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2 hours ago, Bill E Goat said:

I dont know of many sports that allow you to compete without being a member of a club.  I can't just roll up to the local golf club and ask to play in their competitions without being a member.  I can play social golf but not compete.

I think the idea has merit but as usual a complete clusterfuck in how it is sold.  The whole duty of care and AS personal liability insurance (which is absolute crap like loss of income up to $300 per week) is bullshit.  Its all about AS saying they have increased their participation numbers.

Maybe membership should be mandated for races in which there is a pointscore series with non spinnaker events excluded.

I think the bigger question for clubs is what are they offering to make people want to join,

Some I sail with are members of Manly 16's but sail elsewhere others are country members of the RYCT but race in Sydney.  Maybe its time for clubs to look at what membership options they have available

My argument against this club membership comparison is to say - the yacht and owner are members, the crew are guests. Also, what other sport requires one person to outlay thousands of dollars a year, plus the original cost of the boat, plus race entry fees, and then asks the guests to pay as well?

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3 minutes ago, mccroc said:

We are actually totally in agreement - I have done far more miles solo or dh than fully crewed. As someone posted on another site - I was doing the DH thing "before it became popular". (insert laughing emoji).

The only thing I would say about Government intervention is: isn't that why there is an AS? To lobby on our behalf to reassure the govt that we have good rules and safety processes. Their role surely isn't to anticipate the Spanish Inquisition, and murder us all before the govt can.

 

AS 's role is to lobby the Government for money to support elite sailors WC & Olympic dreams (and build a cushy office complex). It uses clubs and their members as justification for their budget.

Occasionally they might do things that help the other 99% of sailors, but that is clearly the exception, not the rule.

    

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24 minutes ago, mccroc said:

My argument against this club membership comparison is to say - the yacht and owner are members, the crew are guests. Also, what other sport requires one person to outlay thousands of dollars a year, plus the original cost of the boat, plus race entry fees, and then asks the guests to pay as well?

As a golf comparison the private course near me costs about 20k to join plus 5k per year, if a member invites me, as a non member, to play socially with him it would cost me $130.  However if I wanted to play in the competition I would have to be a member of a reciprocal club  I think people who are racing seriously should be members of a club, casual guests on a twilight shouldn't

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18 minutes ago, Bill E Goat said:

As a golf comparison the private course near me costs about 20k to join plus 5k per year, if a member invites me, as a non member, to play socially with him it would cost me $130.  However if I wanted to play in the competition I would have to be a member of a reciprocal club  I think people who are racing seriously should be members of a club, casual guests on a twilight shouldn't

Not really a good comparison.

Does your caddy, the golf cart steerer and the wife serving you drinks have to be members when you compete?

 

If you want to compare golf to sailing, then each golfer is the equivalent of a boat owner and his bag/buggy, the boat. 

 

 

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22 minutes ago, Bill E Goat said:

As a golf comparison the private course near me costs about 20k to join plus 5k per year, if a member invites me to play with him it would cost me $130.  I think people who are racing seriously should be members of a club, casual guests on a twilight shouldn't

Golf comparison - let's have another go. So I go and play at a golf club and have to pay. Well yes, because the Golf club supplies the course - the fairways the greens etc. A sailing club does not own the water. They have to share it with power boats, kayaks etc.

But okay - so if serious racers should pay - who should they pay? Has AS made clear if say you have a SailPass with RSYS that it allows you to race at MHYC? Should these serious racers be forced to pay a club that they never go to? What about a club that doesn't have a clubhouse - what are the crew paying for?

I mean AS is saying they don't get the money, so who should. Is this why the clubs are agreeing against the wishes of their members - oh that's right, the clubs are members of AS, we're not.

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19 minutes ago, The Dark Knight said:

Is there another sport that requires so much investment in the equipment by the competitor and so little investment by the club, with competition taking place in a public space?

Rally driving

Gliding

Water skiing

Speedboat racing

As said before you shouldn't have to force people to join a club, you should make it attractive for them to want to join

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25 minutes ago, Bill E Goat said:

Rally driving 

Gliding

Water skiing

Speedboat racing

As said before you shouldn't have to force people to join a club, you should make it attractive for them to want to join

I would argue that with the exception of gliding, the others these days require the competition areas closed off. Not that it matters.

