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Welcome to the UASHO!

(correctly pronouced "You Assho' ")

 

One positive aspect of the Urban Blight thread is that the ugly boat admirer closet door cracked open.

I'm okay with ugly boats. It appears many of you are as well.

Now, let's get this shit straight, there is a difference between UGLYboats and FUGLY boats. Ugly boats are boats with their heart in the right place, with skippers who sail the damn things. Fugly boats are just straight up WTF were they thinking? Either the owners, builders or NAs who drew them- take your pick.

 

So, no fugly boats here- just your favourite uglyboats.

 

Phil Bolger drew a shitload of uglyboats,

 

204434_marthajane.jpg

 

but they were ugly on purpose, with a method to his madness. Besides, the man also drew the chebacco,

 

chebaco.jpg

 

 

... it ain't like he didn't know how to draw a pretty boat.

 

So, whatcha got?

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Writing from a country that owns a number of second hand submarines, it seems to me that giving such a craft to a drug cartel would be a great way to immediately bankrupt their operation.

Yeah, the boat looks like shit.  But they're smiling, which is the reason to sail......

No trailer, no problem.  Just drill through the bilge keels and slide the axle right in. A couple of fittings from Harbor Freight and your off to the scrap yard!

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Come on!

BJ:

Bolger never drew an ugly boat in his life.

He drew some unusual looking boats but he always had control over the shape and all of the lines.

The true, deep down, butt ugly boat is born out of ignorance for the essential aesthetic paranorms of yacht design,

 

I don't know what "paranorms" means but when I came to that part of the sentance it just had the right feel. I may have heard it on CNN. Feel free to substitute the high faluting word of your choice.

 

When I look at Bolger's unusual designs and someone says, "That's ugly" I think of the people who didn't like Beethoven's last quartets. Those listeners were just not ready, not open enough, not, with no offfense intended, educated musically enough.

 

It's a paranormal kind of thang.

 

I'm in a bad mood. But quite clean.

My wife has us both on a "cleansing diet" for the weekend. Some Dr. Oz thing she saw on TV. I'm realigning my hormones through diet.

This boils down to: If it tastes good, you can't have it.

 

The morning was all exotic juices and not a single Bloody Mary.

Lunch was twigs and leaves of various kinds. Thank God for olive oil.

Dinner is an amorphous cabbage soup and no ham hocks.

 

I have some black cherry ice cream stashed for after Jill goes to bed.

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Bob, one man's unusual is another man's ugly, that is why this is the uglyboat ADMIRATION society. The "true deep down butt ugly" boat is fugly- fucking ugly.

we don't do fugly here, because you are right. Beauty is skin deep, and ugly goes to the bone, but FUGLY goes right down deep into the soul.

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I'm rereading Boats With An Open Mind, which is basically Bolger's book on this thread topic. I find many of the boats ugly yet appealing. So I guess I'm not quite ready. I might have to read it yet again when I'm done. Would not kill me. I fell asleep last night still laughing over his little punt that would carry a crew of adults plus a "large, frightened dog."

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Hmm... Dangerous territory here, but as an ugly boat owner myself (Cal T/2), maybe I'm safe.

 

So here goes - I understand the functional appeal of center cockpit designs, but still... Tough to make them look "right".

 

Case in point - Morgan Out Island.

 

100554674.jpg

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I don't know, if I think of something that's 'ugly', it has to be ugly through and through. Not just in appearence but in soul. That's a tough thing to do and it needs to be done with purpose and conviction.

 

years ago a coworker came to the office after giving birth to show off her newborn baby. I saw her in the reception area with some of the other hens who were all smiles looking down at the kid. Naturally, I anticipated a lovely little cherub. Hopefully my quick exit did not incite any concern as once I saw the demon spawn what was, I very nearly threw up in my mouth.

 

He is now a college man and one of the most handsom kids you'll ever see.

 

So I have a tough time judging ugly, 'cept when it comes to the opposite sex. And up here in MN while there are plenty of blond-haired, blue eyed scandi-queens, the ugly stick borne of the ugly tree grows strong up on the range.

