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65- by 32-foot catamaran 3200sqft of living space


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at this point there is only one course of action that he is going to accept, launch. And sorry for those that are offended but i AM laughing. I am also horrified at the whole thing but enough warnings have put in front of him, enough smart people have offered help. What's the saying? You can fix stupid.

Actually, the saying is you CAN'T fix stupid. -_-

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I can assure you, nothing was added to The Rod's replies.   Perhaps sharing my reverence for The Rod, as well as my deep appreciation for the journalistic accomplishments of my Sailing Anarchy predece

And wtf happened to lil'murray.......?

Guy did not grow a vagin! Mr. Hot is full of merde! The only place Mr. Hot has seen a double hurricane is in La Nouvelle Orléans. 

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if H-R Rubber Bands all the parts together so as to not lose everything when it breaks the first time

 

and brings enough tools and wet-patch cement

 

he could Morph along and perhaps eventually

 

wind up with something made for the conditions of the Open Sea

 

 

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Oi! Woody. Don't mention rubber bands!

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More pictures of the interior.

 

.... ...

the two intermediate beams span the distance, they are supported at the top by the beam shown and at the forward end of the bridge deck. If you look closely in the this photo the burner portion or a propane powered turkey deep fryer can be seen center forward.

 

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Still in roughly the same place standing a little further aft and now rotated to show the forward port corner of the cabin. I am told that this area will be designated as the gym on the boat. Actually I am standing with my back pushed up against some sizeable piece of gym equipment.

 

... ...

 

yah "steel reinforced beams" using galvanized joist hangers.

 

That's kind of an odd place for the head, isn't it?

 

FB- Doug

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I've studied the pictures above, lilmurrey, and I've identified all of the objects. It's 100% garbage. Probably soon to be flotsam.

 

I have examined the turkey fryer, and I can say confidently that it appears to be in very servicable condition

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ORDER Your Flyin Hawaiian Apparel Now !!!!!!

 

 

Shirts $30 - Pennants $40

 

Pennant can be worn as a Dunce Hat when Boat's Gone

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If he hadve turned those timbers 90 degrees, to be edge on, instead of face on, he would have increased their strength considerably. Im curious to know how he plans to fix plexiglass to plywood sheets that have already sagged into a hungry horse look when viewed from outside. The chainplates bolted to the plywood gusset is just, well, er, pathetic. No other word comes close. And what is that pivoting exercise bed all about ? Surely the Rod's wrists have had enough exercise by now.

 

 

Those things on the columns are the boat's chainplates? Like, you mean where the shrouds tie in to the overall structure?!????!!!

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I feel a disturbance in the force. Its a record high tide here in South Australia in 4 hours time. 2.8 metres. Should just put our jetty underwater. Gawd, I hope that when the water goes down again, there is not a 65 x 32 debris field sitting on top of it. Those 4th mode Macgregor warp drives are fkn awesome. It he turns up in my backyard with a turkey friar, ít will be his ass that is lit up.

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Tonight could be the night!

 

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Late this afternoon I spent a couple hours hanging around and aboard the “Hawaiian” I also got more photos.

 

The storage container has been moved and son Mike is working to get everything off the boat to lighten it in preparation to launch. Parked cars have been cleared along the path to the ramp and there is anticipation in the air. Unfortunately, it’s the air that is the problem. The wind has been 12-14 knots all afternoon and Hot Rod says that he won’t try to move the boat in anything over 3-5. As I reported before the boat is balanced on the trailer. The stacked cribbing underneath the bridge deck is chained to the trailer, but the boat isn’t attached to either the trailer or the cribbing. I am thinking they may fasten some crossing lines from the hulls to the trailer but the angles are likely to be such that they wouldn’t do much good. Even if the boat could be securely fastened, the trailer offers such a narrow base that the whole thing, trailer and all could be tipped by the wind onto one hull.

 

If the boat does make it into the water the plan is to spend all night loading all the stuff from the container back on the boat by morning so they can be towed out of the harbor by the welder friend who I am told has a 25’ Whaler. Hot Rod is very cagey about where they are headed but it’s going to be an anchor-out situation. When I enquired about the possibility of going to Richardson Bay Hot Rod’s response was “Something like that.” I am going to head back down to the marina in about an hour and see what’s up.

 

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If he hadve turned those timbers 90 degrees, to be edge on, instead of face on, he would have increased their strength considerably. Im curious to know how he plans to fix plexiglass to plywood sheets that have already sagged into a hungry horse look when viewed from outside. The chainplates bolted to the plywood gusset is just, well, er, pathetic. No other word comes close. And what is that pivoting exercise bed all about ? Surely the Rod's wrists have had enough exercise by now.

 

 

Good to see he's delayed installing the picture windows in the front to avoid damage due to racking when launching.

 

"Again, he says that he is delaying installation because of his concern for damage to the seals that may be the result of moving and launching the boat."

