Jump to content

Recommended Posts

15 hours ago, C34 Happy said:

Congratulations, robalex. How did she fare in the first race?  Is that the water ballast streaming high off the port transom?  Did you find you needed/wanted the water ballast even with at least five aboard?

Yes we thought the ballast helped.  Ideally we would not be rated with it racing fully crewed but racing under PHRF in our area the rules say if you are equiped with WB you get rated with it.  Boat went well even though it was not tuned up.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 374
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

The hull shape is designed to promote earlier surfing/planing compared to the 3200, with less wetted surface area and more sail area. With the mast and keep positioned further aft, the jib and spinnak

Do people stop sailing their pretty damn nice boat because they're getting their ass handed to them by pros? I get my ass kicked by pros all the time, kind of enjoy it. Better than being the king of a

For those of us too cheap to pay for information the free version of the JPK 1030 review is out now if you're still interested and haven't seen it yet.  Paying for information is like so totally 1990'

Posted Images

1 hour ago, European Bloke said:

Which is 'interesting' given the current social distancing rules...

All sorts of helpful exemptions, not least the fact that some of the people on those boats are at their place of work rather than engaging in a leisure activity.

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Kincora said:

Congrats Nigel,  You are a class act.  Oh how is the Chili on the new Fastrak?

Kincora - The Fastrak Chilli is better than ever!!!!

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah yes, a hot one.

Great to see you now have a fleet of 3300.  Have a blast racing.  My gets unloaded off the ship Monday.  So finally start sailing here again.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

That might have been clear enough.  My Archambault 31, is on the pier in Portland, ME Port, not Sunfast 3300.  Do not have the budget for the 3300, but I love the boat.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/28/2020 at 8:33 PM, Shadowman said:

 

New 3300 in Ireland going through its paces with Zero and Main in 25 knots.  Great Video of boat at speed. see https://afloat.ie/sail/events/round-ireland/item/46749-jeanneau-sunfast-3300-hits-15-knots-during-round-ireland-training-video

Crazy just how loose that forestay gets once you get it fully loaded up downwind, can see why they need those runners on when its like that.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Really interesting looking at the boats from the UK sailing with lots of wind.  Where I sail in WLIS there is usually not much wind so we maxed out the sail sizes. Main is longer on the foot and bigger gaff.   Also have a J1 that tacks to the end of the sprit for sub 10knots.  Makes things a little more fun in the light stuff.  Have carried it up to 12 but think the crossover is down from that.

IMG_3922.thumb.jpeg.0d18a5f3cb20f8e40cb55cee9b3db041.jpeg

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/28/2020 at 8:33 PM, Shadowman said:

 

New 3300 in Ireland going through its paces with Zero and Main in 25 knots.  Great Video of boat at speed. see https://afloat.ie/sail/events/round-ireland/item/46749-jeanneau-sunfast-3300-hits-15-knots-during-round-ireland-training-video

What a blast through that chop

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, robalex117 said:

Really interesting looking at the boats from the UK sailing with lots of wind.  Where I sail in WLIS there is usually not much wind so we maxed out the sail sizes. Main is longer on the foot and bigger gaff.   Also have a J1 that tacks to the end of the sprit for sub 10knots.  Makes things a little more fun in the light stuff.  Have carried it up to 12 but think the crossover is down from that.

IMG_3922.thumb.jpeg.0d18a5f3cb20f8e40cb55cee9b3db041.jpeg

Seems like a great idea.  I suspect the J/99 could benefit from a similar sail plan for most US venues.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, robalex117 said:

Really interesting looking at the boats from the UK sailing with lots of wind.  Where I sail in WLIS there is usually not much wind so we maxed out the sail sizes. Main is longer on the foot and bigger gaff.   Also have a J1 that tacks to the end of the sprit for sub 10knots.  Makes things a little more fun in the light stuff.  Have carried it up to 12 but think the crossover is down from that.

 IMG_3922.thumb.jpeg.0d18a5f3cb20f8e40cb55cee9b3db041.jpeg

How high does that setup point?

Does tacking a involve a furl or does that guy standing on the bow sprit lend a hand?

Also, is it common practice to deploy crew to the bow sprit in light air?