29 minutes ago, Bill E Goat said:

should make it attractive for them to want to join

That it is the key point...

The deal should be that the boat owners bring in the people, either directly or by being a boat in need of crew and the clubs should then figure out how to keep the people coming in and catch a few. AS should butt out of this matter unless the clubs ask for help rather than being dictated to. 

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5 hours ago, Abbo said:

If AS actually gave a shit about clubs they would lobby the govt for a 50% reduction in alcohol excise for clubs. The clubs can take 25% and pass the rest onto the members. The effects would be instant and significant. I have not had a beer at RQYS in 4 or 5 years.... but that has probably got more to do with the company than the exorbitant prices.

Free piss for everyone will be the cornerstone of my election platform. 

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2 hours ago, Bill E Goat said:

As a golf comparison the private course near me costs about 20k to join plus 5k per year, 

Yes but the Sydney clubs don't have to mow the harbour.

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We are talking about Sailing here.

Not Golf nor even Golf V2.0, not Motorsport, not Grouse Shooting, not Horse sport, not anything.......

Sailing.

Its unique, quirky, time hungry, complex, expensive and elitist. Trying to convince it's otherwise is bullshit (Especially when every partner of AS is lured by the high socio economic value of the demographic).

The bigger the boat the more all of this applies. 

Start in an Oppy or a Bic - simple low cost, fun, easy & inclusive etc

But By the time you are doing Sydney Hobart on a TP52, those same things are diminished, and those first descriptions start to assert (along with all the posturing and wank factor).

But for this forum we are talking about yachts or keelboats.

The owners love to win. Their boat & name goes in the club record (not the crew) and they get to bask in whatever glory they are seeking.

It's always been recognised that good owners get good crew, either by talent or credit card or whatever. They set the program tone. (Competitive, fun, drunk, hot girls only need apply, fast, overseas, all expenses paid.......delete as appropriate)

Natural selection is powerfully at work here. Arsehole owners, better be very talented sailors or they end up with no or inexperienced crews......

Crew turn up; park miles away, rarely get facilities, long hours and don't get a say in much; certainly not on club AGM's or anything that might make them feel like they belong or that they are a stakeholder in anyway. 

So why should they be stuck for hundreds of dollars worth of utterly meaningless crew membership? We already support the marine industry in many ways, and spend handsomely in hospitality - just possibly at venues with some (or even any) eye candy, conversation and better prices....... 

So when they dress all this stuff as being for better safety, yet don't apply it for the races in partial darkness and where alcohol is involved (Twilights), how can it not be seen as a hypocritical money grab?

The owners have no change to their outlay, so cannot understand why there is a groundswell of unease amongst the crew, who will slowly melt away as being busy or unavailable. 

2 handed racing and sellers of fancy gyroscope autopilots are going to have a bright future....... But stories of large rowdy prize giving parties will only be  told in historical context.......

Well done Australian Sailing, excellent work.

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So what if you don’t buy into this?

1) Gather the crew for a Wednesday twilight casual sail, and start at the gun, well below the pin.

2) Sail around a few “navigational marks” that just happen to follow the same sequence as the twilight racers. Be gracious, dip early and cheerfully wave at the racers as you follow them around while sinking a tonne of beer.

3) Complete your casual cruise by sailing around the finish line on your way home.

4) Support your club by having dinner and drinks at the bistro.

5) Comply in every other aspect with entry requirements for the point score or ocean events.

6) Send hookers and Moët to the chairperson of the club’s disciplinary committee.

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50 minutes ago, Jason AUS said:

So what if you don’t buy into this?

1) Gather the crew for a Wednesday twilight casual sail, and start at the gun, well below the pin.

This isn't the dumbest idea ever.

What makes someone 'crew'? If I'm not being paid, surely I'm a guest, not crew.

I like sailing - and sailing against other boats. But I'm not really a competitor, in the sense that I get anything if the boat I'm on wins. The owner is really the only competitor. I seem to remember being on board boats that have won stuff, but I don't have any trophys, or my name in any record books anywhere.

