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Santa Cruz 70 - Fleet Roll Call


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On ‎5‎/‎17‎/‎2019 at 7:00 PM, some dude said:

So that's the old Citius aka the City Bus?  Sad.  Had some good times on that boat.  Had a huge frac rig for a while

The white Chardonnay is just an SC70 hull and deck-never was a race boat.  No bulkheads, bunks, or galley down below.  Just couches all the way around the hull.  Purpose built for pony rides.  The only winches are electric, way in the back by the wheel so the ride operator can trim the sails and drive at the same time

I see Chardonnay II (White Hull) on the spread sheet list was purpose built as a charter. How could they justify that cost, ROI? Converting old race boat is one thing, but building a new one just for charters? Seems like a long grind to get cash positive...

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I had the cash piled up to get a 70, until I went sailing on one at age 60: nope, no way. If I was still 30, no problem. But it was only the under 30s aboard that could actually work the boat, all us

Though our pedigree racing days are over,  we definitely have warm, dry bunks and a well-stocked galley (and bar) on Drumbeat. There's probably some merit to crew morale and being able to fight anothe

Yes they did get beat up on handicap racing.  However, the 70 class has only ever been interested on how they did against their own.  They didn't care about overall handicap placing against other desi

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And it's really just an SC70 hull and deck.  Stubby keel, stubby off the self mast tube.  Way cheaper than a real SC70, especially if someone else cancelled their order after the hull and deck were made.

And yes, cash flow positive on day 1 and every day afterwards

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7 hours ago, malisch said:

I think the last Donnybrook was owned by Jim Muldoon in Annapolis, which became an Andrews 80 (ex. Magnitude) after they ran aground leaving the Chesapeake in the 70.  The 70 (carbon construction) was totaled, last I heard it was purchased and refit for cruising in the Pacific.

 

Man, 70's in Lake Michigan are the stuff of childhood dreams.  

barfly posted the up to date story above (much thanks). She was really a SC-72 and pretty turbo at that (swept spreader rig, 11'+ draft etc.), looks like the Hong Kong based new owner likely won out big time with boat as they are winning races on her post-grounding. The Andrews 80 never quite seems to get on step...

The 9' draft of the originals isn't great but when most 40' racer cruisers draw 8' 6" these days and cost the same or more, you have to scratch your head a bit. Running costs might get in the way however...

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17 minutes ago, Pro looper said:

The boats are  right outside my window and I know the owners and captains and crew

most trips are full , licensed for 49.  corporate charters can be less people but 

charters are not cheap 

PL.

You couldn’t pay me to go out on a trip like that!

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2 minutes ago, stayoutofthemiddle said:

If you know how to sail you are not the target market. Someone above called it a "pony ride". Best description...

Good point! 

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On ‎5‎/‎17‎/‎2019 at 2:13 PM, Swimsailor said:

Several Andrews and N/M boats too. 

Yeah

There were 7 Andrews-70s built by Choate, starting with Victoria, plus a pair built in Estonia (Trader and Renegade)

There were maybe 10 NM-68s built, not all of the same design, but IIRC 6 of them (built by Choate, Geraughty or others) were fairly similar including Drumbeat, Swiftsure III (later Blue Ruby), the original Pyewacket (later Starship-I), Marishten (now Coruba), Cheval (later Denali)  and the original Magnitude.... plus Maverick, fairly similar shape but built of aluminum

Rounding out the set, there was Cheetah, a sled built by Choate to a Peterson design....

 

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I'm not sure the full history on the Donnybrook Andrews 80, someone else here probably does. They had her listed for $200k 2 years ago. The biggest issue with that program has been its non profit status limiting how much can be spent on crew and gear, and as a result the crew is rarely consistent and skilled enough to make her go.

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The full history? I’ve got most of the rundown. Boat was turbod for the 2011 transpac in a (failed) attempt to compete with Bella mente for line honors. Pulled out the canting keel, daggerboard, and associated structure and fitted a 20foot fixed keel on the same bulb. Massive box top mainsail. I think an articulating bowsprit. 

