r.finn

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Posts posted by r.finn


  1. 6 minutes ago, stief said:

    Was afraid of that. 

    Waves are the worst for peace of mind with my tri. Banging against the 'bunks', slapping and twisting the amas (not that I could see any flex), was always a constant worry.

    Not quite as bad as the background anxiety of being holed while lugging around a big chunk of lead, though.

    As far as voyage planning/ comms, any comments on 'Brisbane' Bill's use of forss' tracker and the expense of a WSSRC registration (GBP 1835. 00, I think)? 

    Yeah, I've always hated waves.  Whenever I hear someone talk about how fast their boat is, I smile and nod, but what I'm really thinking is "yeah, but what about in waves?".  Anxiety has always had the most comfortable birth on the boat.  That will always be the case.  Not familiar with Forss'.  WSSRC: I guess it made sense before everyone had trackers, but today I have 2 trackers, no engine, and when I arrive in SF will anyone really tell me that the voyage was illegitimate?  If so, I'm not sure who that will be a problem for, but it won't be me.  I feel that their fee is better spent getting Jzerro ready again.

    • Like 4

  2. 2 hours ago, mightyhartley said:

    Yes, all the board sports which seem to see themselves as progressive have totally adopted the shunting way and look back on their roots as primitive and awkward for still using the traditional bow/stern model: snowboarding vs skiing; wakeboarding vs water skis; skateboard vs roller skates...

    I grew up skateboarding.  I'm Goofy footed (port tack) but did flip tricks switch, I mean, starboard, so maybe this always made sense.  


  3. 43 minutes ago, stief said:

    Wondered when someone would link Jzerro and Jezerro. :D 

    Has been quite rewarding comparing and contrasting the two voyages over the last few weeks (and the dreams behind the projects).

    Sure, but I made Jzerro's crater ;).

    • Like 5

  4. I cannot find a picture of it, but in the 90's there was a successful 60+/- foot tacking proa that won a handful of races in the Med but was lost during a transatlantic race.  It was yellow with large, round beam sections and very wide.  Anyone know the boat I'm thinking of?

    • Like 1

  5. 3 minutes ago, SeaGul said:

    Skateway is a 40ft offshore racer - very different - and better for the task of record - but more expensive of c; 

     

     

     

    Sounds great!  How much?


  6. 33 minutes ago, Wess said:

    With so so so many cats and tri out sailing all over the world can somebody please direct me to a list of the many failed beams?

    2002 Route du Rhum

    • Like 1

  7. 1 hour ago, Wess said:

     

    A while back your crew (think it was you owning Jzerro then) posted about the experience of racing Jzerro against an F31R and being somewhat faster or slower depending on conditions but that where Jzerro shined was when the breeze and seastate got up such that the F31 needed to back off.  It prompted further discussion of how the proa might be a better heavy weather offshore platform than a cat or tri.  Not sure if you agree that or not.  But if you don't mind I was wondering if you could explain why you picked a proa for this voyage (compared to a cat or tri):

      * Because it hasn't been done before by a proa and specifically looking to prove that the proa platform is capable of making this type of journey safely?

      * Because the proa offered the best bang for the $ in terms of acquisition cost?

      * Because the proa would be fastest?

      * Because the proa would be safest?

    If being safest is part of it, I would really appreciate to understand why you think that. 

    Hope you are well.