So why can't the owner register themselves as the only crew... but also have half a dozen guests on board? So the boat and the owner are competing, but the guests are just along for the ride? So the owner might chose to sail past an anchored boat at a particular time, but as a guest I'm just along to drink beer and pull the odd string.

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53 minutes ago, Se7en said:

This isn't the dumbest idea ever.

What makes someone 'crew'? If I'm not being paid, surely I'm a guest, not crew.

I like sailing - and sailing against other boats. But I'm not really a competitor, in the sense that I get anything if the boat I'm on wins. The owner is really the only competitor. I seem to remember being on board boats that have won stuff, but I don't have any trophys, or my name in any record books anywhere.

So why can't the owner register themselves as the only crew... but also have half a dozen guests on board? So the boat and the owner are competing, but the guests are just along for the ride? So the owner might chose to sail past an anchored boat at a particular time, but as a guest I'm just along to drink beer and pull the odd string.

I should have added “buy a beer for the race committee volunteers.”

Always.

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It's just about the numbers game for AS - they know that the more 'people' they can have on their books the more money they get for the high performance program - simple as that. No other hidden motive or altruistic purpose of supporting the clubs - purely and simply it's about growing the AS empire - just have a look at their staff list it's almost as long as the public services'. 

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10 hours ago, Se7en said:

This isn't the dumbest idea ever.

What makes someone 'crew'? If I'm not being paid, surely I'm a guest, not crew.

I like sailing - and sailing against other boats. But I'm not really a competitor, in the sense that I get anything if the boat I'm on wins. The owner is really the only competitor. I seem to remember being on board boats that have won stuff, but I don't have any trophys, or my name in any record books anywhere.

So why can't the owner register themselves as the only crew... but also have half a dozen guests on board? So the boat and the owner are competing, but the guests are just along for the ride? So the owner might chose to sail past an anchored boat at a particular time, but as a guest I'm just along to drink beer and pull the odd string.

Technically there are only two types of people besides the Master on a boat. 'Passengers' that take no part in the operation of the vessel and 'Crew' who do. AS need to amend their definitions to encompass all who boat. That way they can get a few bucks from anyone who gets on a ferry as well. It is fair given that they do just as much for a city cat passenger as they do for someone who races every weekend.

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13 hours ago, Boink said:

Arsehole owners, better be very talented sailors or they end up with no or inexperienced crews......

Nah there are plenty of absolute cunts who pay for good sailors to win them trophies. Pro's are basically hookers who sell their bodies to the highest bidder. There are a few guys at my old club that could tell you that a fuckwits cock tastes the same as a good guys. 

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22 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

Technically there are only two types of people besides the Master on a boat. 'Passengers' that take no part in the operation of the vessel and 'Crew' who do. AS need to amend their definitions to encompass all who boat. That way they can get a few bucks from anyone who gets on a ferry as well. It is fair given that they do just as much for a city cat passenger as they do for someone who races every weekend.

So does a passenger automatically become crew as soon as they hold a line? What about if I just sit on the side of the boat, and occasionally swap sides?

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1 hour ago, TheUltimateSockPuppet said:

Unless you're the Australian cricket captain and text it to someone!

He should have known that a wicket keeper can never bowl a maiden over. He was hoping she would face one at the members end.

 

thank you thank you, I will be here all week...

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5 hours ago, LB 15 said:

Nah there are plenty of absolute cunts who pay for good sailors to win them trophies. Pro's are basically hookers who sell their bodies to the highest bidder. There are a few guys at my old club that could tell you that a fuckwits cock tastes the same as a good guys. 

That's not the crew who I am talking about. Jizz suckers are everywhere, work, sport and will guzzle regardless.

Think the good quality amateur crew who actually make up the meat & potatoes of big boat sailing. Experienced and knowledgeable. But who are getting squeezed by family and partner pressure for their time and who extra hurdles and barriers means that they can get much better value shits & giggles by going surfing, kite surfing or a hundred other activities, without having to line the greedy pockets of AS and clubs who give nothing in return. 

Owners expect to pay for the privilege, but don't spread the Rort to those that silently enable..........