 

Wonder if he's considered the forces exerted by a ten foot, cresting, boarding sea, or for that matter in flat water the three foot wake of a ferry boat or tug.

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Quick check on tide tables for the nearest area, shows high for the month at half past midnight. I make that about three hours from now. If it were me I'd be parked on the ramp right now, waiting for the tide to come to me.

 

Actually, if it were me, I'd be cutting my losses and running for the hills. What's that line about world navigators who walk inland with an oar on their shoulder until someone asks them what it is?

 

Will someone confirm my tide calcs pse.

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Any anarchists up that way with a boat on standby? We can't let the rodman just be towed out of our lives. We need someone on scene when (not if) this ends badly. Lilmurray stay with him until we can get backup to you! Clean get on a plane now!

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Any anarchists up that way with a boat on standby? We can't let the rodman just be towed out of our lives. We need someone on scene when (not if) this ends badly. Lilmurray stay with him until we can get backup to you! Clean get on a plane now!

+1

 

Please someone cover this. I love this thread and i would even click on some random ads here for a video of the launch!

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Just got back from the ark he under the boat working on it

 

Anything on timing? Perhaps in 24 hours. There appears to be mebbe half an inch more tide then.

 

Mebbe you can ping lilmurray and hook up with him as SA's reporting team.

 

Well, seems we're not going to stop whatever happens from happening. The one useful and humane service you guys can perform is making sure that Momma and the wheelchair aren't aboard when that thang goes down the ramp. Persuade her and rod that the best way to enjoy and remember the launching is watching from ashore.

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The first thing to go will be the patio glass taking the compression load of the whole boat on the narrow trailer bed as soon as he removes the pallets under each hull. Then, if they get it in the water, they will discover that the antifoul line is about a foot lower than it should be and the rig tension will go to jelly as the hulls flex and the bridgedeck sags. Wait until the tide comes in, and the 4 holes for the control wires for the rudders, are found to be underwater.... Then later tonight, when he drills the hole through the bridgedeck for the toilet, and to let the rapidly rising bilgewater out, he will find that the water level is a whole lot closer than he imagined........It will be the Oh Fk moment number 168 for the day. And thats before they load anything onto it. Its like the local retarded kid in his carboard rocketship built from his mums washing trolley.... You just know it will just end in tears. Look away, nothing to sue here.

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.................. The chainplates bolted to the plywood gusset is just, well, er, pathetic. No other word comes close. And what is that pivoting exercise bed all about ? Surely the Rod's wrists have had enough exercise by now.

 

I was told by a third party that there will be a gym on board because Hot Rod is also a fitness enthusiast and "an athletic trainer". That can be added to his other qualifications mentioned earlier. He has also told me that he is "a licensed long-haul truck driver and heavy equipment operator.

 

Chain plates? I have some additional images. Most of these are below deck

 

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This is a detail of the forward port chain plate from below deck. It is typical of most of the below deck chainplate details that can be see in several of the pictures I have posted previously.

 

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Two above deck chainplates can be seen here. In the foreground is the port attachment point for the salvaged s.s. square tube that supports the main mast, radar mast, and the wind turbine. The port side running light is one of the many other parts fabricated on site from salvaged metal. In the background is the above deck portion of the chainplate shown in the first photo.

 

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This is a below deck view looking aft at the chainplates that hold the square tube mentioned above.

 

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Okay, now we see the starboard attachment point of the tube from below deck, except this is the view looking forward.

 

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Finally, this is taken looking aft at the upper corner of the hatchway on the port side. This is what all of the typical chain plate attachment points look like on the opposite side of the posts they are attached to. Note the large washers. Here they are called maleable washers and are typically used in the costruction industry for structural fastenings. The bolts appear to be standard construction grade galvanized bolts. With the round embedable head we call them Carriage bolts here. They are either 1/2 or 5/8" in diameter.( I should have examined them more closely for size.)

 

I am off to the marina to see if anything is up as we near high tide around 12:30. Wind speed is reported at 4kts in the marina. So it could be a go.

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There is a clue about his intentions in the stern view photograph. Underneath the bridgedeck by the stairs, is a white triangular molded fibreglass marina equipment bin. The sort that is bolted down into the corner of your marina berth, designed for secure weatherproof storage of equipment. My guess is he already has a marina berth booked, and has bought the prescribed bin for it already, which suggests he plans being there for some time. Then wherever he goes, he fits it to the marina berth, and it looks like it has been there all along because its the standard design commonly used in marinas. I thought he bought it to fit in under the verandah, but why do that when you could fit a plywood rectangular one there, have a day lounge and store twice as much ?

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I am back from the marina and the score is: Law of Gravity 1, Hot Rod 0.

 

Where do I start?

