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Bill5

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Posts posted by Bill5

  1. Just now, Bruce Hudson said:

    I emphatically apologize for any offense caused by my approach above.

    (It is painful for me with friends and family being in your metaphorical dumpster fire).

    My hope is that much distance is put between humanity and any such metaphorical dumpster fires. The question is equally how to fight fires both present and future.

    I am not offended at all! It is what it is. No candy coating. And if it is the turn of phrase that offends, well, that’s your issue.

    Let’s talk about Zim ILCAs, of which I would not hesitate to purchase and support my local dealer. No politics in my decision.

    • Like 1
  2. 3 minutes ago, Bruce Hudson said:

    Nobody above said that they were.

    Yet as a consequence, metaphorical bridges are being built.

    Sorry Bill, that is a bit rich, and incorrect about the environmental issues. It is offensive to suggest that China is still crawling out of the dark ages - actually, we all are. The pandemic should be a lesson in humility - particularly for the UK and US - please learn it. Yes, there are human rights issues in China for sure. In my view spitting vitriol won't get you very far.

    I am not trying to get very far. Just sharing my thoughts. 

  3. 6 hours ago, Bill5 said:

    Anyway, let's get back to Wess' bet and see where we stand. Here is what Wess said:

    image.png.85b38fb8d04ecb499a62b9ab3554b47b.png

    Results

    Higher prices: There can be some debate - as different geographies have different experiences, but straight up the price has gone up. Win: Wess

    Supply problems: No need to comment. Win: Robbie, Tracey and others, handily.

    Quality problems: So far, one leaky bailer. LPE had quality problems well before all this. PSA were already producing higher quality boats, and there IS no reason NOT to believe the other builders will put out a quality product. Win: Robbie, Tracy and others, handily. 

    Lawsuit: Has there been a new lawsuit post "SMOD LPE world"?

    So it's either a 3-1 win for Robbie, Tracey and others, or a tie. And the tie would go to Robbie, Tracey and others just because Wess can be such a dick. 

    TYPO FIXED

  4. I have no problem buying an ILCA made in China. According to people that actually know what they are talking about, a quality product can be expected. I am sure there are thousands of quality businesses and millions of wonderful people in China. But as a nation? It’s a dumpster fire. It may be crawling out of the dark ages, but the country’s human rights record and ongoing middle-finger to environmental issues are disgusting. No need to come back with “Ya, but what about (insert nation here)”. Most countries have crosses to bear, but not like China. It’ll be shit for decades to come. And ILCAs aren’t being built their because ILCA are “building bridges”.

    • Like 4
  5. Anyway, let's get back to Wess' bet and see where we stand. Here is what Wess said:

    image.png.85b38fb8d04ecb499a62b9ab3554b47b.png

    Results

    Higher prices: There can be some debate - as different geographies have different experiences, but straight up the price has gone up. Win: Wess

    Supply problems: No need to comment. Win: Robbie, Tracey and others, handily.

    Quality problems: So far, one leaky bailer. LPE had quality problems well before all this. PSA were already producing higher quality boats, and there in no reason to believe the other builders will put out a quality product. Win: Robbie, Tracy and others, handily. 

    Lawsuit: Has there been a new lawsuit post "SMOD LPE world"?

    So it's either a 3-1 win for Robbie, Tracey and others, or a tie. And the tie would go to Robbie, Tracey and others just because Wess can be such a dick. 

    • Like 4
  6. On 5/7/2021 at 5:50 AM, Wess said:

    Moths to a flame.  Fish in a barrel.  So easy a caveman could do it.  And so much fun.

    I'm thinking a more accurate statement is "flies to shit". I have certainly been guilty of being a fly to a lot of your shit. My bad. 

    • Like 1
  7. On 5/7/2021 at 6:52 AM, Wess said:

    I agree but reject the premise as being irrelevant and flawed.  Its not about Scheidt vs you or me or Bill.  Its about Bill vs Bill in those two boats and if you are honest the upgraded one will be faster.  And that ain't OD.  Its simply a way for ILCA and manufactures to make money. 

    Repeat:

    Bill vs Bill. Bill wins every time. But I remain curious, Wess, as to what class Bill can buy a 25 year old boat and win without upgrading. And what one design has remained unchanged since the first one hit the water?

    • Like 2
  8. 7 minutes ago, Xeon said:

    The py system doesn’t really tell you anything as all it does is measure the speed of one group of sailors again the speed of other groups of sailors. So doesn’t tell you anything about one classes boat speed.


    But for the record over the last 15 year the py number has got bigger meaning the Laser/ILCA has got SLOWER . 

