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12 minutes ago, lydia said:

In PHS you lobby the handicapper for a better rating

Yep, happened to me once.

This boat harassed me till I adjusted the handicap.  They won by 30 seconds adjusted,

I' not handicapping anymore but I would never adjust anything except to make it worse every time they complained.

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1 hour ago, MelbourneA31 said:

Seriously, you are trying to tell me that is more "Mickey Mouse" than AMS? The system that is nothing more than a performance handicapping system that you have to pay for?

IRC is just a money can buy a good handicap or a net wealth handicapping system.

A fair handicap system would enable any boat regardless of design as long as it has been modernised and upgraded and has a crew of rockstars.

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Is there a handicap system that adjusts for conditions?

I haven't seen one, that is the problem.  Handicaps are bullshit.

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4 minutes ago, Gorn FRANTIC!! said:

It was called IMS.

And IMS constructed course pretty much went to shit in one Sydney Mooloolaba where the 36 footers could see the 40s at finish but the 40s won.

Who ever picked the constructed  course picked the winner.

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46 minutes ago, Gorn FRANTIC!! said:

It was called IMS.

It was but it's gone because it too was bullshit to be replaced by an even more complicated bullshit system.  Much of mixed fleet racing in AUS is not keel boats in the blue stuff.

I went through the garage and threw out all trophies that had anything to do with handicaps, except one that was a win in a big one, when we were almost first over the line anyway.  I always took them graciously but considered them a consolation prize.

The only way you can really claim a great victory is when you win against people that started at the same time with the same gear as you have.  That's why there are no World Championships from World Sailing for handicap events, no Olympic events either.

Handicaps are bullshit. 

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9 minutes ago, astro said:

It was but it's gone because it too was bullshit to be replaced by an even more complicated bullshit system.  Much of mixed fleet racing in AUS is not keel boats in the blue stuff.

I went through the garage and through out all trophies that had anything to do with handicaps, except one that was a win in a big one, when we were almost first over the line anyway.  I always took them graciously but considered them a consolation prize.

The only way you can really claim a great victory is when you win against people that started at the same time with the same gear as you have.  That's why there are no World Championships from World Sailing for handicap events, no Olympic events either.

Handicaps are bullshit. 

The world of yachting would be pretty boring with only OD racing

 

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12 minutes ago, The Dark Knight said:

The world of yachting would be pretty boring with only OD racing

 

Even the Hobart has the pundits speculating the week before about the forecast Vs which boats will be in contention.  Same thing happens in clubs "ahhh its going to be  a drifter and old Bill will get the gong again!"

That's bullshit!  Why is the winner dependent on the conditions?  Why is it not the best sailors win?

Handicaps are complete bullshit.  The only people who do no admit that are the winners.

EDIT: And don't get me started on people who take them seriously enough to complain about their rating.

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19 minutes ago, astro said:

It was but it's gone because it too was bullshit to be replaced by an even more complicated bullshit system.  Much of mixed fleet racing in AUS is not keel boats in the blue stuff.

I went through the garage and threw out all trophies that had anything to do with handicaps, except one that was a win in a big one, when we were almost first over the line anyway.  I always took them graciously but considered them a consolation prize.

The only way you can really claim a great victory is when you win against people that started at the same time with the same gear as you have.  That's why there are no World Championships from World Sailing for handicap events, no Olympic events either.

Handicaps are bullshit. 

Agree astro, but we can't all afford identical 100 footers

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14 minutes ago, The Dark Knight said:

The world of yachting would be pretty boring with only OD racing

 

Forgot to say that I agree but not in the way you intended.

It would be really boring for all those who cannot sail well enough to get on the podium.

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And there lies the  big issue.

Who gets to pick the one design?  look at the international one design dinghies,  any one think an Optimist is the best trainer around now, or that a 470 is a great boat and fun to sail?

The advantage of handicap racing is you get to sail what you have got &/or what suits you,  sure you may not be competitive in all or even any conditions, but you get to enjoy sailing a boat you enjoy against the best around.