When it became donnybrook it went to Dencho for a paint job, minor refit, installation of a very long fixed sprit, and the reinstall of the canting keel structure and daggerboard. Keel was trimmed back to the original 12 foot canting version because nowhere on Chesapeake bay is 20feet  

First race was Bermuda 2012. Crew only had a few days of practice before the start and a lot of old sails, including an old pinhead main. Pinhead main was because the boat was so backed into the downwind vmg corner of the design box that it wouldn’t meet Bermuda stability requirements with the weight of a square head main up in the air. That year was a breezy broad reach all the way and after a minor water ingress problem around the base of the daggerboard trunk was discovered the decision was made to turn around because the forecast for the gulf stream was absolutely heinous (30kts against 4 kts of tide) and nobody wanted to make the problem worse and potentially sink the boat.

Boat won some line honors in bay races in Annapolis, then did Halifax against rambler 90 in 13. Held with them pretty well most of the race but once it went upwind the boat’s lack of RM really showed. Hit a whale on the second morning of the race and had to reset the bulb once the boat got back to Newport.

They went and did a pineapple cup in -2014 and reported a top speed of 33 knots. Second on line honors to Shockwave due to lack of form stability in the reaching conditions in the middle of that race.

2015 was RORC 600 where they were even with a VO65, Annapolis to Newport where the R/P 63 Lucky got them on line honors, then it’s basically sat for sale at hinckley since they hit a reef in the BVIs the winter of 2016 and the keel was condemned. 

Beyond the performance of the boat, Muldoon’s management style and the people he had organizing the crew really hobbled it from getting off the ground. By the time I sailed with them he had mellowed considerably from the legendary days of shouting and berating crew and I was never asked to give my t shirt and shorts back. That said there were some notable bursts of anger that let you see that he was still a brawler. Some crew onboard probably derived too much of their own personal identity from the boat which led to unpleasant tensions and drama both onboard and off the water. Some serious “penny wise and pound foolish” going on with campaigns as well. There was very little consistency among the crew and a total unwillingness to bring in paid talent to raise the level of the amateurs he liked to sail with. By refusing to cover anyone’s hotel or travel expenses for races he self-selected the crew pool into only people who could afford to race with him. There wasn’t a lot of overlap between that list and the list of people who knew how to sail a boat like DB. Other examples were refusing to buy a satphone to be able to download GRIB files offshore. For Halifax we finished the race on 48 hour old weather files that had no relation to the reality we were seeing on the water.

Overall it’s still just a good transpacific downwind slide boat. Sweetest boat I’ve ever driven off the breeze, it just goes and goes and goes. The skinny canoe body and lack of RM hobbles it in any upwind or reaching conditions. A long layup hasn’t been kind to her though and going through the boat and modernizing equipment and layouts would probably lead to a big savings in weight and competitiveness. A Wild Oats or Rio style cut and shut to move the mast aft in the boat and give it more form stability would probably yield big dividends, and while you’re at it beef up the rig and hull structure to take more RM. So you’re talking conservatively two million bucks to get it back into real fighting shape to be competitive in any race, but it would be a cool project. The guts and DNA of the boat are good.

I’ve probably said too much but I believe the program is functionally defunct at this point, so not too worried  

 

 

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While on a family charter in the BVI I saw Donnie Brook in the slings at Soper's Hole. I met the owner's son and got a tour around the boat. I is a very sexy bit of kit. But, definitely rough around the edges.

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1 hour ago, jackolantern said:

The full history? I’ve got most of the rundown. Boat was turbod for the 2011 transpac in a (failed) attempt to compete with Bella mente for line honors. Pulled out the canting keel, daggerboard, and associated structure and fitted a 20foot fixed keel on the same bulb. Massive box top mainsail. I think an articulating bowsprit. 

When it became donnybrook it went to Dencho for a paint job, minor refit, installation of a very long fixed sprit, and the reinstall of the canting keel structure and daggerboard. Keel was trimmed back to the original 12 foot canting version because nowhere on Chesapeake bay is 20feet  

First race was Bermuda 2012. Crew only had a few days of practice before the start and a lot of old sails, including an old pinhead main. Pinhead main was because the boat was so backed into the downwind vmg corner of the design box that it wouldn’t meet Bermuda stability requirements with the weight of a square head main up in the air. That year was a breezy broad reach all the way and after a minor water ingress problem around the base of the daggerboard trunk was discovered the decision was made to turn around because the forecast for the gulf stream was absolutely heinous (30kts against 4 kts of tide) and nobody wanted to make the problem worse and potentially sink the boat.

