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15 hours ago, mikewof said:

Anyone here know about the new VAT rules with Brexit?

I sold someone some seawater desalination stuff, they live in Britain, and my shipping interface won't let me ship until I first collect their VAT and send to her Royal Majesty's something or another.

I've looked at instructions online, but they seem to conflict in some key ways. It seems half of the time, the answers I get are "refund their money and give up." But my customer needs her desal stuff, it shouldn't be that hard for me to give the Queen what she wants, right?

 

1 hour ago, Fiji Bitter said:

The short answer is nobody anywhere knows. Some posters here do know how difficult and expensive it is.

The best useless advice is to not even think about shipping anything! Sorry...

 

Unfortunately true. The UK gov website currently seems to be recommending that you pay a specialist importation company to handle the importation and associated VAT payments. These companies are already registered with UK HMRC and thus avoid the need for the original seller to do so. As the importer they are taking on responsibility to warranty the goods, so their fee covers their costs to do so. I would be surprised if their T&C's don't impose warranty costs back on to the original seller, but I don't know.

The alternative is to register your company with UK HMRC for VAT, then you need to charge UK VAT on your sales, plus any applicable duty, then every three months you have to make a VAT submission and send the relevant payment to UK HMRC. You have to make the submission every three months for the entire period you are registered regardless of whether you have made a sale to the UK in that period. It is not clear what fees apply for this registration. We didn't pay any but that was 25 years ago!

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I was thinking for the last few days that  as a pro union lifelong Alliance voter I should respond to this post but turning on the radio this morning and hearing Mike Nesbitt made me decide to act.

No way I'm going to PA. This was a top thread, now it's fucked. Thank you fucking idiots.

Umm, that would be you.  1) You are fool (as is both evident and self-confessed) who thinks that brexit is a good idea.  2) You post nonsense that only reinforces this and believe that you a

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It’s not just the U.K., by June all EU countries will be operating a similar system, it takes out the unfair advantage of buying from other countries where VAT or equivalent was not charged or pocketed by the supplier, creating the difference in prices we have all assumed was “ it’s cheaper in X Country “

thttps://europa.eu/youreurope/business/taxation/vat/cross-border-vat/index_en.htm#withintheeusellgoodsfinalconsumer-1

Even the Chinese are complaining in having to set up payments to HMRC. We just bought some goods out of the States and they have encountered the same problem.

Get used to it guys, every government in the world is having to deal with record debt, somehow they are going to claw that back and increased Stealth and Wealth taxes are going to be implemented or be more regimented.

 

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5 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

It’s not just the U.K., by June all EU countries will be operating a similar system, it takes out the unfair advantage of buying from other countries where VAT or equivalent was not charged or pocketed by the supplier, creating the difference in prices we have all assumed was “ it’s cheaper in X Country “

thttps://europa.eu/youreurope/business/taxation/vat/cross-border-vat/index_en.htm#withintheeusellgoodsfinalconsumer-1

Even the Chinese are complaining in having to set up payments to HMRC. We just bought some goods out of the States and they have encountered the same problem.

Get used to it guys, every government in the world is having to deal with record debt, somehow they are going to claw that back and increased Stealth and Wealth taxes are going to be implemented or be more regimented.

 

That is for relatively small retail. For commercial goods and equipment here is a link to where to tax for supply to the EU countries.

For example, "where the goods are being installed or assembled, if done by the supplier [Article 36 of the VAT Directive]

  • Example 7: Romanian VAT must be paid on the supply of a machine installed in Romania by the Italian supplier for his customer. Should the machine instead be installed by the customer himself, the supply will be taxable in Italy (an exempt intra-Community supply in Italy followed by an intra-Community acquisition in Romania will take place if the customer is a taxable person)."

This means that if you supply equipment that is installed by the customer, and you are outside of the EU, then you will not need to register with the country where your VAT-registered EU agent is (exempt supply as it is wholesale), and the agent can supply all of EU without having to register in every country. Much simpler and cheaper, but not sure if it would apply to your desal kit.

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12 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

For small 1 off sales it’s far easier to setup an EBay or Amazon sale. 

Amazon is a PITA, but you're saying that eBay will handle the VAT paperwork on the sale? I'll keep that info in my pocket in case my current attempt fails. Very helpful, thank you.

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13 hours ago, hump101 said:

 

Unfortunately true. The UK gov website currently seems to be recommending that you pay a specialist importation company to handle the importation and associated VAT payments. These companies are already registered with UK HMRC and thus avoid the need for the original seller to do so. As the importer they are taking on responsibility to warranty the goods, so their fee covers their costs to do so. I would be surprised if their T&C's don't impose warranty costs back on to the original seller, but I don't know.