And if like me at the present that mean not being in with much chance of a trophy, so be it.  Enjoy the warm dry bunks, oven cooked meals, contents of 3 fridges & great times with a bunch of mates.

In my younger days I raced the cold wet alloy boats  and have had success at up to World Cup level, and I still day race on a carbon 43 footer,  so I am not a heavy boat nut,  but with age comes a liking for a degree of comfort and good mates.  Can't really do that on a Farr 40,  a Swan 125?  I might try that!

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12 hours ago, lydia said:

And IMS constructed course pretty much went to shit in one Sydney Mooloolaba where the 36 footers could see the 40s at finish but the 40s won.

Who ever picked the constructed  course picked the winner.

So the problem was the person who set the course and not the rule itself then?

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16 hours ago, lydia said:

And IRC is not, at least I would only have to pay what $75.00 for Ams as opposed to $450 for IRC

Both just arbitrary as far as I can see.

In PHS or AMS you lobby the handicapper for a better rating and in IRC a group of owners representatives lobby the rating office to get the same this thing.

Unless of course you a French boat and as everyone knows there is only one rule in the book that can not be reviewed.

Fixed it for you

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12 hours ago, lydia said:

Agree astro, but we can't all afford identical 100 footers

No....ah, but a Finn is a wonderful thing...and win lose or draw... you get to play with some great people who share a passion for our sport! ;-)

 

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2 hours ago, Gorn FRANTIC!! said:

So the problem was the person who set the course and not the rule itself then?

A big part of the problem was the serious IOR sailor who would have the stopwatch out at every mark calculating their corrected gains & losses on the leg and how many seconds they needed to make up or hold.  When IMS went to courses/windspeeds calculated after the race, they were out of a job as the tif was not yet established for the race!

I admit to being something of a fan of IMS, (possibly because I was on a boat that won just about everything there was to win in the early years), & I believe that with current VPPs it could be about the best answer we have tried so far.  I would add that the base VPP should be an ongoing work as improvements became available.

But even a supporter like me has to admit that there can be weird outcomes.  One long race (300+ miles) we finished in good breeze which later dropped out before the slower boats arrived over the next day or so,  when we finished our calculated placing was 2nd, (bugger!),  but as the slower boats got slower & slower in the lightening breeze the calculated breeze for IMS dropped lower & lower.  By the time the final results were calculated we ended up fourth,  nothing too weird about that.  Except that the two boats that had passed us in the results had both finished ahead of us,  meaning they had passed us while ALL THREE of were tied up & in the bar!!!

Some people had issues with this type of outcome.

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The only remarkable thing about this push for ORC is how long it took. There are twice as many rating systems today and half the fleet sizes than 25 years ago. WTF.

ORC and ORCi have been in Aust over a decade. The latter should never have been given a fucking visa. Concentrate now on IRC and ORC, every other fucking combination has been tried.

PHS offshore can even be fucked off now that LB is banned from starting in the race he started to pick up that silverware every outing. :lol:

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14 minutes ago, trt131 said:

Slight thread drift, I don't think LB started that race, I am pretty sure it was Rusty.

They were holding hands at the time.

One was Commodore and the other was Chairman of Sailing.

gotta love the titles!

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3 hours ago, lydia said:

I was an IMS fan as well.

But the sad reality is that nothing produced better racing than IOR.

Or indeed fairer ratings across a fleet.

An upper rating limit of 1.6ish would solve that, but that horse has bolted. 

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fixed Handicaps go hand in hand with divisions and courses. PHS in some competitions is the most fair because it gives the closet results over time.

