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J/35 - How to run aground and what to do about it.


Tyson0317

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During the Blakely Rock Benifit Race this weekend coming up on the reef, which was the main mark in the race... Depth read at 25ft, I hit the record button on the GoPro (wanting to record our upcoming sail change) and then this...

 

I vaguely remember reading a post about a year ago here from a J/105 in SF Bay (I think) hitting 'marine life' with their keel and it costing $55k in repair, or something. From what I see, it doesn't actually look that bad. We got zero leaks from this and the keel bolts look OK.

 

1. Do you guys see any problem with me sailing the boat?

2. How soon should I get it hauled and inspected?

3. Any guesses what this will run me to repair?

 

Calling insurance co tomorrow...

 

https://youtu.be/hVfosaV9ITQ

 

 

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That wern't no marine life my friend that was a fricking rock..... ;) Boat is probably ok, but your main issue is going to be h20 ingress in the keel through the big ass hole in the gelcoat.... Quick fix would be to haul and throw something on the bottom to seal it and go sailing. Fix it permanently when you haul for the winter. sux, but that's about it...

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Yes, you hit a rock. Sooner or later every racer will do that. Speed seems slow, so damage should be limited to leading edge of keel. Which is lead, with fairing & primer over it. No rush to fix that, it will not spread before next haulout (yearly?) Have diver look at it, rough shape it smooth with a wood rasp/coarse file. Look inside boat where trailing edge of keel is - this is where any serious damage would be. Look for sideways or arcing cracks that indicate the hull has moved upwards a lot. Finding cracks means grinding thru gel coat to get better look at them. Hull is solid around keel, no core. I don't know how far out solid area goes, should be at least 6". If you find cracks on the inside have diver look at outside! You have a keel stub, so also look hard at joint area between stub & keel, inside & out.

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Depth sounder will not alert you in time when bottom shoals quickly. It's measuring depth just in front of keel, no reaction time when it shallows quickly. Which is why most boats were outside of you.

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Get it lifted out and inspected asap, that was a fairly big hit and you haven't really got any idea if you've done serious damage or not; the joint between the keel and the sump might be damaged, stringers might have been damaged, the joint between the sump and the hull might be damaged, there are plenty of things that could be wrong that you're not going to be able to see without looking at the hull or taking the floorboards up. The keel might fall off in the future because you've compromised the structure (unlikely, but is it worth the risk?), or you might end up with an unnecessarily massive repair bill because water has been allowed to get into places that it shouldn't be.

 

I'd imagine that if you phone your insurance company and tell then you sailed into a rock so large that it stopped the boat dead and then fired it backwards, they'll probably be pretty keen on you getting it checked as a matter of urgency.

 

Unsure on the repair price, highly dependent on what's been damaged. It might be a little bill for some cosmetic damage to the keel, or a very big bill for lots of structural damage. Fingers crossed it's the former!

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+1

 

Dont just let it happen again.

 

Hint the big rock on the right.

 

Get real nervous around BIG ROCKs sticking out of water.

 

Even more so the under water ones.

 

As for one you found it is only a new one to you.

 

Who was looking at the Garmin chart plotter?

 

You do know old j35s have a tendency to have the keel area fiberglass inside gridwork seperate from the bottom skin.

 

Haul the boat get a great servey. Have the Ins. Co pay to "properly repair"every thing found broken.

 

Get a the keel releaded.

 

Let the pros at a good yard do all the work.

 

Don't ask why I think this is the way forward.

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I had no doubt that we hit a rock. I dive that spot often and many boats have had much worse stories getting caught between the 'spires' there. Our chart plotter got knocked out about a week ago. Crew-member tripped while going down the ladder and ripped it off the mount trying to catch himself...

 

Going to call the ins. co. tomorrow. Not even sure what my deductible is. Ought to be a fun time. That's boating!

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Not super familiar with J-boat build quality--we have a few 22s and 24s in our area--but I don't think you would cause any major structural damage with a relatively low speed hit like that.

 

i would look for cracking/heavy crazing around the keel joint as well as at the trailing edge on the inside and exterior of the boat.

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Note to others suggesting haul out and total inspection.. Click the link and look at the damage..... He dove the boat the next day and you can see no cracks in the bottom paint or other structural stuff besides big ass chunk out of bottom of keel. Do what longy said and go sailin if you don't find anything... It is a 30 yo J35 not a brand new carbon something... Have fun...

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Look again at the whole vid. There indeed are troubling cracks/chipping in the bottom paint at the fore and aft edge of the hull/keel joint. Significant flex was experienced here. I'd be nervous unless and until the keel was dropped and keel bolts checked and put together again....

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Definitely have it hauled and checked. The 35 I sail on pounded on a sandy bottom and then later hit an 'object' in the bay on our Thursday course. When the boat was hauled for a bottom job the keel was wiggling back and forth. Once the hull dried the cracks around it in the sump and bottom could be seen. $30g's of insurance money later and she was good as new again. The sump and area into clear glass/core where the cracks ended were cut-out, after a mold was made, and then the new section put in place. She is solid as a rock now.