Boat won some line honors in bay races in Annapolis, then did Halifax against rambler 90 in 13. Held with them pretty well most of the race but once it went upwind the boat’s lack of RM really showed. Hit a whale on the second morning of the race and had to reset the bulb once the boat got back to Newport.

They went and did a pineapple cup in -2014 and reported a top speed of 33 knots. Second on line honors to Shockwave due to lack of form stability in the reaching conditions in the middle of that race.

2015 was RORC 600 where they were even with a VO65, Annapolis to Newport where the R/P 63 Lucky got them on line honors, then it’s basically sat for sale at hinckley since they hit a reef in the BVIs the winter of 2016 and the keel was condemned. 

Beyond the performance of the boat, Muldoon’s management style and the people he had organizing the crew really hobbled it from getting off the ground. By the time I sailed with them he had mellowed considerably from the legendary days of shouting and berating crew and I was never asked to give my t shirt and shorts back. That said there were some notable bursts of anger that let you see that he was still a brawler. Some crew onboard probably derived too much of their own personal identity from the boat which led to unpleasant tensions and drama both onboard and off the water. Some serious “penny wise and pound foolish” going on with campaigns as well. There was very little consistency among the crew and a total unwillingness to bring in paid talent to raise the level of the amateurs he liked to sail with. By refusing to cover anyone’s hotel or travel expenses for races he self-selected the crew pool into only people who could afford to race with him. There wasn’t a lot of overlap between that list and the list of people who knew how to sail a boat like DB. Other examples were refusing to buy a satphone to be able to download GRIB files offshore. For Halifax we finished the race on 48 hour old weather files that had no relation to the reality we were seeing on the water.

Overall it’s still just a good transpacific downwind slide boat. Sweetest boat I’ve ever driven off the breeze, it just goes and goes and goes. The skinny canoe body and lack of RM hobbles it in any upwind or reaching conditions. A long layup hasn’t been kind to her though and going through the boat and modernizing equipment and layouts would probably lead to a big savings in weight and competitiveness. A Wild Oats or Rio style cut and shut to move the mast aft in the boat and give it more form stability would probably yield big dividends, and while you’re at it beef up the rig and hull structure to take more RM. So you’re talking conservatively two million bucks to get it back into real fighting shape to be competitive in any race, but it would be a cool project. The guts and DNA of the boat are good.

I’ve probably said too much but I believe the program is functionally defunct at this point, so not too worried  

 

 

A very good summation of the Donnybrook program. Thanks for posting it up. 

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On 5/20/2019 at 6:02 PM, sledracr said:

Yeah

There were 7 Andrews-70s built by Choate, starting with Victoria, plus a pair built in Estonia (Trader and Renegade)

There were maybe 10 NM-68s built, not all of the same design, but IIRC 6 of them (built by Choate, Geraughty or others) were fairly similar including Drumbeat, Swiftsure III (later Blue Ruby), the original Pyewacket (later Starship-I), Marishten (now Coruba), Cheval (later Denali)  and the original Magnitude.... plus Maverick, fairly similar shape but built of aluminum

Rounding out the set, there was Cheetah, a sled built by Choate to a Peterson design....

 

This is going way back, but as I recall, Dencho-built Saga was first N/M 68 built for three partners (one was Barry Berkus who had owned the Hollmann, Sunset Blvd. years before) for the 1983 Transpac. She was somehow(*) beaten by Nolan Bushnell's (Atari, Chuck E Cheese) Ron Holland design Charlie, Crewed by Skip (*) and Bone, et al before being quickly sold to Japan. 1985 Transpac saw the first three SC-70s: Factory boat Blondie, SoCal partner-owned Citius,   Savings & Loan scandal dude from SD with Kathmandu, along with Geraghty built N/M 68 Swiftsure III for Frazee Bros. I think there was one more skinny N/M 68, but old age sucks as Longy concurs. Next year, Roy Disney hired John Heinemann of Hi tech boats to come West and build the first next-gen N/M sled. Massive quantities of Carbon, Nomex, and cocaine resulted in Pyewacket becoming the first of several flared topside, narrow waterline designs from N/M. Dencho built Cheval & Marishiten, Betts built Maverick out of alloy & Westerly built a 66 foot version with more sail called Pandemonium. Many stories there. Dencho also built Cheetah, a 66 foot Peterson design for the man himself, Dick Pennington. Meanwhile, carbon fiber began arriving at the chicken coop...   