Fairness regularly seems to get over ridden by having "equal boats in the divisons"

The IRC RACE MANAGEMENT GUIDELINES has good direction that unfortunately seems to be missed by many OA, including AS.  https://ircrating.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/manage_2019.pdf

Class Rule/Type Parameters 0 Racing LH greater than 9.0m and less than 16.5m. IRC Series Date: 2000 and later. IRC Hull Factor: 10.4 and higher. IRC DLR: 145 and lower. IRC TCC: Greater than 1.000 and less than 1.350. 1 IRC TCC 1.100 to 1.199. 2 IRC TCC 1.000 to 1.099. 3 IRC TCC 0.999 and below. 4 IRC Cruiser IRC Hull Factor 7.6 or less. 5 IRC Classic IRC Series Date of 1970 or earlier. 6 Sports Boats DLR less than 150, LH less than 10m, and TCC greater than 0.950

5. COURSES With the ever increasing range of boat types racing under IRC, it is inevitable that courses and conditions will affect race results. Race Committees can minimise these effects by considering carefully the types of courses set. Conditions are beyond the control of a race committee, but even then course location may be significant. There has been much discussion in recent years concerning the dominance of windward-leeward courses. The IRC Technical Committee considers that if all races were windward-leeward, designers would inevitably optimise designs for this style of racing, eg. heavy, narrow designs with poor reaching performance. Noting also that a balance of course types is a fundamental part of fair yacht racing, it is strongly recommended that race committees should set a variety of courses

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Just now, jack_sparrow said:

Clubs with marinas with flag officers in the marina business....what could go wrong. :lol:

Clubs with 'flag officers' that wear spiffy white uniforms with a ton of gold braid and have speshul 'FIGJAM' burgees - it's already GONE wrong...

FKT

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On 8/23/2020 at 6:39 PM, astro said:

Is there a handicap system that adjusts for conditions?

On 8/23/2020 at 7:40 PM, Gorn FRANTIC!! said:

It was called IMS.

On 8/23/2020 at 8:22 PM, astro said:

It was but it's gone because it too was bullshit ...

10 hours ago, TUBBY said:

I admit to being something of a fan of IMS,

10 hours ago, lydia said:

I was an IMS fan as well.

 

IMS didn't make it because 10 things conspired against it.

1. A jealous and competitive English offshore-sailing father.

2. An independent, but more laid back American offshore-sailing mother.

3. They both wanted to sail at the Mexico City Olympics with their first child but didn't.

4. The Boston Tea Party.

5. The mother's urge to have a second child.

6. The mother loved both children equally, the father less so.

7. An American non-sailing company.

8. A French sailing company.

9. The Commonwealth replaced the Empire. 

10. The Cruising Yacht Club weren't a Royal Club but wished they were.

The "role" each of those 10 things played in IMS not making it? You will have to guess. :lol:

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23 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

IMS didn't make it because 10 things conspired against it.

1. A jealous and competitive English offshore-sailing father.

2. An independent, but more laid back American offshore-sailing mother.

3. They both wanted to sail at the Mexico City Olympics with their first child but didn't.

4. The Boston Tea Party.

5. The mother's urge to have a second child.

6. The mother loved both children equally, the father less so.

7. An American non-sailing company.

8. A French sailing company.

9. The Commonwealth replaced the Empire. 

10. The Cruising Yacht Club weren't a Royal Club but wished they were.

The "role" each of those 10 things played in IMS not making it? You will have to guess. :lol:

Funny how IRC never took off in Europe outside France.

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I seem to remember the early days of I'm a Mess were OK? Good efficient hull shapes very stable downwind. Lots of encouragement for creature comforts onboard. Boats like the Dolan's "Encore" with teak decks, full cruiser fit out including gold plated tapware and yet still had a very competitive rating.

Things started going to shit when they started pulling lead out of bulbs and putting it in the bilges, and fitting jumper struts which were left loose and only there for the rating boost. Why they didn't nip that shit in the bud I will never know. Had to have contributed to the demise...

LB, Lydia, remember that one with a LOT of lead in the bilge? La La LAAAHHH!!!!!

 

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Abbo it was not the amount of lead in the bilge it was fact that the fact it was never bolted down to the boat.

The timber tip on the keel was also a nice touch.

Lucky that thing was so well built by Peter Boulton otherwise SA would be short a few posters.

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BTW Abbo, you see this little gem pop up on the NoR at the Lota Fishing and Fighting Club?