The alternative is to register your company with UK HMRC for VAT, then you need to charge UK VAT on your sales, plus any applicable duty, then every three months you have to make a VAT submission and send the relevant payment to UK HMRC. You have to make the submission every three months for the entire period you are registered regardless of whether you have made a sale to the UK in that period. It is not clear what fees apply for this registration. We didn't pay any but that was 25 years ago!

I registered with U.K., and I now have a "Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs Gateway User I.D." I'm now trying get a VAT number assigned with this this I.D.. So I'll have to get the VAT from my customer using some kind of electronic payment method, deposit that to my business account, and then deposit that to Her Majesty's bank account apparently. What a cluster fuck. Is Britain trying to kill their economy with this shit? The really stupid part is that we only have to deal with this minutiae for purchases under 135 pounds sterling. For anything over like (like a boat or a more expensive desalination system) the seller just reports the price, and the Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs office collects the VAT on their own. They're thus fully capable of dealing with this, they just don't want to be bothered with smaller purchases.

The idea of having to make a submission every three months, regardless if I have a sale or not, doesn't really sit too well with me. I kind of get it with my own government, but not with "Her Majesty's" government, I might be "employed" by the U.S. Government, but I'm not employed by the Queen.

And why do they slap "Her Majesty" on everything? Is Her Majesty worried that people will forget she's there? It's kind of like writing a toddler's name on his snow boots and mittens.

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If you use OMP like Ebay, they will collect the VAT & customs fee by using a parcel delivery who will try to get it from the costumer. If the costumer refuses taking delivery the parcel will be send back and you have to pay.
 

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7 minutes ago, LeoV said:

If you use OMP like Ebay, they will collect the VAT & customs fee by using a parcel delivery who will try to get it from the costumer. If the costumer refuses taking delivery the parcel will be send back and you have to pay.
 

Plus a listing fee plus 9-11% selling fee....

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Why get pissed just with the U.K. government when all of the EU is going to be the same by June, it’s a transition phase where buyers and sellers are going to be penalised until we wake up to the fact that it maybe cheaper to buy local and forget the huge air miles small 2nd hand articles are dispatched around the world for the convenience and desires of an individual. Surely it’s designed to slow up the likes of China flooding markets with tat and for the Greenies amongst us, any global movement that’s done away with has to be good for the planet.
 

If Biden has his way then all companies selling into other countries will have to pay local tax as well. Now I’m for that as the likes of Google, Amazon, EBay are really hitting local markets and paying tax in the least possible way. But it has to be agreed by all the worlds major countries, I can’t imagine the likes of the Netherlands, Ireland with their flags of convenience for tax purposes  and Germany with their huge export excess welcoming that.
 

Even the U.K. who has championed international company tax reform is baulking at the thought some of our major exporters having to pay tax in other countries. 

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2 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

Why get pissed just with the U.K. government when all of the EU is going to be the same by June, it’s a transition phase where buyers and sellers are going to be penalised until we wake up to the fact that it maybe cheaper to buy local and forget the huge air miles small 2nd hand articles are dispatched around the world for the convenience and desires of an individual.

If I order something from the UK, it will be less grey energy than if I order it from Spain... Nevertheless I can't stand red tape so now will do my best to order stuff from other EU countries as it will be easier for me evn if I can't speak German or Italian! Geographically the UK is in Europe, British companies will have to go further to compensate for the lost custom from EU countries, it doesn't make sense from an environmental point of view.

Anyway I bought a small ham radio kit in the UK 10 days ago, it is still floating somewhere in the postal service, it is alright there is no rush and I knew this would happen. Nevertheless a year ago I would have received it within 3 days! It is a cottage industry so won't break the UK economy but I am sure that they are chuffed to be on equal footing with Chinese vendors in term of ease of sending stuff to the continent!

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So if you ordered it from China, would it be faster than from the U.K. At the moment we can order gear from the Far East and it arrives in 8 working days, Germany it’s taking 10. 
 

On anyone’s terms that’s wrong, but you can’t blame Boris to tighten things up re duties if the EU is doing the same to goods going to the EU from the U.K.

Interesting to me were the reports in the business press on Sunday that movements cross channel to France if you take a COVID into account, were back to 107% levels of 2019.

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8 hours ago, Panoramix said:

It is a cottage industry so won't break the UK economy but I am sure that they are chuffed to be on equal footing with Chinese vendors in term of ease of sending stuff to the continent!

Both China and UK and US and ROW will have to pay VAT for access to EU single market for stuff under 150E.

Import One Stop Shop for the EU, register in one country and it is valid for 27.
https://shiptheory.com/blog/import-one-stop-shop-ioss/
https://tax-technology.expert/ioss-demystified/

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UK admission to Lugano Convention looks like to be blocked by EU commission. An accord that facilitates court jurisdiction over cross-border civil and commercial disputes.
Bad for UK SME and London FS.

For divorces etc it will be the previous Hague convention that will deal with that.