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and the funny thing about ugly too. Expose yourself to it enough and that shit grows on you. Dock neighbor had one o' them Bayliner Bastards. He was of the man persuasion and as a result, that ugly-ass boat was the cleanest and most orderly in the harbor. Down below, I was impressed with the amount of room that thing had. When you're in it, you can't see the outside.

 

Disclaimer:

  • Not all gay men are neat freaks, but I haven't seen many who weren't
  • There's a line, and on this side of it, we ain't gay.
  • NTTAWWT

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BLJ:

OK, I think I get it. That old S&S ketch I believe went on to become either a Swan model, believe it or not, or maybe a Wuaquiez model. I think I know the boat you are referring to Booth, too much sheer spring, funky raised quarter deck, odd shaped tarnsom. Right? I always thought that boat odd but not bad looking., in a fugly sort of way.

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I don't know, if I think of something that's 'ugly', it has to be ugly through and through. Not just in appearence but in soul. That's a tough thing to do and it needs to be done with purpose and conviction.

 

years ago a coworker came to the office after giving birth to show off her newborn baby. I saw her in the reception area with some of the other hens who were all smiles looking down at the kid. Naturally, I anticipated a lovely little cherub. Hopefully my quick exit did not incite any concern as once I saw the demon spawn what was, I very nearly threw up in my mouth.

 

He is now a college man and one of the most handsom kids you'll ever see.

 

So I have a tough time judging ugly, 'cept when it comes to the opposite sex. And up here in MN while there are plenty of blond-haired, blue eyed scandi-queens, the ugly stick borne of the ugly tree grows strong up on the range.

 

Really, you had to bring up the 'range chicks? Funny thing about them is that many(certainly not all) are pretty cute till about HS graduation, then something seriously bad happens. People of WalMart bad. Maybe it's just the cute ones leave, leaving behind the "devil spawn". Must be the generations of inbreeding or something.

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Ok ... so here's a hard one. The scow that won the Mini Transat.

 

very fast reaching and running but gives a speed away upwind.

 

If form follows function; will we become used to this form?

 

Nothing hard about that... if it wins, it's beautiful.

 

2nd on Bolger never drawing an ugly boat.

 

IMHO "ugly" is something that is impractical or dysfunctional, not just failure to conform to a certain aesthetic.

 

FB- Doug

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This is not ugly? I actually like the design in some ways and might even own one, but damn. That's UGLY. (Bolger Fiddler II)

 

I'll bet you one alcohol fueled daysail on our respective home waters that that wasn't built to the plans. One of the problems with the "Bolger boats are ugly" line is that a lot of whats out there are owner-induced departures from the plans. For a whole host of reasons that seemed like good ideas at the time. But weren't. Bolger used to say that one of the keys to being a good designer was to pick your builders carefully. Imagine the risk a designer takes with their reputation when they sell plans for backyard wood butchers like me....

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Boothy:

Oh yeah, that old one. I forgot about that one. Thanks a lot for reminding me.

I don't find that boat so bad. It's no beauty but for what it is I think it's OK.

 

I don;t race Mini Transats so I have no dog in that fight but to my eye that thing is big time ugly. But kind of cool in that it works well.

I was really hoping that design would be slow but I knew in my heart that it would work, off the wind.

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This is not ugly? I actually like the design in some ways and might even own one, but damn. That's UGLY. (Bolger Fiddler II)

 

I'll bet you one alcohol fueled daysail on our respective home waters that that wasn't built to the plans. One of the problems with the "Bolger boats are ugly" line is that a lot of whats out there are owner-induced departures from the plans. For a whole host of reasons that seemed like good ideas at the time. But weren't. Bolger used to say that one of the keys to being a good designer was to pick your builders carefully. Imagine the risk a designer takes with their reputation when they sell plans for backyard wood butchers like me....

