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OK...so I've nearly sobered up... and want to say a few things to the SA team that have followed the Voodoo story. Firstly  - Thank you for your support and input! From the outset I've put though

I was on shore for my live interview show, and then live with the ABC Grandstand radio for the start.  Channel 7 has full rights to all live vision - so there was really no point going on the wat

I have received dozen emails/private messages about my tracker for this year. I have updated to new Windy version and I hope it will work on boxing day https://gis.ee/sh/

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41 minutes ago, us7070 said:

it's easy to check that you are transmitting AIS

I have the GME unit set up as a black box which just outputs a nmea feed to a laptop. So no ability to change settings on the fly. Nor can i see any lights on the unit as it is out of sight.

I have only checked AIS by the simple expedient of calling another boat to ask if they can see me... perhaps not something Id do in a race. It never occured to me to use any online source to check while on the boat, which is stupid of me as I do it all the time at home.

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7 minutes ago, Se7en said:

I have the GME unit set up as a black box which just outputs a nmea feed to a laptop. So no ability to change settings on the fly. Nor can i see any lights on the unit as it is out of sight.

I have only checked AIS by the simple expedient of calling another boat to ask if they can see me... perhaps not something Id do in a race.

No one carries a mobile phone?

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I just spent two hours trying to read faster than you blokes can write.

Thank Christ someone started a new thread.

It's like running up the down escalator.

Plenty of wind here now, NW gusting forties.

I see Tasman Island had NW gusting 66 knots earlier.

That must be fun around Cape Raoul.

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8 minutes ago, paps49 said:

He should be flicked for not reading the SI's then, it's in his job description as Skipper.

No argument from me on that. At best he is a bit arrogant and incompetant, and gets let off with a warning. At worst it was deliberate cheating, boat is DSQ and MR faces a 69 hearing.

Do you think MR will fall on his sword to try and spare any penalty for the boat?

I feel for the crew, being on a motorboat with a skipper who is either incompetant or a cheat. Hard to keep your head high at shippies.

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4 hours ago, random said:

Just saw the news and I am pleasantly surprised about the protest.

Sailing needs to be kept as clean as possible.  The job the PC has should be relatively simple but the pressure on all concerned is something no one needs.

For something like this to happen two years in a row, it indicates a culture common to bully boys used to having the best toy in the sandpit, unable to deal with competition and not expecting to be held to the same standards as the other kids, surprised and indignant when they are.

MR's behavior when they were penalised last year was disgraceful, this year to claim it was their 10th LH win was also disgraceful and would have no doubt pissed-off all concerned at the organising authority in Hobart.  Let's see what the stupid fuk says this time.

Is this the same Random? And I don't mean to sound sarcastic or condescending mate. 

Brilliantly put. Sailing does indeed need to be as clean as possible or we risk running into the same crap as soccer's diving, cycling's drug reputation, athletics doping and the varied troubles of so many other sports.

When asked 'why sailing' I always used to say "Because the right sort of people go sailing!" - And in the main that is still the case but when people break rules and then are arrogant in their attitude when challenged it needs to be brought to a solid and rapid halt.

Of course we still have the hearing to come but it WAS in the SI's. I don't know about anyone else but whether competing, umpiring or judging the second thing I always do is read the SIs (1st thing is read the NoR).

Those are the basic RULES of the regatta along with the RRS and competitors should be expected - by their fellow competitors as well as the OA - to follow them all.

Anyway we should know not too long after 1300 Aussie time.

 

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Another way I've checked the quality of the cabling and antenna (which confirms in parallel AIS can get out) is by using DSC on the VHF to query other boats

AS US said, it's as simple as removing the filter as a go to solution, and there are more and more ways to check your signal is going out the more you think about it..

 

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4 minutes ago, Se7en said:

No argument from me on that. At best he is a bit arrogant and incompetant, and gets let off with a warning. At worst it was deliberate cheating, boat is DSQ and MR faces a 69 hearing.

Do you think MR will fall on his sword to try and spare any penalty for the boat?

I feel for the crew, being on a motorboat with a skipper who is either incompetant or a cheat. Hard to keep your head high at shippies.

As I said in the other thread Richo would do his reputation a power of good if he offered up a mea culpa at 1300 but I'm not holding my breath.

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4 minutes ago, shanghaisailor said:

Is this the same Random? And I don't mean to sound sarcastic or condescending mate. 

Brilliantly put. Sailing does indeed need to be as clean as possible or we risk running into the same crap as soccer's diving, cycling's drug reputation, athletics doping and the varied troubles of so many other sports.

 

 

 

 

I know right!