    Thanks for the support.  We did race against an F31R and they were clearly faster than us in light air out of the bay.  We had a strategic difference that benefited us, so it wasn't apples for apples during the first 24 hours.  They stayed closer to rhumbline and we went as far east as we could.  24 hours into it they were ahead DTF, but only a little further south than us (Pensacola to Isla Mujeres).  We rolled the dice on a big shift filling in from the East and we both sailed most of the night in very light wind that first night.  By day break the wind began it's 270 degree swing to the east, and we were over 20 miles E of the F32R after it settled in.  So we benefited from the new wind for longer and actually saw their silhouette to the west, at dusk the second night.   That evening we crossed the northern end of the Gulf Stream "loop" and inside the loop there was (as usual) a really nasty sea state.  Short waves from every direction.  Jzerro happily romped through there but it was very unpleasant for the crew. Because of our lee hull having high freeboard, no water came over the prow.  Having sailed trimarans a bit I knew they would be having to slow down to A. keep their sanity and B. safely keep their ama from diving.  We kept our bow E of rhumbline in anticipation of the header.  On the third night I saw their silhouette on the horizon behind us as we both set up for a night of unstable showers from the SE.  After sunrise we crossed the GS again on our approach to Isla Mujeres.  This was moderate 11-15 knots close to the wind, but not a full beat, in relatively flat water.  After reviewing the race tracker, it appears this is where we actually extended the most, the last 60 or 80 miles close hauled in over 10 knots and flat water.  We finished two hours ahead of them.  So I don't know what that means, but I know they were an experienced team, as I've also seen them at the end of a Pensacola to Havana race and a Chicago Mac race.  There was a short tacking duel leaving the Pensacola Bay channel and it was a joke.  They were long gone by the time we finished our third tack.  The only other big maneuver after that was a gybe the next morning and we were on port tack for the remaining 450 miles.  

    *I didn't pick the proa because it was specifically unique.  This record has never been done at all, so I could have chosen a Cape Dory 36 if I wanted, but I wanted to do it quickly with a limited budget and low running costs.  A Class 40 is an obvious choice, but I think a vast majority of them would be slower and the price would be way higher to run and own.

    *Yes, more knots/$.  

    *The Jzerro option was the fastest option for a small budget.

    *As previously mentioned I would never attempt this on a 3,200 lb trimaran or cat.  I don't think their beams are up to task and the boat would be a lot shorter.  Honestly it would have to be a pretty robust tri or cat for me to attempt something like this and I'd probably end up on the Cape Dory 36' as the second option, based on budget.

    • Like 3

  8. 22 minutes ago, SeaGul said:

    The fact that nobody crushed what I stated - I think it rather close to the truth...   then to say its not a big deal that proas really have big trouble with basic boathandling is the real problem for them , not that they look different.  Most of the designs we see are coastal designs where tacking/jibbing/shunting is important. The problem could be solved wit a design that was atlantic on one tack and pacific on the other - and had a bow and stern. Could be a fun boat to sail - and cheaper than other solutions; simple rudder and dagger - much faster and easy and exiting to handle. 

    Yes, anyone who says that a proa could compete with regular boats on a windward leeward course is either lying or has no idea of what they are talking about.  You will not get that argument from me. I would never sign up for a race that was leass than 100 miles due to that handicap.  I do not agree with you regarding how vulnerable they are during the tack though.  It simply hasn't been my experience.  And they are fine for coastal cruising etc...  I've done plenty of short tacking under mainsail only to get to a tight spot, but it will never be as easy as tacking your trimaran.  Consider this: without the jib, you still have to stop and ease the main 90 degrees, then sheet it it the remaining 90 degrees while going back to upwind course.  There is drift and sailing well off of upwind for a considerable part of that maneuver, no matter how quickly you do it.  The boat has to go from stop to reverse, reach then upwind, every tack.  It's clearly not the type of boat you want SeaGul.  

    • Like 1

  9. 3 hours ago, SeaGul said:

    Regarding tacks - we really dont turn down to get speed in the start of the tack - but after a tack we do. I also think a proa that stops totally can use some time to get going again and also drift abit - so the reality it even worse than stated over. 

    The picture for a jibe; a cat or tri that jibes barely slows down - and just take a turn  and goes again at good speed. So if you need a shunt downwind you really loose a lot distance.... 

    Regarding bigger seas and wind; tacking is still easy - using the right moment to tack its often easier than with no waves. But to take a full stop broadside to the waves - then you are sitting duck. 