 

Anomaly, I was just leafing through 30 Odd Boats and found that one, and the cartoon in the book looks pretty darn similar to the built boat. The boat looks a bit rougher in a few details, but my opinion is that they are both darn ugly.

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I cruised for 7 years on an ugly boat. It was the most boat for my £ when I was looking. 1/4in corten steel but the designer clearly was having an off day.

 

The G&T at sundown looked the same and I got to look at the pretty boats from my ugly one.

 

https://picasaweb.go...feat=directlink

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Though I admired Bolger for being innovative. I can't say I admired all his designs.

 

In fact I admired a minor percentage of them, In his later years the percentage of good looking designs declined considerably.

 

Functional in Bolger terms looks functional, functional does not necessarily look appealing,nor usually good looking or aesthetically pleasing.

 

Designers who continued to learn from experience, and who's designs continued to improve in aesthetics, as well as form and function aesthetically in their later years. Those are the designers who to me have honed their skills well, and are masters of their trade.

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The boat looks a bit rougher in a few details, but my opinion is that they are both darn ugly.

 

I'll take that as a gracious concession- Just let me know when to come down for the boozecruise. Or, you come up here and supply the booze and I'll supply the boat(s). Hell, we could probably even get KD to join us if he's not busy marrying Courtney offf (or perusing those odd photo libraries that only he seems to have access to).

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I'll bet you one alcohol fueled daysail on our respective home waters that that wasn't built to the plans.

 

The cutwater thing under the bow doesn't show on the plans in 30 Odd Boats, and there should be hatch between the two forward-looking windows. Otherwise, it looks pretty true.

 

The point is that it's 16' long and has a double bed (hence the smoked glass), galley and dresser. And since PCB was really good powerboat designer, but I bet it runs OK.

 

In the same book, Bolger said of a 20' cruising sharpie design, "Finally, she's plain ugly. Jessie Cooper (next chapter) is ugly but with strong character. This one is nondescript ugly." He also wrote that leeboards (which he used a lot) are ugly. So he wasn't under any illusions, but he was a genius at getting a "form follows function" exception on many of his boats.

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I snapped this boat in one of our local marinas. I guess it's an example of a boat made ugly by squeezing in too much interior. i worry that if I sneer at it in public, it will turn out to have been designed by some big name designer (no, not BP).

 

 

post-5724-0-10895100-1353257241_thumb.jpg

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Semi:

That is a Bayliner and they established new levels for ugly in almost all their models.

Sad thing is that a couple of those Bayliners beauties were built on hulls splashed from nice Gary Mull designs. "I'm sure another 15" of freeboard will look just fine."

 

Back to Bolger and ugly. I'm still not buying it. I think when he called his own designs "ugly" we was just getting a jump on the peanut gallery. "What do you mean you think it;s ugly? I already told you you'd think it was ugly."

Or as Beethoven put it, "You are not supposed to like it."

 

I'll tell you a story:

When I was a kid in the early 60's there was a designer from Chicago F.S. Ford Jr.. Mr Ford advertised his design services frequently in rather large ads in YACHTING and RUDDER. His designs were hideous. Even as a kid I remember thinking how grim his designs were. His sailboats were ugly and so were his powerboats. I mean his boats didn't have a single harmonious line on them. One day I was talking to Bill Garden and I asked him what he thought of F.S. Ford's designs. Bill said, "I think God should break his pencil."

 

So maybe our director in charge of all Google things nautical, Mr. Boomer, could dig up an example of an F.S. Ford Jr. design so we can all nod knowling.

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This is not ugly? I actually like the design in some ways and might even own one, but damn. That's UGLY. (Bolger Fiddler II)

 

FiddlerII.jpg

 

It looks like one of the shuttles used in the original Star Trek. Just add in the the side "torpedos", and off you go....

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Bob:

The Bayliner Buccaneers have to be WAY up there on the ugly meter. Someone told me long ago that Bill Garden designed one of them, I truly hoped he was wrong,I guess he was right :( Any idea on just what happened. I love his work. We lived on a lovely 36ft

powerboat of his design named Journeyman.