I hit the like button instinctively  but thankfully my cup was empty!!

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I'm not sure if this has been already noted but I do find it weird that on MarineTraffic (a web based AIS tracker), WOXI was shown a last known position early this morning as in Sydney harbour. And the time of the last known position....2018-12-26 11:08

Later this morning It got an update from Hobart 2018-12-29 09:49...makes me think the jury is testing it or someone finally fixed it.

 

Timing is a bit sus though.

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7 minutes ago, shanghaisailor said:

Is this the same Random? And I don't mean to sound sarcastic or condescending mate. 

Brilliantly put. Sailing does indeed need to be as clean as possible or we risk running into the same crap as soccer's diving, cycling's drug reputation, athletics doping and the varied troubles of so many other sports.

When asked 'why sailing' I always used to say "Because the right sort of people go sailing!" - And in the main that is still the case but when people break rules and then are arrogant in their attitude when challenged it needs to be brought to a solid and rapid halt.

Of course we still have the hearing to come but it WAS in the SI's. I don't know about anyone else but whether competing, umpiring or judging the second thing I always do is read the SIs (1st thing is read the NoR).

Those are the basic RULES of the regatta along with the RRS and competitors should be expected - by their fellow competitors as well as the OA - to follow them all.

Anyway we should know not too long after 1300 Aussie time.

 

Random and BJ are both from Queensland ...

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11 minutes ago, Se7en said:

No argument from me on that. At best he is a bit arrogant and incompetant, and gets let off with a warning. At worst it was deliberate cheating, boat is DSQ and MR faces a 69 hearing.

Do you think MR will fall on his sword to try and spare any penalty for the boat?

I feel for the crew, being on a motorboat with a skipper who is either incompetant or a cheat. Hard to keep your head high at shippies.

That's not the way protest hearings work - or at least should work

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11 hours ago, PITA said:

Not sure it's a comparable sitch...?  Not a fan of either but wasn't at least one a gear failure?

But, anyhoo - I don't agree with it... but don't they allow them to go black in the VOR to gain tactical advantage?  Seem to remember that when I was following SCA.

Anyway, I'm off for a QLS tomorrow with blokes who got a helicopter ride home 20 years ago so I doubt anyone will be feeling sympathetic if there's a protest where there's the possibility of a safety issue.

Hi PITA

Something niggled at me overnight and I went back to check the VOR SIs for the latest race.

SIs 27.11 States "The AIS shall remain powered on and transmitting at all times when Racing."

When a boat "went stealth" it was their 6 hourly update on the VOR Website that wasn't made public, not their AIS. 

So my original statement was correct that the VOR AIS was ALWAYS ON!

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4 hours ago, axolotl said:

I strongly suggest not testing transmit power using an SWR meter without having an antenna (or dummy load) connected.  It's quite possible you'll  damage the device.

I would also strongly suggest no one use my couple of lines in post as instructions for testing VHF power loss.

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19 minutes ago, olaf hart said:

Random and BJ are both from Queensland ...

So you think that matters?

I have met Squark a few times but my home state has got nothing to do with it.

I just hate cheats.  Particularly repeat cheats.

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40 minutes ago, Se7en said:

I have the GME unit set up as a black box which just outputs a nmea feed to a laptop. So no ability to change settings on the fly. Nor can i see any lights on the unit as it is out of sight.

I have only checked AIS by the simple expedient of calling another boat to ask if they can see me... perhaps not something Id do in a race. It never occured to me to use any online source to check while on the boat, which is stupid of me as I do it all the time at home.

as i have said elsewhere - on your boat, the display of your own AIS icon on your chartplotter or nav computer is turned off by an MMSI filter.

you can turn off that filter.., and your AIS icon will be displayed.., and you will know that you are transmitting AIS

 

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51 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

 

Lot of ignorance on this subject so maybe a helpful interlude. AIS transmissions are received direct by a low orbit geostationary satellite. No special gear required. VHF transmission is restricted to line of sight so to curvature of the earth. Into space no such restriction except straight line distance.

Just to add on this - Marine Traffic will show positions sourced both from land stations and from satellites, but you only get the satellite data if you buy their super duper subscription. Plus I have seen instances where their updates on land based sources is less than fresh. 

 

I would point at Just a Skosh's data source as being much better 

 

As an aside, the Pineapple Cup has it as optional now, as does Bermuda 1-2.  The RdR had it as required and everybody was transmitting. The RC would have time penalized the crap out of a bn out that did not. Oh, and they required that we leave our AIS turned on at the dock on Saint Malo for a day of two before the start so they could validate its function. Jo excuses. 

