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Not a racer, but am I going to get bored with a Capri 14.2?


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 I’m not interested in racing, which is a good thing because I’m incapable of any sailing that requires a great deal of athleticism. 

 I simply do not possess the agility, flexibility or stamina needed for leaping about the cockpit and hiking out so far that my head touches the water. 

 On the flipside, however, I am not looking for a tugboat or something I will quickly outgrow, find boring, and get stuck with trying to sell. 

 I can’t count the number of boats I’ve seen on CL that remain there for six months straight without selling.. 

 I’ve read countless articles and reviews, watched YouTube videos, and searched for posts on forums like this, so I have a great deal of information of what to look out for, pros and cons, and  tips to make the boat easier to deal with. Climbing back in after recovering from capsizing seems to be a popular topic, given the massive amount of freeboard. 

 For me the pros are the high boom height, roomy cockpit, furling jib, light weight, and proclaimed stability. 

 Cons are the freeboard height, seemingly beginner-oriented performance, and the lack of a motor mount or ladder on the gunwale.

 Oh yeah, and don’t get me started on the hideous, multicolored sails! Who thought that blue, purple and pink would make a good color combination on a sailboat??   Do those sales come with a clown suit?  :p 

I found two, 14.2’s that are reasonably local  that are in absolutely perfect condition for between $2000 and a $2400.  

 I’m just worried this boat will sit in storage, collecting dust while I try to find somebody to buy it. 

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Winston29 said:

 I’m not interested in racing, which is a good thing because I’m incapable of any sailing that requires a great deal of athleticism. 

 I simply do not possess the agility, flexibility or stamina needed for leaping about the cockpit and hiking out so far that my head touches the water. 

 On the flipside, however, I am not looking for a tugboat or something I will quickly outgrow, find boring, and get stuck with trying to sell. 

 I can’t count the number of boats I’ve seen on CL that remain there for six months straight without selling.. 

 I’ve read countless articles and reviews, watched YouTube videos, and searched for posts on forums like this, so I have a great deal of information of what to look out for, pros and cons, and  tips to make the boat easier to deal with. Climbing back in after recovering from capsizing seems to be a popular topic, given the massive amount of freeboard. 

 For me the pros are the high boom height, roomy cockpit, furling jib, light weight, and proclaimed stability. 

 Cons are the freeboard height, seemingly beginner-oriented performance, and the lack of a motor mount or ladder on the gunwale.

 Oh yeah, and don’t get me started on the hideous, multicolored sails! Who thought that blue, purple and pink would make a good color combination on a sailboat??   Do those sales come with a clown suit?  :p 

I found two, 14.2’s that are reasonably local  that are in absolutely perfect condition for between $2000 and a $2400.  

 I’m just worried this boat will sit in storage, collecting dust while I try to find somebody to buy it. 

 

 

 

Take the boat out for a sail. If you come back with a huge smile on your face it's the boat for you.

Before you buy do a capsize drill. Make sure you can get back in the boat. 

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 Do sellers let you take their boat out for a spin?

Most of the boats I’ve found aren’t anywhere near a body of water. 

 I trained in capsize recovery using a Vanguard 15, which admittedly has less freeboard to deal with. I was able to get back in the boat after righting, but it took a bit of grunting and groaning. 

 I read an article somewhere that said if a folding ladder wasn’t an option, using a length of rope with a couple of loops tied it, hung over the transom, worked pretty well.  The only real problem being the tendency of the rope, and your foot, to get pushed under the boat while trying to climb back in. 

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3 hours ago, martin.langhoff said:

We're entering the realm of too much thinking, talking, or forum posting.  Join that club you mentioned. Sail. Sail anything you can get on. 

Thanks for the reality check..  I can really take things too far.  ;)

 

I'll shut up now.  

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9 hours ago, Winston29 said:

 Do sellers let you take their boat out for a spin?

Most of the boats I’ve found aren’t anywhere near a body of water. 

 I trained in capsize recovery using a Vanguard 15, which admittedly has less freeboard to deal with. I was able to get back in the boat after righting, but it took a bit of grunting and groaning. 

 I read an article somewhere that said if a folding ladder wasn’t an option, using a length of rope with a couple of loops tied it, hung over the transom, worked pretty well.  The only real problem being the tendency of the rope, and your foot, to get pushed under the boat while trying to climb back in. 