 

http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=1327

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This is not ugly? I actually like the design in some ways and might even own one, but damn. That's UGLY. (Bolger Fiddler II)

 

FiddlerII.jpg

 

It looks like one of the shuttles used in the original Star Trek. Just add in the the side "torpedos", and off you go....

 

You nailed it! The guy that designed the Star Trek Shuttle was a car designer back in the day.

 

Same guy that designed the Ford Econoline pickup.

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Vik:

Yes, Bill designed two models for Bayliner. Bill was friends with Oran Edson who owned Bayliner at the time and I suspect Edson threw box of money at Bill and Bill caved. But Bill wouldn't avoid a challenge and I suspect he was proud of the ugly boats he drew for Bayliner and I'm certian they were exactly what Bayliner wanted at the time. Bill's Bayliners are not nearly as ugly as the in house Bayliners.

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That is a Bayliner and they established new levels for ugly in almost all their models.

Sad thing is that a couple of those Bayliners beauties were built on hulls splashed from nice Gary Mull designs. "I'm sure another 15" of freeboard will look just fine."

 

 

I remember the Garden and Peterson designs. I don't remember the Mull designs.

 

edit: Gasp! I wonder if the guy in charge of their sailboat division was blind? http://sailboatdata.com/view_builder.asp?builder_id=117

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Boomer:

As I remember two of the Bayliner models were splashes off Rangers 23' and 26' models. The Peterson was their half ton model and it was not a bad looking boat by comparison. I went up to visit them when this was going on and they were not bashful about explaining the wisdom of their splashes.

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So maybe our director in charge of all Google things nautical, Mr. Boomer, could dig up an example of an F.S. Ford Jr. design so we can all nod knowling.

 

 

Didn't he design the Pintail?

 

Looks like he designed more then a few boats for MFG, who had more then a few generic boats over the years.

 

That Shark cat wasn't so generic though.

 

Strange that they were the original builder of the Corvette bodies....to bad that didn't play over into their boat designs.

 

http://sailboatdata....?builder_id=260

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Boomer:

I don't think Bayliner was used to paying outside designers and at the same time they were not familiar enough with sailing yacht design to do the design and tooling inhouse. I'm not certain but I think that Ranger may have been out of business when these splashes occurred. Next time you see one of those Bayliner models, squint and try to block off the top 12" or so of the freeboard. I'll bet you can find a Ranger in there.

 

F.S. Ford Jr. did design the PINTAIL.

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This is not ugly? I actually like the design in some ways and might even own one, but damn. That's UGLY. (Bolger Fiddler II)

 

FiddlerII.jpg

 

I keep looking at that raggedy "sheer line" and thinking 'no way Phil drew it like that'... And then it hit me: For fuck's sake Tom, you've got us debating the aesthetics of a paper model cut out (presumably?) from the cartoon and taped together (the first clue was the tape on the corner of the windows....) and then plunked down in the back garden for the photo shoot.....

 

If we're gonna debate "ugly" lets at least use a real build. How about "Watervan"? But no sayin its "ugly" till you spent at least a night aboard. Preferably on a hot summer night (even better with some hotties) so you can test out the ventilation:

 

http://www.google.co...29,r:2,s:0,i:79

 

Lots of pics of Watervan here, at the top of the page, followed by a rather great collection of other Bolger works (full disclosure, one is a build of mine):

 

http://www.google.co....w=1024&bih=537

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Always thought Milgram's Cascade was ugly as sin (by the way, what's so ugly about some sins?) but the damn thing did exploit rule loopholes and stir up the sailing community.

 

I know Flying Scots are stable practical and popular boats but you must love them to sail them.

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Bill designed two models for Bayliner. Bill was friends with Oran Edson who owned Bayliner at the time and I suspect Edson threw box of money at Bill and Bill caved.

 

The Buccaneer 300 is written up in his first book Yacht Designs. One of them showed up here a few years ago. It has a huge volume for a 30-footer. I can't say I thought it looked good, but partly that was because it was in poor condition.