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Between AS, SailSys and club rules its getting pretty hard to figure out if you're actually correctly entered.

Fleets are getting smaller, and every boat is struggling to find semi-regular amateur crew.

Soon we won't need handicaps as fleets get to 5 and under as you'll be able to predict the winner for the wind conditions, and every time a new boat joins they will either be 30 mins in front or behind the whole fleet due to a random handicap allocation. 

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4 hours ago, Xtasea said:

Soon we won't need handicaps as fleets get to 5 and under as you'll be able to predict the winner for the wind conditions, and every time a new boat joins they will either be 30 mins in front or behind the whole fleet due to a random handicap allocation. 

Welcome to Hobart, where we always know who's gonna win. I'll give you a hint, the name sounds like midnight rambler

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On 11/23/2021 at 9:16 PM, Fintho said:

Welcome to Hobart, where we always know who's gonna win. I'll give you a hint, the name sounds like midnight rambler

Tenterfield Saddler?

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The clubs with mostly older age demographic members, who run Wags/Sags for their members, who have great difficulty getting regular "crew" ( more like helpers) onto their boats, that run their Social Sailing under ColRegs ( yes, we can, and, no, you dont have to use RRS) are issuing the Sail Pass for unlimited sails, and for 365 days.

 

nothing in the Rule 46 blurb, has any max  time limit, or min $ amount, so, why not!

just give out the SailPass for free!

 

besides, those that use ColRegs to sail, dont come under any rules prescriptions if not using RRS, ir Rule 46.

it's just Social Sailing, after all.

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7 hours ago, JasonL said:

The clubs with mostly older age demographic members, who run Wags/Sags for their members, who have great difficulty getting regular "crew" ( more like helpers) onto their boats, that run their Social Sailing under ColRegs ( yes, we can, and, no, you dont have to use RRS) are issuing the Sail Pass for unlimited sails, and for 365 days.

 

nothing in the Rule 46 blurb, has any max  time limit, or min $ amount, so, why not!

just give out the SailPass for free!

 

besides, those that use ColRegs to sail, dont come under any rules prescriptions if not using RRS, ir Rule 46.

it's just Social Sailing, after all.

Until lets say some directors of a badly run club need to cover up their own incompetence and start charging for everything to hide the losses.

 

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7 hours ago, JasonL said:

The clubs with mostly older age demographic members, who run Wags/Sags for their members, who have great difficulty getting regular "crew" ( more like helpers) onto their boats, that run their Social Sailing under ColRegs ( yes, we can, and, no, you dont have to use RRS) are issuing the Sail Pass for unlimited sails, and for 365 days.

 

nothing in the Rule 46 blurb, has any max  time limit, or min $ amount, so, why not!

just give out the SailPass for free!

 

besides, those that use ColRegs to sail, dont come under any rules prescriptions if not using RRS, ir Rule 46.

it's just Social Sailing, after all.

The only problem with that is the IRPCS don't have a section for mark rounding. And if you are racing under the Col regs, it has nothing to do with AS so why would you need a sail pass?

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12 hours ago, LB 15 said:

The only problem with that is the IRPCS don't have a section for mark rounding. And if you are racing under the Col regs, it has nothing to do with AS so why would you need a sail pass?

What is there to stop a non-AS affiliated club from following the racing rules prescribed by WS.

 

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1 hour ago, The Dark Knight said:

What is there to stop a non-AS affiliated club from following the racing rules prescribed by WS.

 

I think it's something to do with copyright?

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6 hours ago, The Dark Knight said:

What is there to stop a non-AS affiliated club from following the racing rules prescribed by WS.

 

Or, what is there, to stop a currently AS affiliated clug from pissing the RRS off, and just sticking to ColRegs, 

quite a few do, AS tut-tut about it, but thats it

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5 hours ago, Jethrow said:

I think it's something to do with copyright?

Australian Sailing does not hold the copyright to RRS

the RYA in Scotland? does, 'sides, what are they gonna do,,, send out an "Och Aye Laddie" letter?

there a a few clubs that do use RRS, not affiliated, nothing has been said. ( not going to disclose,,, they can do the research themselves,,, f they can.)