Hope you never need that 3rd reef.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I only see 1 reef on that main. The foot of that jib looks like its wrapping around the pulpit pretty heavily not only distorting your sail entry shape but also creating tons of chafe.

You may require a lifeline mod to a lower point so the sail has a clean entry without any obstacles.

Looks like a cool setup. What kind of furler are you using?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't see a 3rd reef, but wonder what conditions would require a second reef for an otherwise underpowered boat with waterballast?  I suspect those conditions would be so rare on LIS that it wouldn't matter.  Few race boats in the PNW have a 2nd reef because we rarely/never get conditions where it would be needed. 

Also, I wonder if Robalex has another main with less roach and could just run that when the forecast called for it?

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Irrational 14 said:

I only see 1 reef on that main. The foot of that jib looks like its wrapping around the pulpit pretty heavily not only distorting your sail entry shape but also creating tons of chafe.

You may require a lifeline mod to a lower point so the sail has a clean entry without any obstacles.

Looks like a cool setup. What kind of furler are you using?

Inshore main.  Only have one now but will get another offshore that is a little smaller and has the necessary reefs.  Using Karver KSF2.  Those do either bottom up or top down without any spinner attachments.  That sail is bottom up but code 0 is top down.  You can either not skirt the sail and let it go over the lifeline and pinch the foot or skirt inside the pulpit.  It looks worse in the picture then I think it is.  But maybe experts can weigh in if it is really doing damage.  The way the sail sets that tack needs to be low, but if the clew was a little higher the head has room to go up 8" or so so  we could raise it a then skirting the lifeline would be less of an issue.  But the way it is cut the tack needs to be almost as low as possible.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Teener said:

How high does that setup point?

Does tacking a involve a furl or does that guy standing on the bow sprit lend a hand?

Also, is it common practice to deploy crew to the bow sprit in light air?

Hope you never need that 3rd reef.

As high as regular jib.  All my sails are North but that J1 is a Doyle with structured luff which means no cable and vertical battens.   Early days.  When it is at the top end and we have the tack cranked the forestay is lose like a 420 or that Irish boat with the code 0 in the video.   Tacking involves a furl, very much like you see on the volvo boats.  It furls very quickly.  Never had put cew on the sprit but put them on the foredeck.  Only have 1 reef in that sail.  Inshore main.  Not very windy around here.  With our AP jib and full main no problem sailing in 18 knots upwind.  That jib likes sub 9 knots.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, robalex117 said:

IMG_3922.thumb.jpeg.0d18a5f3cb20f8e40cb55cee9b3db041.jpeg

Cool setup. Is that a deflector on the runner around the top spreader or just a bit of bungee to keep it in place?

I imagine kite hoists / drops need a bit of smart crew work to avoid fuck-ups at the end of the sprit and furling the kite into the jib

Link to post
Share on other sites

Would a J1 tacked out on the end of the sprit be a big penalty in PHRF? I wonder too about how she would point, Quite interested since we sail in very light winds about half the time. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Seems like a great idea.  I suspect the J/99 could benefit from a similar sail plan for most US venues.

Yes, a huge penalty in all measurement rules to have basically a masthead genoa tacked in front of the stem.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Fastrak said:

 

Sorry the heading is mis-leading and a typo between different videos. The TWS here was 20-23 knots, not 15 knots.

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Teener said:

No worries, kinda guessed.  Still hauling the mail.

Was that reaching or vmg?

Reaching. Testing angles and crossovers for the Fractional Zero versus the other sails. The FRO is not a VMG running sail.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...

The US boat mainsail is huge! Seems the UK boats have also added some sail area from the first boat when comparing foot lengths, Looks quite the same as Ken Read has. Any insight from the UK teams?

FA0E99B3-B14F-449C-88E0-BF9B48F4202B.thumb.jpeg.18c5d6a2e7eb52a4f9d0f98c1bbbe3f7.jpeg

AD8429B3-27FB-49FE-9FF7-FA78DBCE7216.thumb.jpeg.a786337d8e6e9f8d2dbee8d69bb0ed68.jpeg

F6AE81A2-D44B-460E-B9C6-C73CD3E254E3.thumb.jpeg.84bdf9a55fffa45bf165b9ea3bdff4ef.jpeg

D779DA87-721F-453D-B481-80D9F5567D09.thumb.jpeg.2a4f6b54a97ce83b14983bf44ff963dc.jpeg

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, KCJ said:

The US boat mainsail is huge! Seems the UK boats have also added some sail area from the first boat when comparing foot lengths, Looks quite the same as Ken Read has. Any insight from the UK teams?