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I had no doubt that we hit a rock. I dive that spot often and many boats have had much worse stories getting caught between the 'spires' there. Our chart plotter got knocked out about a week ago. Crew-member tripped while going down the ladder and ripped it off the mount trying to catch himself...

 

Going to call the ins. co. tomorrow. Not even sure what my deductible is. Ought to be a fun time. That's boating!

Hindsight is of course 20/20. A few random thoughts. First I see no whitecaps on the water so am thinking/guessing this was a pretty low speed crash which will certainly help. As a general statement (assuming proper maintenance over the boats life of course) the 35 is a pretty well built boat and solid. I would get the boat checked out by a competent marine surveyor and yard (competent being the key ingredient to that statement) but suspect at the end of the day the largest damage will be to your ego and not the boat. Further suggestion is when things break fix them immediately. At times things on boats can fall like dominoes, not to say for example if the chart plotter had been there/working that you still would not have hit the rock, but any aide in preventing that (such as a working chart plotter) will certainly help. Sometimes larger bad things happen on boats when a lot of smaller deferred maintenance things are put off. Just my 2 cents. Hang in there and keep trying, all sailing is a learning experience no matter how long you have been doing it.

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Look again at the whole vid. There indeed are troubling cracks/chipping in the bottom paint at the fore and aft edge of the hull/keel joint. Significant flex was experienced here. I'd be nervous unless and until the keel was dropped and keel bolts checked and put together again....

I do admit that I skimmed the video and did not sit through the whole thing. Stopped at the interesting bits. As I said before. Do what longy said and go sailing if everything checks out....

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looks like the trailing edge of the keel oil canned the bottom. you'll be happy you had it hauled and inspected.

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Agree with Ryley, something caused the area around the back of the keel to flex enough to knock off the bottom paint. Plus the cracks are big enough to "grip" the bubbles.

 

All fixable but is probably more than a little putty and paint on the lead.

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Man there is a helluva lot of bad advice here.

There is one right answer after a grounding that hard.

You know how much upward stress that puts on the aft stringers? (dont answer that).

Have you looked at all of the stringers going aft?

Inspected all the motor mounts?

A haul and inspection. Especially around the prior bondo job on the keel trainling edge

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Pull the boat. Do not go sailing. Get it repaired Have it fully checked and signed off on by a GOOD inspector. Get the insurance company involved. There are definite liability/insurance issues involved with going sailing afterwards and potentially making it worse.

 

J/boats of that era have terrible structural problems from wet balsa. I saw a hit on a J/30 which split the boat down the hull/deck joint. Don't fuck around with it.

 

And for the love of christ have your boat dived on before races. Those are some pretty fresh sails you have up. The state of your bottom totally negated the money you spent on those.

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as a J35 owner, the keel sump to me is the weak point. need to get in there and reinforce it. we hit a huge bamboo log and put a hole in the keel root area. wound up rebuilding that whole section.

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Did not have time to look at the whole vid until now. If it chunked the back of the keel/hull joint, well...

 

Agree that the bottom was dirty and the paint looked rolled-on, not sprayed. Needs more attention here once the keel is checked/repaired.

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as a J35 owner, the keel sump to me is the weak point. need to get in there and reinforce it. we hit a huge bamboo log and put a hole in the keel root area. wound up rebuilding that whole section.

Had the same on my mid 80's C+C 35-3. Glass was paper thin. Taking those boats offshore was Russian Roulette.

The guys saying just go sailing should go out in the garage and hit themselves in the temple with a ball peen hammer 3 times hard. You can end up slowly doing more damage, and you have a responsibility to people you take out on that 30 year old shitbox. Take it out and have it looked over while insurance will foot some or all of the bill. And stop coming here for advice. Try Sailnet!

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We've had similar issues with our J/36 after a geology session, but found no problems with the stringers or floors inside. We had the cracked areas all ground out and laid new layers of glass up over the after edge of the keel/hull joint. Having the glassing done professionally by someone whose work we trust has kept us from worrying about it since. Not wanting to lose any righting moment by shaving lead off with a rasp or file, I banged the keel back into shape with a sledgehammer.

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I'm speculating a bit and relying on a distant memory, but...

 

I see the "More Power" graphic on the front of the cockpit. I seem to recall that this boat was once named More Power and before that, it was named Major Damage (ironic, huh?). It originally sailed in San Francisco and was the J-35 class champion at least once. It then came to Puget Sound. It was renamed something else (I cannot recall that name, but maybe Diversion, but I might be mixing that up with another J-35) and sailed occasionally out of Gig Harbor. When it was for sale, I think that the word was it had already sustained significant damage to the keep sump area and been repaired.

 

I'm sure someone can correct me if I'm wrong about some/all of this.

