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Quant 28 DSS


Doug Lord

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This video gives some idea of the speed of this boat which has won almost every race she entered:

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Doug, I know this is all the rage and all, but it's hard for me to believe in that video that the DSS wing is doing more for the boat than the wings. I can imagine scenarios where the added righting moment would help, but this just looks like drag. If they were all sitting in the cockpit getting that kind of RM then it'd be a lot more convincing. Cool boat, glad they're winning.

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Doug, I know this is all the rage and all, but it's hard for me to believe in that video that the DSS wing is doing more for the boat than the wings. I can imagine scenarios where the added righting moment would help, but this just looks like drag. If they were all sitting in the cockpit getting that kind of RM then it'd be a lot more convincing. Cool boat, glad they're winning.

I agree there, it looks more like drag than anything else. but sweet boat nonetheless and fast too!

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Here's a video of the Infinity 36-one of the best video's yet: http://vimeo.com/45635108

 

Heres a list of the Allianz Quant 28's racing over 2011 and 2012. Also see the picture in the enclosed pdf.

 

Season 2011 and 2012: Silver mine called Q28!

 

---Fastest yacht of the pack in her first race - «T-Derby», Lucerne, May 2011 (53 boats participating)

 

---Winner of the annual regional championship on lake of Zurich 2011 with the minimal number of saled races. (5 best races out of 9) 4 victories out 5 races. 4 time fastest monohull over all (65 to 155 boats participating each race)

 

---Geneva – Rolle – Geneva 2011: 2nd boat in the class, elapsed and corrected time, 9th Monohull out of 180 participants.

 

---Winner of the annual regional championship on lake of Zurich 2012 with record number of points gathered. 8 races sailed in the racing division, 8 races won (also all time record). 7 times out of 8 races fastest monohull over all (65 to 155 boats participating each race)

 

---Geneva – Rolle – Geneva 2012: 1st boat home in the class as well as victory after corrected time. 8th monohull of 200 – crossing the line 9 seconds after the tallest Libera A (47’) of lake of Geneva after 6 hours and 30 minutes of total sailing time.

 

---Bol d’Or 2012: Line honours in Class TCF 1. 7th monohull of 430 – crossing the line 3 minutes behind «Taillevent II» a 47’ AC cupper like yacht after total sailing time of over 21 hours.

Also go to: http://www.thedailysail.com/inshore/...-photo-gallery

__________________

DSS-sterns-Drag reduction thanks to DSS.pdf

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  • 2 months later...

Looks like the Quant 28 will be racing again in Switzerland under new owners. The Quant 30 is the refined version and will be sailing pretty soon.

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Doug, I know this is all the rage and all, but it's hard for me to believe in that video that the DSS wing is doing more for the boat than the wings. I can imagine scenarios where the added righting moment would help, but this just looks like drag. If they were all sitting in the cockpit getting that kind of RM then it'd be a lot more convincing. Cool boat, glad they're winning.

 

To give some perspective - the concept is in the same family as curved foils in an ORMA 60. Are they just drag? No - its significantly faster to have them...... I agree that more evidence is needed like one boat with and one boat without and go 2 boating. Or something along these lines...

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Doug, I know this is all the rage and all, but it's hard for me to believe in that video that the DSS wing is doing more for the boat than the wings. I can imagine scenarios where the added righting moment would help, but this just looks like drag. If they were all sitting in the cockpit getting that kind of RM then it'd be a lot more convincing. Cool boat, glad they're winning.

 

To give some perspective - the concept is in the same family as curved foils in an ORMA 60. Are they just drag? No - its significantly faster to have them...... I agree that more evidence is needed like one boat with and one boat without and go 2 boating. Or something along these lines...

Even just comparing the boat's performance on the day with the board in and out would be nice. It sounds like a really great idea if the numbers line up, but if so, why isn't anyone else doing it?

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There are several new boats in build all over the world. Other than that copying the system is going to be prevented since it is patented worldwide.

I don't see how anyone can look at the Quant 28 racing record and have any question whatsoever about the viability of DSS which gives design advantages in lite and heavy air. The Q28's racing record in light, heavy and everything in between is second to none.

You should also check out the Infinity 36 and the DSS website under "Faqs".

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  • 1 month later...