 

Clearly I should have spent a little more time looking at the trailer. As I left this afternoon I took a look at it, made a few photographs and thought: this is never going to hold. The trailer material is very light gauge and it is set up for a 2 1/4 ball. The hitch on the tow vehicle is a 2" reciever type with a 6" drop ball mount. These trailer balls and mounts are rated at about 5000#. I tow my small boats with this type of gear all the time. Hot Rod has been telling me that he estimates the boat weight at 10,000 to 12,000 pounds and I'll bet the trailer and all the big timbers on it weighs at least another 3-4,000 pounds.

 

You might want to take a moment now and do the math.

 

I'm pretty sure I posted earlier Hot Rod's comment that the boat was so well balanced on the trailer that there was "almost no tongue weight". Well there was tounge weight alrighty. The jacks around the perimeter of the trailer were lowered and the boats full weight was brought to rest on the axels, then the last two jacks at the front of the trailer were lowered placing the tongue weight on to the trailer ball, at which point the ball mount promptly snapped in half, and the trailer tongue dropped into the dirt. I didn't actually see this happen but Hot Rod was right on it, swinging the Grade-all around and placing the forks under the forward section of the trailer. His intent was to bring the trailer back to level so that they could replace the jacks and relieve the weight from the axels. The tires on the front trailer wheels were pretty much flattened at this point. As he attempted to lift the front portion of the trailer one side of it just crumpled. Several bottle jacks were brought in and things were stabliized. It looks like they will be up all night jacking the whole thing back up, as it took them 3 hours to bring it down.

 

I have some still photos that I will post tomorrow after I get some sleep. There was a guy with a video camera there but I don't know if he got the "moment". I was planning on using my ipad to shoot some video but I figured the action wouldn't occur until they actually tried to pull the thing. I will be more proactive for the next attempt which may come tomorrow night. It all depends on whether or not they can get their welder over to make the trailer repairs. It may not get put back together right away as Hot Rod says he is really hurting for money.

 

Donations anyone?

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No Way that all could have happened w/o the structure suffering

 

Well Not at night

 

But come daylight things might speed-up

 

as he wont have to go - around - up - In and Back to get or put back tools, supplies or Beer

 

just pass through the holes/cracks in the hulls

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if they are rewelding the towbar because it snapped off on level ground, the second the load was applied, and the trailer A frame is now damaged, what is it going to do when they try dragging it around corners, or when the weight really comes on, reversing down the ramp....

 

Are the tow vehicles brakes alone capable of stopping 16000 lbs plus the weight of the tow vehicle ? (you can bet that the trailer does not have appropriate brakes for immersion or independant operation if the trailer was uncoupled.)

 

With the centre of gravity of the load so high, (which shifts aft when going down the ramp), what is stopping the tow vehicles rear wheels losing grip entirely, or the trailer just breaking away totally as it backs down the ramp ?.

 

LilMurray you HAVE TO video record this launch attempt, but dont stand behind this sucker. 20,000 lbs of runaway trailer and tow vehicle is going to leave a mark that doesnt buff out. This is your greatest moment LilMurray. Good luck.

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I believe I was told by someone onsite that the POS was build on a Mobile Home trailer/frame

 

to get an idea of what's being asked of the trailer

 

lets look at Mobile Home tires (count the Axles X2 for load rating for all tires)

 

 

MOBILE MAX 8-14.5 LT Tire & Black Mobile Home Rim, Load Range G

5509_st.jpg

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Load Range: G (14-ply rating)
Max. Capacity: 3085 lbs. each
Maximum PSI: 105 lbs.
Overall Diameter: 27.8"
Rim Finish: Black Painted
Rim Type: Demountable/Mobile Home Rim

MOBILE MAX LT Bias-Ply Trailer Tire. LT signifies the tire is a "Light Truck" size that was designed to be used on trailers that are capable of carrying heavy cargo.

STOCK # 1619020

Regular Price: $117.66

Special Price: $105.89

Quantity: Add to Cart
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I tried to see how many axles but no pictures are clear enough on any of the 17 pages. Assuming its a triple axle trailer with single tyres on each side, that is about 18,500 lbs maximum. The trailer is operating at the tyres maximum capacity, but the tyres are actually designed with quite a margin for safety, unless they are aged or retreaded and are being turned hard. .

 

But Rods estimates of 16,000 to 20,000 lbs is most likely an understatement. Ive built a 9 metre plywood boat before, and it turned out much heavier than Id hoped because it used a lot more plywood than I expected. Rod probably hasnt included the trailer and packers weight in that figure either. The fact that the trailer frame is now damaged, says its too much for the trailer already.

 

So unless its a quad axle trailer, there is a really good chance of blowing a tyre when turning the trailer hard. Once one goes, the rest on that side will quickly blow out and Rods fear of the hull striking the ground on that side may eventuate. If he gets as far as the ramp, it will be the rearmost tyres to blow on the turn first as the centre of gravity swings aft and they are scrubbed sideways. If the back tyres go, they will all blowout immediately. Stuck on the corner, with 6 blown tyres and the hulls sitting on the road. Thats if he doesnt rip off the A frame on the trailer first.