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Tyson,

Sorry to say, but this one needs to be hauled and looked at closer. 2 reasons. 1, you don't want water getting into hull core. Even if area around keel is solid glass, you have no idea how far out those cracks in the back of the keel radiate. Only one way to figure that out, and it can't be done in the water. 2. Good chance you popped some stringers/floors and have cracks around the stringers/floors both aft of the keel and forward of the keel. While those can be found while boat is in the water, you need to pull for reason number one.

 

Finally, getting insurance involved now allows you to get all damaged fixed. Waiting, and then finding out you have additional damage later, means insurance co can rightly say it may have been caused by you failing to repair properly after the grounding and so deny the claim, or parts of it.

 

If it was the Chesapeake Bay, and you hit going that speed, in soft mud, and there was no chipped of bottom paint or cracks aft of keel, I'd tell you that you were probably ok to go sailing. You it a rock and stopped almost instantly. 10,500lb boat going 4 knots or so is alot of momentum, multiplied by an almost 7 foot lever arm equals a bunch of force concentrated on the back end of where the keel meets the hull...time to stop sailing, get the boat out of the water, and get a good surveyor and good boatyard to figure out what is damaged and get it fixed now...

Crash

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Tyson,

Sorry to say, but this one needs to be hauled and looked at closer. 2 reasons. 1, you don't want water getting into hull core. Even if area around keel is solid glass, you have no idea how far out those cracks in the back of the keel radiate. Only one way to figure that out, and it can't be done in the water. 2. Good chance you popped some stringers/floors and have cracks around the stringers/floors both aft of the keel and forward of the keel. While those can be found while boat is in the water, you need to pull for reason number one.

 

Finally, getting insurance involved now allows you to get all damaged fixed. Waiting, and then finding out you have additional damage later, means insurance co can rightly say it may have been caused by you failing to repair properly after the grounding and so deny the claim, or parts of it.

 

If it was the Chesapeake Bay, and you hit going that speed, in soft mud, and there was no chipped of bottom paint or cracks aft of keel, I'd tell you that you were probably ok to go sailing. You it a rock and stopped almost instantly. 10,500lb boat going 4 knots or so is alot of momentum, multiplied by an almost 7 foot lever arm equals a bunch of force concentrated on the back end of where the keel meets the hull...time to stop sailing, get the boat out of the water, and get a good surveyor and good boatyard to figure out what is damaged and get it fixed now...

Crash

 

You only have one choice, as above.

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Thanks guys. Boat coming out of the water at noon tomorrow at the CSR Marine dock (being told by many people that its the best shop around). Will keep ya posted.

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During the Blakely Rock Benifit Race this weekend coming up on the reef, which was the main mark in the race... Depth read at 25ft, I hit the record button on the GoPro (wanting to record our upcoming sail change) and then this...

 

I vaguely remember reading a post about a year ago here from a J/105 in SF Bay (I think) hitting 'marine life' with their keel and it costing $55k in repair, or something. From what I see, it doesn't actually look that bad. We got zero leaks from this and the keel bolts look OK.

 

1. Do you guys see any problem with me sailing the boat?

2. How soon should I get it hauled and inspected?

3. Any guesses what this will run me to repair?

 

Calling insurance co tomorrow...

 

Is that J35 the old Touch of Grey?

The reason I ask is that the 35's next to you didn't hit.

If it is, you probably only knocked off the illegal 4 inch shoe that was put on the boat back in the mid to late 80's

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Now that's funny.

 

Your saying if its TO Gray a 'class legal boat could have missed the bump'? Well.

 

Sounds like the class measurer should be looking at the boat too. If it is as you say a illegal shoe keel boat. BEFORE keel repairs are ordered...

 

Whatz it rate?

 

lol This just got interesting...

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Now that's funny.

 

Your saying if its TO Gray a 'class legal boat could have missed the bump'? Well.

 

Sounds like the class measurer should be looking at the boat too. If it is as you say a illegal shoe keel boat. BEFORE keel repairs are ordered...

 

Whatz it rate?

 

lol This just got interesting...

If my memory serves me correct, the owner was class president at the time.
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Is that J35 the old Touch of Grey?

The reason I ask is that the 35's next to you didn't hit.

If it is, you probably only knocked off the illegal 4 inch shoe that was put on the boat back in the mid to late 80's

 

 

Oh wow, this is getting good, Think I'll go make some popcorn, sit back and watch this unfold. Poor guy runs aground, f's up his boat and now it's time to pour salt in the wound with a grudge someone's been holding onto for over 30 years. :lol: ( unless that was all in good fun, my bad then)
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35 Class Pres then owned What boat? Tys boat or To Gray or...? Are they the same old j?

Same group
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Is that J35 the old Touch of Grey?

The reason I ask is that the 35's next to you didn't hit.