1 RULES

  1. 1.1  Racing shall be governed by the rules as defined in The Racing Rules of Sailing.

  2. 1.2  The prescriptions and Special Regulations of Australian Sailing Inc. shall apply.

  3. 1.3  Division Yachts must comply with Category 5 Safety and Equipment Special Regulations.

  4. 1.4  Etchells must comply with Category 7 Safety and Equipment Special Regulations.

  5. 1.5  Class Rules shall apply to each class.

  6. 1.6  RQYS Club Participation Rules, House Rules and Code of Conduct shall apply.

2 ELIGIBILITY AND ENTRY

  1. 2.1  Entry is open to boats owned, skippered and crewed by financial members of the Royal Queensland Yacht Squadron.

  2. 2.2  Off the Beach classes may enter by SIGNING-ON and including all requested details on the sign-on sheet.

  3. 2.3  Division Yachts and Etchells may enter by SIGNING-ON with the Race Committee over VHF ch 72 in the 30 minutes

    leading up to the race start.

Sorry Jack you can't come sailing!

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13 minutes ago, lydia said:

BTW Abbo, you see this little gem pop up on the NoR at the Lota Fishing and Fighting Club?

1 RULES

  1. 1.1  Racing shall be governed by the rules as defined in The Racing Rules of Sailing.

  2. 1.2  The prescriptions and Special Regulations of Australian Sailing Inc. shall apply.

  3. 1.3  Division Yachts must comply with Category 5 Safety and Equipment Special Regulations.

  4. 1.4  Etchells must comply with Category 7 Safety and Equipment Special Regulations.

  5. 1.5  Class Rules shall apply to each class.

  6. 1.6  RQYS Club Participation Rules, House Rules and Code of Conduct shall apply.

2 ELIGIBILITY AND ENTRY

  1. 2.1  Entry is open to boats owned, skippered and crewed by financial members of the Royal Queensland Yacht Squadron.

  2. 2.2  Off the Beach classes may enter by SIGNING-ON and including all requested details on the sign-on sheet.

  3. 2.3  Division Yachts and Etchells may enter by SIGNING-ON with the Race Committee over VHF ch 72 in the 30 minutes

    leading up to the race start.

Sorry Jack you can't come sailing!

That's the NOR for the club champs right?

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4 minutes ago, lydia said:

Try Opening Day at least as other NoR not up.

My how inclusive. Welcome to RQYS, we prefer to play with ourselves.

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16 hours ago, snoopy said:

fixed Handicaps go hand in hand with divisions and courses. PHS in some competitions is the most fair because it gives the closet results over time.

Fairness regularly seems to get over ridden by having "equal boats in the divisons"

The IRC RACE MANAGEMENT GUIDELINES has good direction that unfortunately seems to be missed by many OA, including AS.  https://ircrating.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/manage_2019.pdf

Class Rule/Type Parameters 0 Racing LH greater than 9.0m and less than 16.5m. IRC Series Date: 2000 and later. IRC Hull Factor: 10.4 and higher. IRC DLR: 145 and lower. IRC TCC: Greater than 1.000 and less than 1.350. 1 IRC TCC 1.100 to 1.199. 2 IRC TCC 1.000 to 1.099. 3 IRC TCC 0.999 and below. 4 IRC Cruiser IRC Hull Factor 7.6 or less. 5 IRC Classic IRC Series Date of 1970 or earlier. 6 Sports Boats DLR less than 150, LH less than 10m, and TCC greater than 0.950

5. COURSES With the ever increasing range of boat types racing under IRC, it is inevitable that courses and conditions will affect race results. Race Committees can minimise these effects by considering carefully the types of courses set. Conditions are beyond the control of a race committee, but even then course location may be significant. There has been much discussion in recent years concerning the dominance of windward-leeward courses. The IRC Technical Committee considers that if all races were windward-leeward, designers would inevitably optimise designs for this style of racing, eg. heavy, narrow designs with poor reaching performance. Noting also that a balance of course types is a fundamental part of fair yacht racing, it is strongly recommended that race committees should set a variety of courses

This is the biggest failure of IRC and it the clubs and AS that cause it.