FA0E99B3-B14F-449C-88E0-BF9B48F4202B.thumb.jpeg.18c5d6a2e7eb52a4f9d0f98c1bbbe3f7.jpeg

AD8429B3-27FB-49FE-9FF7-FA78DBCE7216.thumb.jpeg.a786337d8e6e9f8d2dbee8d69bb0ed68.jpeg

F6AE81A2-D44B-460E-B9C6-C73CD3E254E3.thumb.jpeg.84bdf9a55fffa45bf165b9ea3bdff4ef.jpeg

D779DA87-721F-453D-B481-80D9F5567D09.thumb.jpeg.2a4f6b54a97ce83b14983bf44ff963dc.jpeg

 

The UK boats have their sail plan optimised for IRC racing. There is one US boat racing in the UK which has a sail pan optimised for phrf and ORC for when it goes across the pond to race. For comparison a UK boat rates around 1.027 under irc and the US boat rates 1.041 with the larger sails. I don’t know the owner of the US boat but so far their race results haven’t reflected their larger sails...

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 1 month later...

RORC IRC Two-Handed Autumn Series - Gentoo wins Race 2

by Louay Habib 28 Sep 09:12 BST26-27 September 2020

yysw296330.jpg James Harayda & Dee Caffari racing Sun Fast 3300 Gentoo © Rick Tomlinson
Tweet
 

James Harayda & Dee Caffari, racing Sun Fast 3300 Gentoo, have won the second race of the RORC IRC Two-Handed Autumn Series. Gentoo took line honours in the 128nm race as well as the win on IRC corrected time. Richard Palmer's JPK 10.10 Jangada, raced by Jeremy Waitt and Shirley Robertson, was second, less than five minutes ahead of Sun Fast 3200 Cora, raced by Tim Goodhew & Kelvin Matthews.

The overnight race was held in blustery conditions with about 25 knots from the north to north west. The RORC Race Committee set a course taking in all points of sail and requiring strategic decisions, especially with regards to tidal current and also for wind shadow on the southside of the Isle of Wight.

Undoubtedly the best start was made by Nicola Simper's S&S 34 Blueberry, starting the race at full pace at the Squadron Line. The RORC fleet headed as far west as East Shambles buoy with Outer Nab 2 forming the most easterly point of the course. After a night of hard racing south of the island, the fleet hankered down for a beat back into the Eastern Solent to finish in the early hours of the morning.

James Harayda is just 22-year-old and racing Gentoo with Dee Caffari who has sailed around the world six times. Dee is the first woman to have sailed single-handed and non-stop around the world in both directions. Harayda & Caffari have their sights set on representing Great Britain in the Two Person Offshore Keelboat Event for the Paris Olympic Games in 2024.

"You forget who you're sailing with very quickly, Dee doesn't come with an ego despite having achieved such amazing things," commented James Harayda. "It's a really nice dynamic on board, Dee brings a huge amount of experience that I haven't had, I think our skills complement each other quite nicely."

 

The Royal Ocean Racing Club's Two-Handed Autumn Series comes to a conclusion with the last race scheduled to start on Saturday 10th October. Jangada leads the series, followed by Daniel Jones' Sun Fast 3300 Wild Pilgrim. Rob Craigie & Deb Fish's Sun Fast 3600 Bellino is third

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/10/2020 at 11:08 AM, solosailor said:

Yes, a huge penalty in all measurement rules to have basically a masthead genoa tacked in front of the stem.  

I'm not sure that's true. It increases the J measurement, but I would expect the ORR VPP to treat that as a "Large Roach Headsail" and confine to its usable range. End result (uneducated guess) is that the light air performance numbers would improve, medium - heavy wouldn't change at all.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/10/2020 at 6:07 AM, Snowden said:

Cool setup. Is that a deflector on the runner around the top spreader or just a bit of bungee to keep it in place?

I imagine kite hoists / drops need a bit of smart crew work to avoid fuck-ups at the end of the sprit and furling the kite into the jib

Just bungee.    Not sure what you mean regarding the kite.  We hoist from a bag on the rail and usually do a letterbox into the main cabin.