I strongly suspect that the people who advocate climbing in over the transom have never tried it in real life.

If you are in the water, holding the boat by the transom, your body is a sea anchor. The wind is blowing, right? The boat pivots downwind and tries to run away from you.

I generally climb in by the sidestay. Gives a handhold, keeps the boat steady, yes it's difficult to not pull the boat over on top of you, but at least you're pulling it to windward. The boat stays put.

Test sails- for small boats, this is rare. I've done it when selling a boat, but it was a nice day and a nice sail anyway. If there isn't a body of water right nearby, chances are very slim. But it never hurts to ask.

If you get bored with a boat, you can do any of a several things- take the boat to an exotic wild location, take it out in really crazy wind, re-rig it with some big-ass sails, or just sell it.

FB- Doug

 

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6 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

I strongly suspect that the people who advocate climbing in over the transom have never tried it in real life.

If you are in the water, holding the boat by the transom, your body is a sea anchor. The wind is blowing, right? The boat pivots downwind and tries to run away from you.

I generally climb in by the sidestay. Gives a handhold, keeps the boat steady, yes it's difficult to not pull the boat over on top of you, but at least you're pulling it to windward. The boat stays put.

Test sails- for small boats, this is rare. I've done it when selling a boat, but it was a nice day and a nice sail anyway. If there isn't a body of water right nearby, chances are very slim. But it never hurts to ask.

If you get bored with a boat, you can do any of a several things- take the boat to an exotic wild location, take it out in really crazy wind, re-rig it with some big-ass sails, or just sell it.

FB- Doug

 

transom recovery is fine if someone is already in the boat and has it under control, and it's blowing less than 15.... (at least for the c420 or the 29er)

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12 hours ago, fastyacht said:

Do you sail?

How often?

Please answer this question, and then maybe something coherent can come from this thread.

Oops.  I thought I included that info in my first post...  Sorry about that.  

Do I sail?  Not yet.  I just completed beginner and advanced dinghy lessons last month.  I did quite well in the classes.  

 

Tonight I was offered a free, Mod-1 CC-14.2.   It's in OK shape, but will need all new running rigging, a good cleaning, and possibly sails ( I wasn't able to locate the sails tonight).  It needs a little gelcoat work on the bow, too, but just a little.  The cuddy door, currently made of wood and looking like a homemade job, will also need to be replaced.  There's some oxidation on the spars, but not too bad.  Pretty much what you'd expect from a boat that's been sitting in the elements for years.  

it comes on a galvanized, Calkins trailer, and both the boat and trailer are currently registered.  

It used to be a class boat for a local sailing school, but now they want it gone, so they offered it to me for free.  A sailing friend has offered to put it in his driveway and help me restore it, and I've found a secure, dry storage space for it, 100 yards from the boat ramp, for $50 a month, where I can keep it. 

If it turns out that parts aren't hard to find, I'll likely take the boat.  It could be a fun project, and the asking price ($0.00) saves me some bread on the repairs.  

I take back my original question.  After watching a few more YT videos, it looks like it could be a fun little boat.  

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6 hours ago, Winston29 said:

Oops.  I thought I included that info in my first post...  Sorry about that.  

Do I sail?  Not yet.  I just completed beginner and advanced dinghy lessons last month.  I did quite well in the classes.  

 

Tonight I was offered a free, Mod-1 CC-14.2.   It's in OK shape, but will need all new running rigging, a good cleaning, and possibly sails ( I wasn't able to locate the sails tonight).  It needs a little gelcoat work on the bow, too, but just a little.  The cuddy door, currently made of wood and looking like a homemade job, will also need to be replaced.  There's some oxidation on the spars, but not too bad.  Pretty much what you'd expect from a boat that's been sitting in the elements for years.  

it comes on a galvanized, Calkins trailer, and both the boat and trailer are currently registered.  

It used to be a class boat for a local sailing school, but now they want it gone, so they offered it to me for free.  A sailing friend has offered to put it in his driveway and help me restore it, and I've found a secure, dry storage space for it, 100 yards from the boat ramp, for $50 a month, where I can keep it. 

If it turns out that parts aren't hard to find, I'll likely take the boat.  It could be a fun project, and the asking price ($0.00) saves me some bread on the repairs.  