These were great times, with some amazing characters, some of whom are no longer with us. Paul Fernald (Mauler) deserves kind mention for his contributions to the Pendragon, Blondie & Ragtime programs.

Please fill in the gaps, and share stories about these amazing boats, and amazing people who owned and sailed them. Have any of you LB boys compiled the unabridged book of Pennington yet? 

 

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I Worked for Dick and Doug on Cheetah, I worked on Swiftsure 3 for Doug, Victoria for Michael, Mongoose for Joe, Magnitude for Doug, Cheval was our neighbor, Hal!,  as was Silver Bullet and Citius, Rags, Blondie, I even jumped in and helped with the first Pyewacket keel refit,  I can say those were the best times, so many great people I met and still know today, my best friend was responsible for nearly every one of those gigs in some shape or form, all ended well and I am still good friends with them all.

All these guys, both living and those who have past on, and all the other owners that jumped in and built a program, did so much for so many, that I cannot overstate its effect on the marine industry.

They each built a legacy that, when you read this thread, says it all.

As far as stories? 

Never. 

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Dennis told me SAGA was the lightest sled he'd built..something I soberly reflected on delivering SAGA north from the '85 Cabo Race ...Abeam Cabo San Lazaro we hit a whale at night..prop shaft bent and keel began leaking at its forward attachment.  Limped into San Diego, bailing with a bucket.

Fast forward to a humorous scene aboard SAGA in the '85 Transpac.  When the wind came aft and the spinnaker was set on the third day, Tom Blackaller, inshore racer, sailmaker, and raconteur par excellence, couldn't believe we were going to carry 300 pounds of wet jibs the remaining 1500 downwind miles to Honolulu. He reached into his duffel, wrote Doug a check for the headsail inventory, and ordered the crew to jettison all the jibs overboard.

Cooler heads prevailed and the check was not accepted. But Blackaller never let us forget for the rest of the race. I can still hear his cackling lament every time he came on watch: “Just think how much faster we'd be going if we weren't carrying all these damn sails.”

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On 5/17/2019 at 7:00 PM, some dude said:

So that's the old Citius aka the City Bus?  Sad.  Had some good times on that boat.  Had a huge frac rig for a while

 

Pretty proud to have sailed on her, if only for one season.  Did bow when that nasty storm blew through in the 2011 Mac.  Never saw light like that in the sky.  

Saw her last fall on a trip to Santa Cruz.  Personally, I was a little sad to see her in that state.

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13 hours ago, Coolerking said:

I Worked for Dick and Doug on Cheetah, I worked on Swiftsure 3 for Doug, Victoria for Michael, Mongoose for Joe, Magnitude for Doug, Cheval was our neighbor, Hal!,  as was Silver Bullet and Citius, Rags, Blondie, I even jumped in and helped with the first Pyewacket keel refit,  I can say those were the best times, so many great people I met and still know today, my best friend was responsible for nearly every one of those gigs in some shape or form, all ended well and I am still good friends with them all.

All these guys, both living and those who have past on, and all the other owners that jumped in and built a program, did so much for so many, that I cannot overstate its effect on the marine industry.

They each built a legacy that, when you read this thread, says it all.

As far as stories? 

Never. 

I loved it when you were on the gurney grinding Pyewacket’s keelbox, with Rick and Gregg rolling you by your ankles!

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9 hours ago, silent bob said:

I loved it when you were on the gurney grinding Pyewacket’s keelbox, with Rick and Gregg rolling you by your ankles!

Haha! That was a real shit show!!!

Its amazing how the Kevlar piled up so fast!

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40 minutes ago, Coolerking said:

Haha! That was a real shit show!!!