If it is, you probably only knocked off the illegal 4 inch shoe that was put on the boat back in the mid to late 80's

Oh wow, this is getting good, Think I'll go make some popcorn, sit back and watch this unfold. Poor guy runs aground, f's up his boat and now it's time to pour salt in the wound with a grudge someone's been holding onto for over 30 years. :lol: ( unless that was all in good fun, my bad then)

 

No grudge, don't really give a shit.

Just stirring shit and having some fun with info a lot of people don't know about

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Using Blakely Rock as a race mark, as has been done for many years, provides work for local boat yards year after year. The gift that keeps on giving.

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Touch of Grey?

Unless old 32276 had a predecessor I don't know about - And I've been sailing the various permutations of the class since 1989 - she's still active in Chicago.

Bozo's Circus, nee Midnight Special, nee Top Gun, crunched Graham Shoal in the 1990 Chicago-Mac (as Midnight Special). Initial inspections seemed OK, but on the delivery leaks, stringer and motor mount issues were discovered. Irish made it right and the owners wallet a bit lighter. Boat raced in the NAs in late August. Haul it, inspect it, fix it. you won't regret it.

 

 

During the Blakely Rock Benifit Race this weekend coming up on the reef, which was the main mark in the race... Depth read at 25ft, I hit the record button on the GoPro (wanting to record our upcoming sail change) and then this...

I vaguely remember reading a post about a year ago here from a J/105 in SF Bay (I think) hitting 'marine life' with their keel and it costing $55k in repair, or something. From what I see, it doesn't actually look that bad. We got zero leaks from this and the keel bolts look OK.

1. Do you guys see any problem with me sailing the boat?
2. How soon should I get it hauled and inspected?
3. Any guesses what this will run me to repair?

Calling insurance co tomorrow...

https://youtu.be/hVfosaV9ITQ

Is that J35 the old Touch of Grey?
The reason I ask is that the 35's next to you didn't hit.
If it is, you probably only knocked off the illegal 4 inch shoe that was put on the boat back in the mid to late 80's

 

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here are some photos of the finished product. these frame go all the way to the bottom of the sump. this section of the boat is now stiffer than a woodpeckers up lip.

post-32-0-02106800-1460095063_thumb.jpg

post-32-0-13398200-1460095069_thumb.jpg

post-32-0-02106800-1460095063_thumb.jpg

post-32-0-13398200-1460095069_thumb.jpg

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Touch O Grey is hull #1 and resides in the Chicago area and has since the mid 90's at least.

 

I had similar cracking at the back of my keel. Had it patched several times over 20 years. Two years ago it got a lot worse and had to have the whole keel joint rebuilt as it was delaminating. I Have also had the inside sump rebuilt and reinforced several years before that. If not leaking probably not too bad. Oil can effect on the back so checking the stringers is a really good idea. Price, hard to say but worst case scenario is probably 5kish most likely a lot less.

 

The boats are old and need some TLC occasionally but still a great ride.

 

Overall your bottom needs some TLC. It will improve your light air performance noticeably.

BTW I am the current class Pres LOL!

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I'm speculating a bit and relying on a distant memory, but...

 

I see the "More Power" graphic on the front of the cockpit. I seem to recall that this boat was once named More Power and before that, it was named Major Damage (ironic, huh?). It originally sailed in San Francisco and was the J-35 class champion at least once. It then came to Puget Sound. It was renamed something else (I cannot recall that name, but maybe Diversion, but I might be mixing that up with another J-35) and sailed occasionally out of Gig Harbor. When it was for sale, I think that the word was it had already sustained significant damage to the keep sump area and been repaired.

 

I'm sure someone can correct me if I'm wrong about some/all of this.

Edit: Not Diversion. Was named Standing Ovation when it came to GH fro SF.

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Back to the topic, saw this boat at the yard and is pretty safe to say it's going to be at more than just a little putty and paint. A couple of cracks hinting that the front of the sump and hull skin may no longer be as cozy they should be. Add that to the back where the sump tried to push up into the hull.

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Back to the topic, saw this boat at the yard and is pretty safe to say it's going to be at more than just a little putty and paint. A couple of cracks hinting that the front of the sump and hull skin may no longer be as cozy they should be. Add that to the back where the sump tried to push up into the hull.

This happened to a J-120 is San Diego a few years ago:

 

http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=68245&p=1599847

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Back to the topic, saw this boat at the yard and is pretty safe to say it's going to be at more than just a little putty and paint. A couple of cracks hinting that the front of the sump and hull skin may no longer be as cozy they should be. Add that to the back where the sump tried to push up into the hull.

 

 

Just like what happened to our 35, front of the sump almost to the mast step, and then around the back just in front of the engine mounts. Have them contact Mike Gable at Gable Enterprises, he may still have the mold he made to replace the sump. The boat is rock solid now, $30,000 later. While they are in there it would be best to check the core around the backstay mount in the transom. Ours has needed fixing twice.

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I was somewhat surprised that they did not total the boat. This was not too long after Sandy and I think they had enough boats on their hands to scrap and since Gable persuaded them that he could make her like new, they went with it.