I take back my original question.  After watching a few more YT videos, it looks like it could be a fun little boat.  

Go for it!

Parts is parts........

FB- Doug

 

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Agreed, this sounds like a great outcome.  You will get some experience in boat repair (always useful and sometimes enjoyable), and have a nice boat to grow your sailing skills.  If you find that you want to upgrade to a higher performance boat in a few years, you can pay it forward and give this boat to someone else starting in the sport.   The shop I worked for in high school in the 1980s sold a lot of Capri 14.2s.  They are tough little boats, and fairly simple to rig, so I suspect that you should have minimal trouble getting her back on the water in fully functional form.  I never sailed one in conditions over 10-12 knots, so I can't speak to how they do in a blow, but in moderate winds of 5-10, they are a great learning boat, and one of the few small boats that don't require the flexibility of a gymnast to sail.

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16 hours ago, Winston29 said:

Tonight I was offered a free, Mod-1 CC-14.2.   It's in OK shape, but will need all new running rigging, a good cleaning, and possibly sails

Go for it. 

And still, as you haven't sailed much, join that local sailing club as well and sail their boats while you learn a bit more, and while you repair / refurb your boat. Depending on time, skill, parts availability and money, the refurb could take all summer and then some. You don't want to risk that.

You want to sail in summer (club boats if that's what's at hand), and repair/refurb in winter. If it turns out you dont' enjoy the repair/refurb work, you've gotten your sailing done, and you can pass on the "free" boat to someone who does enjoy it.

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22 hours ago, fastyacht said:

On the other hand, in waves, the rudder and stuff and the transom going up and down. Not good for body parts.

if you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a rudder... 

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Well, the free boat deal fell through.  It turned out it was given to someone else a while ago, and they used it for parts.............................................  

 

So I bought a mint condition, '92 Mod 2 and took it out on Redwood Creek this afternoon.  :D  If you know the area, we went out well past the power lines, but not out of the channel and into the bay.  

Thank God I had a friend with me who knows how to sail, or I would have been doing a lot of swimming today.  I don't know what the wind speed was, but if I had been alone, I would't have gone out at all.  I'm still not used to dealing with the tiller and main sheet together.  Add the jib to the mix, and I'm overwhelmed!

I definitely need a LOT of practice.  Even after my successful dinghies lessons, I felt really lost and made a lot of mistakes.  One of the biggest, or at least most common, was losing track of where I wanted to point the boat after a tack.  I know about picking an object on the shore *before* staring the tack, but I wasn't sure what object I wanted.  I also had trouble finding the proper point of sail, just after or between tacks, and did a bit of wandering about trying to find it.  Not always, but sometimes.  

I wasn't a big fan of the "Barbie sails" (blue, purple and pink), but we got more than one compliment on them while out on the water.  

Boy, that boat swings around FAST in a tack!  :o

All in all, though, a very fun day with plenty of hiking and not a single capsize..  Though we came pretty close a time or two.  :)  Now I'm beat.  I'm not kidding.  

 

W

 

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Don't worry about getting disoriented when you tack.  This type of learning is best done with practice.  Keep your head down and laugh it off.  You are on the right track though, thinking through your new angle and looking for a reference point on shore.  The more you do it, the less you will think about it.   Every once in a while I still 'lose the wind' on a tack or gybe if I get distracted, and I've been at it for 45 years.   

If you haven't done so, I'd recommend at some point soon capsizing the boat in a controlled situation.  Perhaps when you are ready to come in for the day, on a warm day.  It is great to understand what happens and how much effort is involved in righting the boat when you are mentally ready for it.  That way, when you are surprised by a capsize, you have the confidence of knowing that you CAN right it.

Very smart move heading out with someone more experienced initially. That is a great way to increase your comfort envelope while staying safe.  It sounds to me like you have the right boat.  Sailing small boats is challenging, mentally and physically, and that's why we do it.  There is always more to learn, you can always get better.   The lessons are usually accompanied by a nice view and if you are doing it right, good company as well.  Enjoy!

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12 hours ago, Winston29 said:

Well, the free boat deal fell through.  It turned out it was given to someone else a while ago, and they used it for parts.............................................  