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10 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

So if you ordered it from China, would it be faster than from the U.K. At the moment we can order gear from the Far East and it arrives in 8 working days, Germany it’s taking 10. 

I would say that it is about the same... Before Brexit it was 2 or may be 3 working days to get UK stuff, not 2 weeks!

In this age of zero stock, 2 weeks doesn't work for many businesses, I think that Germany will be the winner as they have lot of online shops.

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8 hours ago, Panoramix said:

think that Germany will be the winner as they have lot of online shops

As far as I know many stopped deliveries to GB. That's not good, but german online shops have at least 27 other countries in the EU they can deliver without any problems , and to deliver the ROW is up until now no big deal. UK online shops also either stopped exporting to EU or moved partly or at least the warehouse to the EU, especially if they are also hit by rules of origin (like selling wetsuits or sailing gear made in the far east). Otherwise they would lose the market of 27 of the richest markets in the world. 

And it is not that the EU made some "new rules" especially for the UK like the UK rw press tries to say, 3rd country rules were in place long before brexit, and the UK not only knew the rules, they also made them. 

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1 hour ago, jgh66 said:

That's not good, but german online shops have at least 27 other countries in the EU they can deliver without any problems , and to deliver the ROW is up until now no big deal. 

If we add up all the other EU countries market size together outside France Germany and Spain,  it’s about the same as the U.K. and the rest of the world is fair game to all.

For all the price advantages we used to see from EU, with the proper VAT added and taxes now becoming equal, excl delivery, I was shocked to see my Netherlands supplier of lithium batteries which I have used exclusively for the last 8 years, was now more expensive than a U.K. supplier. 

One thing Brexit has done is made me look at beyond the old and trusted EU suppliers and I have to say, my costs are down, balanced with the downside of about 14 day delivery, but 24 hour if U.K. based. That’s OK I can work with that.
 

 

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1 hour ago, Waynemarlow said:

If we add up all the other EU countries market size together outside France Germany and Spain,  it’s about the same as the U.K. and the rest of the world is fair game to all.

Really? Where did you get these numbers?

I bet that if you add together just Italy, Austria, Belgium and the Netherlands, it must be more than the UK! On top of this it isn't just access to EU countries as Switzerland and Norway are both part of Schengen and UK e-commerce will also lose easy access to these 2 (rich) countries.

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20 minutes ago, Panoramix said:

Really? Where did you get these numbers?

I bet that if you add together just Italy, Austria, Belgium and the Netherlands, it must be more than the UK! On top of this it isn't just access to EU countries as Switzerland and Norway are both part of Schengen and UK e-commerce will also lose easy access to these 2 (rich) countries.

Sorry, I thought we were talking about E commerce.

image.thumb.png.16208b89e280cee269af0402c299fd1b.png

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That is the revenue of e-commerce companies, to compare the UK market vs the Schengen one, you need to look at consumer spending per country which will be different. Companies like Wiggle were selling lot of stuff on the continent pre-Brexit and this will be included in your 200 billion figure.

With so many British e-commerce business that were successful, I am pretty sure that there were more EU people buying in the UK than the other way round.

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1 hour ago, Panoramix said:

That is the revenue of e-commerce companies, to compare the UK market vs the Schengen one, you need to look at consumer spending per country which will be different. Companies like Wiggle were selling lot of stuff on the continent pre-Brexit and this will be included in your 200 billion figure.

With so many British e-commerce business that were successful, I am pretty sure that there were more EU people buying in the UK than the other way round.

Interesting that most of the guys I knew buying bike parts found Wiggle expensive and Bikeparts.de cheaper. I would suspect that there was pretty much equal volumes going across the channel in both directions and that was the power of ECommerce and cheap delivery. 
 

In some ways I think any reduction in vans delivering goods throughout Europe, all for a few pence difference on the retail price, will be doing us and the planet a great favour.

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24 minutes ago, Waynemarlow said:

Interesting that most of the guys I knew buying bike parts found Wiggle expensive and Bikeparts.de cheaper. I would suspect that there was pretty much equal volumes going across the channel in both directions and that was the power of ECommerce and cheap delivery. 
 

In some ways I think any reduction in vans delivering goods throughout Europe, all for a few pence difference on the retail price, will be doing us and the planet a great favour.

For me it is probably less grey energy if I buy from the UK than from Germany, yet I've stopped looking at Wiggle... TBH now I mostly use my local bike shop for anything that isn't special but all this stuff is made in the far east and will have to travel anyway from the importer to the stockist then to the shop, I am not sure which route is best. E-commerce may well be more efficient as it uses the postal service where the infrastructure is shared by many.

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6 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

Interesting that most of the guys I knew buying bike parts found Wiggle expensive and Bikeparts.de cheaper. I would suspect that there was pretty much equal volumes going across the channel in both directions and that was the power of ECommerce and cheap delivery. 
 