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There was a very lovely, down to earth and athletic young lady in Liberty Bay Marina for a while with Buccaneer 300, moored next to us. She bought it for a live-a-board, loved that boat she did and kept her clean and spotless inside and out. She even compounded and polished the hull. Probably one of the cleanest kept boats in the marina, and at that marina you had to have a well maintained boat...no derelicts allowed. The power-boaters thought her boat was beautiful, I thought it was beautifully maintained....I'd watch the sail-boaters walk by and shake their head, if she wasn't around.

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This is not ugly? I actually like the design in some ways and might even own one, but damn. That's UGLY. (Bolger Fiddler II)

 

FiddlerII.jpg

 

I keep looking at that raggedy "sheer line" and thinking 'no way Phil drew it like that'... And then it hit me: For fuck's sake Tom, you've got us debating the aesthetics of a paper model cut out (presumably?) from the cartoon and taped together (the first clue was the tape on the corner of the windows....) and then plunked down in the back garden for the photo shoot.....

 

 

Hah! You're right! I had not noticed, but did think it a bit off somehow. I just saw the design in 30 Odd Boats and searched for an image, found one that looked kinda like the boat in the book.

 

I still think that if you built the boat as drawn, you would have an ugly boat. Not one I would not own, mind you, but an ugly boat. However, I agree that this model is hardly proof and if you come this way I'll pay up on that harbor cruise. ;)

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If we're gonna debate "ugly" lets at least use a real build. How about "Watervan"? But no sayin its "ugly" till you spent at least a night aboard. Preferably on a hot summer night (even better with some hotties) so you can test out the ventilation:

 

http://www.google.co...29,r:2,s:0,i:79

 

Lots of pics of Watervan here, at the top of the page, followed by a rather great collection of other Bolger works (full disclosure, one is a build of mine):

 

http://www.google.co....w=1024&bih=537

 

Sorry, I can't wait that long. Watervan is ugly. I want one. With air conditioning.

 

Which of those images is yours?

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I'd watch the sail-boaters walk by and shake their head, if she wasn't around.

 

I thought I had taken a picture of the one here, but I can't find it. This pic is off the web.

 

post-5724-0-54303900-1353271610_thumb.jpg

 

The book calls it the Buccaneer 300 and on the web it's called the 305. Same boat, I'm pretty sure.

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However, I agree that this model is hardly proof and if you come this way I'll pay up on that harbor cruise. ;)

 

Hey everybody, Tom's buying! Can you spell roadtrip? How many CA'ers wanna go down to Florida in, say, February?

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Sorry, I can't wait that long. Watervan is ugly. I want one. With air conditioning.

 

Which of those images is yours?

 

Watervan? Really? I'd of put you down for a SuperBrick. With or without AC.

 

There's a pic of the Tennessee I used to own..... Pic shows it in modified form. After a while I modified it for liveaboard use by cutting the original house off and turning it into what I think looks like an English lake boat. Sort of.....

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I'd watch the sail-boaters walk by and shake their head, if she wasn't around.

 

I thought I had taken a picture of the one here, but I can't find it. This pic is off the web.

 

post-5724-0-54303900-1353271610_thumb.jpg

 

The book calls it the Buccaneer 300 and on the web it's called the 305. Same boat, I'm pretty sure.

 

That's it...I knew what you meant....I was sad to see that young lady go when she finally got moorage closer to her work...one of those types that would brighten up your day with just a smile and the bounce of her step...and no, I'm not talking about tits bouncing.

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However, I agree that this model is hardly proof and if you come this way I'll pay up on that harbor cruise. ;)

 

Hey everybody, Tom's buying! Can you spell roadtrip? How many CA'ers wanna go down to Florida in, say, February?

 

How about Hawaii? :)

 

Actually you set the date and time, I'm up to flying down....

 

I don't drink anymore...but I don't drink any less. B)

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Ok how about Trekka? If John Guzzwell hadn't sailed her around the world and given us all dreams, we would probably regard that Laurent Giles reverse shear as ugly..

