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Corsair / Farrier 31 /9 variations


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I've decided to make the switch to a F/C31 after having an opportunity to sail aboard eric1207's boat. Now I'm just trying to sort through all the various models and decide which ones would work well here in the Puget Sound. I've looked at the various PHRF numbers but was hoping I might get some help here on what the variations mean in practical terms for the boat; such as shorter fixed vs rotating mast and inboard cassette vs the transom hung? 

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What’s your program?  Racing, cruising, a bit of both?  

In the Bay Area most boats that race are the F-31R rotating+extended mast version with transum hung rudders, rating -15 to +10 on PHRF. Fun boats to sail.  Interiors vary a lot, as do boat weights.  You probably want the R variants since you are in a light airs area.

F-9 / F-9R is homebuilt / kit version of the F-31R, as far as I know. But i’m no expert - there are good specs / materials online if you google. 

F-31-1D is the turbocharged version of the F-31R with a bigger mast, significantly faster (about -35 PHRF if I remember correctly).

 

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I own a rear cockpit 1995 Corsair F31, For solo sailing, I like the rear cockpit as it allows you to reach the outboard tiller for ease of maneuvering, I like the under slung rudder (we do encounter ventilation problems) as it allows the tiller to be forward of my (rear mounted) traveler, allowing to steer through a tack with your foot while tacking the jib, I have a 42'6" fixed mast, on OMR our rating system, we are quite competitive. Inside I like the pull out bed from under the cockpit floor as it makes a very roomy berth, the enclosed head offers good privacy as well. I don't like the lack of a (chart) table to eat at. 

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On 7/14/2018 at 10:59 PM, galacticair said:

What’s your program?  Racing, cruising, a bit of both?  

In the Bay Area most boats that race are the F-31R rotating+extended mast version with transum hung rudders, rating -15 to +10 on PHRF. Fun boats to sail.  Interiors vary a lot, as do boat weights.  You probably want the R variants since you are in a light airs area.

F-9 / F-9R is homebuilt / kit version of the F-31R, as far as I know. But i’m no expert - there are good specs / materials online if you google. 

F-31-1D is the turbocharged version of the F-31R with a bigger mast, significantly faster (about -35 PHRF if I remember correctly).

 

I'll be doing mostly cruising during the summer. In the winter I hope to do a fair number of distance races. I'm on the Puget Sound and it typically has winds on the lighter end of the spectrum. 

 

I'll keep and eye open for the R version. The taller mast part makes sense to me. I just could find much to hear if the shorter mast was stickier in the light breezes. 

On 7/15/2018 at 3:30 AM, Frassld said:

I own a rear cockpit 1995 Corsair F31, For solo sailing, I like the rear cockpit as it allows you to reach the outboard tiller for ease of maneuvering, I like the under slung rudder (we do encounter ventilation problems) as it allows the tiller to be forward of my (rear mounted) traveler, allowing to steer through a tack with your foot while tacking the jib, I have a 42'6" fixed mast, on OMR our rating system, we are quite competitive. Inside I like the pull out bed from under the cockpit floor as it makes a very roomy berth, the enclosed head offers good privacy as well. I don't like the lack of a (chart) table to eat at. 

What speeds do you typically start seeing the ventilation problems and how bad does it affect performance?

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What was written above seems to imply there are 3 lengths of masts.  I'm not the expert but AFAIK there are only 2 sizes; 40' on the fixed mast versions, and 42.5' on rotating ones.  I believe the R and D have the same height masts; 42.5'.  The difference may be in material, carbon vs alu. and I think there are different manufacturers of the carbon masts.  If you can get a hold of Martyn on the Yahoo site or he or others will likely set you straight.  Over the years there has been plenty of info on that site to answer all your questions. Unfortunately I know of no way to search subjects on Yahoo other than scrolling and reading endlessly.  

PS:  the R and or D versions have shorter and maybe lower cabins, so a detriment to cruising in PNW.   