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God's teeth, this just keeps getting worse and worser...

 

You'd think the marina would be quite concerned about this. If by some chance it manages to get to the ramp and then breaks down there solidly, it will really impact their operations, i.e. cash flow.

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God's teeth, this just keeps getting worse and worser...

You'd think the marina would be quite concerned about this. If by some chance it manages to get to the ramp and then breaks down there solidly, it will really impact their operations, i.e. cash flow.

This is California.

The Marina owners would be crazy to let this thing move without insurance.

The only logical outcome is eviction and demolition.

That would also be the happiest possible ending. Once it gets near or in the water, costs and casualties rise.

But just in case, I want to be there for the launch.

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God's teeth, this just keeps getting worse and worser...

You'd think the marina would be quite concerned about this. If by some chance it manages to get to the ramp and then breaks down there solidly, it will really impact their operations, i.e. cash flow.

This is California.

The Marina owners would be crazy to let this thing move without insurance.

The only logical outcome is eviction and demolition.

That would also be the happiest possible ending. Once it gets near or in the water, costs and casualties rise.

But just in case, I want to be there for the launch.

 

I hadn't thought of that: this boat must be completely uninsured, since obviously to insure something that big you'd need to have it surveyed, and as we've established many times here it would not likely pass a survey. That's some pretty serious liability exposure. Moving something that big without proper equipment is just tempting fate to get someone seriously hurt.

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I'm not rich enough to donate anything decent to this launch attempt. A kickstarter thing would likely not get enough for a few weeks :( I'm really just hoping it gets launched without incident, since I have some engineering background, I would like to see how/where it fails in the drink. I made my prediction earlier, that if he got it into the water without incident, that it would float. When some 3 or 4 foot surf hits on anything off of 0 and 180... all bets are off

 

Thanks for the reports again lilmurray

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only way that heap will float on is lines

 

is to build a kiddy pool around it

 

and fill it with bottom paint :)

 

 

 

Knowing it was coming and H-R wouldn't take good advice

 

it's been FUN to Heap it On

 

But now that it's time it meats its demise = Actually It's Really SAD

 

H-R should get Grumpy to send a Scraper to push it straight onto the creak

 

it will NOT be pretty long before it gets to the ramp

 

and everyone helping should hope the MAX Fine for littering is $1000

 

surprised the tree Huger's arn't burning Bras in protest

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BREAKING NEWS, San Rafael, CA USA 12:01 PM PDT May 25, 2013

 

Late Night Launch Attempt Aborted

 

Conditions were perfect last night for launching the 62 foot long catamaran "Flyin Hawaiian", according to Captain and crew. There was no wind and the tide was high. However, due to an error in calculating the center of gravity, the launch attempt was aborted when several components met their limits. Parts of the supporting trailer bent under load. The trailer hitch broke into 2 pieces, although the 2 inch ball was apparently undamaged. The tongue weight was previously reported to be zero; Captain Hotrod stated "the CG was miscalculated by 2 feet --it's a setback"

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I'm truly surprised that someone with all that knowledge, experience, training and licencing could make such an error.

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Sooo many things miscalculated

 

all raising there ugly head 1 2 3 at a time Once

 

of note most HD & Mobile Home Etc. trailers have a 2 5/16' hitch

 

What a Stupid Fack to NOT Test ANYTHING First

 

Like pull the MoFo over and line up to head for the ramp (still on dirt lot) in the Day Time

 

What is Only NOW being tested is his capabilities (in ALL Aspects)

 

FAILBOAT

 

He should paint it RED and call it ARKALLAMESS ^_^

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I still want to see a wingsail on this thing.

Then H-R could challenge one of the AC 72s to a race....

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NORTH KOREAN ARMY NEWS 3:18 AM

Once again, the imperialist pigdogs fail in their launch attempts at invading our beloved country. What a brilliant mind he and mission control must have, to already know precisely where the centre of gravity actually was, and where it should be. Fortunately a small band of patriots to the true motherland succeeded in moving the turkey frier from its calibrated position under the cover of night and didnt tell him. This cunning plan destabilised the complex and high tech Apollo 13 esque undertaking. Unfortunately the inbuilt safety circuits tripped their alarms in time to avert serious damage. Its just what happens when you privatise missions of this nature which push the frontiers of scientific knowledge and subhuman endeavour. We will respond with a bigger and better launch failure, to ensure that these Americans realise that we are much better at these things .....