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10 hours ago, The Dark Knight said:

What is there to stop a non-AS affiliated club from following the racing rules prescribed by WS.

 

Absolutely nothing except there would be no avenue to appeal a decision of a club protest committee. I can't see AS taking action to stop the use of their Intellectual Property.

Wow- its not often you get to use AS and 'intellectual' in the same sentence!

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4 hours ago, JasonL said:

Australian Sailing does not hold the copyright to RRS

the RYA in Scotland

You know it is often said if you have no fucking idea about something it is best not to prove it.

 

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4 hours ago, JasonL said:

Or, what is there, to stop a currently AS affiliated clug from pissing the RRS off, and just sticking to ColRegs, 

quite a few do, AS tut-tut about it, but thats it

But if a club were not affiliated with AS what recourse would thin skinned man-child members with towering, porcelain egos have when they are struck down with butthurt? 

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WARNING: RANT AHEAD!

So an afternoon of being hit around the head by the new world of Cat 7 racing as it now appears to be.

I have entered and will be skippering a 1932 Fife 9 metre in the Hobart Classics Regatta on behalf of a wonderful and generous owner who is overseas. Paid the money, got a receipt, and then another email or two. But then this afternoon I get forwarded to me an email sent by a Regatta Committee member that was sent to the other person who looks after said yacht, saying I haven't signed the Conditions, oh and they won't accept the Cat 7 from SASC - who due to COVID thought it was reasonable to extend the validity of EAs to 31st December - you know to make things easier. Why didn't the CYCA Sailing Office contact me directly? Maybe they know how shabbily I was treated by them in 2019 when we came second, but held the prize giving an hour early, meaning we missed it.

So being an auditor I can do it on the owner's behalf. Oh, but then CYCA won't accept self checking of inflatable pfds. Hobart and offshore, okay, but inshore? Come on. Funny, as we are probably the only yacht on the Harbour that requires all crew to wear pfds at all times.

And then I have to update my crew list everyday. To do this I have to invite each crew member - probably 15 or so different ones over the three races, to open a SailSys account so I can add them each day, otherwise I will be scored DNC. 

Then I went to the AS website to check what the latest COVID rules are regarding racing, and I read another article explaining how from January 2022 the whole world will be improved by the new AS prescriptions to Rule 46. Having more stupid membership rules does not make racing safer. Having the useless AS insurance does not make racing safer.

What ever happened to the basic rule of the sea - skipper's responsibility?

I am so close to saying fuck off to every club that has agreed to this, especially my own, and then move my own boat to another mooring, cancel my club membership - a year short of Life Membership, and never race again. My wife would be happier, as she sees how much this has dulled my love for the sport I have enjoyed for 55 years or so.

Seriously , how did we allow this to happen?

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1 hour ago, mccroc said:

I am so close to saying fuck off to every club that has agreed to this, especially my own.....

Seriously , how did we allow this to happen?

Feel your pain @mccroc and bizarrely had just commented on this on the other forum touching on what troubles Australian Sailing........ See here.

Something has to change because as you have found, the burden of administration is out of control, the costs associated are unjustified, and the outcomes are meaningless...... So it will kill our sport.

Yet, Clubs are able to not apply these rules - all on the name of improving safety - to Twilight's (where attendance is popular and the bar does roaring trade, but amazingly sailing in dusk whilst inebriated is not seen as a raised risk). So as long as club income is good then safety is secondary........

YCMTSU

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39 minutes ago, Boink said:

 

Yet, Clubs are able to not apply these rules - all on the name of improving safety - to Twilight's (where attendance is popular and the bar does roaring trade, but amazingly sailing in dusk whilst inebriated is not seen as a raised risk). So as long as club income is good then safety is secondary........

YCMTSU

Thanks for the comment, but this last para of yours is not the reality for me - the clubs I race with are enforcing, or will from Jan 1st enforce the AS rules. Regardless of the reality that the RRS 46 prescriptions have no safety benefits.

I am seriously thinking that I will refuse to enter people on my crew lists, because they are guests, not crew. This would be an interesting Protest hearing! If we all revolt....