 

To tell the truth... I always liked Trekka, not that I was a fan of reverse sheer....I thought of her as a plucky little bulldog of a boat.

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Ok how about Trekka? If John Guzzwell hadn't sailed her around the world and given us all dreams, we would probably regard that Laurent Giles reverse shear as ugly..

 

To tell the truth... I always liked Trekka, not that I was a fan of reverse sheer....I thought of her as a plucky little bulldog of a boat.

 

I remember reading about Trekka in Eric Hiscock's classic Cruising Under Sail - never realised she was still around! And looking in very good nick too - anybody know her recent history?

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However, I agree that this model is hardly proof and if you come this way I'll pay up on that harbor cruise. ;)

 

Hey everybody, Tom's buying! Can you spell roadtrip? How many CA'ers wanna go down to Florida in, say, February?

 

Charlotte Harbor Regatta is the first weekend in February. I think I have already agreed to do two conflicting things that weekend. Why not add a third?

 

 

Watervan? Really? I'd of put you down for a SuperBrick. With or without AC.

 

There's a pic of the Tennessee I used to own..... Pic shows it in modified form. After a while I modified it for liveaboard use by cutting the original house off and turning it into what I think looks like an English lake boat. Sort of.....

 

Yeah, I'd take a SuperBrick too. A much shorter list would probably be "boats Tom does not want." ;)

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Ok how about Trekka? If John Guzzwell hadn't sailed her around the world and given us all dreams, we would probably regard that Laurent Giles reverse shear as ugly..

 

To tell the truth... I always liked Trekka, not that I was a fan of reverse sheer....I thought of her as a plucky little bulldog of a boat.

 

I remember reading about Trekka in Eric Hiscock's classic Cruising Under Sail - never realised she was still around! And looking in very good nick too - anybody know her recent history?

 

She's at the Maritime Museum in Victoria....thought she was in the museum, not in the water.

 

http://mmbc.bc.ca/experience/our-fleet-2/trekka/

 

http://mmbc.bc.ca/experience/our-fleet-2/trekka/

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Ok how about Trekka? If John Guzzwell hadn't sailed her around the world and given us all dreams, we would probably regard that Laurent Giles reverse shear as ugly..

 

this brings up an interesting point. where is the line between ugly and not? being ugly begins with the visual sense. I think on that much we can agree. also, anyone has the right to think that something may be visually ugly to him or her. but where does the line begin where the function, performance, success or whatever of an object suddenly makes it no longer ugly, or even attractive? for example, I've been seeing the for-sale ad in 48 North for Trekka's sistership for what seems like an eternity with the hidden intent on the sale apparently implying "please buy me based on a connection to detached accomplishments." of course that's an opinion created by my own personal filter and projections, but I think the question is valid, and for me quite interesting

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Don't forget the Reinell 26, another boat built by power boat builders back in the '70s gas shortage days. There was one moored next to me once and for some reason I pushed aaginst the hull with my foot and it deflected about an inch or so. In the picture below note how the hull has sagged around the keel. The keels were only about 18" deep and very wide so they could get headroom below by putting the sole down in the keel. They sailed like crap.

 

post-25831-0-79230900-1353277470.png

 

post-25831-0-84897600-1353277762_thumb.jpg

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I always loved the look of Trekka. It goes back to the MYTH Of MALHAM look. And the MYTH is one of my all time fav boats. Nothing wrong with reverse sheer.

 

I always liked her, as well as the M.O.M, though not being a great fan of reverse sheer. The 40' reverse sheer design in Arther Beiser's "The Proper Yacht" was another interesting design, think it was a Bruce King design. There was another very similar 40' reverse sheer at the Port of Poulsbo marina back in the mid to late '70's, could still be there AFAIK, think it was a Bruce King design as well, I could be wrong on that though.

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BLJ:

OK, I think I get it.