BREAKING NEWS, San Rafael, CA USA 12:01 PM PDT May 25, 2013

Late Night Launch Attempt Aborted

Conditions were perfect last night for launching the 62 foot long catamaran "Flyin Hawaiian", according to Captain and crew. There was no wind and the tide was high. However, due to an error in calculating the center of gravity, the launch attempt was aborted when several components met their limits. Parts of the supporting trailer bent under load. The trailer hitch broke into 2 pieces, although the 2 inch ball was apparently undamaged. The tongue weight was previously reported to be zero; Captain Hotrod stated "the CG was miscalculated by 2 feet --it's a setback"

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I am going to try and address some of the questions and speculation that has been raised since my last two posts. Along with this is a few photos some from last night.

 

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This is the tow vehicle. Overall, it is probably up to the task but there are weak points,

 

post-98603-0-26065200-1369511186_thumb.jpg post-98603-0-11638400-1369513648_thumb.jpg

 

This is one I spotted yesterday. And as I described in an earlier post this is what happened to it last night.

 

 

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The forward section of the trailer in the afternoon. After tweaking . A detail of the buckled steel member

 

 

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There have been some comments and speculation about the "trailer". I confirmed several posts ago that it is in fact a salvaged substructure from a mfg. home (ie. 1/2 a 'Double Wide'. . It is of the pretty typical 14X70' triple axel variety and is equiped with std wheels. They are unusual in comparison with what you might be used to as the tires are mounted to special donut shaped rims that are demountable from center hubs that stay on the axels. While there probably are brakes on these axels I don't see any evidence that they are set up on this particular "trailer". Some people use these axels, but typically not the frames, for home built trailers, but some years ago my brother was advised against it because they are not designed or built for long term use. The structures that these frames are part of generally get pulled around a good portion of the country by small HD specialty tow vehicles. Some times you see a big pickup towing a smaller one but not of this size.

 

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So close yet so far. Remember it is probably less than two hundred yards to the launch ramp. With the tide in the upper part of the ramp affords a rather gentle incline. Hot rod is anticipating a waterline of only 12-18". He figures that launching bow first will allow the hulls to begin floating very early down the ramp. He told me last night that the original plan was to back the boat down the ramp at low tide and wait for the incomming tide to float it. Apparently the Harbor Master was less than enthusiastic about this idea. Speaking of the Harbor Master, I do not know him, but I hear that he is a nice guy and rather accommodating to the people in the harbor and storage yard. While the marina is a going concern it is not a bustling place. The ramp is used almost exclusively by small to medium sized powerboats. However, this is also the "home ramp" of Richard Aneson. A couple years ago I watched him leave from here and take out his monster jet powered cat for a spin on his 90th birthday. But I digress.

 

Some people have commented on insurance. I haven't asked Hot Rod about it, but based on conversations with him on other issues I would be surprised if "Flyin" was insured . I suspect that he signed a waiver of liability when he came into the storage yard (launching privilages included), but I don't recall the last time in Northern CA I was asked by a harbor, launch ramp, yacht club, or marine operator to prove that my boats were insured.

 

It is a beautiful day, and while I should be working from home today I am posting here and fixing to walk to to the Marina for a look see.

 

More to come.

 

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NORTH KOREAN ARMY NEWS CLASSIFIED ADS (Bacon section) 3:19AM

 

Wanted to exchange: One turkey frier knob in exchange for a quick sniff of slightly used bacon wrapper.

 

Anyone got bacon ? Anyone ?

 

Well, I did five minuets ago.

 

Should read sailing anarchy before breakfast.

 

So the tow thingy broke, every project will have its setbacks, I mean look how far he has got and this is his first setback, and it's use once build cheap item.

He's doing well

 

Go the Hot Rod!

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He must have forgotten to factor in the weight of all the 'paperwork and certifications' he has on board.

 

"I am no longer impressed by my own resume."

 

Rodman you are not the only one!

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The trailer frame buckled directly under the forward end of the packing timbers on the port side as a result of the shock of the coupling hitting the ground. The trailer frame is clearly insufficiently strong. It is now twisted such that all the front end load will now be carried solely by the starboard side, which is likely to fail through minor impacts such as crossing the kerb or shifts in the CG when entering the ramp. Id be more concerned with the braking ability of the tow tug and whether its brakes have been maintained recently. Once that POS starts going down the ramp, turning corners or crossing kerbs, its all bets off.

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The trailer frame buckled directly under the forward end of the packing timbers on the port side as a result of the shock of the coupling hitting the ground. The trailer frame is clearly insufficiently strong. It is now twisted such that all the load will now be carried solely by the starboard side, which is likely to fail through minor impacts such as crossing the kerb or shifts in the CG when entering the ramp. Id be more concerned with the braking ability of the tow tug and whether its brakes have been maintained recently. Once that POS starts going down the ramp, turning corners or crossing kerbs, its all bets off.