Its amazing how the Kevlar piled up so fast!

Been there, done that as well.  Came out looking like a teddy bear. 

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  • 1 month later...
2 hours ago, Blitz said:

I think that one's accounted for.  Where did you see it?  It used to be in Tacoma, wa.  Raced on it a few times, very cool boat but been cruzerized.

Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada. Looks like it may be just passing through...

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On ‎6‎/‎30‎/‎2019 at 11:55 AM, Snapper said:

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Orient Express yet. I saw her in Falmouth, U.K. a few years back. Full refit, probably by Pendennis, and was heading for the Med, I believe.

 

 

OE Falmouth 1.jpg

OE Falmouth 2.jpg

Which sled is this from the Excel List above?

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The Original Orient Express /// Equation

19

1993

SC

Orient Express

US-93

Equation, then Orient Express again?

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On 6/29/2019 at 6:42 PM, pinhead said:

Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada. Looks like it may be just passing through...

Now that I think about it Drumbeat was a Nelson Marek not a Santa Cruz.

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15 minutes ago, Blitz said:

Now that I think about it Drumbeat was a Nelson Marek not a Santa Cruz.

Did Drumbeat’s owner by a SC?  When I worked on Cynosure, all the big orange life jackets were still labeled Drumbeat (until they got replaced later that year).  

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3 minutes ago, Monkey said:

Did Drumbeat’s owner by a SC?  When I worked on Cynosure, all the big orange life jackets were still labeled Drumbeat (until they got replaced later that year).  

I don't know if he bought another boat.  Drumbeat sat unused for a few years in Tacoma and had a fair bit of deffered maintenance that needed to be done.  It was sold maybe a year or so ago.

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2 minutes ago, Blitz said:

I don't know if he bought another boat.  Drumbeat sat unused for a few years in Tacoma and had a fair bit of deffered maintenance that needed to be done.  It was sold maybe a year or so ago.

Very different Drumbeat then. There was a Drumbeat that was an SC70, that found its way to Lake Michigan many years ago. It was bought by Terry Kohler, became Cynosure, and was properly pimped out with every go fast bit the class would allow. Differed maintenance wasn’t an option we were allowed. 

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5 hours ago, stayoutofthemiddle said:

Which sled is this from the Excel List above?

 

4 hours ago, FINS said:

The Original Orient Express /// Equation

19

1993

SC

Orient Express

US-93

Equation, then Orient Express again?

There's your answer. As you can see, the cockpit was changed up with twin wheels and the interior was really cool. 

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Fun (?) story from the Orient Express build.... they originally decided to go with a fairly radical layup for the carbon deck build and some of the owner's reps were there when the deck was popped out of the mold.  Well... apparently something was wrong in the layup schedule, and the deck pretty much disintegrated as soon as it was off the tooling.  Not sure if was materials or temp or process, but I'm told the sound of the deck delaminating in real-time was incredible.

An hour later, the remains of the deck had been cut up into chunks and put in the dumpster, and a slightly more conservative layup was uh... discussed...

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We had a daysail jaunt aboard Orient Express - the local race boat program I sailed on sponsored their arrival party.  Anyway,  our skipper wanted to get some business done so she fired up her portable telephone and made a call,  then realized it might get wet and ducked below deck.

Call lost.

Came back up,  redialed, connected and ducked inside again.   dropped call again -   "this damn thing isn't working" 

Yep - carbon deck.

I still remember how fast we went uphill on a flat day off Kahala - like we were on rails.

 

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8 minutes ago, stayoutofthemiddle said:

Is there any more detail on this? Why would you abandon ship?! It's not the keel! Just drop sails and limp home under power.

Well, if you're interested in speculating before the facts are in you can keep speculating until you reach the conclusion that if it's a well prepared boat with an experienced crew, there must have been a big hole in the bottom of the boat

Or you can wait for the facts.  They just got to shore a few hours ago, and it turns out that:

 

Wait for it

 

There was a big hole in the bottom of the boat.