In some ways I think any reduction in vans delivering goods throughout Europe, all for a few pence difference on the retail price, will be doing us and the planet a great favour.

Covid has increaced the amount of vans delivering goods, not reduced.

All shops closed, so everybody is ordering by internet (could still be at the same shop, that now has e e-shop)

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Leading MEPs on Tuesday once again refused to set a date to ratify the EU-U.K. post-Brexit trade deal, saying they would wait until London gives reassurances it will apply the deal.

The decision will be "deferred due to the need for progress on roadmap for pragmatic yet full implementation of the WithdrawalAgreement," tweeted Christophe Hansen, the lead Brexit MEP on the European Parliament's trade committee. "Cool heads must prevail," Hansen added.

https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-uk-trade-post-brexit-deal-ratification-delayed-again/
--------------
Seems IMB and delaying NIP has it's consequences.
Nothing looks to be signed or agreed on till NIP problems are sorted. Leverage.

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1 hour ago, gewoon ik said:

Covid has increaced the amount of vans delivering goods, not reduced.

Well what a deduction, do we now call you Poirot ?

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1 hour ago, LeoV said:

Nothing looks to be signed or agreed on till NIP problems are sorted. Leverage.

Wouldn't bet on it, the longer the agreement is not signed, the longer the UK gets to sort its customs and tax systems else where. With a government short of money taxing every bit of goods coming into the UK may well be an option if no deal is on the cards.

If the problems are being blamed on the EU intransigence on the NIP, then Boris could simply walk away with no agreement and England would probably back him.

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Yesterday’s news:
German agency connects AZ to risk of blood-clotting. UK press and politicians; Unscientific! They put everyone at risk!

UK public empathised so quickly, so completely with “their” agency over ”other” agencies that the outcome could only be: our agency says no connection, so an agency that sees a connection must be unscientific.

Today’s news: How brilliant UK doctor linked blood-clotting to AZ, rightly wanting to raise awareness of a risk.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/apr/13/how-uk-doctor-marie-scully-blood-clotting-link-astrazeneca-covid-jab-university-college-london-hospital

So while UK politicians were lambasting the EU, the UK vaccine taskforce knew they were right. And waited, and waited and waited. Till a few days ago with an advice for a different jab for young if possible and today with this article.
But of course it where the UK scientists who warned the world, and not the Norwegians or German scientists.
Utter spin and bullocks.

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12 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

If the problems are being blamed on the EU intransigence on the NIP, then Boris could simply walk away with no agreement and England would probably back him.

Finally the Brexiters will get their hard Brexit! Not sure that the ordinary man will enjoy the consequences of being treated by the EU like a totally foreign country, even China would come in front!

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Germany has fined and deported three British electricians.
Customs authority officials in Stuttgart acted after they inspected the men's paperwork while they were fitting out a sports shop for a Slovenian company.
Thomas Seemann, the spokesman for the customs office in Stuttgart, told The Times: “The official accusation against the men is that they were working illegally in the Federal Republic of Germany, as they did not have a place of residence or the correct paperwork.

“Based on this, they had to deposit a ‘financial security’ for the expected penalty.
"The public prosecutor’s office in Stuttgart will determine how high the penalty will be.

--------------------------
Illegal immigrants because of doing illegal work...

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https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.04.08.21255103v1.full.pdf

EU was the largest spender of the research on new method of vaccination at Oxford.
At the time UK was in Horizon programme for this, so paid into that EU fund too. But EU spending committee was independent.
UK funded for AZ the research to make it an AZ jab. Suddenly no EU or US money to be seen.

Waisted money for the EU ? Nope, EU funded this fundamental research at other EU universities too.
At the time they all worked together, and together they worked out the fundaments.
Jannsen (J&J) vaccine is based on this research.

So investment EU and UK in Oxford research for all research roughly 60% UK 40% EU.
With this information let's call it 60/40 the claim Oxford/AZ  jab is  British.
But more information needed to really make a judgement, is the UK payment deducted in UK AZ contract or not ?
How much and by who was invested in production capacity ?

And from this you can see that 97% of the research and devolpment was publicly funded, no investment from big pharma.

SG/AH are the two leading Oxford professors working on this research project.

Ey_tGDTXEAIpoko?format=jpg&name=medium

 

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Not sure why you're still banging on about AZ, Denmark has now binned it all together and its being reported that the AZ EU contract is not being renewed as of 2022.  Talk about a fit of pique when any risk is tiny to that of being hit by a bus on the way to work and yet its proven saving of lives is incontestable.

Are all those millions of shots held up in all your fridges going to be now dispatched to more countries around the world to be used, rather than disposed of when the out of date is reached or are you guys going to give export licences ?

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Bullshit as usual. 