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, ryley said:

I'm not sure that's true. It increases the J measurement, but I would expect the ORR VPP to treat that as a "Large Roach Headsail" and confine to its usable range. End result (uneducated guess) is that the light air performance numbers would improve, medium - heavy wouldn't change at all.

Ryley you are correct in respect to ORR.  Wind range is under 8 for that sail.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 4 months later...
On 10/7/2020 at 7:18 PM, robalex117 said:

Just bungee.    Not sure what you mean regarding the kite.  We hoist from a bag on the rail and usually do a letterbox into the main cabin.

After letterboxing down the companionway, do you launch back out of there or stuff it back into the bag for the next hoist? 

We are using the front hatch on our boat for all instances even just putting the bag under the hatch and still hoisting from there but I have hesitated to letter box simply because I am trying to imagine what to do for the next hoist?

Dan 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, danstanford said:

After letterboxing down the companionway, do you launch back out of there or stuff it back into the bag for the next hoist? 

We are using the front hatch on our boat for all instances even just putting the bag under the hatch and still hoisting from there but I have hesitated to letter box simply because I am trying to imagine what to do for the next hoist?

Dan 

We repack and hoist off the rail.  But  if fully crewed which is 4 people, and it is not super windy we douse into the forward hatch and then leave for the next hoist.  

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

If you add clips in the right positions in the companion way you can hang the bag there and letterbox douse directly into it. Speeds up the time to reset and avoids having to spend time below. 
 

Here’s an example from Conrad Colman

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, danstanford said:

After letterboxing down the companionway, do you launch back out of there or stuff it back into the bag for the next hoist? 

We are using the front hatch on our boat for all instances even just putting the bag under the hatch and still hoisting from there but I have hesitated to letter box simply because I am trying to imagine what to do for the next hoist?

Dan 

Just make sure to douse on the same jibe as the anticipated next hoist otherwise your spinnaker halyard may get trapped behind spreaders.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, danstanford said:

After letterboxing down the companionway, do you launch back out of there or stuff it back into the bag for the next hoist? 

Assuming your boat is reasonably clear of cushions / sharp things / exposed electrics inside and the kite is not too wet, I have had success shoving the kite forward to the compartment under the forehatch and doing the next hoist from there. Make sure you don't cross the corners otherwise it will go up with a big hourglass next time.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, glass said:

Just make sure to douse on the same jibe as the anticipated next hoist otherwise your spinnaker halyard may get trapped behind spreaders.

Does the 3300 only have 1 masthead halyard?

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Alberta said:

Does the 3300 only have 1 masthead halyard?

 

2 hours ago, Alberta said:

4 hours ago, glass said:

Just make sure to douse on the same jibe as the anticipated next hoist otherwise your spinnaker halyard may get trapped behind spreaders.

 
With 2 multipurpose genoa halyards so that one can be used as the spinnaker pole uphaul and 2 masthead spinnaker halyards there is even more caution needed not to trap any of them.
 
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I manage to trap a halyard all the time on douses, then reset with the other one. Gives me lots of time to get the first one from behind the spreaders. 

 

I have maybe a 50% success rate in keeping the halyard from going around the upper spreader in anything over 20kts. How do you all keep it from swinging around when you letterbox?

Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Alberta said:

I have maybe a 50% success rate in keeping the halyard from going around the upper spreader in anything over 20kts. How do you all keep it from swinging around when you letterbox?

I think the halyard trap on spreaders will probably be a hit or miss (50%) based on luck and how the head swings on the way down. 

In Conrads video he dropped the sail under the boom and straight into the hatch bag.   A letterbox drop typically drops the kite behind the main, between the foot, over the boom and then into the hatch.  My guess is that its a wind/pressure kite size and control decision.  Light wind and easy to control go straight into the hatch/bag.  When windier use the letterbox where the main will help block the wind on the kite. 