This is a comment by an associate of Hugh's that sheds a little light on DSS-from the thread "Foiled..." in the SA forum( http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=146353 ). Mostly in reference to DSS and the Infinity 36:

Hi, I have done a lot of miles (all of them) on the Infiniti 36, although not the second one and a lot of miles on the first test boat, the 27. There are some films here which pretty much show the boat sailing in most conditions. I have been working with Hugh on this for about a decade and where he is a very smart naval architect I am not..... my background is lots of miles on some reasonably sized boats. I still come back to the dock in awe of what Hugh has invented - no manner of talking or describing really does justice to the excellence and simplicity of what has been created. This is simply the biggest (sane) change in yachting for the average guy up to the extreme solo sailor in decades. We have developed this in an extremely methodical manner, never trying to run before we could walk and now, we are about to announce a pretty significant project, but we need to wait a day or two for that........ There are plenty of people who question how it works or indeed, if it does work but they are not people who have sailed on one of the boats! Hugh does an excellent job on this forum of answering technical questions but today he is traveling so it falls to me to try and answer the questions. Yes, we have a square top main, it is not excessive, around 22% for the top, this is nice as it is not too draggy and when we have a reef in the main the twin top mast backstays can both be set, so no need to worry about the rig. The bridle works very well, I was sceptical at first but Hugh was spot-on; only when racing the very, very light Palermo to Monte Carlo race did we need to run a hauler to windward. It is nice and light and simple. Yes, the vang is pretty powerful and when we are seriously wicked then it is the primary main sheet control. Otherwise the boat is the same.....but different. It is great fun to sail them all, especially when you consider the concept that the more speed you can derive from your skill/trim/helm/balance etc the more the foil gives you back.... the faster you go, the more the foil works. It is also worth noting that this is about the hardest size to "do" for DSS. There are a variety of reasons for this, and Hugh is best placed to explain but if you think that basically the faster the boat goes, the better the foils work.... so, a 36 ft boat is naturally slower than a 70ft boat... and therefore it is harder. The smaller boats we have done get away with this because of the racks and water ballast etc. So, to say we are very happy with the Infiniti 36s is a massive understatement, they, like all the boats have outperformed expectations - hope this explains a few things.


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rope dragging in the water, koz not onboard.

the boat appears to be lifting water up above wl at the transom ?

is it patented or pattent pending, dont really see how you could patent a foil nothing new or novel.

 

Have you read any of the information posted in this thread-just curious? Watched either video?

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rope dragging in the water, koz not onboard.

the boat appears to be lifting water up above wl at the transom ?

is it patented or pattent pending, dont really see how you could patent a foil nothing new or novel.

 

Have you read any of the information posted in this thread-just curious? Watched either video?

 

hi doug, how are you

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  • 3 weeks later...

This is a letter I received from Michi-former owner of the Quant 28 DSS and soon to be ownner of the Quant 30 DSS(see foil picture below). See more on the Quant 28 race record(second to none) above :

 

For those who do not know: Geneva is one of the regions in Switzerland where sailing really is something that matters. This spot still is one of the more important locations worldwide, when it comes to lakeracing. So many innovations for lakeboats are rooting in Geneva or Lake of Geneva.

 

Positive proof that Geneva has a rich sailing-culture. Zurich – where i come from – also has a nice lake but hasn’t the same sailing spirit.

 

If now a sailor from Zurich, with a little unconventional sportsboat of just 28‘ manages to get into the fancy Bol d’Or-Magazine with two pics (see attachment) and a caption calling the boat „a sensation“ – then you are tempted to say: „We made it“! All the more as there are so many interesting and headturning boats fighting for recognition – most of them are much taller and most of them are Geneva based.

 

Line honours in the class and 7th monohull over all after more than 21hours of sailing is a good result after victory (both real and corrected time) in the rehearsal race the weekend before the Bol d’Or. The Q28 proved being not only incredibly capable for her size, but also is she relatively easy to sail and extremely simple to maintain and to move.

 

This is what we in Zurich are calling a real progress. The Q28 is clearly symbolising a new generation of sportsboats, fast, handy and and a boat for any passionate sailor.

 

My thanks go to everybody who made this possible, believing in Hugh Welbourn‘s DSS-System and Design and also in the QuantBoats-Lakeracer-Project – and especially to our sponsor „Allianz-Suisse“.

 

This letter also is the perfect occasion to announce that the former Allianz-Q28 has now found the right habitat:
A talented crew from the SNG is the new owner of this marvellous pocket-rocket and they now have to prove their abilities and skills, to make the boat even faster.

 

But don’t worry, our team will come back, trying to sail as fast as before but with a boat even simpler and easier to sail.

So please wait to welcome the new Quant30 – unluckily not yet sailready for the 75th anniversary of the first Bol d’Or.

 

 

See you soon and have a nice sailing season

 

Michael Aeppli & Max Schmid

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Looks longitudinally stable. That helps to keep attached airflow in sails which is a bonus. Would be nice to see some upwind footage.

Worldwide patent is good for the inventor, but slows the mainstreaming and development process. Look what happens in the foiling Moth folks. They share tricks about handling, speed and hardware, and therefore are making very good progress.

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