Only Denmark has stopped using AZ so far, it is used in GER for people older than 60, elsewhere 55, and on some plague islands for 30 years and older. 

But it makes sense to increase production of safer vaccines and stop ordering/producing unsafe stuff, or?

Maybe not in countries that have no other options, and a large proportion of their people are so dumb to believe even in the most insane lies. 

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2 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

Not sure why you're still banging on about AZ, Denmark has now binned it all together and its being reported that the AZ EU contract is not being renewed as of 2022. 

What’s Bullshit about that statement ?
 

As a point of interest what’s the rate of thrombosis of the AZ vaccine in Germany versus the rate of thrombosis from German air flights ?

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Gov.uk:

 

JCVI currently advises that it is preferable for adults aged <30 years without underlying health conditions that put them at higher risk of severe COVID-19 disease, to be offered an alternative COVID-19 vaccine, if available

 

Stiko germany:

 

Warum ist der AstraZeneca-Impfstoff nur noch für Personen ≥60 Jahre empfohlen?

Seit dem 01.04.21 empfiehlt die STIKO die Impfung mit dem Impfstoff Vaxzevria der Firma AstraZeneca nur noch Personen im Alter von ≥60 Jahre.

Der Grund für diese Altersbeschränkung liegt in den seltenen Fällen von Thrombosen in Kombination mit Thrombopenien, die nach der Impfung bei wenigen Geimpften aufgetreten sind.

Diese schweren, teilweise tödlich verlaufenden Nebenwirkungen wurden überwiegend bei Frauen im Alter ≤55 Jahren beobachtet. Es waren aber auch Männer und Ältere betroffen. (siehe FAQ "Worauf sollten Personen <60 Jahre achten, die bereits mit dem AstraZeneca-Impfstoff geimpft wurden?")

Die STIKO schränkt ihre Empfehlung deshalb nach einer Risiko-Nutzen-Abwägung für beide Geschlechter ein.

In der Altersgruppe der ≥60-jährigen nimmt das Risiko einer schweren bzw. tödlichen COVID-19-Erkrankung zu, sodass die Nutzen-Risiko-Abwägung hier eindeutig zu Gunsten der Impfung ausfällt:

Die Impfung mit AstraZeneca verhindert effektiv eine (schwere) COVID-19-Erkrankung in einer Bevölkerungsgruppe, die – verglichen mit Erkrankten der Altersgruppe 18-bis-60 Jahre - ein mehr als 60-mal höheres Risiko hat an COVID-19 zu versterben (Quelle: RKI-Meldedaten). Gleichzeitig traten 89% der gemeldeten thromboembolischen Ereignisse bei <60-Jährigen und damit nicht in dieser von COVID-19 besonders gefährdeten Altersgruppe ≥60 Jahre auf.

Die STIKO empfiehlt Personen ≥60 Jahre daher weiterhin die Impfung mit der COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca. In der älteren Altersgruppe wird der Impfstoff im Allgemeinen besser vertragen und führt zu weniger häufigen und weniger schweren Impfreaktionen.

Darüber hinaus ist unabhängig vom Alter eine Entscheidung nach ärztlichem Ermessen für die erste oder zweite Impfstoffdosis mit Vaxzevria von AstraZeneca möglich, die bei individueller Risikoakzeptanz nach sorgfältiger Aufklärung getroffen wird, . Bislang liegen keine Daten zum Risiko bei Zweitimpfung vor.

Stand: 01.04.2021

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Did you look up the DVT rates for German airlines and the Covid thrombosis deaths, seems every young lass is willing to throw themselves onto a flight to the sun and yet is being advised to not take the AZ vaccine.

I guess we had better cancel all flights for the young, mind you most air travel at this moment would seem a safe bet as they are not even flying :rolleyes:

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JGH, he is lost, ignore him for your health, and thank you for not quoting him.

UK press is in a horrible state, every newspaper or TV channel could have done the ROI requests and found out about the Oxford finances. Now the medical sector itself got enough of the bull shit coming from BJ mouth..

5Ehh8zLf?format=jpg&name=small

Who of you is the biggest scumbag ?

 

 

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18 hours ago, LeoV said:

Germany has fined and deported three British electricians.
Customs authority officials in Stuttgart acted after they inspected the men's paperwork while they were fitting out a sports shop for a Slovenian company.
Thomas Seemann, the spokesman for the customs office in Stuttgart, told The Times: “The official accusation against the men is that they were working illegally in the Federal Republic of Germany, as they did not have a place of residence or the correct paperwork.

“Based on this, they had to deposit a ‘financial security’ for the expected penalty.
"The public prosecutor’s office in Stuttgart will determine how high the penalty will be.

--------------------------
Illegal immigrants because of doing illegal work...

That’s kind of  a reversal of fortunes for the Brits, used to be the Eastern Europeans would go to the UK to do the dirty work.

