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Navman/Northstar 3100/310 paddle wheel! Kiwi help?


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So I'm appealing to anyone who might have an old Navman/Northstar 3100/310 speed paddlewheel. For a week my speedo has read zero, I figured it was fouled and went to clean it on Sat but the wheel is gone, the pin and hub are there, but the wheel itself is AWOL.

 

I've tried everywhere to find one, Navico, Gemeco, eBay, CL, etc. etc.Does anyone have one or a source or any leads on where I might find one? It's a shot in the dark I know but with all the failed displays out there, there has to be a mountain of transducers and paddle wheels. I'd like to keep this stuff going for a little while longer.

 

Any and all help would be appreciated.

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Yeah, since I work with reading proximity sensors and other industrial sensors I was thinking the same thing. Airmar makes ~90% of the speed transducers however it appears the Navman speed 'ducer was not made by them and actually made in NZ and is the 10% outliers. Since the technology is pretty elementary and I doubt Navman invented a whole new technology but is like the rest of the 90% of the 'ducers made it merely has a magnet and a sensor to count the revolutions. I was going to raid a supply of Raymarine parts and test to see what kind I would get using an alien paddlewheel. I hesitate to say it, but I may for the first time ever bring my 'sillyscope to the boat and see what I can see.

 

I first imagined a pile of useless Navman/Northstart gear waiting to be plundered. Thats proven not to be the case.

 

I most likely will chuck it all and go with B&G Tritons over the winter but am very biased against any Navico product given the wonderful experience being a Navman early adopter.

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I've spent hours on this, no the 3100/310 speed transducers are not Airmar parts. A call to Airmar to a person recommended by someone at Gemeco (they sell almost all kinds of transducers) confirmed it. The picture you show above is not the 3100/3100 and is not the same size and will not fit in the exiting hole (according to Airmar, they have a great cross reference tool on their site, I also called to confirm). And the paddle wheels were sourced only from a single place in NZ (they may have be manufactured elsewhere, but I've not gotten past this point).

 

I've spent way too much time on this, but Navico, Airmar, and Gemeco all have been helpful, but to no avail.

 

I'm still hoping for a dead unit to pop up somewhere.

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Mine started life as a Navman 3100 system. As all the displays failed within warranty they were swapped out. 3 out of 4 failed again. Swapped out again, this time, again gratis for the Northstar 310's. So the 'ducers are Navman parts. The depth IS an Airmar part, the speed is not. The hole is different size that the later ones or so I have been told. I am going to mic them tomorrow.

 

Since I work with industrial sensors I am guessing the paddle wheel is just a magnet that has a prox sensor counting revs. I may get the Airmar 6 blade paddle wheel and see what happens. I think it's worth a $30 shot.

 

I've put so much time into the stuff, I can repair the displays and have replaced the Hall sensors in the wind wand I want to keep it going, like that old Nova with 225K miles.

 

Not really, I do want Tritons and full NMEA2K system. But spending more money with Navico after they killed off Navman/Northstar is sort of a drag.

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Everything I have is networked so I can have it show GPS speed. Since I race in an area where currents are key, I have the BSP display right above the Multi I have showing SOG (or WVC (VMG)) so I can see in real time the current effect. I am a gizmo sailor. I calibrate the BSP constantly so I have it pretty close to actual speed thru the water most of the time.

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I actually do have one but it reads eratically or not at all, I don't remember. I think it may be the same problem as the other one I have, the Hall effect sensor is probably bad. The on the top of my mast is reading sporadically and I was planning on pulling the mast and reworking both over the winter.

 

You will need the Wind 3100 to decode the signal from the wind transducer tho I believe. The processing is done in the head unit. I have at least 2 or 3 of these, but none work correctly. One has no NMEA out, and I have an analog 3150 that the LCD doesn't read. Another analog 3150 I have in pieces I was trying to repair the LCD display but the zebra stripe fix doesn't work on the analog units so it will be scrapped.