The CC center cockpit with aft cabin has a pretty small cockpit but the aft cabin is a nice place to stick the kids in to keep an eye on while sailing or to make their own space when anchored.  IIRC smaller kids can crawl under the cockpit to reach the main cabin in case they need to stay connected to mom or come over for dinner, etc...

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I would say ventilation occurs when reaching (in the high teens) with the main over sheeted, the boat just keeps going straight with no steerage, a good wriggle of the rudder normally rectifies this, I have also lost steerage on F25 and F22 when pushed.

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I took some time to write out my limited take on the various models  of the Farrier 31 trimaran:   F9, F9A, F9AX and F31CC, AC, R, D, UC

Don’t know much about the F9s except that I think the X is a bit wider.  Most are home built.

Older F31s have 40’ non-rotating masts.  Some like this as its simpler to raise and lower the mast.  Newer ones have rotating 42.5’ masts = faster.  At 66 I don’t have problems raising/lowering my 42.5’ rotating mast single handed.  A bit of a lump in the throat and careful triple checking everything gets me thru.  Older F31’s have a rudder in a clumsy cassette in the aft part of the cockpit.  Quite quickly Ian decided to hang the rudder off the back  instead and these are desirable if for nothing else it is out of the way when the rudder is brought out of the water, which I do every nite.  Don’t confuse this with a true cassette rudder which is an aftermarket/custom thing and hangs off the back on pintels but instead of swinging up out of the water on a pivot bolt it simply lifts straight up thru a sleeve that is attached to the pintels, kind of like a dagger board.  This is more desireable as the boat can easily be steered in shallow water with the rudder partially lifted (vertically), out of its sleeve.  The pivot style can not be steered if it is not fully down because there is too much pressure on it.   Both will kick back if you hit something but the cassette one is not nearly as easy to put back in place as the pivot bolt style  

CC is center cockpit.  Small cockpit, bad for guests but they will likely be on the nets or sitting on the cabin top anyway.  Aft cabin is a great spot to keep and eye on the kids while sailing.  Kids can crawl thru to the main cabin if needed.  Cabins are somewhat separated, privacy.  I think the forward cabin is a bit smaller.  Doesn’t have the nice big pull out bed of the AC.  Both the aft cabin and the vee berth are small for a couple. 

AC is the aft cockpit.  Bigger cockpit,  big cabin, I really like the big pull out bed.  Has a real head that is ok for my 6’ frame, I don’t think it was any smaller than the luxurious Dragonfly 35 I toured.  This is the boat I bought mainly for those reasons. 

R and D are racier, may have smaller and lower cabins.  Very spartan ranging from nothing inside to portapottie with a curtain and tiny galley.  Might have carbon masts; pros and cons. 

UC  for Ultimate Cruiser.  Main difference is that this is usually an AC without the vee berth.  Instead there is a large head in the bow.  I think it wastes space and you don’t need it.  I’d rather have the AC’s  vee berth for guests or to use to store my 2 bikes.  Might be nice for a small segment of buyers who value a large head.  

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On ‎7‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 7:34 PM, eric1207 said:

I took some time to write out my limited take on the various models  of the Farrier 31 trimaran:   F9, F9A, F9AX and F31CC, AC, R, D, UC

Don’t know much about the F9s except that I think the X is a bit wider.  Most are home built.

Older F31s have 40’ non-rotating masts.  Some like this as its simpler to raise and lower the mast.  Newer ones have rotating 42.5’ masts = faster.  At 66 I don’t have problems raising/lowering my 42.5’ rotating mast single handed.  A bit of a lump in the throat and careful triple checking everything gets me thru.  Older F31’s have a rudder in a clumsy cassette in the aft part of the cockpit.  Quite quickly Ian decided to hang the rudder off the back  instead and these are desirable if for nothing else it is out of the way when the rudder is brought out of the water, which I do every nite.  Don’t confuse this with a true cassette rudder which is an aftermarket/custom thing and hangs off the back on pintels but instead of swinging up out of the water on a pivot bolt it simply lifts straight up thru a sleeve that is attached to the pintels, kind of like a dagger board.  This is more desireable as the boat can easily be steered in shallow water with the rudder partially lifted (vertically), out of its sleeve.  The pivot style can not be steered if it is not fully down because there is too much pressure on it.   Both will kick back if you hit something but the cassette one is not nearly as easy to put back in place as the pivot bolt style  