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You guys really are backward looking old farts. Are you all retired with too much time on your hands and your only thrill each day is to post here on SA the most negative thing you can find on Boris spread across the press of 450 million people. 
 

When are you going to accept Brexit is done and what will be will be rather how things used to be ? This thread now is left with just a few liberal and leftie Brexit haters not wanting to accept that in a democratic society, when you have a referendum and say you are going to honour the result, then that’s what happens.

This thread has little meaning left, the boat park opened up last week, sailing has started, racing begins in a couple of weeks, time has come to bin this thread and move on.

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1 hour ago, Waynemarlow said:

You guys really are backward looking old farts. Are you all retired with too much time on your hands and your only thrill each day is to post here on SA the most negative thing you can find on Boris spread across the press of 450 million people. 
 

When are you going to accept Brexit is done and what will be will be rather how things used to be ? This thread now is left with just a few liberal and leftie Brexit haters not wanting to accept that in a democratic society, when you have a referendum and say you are going to honour the result, then that’s what happens.

This thread has little meaning left, the boat park opened up last week, sailing has started, racing begins in a couple of weeks, time has come to bin this thread and move on.

I thought you were banned Jacky-boi.

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Seems Brexit is done for most in the EU. Would love to ratify the TCA and don't think about it anymore. 

Looks like the UK is the place where Brexit still is not done. No proper implementation of WA in NI, no chance for England to get their border control posts ready in time, no way to get the EU to ratify the great BJ Deal. Which will lead to new international trouble. Get your Brexit done, stay on your island and we are all happy. 

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1 hour ago, Waynemarlow said:

You guys really are backward looking old farts. Are you all retired with too much time on your hands and your only thrill each day is to post here on SA the most negative thing you can find on Boris spread across the press of 450 million people. 

I reckon you're just trolling but WTF, I'll bite :-)

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When are you going to accept Brexit is done and what will be will be rather how things used to be ? This thread now is left with just a few liberal and leftie Brexit haters not wanting to accept that in a democratic society, when you have a referendum and say you are going to honour the result, then that’s what happens.

It's barely started. Impact is only just starting to show. Lots of work still to do.

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This thread has little meaning left, the boat park opened up last week, sailing has started, racing begins in a couple of weeks, time has come to bin this thread and move on.

Think we should wait until at least May 10th, possibly July 12th, before we start counting chickens. Those who want to pretend Brexit is done & dusted are the liars and fools that want to hide the truth.

 Expect lots of "look at the damage that the pandemic has caused" from those desperate to bury mistakes.

How long before we see a resurgence of facism in England? Look out for groundwork like extending protection for police misdeeds, reduction in freedom to assemble & protest and official publications playing down race issues. When things like that start to happen we should begin to be concerned...

Cheers,

             W.

 

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How many fucking socks do you have Jack?

 

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10 hours ago, Sea warrior said:

That’s kind of  a reversal of fortunes for the Brits, used to be the Eastern Europeans would go to the UK to do the dirty work.

Why? Have seen many Brits working in the western EU in the past... maybe due to this:

Disposable income
The UK has six of the ten poorest regions in North West Europe in terms of disposable income (East 
Yorkshire and North Lincolnshire; Northern Ireland; South Yorkshire; Durham and Tees Valley; West 
Wales and the Valleys; and the West Midlands). 
There are a further 5 regions below the EU average - Lancashire; Northumberland/Tyne and Wear; 
Merseyside; West Yorkshire; and Greater Manchester.
Variations in disposable income are less pronounced than in GDP per capita. There is no UK region 
with average disposable income of below 90% of the EU average. However, our record is still poor 
compared to other North West European countries. While there are 11 UK regions below the EU 
average, there is only one from France and none from Germany.
The UK’s record has also worsened over time. In 2008, there were only three European countries 
amongst the poorest in North West Europe.

Conclusions
The perceived performance of different economies has a considerable influence on policymakers. 
Obviously, policies introduced in countries perceived to have enjoyed economic success are more 
likely to be copied, whereas those in countries considered to have performed badly are more likely 
to be disregarded.
We have seen during the EU referendum campaign, the claim that UK was ‘shackled to a corpse’ as a 
result of EU membership. Yet this sense of superiority seems wildly mis-placed. Large swathes of the 
UK can only dream of achieving the levels of economic activity and living standards of even the 
poorest parts of supposedly similar EU countries.
Proposals to increase levels of taxation and public spending; expand trade union and collective 
bargaining coverage; or introduce worker representation into corporate governance structures in 
the UK are also regularly attacked for being ‘anti-business’ with the implication that they would be 
harmful to the economy. However, these measures are commonplace in other European countries.