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6 hours ago, mccroc said:

 

I am seriously thinking that I will refuse to enter people on my crew lists, because they are guests, not crew. 

from google.
 

As nouns the difference between crew and passenger

 is that crew is a group of people manning and operating a boat,  while passengeris one who rides or travels in a boat, but who does not operate it and is not a member of the crew. 
 

RRS 46 makes no mention of “PASSENGERS”.

The protest should be fun.

PS

As a researcher on an Australian Vessel, I was signed on as a “Supernumerary” ( present in excess of the normal or requisite number.) and did not receive any of the normal maritime crew benefits such as being allocated “sea time” etc. 
So a precedent is set in maritime law.

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I checked into the crew - v - guest situation a while back.  IIRC the AS prescription uses the terminology "persons on board" so it purports to capture non-crewing guests also.  If the local newspaper wants to get some on-water photos and you take their photographer on board your boat, YOU are responsible for obtaining a Sailpass for the photographer.

Fucking bullshit!  What policy justification can AS provide for this?  They've never tried as far as I know.

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Most club boats are already struggling to fully crew, most yacht fleets are dying, this may well kill it. 

There will no easy way for the 50+ year old who is the average crew to find their way back into sailing with a season of tryouts of positions and boats to see if they can still rekindle their teenage sailing memories. 

Oh well, 95%+ of yachts are floating apartments or wealth demonstrators already.

End of the sail makers too if us idiots are breaking sails and kites each week. 

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On 12/4/2021 at 5:10 AM, MRS OCTOPUS said:

As a researcher on an Australian Vessel, I was signed on as a “Supernumerary” ( present in excess of the normal or requisite number.) and did not receive any of the normal maritime crew benefits such as being allocated “sea time” etc. 
So a precedent is set in maritime law.

Did your 'research' show how the font changes when you cut and paste text? My research (i.e. looking at your post) shows that since you had to cut and paste the term 'Supernumerary' this entire little fantasy is utter bullshit. My previous 'Research' shows this to be consistent with every other thing you have ever posted on here. 

Thanks for playing.

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On 12/3/2021 at 10:14 PM, mccroc said:

Thanks for the comment, but this last para of yours is not the reality for me - the clubs I race with are enforcing, or will from Jan 1st enforce the AS rules. Regardless of the reality that the RRS 46 prescriptions have no safety benefits.

I am seriously thinking that I will refuse to enter people on my crew lists, because they are guests, not crew. This would be an interesting Protest hearing! If we all revolt....

Interestingly there have been two Wolf rock races (don't ask why) held over the past month here is SE QLD. Both were billed as S2H Qualifiers. One was jointly run by several clubs and didn't not require a sail pass. It had 22 entries. The other was run by everyone's favourite Royal club (Who claim they 'own' the Wolf rock race) and did require a sail pass for each crew member. It had 5 entries.

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13 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

Thanks for playing.

 I wondered how long before my stalker rolled up.

I feel honoured , precious pussycat, that you dedicate so much time to reading my posts. Eventually your comprehension will improve.

We can only hope.

Meanwhile has your therapist discussed “Reactive Abuse” with you?
 

https://breakthesilencedv.org/reactive-abuse-what-it-is-and-why-abusers-rely-on-it/

 

Taking special note of……….

One of the most common tactics abusers use is to shift blame for the abuse onto the victim. The abuser will claim the victim is the abuser because of the reaction the victim has. The abuser may even attempt to convince the victim that there is nothing worth reacting over and that the victim is overreacting to the abuse. What the victim is actually experiencing is called reactive abuse.

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4 hours ago, MRS OCTOPUS said:

 I wondered how long before my stalker rolled up.

I feel honoured , precious pussycat, that you dedicate so much time to reading my posts. Eventually your comprehension will improve.

We can only hope.

Meanwhile has your therapist discussed “Reactive Abuse” with you?
 

https://breakthesilencedv.org/reactive-abuse-what-it-is-and-why-abusers-rely-on-it/

 

Taking special note of……….