     

    I have owned boat with and without the new controls. Overall was I faster with the new controls NO. 

    BUT the new controls ( especially the new harken vang ) did mean l could  go sailing in windy conditions when before I was just overpowered and often didn’t even bother going rigging up. 
    So it just ment I had a last place again my name on the race sheet instead of a DNS. :D

     

    Thanks Xeon. But I do think PN is a reasonable indicator of speed, and what everyone asks when a “how fast is it” question is out forward in DA. I know the numbers tend to rise and fall marginal amounts based on reporting of results, etc, but I think the Laser variance has been quite small - and is based on results from over 28,000 races. 
    Your point is right on in terms of sailability with the new gear. That, and durability, have been what has driven every change. None were done to make the boat faster. 

    • Like 2
  9. 22 minutes ago, Wess said:

    I agree but reject the premise as being irrelevant and flawed.  Its not about Scheidt vs you or me or Bill.  Its about Bill vs Bill in those two boats and if you are honest the upgraded one will be faster.  And that ain't OD.  Its simply a way for ILCA and manufactures to make money. 

    Bill vs Bill. Bill wins every time. But I remain curious, Wess, as to what class Bill can buy a 25 year old boat and win without upgrading. And what one design has remained unchanged since the first one hit the water?

     UK guys - has the PN for the Laser jumped over the years as the result of changes?

    • Like 2
  10. 8 hours ago, Wess said:

    Where the heck did I say that?  You folks are claiming the boats are all OD.  Come on that is absurd.   You can spend thousands more or less upgrading an older used boat or a new base model ILCA, equipment them quite differently, and the build processes have changed.  Some are faster and some are slower around the course and the sales of new (boats and gear) is how ILCA leadership has decided to fund themselves since can't get most Laser sailors to join so this will continue.  That is one of the reasons I believe the construction manual should be public and upcoming changes announced prior... so you can avoid buying an obsolete ILCA.

    Read your last sentence calling for notice of changes. Perhaps “vote” was too strong of a word on my part. What makes a Laser obsolete? What are your expectations? A guy in our club (Laser returnee) picked a slime green Laser from the 70’s. All original - red shag, the works. Do you actually believe he should be able to launch and win with no updates? In what class can you do this? Must be lots of edibles in Wess world.
     

    • Like 1
  11. 45 minutes ago, Wess said:

    Dare you to buy one!

    The local dealer is selling Zims. If I was in the market, I would buy from him. I would buy from him if he was selling ILCAs from the UK, Argentina, Poland, Australia, Thailand or Italy. 

    • Like 2
  12. 1 hour ago, Wess said:

    Apparently you are both an idiot incapable of reading.  Try to phone a friend and they can read to all the things OTHERS have already said were wrong with these boats.  Oh and have a nice day.  :)

    Well, there was a photo of one with a cleat on backwards while still in the shop. And there was one with a leaky bailer that Robbie spoke to. The And then there was Julian B’s glowing report and reference for the builder. What other comments based on actual experience are there? I phoned a friend and he couldn’t help. He must be an idiot.

  13. 3 hours ago, Wess said:

    All right but then don't claim its OD.  Because its not. The difference between an older used L:aser boat with no upgrades and a newer ILCA boat with all of them is 1.) a lot of money (more than $1000 and of which ILCA leadership take a cut), and 2.) speed around the course.

    Oh I see. So back in the 70s you think they should have taken fixing the mast step to a vote. 

    • Like 1
  14. 7 hours ago, Wess said:

     

    He would ask why does ILCA think its OK that you can upgrade your (NOT) OD boat - at the cost of $ thousands - on:

      * Improved mast sections (upper now, lower coming)

      * Better line packages

      * Better vangs

      * Better outhaul connections and controls

      * Improved daggerboards and daggerboard controls

      * Improved rudders

      * Better sails

      * Various tillers and tiler extensions

    And he would think you a fool if you think that new rigs aren't coming in part because this is how class leadership makes money for the class since folks don't join and how builders make money.

    If lemming were really honest they would concede that there are so many upgrades that cost in total thousands, and that the only thing that is still OD on the boat is the hull.  And bad news lemmings you only think that because changes to the hulls are buried in the construction manual and not made public so you don't even know that your hull has been obsoleted some time ago.

    Happy Monday all!

    The only change I would have backed off was the vang. No problem with the purchase, but a stopper at block to block (or just past) would have saved a bunch of top sections, and perhaps reduced the need for the carbon top. The balance are either durability or simple efficiency related. Nothing that changed the performance of the boat. 

    • Like 2
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