 

 

that high reach was NOT intended to lift the weight of H-R's Combined POS

 

so it was NEVER intended to control said weight on level ground

 

the entire mess is as rigid as a limp biscuit (fooled ya huh)

 

time to break out the sawzall and cut up the compromised frame never intended for the use

 

they still have time to circle it all with a pile of giant boulders Rip/Rap

 

and have a Viking BonFire for the Holiday on Monday

 

it will be the cheapest clean-up possible

 

anything they do from this point Fwd shall leave a Monster Snail Pile of Debris

 

I say it Never sees the ramp less it "LOOks" that way B)

 

at least they are Safer on Land

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of note most HD & Mobile Home Etc. trailers have a 2 5/16' hitch

 

Sorry, oops, It is 2 5/16 rated at 6000#, not 2 1/4 rated at #5000. It was late ;I was tired; knew it was the next size up from 2"rated at #3500; tossed it out there off the top of my head. That's my storry, sticking to it. Hope I haven't ruined my credibility. The ball itself did survive. Didn't I hear something a while back about warning points?

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of note most HD & Mobile Home Etc. trailers have a 2 5/16' hitch

 

Sorry, oops, It is 2 5/16 rated at 6000#, not 2 1/4 rated at #5000. It was late ;I was tired; knew it was the next size up from 2"rated at #3500; tossed it out there off the top of my head. That's my storry, sticking to it. Hope I haven't ruined my credibility. The ball itself did survive. Didn't I hear something a while back about warning points?

 

 

Yes Quite valuable in the SA SWAG Store

 

dude should put that ball on Craigslist as they wont be needing it ;)

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no warning points for you-keep up the good work

thanks

 

 

of note most HD & Mobile Home Etc. trailers have a 2 5/16' hitch

 

Sorry, oops, It is 2 5/16 rated at 6000#, not 2 1/4 rated at #5000. It was late ;I was tired; knew it was the next size up from 2"rated at #3500; tossed it out there off the top of my head. That's my storry, sticking to it. Hope I haven't ruined my credibility. The ball itself did survive. Didn't I hear something a while back about warning points?

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I think he may be able to make it to the ramp. Boat doesn't look very heavy for a sailboat. Getting out the of channel from San Rafael to the bay is going to be hard. Getting from the bay out under the GG and past the SF bar is going to be impossible. Maybe in dead calm conditions with totally slack tide and no weather for the previous two weeks in the Pacific Ocean.

 

Is there a hardpoint on the boat from which it could be towed? I don't see one.

Just the owner.

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That ball sounds like it will shear off (or strip the nut off), when the weight of the trailer and its load comes onto it if the tow tug applies its brakes on the ramp. Its time he stopped taking ridiculous risks and just ring for a low loader for the day. Its taking dumb risks like this that will be his undoing. Sometimes people need saving from themselves.

 

A transport safety compliance officer taking one look at that unregistered trailer and the load its attempting to shift would issue a cessation direction notice and a vehicle defect notice immediately it started crossing the kerb. Its not just about protection of infrastructure, its about the safety of persons. Whether Rod likes it or not, he's a person.

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Low loader is the right way to go. Only heartbreak if he persists with that rusty POS called a trailer. However lilmurray reported no bucks for low loader.

 

I'd say it's in the interests of the company or individual responsible for clearing the site to go for a quick resolution and kick in for a low loader. Say "Hey, we'd like to give a hand. Just sign this waiver of liability and we'll park you on the ramp at low tide. You agree to piss off as soon as you're afloat."

 

Presto, everyone wins.

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yeah, i really do hope they offer the option and he takes it, even if he signs an IOU for some $, it really would be worth it

 

honestly i'm curious what they would charge for that, anyone pay for one before or know people who do it around there?

 

(if he put up his turkey deep fryer and the house range or something, (after someone explains why its a really good idea NOT to be using a home range in moving ship), lol, sigh

if you don't just 'get' that on your own, perhaps it can't be explained

 

maybe he's thought of it and screwed a few 2x4's around the floor around the stove to keep it from moving? :)

(pics please lilmurray if you can)

 

step 2-> show him how rough a sea would be needed for it to fall over even with his 'solution'?

 

or is that too close to bursting his insane bubble?

 

heck, he programmed before, surely a 3 step process like that would illuminate him?

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At a minimum a proper hitch for the load begins to look like this

 

springfield_mo_fifth_wheel_hitches_fs.jp

 

But till the load weight is actually known the proper Tow Rig can not be estamated

 

BUT RULE OF Thumb Too BIG is Better if ya gutta guess

 

but H-R Loaded the SHIT outta a light duty frame that got its integrity from the Mobile home it was built for

 

 

I Say the truck that moves it from that lot

 

will be fitted out like this

 

-1688237399.jpg

 

And this

 

roll-off_truck.gif

 

with the help of one of these

 

35_CY_bucket.jpg

 

but more likely H-R will get something "he" knows is Good Enough

 

LoaderBucket.jpg

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A transport safety compliance officer taking one look at that unregistered trailer and the load its attempting to shift would:

1. issue a cessation direction notice and employ portable Haenni scales under each wheel to calculate its axle loads.