 

Now back to your regular programming 

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9 minutes ago, some dude said:

Well, if you're interested in speculating before the facts are in you can keep speculating until you reach the conclusion that if it's a well prepared boat with an experienced crew, there must have been a big hole in the bottom of the boat

Or you can wait for the facts.  They just got to shore a few hours ago, and it turns out that:

 

Wait for it

 

There was a big hole in the bottom of the boat.

 

Now back to your regular programming 

Aggressive! Just interested to hear what happened. Most discussion on SA is speculation!  Wouldn't be the first boat that snapped a rudder and wasn't taking on water.

 

If you want to see what real speculation looks like read the "My Song fell off a cargo?!" Thread!

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1 hour ago, stayoutofthemiddle said:

Is there any more detail on this? Why would you abandon ship?! It's not the keel! Just drop sails and limp home under power.

I can’t speak for OEX, but have spent a lot of hours crawling around the rudder quadrant of SC70’s.  They aren’t separated by a watertight bulkhead (at least the three I’ve seen). Rudder damage could easily equate to rapid water ingress. As others said, if the damage prevents you from dropping the rudder and plugging the hole, you’re basically shit outta luck. 

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56 minutes ago, Monkey said:

I can’t speak for OEX, but have spent a lot of hours crawling around the rudder quadrant of SC70’s.  They aren’t separated by a watertight bulkhead (at least the three I’ve seen). Rudder damage could easily equate to rapid water ingress. As others said, if the damage prevents you from dropping the rudder and plugging the hole, you’re basically shit outta luck. 

Makes sense. I didn't realize some race boats have the rudder box in a separate water tight bulk head but this makes sense incase the post rips a hole in the bottom.

How many boats are done this way? Seems like a sensible design for offshore sailing, especially with all of those containers floating out there!

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4 hours ago, stayoutofthemiddle said:

Is there any more detail on this? Why would you abandon ship?! It's not the keel! Just drop sails and limp home under power.

 

4 hours ago, some dude said:

Well, if you're interested in speculating before the facts are in you can keep speculating until you reach the conclusion that if it's a well prepared boat with an experienced crew, there must have been a big hole in the bottom of the boat

Or you can wait for the facts.  They just got to shore a few hours ago, and it turns out that:

 

Wait for it

 

There was a big hole in the bottom of the boat.

 

Now back to your regular programming 

Thats why you Abandon Ship, the Ship Abandons YOU!

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Anyone know what other names OEX had?

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@Essex Didn't look there but I found a site with them listed. She was also named Renegade at one time.

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13 minutes ago, sledracr said:

I’m not aware of a SC70 called Renegade.  The only Renegade I know of was the Andrews 70 built in Estonia.  

Well it was Renegade in Detroit ….

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On 5/13/2019 at 12:00 PM, stayoutofthemiddle said:

Did any of the sleds ever make it down to KWRW? Seems like a lot of boat to take on the road!

Well Starlight Express won Lauderdale to KW in 87 so maybe. She also set records for vineyard race and MH-Halifax in 89.

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/fl-xpm-1987-01-18-8701040687-story.html

 

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Correction, she was first over the line in 87 which was I believe the inaugural KWRW, presume they stuck around, can't seem to find any results for that first KWRW. 

I do recall a sailing world article that began by asking "what's a socal sled doing over here on East coast?".

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On 5/20/2019 at 9:57 AM, stayoutofthemiddle said:

I see Chardonnay II (White Hull) on the spread sheet list was purpose built as a charter. How could they justify that cost, ROI? Converting old race boat is one thing, but building a new one just for charters? Seems like a long grind to get cash positive...

tax write off ...

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14 hours ago, FINS said:

Well it was Renegade in Detroit ….

@FINSThank You. I grew up in your town. Went to GPSHS. Cheers. 

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1 hour ago, stayoutofthemiddle said:

Is that the same Andrews 70 called Decision? I remember a KWRW back in college where that boat was there when it was new(ish). Circa 2002?

Decision was the Pegasus Andrews 70 Turbo, which was the Cheval.

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Not as complete/current, but here's the list of Andrews-70s I've paid attention to... 

Seven built to the original design and then 2 built in Estonia to (according to Alan Andrews) a more powerful design - longer waterline, wider.  To the best of my knowledge, only two were built to that later design.

