeks of time spent sailing to Puerto Vallarta is difficult for both owners and crew. The costs of not being at work, further distance to deliver the boat, and even more food to provide for the race add up. The creation of NHYC and BYC's Cabo races are the answer to this problem. After dwindling entries in the tradtionally more competitive SDYC Puerto Vallarta race:

2000 37 Entries
2002 33 Entries
2004 22 Entries
2006 15 Entries
2008 19 Entries

and dwindling entries in the more cruising oriented Del Rey Yacht Club Puerto Vallarta race:

2001 37 Entries
2003 24 Entries
2005 22 Entries
2007 14 Entries

these new Cabo races are simply what the market forces have created. With almost 40 boats entered in this years BYC Cabo race and 19 in the Puerto Vallarta race you can see that the market has a stronger demand for the shorter distance race.
The most to ever in the SDYC Puerto Vallarta/Manzanillo is 42 and the most to ever enter in the DRYC Puerto Vallarta race is 37 a strong in dication that the people racing in the Cabo race would likely not sail to Puerto Vallarta.
Trying to create some communistic race that unites both fleets is ideal but the desires of people who race to Puerto Vallarta races (possibly MEXORC or other indications) are different from those who sail to Cabo.

I can read the data to say that interest in both races has dwindled. Cabo is the pits, and PV is further, so it's horses for courses, seems to me.

#3 R Booth

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 08:50 PM

MDR to Bahia Tortugas?


Just an idea..........

#4 opusone

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 09:05 PM

Dont forget that Long Beach Yacht Club held a race to Mexico just a few months ago - I think 6 boats went.

Running the race is expensive, time consuming and takes alot of our volunteers to run and organize the event. It would be great if we could get another club to join us in organizing the event. As a member of BYC, I would like to think we would welcome the help from another club. Hold fewer events to increase participation, share the costs and volunteer work.

I am racing my boat to Cabo in March to get her ready for Transpac - the distance is right and I do not have the time to go all the way to PV - besides, my boat is on the slower side of the entrants thus far.

Just my .02 cents

opusone

#5 Jguy

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 09:25 PM

PV isn't all that much faster when you figure in the fact that you are starting from San Diego instead of Newport or MDR. Also, who wants to go to Cabo over and over, how about a little variety and swap every year. Also remember that Cabo is much more expensive and they don't welcome our sailboats there like they do in PV. Fishing is numero uno in Cabo. I would suggest NHYC and BYC co-host Cabo in odd years and SDYC continue their PV race in even years to tie in with MEXORC as they have done for decades.

#6 Bitter Gnat

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 09:32 PM

JGuy hit the nail on the head. Mexorc is the reason SD to PV is still the one to do.

#7 R Booth

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 09:34 PM

At the risk of sticking my ignorant nose into a racing thread again, is there a reason that La Paz has not been considered? It's literally got everything needed---anchorages, 6 marinas, int'l airport, a lot more scenic than Cabo and without the prices and idiot tourists, nicer people and cleaner water.

Again, just an idea...........

#8 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 09:36 PM

PV is a great, populous town on a gorgeous bay full of opportunities for fishing, island hopping, and cruising, with lots of reasonably priced services for visiting yachts.

Cabo is a shithole populated by drug-addled college kids, criminals, and sportfisherman from Texas.

If you're going to race all that way, you might as well go somewhere nice.

Just sayin'

#9 NoStrings

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 09:53 PM

Rick,
Most people won't want to turn the corner at Cabo and then suffer a 100 mile light air upwind slog to La Paz.