2. He would then determine the maximum legal weight for that rig and report the driver for a heavy vehicle overmass offence, which has severe penalties designed to protect public infrastructure, public safety, public amenity and negate commercial advantage.

3. He would then prescribe the axle configurations and minimum distances apart, required to legally and safely handle the load.

 

Meanwhile, he would issue a vehicle defect notice for the damaged trailer chassis which would put it off the road until repaired and inspected.

 

And Rod would probably be reported for driving an unregistered, uninsured heavy vehicle without the appropriate licence.

 

if the marina ramp manager knew about the trailer failure, he would be very concerned about the possibility of axle load point damage to his ramp slab. You can guarantee that the insurer behind the marina ramp manager would not be allowing illegal overmass vehicles like this to be put onto the slab.

 

Both the marina manager and the harbormaster would cop it in the neck if public amenity was compromised, the ramp slab damaged or persons injured.

 

Its all about maintaining public safety, amenity, infrastructure and protecting the transport industry who pay good money to maintain expensive rigs that do this work safely.

 

And that is not even starting on the boat, which probably lacks safety equipment, insurance, or pre registration inspection.

 

Sure regulations are a pain in the ass sometimes, but on this occasion, they are there to protect against the very risks that Rod's illconceived venture represents.

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GAWD that was Harsh

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sadly he's arrived at the FAILallaRound Island

 

& this won't go many Rounds :unsure::mellow::(

 

 

Even Bob Perry listened to the monkeys of SA before picking what to design (FT-10m)

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Hot Rod might also consider that even if he gets the horizontal CG corrected and the tongue weight is low enough, the towing bits still have to pull all the weight that sits on the trailer and the trailer itself. They can break in the horizontal plane just like they broke in the vertical plane.

 

It's a little anticlimactic that the trailer is the problem. Was that even one of the failure modes we were betting on?

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TTT, he can't afford any loader, low or otherwise. He's tapped out.

 

This broken trailer and broken hitch might very well be the end of the road.

It's possible he could recover from this and seeing how he has pretty much his whole life pivoting on this launch, he may indeed find some way to kiss the water. The odds are against it though. The entire operation is a patch to a fix to a kludge to an unspec'ed, unplanned catastrophe. It's an unending chain of weak links held together by dreams and dry-wall screws. There are more weak links in this project than dry-wall screws and there's 300 pounds of those. As much entertainment as this is for us, it's pretty much over for Hot Rod. What's next for the poor guy?

 

God bless him for seeing it through this far. His unflagging optimism is matched only by his stubbornness and ignorance.

 

The entire project sounds like something dreamed up in the middle of a meth and booze binge. When he finally lit back down to earth he looked around him, saw this pile of untreated tract-home fir and the rudimentary framing to his craft and simply resigned that he was too deep in to back out.

 

What's his next step? I'm sure he is agonizing over how to fix the trailer and hitch [all this with no more money, mind you] or if he can't fix it, how is he going to finance Plan B. I don't think Hot Rod has ever had a Plan B since the beginning. It's one direction: forward. Now that it's ground to a halt after moving a mere 12 inches (straight down) which tack does he take?

 

At what point does Hot Rod walk away? From all indications, he is going to go down with his ship. Other than a decent set of tools, this is it -- all he's got.

 

We are all hoping the thing disintegrates before launch. That is the best of all outcomes at this point.

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He will try again, fail on the ramp and access will be blocked for all users for the immediate future. The marina will have to bring in contractors to move the shit box back on land , it will be chained up until all bills are paid. Rod man is broke so he will just keep living on it until the complaints about trailor park trash force him to move off it. It will then be impounded and locked up until the local kids break into it, and it will burn down one night when one of their bongs falls over. Failing that he (or the yard) may find someone as clueless as him to buy it. Might get slightly less than the $6 million market value though.

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This is getting like the bad old days during the clear lake court case!

 

25 user(s) are reading this topic

22 members, 2 guests, 1 anonymous users

 

Life Buoy 15, zerothehero, MisterMoon, toddster, Chinook, Flaming, SOB, Somebody Else, Nursing Home Refugee, windsurfer, Schock & Awe, K38BOB, RandyM81, mhawley, hdra, bathtub, Owen, some dude, JohnN, Timmys_Trick_Turkey, bjalgera, skyeblue.

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I've got my doubts about that Grade-All thingy. It is designed as an all terrain forklift, for lifting pallets of concrete blocks and such up three or four stories. Generally it is rated for thousands of pounds, not tens of thousands of pounds. I doubt that the hitch receiver, brakes, tranny etc. are up to the job. They were dubious new, and I'm sure that all are now victims of old age and benign neglect.

 

It doesn't weigh all that much. I'm guessing that if HD managed to get the tongue weight within limits on level ground, assuming that the tranny didn't explode first, going down the ramp either the brakes would fail, or the CG would shift and lift the rear wheels up enough to lose traction & steering, and the whole thing would look like an empty 18 wheeler going down a mountain road in a blizzard (DAMHIKT).