No-one even tries to comply and as a result course selection determines the winner.

How about AS says we will not endorse your regattas unless you give effect to the Race Management Guidelines.

 

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I remember with fond memories the Friday nights at RQYS when the placed was packed with a veritable cross section of humanity united with their love of the sport. It didn't matter who you were, you were welcomed with open arms and you wanted your Friday night to be at RQ amongst sailors swapping bullshit and spilling beer. The senior exec were indistinguishable from the rest, and my overriding memory was the huge grins and the feeling that it wasn't possible to have that many decent souls all together in one spot. And the sport was going from strength to strength.  

Now you walk through and the overall sensation is lifeless, grim and unwelcoming. There is a sense of foreboding, as if the pictures have eyes and you have to remember not to loudly call out a welcome across the bar without fear of a warning disciplinary letter.

And all this happened with because of  Flag officers who blatantly abuse their title and use the club to further their own interests and do not give one fuck about the sport of sailing. Over time this attracted more undesirables into senior positions, and voila you have a rotting blight on the sport that spreads its cancer the longer it goes on. I disagree with Greasy's previous comment about how clubs have always had these issues. After spending my life in non for profits I can attest to the level of depravity on display at RQYS is unparelleled, and I spent a lot of time in the bikie scum and car scene who were saints by comparison.   

Australian Sailing as our only watchdog are equally rotten to the core as they support all the lies and falsehoods whilst admitting they know all about it. But GRS will be along soon to seek assistance with getting a ride to expand his sailing. One day he might stop long enough to muse on what his culpability and inaction has done to like minded souls. 

My intent is not vindictiveness, it's sadness from knowing how good it should be. Color me stupid for being so naive.  

  

         

  

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11 hours ago, lydia said:

Abbo it was not the amount of lead in the bilge it was fact that the fact it was never bolted down to the boat.

The timber tip on the keel was also a nice touch.

Lucky that thing was so well built by Peter Boulton otherwise SA would be short a few posters.

Trust me I know all about the lead. I was the one who refused to deliver it home from Coffs when I discovered about 400 kg of  25 kg ingots loose in the bilge. Didn't we get Steery to glass it in permanently? 

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12 hours ago, lydia said:

Try Opening Day at least as other NoR not up.

Nope for the whole season

2.3 Skippers and Crew with seasons entries are required to be financial members of the Royal Queensland Yacht Squadron in the appropriate category.

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3 hours ago, shaggybaxter said:

Now you walk through and the overall sensation is lifeless, grim and unwelcoming. There is a sense of foreboding, as if the pictures have eyes and you have to remember not to loudly call out a welcome across the bar without fear of a warning disciplinary letter.

Signed in there last year for lunch.  Yeah the new building has been there a while but it wasn't there when I was a member last.  The Entry reminded me of a Holocaust Museum, or the ANZAC memorial exhibit in ANZAC Square in Brisbane.   DIm lights and the imagery was not welcoming.  Gave me the heeby-jeebies.

But they were starting to slide in my last year there.  In the bar an Asian women all dressed up and dripping in gold was denied service in a rude way.  Asked for her membership or her sign-in tag, she didn't have it.  I was next to be served, scruffy sailing gear, zinc all over my face, hair everywhere ... "Yes what can I get you sir?  The Asian women was still standing there looking slightly incredulous, before walking off. 

Before sailing one day I rushed over to by some food for the crew.  I saw ham/chicken and salad rolls made up behind the glass.  Guy walks by and says "Kitchen isn't open till 8:30."  It was 8:20 at the time.  "But but I just want to ... ".   He walked into the kitchen, plonked his arse on the stainless bench, his feet up on a stool and in full view proceeded to ignore that I was there, chatting to the other staff.

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2 hours ago, trt131 said:

This is not exclusive to RQ, a lot of clubs have a similar clause and have had so for many years.