 

One of the displays would be fine IF it processes the signal you could read it on the Multi display. But I'm not sure any of the wind displays works correctly,

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BUMP! C'mon, there has to be one out there somewhere..

 

I took an old Airmar wheel from my Marina's scrap pile. It was a 4 blade, not a six like the original. It was also larger in diameter than the original and narrower. I tried it out. It would not spin freely BUT it did register speed on the display. I stuck it in hoping the hydro effect would spin it but no such luck.

 

So not I need a smaller wheel. I estimate the wheel diameter to be 1 7/8"? I can get a similar looking wheel from Airmar but it's for the Navman high speed transducer, 50 kts is mentioned in the catalog. It looks similar to the original but I cannot find any specs on it.

 

So am I correct there is a Hall effect sensor just reading revs and if I could find a compatible size wheel I might be good? I'm thinking since an old scrap wheel registered speed I may be good to go if I can fit one.

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Yes absolutely. I will send you a PM. What do you want for it? The extra wind wand I had is totally non functional and I cut the wire right at the mast mount block to make a bench test fixture for the wind wand 2 years ago when I replaced the Hall sensors in mine. I may have spare displays, I got good at fixing the missing digit displays, I can poke around and see what I still have, I sold and given a lot away.

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Hi Drew

I don't want anything for it ' my display is fine my problem is the wind transducer but to be honest I haven't even looked at it ' could be a dry joint .

Anyway I have your address and I will send it off today.

Good luck with it it should be ok though , I put it near my compass and the compass went crazy.

 

Al

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  • 1 year later...

I had the same problem: pin and hub still on the transom transducer, but no paddle wheel.  I think it's been like that for some time.

So I designed and 3D printed one: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2824820

You'll need some tiny, cheap magnets from Amazon (or wherever) to superglue in the holes.  I've yet to test it on the water (too cold) but it registers when it freely spins, so please use at your own risk!

Martin

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  • 6 months later...

I know this is an old thread but still hoping you and Neil G (Netanya) still have a passion for Navman. I have a three Mast head units and three Head units and on each of them I can't get a speed reading.

I have used Neil's magnificent circuit diagram to get one mast head unit to fix the direction problem but I'm having trouble determining the speed fault. 

Of the two I have at home one is the circular disc style mentioned in Neil's post and the other is a more modern style as shown in the pictures. I think this one was working but I spiked the speed Hall effect transistor (bottom right of second picture) when trying to take a voltage reading. I replaced it but now no speed. Could you or Neil if he is following this thread advise of the voltage I should be expecting on the blue wire and the variance +/-.

I am having trouble sourcing the switching Diodes A6w and A7w (BAV99) or at least in quantities less than a 1000 here in Australia.

Any insights gratefully accepted

Regards,

David

20180901_211025.jpg

20180901_211036.jpg

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  • 5 months later...
  • 3 weeks later...

If there's need, I have a Navman 3100 speed log, depth, and wind plus a repeater that I'm replacing.  I used to have a new-in-the-box depth 3100 sitting around as a spare, but I think I discarded during a purge a year or so ago.

  Anyway, if someone wants replacemnts/spares for their 3100 setup, make me an offer.  Heck, I've still got the manuals!

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On ‎4‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 7:59 PM, SVArcturus said:

If there's need, I have a Navman 3100 speed log, depth, and wind plus a repeater that I'm replacing.  I used to have a new-in-the-box depth 3100 sitting around as a spare, but I think I discarded during a purge a year or so ago.

  Anyway, if someone wants replacemnts/spares for their 3100 setup, make me an offer.  Heck, I've still got the manuals!

 

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On 4/29/2019 at 7:37 AM, Hakuna Matata said:

SVArcturus, do you have the masthead wand for the wind instrument?

I believe I do, but I'll have to check.  I took the mast down last year (I'm doing a major refit), so the masthead unit should be around here somewhere.