Looks like at the end of the video Conrad was zipping up / stopping the kite prior to the next set.  Makes sense for single handed.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I really do appreciate the boat for many reasons. The design is fast, the sail plan great, the line layout seem right.  But for $300,000 after sail away delivery and taxes could they have made the cockpit a bit more comfortable for the target market of professional men & women in their late 40s to 70s who have the funds and time to sail them? 

jeanneau-sun-fast-3300-boat-test-2024-olympics-contender-credit-jean-marie-liot.jpg

jeanneau-sun-fast-3300-boat-test-cockpit-credit-jean-marie-liot.jpg

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Black Jack said:

I really do appreciate the boat for many reasons. The design is fast, the sail plan great, the line layout seem right.  But for $300,000 after sail away delivery and taxes could they have made the cockpit a bit more comfortable for the target market of professional men & women in their late 40s to 70s who have the funds and time to sail them? 

the woman in her late 40s in the picture is Pip Hare... she doesn't need any more comfort than that!

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Snowden said:

the woman in her late 40s in the picture is Pip Hare... she doesn't need any more comfort than that!

Hare has pro sailor buns.  There is more to this chase - can we can boil it down to why we would sail a boat like this - proof of prosperity, class, dominance, emotional state  & ego. Without true data and based on biased conjecture, middle aged competitors secretly prefer IRL french toast girls (boys) to remain for more than a daysail rather waking up solo or unevenly short handed. When your french toast girl pops up on deck tied to the race dock on late Sunday morning, who cares about the regatta pickle dish. You already won.

 

Yeah, I went there. She makes me happy.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 1 month later...

Seahorse magazine ...editorial article from SeaVentures

Spot on

Spot on

Visit Sea Ventures

When Daniel Andrieu and Guillaume Verdier designed a new shorthanded racer for Jeanneau even they couldn’t have dreamt what a stunning success they were about to set in motion

No less than 70 Sun Fast 3300s have been built, with fleets in the UK, France, Norway, Australia and the USA. As many as 15 will be on the start of the Fastnet later this year. Being a veteran double-handed campaigner himself, Nigel Colley of Sea Ventures in Swanwick, UK, will be ready to support any and all who are interested in double-handed sailing, this newest and most exciting sector of our sport.

Whether an aspiring Olympian, a keen amateur tired of full-crew racing, a couple looking for a new way to enjoy sailing, or any other number of different permutations, the Sun Fast 3300 rises as the perfect choice for two-handed sailing. Its clever full-bow hull design from designers Andrieu and Verdier extends waterline length, and the water ballast tanks add to stability. The generous sail area set in the large foretriangle both reduces weather helm and gives plenty of versatile sail power when needed. Large bowsprit-borne asymmetrical spinnakers and Code Zeros in the downwind sailplan propel the boat at impressive offwind speeds.

To say the growth in popularity of the short-handed racing scene is brisk is, by now, almost a cliché. Expanding beyond the traditional arenas of interest around La Manche, and not counting the pro and semipro enthusiasts who are already hooked, there are four key factors that have helped propel this trend worldwide towards new participants:

Main picture: the Sun Fast 3300 is a remarkably successful design by any standards. More than 70 are already racing and around 15 of them are expected to be on the start line of this summerʼs Fastnet Race.
Below: the simple but comfortable and very practical interior layout makes the Sun Fast 3300 a capable and enjoyable cruiser as well as fully optimised offshore racer
article7pic2.jpg
  • Promotion: The widespread access to vast multimedia resources has put the Vendée Globe onto nearly every screen in the sailing world. The fundamental appeal of the man vs nature story will never tire, especially when technology has advanced the boats’ speeds in such profound and dramatic ways. One can safely assume this spectacle will inspire the next generation of offshore stars.
  • Politics: World Sailing has finally amassed support for a new offshore sailing medal discipline in the 2024 Olympics. With its strong media following, France is the perfect venue to support offshore sailing, and interest will automatically be spread among all nations interested in fielding a team. However, the devil still lies in the details: what equipment will be used, how will national team selections be run, and will the IOC even give its final approval in May.
  • Pandemic: Local restrictions vary, but in many areas of the globe the ability to get out and enjoy sailing or racing has been curtailed in the past year or limited to household-only crews. Race organisers have tried to adapt by offering no-host races, and this was quite popular last season and may likely continue well into the spring and summer. Many have discovered they rather like not having to rustle together a large crew and with help from their own family or close friends they have rediscovered an activity they probably used to enjoy before getting sucked into full-crew racing.
  • Practicality: Even before the pandemic hit, big-boat racing owners were tiring of the hassle and expense of fielding a full crew every time going out to race. Racing with a smaller team has appeals to those who want to go on either short or long duration races with either modified and adapted versions of the boats they have or with the purchase of new model options in the marketplace now that appeal directly to this new group of enthusiasts. Whether racing around an island in their local bay or planning to do the Fastnet course, the enormous growth in popularity suggests this could be the fastest growing sector in racing and cruiser/racer sailing today.