One of the most common tactics abusers use is to shift blame for the abuse onto the victim. The abuser will claim the victim is the abuser because of the reaction the victim has. The abuser may even attempt to convince the victim that there is nothing worth reacting over and that the victim is overreacting to the abuse. What the victim is actually experiencing is called reactive abuse.

So why are you now shifting the abuse on to me? Don’t you read what you cut and paste cupcake. But back on topic, how come you couldn’t spell supernumerary and had to look it up?

And what was it you were researching? Sea sickness? Hoping for a breakthrough so you can sail offshore some day?

 

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6 hours ago, LB 15 said:

Interestingly there have been two Wolf rock races (don't ask why) held over the past month here is SE QLD. Both were billed as S2H Qualifiers. One was jointly run by several clubs and didn't not require a sail pass. It had 22 entries. The other was run by everyone's favourite Royal club (Who claim they 'own' the Wolf rock race) and did require a sail pass for each crew member. It had 5 entries

This is exactly how the sport gets killed.

Too much oversight, using safety as the battering ram, that actually destroys the entire Castle (Sport of Sailing) you are trying to take control of......    

But weasel marketing will somehow always spin an actual negative into a much hailed success.

Eventually it will be one boat per class, but dressed up as "everyones a winner"......

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Please update your sailsys details in order to take part in this thread. Please register for each thread that you wish to take part in. Registration must be complete 72 hours before taking part in any thread.

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1 hour ago, Boink said:

This is exactly how the sport gets killed.

Too much oversight, using safety as the battering ram, that actually destroys the entire Castle (Sport of Sailing) you are trying to take control of......    

But weasel marketing will somehow always spin an actual negative into a much hailed success.

Eventually it will be one boat per class, but dressed up as "everyones a winner"......

As it turns out you could not be more correct. I just found out that there were 5 entries but only 3 started and one of them pulled out after a few hours leaving ...one in the two handed division and one in the fully crewed division! Not only that they went ahead with the prize giving - each boat got huge trophies for line honours and overall in each division.

You can not make this shit up.

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55 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

As it turns out you could not be more correct. I just found out that there were 5 entries but only 3 started and one of them pulled out after a few hours leaving ...one in the two handed division and one in the fully crewed division! Not only that they went ahead with the prize giving - each boat got huge trophies for line honours and overall in each division.

You can not make this shit up.

That must have been a real well attended & fun prize giving party....... 

But the upside is........ Plenty of chairs available for the postprandial activities

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10 hours ago, LB 15 said:

Interestingly there have been two Wolf rock races (don't ask why) held over the past month here is SE QLD. Both were billed as S2H Qualifiers. One was jointly run by several clubs and didn't not require a sail pass. It had 22 entries. The other was run by everyone's favourite Royal club (Who claim they 'own' the Wolf rock race) and did require a sail pass for each crew member. It had 5 entries.

Do they both use the same RRS ?

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3 hours ago, Abbo said:

I heard a rumour the yacht "Dream" sank not long after the start of the 1st race after a collision... Can anyone confirm this? 

Abbo,

So what Port / Starboard or Starboard / Port rule were they using ?

 

Were they  racing out of the Lotta fishing and fight club ? if so they would off been using the Starboard / Port Morton Bay Local rules.

 

Maybe we need GRS to come and explain this local rule and how it replaces the normal rules and how it's only for the rich and shameless and the invited few of the Lotta fishing ad fight club who drink / buy red wine with and for GRS.

 

Pulpit

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8 hours ago, Xtasea said:

Please update your sailsys details in order to take part in this thread. Please register for each thread that you wish to take part in. Registration must be complete 72 hours before taking part in any thread.

I’m not participating in this thread. I’m just a passenger…

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55 minutes ago, Jason AUS said:

I’m not participating in this thread. I’m just a passenger…

So instead of getting screwed by Australian Sailing.........

Your getting screwed by the Owner.

But Choice and Consent is important. ;)

No one could argue that Consent is granted in the former.........

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Sadly, it appears that sailing is not the only sport in Australia that is administered by a bunch of uncaring, self-serving assholes.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-12-08/olympic-swimmer-maddie-groves-says-she-was-sexually-abused/100669340

I read the ABC article and, even though the sports are so different, the attitudes are the same.  It's depressing.