#10 longy

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 10:10 PM

The crux of the discussion is whether or not you want to cross the wind shadow off Cabo (restart race) or deal with the wind turning off at night in Banderass bay. Cabo is short time & distance, most can fit it into work scedules PV (or La Paz) is another 2-3 days of racing. No ones forced to spend time in Cabo, I've been on a cpuple of boats where the entire crew flew out the day they finished, leaving the delivery crew a clean boat to live on while they got ready to return. If you must make a vacation out of the race, meet the girls somewhere else nicer/cheaper after the race finish

#11 Hitchhiker

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 10:42 PM

I'm with Longy, the Cabo race is far more satisfying wind wise, than either PV or Manzanillo. I don't care what the destination is, I'm in it for the race and the sailing. I've spent too many times drifting across Banderas Bay, watching all of the back enders catching up. That said, I'm going again!

#12 Hank

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 11:19 PM

Hello ...R Booth and others

Have any of you heard or seen this.......

This is from the Del Rey Yacht Club site.

I do not think this is answer, I think I agree with the Editor........

These stupid different YACHT CLUBS need to start talking to each other.

________ __________ _____________ ___________________


DRYC cordially invites you to participate in the 20th Biennial Marina del Rey to Puerto Vallarta
International Yacht Race. Forty years of continuous race management has earned DRYC a
reputation for unparalleled excellence in presenting a long distance race event.


The PV€™09 Race Series features separately scored races, with stops in beautiful anchorages down the
coast of Baja California
, where skippers will experience fun-filled social activities at each destination. An
innovative Scoring System computes handicap and corrected time on actual time sailed. This allows the
use of engine power if the winds are so light as to preclude a boat from finishing one race in time to enjoy
the end-of-leg festivities and to start the next race. There are two Divisions: Spinnaker and Non-Spinnaker.

#13 Prouda my Pickle Dish

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 11:35 PM

PV is a great, populous town on a gorgeous bay full of opportunities for fishing, island hopping, and cruising, with lots of reasonably priced services for visiting yachts.

Cabo is a shithole populated by drug-addled college kids, criminals, and sportfisherman from Texas.

If you're going to race all that way, you might as well go somewhere nice...

Word.

After no races for 6 years, NHYC decided to schedule their Cabo race just 30 days after the start of the ongoing Del rey PV Race! No consideration for the timing of the events! That caused the racers to make a choice and cut participation in half. Classy.

The light air reach across the bay to PV can be a challenging adjunct to the race and allows those behind a chance to catch up or those ahead to extend their lead to save their time...it's called sailboat racing and it's part of the game. I'd rather spend the extra day to get someplace fun and interesting.

The multi-leg race on the site is designed to allow the Cruising class boats a little fun and a to get in before the party is done. Racers can go non-stop. This concept is not new...the Ensenada race allows motoring in Cruising Classes.

#14 SailDaddy

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 12:28 AM

We used to race to Acapulco and Mazatlan too. MexORC used to rotate between Tenacatitas near Acapulco and Banderas Bay near PV. I kind of liked Mazatlan and the El Cid hotel and Marina was nice. Probably fell down by now though. But crosing the Gulfo de Calli was either feast or famine. No wind or 40kts.

Got to agree about Cabo though. Maybe fun once but not a lot. It is a day or 2 closer though. All depends on how well you call the gybe. Fastest we ever got to PV never even saw the lights of Cabo.

There were some navigator that thought that getting to PV is more tactical than getting to Honoruru. (Another beautiful Marina)

#15 pooodil

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 01:25 AM

The crux of the discussion is whether or not you want to cross the wind shadow off Cabo (restart race) or deal with the wind turning off at night in Banderass bay. Cabo is short time & distance, most can fit it into work scedules PV (or La Paz) is another 2-3 days of racing. No ones forced to spend time in Cabo, I've been on a cpuple of boats where the entire crew flew out the day they finished, leaving the delivery crew a clean boat to live on while they got ready to return. If you must make a vacation out of the race, meet the girls somewhere else nicer/cheaper after the race finish

Longy
A slow PV race is 5 days and change now that you finish at Punta Mita.
A slow Nwpt Cabo race is 4 days and change.
2 to 3 days to cross the Gulf is called bad tactics ( navigation ) ?
PV is a much superior destination which my family appreciate.
The fact that people want to spend less time competing is evident in the general drop in participation in "overnite races"
Personaly I think people are getting soft and can't hack the challenge.
Yes the clubs need to be more aware and respectful of each other when scheduling their events.
Thats my peso's worth.