I'm not aware of any Sicktorian clubs doing this - can you name one?

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14 minutes ago, Dark Cloud said:

I'm not aware of any Sicktorian clubs doing this - can you name one?

Our equivalent or RQYS, changes to a safety category that is not normally used for similar races and then adds some extra safety requirement, to exclude certain boats from competing.

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1 hour ago, The Dark Knight said:

Our equivalent or RQYS, changes to a safety category that is not normally used for similar races and then adds some extra safety requirement, to exclude certain boats from competing.

Ah but that's for only 1 event. 1 that mostly no-one gives a flying fuck about - it excluded most boats/sailors in any case

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2 minutes ago, Dark Cloud said:

Ah but that's for only 1 event. 1 that mostly no-one gives a flying fuck about - it excluded most boats/sailors in any case

except the club that is trying to exclude those pesky old boats that are competitive under IRC on the bay and beat that clubs big budget boats. ;)

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13 minutes ago, The Dark Knight said:

except the club that is trying to exclude those pesky old boats that are competitive under IRC on the bay and beat that clubs big budget boats. ;)

Yes they were well sailed boats the 10s - the change was part of a wide range of changes to safety, rules and procedures across the board - in response to a certain skipper of a certain A10 in the previous years race losing his life in said race

RIP MP

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38 minutes ago, The Dark Knight said:

except the club that is trying to exclude those pesky old boats that are competitive under IRC on the bay and beat that clubs big budget boats. ;)

Funny - going *way* back there was a bloke from South Aus who had a Bolger light schooner. Apparently he beat up on a number of much more expensive boats and the owners did NOT like it at all, to the point where they tried very hard to get him tossed. Not sure what happened in the long run as it was back in Usenet days. Don't think any of you guys were around back then.

FKT

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On 8/24/2020 at 12:55 PM, trt131 said:

Slight thread drift, I don't think LB started that race, I am pretty sure it was Rusty.

You are quite correct it was Rusty's idea and he made it happen - A few of us just dedicated a decade of our lives to keeping it going and building on it. Sadly the currant flags seem to want to end it - starting a race in Opposition to it and not attending the presentation. Could you imagine the Commodore of the CYCA winning line and overall of the Sydney to Hobart and not then not showing up at the presentation? In my opinion it disrespects the other competitors and most importantly the sponsors who were the host of the event.

 

 

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30 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

You are quite correct it was Rusty's idea and he made it happen - A few of us just dedicated a decade of our lives to keeping it going and building on it. Sadly the currant flags seem to want to end it - starting a race in Opposition to it and not attending the presentation. Could you imagine the Commodore of the CYCA winning line and overall of the Sydney to Hobart and not then not showing up at the presentation? In my opinion it disrespects the other competitors and most importantly the sponsors who were the host of the event.

 

 

Not to mention the mayor of Yeppoon and the local member who were also in attendance. Conduct unbecoming?

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7 hours ago, Bill E Goat said:

Nope for the whole season

2.3 Skippers and Crew with seasons entries are required to be financial members of the Royal Queensland Yacht Squadron in the appropriate category.

Sure as shit is going to fuck over AS revenue as people sail outside the club framework and don't join clubs.

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6 hours ago, Dark Cloud said:

Yes they were well sailed boats the 10s - the change was part of a wide range of changes to safety, rules and procedures across the board - in response to a certain skipper of a certain A10 in the previous years race losing his life in said race

RIP MP

Except the Mexican RQYS continued to race cat 6 except for the Ass Cup, even though it was in the same waters.

Im sure someone told me that the coroner did not make any recommendations that would impact on the 10’s otherwise the clubs that have them would have to make such changes.

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16 hours ago, The Dark Knight said:

Our equivalent or RQYS, changes to a safety category that is not normally used for similar races and then adds some extra safety requirement, to exclude certain boats from competing.

They do that in Hobart too, for the entire summer pennant series. Funnily enough the AS IRC Nationals on the same waters only required the normal safety category. Which is why we sailed in that instead.