 

So I bought a mint condition, '92 Mod 2 and took it out on Redwood Creek this afternoon.  :D  If you know the area, we went out well past the power lines, but not out of the channel and into the bay.  

Thank God I had a friend with me who knows how to sail, or I would have been doing a lot of swimming today.  I don't know what the wind speed was, but if I had been alone, I would't have gone out at all.  I'm still not used to dealing with the tiller and main sheet together.  Add the jib to the mix, and I'm overwhelmed!

I definitely need a LOT of practice.  Even after my successful dinghies lessons, I felt really lost and made a lot of mistakes.  One of the biggest, or at least most common, was losing track of where I wanted to point the boat after a tack.  I know about picking an object on the shore *before* staring the tack, but I wasn't sure what object I wanted.  I also had trouble finding the proper point of sail, just after or between tacks, and did a bit of wandering about trying to find it.  Not always, but sometimes.  

I wasn't a big fan of the "Barbie sails" (blue, purple and pink), but we got more than one compliment on them while out on the water.  

Boy, that boat swings around FAST in a tack!  :o

All in all, though, a very fun day with plenty of hiking and not a single capsize..  Though we came pretty close a time or two.  :)  Now I'm beat.  I'm not kidding.  

 

W

 

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Congrats! Nice looking boat, looks like the trailer is pretty good too.

Some comments.... these boats will spin like a top. The rudder is capable of going to almost 90 and the boat can turn fast/hard enough to fling you out! So, positive control of the tiller is a must. Get used to turning in definite increments, first with the rudder over by a tiny bit for course correction, then by 10~15 to take a new course; when tacking or other maneuvering you should only put it past 45 (more like 30 really) in rare special circumstances. [edit to add] sorry if this is advice that's been repeated, but do not ever..... never never never!! ... ever let go of the tiller

When tacking: Are you facing forward during tacks? If not, try to practice swapping sides with the sheet/tiller behind your back, so you can always look where the boat is headed. Choosing a landmark about 90 from your heading when beginning a tack, that's an excellent way to get/keep oriented. At some point as you gain experience, you'll be able to tack the boat from close-hauled to close-hauled without even thinking about it.

These kick-up rudders have a feature that is also a bug- the rudder blade exerts a LOT more leverage when it's kicked up. In stronger winds, once you're out in deep water, very much worth the trouble to stop the boat (heave-to or whatever) and make sure the rudder blade is all the way down and held tightly there. OTOH in light air, it makes it easier to feel the rudder, steer positively, and scull a bit, with the rudder blade kicked up slightly.

Last, consider taking the mainsheet cleat off. Use the ratchet, always keep the mainsheet in your hand. It will lead to much more confidence in boat-handling and many fewer capsize close calls. I've worked with a couple of youth programs so long I've forgotten what it's like to sail a small boat with the mainsheet cleated.

Plus+ on getting a boat in primo condition. You can enjoy sailing instead of fixing! Looking forward to hearing more adventures

FB- Doug

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  • 1 year later...
On 6/3/2019 at 8:01 AM, Steam Flyer said:

Congrats! Nice looking boat, looks like the trailer is pretty good too.

Some comments.... these boats will spin like a top. The rudder is capable of going to almost 90 and the boat can turn fast/hard enough to fling you out!

You weren't kidding.  I had to be super careful not to toss my crewmates over the side when tacking!  On the plus side, it meant tacking in very light wind was super easy.  

Nice little boat, but just not the right design for me.  I sold it in May, and now I'm searching for a trimaran to take its place.  

I'm thinking about a WindRider 16, but you just can't find them for sale in California.  :unsure:

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On 5/29/2019 at 4:58 PM, fastyacht said:

On the other hand, in waves, the rudder and stuff and the transom going up and down. Not good for body parts.

Can it it be as soprano inducing as the Laser Flange?

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15 hours ago, Winston29 said:

You weren't kidding.  I had to be super careful not to toss my crewmates over the side when tacking!  On the plus side, it meant tacking in very light wind was super easy.  

Nice little boat, but just not the right design for me.  I sold it in May, and now I'm searching for a trimaran to take its place.  