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18 hours ago, Abbo said:

I heard a rumour the yacht "Dream" sank not long after the start of the 1st race after a collision... Can anyone confirm this? 

Dream was in a P/S a few weeks ago. Nasty bow shaped hole in the port side. Didn’t think it would be out sailing again yet, so doubt it went out & sunk. 

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19 hours ago, LB 15 said:

As it turns out you could not be more correct. I just found out that there were 5 entries but only 3 started and one of them pulled out after a few hours leaving ...one in the two handed division and one in the fully crewed division! Not only that they went ahead with the prize giving - each boat got huge trophies for line honours and overall in each division.

You can not make this shit up.

We had to DNS because our poor owner got pinched for rigging which he wasn’t expecting as the boats only 6-7yrs old from new! So had to get that sorted instead of that. We are going out overnight this weekend instead + sailing to Syd the following week. 

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17 hours ago, Dark Cloud said:

Do they both use the same RRS ?

 

15 hours ago, pulpit said:

Abbo,

So what Port / Starboard or Starboard / Port rule were they using ?

 

Were they  racing out of the Lotta fishing and fight club ? if so they would off been using the Starboard / Port Morton Bay Local rules.

 

Maybe we need GRS to come and explain this local rule and how it replaces the normal rules and how it's only for the rich and shameless and the invited few of the Lotta fishing ad fight club who drink / buy red wine with and for GRS.

 

Pulpit

The OA was not the Lota dining and chair throwing club, it was another. However the boat that was on port is a member of that esteemed club so there may have been some confusion over the P/S rule.

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13 hours ago, LionessRacing said:

Oy, you guys are still fighting this lost war? 

Still going. One has to recognise the tenacity, at least. Thought it ran out of puff a couple of months back but I was mistaken.

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14 hours ago, LionessRacing said:

Oy, you guys are still fighting this lost war? 

 

2 hours ago, Boink said:

Is that you, Australian Sailing......?!?!?

Wondered when you'd make an appearance

 

36 minutes ago, grs said:

Still going. One has to recognise the tenacity, at least. Thought it ran out of puff a couple of months back but I was mistaken.

You mean you had hoped it had run out of puff......

So that the Carpet could be fixed up

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2 hours ago, grs said:

Still going. One has to recognise the tenacity, at least. Thought it ran out of puff a couple of months back but I was mistaken.

And there it is.


For anyone wondering how chronically tone deaf Glen is, or how poor his ability is to read the room - he never fails to astound, amaze and disappoint.

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18 hours ago, Boink said:

So instead of getting screwed by Australian Sailing.........

Your getting screwed by the Owner.

But Choice and Consent is important. ;)

No one could argue that Consent is granted in the former.........

At least the owner buys me dinner and a nice bottle of Shiraz before #crewing me? And that’s NOT a typo…

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6 hours ago, grs said:

Still going. One has to recognise the tenacity, at least. Thought it ran out of puff a couple of months back but I was mistaken.

I think the reality of what is happening in 24 days is starting to dawn on people who previously didn't think about it. Certainly a big source of angst at the club prize giving last Sunday.

I don't think the battle will go away - the pressure will be on the clubs to right their wrong of agreeing to a totally insane prescription.

If I have referred to the wrong battle, then of course there are the other ones that again will only heat up when decisions are published.

 

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21 hours ago, grs said:

Still going. One has to recognise the tenacity, at least. Thought it ran out of puff a couple of months back but I was mistaken.

Wow. And there is our representation. Pay your money and go away.

Instead of recognising our tenacity, how about recognising our concerns.

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1 minute ago, Mad Mac said:

Wow. And there is our representation. Pay your money and go away.

Instead of recognising our tenacity, how about recognising our concerns.

"The dogs bark, the children cry but the AS circus caravan rolls on...."

FKT

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1 hour ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

"The dogs bark, the children cry but the AS circus caravan rolls on...."

FKT

And that's because the clubs are the members of AS not the individuals. So all AS has to do to keep the status quo is to keep the big clubs happy (after all the votes of only a few big clubs carry enough weight to pass anything at AS level).

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