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Inspecting the bottom, I found our NorthStar S310 is missing one blade on the paddle.  I've looked high and low for a replacement and have come up dry.  I could connect the head unit to the GPS to get GPS boatspeed, but I like both hull speed and GPS speed to know when I am in current and should go for deeper or shallower water.

If anyone has the paddle / transducer / propeller / impeller for sale let's make a deal.

 

DSC02528.JPG

DSC02530.JPG

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This might be the same one I 3D printed (above post from Mar 2018).  Mine was absent, except for the plastic cylinder and metal spindle in the middle, and I failed to find one to buy.  The shape was a complete guess and I had to redesign a few times for the orientation of the small magnets but I eventually got it to register rotation. 

I tested it in the water last summer against GPS and (surprisingly) it works perfectly.  With no damage after a season.

Regards,

Martin

 

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2824820

Selection_001.png.1925b79aae31a677eeb64382f58853ef.png

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I searched high and low for one and was getting ready to pull the whole thing out. I tried a few different ones that were close in size from the junk (spares) pile at the Marina I keep my boat to no avail. As I recall the assembly was not made by Airmar like the rest of the industry and is nearly impossible to find.

I lucked out tho here on SA when an Aussie had a brand new one and sent it to me for free. Saved me a bunch. I sent him an old (but never worn) Figawi hat and he was very thankful for that. So keep on looking. I was within inches of buying B&G's this year so I would have given you mine but I'm stringing it along another year or so.

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On 4/9/2019 at 1:49 AM, patcda said:

 

I have all the instruments speed depth and wind, if you didn't get any joy out of SV Arcturus let me know, I am in Queensland Australia, if that is any help.

Regards,

David.

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  • 3 months later...
On 5/10/2019 at 9:46 PM, Hakuna Matata said:

I have all the instruments speed depth and wind, if you didn't get any joy out of SV Arcturus let me know, I am in Queensland Australia, if that is any help.

Regards,

David.

Hi David and others

I have a Northstar Explorer M310. The eight-blade paddle wheel has disappeared and I’m having trouble finding parts. Not sure if it is possible to get a replacement paddle wheel or full sensor plug that would be compatible with the display unit?

Attached is a pic of the manual showing wheel and full plug. Any advice on compatible replacement parts much appreciated.

Andy

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  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks Jmartyg!

Yes, I came to the same conclusion and purchased the Plastimo/AdvanSea 40640. It produces the same electrical output signals (so is compatible with the display), but its diameter is a few mm bigger than my Northstar M310 through-hull sensor plug. Maybe the diameter is the same as the 3100 though. Anyway, I had to sand it’s diameter down a mm or two and use smaller o-rings to get it to insert. Also, the insertion depth of the plug has to be checked, because it can protrude too much or not enough as there is no preset end-stop using this plug. Once modified, it worked well (see pic - sanded down diameter with o-rings removed).

Because I was only missing the paddle wheel, another approach is to just get a Plastimo 40640 paddle wheel and adapt the Northstar sensor plug to accept it. The Plastimo paddle wheel looks quite different but its design locks onto the passing water better than the Northstar paddle wheel design, so it measures speed more accurately without using calibration scaling. Fitting it requires modifying the Navman/Northstar sensor plug paddle wheel shaft mount by carefully shaping/removing some material so that it accepts the Plastimo wheel and allows it to spin freely. It works well and I found it an easier mod to do (and cheaper) than reducing the diameter of the full new Plastimo sensor plug.

In summary, I now have two working speed sensors, both of which are compatible with Plastimo replaceable paddle wheels. If you’re just missing the paddle wheel, it is cheapest and easiest to just to get a replacement Plastimo 40640 paddle wheel and adapt the Northstar/Navman sensor plug to accept it.

Cheers,

Andy

 

67FF211B-097A-4609-9A9E-A9B9796C839A.jpeg

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  • 1 year later...

Kapiti, 30mins north of Wellington, New Zealand. This guy prints them. $60NZD

https://kapiti3d.com/paddlewheel-navman-3100-speed-transducer/

 

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