#16 Harry Pattison

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 03:21 AM

Another factor to consider is the size of the race. Last year's NHYC Cabo race and this year's BYC both have about the maximum number of boats that either of the clubs want, and pretty much the maximum that Cabo can accommodate. So having another race for other people to enter may actually increase the number of boats that race each year.

The different races also appeal to different people that have different ideas of how long a race they want to do, and where they want to finish. The new Del Rey yacht Club race that is being done in four legs, and you can sail in any or all legs, adds a whole new dimension to the boats that can do longer races. The first leg of the race to Turtle Bay will be open to boats 30 feet and up, and being only a day or so longer than the Ensenada Race seems to be appealing to a lot of smaller boats that now have a chance to do more of a true offshore race, and can do the race and the delivery home all in one week. I think it is a great idea and will further increase participation in Mexican races, not distract from the ones already on the calendar.

#17 R Booth

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 03:40 AM

I mentioned earlier about a MDR to Turtle Bay race, Mr. Pattison. I think it's about 440 miles, gets a little windier in the northern half of Baja, the bay can hold a zillion boats, there's an airstrip in the town of 700 people, restaraunts, bars and stores, fantastic people, fuel, long quiet beaches, good fishing, cel phone coverage, a medical clinic, a pier and is a 17 hour drive to TJ. My (ratehr limited) experience there thinks that a late October or Spring Breakish date would get people in warmer water and nicer weather. Maybe Dry Armour could summon up the wind charts for those periods. But all in all, it could be an interesting venue.

But again, I'm not a racer....nor do I play one on TV..........

#18 opusone

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 03:40 AM

[quote name='pooodil' date='Feb 4 2008, 05:25 PM' post='1527968']
Longy
"Personaly I think people are getting soft and can't hack the challenge."

Pooodil -

You nailed it - I am absolutely "soft" and "can't hack the challenge."

Are you going???

opusone

#19 pooodil

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 02:37 PM

"Personaly I think people are getting soft and can't hack the challenge."

Pooodil -

You nailed it - I am absolutely "soft" and "can't hack the challenge."

Are you going???

opusone
[/quote]
Fuck yea !!!!!

#20 Hank

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 03:50 PM

Maybe Dry Armour could summon up the wind charts for those periods. But all in all, it could be an interesting venue.

But again, I'm not a racer....nor do I play one on TV..........



March is consistently the windiest month of the year on the Baja Coast. Just ask the delivery skippers. And northern Baja is not necessarily windier than southern Baja. Weather patterns on the Baja California coast (Lower California) and for that matter all of the Alta California coast (Upper California) coast generally last four days.

#21 MR.CLEAN

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 04:02 PM

Weather patterns on the Baja California coast (Lower California) and for that matter all of the Alta California coast (Upper California) coast generally last four days.

Except when they last 14...

#22 R Booth

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 04:12 PM

On my two seperate down hill trips to Cabo (Febuary and Halloween time) we had much more breeze in the northern half.................

#23 Hank

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 03:53 PM

On my two seperate down hill trips to Cabo (Febuary and Halloween time) we had much more breeze in the northern half.................


I know it seems that way sometimes, but ask any delivery skipper that has been stuck in Cabo or in Bahia Santa Maria for more than a few days. Sometimes it is no different than the Big Sur coast line in terms of wind. The southern half also has some shallow spots and sea mounts that make the sea state very interesting to say the least.

#24 DogBalls

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 05:08 PM

How about the South - North Boarder run... COmplete with German Shepards, Armed Boarder Patrol, and electrical fences...

Oh, you mean sailing races? Don't know, haven't done any




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