They are obviously not damaging North Western European economies to the extent that the poorest 
parts of the UK are held back by the more extreme version of capitalism practiced in this country. 
This suggests that the risks associated with the more stakeholder-oriented model found on mainland 
Europe are exaggerated. while its advantages are under-appreciated.

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6 minutes ago, jgh66 said:

Proposals to increase levels of taxation and public spending; expand trade union and collective 
bargaining coverage; or introduce worker representation into corporate governance structures in 
the UK are also regularly attacked for being ‘anti-business’ with the implication that they would be 
harmful to the economy. However, these measures are commonplace in other European countries.

 

Yes but Thatcher said it wouldn't work so it is a Gospel Truth.

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That report was necessarily limited to reviewing regions, but the income disparity within regions in the UK is just as stark. There are areas of Lancashire, deemed overall as only "below average" in the report, that are so destitute that house prices have gone negative, whilst other areas in the same county are at normal levels.

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Today's news in german papers.. 

 

This report highlights the damage that Brexit has already done to the City of London. More than 440 firms in banking and finance have moved or are moving part of their business, staff, assets or legal entities from the UK to the EU. While this is higher than previous estimates, it underestimates the real picture – and the potential longer term impact

https://newfinancial.org/topics/brexit/

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On 4/16/2021 at 8:21 PM, hump101 said:

that are so destitute that house prices have gone negative

How does that work ?

5000 quids + a house for free in a gumtree ad ?

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4 minutes ago, Panoramix said:

How does that work ?

5000 quids + a house for free in a gumtree ad ?

Housing associations that took on contracts to supply housing to low or no income households have now found that the rent will not cover the maintenance, as government subsidies have dried up, so they didn't do any, so renters left. No work, so no new tenants, now the association has tried to sell the properties for £1. No buyers. The council refused to take them even if they were paid to do so, as cost to renovate is prohibitive.

Edit: found the reference, the price was £1 for 100 houses, but no buyers.

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14 minutes ago, hump101 said:

Housing associations that took on contracts to supply housing to low or no income households have now found that the rent will not cover the maintenance, as government subsidies have dried up, so they didn't do any, so renters left. No work, so no new tenants, now the association has tried to sell the properties for £1. No buyers. The council refused to take them even if they were paid to do so, as cost to renovate is prohibitive.

Edit: found the reference, the price was £1 for 100 houses, but no buyers.

Considering how hard it is to find an affordable house in the UK, that's mad!

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Whatever that piece may say, it seems houses in Horden do in fact have some value, especially those fit to occupy.

https://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/property/county-durham/horden/

FWIW, I know someone who makes a living from buying similar properties, renovating them and renting them out. His biggest problem is that tenants tend to pay the rent for a short period, then stop. Eviction was always difficult, time-consuming and expensive and the provisions of the Coronavirus Act, while well-intentioned, have made that, from his point of view, much worse.

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1 minute ago, Panoramix said:

Considering how hard it is to find an affordable house in the UK, that's mad!

It is mad, but just shows the disparity in wealth around the country. A broom cupboard in London is worth £150k, but elsewhere they can't give the property away. An apartment in London has gone up 300% in the last 20 years, but some property in the highlands has not risen in value at all in the last 30 years, whilst in some northern regions of England they have dropped. Labour subsidised rent for the unemployed to a level that sustained property prices as it was worth buying to rent in those areas, but the Tories have cut these subsidies, whilst at the same time removing other "perks" for landlords, like offsetting interest payments against tax. The above is an example of where the worst properties, with the least reliable tenancies, are now dropping off the market.

As Dogwatch notes, these are very localised effects, but unchecked they will spread as adjacent tenants move out.

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10 minutes ago, dogwatch said:

Whatever that piece may say, it seems houses in Horden do in fact have some value, especially those fit to occupy.

https://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/property/county-durham/horden/

FWIW, I know someone who makes a living from buying similar properties, renovating them and renting them out. His biggest problem is that tenants tend to pay the rent for a short period, then stop. Eviction was always difficult, time-consuming and expensive and the provisions of the Coronavirus Act, while well-intentioned, have made that, from his point of view, much worse.

Sold prices are probably a better indicator, and some have sold. A few on that page have had substantial reduction in value, though.

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It's also worth noting that the C4 piece did not say the properties were valueless. It said they were unwanted by social housing providers (housing association and local council). There are specific reasons for that. The "bedroom tax" which it mentions is a decrease in housing benefit paid to tenants occupying social housing deemed too large for their needs. It does not apply to tenants of private housing. Therefore poor quality housing stock which may be unwanted by social housing providers may find a buyer in the open market, either owner-occupier or (more likely) buy-to-let.