    I thought of you when I saw this.  Enjoy.

    eb4016d64722ac6400137de210909a08.jpg

    • Like 2

  10. 35 minutes ago, harryproa said:

     

     
    Ryan,
    You are brown trolling.  
    I answered the question about Harryproa owners not posting in the R2A thread.  You ignored it, waited a couple of months and repeated it.
    I quoted Rick Willoughby and other owners on Harryproas in post #59 Big Red Proa and #355 on the R2A thread.  Russ called it bullshit; pussy accused Rick of lying and taking bribes.  You ignored it, told us what you "hate about Rob", waited a couple of months and repeated yourself.   
    I am trying to be nice, but it's hard when you continue the sniping.      
    Something you might like to think about before rushing out your response:  I get interest in Harryproas from adverse posts on SA, but I have a bunch of helpful idiots that make replying easy and a product that is unique.  I also fund my own adventures and boats.   
    You are selling yourself in competition with hundreds of other wannabees so maybe you should concentrate on your image, rebuilding your boat and leave me alone. 
    Or,  you can keep it up,  I will respond in kind and we will see what happens to your donations and support.    Your call.

    I'm pretty sure everyone here would love to hear directly from the operators of you boats. I don't think I've ever read a post from someone who owns and operates one of your designs, despite how good your guerilla marketing on forums has been for your business.  It's time.

    • Like 2

  11. 1 hour ago, SeaGul said:

    Neither the R-33 nor the SC30 needs to fly hulls to do 15kn downwind - they will be nowhere near their limits in 15kn wind. But the seastate would be important ... a proa with the ama on a wave seems scary with just the pod to save it. 

    It may seem scary, but I assure you it's not.

    • Like 3

  12. 1 hour ago, multihuler said:

    Give Jzerro a break, for all that she has given her two owners, she deserves a south pacific cruise, coconuts, rum and half naked women , not a 50/50 death bash around the horn.   Ryan has proven his testosterone level, Back to Jzerro, besides injuring Ryan, how about losing a perfectly FINE proa? 

    What if everything we learned in kindergarten was wrong?

     

    Didn't  Bernard Moitessier teach anybody anything?

     

    25000 people a day die of starvation.,

    You want to put together a fun multihull race? Raise money to plant food!  We can call it what do you mean 25000 people die of starvation every day. 

    Human beings priorities are messed up.

     

     

     

     

    I hope this doesn't offend you, but are you really the best person to advise others about how to use their boats?

    • Like 1

  13. 36 minutes ago, Sidecar said:

    @r.finn

    Have you considered the possibility of a suitably curved “moustache” foil spanning from (and supported by) the keel bottom and the outer edge of your leepod for extra stability and lift at speeds?

    It's possible, but far from my budget or priority.  I'd rather put my energy into making the boat lighter.  I think foils to leeward make a lot of sense on a new design though.

    • Like 2

  14. 11 minutes ago, triple jim said:

    Ryan, thanks for sharing your sailing experience, I make more sense of pacific proas now. I have a question : I guess the ama slams sometimes into waves as the weather ama of a tri would do and is that a problem when the ama is fully ballasted ? How do you handle this ?

    Excuse me "trolls", I have nothing against Harry Proas but I understand it's a completely different story to fly a lightly ballasted ama compared to concentrate the load on an ama hosting the accommodations, we 're talking completely different concepts and different levels of loads on the akas...

    I had the opportunity to sail along with Lady Godiva in Sete, another Atlantic proa from Dick Newick and Tahiti Douche (Atlantic too). Cool boats. Another proa is back to life in Ibiza, thanks to Stuart and Zack Rodgerson : Anglia Pipedream, I guess I have a photo somewhere...

     

    Yes, the ama can get hit hard when reaching and it's worse when heavily loaded with ballast.  You can definitely add more sail area and go faster, but depending on sea state, it doesn't feel good for the structure when the waves are up, so I try not to push it. 

    Lady Godiva and Tahiti Douche!  Amazing looking boats.  See if you can find that AP photo!

    • Like 1

  15. 2 minutes ago, TwoBirds said:

    Makes sense, wess has been posting in these threads for ages and doesn't even know the basics, up till now I've been assuming he's just stirring the pot and reacting accordingly.

    I've been playing around with an idea for explaining the basic proa types as relates to a trimaran so it's easier to picture.

    Wess volunteered his trailer to haul Jzerro, among other services, and I nearly took him up on it before heading to Jim Brown's house to take care of it there. He's definitely an ally.

    • Like 1