Maybe the best analogy I can offer is automotive. The original air-cooled VW beetle is ugly. but it's ugliness is a direct result of the necessities of the design spec, and every aspect of the vehicle is inlcuded only if it moves the vehicle toward successful completion of the design brief. As the DDB-crafted ad from 1969 proclaimed, "it's ugly, but it gets you there."

The New Beetle is fugly. it is an ill-conceived package that, instead of reflecting the underlying design, obscures the mechanicals and hampers maintenance and enjoyment rather than enhancing it and becomes parody rather than homage.

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Don't forget the Reinell 26, another boat built by power boat builders back in the '70s gas shortage days. There was one moored next to me once and for some reason I pushed aaginst the hull with my foot and it deflected about an inch or so. In the picture below note how the hull has sagged around the keel. The keels were only about 18" deep and very wide so they could get headroom below by putting the sole down in the keel. They sailed like crap.

 

post-25831-0-79230900-1353277470.png

 

post-25831-0-84897600-1353277762_thumb.jpg

 

There was one at the boatyard where I kept my boat. The rigging was grossly undersized - it looked like what you would find on a 16 foot boat. But the owner, who was retired, sailed it almost every day.

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I think the best thing about homely boats that don't sail well is that they are often an inexpensive way to get someone started.

 

Friend of mines first boat was a Mac 26X. We didn't ridicule him but suggested that there might be better options if sailing was his plan. After 3 seasons of "cruising" the Mac, he went to the Naptown show and bought a Bavaria 36. He got lots of calls when he listed the Mac and sold it faster than any "real" sailboat I've sold. He and his bride are planning to cruise the Bavaria up and down the East coast in retirement. I'm glad we encouraged him in his misguided start.

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Ugly boats are not all slow.

 

I'd like to nominate this boat as a particularly ugly one. That's me driving and my co-owner trimming, so obviously I liked the boat well enough to buy it. In fact, I thought it was genius the moment I first saw it and it is still one of my all time favorite boats.

 

Still ugly. Even uglier on its trailer, but I'll spare you any of those pictures.

 

headon162.jpg

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He got lots of calls when he listed the Mac and sold it faster than any "real" sailboat I've sold.

 

Selling Mac X or M boats is not work. Easiest sales job ever. Almost. His 19 foot powersailer is even easier, if you can find one to sell.

 

All the real MacGregor sailboats sell about like sailboats. Slowly. ;)

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The boat looks a bit rougher in a few details, but my opinion is that they are both darn ugly.

 

I'll take that as a gracious concession- Just let me know when to come down for the boozecruise. Or, you come up here and supply the booze and I'll supply the boat(s). Hell, we could probably even get KD to join us if he's not busy marrying Courtney offf (or perusing those odd photo libraries that only he seems to have access to).

I'm in.

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I'll take that as a gracious concession- Just let me know when to come down for the boozecruise. Or, you come up here and supply the booze and I'll supply the boat(s). Hell, we could probably even get KD to join us if he's not busy marrying Courtney offf (or perusing those odd photo libraries that only he seems to have access to).

I'm in.

 

Jeezus KD, pay attention would ya? We're going to Florida! Can you get that Pontiac wagon your folks used to have? Unless we're going to Hawaii--- Boomer sort of offered to spring for the trip over there. At least I think he did. It got kinda confusing there for a while. I'm fine with "just" Florida-- Tom appears to have a neat guest cabin already arranged.... Seems like a nice guy.

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Hey, if you are going to combine slagging Star Trek with boats you can not count out the Footprint pontoon boat. An unholy melding of pontoon boat, pop-up travel trailer, and Trek shuttle...post-25282-0-74634500-1353293955_thumb.jpg

 

Saw it at the Toronto boat show last winter, was speechless!

 

I'm sure though that it does what it is supposed to do, and meets the design criteria.

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Hey, if you are going to combine slagging Star Trek with boats you can not count out the Footprint pontoon boat. An unholy melding of pontoon boat, pop-up travel trailer, and Trek shuttle...post-25282-0-74634500-1353293955_thumb.jpg

 

Saw it at the Toronto boat show last winter, was speechless!