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it's worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

I don't know why anyone would want a wheel on a J35.

So, that boat, while it may be worth quite a bit to you,

is worth nothing to me.

 

If someone offered me 30k for mine right now, I'd run, not walk, to deposit their check.

And I've probably got a better sail inventory than you do.

 

 

 

Meanwhile back at the ranch....

 

Hey Tyson, hows the boat?

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it's worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

I don't know why anyone would want a wheel on a J35.

So, that boat, while it may be worth quite a bit to you,

is worth nothing to me.

 

If someone offered me 30k for mine right now, I'd run, not walk, to deposit their check.

And I've probably got a better sail inventory than you do.

 

 

 

Meanwhile back at the ranch....

 

Hey Tyson, hows the boat?

 

But then what would you do?

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it's worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

I don't know why anyone would want a wheel on a J35.

So, that boat, while it may be worth quite a bit to you,

is worth nothing to me.

 

If someone offered me 30k for mine right now, I'd run, not walk, to deposit their check.

And I've probably got a better sail inventory than you do.

 

 

 

Meanwhile back at the ranch....

 

Hey Tyson, hows the boat?

 

But then what would you do?

 

 

I'm developing a certain fondness for OPB's ;)

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I'm guessing that has something to do with boats...

 

OPB

Category filter:

Acronym Definition

OPB Oregon Public Broadcasting

OPB On-Chip Peripheral Bus

OPB Ontario Pension Board (Canada)

OPB OBERMEYER Planen + Beraten GmbH (German engineering firm)

OPB Other People's Boats

OPB Omega Phi Beta (Sorority)

OPB Out of Plane Bending

OPB Officer Preselection Brief

OPB Office of Plans and Budget

OPB Operational Preparation of the Battlespace

OPB Oficial de Protección de Buque

OPB Operations Program Baseline

OPB Officer Program Branch

OPB Orders and Pay Branch

OPB Outstanding Principle Balance

OPB Order Processing and Billing (BookMaster software)

OPB Outline Planning Brief

OPB Operating Plan and Budget

OPB On Base Percentage (baseball)

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I'm guessing that has something to do with boats...

 

OPB

Category filter:

Acronym Definition

OPB Oregon Public Broadcasting

OPB On-Chip Peripheral Bus

OPB Ontario Pension Board (Canada)

OPB OBERMEYER Planen + Beraten GmbH (German engineering firm)

OPB Other People's Boats

OPB Omega Phi Beta (Sorority)

OPB Out of Plane Bending

OPB Officer Preselection Brief

OPB Office of Plans and Budget

OPB Operational Preparation of the Battlespace

OPB Oficial de Protección de Buque

OPB Operations Program Baseline

OPB Officer Program Branch

OPB Orders and Pay Branch

OPB Outstanding Principle Balance

OPB Order Processing and Billing (BookMaster software)

OPB Outline Planning Brief

OPB Operating Plan and Budget

OPB On Base Percentage (baseball)

it's in there somewhere...

 

but wouldn't that last one be OBP?

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Hi Jack,

 

 

I'm guessing that has something to do with boats...

OPB

Category filter:

Acronym Definition

OPB Oregon Public Broadcasting

OPB On-Chip Peripheral Bus

OPB Ontario Pension Board (Canada)

OPB OBERMEYER Planen + Beraten GmbH (German engineering firm)

OPB Other People's Boats

OPB Omega Phi Beta (Sorority)

OPB Out of Plane Bending

OPB Officer Preselection Brief

OPB Office of Plans and Budget

OPB Operational Preparation of the Battlespace

OPB Oficial de Protección de Buque

OPB Operations Program Baseline

OPB Officer Program Branch

OPB Orders and Pay Branch

OPB Outstanding Principle Balance

OPB Order Processing and Billing (BookMaster software)

OPB Outline Planning Brief

OPB Operating Plan and Budget

OPB On Base Percentage (baseball)

 

it's in there somewhere...

 

but wouldn't that last one be OBP?

WTF yes I'll fix that know. Next time feel free to fix it for me.

Is this Fix shIT J Anarchy .

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it's worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

I don't know why anyone would want a wheel on a J35.

So, that boat, while it may be worth quite a bit to you,

is worth nothing to me.

 

If someone offered me 30k for mine right now, I'd run, not walk, to deposit their check.

And I've probably got a better sail inventory than you do.

 

 

 

Meanwhile back at the ranch....

 

Hey Tyson, hows the boat?

 

But then what would you do?

I'm developing a certain fondness for OPB's ;)

I'm guessing that has something to do with boats...