When the SIs have it as optional, I typically keep it TX in bad weather, low viz, and / or high traffic areas, as well as when shorthanded and sleeping. The rest of the time the TX is off. If the race requires it, then it is TX all the time. 

As for another comment about commercial traffic filtering out B signals,  that has not been my experience at all. 

In my opinion, it should be a hefty time penalty. And a Rule 69 flick for skipper and navigator if it can be proven it was actual premeditated cheating. 

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4 minutes ago, us7070 said:

you can turn off that filter.., and your AIS icon will be displayed.., and you will know that you are transmitting AIS

To be clear, that may show that your AIS TX is enabled but it doesn't mean that it is working properly, does it? 

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2 minutes ago, weightless said:

To be clear, that may show that your AIS TX is enabled but it doesn't mean that it is working properly, does it? 

no - Tx could be on but not functioning

given that it was functioning right before the race.., and that they were receiving the whole race.., it seems more likely that Tx got turned off, than that Tx malfunctioned.

i'm not sure, b ut i have read that Tx was functioning after the race, which would seem to be nearly conclusive evidence that it wasn't a malfunction

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12 minutes ago, us7070 said:

you can turn off that filter.., and your AIS icon will be displayed.., and you will know that you are transmitting AIS

I understand this.

I was just commenting that in my particular installation, control of the AIS is via a USB connection, which is not connected by default. So I have no ability to change config on the fly as you suggest. Hence the use of the term 'black box AIS'. I have also not connected a tx on/off switch as I have no plans to cruise past Somalia.

I need to remove cabinetry to get to my AIS unit, which is a bit annoying. Hence I just check with other boats that it is working. Or will now go online since that has been correctly pointed out as easier.

(That is supposed to be the standard way to set up a GME AIS, as there is an issue with leaving the ground in the USB connection connected to ship ground via a PC.)

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14 minutes ago, Se7en said:

I understand this.

I was just commenting that in my particular installation, control of the AIS is via a USB connection, which is not connected by default. So I have no ability to change config on the fly as you suggest. Hence the use of the term 'black box AIS'. I have also not connected a tx on/off switch as I have no plans to cruise past Somalia.

I need to remove cabinetry to get to my AIS unit, which is a bit annoying. Hence I just check with other boats that it is working. Or will now go online since that has been correctly pointed out as easier.

(That is supposed to be the standard way to set up a GME AIS, as there is an issue with leaving the ground in the USB connection connected to ship ground via a PC.)

i get it...

i don't know the particulars of your setup.. but if, like a lot of boats, you have navico AIS and a gofree (wifi 1)wifi unit, you can make a wifi websocket connection to the AIS and configure it with a web browser, without the usb cable. i'm sure other hardware works too for that.., but that's the gear i have used

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10 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Xmas & New Year to you RM. You recovered and got the boat home?

And to you, Jack. 

 

Fully recovered and buried in the day job. The boat is sitting in Key West, waiting for the Pineapple Cup in late January. I have a short list of things to do,  headed down there in a week or two for a couple of days to do some sorting. 

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2 years in a row, WOXI either disregards or does not know the rules.  If you recall, a few years ago in rough weather in the Hobart, WOXI was speaking to a helicopter regarding safety and WOXI asked "what sail does the boat ahead have up"?   There was an inquiry and the story was that the WOXI radio person was a sailmaker concerned about his customer and his sail."

A few years before that when they used SSB radios for the check in at Eden, there was another issue with WOXI not communicating.    So this makes one ponder...…...

WHAT OTHER RULES HAX WOXI BREACHED OVER THE YEARS THAT WERE NEVER CAUGHT????

Here in So Cal, we have a race called the Islands Race.   RC had same requirement on AIS and the boat that finished first was not transmitting at a critical time of the race in the lee of San Clemente Island.  They were protested and lost.  DSQ.   Should be same result in SH race.

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3 hours ago, hoppy said:

from this mornings CYCA news

 

 

3 hours ago, hoppy said:
  Quote

In other news, Triton is the latest yacht to finish the race. Owned by David Gotze and Michael Cranitch, the LC60’s crew includes Tony ‘Ace’ Ellis, who has just sailed his 51st Sydney Hobart, equalling Tony Cable’s record for the most races by an individual. Still at sea is LeeAnn Lynch’s Relish IV, with Bill Ratcliff sailing his 50th race.

And while Alive is waving the banner for Tasmania, spare a thought for fellow Tasmanian entry, 2 Unlimited. She was hit by a sunfish yesterday afternoon along the Tasmanian Coast and retired, making a total of seven retirements from the race. The Farr 40 recently purchased and modified for offshore racing by gun sailor, Greg ‘Enzo’ Prescott, was a solid bet for the overall win.