I'm thinking about a WindRider 16, but you just can't find them for sale in California.  :unsure:

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Cant offer a trimaran, but I can offer a JY15 racing dingy to you for $1250. A great step up the ladder from the 14.2. (https://hudsonvalley.craigslist.org/boa/d/cold-spring-1997-hunter-jy15-sailboat-8/7157116263.html)

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3 hours ago, JBOATTROUBLEMAKER said:

Cant offer a trimaran, but I can offer a JY15 racing dingy to you for $1250. A great step up the ladder from the 14.2. 

Thanks, but dinghies are the wrong design for me.  They require too much "gymnastics" to sail. 

Old age and a dodgy lower back make that out of the question.  Armchair sailing, on the other hand, well that just might be an option!  

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17 minutes ago, Winston29 said:

Thanks, but dinghies are the wrong design for me.  They require too much "gymnastics" to sail. 

Old age and a dodgy lower back make that out of the question.  Armchair sailing, on the other hand, well that just might be an option!  

Get wet on a Weta!

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46 minutes ago, Winston29 said:

Thanks, but dinghies are the wrong design for me.  They require too much "gymnastics" to sail. 

Old age and a dodgy lower back make that out of the question.  Armchair sailing, on the other hand, well that just might be an option!  

A Trimaran may make that worse for you. I would suggest a more stable and less hiking intense boat like a Lightning.

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1 hour ago, JBOATTROUBLEMAKER said:

A Trimaran may make that worse for you. I would suggest a more stable and less hiking intense boat like a Lightning.

Thanks for the suggestion, but anything requiring hiking-out, climbing all over, or sitting with my back unassisted for any length of time, is not an option.  

I'm currently looking at the WR, and at one point the Hobie AI (no longer desired), because they closely match the seating position I have on both the touring kayaks and recumbent bicycles I've owned for the last 16 years.  

If I can sit supported, as if in a chair, I'm fine all day.  The problem I'm having is that used WR's are impossible to find on the "Left Coast", and new ones are, IMO, too expensive for a plastic bathtub with amas and a sail ($6,850, shipped, without a trailer).  

 

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3 minutes ago, Winston29 said:

Thanks for the suggestion, but anything requiring hiking-out, climbing all over, or sitting with my back unassisted for any length of time, is not an option.  

I'm currently looking at the WR, and at one point the Hobie AI (no longer desired), because they closely match the seating position I have on both the touring kayaks and recumbent bicycles I've owned for the last 16 years.  

If I can sit supported, as if in a chair, I'm fine all day.  The problem I'm having is that used WR's are impossible to find on the "Left Coast", and new ones are, IMO, too expensive for a plastic bathtub with amas and a sail ($6,850, shipped, without a trailer).  

 

I am having a similar problem right now looking for an RS500.

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5 hours ago, Winston29 said:

Thanks, but dinghies are the wrong design for me.  They require too much "gymnastics" to sail. 

Old age and a dodgy lower back make that out of the question.  Armchair sailing, on the other hand, well that just might be an option!  

 

2 hours ago, Winston29 said:

Thanks for the suggestion, but anything requiring hiking-out, climbing all over, or sitting with my back unassisted for any length of time, is not an option.  

I'm currently looking at the WR, and at one point the Hobie AI (no longer desired), because they closely match the seating position I have on both the touring kayaks and recumbent bicycles I've owned for the last 16 years.  

If I can sit supported, as if in a chair, I'm fine all day.  The problem I'm having is that used WR's are impossible to find on the "Left Coast", and new ones are, IMO, too expensive for a plastic bathtub with amas and a sail ($6,850, shipped, without a trailer).  

 

armchair-sailors.png?fit=660,330&ssl=1

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On 8/20/2020 at 7:40 PM, Alan Crawford said:

Weta trimaran - especially if you have a place to keep it assembled (see Weta thread on Multihull Anarchy)

Thanks, but I can tell just by looking at the way the guy is sitting in it, that I wouldn't be able to sail it pain-free.  

Hell, my lower back gave me a frightening jolt this morning, simply because I had the audacity to sleep on my side last night.  :blink:

Now I'm moving around my apartment, bracing myself on things, like I'm 95 years old......  Which in a way I am.  :P  

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It is great that you are still considering sailing as many would have given up by now. So you should be encouraged by that. Your journey has certainly been well documented....

Compromises may need to be considered and maybe a boat for disabled people might be one answer? I know you are not disabled,  but these craft may suit your needs better. Standard sailing dinghies require some form of mobility and boats designed for less able bodied people may be more ideal.