OPB

Category filter:

Acronym Definition

OPB Oregon Public Broadcasting

OPB On-Chip Peripheral Bus

OPB Ontario Pension Board (Canada)

OPB OBERMEYER Planen + Beraten GmbH (German engineering firm)

OPB Other People's Boats

OPB Omega Phi Beta (Sorority)

OPB Out of Plane Bending

OPB Officer Preselection Brief

OPB Office of Plans and Budget

OPB Operational Preparation of the Battlespace

OPB Oficial de Protección de Buque

OPB Operations Program Baseline

OPB Officer Program Branch

OPB Orders and Pay Branch

OPB Outstanding Principle Balance

OPB Order Processing and Billing (BookMaster software)

OPB Outline Planning Brief

OPB Operating Plan and Budge

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it's worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

I don't know why anyone would want a wheel on a J35.

So, that boat, while it may be worth quite a bit to you,

is worth nothing to me.

 

If someone offered me 30k for mine right now, I'd run, not walk, to deposit their check.

And I've probably got a better sail inventory than you do.

 

 

 

Meanwhile back at the ranch....

 

Hey Tyson, hows the boat?

 

it's worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

I don't know why anyone would want a wheel on a J35.

So, that boat, while it may be worth quite a bit to you,

is worth nothing to me.

 

If someone offered me 30k for mine right now, I'd run, not walk, to deposit their check.

And I've probably got a better sail inventory than you do.

 

 

 

Meanwhile back at the ranch....

 

Hey Tyson, hows the boat?

oh!!! someone is jealous

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  • 3 weeks later...

Sorry, but that wasn't a "no big deal" hit. Please google Cheeki Raffiki Maritime Accident Investigation (or something like that will get you there). Beneteau 40.7 had a history of "minor groundings" was even pulled out of the water a few times and inspected, lost with all hands two years ago when the keel fell off off of Nova Scotia, I think it was. The construction of the J 35 might be completely different but I gleaned enough from that accident report to know if that were my boat I'd have it pulled out and the keel dropped after hitting that hard.

 

I'm not that impressed with the frame structure in the keel area of those photos. I'm surprised there weren't actual floors glassed in to spread the keel loads, basically, what George added. A few pounds down low like that wouldn't affect performance to any degree, I would think.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Tyson? any news?

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  • 3 weeks later...

Tyson? any news?

Considering the lengthy silence from one who initiated and sustained many active threads simultaneously, I would suspect the news is grim. Hope it's not the case.

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He showed up (with the boat) on May 7th for a race. But there was no wind, so he went home early. I assumed the boat was fixed, but I did not have a chance to talk to him.

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  • 1 month later...

He must be busy welding ....

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Tyson? any news?

Considering the lengthy silence from one who initiated and sustained many active threads simultaneously, I would suspect the news is grim. Hope it's not the case.
Me too, not admitting anything- but, a few style points:

 

Don't remember if you have lazarettes, but if you do, points are rewarded for 2 or more folks jumping into them, emptying them out completely,

And then one person staying down to obsess on tasting whatever liquid might be sloshing around.

 

Points also for ripping up cabin sole, and having a taster down there too. (I was watching your YT in A noisy bar, so forgive me if I didn't catch that...)

 

Going for the keel/hull joint first gets judge approval when diving on the keel.

 

Bringing up important papers and gear from the cabin can rack up the points, as well as a panicky mayday call to the coast guard, which they will record, of course.

 

There was a Farr something that hit a rock up in BC a few years ago, and the keel folded up into the hull like a centerboard.

 

I've probably forgotten something....

 

Oh! Dealing with the insurance company, but the judges don't usually get to rate that. High degree of difficulty though-

 

Tyson? any news?

Considering the lengthy silence from one who initiated and sustained many active threads simultaneously, I would suspect the news is grim. Hope it's not the case.
Me too, not admitting anything- but, a few style points:

 

Don't remember if you have lazarettes, but if you do, points are rewarded for 2 or more folks jumping into them, emptying them out completely,

And then one person staying down to obsess on tasting whatever liquid might be sloshing around.

 

Points also for ripping up cabin sole, and having a taster down there too. (I was watching your YT in A noisy bar, so forgive me if I didn't catch that...)

 

Going for the keel/hull joint first gets judge approval when diving in the keel.

 

Bringing up important papers and gear from the cabin can rack up the points, as well as a panicky mayday call to the coast guard, which they will record, of course.

 

There was a Farr something that hit a rock up in BC a few years ago, and the keel folded up into the hull like a centerboard.

 

I've probably forgotten something....

 

Oh! Dealing with the insurance company, but the judges don't usually get to rate that. High degree of difficulty though-

 

Edit- & pics of you from other boats & a pic of your check to the insurance co...

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  • 2 weeks later...

crickets .... I hear crickets .....

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Check out the guy on the right in this picture from that website image.php. He does not look like a satisfied customer at all. "I just paid $100 to sit on the fucking rail all day, soaking wet, freezing cold, do nothing AND we come in DFL? This is nothing like the craigslist ad said it would be. I want my money back or I'm gonna sink your fricken boat."

 

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Bring a 6-pack and you're on for any Thursday night race on our 35...12 even better.