Bullshit.  

"Man bites Dog".

In other news, reports just in confirm that WOXI was struck by malicious Sunfish with Indian tattoo, which caused the AIS to malfunction. Richards, receives full pardon and new 100 footer for next year.

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Thanks for the pics @hoppy

I don't think you are going to eliminate WOXI protest talk from the thread though..  As much a part of the race as the smaller boats much as I enjoy following, reading of and seeing pics of them.

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10 minutes ago, hoppy said:

Oh, so you find news on other pages?  What a fucking Legend.

The sports categories are there for you anytime you want to check.

Sailing ain't on it.

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18 minutes ago, hoppy said:

I wonder what happened with the First 47.7 as it's trailing the fleet 15 nm behind Gun Runner?

Have a look at their track, it almost looks like a man overboard course.

Chutzpah first little boat, (can't believe 40's are now little boats). Congratulations.

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Talking little boats, which was the first boat home which did not have the motor going the whole way to keep the keel and/or winches moving?  Seems as though if it is easy to bump a switch to turn off the AIS is would also be easy to bump the switch which engages the propeller. Not sailing.

 

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7 minutes ago, Phil S said:

Talking little boats, which was the first boat home which did not have the motor going the whole way to keep the keel and/or winches moving?  Seems as though if it is easy to bump a switch to turn off the AIS is would also be easy to bump the switch which engages the propeller. Not sailing.

 

Mills 78 prospector

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19 minutes ago, bayboy said:

Even this is a record for a yacht going home so early with half the fleet still to finish.

There was the year Oats was beaten (by Loyal/Maximus I think), she only docked long enough to swap crew and sails and was gone in a few hours.

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16 minutes ago, ALL@SEA said:

Impossible to see,  but they've gone for a reef. She'll have great conditions once she's around the Pot in about 10m.

20181229_132525.jpg

Blowing SW30+ in Dover right now. A quick trip home for the Indian.

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6 minutes ago, ALL@SEA said:

There was the year Oats was beaten (by Loyal/Maximus I think), she only docked long enough to swap crew and sails and was gone in a few hours.

Thats half the issue with modern sailing in the 80's no one left until last boat was home even the internationals didnt leave, but we have seen the trend of yachts going home when the race is still going, each to their own I guess.

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1 hour ago, RealEstateBroker said:

2 years in a row, WOXI either disregards or does not know the rules.  If you recall, a few years ago in rough weather in the Hobart, WOXI was speaking to a helicopter regarding safety and WOXI asked "what sail does the boat ahead have up"?   There was an inquiry and the story was that the WOXI radio person was a sailmaker concerned about his customer and his sail."

A few years before that when they used SSB radios for the check in at Eden, there was another issue with WOXI not communicating.    So this makes one ponder...…...

WHAT OTHER RULES HAX WOXI BREACHED OVER THE YEARS THAT WERE NEVER CAUGHT????

Here in So Cal, we have a race called the Islands Race.   RC had same requirement on AIS and the boat that finished first was not transmitting at a critical time of the race in the lee of San Clemente Island.  They were protested and lost.  DSQ.   Should be same result in SH race.

It was Michael Coxon, North sails boss, who asked the helicopter about sail selections on another maxi. He was not on WO but on Loyal.

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2 minutes ago, bayboy said:

Thats half the issue with modern sailing in the 80's no one left until last boat was home even the internationals didnt leave, but we have seen the trend of yachts going home when the race is still going, each to their own I guess.

Everyone stayed for the  King of the Derwent, then there was a regatta at Nubeena (just around from Port Arthur), then the Crayfish Cup at Triabunna (inside Maria Island)... those were the days, well, so I've heard - I'd have just been a kid when those events begun to die.

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2 minutes ago, Trim On said:

Pittwater Coffs race done also?

That rings a bell, possibly she also set the quickest time between Sydney and Hobart (but in reverse) under sail, that stood until Langman's trimaran took the title.

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Everyone stayed for the  King of the Derwent, then there was a regatta at Nubeena (just around from Port Arthur), then the Crayfish Cup at Triabunna (inside Maria Island)... those were the days, well, so I've heard - I'd have just been a kid when those events begun to die.

 

and the Hobart Auckland race.

Did the Crayfish Cup one year and left with 72 dozen Cascade beer onboard a one tonner.

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6 minutes ago, ALL@SEA said:

Everyone stayed for the  King of the Derwent, then there was a regatta at Nubeena (just around from Port Arthur), then the Crayfish Cup at Triabunna (inside Maria Island)... those were the days, well, so I've heard - I'd have just been a kid when those events begun to die.