 

If this thing makes it all the way to the water, it will have a bad enough case of road rash that it won't float for more than half an hour. I haven't read the whole thread, but I get the impression that HD is confident enough of his construction that watertight bulkheads and redundant bilge pump systems are not required, or even contemplated.

 

Are there any bilge pumps at all?

 

Cap'n Bat

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The trailer frame buckled directly under the forward end of the packing timbers on the port side as a result of the shock of the coupling hitting the ground. The trailer frame is clearly insufficiently strong. It is now twisted such that all the front end load will now be carried solely by the starboard side, which is likely to fail through minor impacts such as crossing the kerb or shifts in the CG when entering the ramp. Id be more concerned with the braking ability of the tow tug and whether its brakes have been maintained recently. Once that POS starts going down the ramp, turning corners or crossing kerbs, its all bets off.

 

'Timmy', your posts are very thoughtfull, pretty great actually. You read others carefully and your responses are food for thought. However, after thinking through this one and remembering that the beam bent as it was being lifted I concluded that I might have led you a stray. Indeed I did. I looked back at my recent late night post and see that yes, I did say that the tongue went into the dirt. I went back to the marina to verify for myself, but the fact is that this part of the trailer never actually hit the ground. What I didn't realize was that when the ball mount broke and the front of the trailer dropped about 6 to 8 inches it landed on some blocking well (trailer) aft of the ultimately buckled steel. It was dark and the whole thing came right down pretty close to the ground, but at no time after the ball mount broke did the weight of the trailer rest again on the tongue. No damage was done to the trailer where it contacted the blocks. I made a pretty thorough examnation today in the daylight to verify this. I think the trailer member buckled when Hot Rod tried to lift it because he must have been enough off center with most of the weight carried on the (tralier) port rail. It also looks like the beam must have twisted a bit off its centerline weakening its cross section.

 

The current plan is to cut off the front portion of the trailer on both sides aft of the damaged beam. The 'A' shaped tongue portion of the trailer has been unbolted as of this afternoon and Hot Rod was chasing down a cutting torch when I departed. They are considering two options for the second launch attempt based on the possibility of securing a tow vehicle from a friend that has a 'king pin' type of connection. If they get it they say they will mount a compatable connection back under the new forward end of the trailer. If they don't get the vehicle they are planning to weld new flanges to re-bolt up the 'A' frame, now in a more rearward location.

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We are all hoping the thing disintegrates before launch. That is the best of all outcomes at this point.

 

Yes, but on HD super slow mo video, (with all concerned safe and well clear), and perhaps the falling mast smashing the back off a Mcgregor as a bonus

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A few years ago we rented a front end loader and used it to demolish a double wide that was on our church property. What was surprising to me was how light-gauge the metal trailer frame was. It looked to me like it depended on the rest of the trailer's structure to give it integrity. The little trailer my 17' boat is sitting on is made of thicker metal than that thing was. If HotRod's trailer is similar to what I saw, he's in big trouble. I now predict Failure to Launch. Ever.

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The 'A' shaped tongue portion of the trailer has been unbolted as of this afternoon and Hot Rod was chasing down a cutting torch

 

 

Perfect all we need is sum muzak for H-R to sing to as he brings this to a Fiery End

 

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I've joined SA purely to see the photos of this build and I wouldn't float that boat on anything but a mill pond. I think at best the builder is misguided.

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This is just incredible - does the poor guy have any idea that he is being watched and critiqued from all over the world? WTF would he think? What a bunch of peepers we are!!!

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Sunday at 00:19 tide is +6.7 and at 2:18pm it's +4.9

Monday at 01:08 tide is +6.6 and at 3:10pm it's +5.0

 

My bet is he'll try again tonight at midnight or Monday early am. No way he wants anyone from the marina around when all this goes horribaly wrong.

 

A mobile home trailer is NEVER going to move a 12Klbs boat.

 

In looking at the pictures, is it just my imagination or is the boat not tied to the trailer? It looks like it is just sitting on the blocking that is sitting on the trailer. If that's true, then if he actually manages to move the trailer, one solid jolt will slide the boat right off the blocking. This whole thing has the stability of a game of Jenga.

 

Add another title to the resume HR, "Master Idiot."

 

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As an Engineer that installs large equipment, this just boggles my mind. The lack of tie downs on a trailer, the lack of proper equipment, lack of forethought and a contingency. But I guess HR lives life as a contingency.

As a sailor, I don't think I want to be in the same hemisphere as HR when it launches. My guess is like others, assuming it makes it down the ramp and splashes, it aint' making it out of the marina on it's own power, and if it does, it will last only a few hours.

He forgot the most important rule lifting objects, "what goes up comes down heavier"

Maybe he needs to read this book.

512id8fK2uL._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-stic

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