Or a small keel boat. A 2.4 would be another option. 

 

 

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Actually, the Weta can be modified to be sailed by a handicapped person.  There was a gal who was wheelchair bound skippering her Weta at Charlotte's Harbor last year, she also sailed with a crew.  There was also another Weta with a crew as well, not handicapped, and they raced each other.  All four involved had fun.

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44 minutes ago, Admiral Hornblower said:

Illusion 12 

Team Paradise trains disabled sailors to win Gold >> Scuttlebutt ...

That's Not an Illusion 12,  It's an International 2.4 Metre,  Norlin mk3 one design, as used by the Para-Olympics.

This boat being launched is an Illusion 12, it's a completely Different deck. (and a bit shorter)

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On 5/29/2019 at 6:08 AM, Steam Flyer said:

I strongly suspect that the people who advocate climbing in over the transom have never tried it in real life.

I don't teach it anymore. Too many times watching a dragging human at the transom cause the boat to head down, with kite flapping, and rip right into a death roll.
I get that the person inside can steer and help, but unless you're actively steering, its moot.

Side or die.

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"Will I get bored sailing (xyz) boat?"

Well, that's a flawed and loaded question.

My perspective is a bit different. I've been sailing for over 50 years. I remember sailing as a tike. I race 505, FD, canoes. I race across oceans. I raced in college. I love heavy weather sailing. But I also am fastest in a drifter. I like gunkholing and exploring. I have an endless emotional connection to old wooden boats.

The past couple weekends I've gone out for a sail in a beetle cat. I loved it.

Sail for the sailing. Never mind the type of boat. Sailing is so much more than merely the boat type. Enjoy what you have--listen to the water burbling at the bow, play the windshifts, watch the clouds moving over the hills on the far shore, watch the birds, catch some fish, dream of going to another stretch of coastline, or planning a camp cruise, or a regatta.

There is so much to do, you can never get bored, even if you are sailing a Kool Snark.

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On 8/26/2020 at 12:05 AM, ttc546 said:

It is great that you are still considering sailing as many would have given up by now. So you should be encouraged by that. Your journey has certainly been well documented....

Compromises may need to be considered and maybe a boat for disabled people might be one answer?

 

 

That's why I'm leaning towards the WindRider 16.  They're a bit goofy looking, but the seating and ergos look like they'd be just the ticket for my physical requirements.  I've also always had a thing for trimarans, even if that "thing" was purely based on aesthetics.  

I do like how you can overpower the rig (a little) and not capsize, and I really like the lack of needing to hike out.  All the controls are within easy reach from the cockpit, so no more climbing about the boat, trying to keep everything trim and upright.  

As to fastyacht's comment about getting bored.  Perhaps what I should have said was, "Will I quickly outgrow the 14.2?"

I found out the answer to that was No.  It was such a tender and responsive little boat, I had to pay 110% attention if the wind picked up, or I was going for a swim.  

I do remember the enjoyment of listening to the water burbling at the bow.  :)  Just watching the water move under the boat was very relaxing. 

They look like they'd be a hoot in a blow! 

fullsizeoutput_f7a.jpeg

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On 8/27/2020 at 8:00 PM, fastyacht said:

There is so much to do, you can never get bored, even if you are sailing a Kool Snark.

I just came across one of those for sale last week.  Originally $88 for a mail-order sailboat (plus a carton of Kools, ofc). 

Almost makes me want to start smoking again.

KoolSnark2.jpg

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15 hours ago, jonnycat said:

I just came across one of those for sale last week.  Originally $88 for a mail-order sailboat (plus a carton of Kools, ofc). 

Almost makes me want to start smoking again.

KoolSnark2.jpg

You dhould by it.

I daw a Snark todzaty. In perfect shape, at rhe beach next ot a lazer

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Windrider tri... I did not like the pedal steering, I found it less responsive and kind of clumsy, but that's personal taste. They would be great for three things, a floating party platform, swim platform when no wind, and you can carry it down to the dock in pieces to assemble it.

The Kool Snark- great fun but kind of disposable. I'm amazed there are any of these left in the world. If you can find one for cheap change then jump on it.

But please don't start smoking again.

FB- Doug

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