 

I'm sure though that it does what it is supposed to do, and meets the design criteria.

 

It looks to me like it could carry a fleet of fun boats and an air conditioner. What more could anyone ask of a boat? Rodholders, I suppose, but it could carry those too!

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You'd have to look pretty hard to find any ugly IOR boats. Of course there were a few but in general that rule made for some pretty boats with highly interesting shapes.

 

Hmm... While I'm in no position to disagree with Bob Freakin Perry My boat is IOR specific and while I love her (and spend silly amounts of money with the sole purpose of embarrassing "pretty" boat owners), she's not everyone's cuppa joe.

 

213g4y1.jpg

 

1973-CalT-2-CruisingOnTheOpenSea.jpg

 

27%20cal%20t2%20301.jpg

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Manitou 32' CC ketch? Seems to fit the bill as a starter boat, generally ~40% less than other comparible length cruisers and arguably fails (well, probably not much argument) in the practicality department.

 

manitou32.jpg

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I'm sure though that it does what it is supposed to do, and meets the design criteria.

I'm not so sure it does, sculp.

 

As I wrote here:

http://docksixchronicles.blogspot.ca/2012/01/toronto-boat-show-report-part-one-old.html

 

" My first impression was that it was the answer to a question nobody asked. Then I sorta- kinda reconsidered. Perhaps there is a place in the market for a modular pontoon boat with more amenities than the typical deck boat, without the windage and bulk of a pontoon- hulled houseboat. Hell, it has worked for VW with their Westfalia campers for over 5 decades, in a marketplace flooded with fifth wheel trailers and big-ass Winnebagos. I can see the benefits from a manufacturing and customization standpoint as well. One basic platform can be configured as a camper, or with a different module behind the pilothouse, a floating site office, bunkhouse, forward control barge, or mobile hunting camp with storage for an ATV or two.

 

Some details left me scratching my head, though. What is with all of the non-skid glued to the VERTICAL surfaces?

The raceway for the O/B controls is household ABS drain pipe, and the wiring conduit is, er, conduit.

The kettle grille, seen above, is less than a foot away from the non-removable canvas and vinyl wall of the accomodations pod. Besides being a fire hazard, having to barbecue through a window, over a countertop, might get old quick.

 

The pilothouse doesn't seem well thought out. The roof is retractable, which is great for making the space feel open and airy, but the really big windows are all fixed. A big greenhouse with no cross-flow ventilation. That's gonna get warm and stale, topless or not.

The helm is fully forward, putting all of the guests and crew aft of the helmsman. This means that the helmsman is not able to interact with guests easily, and more importantly, with the only access to the exterior of the boat at the aft end of the house, the helmsman can't dock singlehanded, and can't easily communicate with crew during docking.

The cabin is out of commission when closed. All of it. Including the head. And the galley. So, you either have to pop the top and fold out the pop-outs when you embark, or you and your guests pee over the side and eat what you can keep handy in the pilothouse until you get to your destination and open up the cabin.

 

Finally, there is no way to access the stern of the boat with the cabin opened up. Got engine trouble? Gotta close everything up, walk back, realize you need your tools inside the cabin, walk forward, open up the cabin, grab your tools, close up the cabin, walk back ... Maybe more importantly, it means that some of the most useful real estate on the boat is out of bounds. You can't hang propane bottles, store a generator or install a swim ladder/ platform because all of it is inaccessible."Yeah, I spent a lot of time poking around and writing about this design, more than i spent on the Hanse 445 on display, because the Footprint was an intriguing design. The Hanse, not so much.

I think it was Peter Egan who coined the phrase "UJM- Universal Japanese Motorcycle" a couple of decades abck to describe the ubiquitous CB 750/ Seca 650/GS 750/ KZ 750 plain wrapper white bread motorcycles of the 70s and early 80s. So many boats are like that, that when something off the reservation shows up, I hope it is an improvement. Sadly I'm not sure the Footprint is.

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