CC is center cockpit.  Small cockpit, bad for guests but they will likely be on the nets or sitting on the cabin top anyway.  Aft cabin is a great spot to keep and eye on the kids while sailing.  Kids can crawl thru to the main cabin if needed.  Cabins are somewhat separated, privacy.  I think the forward cabin is a bit smaller.  Doesn’t have the nice big pull out bed of the AC.  Both the aft cabin and the vee berth are small for a couple. 

AC is the aft cockpit.  Bigger cockpit,  big cabin, I really like the big pull out bed.  Has a real head that is ok for my 6’ frame, I don’t think it was any smaller than the luxurious Dragonfly 35 I toured.  This is the boat I bought mainly for those reasons. 

R and D are racier, may have smaller and lower cabins.  Very spartan ranging from nothing inside to portapottie with a curtain and tiny galley.  Might have carbon masts; pros and cons. 

UC  for Ultimate Cruiser.  Main difference is that this is usually an AC without the vee berth.  Instead there is a large head in the bow.  I think it wastes space and you don’t need it.  I’d rather have the AC’s  vee berth for guests or to use to store my 2 bikes.  Might be nice for a small segment of buyers who value a large head.  

Thanks for the break down Eric.... I it gets tempting when there are some good deals on the fixed mast versions/earlier versions out there but I think I'll wait the course and try to find the taller rotating mast and later style rudder.

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On ‎7‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 4:49 AM, Frassld said:

I would say ventilation occurs when reaching (in the high teens) with the main over sheeted, the boat just keeps going straight with no steerage, a good wriggle of the rudder normally rectifies this, I have also lost steerage on F25 and F22 when pushed.

thanks for the info on this

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OK I owned an 89, F27 for 20 years sailed on another F28R for awhile and now own a '92 kiwi built duracore epoxy F9A with aft cabin guess its basically an ultimate cruiser with 40' fixed mast and super deluxe interior w propane, heated water shower and nice head.  The wife actually likes sailing and cruising on it!! a big plus.

The F27 was much easier to assemble and disassemble the F28R with Omohundro carbon mast was super easy and really fun to sail as it always felt really lose and fast.

Sailed on a few F31 cruisers like mine they feel much bigger and a bit less lose and fun compared to the F27 and F28R.  Much harder to assemble and rig.  The roominess of the F31s is great as they have headroom throughout and your not ducking to get to the head.  

They actually all tow about the same as long as I'm using my diesel suburban no difference cept the length.  I dry sailed the F27 and ducked a bridge with the mast all solo but cannot do the same on the F9A without some help as the rigging needed to raise the mast is more substantial.  One advantage though is raising mast while unfolded which I couldn't do on the F27.

I've seen a few F25s and F9s they are all over the map as to build quality.  Mine was built by Gavin Hall in New Zealand and might be a bit biased but the build quality is better than my F27!!!  Some serious effort went into this boat its super well made and seems very light for all the cruising gear its got on board.  Would love to ditch the underslung rudder and to daggerboard and also go to a rotating rig.  When I feel I have the time and $$ these are the only changes I'd do.

Yes suffered ventilation on both all three boats really bad on the F27 with assymetric in heavy conditions, almost flipped an F28R got on its side in heavy air downwind when driver came up to fast in a blast with went on its side lost the chute and recovered without the chute seconds later, very wet and wild.  Water came over the bow and into the cabin!!!  I think a deeper rudder would fix this on all three boats.  On the 27 I had the rudder kick up do to kelp patty and did a fast 360 spin not fun at all and really hard to get the rudder back down.

To summarize if racing and sailing solo I'd go for the F28R or for bit less $$ and great overall boat the F27!