This interest is manifested in more than just high-profile one-design class racing, but also racing under IRC or ORC handicaps as well. Last year there were more than 2,000 ORC DH certificates issued in several countries in Europe, Australia and the US, and ORC has structured a new annual double-handed European Championship event: this year’s edition will be in Greece and next year’s will be at the Round Gotland Race in Sweden.

In the IRC world, the UK’s Double- Handed Offshore Series is growing fast, where in this fleet there is some significant UK sailing star talent: Shirley Robertson, Dee Caffari, Stuart Childerley and Henry Bromby are a few. There are also dozens of entries expected in double-handed classes that will be out on the new Fastnet racecourse this year.

In the USA there are both new races – like the Annapolis Double- Handed Race – and established ones held in regions from Florida to Newport, the Great Lakes, Gulf Coast and West Coast where new doublehanded classes have helped boost fleet participation numbers. Even the 2,225-mile biennial Transpac race from LA to Hawaii may once again have enough double-handed entries to form their own class.

Click here for more information on Sea Ventures »

 


We invite you to read on and find out for yourself why Seahorse is the most highly-rated source in the world for anyone who is serious about their racing.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...

Curious if other owners had an issue with the way the skeg was made, it would not allow a small donut zinc to be installed.  I ground it down slightly and it fits perfectly now but seems like they could make right at the factory.  Don't new boats ship with zincs installed?  Hard to see but the trailing diameter of the skeg is about the exact same size as the zinc.   Anyway all good for me now.  8F5FB297-4BEA-4542-9EEC-DEE6C905B73B_1_105_c.thumb.jpeg.3b13e784bc91ed9a1a06c0436d0bda1a.jpeg

 

IMG_0556.thumb.jpeg.26565fe5f65db5c828aeac4f17d11194.jpeg

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

I call bullshit on the whole poxy bunch.  The premise for all these bulbous bow/scow shaped small boats is the French penchant for long distance single or double handed races with weather routing that will ensure they seldom or never have to go upwind.  They are shit sailors upwind in any sort of chop in any sort of breeze. 

We raced against 3 new 3300's and a 3600 for 3 days at the end of February in Port Phillip and hammered them on handicap, both PHS style and measurement TCF.I will admit that it may not have been a fair test, but our boat was almost always faster than these rockstar boats on the water.

Ohh....we are sailing a 20 year old Sydney 32 with a very amateur skipper and a 74 and 69 year old trimmers - definitely nothing professional about us.  The gear is OK but all sails except for our 'regatta main' are between 3 and 8 years old.  You could buy a similar boat for A$65K - These French shitters are A$230K + electrics and sails. And the are plug ugly.

I think it's "The Emperors New Clothes" syndrome at work here, unless you are intending to go offshore with professional routing, and then the amateur will always be beaten by the professionals.  Round the sticks, beer can sailing...no, unless you must follow the lates fashion and you've got an awful lot of disposable income, a generous sponsor, or a clever accountant who can use it to minimise tax. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

There are some boats out there that are easy to sail fast but ultimately lack that last few % of outright performance, like a j boat for example. Then there are boats that are hard to sail fast but when you get it right they are extremely fast, I’ve sailed some boats like this and from what I hear from some in the UK fleet of 3300s, they might fall into this category. Ultimately the 3300 was designed to race under irc in offshore races short handed which is kind of what you’ve said and you’d be right, lots of people have bought into the idea but they’re putting in lots of time and effort to understand the boats and now they are getting fast in all conditions over here, not just reaching. In a race recently in a 3600 we only had a slight edge over the 3300s when the breeze dropped under 10kts upwind and anything over they we’re matching us from time to time and we were at the head of the fleet. Bitterly disappointing to watch them sail 2kts faster on a reach when all sailing with A0s. For reference in the 3600 we can normally keep up with most 40ft cruiser racers on an offshore race with wind from all angles and can even give the JPK 1180s a hard time when the breeze is sub 14kts so when the 3300s are now keeping up with us I think they’ve cracked it...