 

Built

Builder

Original name

Original SailNo

Later Name(s)

1991

Choate

Victoria

55555

Front Runner, Grins, Tital, Shindig, Terrapin, Simon Says

1991

Choate

Alchemy

97999

Arctos (Michigan, 2018)

1992?

Choate

Stella Maris

<cruiser>

 

1995

Choate

Vicki

US-68 (TP-03)

US-685?  Condor, Mr. Bill

1995

Choate

Cheval-95

46269

Pegasus-70, Decision, Runaway

1997

Choate

Magnitude

46469, US-678?

Equation, Pegasus-68, Pyewacket (2015)

???

Choate

Elysium

<cruiser>

Elainium, Bella Uno

 

 

 

 

 

1994

Akton

Trader

35111

 

1994

Akton

Renegade

CAN-55

Sank?

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IOR 70-raters were an entirely different beast.  80-85 foot maxi-boats weighing several times what a “sled” weighs. 

Yeah, the sleds were designed to fit under the max IOR rating of 70.0, but that’s the only similarity they had with IOR “70-raters ”  

 

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Andrews 70's and SC-70's were both 68 feet LOA.  Andrew's 70's have about a foot more waterline and  other things being equal, have a tick more speed on the straight away. My 2 cents after racing both side-by-side in many buoys races.

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6 minutes ago, Essex said:

Yes I know bout the 'regular' maxis of that era, but a 70 rater is a 70 rater imo, just a different take on how to fit the max rating allowed under the rule.

Except they were entirely different vessels built for entirely different purposes. Like comparing a C&C35 to a Moth.

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Guess we are back to question did 70 refer to length (perhaps rounded up a little) or rating.

All good with me.

Interesting that the sleds live on actively racing competitively and are so much loved whereas the likes of kialoa, boomerang etc if surviving are at best restored and doing s/h appearances and the like or of course the Aussie backpacking charter biz. (Am sure there are others around).

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10 hours ago, Essex said:

Guess we are back to question did 70 refer to length (perhaps rounded up a little) or rating.

All good with me.

Interesting that the sleds live on actively racing competitively and are so much loved whereas the likes of kialoa, boomerang etc if surviving are at best restored and doing s/h appearances and the like or of course the Aussie backpacking charter biz. (Am sure there are others around).

Turns out Bill Lee was right-fast is fun 

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Somewhere in the bowels of CalYC is the Pandemonium Trophy.  Is a halfhull model of Pandemonium, upside down with the keel studs sticking out.  It was awarded at Cal Cup for “Excellence in Underachievement”!  I’ll have to head to the 49er Saloon on PCH in the LBC to shoot the shit with Frisch!  

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On 7/18/2019 at 12:45 AM, Essex said:

Guess we are back to question did 70 refer to length (perhaps rounded up a little) or rating.

All good with me.

Interesting that the sleds live on actively racing competitively and are so much loved whereas the likes of kialoa, boomerang etc if surviving are at best restored and doing s/h appearances and the like or of course the Aussie backpacking charter biz. (Am sure there are others around).

afaik.

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3 hours ago, Great Red Shark said:

So,  the boat that was lost was a past winner of Transpac  ( under John DeLaura,  in '91, I think )

Spot on.

OEX was SILVER BULLET, SC-70 #9, launched in 1988. Under John DeLaura's ownership, SILVER BULLET won a Clean Sweep in the 1991 Transpac when she was First-to-Finish (Barn Door Trophy), first in Class A, and first Overall.

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1 hour ago, sleddog said:

. Under John DeLaura's ownership, SILVER BULLET won a Clean Sweep in the 1991 Transpac when she was First-to-Finish (Barn Door Trophy), first in Class A, and first Overall.

The year was 1993.  Brain fade.

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18 hours ago, sleddog said:

Spot on.

OEX was SILVER BULLET, SC-70 #9, launched in 1988. Under John DeLaura's ownership, SILVER BULLET won a Clean Sweep in the 1991 Transpac when she was First-to-Finish (Barn Door Trophy), first in Class A, and first Overall.

 

16 hours ago, sleddog said:

The year was 1993.  Brain fade.

Yep.  Sad loss but as someone else pointed out, she's in an appropriate resting place.

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