Cruising with women and bigger kids you really need the F31/F9A size vessel.  If you have a mooring or slip then go for the bigger boats.  All are great boats and I'm constantly amazed how long we all hold onto them.  My kids grew up on the F27 but they love going to Catalina on the F9A!!  Did lots of sailing on Lake Tahoe too!  nothing but good memories on the old F27!!!  I'm third owner of the F9A Malolo and its been in So Cal for a number of years.  Was brought out here by a Kiwi named Paul who now owns a big cruising cat I believe.

Steve F9A Malolo

IMG_20171007_092605851.jpg

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  • 1 year later...

could never understand the rudder and dagger board on a 28 , the NACA profiles are completely different, rudder for slow speed and the board for high speed?

When you compare to the C24 with the aluminum sections hard to work out what they thinking was with the 28

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We sail a Corsair 31-1D - which is a lighter racing version with a minimal interior and porta potti.  42.5' rotating mast, 6.5' dagger board and high aspect rudder...  We have no rudder cavitation problems at all with this rudder as long as the sails are trimmed properly, however, the high aspect rudder does not work very well at slow speeds. 

 

Rudder and daggerboard are shown on this page: C/F rudders & Dagger boards

Rudder is like: F-9, F-31 Deep Kickup Rudder (but may be a bit higher aspect ratio).

Dagger board is Corsair F31 1D Daggerboard (sticks out of the deck about 2 feet when up), requires different mast raising gear.

 

We dry sail this boat most weekends and it is dead easy to launch and retrieve.  So, I wouldn't worry about the size of the boat for launching and retrieving.  Boat and trailer together weigh just shy of 6,000 lbs, so you can tow with a 1/2 truck or suburban, but I 3/4 ton truck is much more comfortable (truck weighs about 1500 lbs more than the boat and trailer.

 

The boat is very fast and manageable  by two experienced people on a large body of water, but in the lake we sail in, it really requires 4 people, since we are tacking / jibing about every two to three minutes.  She is really a handful on the lake and the crew is normally whipped after two races....

 

Not the best cruising boat, but it is really fast :)

 

 

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14 hours ago, Sailabout said:

could never understand the rudder and dagger board on a 28 , the NACA profiles are completely different, rudder for slow speed and the board for high speed?

When you compare to the C24 with the aluminum sections hard to work out what they thinking was with the 28

I installed a high aspect daggerboard and a dagger rudder on my F28R.

Both are Phils Foils upgrades. Highly recommended.

These upgrade have transformed the boat. Handles better, sails faster, slow speed manoeuvrability is awesome. Main benefit is no rudder ventilation.

 

 

unnamed.jpg

unnamed-2.jpg

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4 hours ago, Sailabout said:

love it

how much difference in the board, they look ok to me?

Is that Phils cassette as well?

Yes Phil's tiller, cassette and rudder blade.

I don't have a photo of the actual daggerboards.. but here's a comparison between a Phil's elliptical and the factory board.  

The Phils board is significantly lighter than the original board.

F9DB02-gallery-2.jpg

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Got the upgrade foils from Farrier, they look very similar to Phils foils

No ventilation  …. or at least I never had any.... fastest was 23 knots

I need to get back out of my slip and turn fully around in 1 1/2 boat lengths …. no problem with slow maneuvers either.

very happy to have them

Thor  F 33

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22 hours ago, can-UK said:

Yes Phil's tiller, cassette and rudder blade.

I don't have a photo of the actual daggerboards.. but here's a comparison between a Phil's elliptical and the factory board.  

The Phils board is significantly lighter than the original board.

F9DB02-gallery-2.jpg

I wondered about mooring a 31 with the tapered foil as now there is a large gap for barnacles to grow and lock your board up?

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20 hours ago, Sailabout said:

I wondered about mooring a 31 with the tapered foil as now there is a large gap for barnacles to grow and lock your board up?

I pay a diver to clean the bottom once a week.. It's not been a problem so far.

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9 hours ago, can-UK said:

I pay a diver to clean the bottom once a week.. It's not been a problem so far.

ask the diver next time if there are barnacles in the board cavity as its a weird shape on the 31 even with the original board in it there is clearance fwd and aft, like inches

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