Cheap ride... The boat I was sailing on in Auckland it was a carton of beer, a bottle of rum, coke, dry ginger and a bag of ice. The skipper was kind enough to let us store this in his chilly bin on the dock.

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Bring a 6-pack and you're on for any Thursday night race on our 35...12 even better.

 

I was thinking more along the lines of a Captain's license re: passengers for hire but beer works too....

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crickets .... I hear crickets .....

 

 

I was googling around to see if there were any recent race results- didn't find any- but came across this: http://j35solution.com/

 

Tryouts? $100 single-day tryout sailing pass? WTF?!?!?

 

ohmy... he should be paying them LOL

 

and 6 pack.. yeah.. charging for passage? big no no without some sort of Merchant Mariner Credential.

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  • 1 month later...

Last time I saw someone hit there the bowman went overboard. We were prepping to assist when he stood up on the rock that they hit and was only waist deep.

Got a photo of this someware. I stood ankle deep in flat calm water, on a rock shoal no one saw, 5 mi out, off shore in Georgian Bay and pushed on the bow of a Tarton 42 to get off the ledge that stoped us. We were motor sailing at 7.5 knots, hit only with the keel at 6 ft.. The boat stoped in 2 inches. That was the amount the lead was pushed in. No big problem. Early 70s boats were beasts with tall thick telephone pole like alu. masts.

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  • 2 months later...

I just got back from sailing for 2 weeks in Grenada and made a post about the reefing system I saw on one of the charter boats. Then decided to read the forum a bit and saw that you old curmudgeons were still beating this dead horse ;-P

 

Yes - the boat was fixed just in time for the Race to the Straights in May. We showed up to a dead calm sunny start and decided that motoring for 5 hours to eat spaghetti with the the sailing sub-chapter of the puget sound geriatric society didn't sound as good as picking up a pair of girls and a few cases of beer. The latter worked our really well ;-)

 

Butcher's Bill was a bit north of $7k. I feel confident that they inspected the boat very thoroughly - the yard has a good reputation here. The job entailed re-leading, fairing and paint. People in the know told me that this had to be the 'insurance rate' as similar damage on other boats was addressed for under $2k of 'poket cash'. But it was the peak of the season and frankly I am out of my depth with something like this. Insurance covered most of it without question - cut a check before I even had time to ask for it. Written survey of the damage states absolutely zero loss of integrity and the boat is 'good as new'. And I just got my insurance renewal papers - $550/yr, same as last year.

 

'Ol Gray? Never heard of it. Our boat is bone stock. Rock spires in that location stick out like that. Right before I turned the camera on, we were yelling for room and did not get it. I've become very intimately familiar with mark-room rules now.

 

Why have I been offline? Unlike what I suspect most of you, I still work for every dollar. Not only that, but own/run a business with the best of clients who are known for being patient, understanding, ego-less and considerate - doctors and dentists. My biz also happens to be a tech firm with Amazon down the street offering $70k/yr salaries for INTERNS! If you have a pulse and a GED, they will pay you to walk around after someone. Makes it a bit hard for us to retain or hire talent. Projects coming at us despite having spent $0 on marketing (exempt the boat ;-) since 2013, hiring staff, dealing with customer expectations.... Ohh yes - I decided to buy a house too. Closing dragged out as my lease was expiring, which nearly gave me an ulcer. Now, 4 months later, I am considering to put out a hit on my home inspector... What started as a "let's paint and redo the carpet" has turned into a complete remodel. Refinishing oak floors, practically new walls, baseboard, cedar-lining 2 closets, existing framing necessitating some custom doors to be made, full bathroom, complete kitchen, updated the electrical, canned lights throughout and then the wettest October on record made a swimming pool of my basement. And yes, I got to weld!!

 

You asked...

 

Per the paid boating outings: Being in Seattle and a coed younger crew, we get a lot of lookie-loos wanting a free boat ride on sunny summer days and drink my beer. Seattle attracts a lot summer interns, temp workers and so on. Crap gets broken, things go overboard, etc. I don't need to tell anyone here what owning a crewed boat entails. After a summer of catering to and entertaining fair-weather sailors, I decided to make greenhorns put some skin in the game. If people come with a solid reference of crewing on another boat, race background, or even ASA103, they are welcomed free of charge. Although I do not offer any kind of certificate, people have told me that they got a hell of a lot more sailing per dollar with us than with the local clubs. And if the greenhorn wants to stick around, and shows some aptitude, I am more than happy for them to come out with us without payment. I've done this for 2 summers now and it worked great to filter out the types that just waste our time. The cash buys beer.

 

The pic you guys dug up is classic! The 'happy' guy on the right is Matt who's been with me the longest of anyone and keeps coming out for some reason.