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, judge said:

I call bullshit on the whole poxy bunch.  The premise for all these bulbous bow/scow shaped small boats is the French penchant for long distance single or double handed races with weather routing that will ensure they seldom or never have to go upwind.  They are shit sailors upwind in any sort of chop in any sort of breeze. 

We raced against 3 new 3300's and a 3600 for 3 days at the end of February in Port Phillip and hammered them on handicap, both PHS style and measurement TCF.I will admit that it may not have been a fair test, but our boat was almost always faster than these rockstar boats on the water.

Ohh....we are sailing a 20 year old Sydney 32 with a very amateur skipper and a 74 and 69 year old trimmers - definitely nothing professional about us.  The gear is OK but all sails except for our 'regatta main' are between 3 and 8 years old.  You could buy a similar boat for A$65K - These French shitters are A$230K + electrics and sails. And the are plug ugly.

I think it's "The Emperors New Clothes" syndrome at work here, unless you are intending to go offshore with professional routing, and then the amateur will always be beaten by the professionals.  Round the sticks, beer can sailing...no, unless you must follow the lates fashion and you've got an awful lot of disposable income, a generous sponsor, or a clever accountant who can use it to minimise tax. 

Hi Judge,

Is it fair to assume from your post that you believe all fat arsed girls cant sail to windward?  

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/9/2021 at 9:31 AM, robalex117 said:

Curious if other owners had an issue with the way the skeg was made, it would not allow a small donut zinc to be installed.

Put the zinc on the other side of the skeg? Shorten the prop shaft...save some weight :-)

Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, judge said:

 

Ohh....we are sailing a 20 year old Sydney 32 with a very amateur skipper and a 74 and 69 year old trimmers - definitely nothing professional about us.  The gear is OK but all sails except for our 'regatta main' are between 3 and 8 years old.  You could buy a similar boat for A$65K - These French shitters are A$230K + electrics and sails. And the are plug ugly.

 

You only get to buy 65k boats like that because people stump up the up front money to buy a new boat. If no one was buying these 'French Shitters' and other new boats then the rest of us would still be stuck sailing overpriced IOR wrecks. 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, JL92S said:

 In a race recently in a 3600 we only had a slight edge over the 3300s when the breeze dropped under 10kts upwind and anything over they we’re matching us from time to time and we were at the head of the fleet. Bitterly disappointing to watch them sail 2kts faster on a reach when all sailing with A0s. For reference in the 3600 we can normally keep up with most 40ft cruiser racers on an offshore race with wind from all angles and can even give the JPK 1180s a hard time when the breeze is sub 14kts so when the 3300s are now keeping up with us I think they’ve cracked it...

What is the rating difference for the 3300's that are matching the 3600's?  Have the 3300 now made the 3600 redundant?

How do the smaller JPK's compare on IRC from your experience?

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/24/2021 at 10:44 AM, bfp said:

What is the rating difference for the 3300's that are matching the 3600's?  Have the 3300 now made the 3600 redundant?

How do the smaller JPK's compare on IRC from your experience?

On IRC the UK 3300's are typically circa 1.028+/- against the 3600's at circa 1.040 +/-. The once dominant 3600 now has its work cut out BUT it can still win and beat the 3300's. The JPK1010's, when well sailed, are still very competitive and in the frame. All 3 boats are competitive and can beat each other. The UK fleet of 3300's are out training together regularly, pushing each other, and learning fast, and it is not by chance they are frequently at the top of the podium.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

So does this mean the 3300s are getting so professional it is burning off the weekend warriors? It can be an unfortunate side effect. Or are some of these programmes hitting the pause button while WS works out what to do.

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Jono said:

So does this mean the 3300s are getting so professional it is burning off the weekend warriors? It can be an unfortunate side effect. Or are some of these programmes hitting the pause button while WS works out what to do.

Do people stop sailing their pretty damn nice boat because they're getting their ass handed to them by pros? I get my ass kicked by pros all the time, kind of enjoy it. Better than being the king of a bunch of hacks. I'm happy if I finish while they're still in sight, really happy if I occasionally get a lucky shift and reach the upwind mark ahead, or cross tacks in the lead. Rare, granted, but it's happened.