We used to get the IOR maxis loaded with kids just burning around the Derwent, many of those kids sail today but Langman was the last big boat to do that quite a few years ago.

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1 minute ago, SloopJohnB said:

Did the Crayfish Cup one year and left with 72 dozen Cascade beer onboard a one tonner.

Wasn't Bacardi, was it? Heard they left with a ton of beer, three up plus two female backpackers and still ran out half way home. Think they may even hada a stop-opver to replenish... so the story goes.

LoL

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4 minutes ago, hoppy said:

I don't see that, but the tracker does show her go into Eden. So that makes sense.

Sorry, I thought you were talking about the Bene 47 Chancellor, not Calypso, owned by Flying Fish, who retired and went to Eden.

 Maybe dropped some seasick punters off, and finishing the commitment to others.

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35 minutes ago, Phil S said:

Talking little boats, which was the first boat home which did not have the motor going the whole way to keep the keel and/or winches moving?  Seems as though if it is easy to bump a switch to turn off the AIS is would also be easy to bump the switch which engages the propeller. Not sailing.

 

Great post LOL!

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5 minutes ago, bayboy said:

We used to get the IOR maxis loaded with kids just burning around the Derwent, many of those kids sail today but Langman was the last big boat to do that quite a few years ago.

Langman also had a heap of kids aboard that day from memory, and destroyed most of his sails in a SW gale, finished under trysail and storm jib.

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1 minute ago, ALL@SEA said:

Langman also had a heap of kids aboard that day from memory, and destroyed most of his sails in a SW gale, finished under trysail and storm jib.

No, he started and finished under those sails. It was blowing 30 and he didn't want to risk the kids and other passengers. Most were from the Huon Yacht Club. Loyal sailed under HYC flag that year. Langman owned the pub at Kermandie (Port Huon).

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45 minutes ago, Phil S said:

Talking little boats, which was the first boat home which did not have the motor going the whole way to keep the keel and/or winches moving?  Seems as though if it is easy to bump a switch to turn off the AIS is would also be easy to bump the switch which engages the propeller. Not sailing.

 

Was it Couta on Voodoo or was Prospector a fixed keel?

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Fuck... it is the holidays over here. Is there a condensed version available? Can someone please condense the last 10 pages into a few sentences? Oats may have fucked up. Skip condemned them, like "so?". Arrogant? Fuck.. I'm lost. Help appreciated. FUs accepted. 

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9 hours ago, TPG said:

You demanded that all data be in expedition. Clearly you don't have all of it.

So back on topic and not "your particular data" the fact remains Ricko has made a couple colossally stupid statements two years in a row. Not sure even the old man's prior blessings will keep him employed with the Oatleys. He's doing just fine looking pretty in his Nantucket reds schtooping for Palm Beach Yachts though. Most if not all people who are shopping for those couldn't give a shit about a sailboat race.

You are an arse clown. Most OB owners I know also own race boats.

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1 hour ago, P_Wop said:

Protest dismissed.  WOXI walks.  See other thread

 

Which other thread for those of us who can't be arsed trawling through pages above here...

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30 minutes ago, Mad Mac said:

It was a bit obscure. :lol:

Not really. Protest was dismissed by PC. For a Protest to be heard it had to be lodged by the competitor, not RC protesting in response to competitor having a cry post race on national TV. Those are the rules. The question of whether WOXI infringed or not was never heard and determined.

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9 minutes ago, Kenny Dumas said:

Any other podium boats have AIS issues besides the super-cheater class?  A 4 th placer might feel justified in protesting them all. 

Nah as they know Oats was the true winner, but Kialoa still cuts a fine sight.....

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4 hours ago, P_Wop said:

Probably glanced at a reference while catchup reading three pages of occasionally irreverant comment...  You  get that when busy with a life outside the interweb...

4 hours ago, P_Wop said:

 

 

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11 hours ago, GBR562 said:

It's never a good time to be caught cheating.
Couple that with the reported arrogance of the "Red Team" around the dock and the skippers idiotic reply to reporters and suddenly being in Austrailia, right now is possibly the worse place to be.

Ring any bells cricket lovers ??

Australia is feeling really sore at the moment, and still reeling after the cheating scandal coupled with the reported arrogance and general "we dont give a shit" that their National Cricket team captain and a number of senior team mates have been found guilty of.
They are a proud nation and another arrogant cheat is exactly what they won't tollerate right now and the press may well have a field day.

Fuck off and have a warm beer you sad, shower dodging fuck.

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