 

In other news, we entered Foulweather Bluff race last October. We had an amazingly good start, but the bottom on the boat had not been cleaned since the repairs done last May - I just didnt have time to dive her. A few bad sail changes later, we were running with the oldest sail on my boat - the .85 chute, which tore a 6ft x 6in hole in it. By the time we got that mess on deck, I did not feel like blowing up our new light chute, so we went under genoa for the very long down-wind leg. We were the last boat across the half-way mark. On the upwind tack we made up a lot of ground, out-pointed most of the field and had quite a few boats behind us at the finish. On corrected time, we did however DFL, which is our first...

 

I registered and was really looking forward to the RTC. But work had picked up. We had not had a practice in some time. One of my main guys was hit with a kidney stone and could not make it. A few others bailed out due to work obligations. I was going to Grenada the following weekend and taking 4 days off work at that juncture was really tough. The boat too was in no shape to go and my crew failed to show on 'prep day' due again to work. At that point I called it off.

 

We did not enter Winter Vashon, for the first time since I've owned the boat. This has been the most miserable race of the year for us every time I've entered it. Long delivery, to the most boring marina I've seen in our state, cold, rain and last year no wind. Today, we went out there with full crew just to tool around while the Vashon racers were making their circle. From the pics, it looked awesome! We had a great practice though.

 

The boat needs a new bottom really bad. I tried to swing that as part of my grounding repair, but the yard wanted an additional $20k!! Probably going to scrape it off myself this spring - so look for more posts from me with stupid questions soon.

 

By the way, you old curmudgeons are still my heroes. I tell people regularly that I would be less impressed by seeing a dude walking on water than I am by a certain one of your member who races single-handed with a full symmetrical dip-pole chute and spanks not only everyone in his class, but usually the vast majority of the 100+boat field; on a regular basis. If $100 would get me on his boat again, I would take the opportunity in a heartbeat!

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Butcher's Bill was a bit north of $7k. I feel confident that they inspected the boat very thoroughly - the yard has a good reputation here. The job entailed re-leading, fairing and paint. People in the know told me that this had to be the 'insurance rate' as similar damage on other boats was addressed for under $2k of 'poket cash'. But it was the peak of the season and frankly I am out of my depth with something like this. Insurance covered most of it without question - cut a check before I even had time to ask for it. Written survey of the damage states absolutely zero loss of integrity and the boat is 'good as new'. And I just got my insurance renewal papers - $550/yr, same as last year.

 

7K for a keel fairing job and inspection? Unless I'm missing something... I'm in the wrong market. For about 7K we would strip, fair and epoxy your entire bottom. Glad to hear your boat survived fairly unscathed!

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20k for a bottom job! What are they painting with gold leaf? A good race bottom would maybe run 10k for a 35 footer, and that is fully decked out smooth as a baby's ass job. Seriously, 20k WTF.

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We did not enter Winter Vashon, for the first time since I've owned the boat. This has been the most miserable race of the year for us every time I've entered it. Long delivery, to the most boring marina I've seen in our state, cold, rain and last year no wind. Today, we went out there with full crew just to tool around while the Vashon racers were making their circle. From the pics, it looked awesome! We had a great practice though.

 

Too bad you did not race Winter Vashon. The winds were great and we completed the 30 miles in just under 5 hours. Had a fast run up Colvos Pass with the pole back and heading straight toward the mark. Had a good beat back and lost to the first place boat by 1-1/2 minutes and beat the third boat by 2 seconds. We had our own J35 class this year.
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GW - I'll try to make it out next year. The last 2 were so miserable! I was still jet-lagged from my trip and the boat needs a scraping big time.

 

Per $20k bottom job - I too thought it was insane. That was on top of the $8k initial bid for the keel job. However, they are by all recommendations, the best shop in the area and they stay busy. Some things that might factor in the price is the over-active environmentalist contingent here in Seattle. A surprising number of locals seem to feel that the best thing that can be done for the planet, is to remove all traces of human activity from it. I am all for the environment doing things that really do make sense, like banning CFC's. But the default standpoint of many do-gooders now is not only to stop people from doing things proven to be bad, but stopping everyone from doing anything that is not proven to be 100% environment-neutral. I know the local shops deal with a lot of frivolous BS as a result.

 

They are saying this is the reason that I am getting some noticeable flaking. They also said that they cannot identify what it is that I have on there now and without knowing what's there, they cannot apply something compatible over it. I would have thought that the industry would have some method to test existing paint, but I am being told that this is not a thing that exists... Another thing mentioned to me was that my bottom may currently have layers of incompatible paint applied. I have zero knowledge of my boat ever being in freshwater, but they are telling me that one of the layers is not salt-rated. So everything has to come off down to the gelcoat. The $20k was to strip everything and do regular (non-race) paint.

 

Sounded insane, so I have to either shop it around, or do it myself.

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Your bottom had way too many layers of paint buildup. Doesn't matter if you knew what was on it or not it has to be stripped to do it right.

 

Around here, we have guys who will corn husk blast the bottom for around $400+ for a 35 footer.(I was quoted that for my 34)

 

Might be your best bet as its a dirty nasty job.

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Where is "Around here"?

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