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Jono said:

So does this mean the 3300s are getting so professional it is burning off the weekend warriors? It can be an unfortunate side effect. Or are some of these programmes hitting the pause button while WS works out what to do.

Luckily in the Solent we have enough fleets that you can choose who you want to race against if sharing the track with really good sailors bothers you.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, inneedofadvice said:

Do people stop sailing their pretty damn nice boat because they're getting their ass handed to them by pros? I get my ass kicked by pros all the time, kind of enjoy it. Better than being the king of a bunch of hacks. I'm happy if I finish while they're still in sight, really happy if I occasionally get a lucky shift and reach the upwind mark ahead, or cross tacks in the lead. Rare, granted, but it's happened.

I can see pros as a positive - if people are hiring professionals to get the last bit of performance out of their boat, it should be easy to recruit experienced amateur crew that want a chance at a very technical boat.

If the performance groove is so narrow that you need professionals to have fun, these boats will have a limited but dedicated following. If they have a wide enough performance groove that weekend amateurs can have fun then it could be very popular.

The other question is whether a healthy circuit of regattas will appear if the Olympics fail to materialize.

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, inneedofadvice said:

Do people stop sailing their pretty damn nice boat because they're getting their ass handed to them by pros? I get my ass kicked by pros all the time, kind of enjoy it. Better than being the king of a bunch of hacks. I'm happy if I finish while they're still in sight, really happy if I occasionally get a lucky shift and reach the upwind mark ahead, or cross tacks in the lead. Rare, granted, but it's happened.

This.

I couldn't give a tinkers damn where a boat stuffed full of pro's finished up. But they give you great datum when you are playing with them. 

Funny story; we went out to watch the start of an offshore race and decided to follow the fleet up the channel exiting the bay. We cut the corner and entered the channel on a shy reach trucking along nicely under kite, just behind a pro 60'er who was under headsail. We were holding them easily for a while, long enough for an increasing  bunch of white faces to be visible staring at us wondering WTF we had come from.

We ended up bearing off just so they didn't mistake us for a competitor and do anything silly, but it sure was fun for a while :).       

 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

I wouldn’t even say the 3300s are pro’d up. There are probably 3 well known names amongst the fleet mainly Dee Caffari, Shirley Robertson and Henry Bomby who have some gold medals and round the world races to their names but the best part is they don’t always win the races. The time and money being put in is often really keen amateur owners looking to make the best of and have a good time and there are a couple of 3600s that get involved too and in the right conditions they have their day against the 3300s. And for those interested a 3600 being sailed by the Army just won it’s class in the first proper crewed sailing regatta of the year in the Solent. Good all round 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I feel the definition of "pro'd up" gets a bit fuzzy when you're talking about a double handed class like this, this isn't an owner stacking the boat with a team of hired guns, these are teams aiming for selection for a potential olympic event, the class of competitor is going to be high regardless of what the day job is...

The advantage of being a big name is potential sponsorship to allow you to spend more time on the water training, but some of the teams without big names behind them are out there training just as much at the moment!

Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, inneedofadvice said:

Do people stop sailing their pretty damn nice boat because they're getting their ass handed to them by pros? I get my ass kicked by pros all the time, kind of enjoy it. Better than being the king of a bunch of hacks. I'm happy if I finish while they're still in sight, really happy if I occasionally get a lucky shift and reach the upwind mark ahead, or cross tacks in the lead. Rare, granted, but it's happened.

That sounds like golf when you are a weekend hacker who gets the thrill from getting one par a round which makes you want to come back.

I'm expecting to get my arse kicked by hacks once I'm in a position to start racing my SF3200. It will motivate me to improve.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/26/2021 at 8:49 PM, inneedofadvice said:

Do people stop sailing their pretty damn nice boat because they're getting their ass handed to them by pros? I get my ass kicked by pros all the time, kind of enjoy it. Better than being the king of a bunch of hacks. I'm happy if I finish while they're still in sight, really happy if I occasionally get a lucky shift and reach the upwind mark ahead, or cross tacks in the lead. Rare, granted, but it's happened.

Fucking boom. 
Some people just like to be a big fish in a small pond. I never got that mentality. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Announcements


×
×
  • Create New...