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13 hours ago, lydia said:

Or just asset protection

Pretty simple Really

What about some of those big shiny race boats with company logo's all over them? If they are owned buy a company or trust surely they would be ineligible?

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50 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

What about some of those big shiny race boats with company logo's all over them? If they are owned buy a company or trust surely they would be ineligible?

Doesn't matter who owns them, just who sails them. All of this stems from the AS prescription to Rule 46 after all the actual RRS only states 'A boat shall have in charge a person designated by the member or organisation that entered the boat.' Nothing there about membership of a club and no reference at all to crew.

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Just now, TheUltimateSockPuppet said:

Doesn't matter who owns them, just who sails them. All of this stems from the AS prescription to Rule 46 after all the actual RRS only states 'A boat shall have in charge a person designated by the member or organisation that entered the boat.' Nothing there about membership of a club and no reference at all to crew.

NoR states quite clearly 'Owned' by a financial member. 

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WTF

 

2.8 Seasons Entry Fees:

Single-Handed Off the Beach Classes $300.00

Double-Handed Off the Beach Classes $350.00

Division Yachts $350.00

 

So a kid with a Laser pays just $50 less than a TP52 owner to enter a series.

 

My club does not charge race/series entry fees for members boats which is financed by the catering deal. 

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2 hours ago, LB 15 said:

The irony is that only financial members can sail on peoples boats but anyone can walk in and dine at the new restaurant there. 

Really? Maybe I should invite you to dinner there next time I'm in Brisbane.

FKT

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5 hours ago, LB 15 said:

NoR states quite clearly 'Owned' by a financial member. 

To look at this from a slightly different angle, does RQYS or its neighbouring Clubs run races on behalf of all the boats in the area? This clause may be to protect their end of season prizes from boats that are not on their register.

We do see this occur (unofficially) in Melbourne. If you enter a race at Royal Yacht Club of Victoria, irrespective of which Club you come from, if you win the race then you get to come to Presentation Night and have the trophy awarded to you. If you attend the trophy night at RMYS it is amazing how all the trophies are presented to boats on their own register, even though the race was actually won by a boat from a neighbouring Club.

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2 minutes ago, MelbourneA31 said:

To look at this from a slightly different angle, does RQYS or its neighbouring Clubs run races on behalf of all the boats in the area? This clause may be to protect their end of season prizes from boats that are not on their register.

We do see this occur (unofficially) in Melbourne. If you enter a race at Royal Yacht Club of Victoria, irrespective of which Club you come from, if you win the race then you get to come to Presentation Night and have the trophy awarded to you. If you attend the trophy night at RMYS it is amazing how all the trophies are presented to boats on their own register, even though the race was actually won by a boat from a neighbouring Club.

Does that policy at Royals differ depending on whether the trophy is perpetual or not ?

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16 minutes ago, Dark Cloud said:

Does that policy at Royals differ depending on whether the trophy is perpetual or not ?

They are all perpetuals, some are awarded for an individual race while others are for a group of two or more races. Practically, it would be pretty much impossible for a boat from a neighbouring Club to sail enough of our races to feature in the season aggregate.

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8 hours ago, The Dark Knight said:

WTF

2.8 Seasons Entry Fees:

Single-Handed Off the Beach Classes $300.00

Double-Handed Off the Beach Classes $350.00

Division Yachts $350.00

So a kid with a Laser pays just $50 less than a TP52 owner to enter a series.

That's entry fees done with so what about other mandated costs to get to the start line?

Hoppy you clearly have never fucking entered a sailboat race in your entire fucking life.

To find your useless fucking brain requires a fucking big microscope.

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3 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Hoppy you clearly have never fucking entered a sailboat race in your entire fucking life.

To find your useless fucking brain requires a fucking big microscope.

As I stated you dumb fuck, my club does not charge members to enter boats in its own series. Also for races like the Range series, they pay our entry fee to the organising club. 
 

Go fuck yourself you Tracy Grimshaw of SA.

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