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28 minutes ago, hump101 said:

It is mad, but just shows the disparity in wealth around the country. A broom cupboard in London is worth £150k, but elsewhere they can't give the property away. An apartment in London has gone up 300% in the last 20 years, but some property in the highlands has not risen in value at all in the last 30 years, whilst in some northern regions of England they have dropped. Labour subsidised rent for the unemployed to a level that sustained property prices as it was worth buying to rent in those areas, but the Tories have cut these subsidies, whilst at the same time removing other "perks" for landlords, like offsetting interest payments against tax. The above is an example of where the worst properties, with the least reliable tenancies, are now dropping off the market.

As Dogwatch notes, these are very localised effects, but unchecked they will spread as adjacent tenants move out.

Yes, but not everybody needs to live close to a place where there is work and you would think that some people would want to relocate to avoid sinking all their economy/earnings in a small house. When we were in the UK my wife worked as an architect on a co-housing project (https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2014/nov/21/how-to-create-happy-communities-through-co-housing)  and you would think that it would be possible to develop places like this. Doing it one house at a time is not going to work, 100 families who are either retired or can work remotely need to team-up though... It might seem mad but 1000GBP per month of mortgage is equally mad!!!

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37 minutes ago, dogwatch said:

It's also worth noting that the C4 piece did not say the properties were valueless. It said they were unwanted by social housing providers (housing association and local council). There are specific reasons for that. The "bedroom tax" which it mentions is a decrease in housing benefit paid to tenants occupying social housing deemed too large for their needs. It does not apply to tenants of private housing. Therefore poor quality housing stock which may be unwanted by social housing providers may find a buyer in the open market, either owner-occupier or (more likely) buy-to-let.

Agreed, but in these areas there are no private tenants as there is no work, so buy to let is only possible to tenants on housing benefits, hence the issue. Your link shows these properties being offered on the private market for £5000, and my link shows that none have sold. I understand there are issues in this area (extensive drug use) that has emptied specific streets.

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29 minutes ago, hump101 said:

Agreed, but in these areas there are no private tenants as there is no work, so buy to let is only possible to tenants on housing benefits, hence the issue. 

No, the "bedroom tax" only applies to those renting social housing, not those in receipt of housing benefit for private tenancies. That is because it was meant to act to release larger social housing properties for family use. It is possible - in fact common - to receive housing benefit for private tenancies.

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1 hour ago, dogwatch said:

No, the "bedroom tax" only applies to those renting social housing, not those in receipt of housing benefit for private tenancies. That is because it was meant to act to release larger social housing properties for family use. It is possible - in fact common - to receive housing benefit for private tenancies.

Yes, but the value of housing benefit provided to tenants has been drastically reduced, hence either rent drops, or tenants leave. Social housing properties that are emptied because of, for example, a "bedroom tax", then can't be refilled with private tenants on housing benefit because they can't pay enough rent to cover the running costs of a private landlord. It costs pretty much the same to maintain a property in Horden as in Twickenham, but the rent is 5 times as much in Twickenham, so the margin for a landlord in Twickenham is around 10%, and in Horden it would be -33%. Hence why it is £300k to buy a 1 bed flat in Twickenham, whilst a 2 bed terrace in Horden is not selling privately at £5k. It has, literally, no value to a private landlord.

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49 minutes ago, hump101 said:

Yes, but the value of housing benefit provided to tenants has been drastically reduced

Why do you believe that to be true?

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3 minutes ago, dogwatch said:

Why do you believe that to be true?

We had tenants who had their housing benefit cut despite their circumstances remaining unchanged. I have spoken with a representative of the local council (Surrey) who confirmed that this was the case across the board. I don't know of the details, but had understood that the headline figures were little changed, but the way that the claim is allocated has resulted in real cuts to actual paid housing benefit.

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4 minutes ago, dogwatch said:

Hmmm. I don't think that is true in general. When was this?

I'd need to check, but would guess 2018 or maybe early 2019?

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I don't see any news items suggesting recent significant changes in housing benefit. It isn't something that affects me directly but as I said earlier, I know someone whose business is renting property to tenants who are mostly on housing benefit. He has several dozen. We've had long conversations about his business model and if there were adverse effects from changes to housing benefit, I'd be surprised if the subject had not come up. All the fuss lately has been around the effect of "bedroom tax" but that wouldn't affect your tenant.

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I would be very interested to hear your friend's take on this. The council contact I spoke to was clear that this was a widespread issue and confirmed what the tenant had told us.

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Regarding Brexit.

NIP talks are following a route we have seen before;
EU; shows us some plans.
UK; we have non but ideas in some areas, be flexible, it is your fault.
Both; let's call the talks constructive.
Very similar to WAB an TAC talks of the last years.

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Buffoon Blojo visited the SW last week.

All the dickheads believing in Brexshit were a bit disappointed ..... hahahahahaha :lol:

Away from ice cream and cheese, the Prime Minister said there will be no special allowance for Cornwall to replace lost EU cash before going on a cheese tangent.

When the UK left the EU, Boris Johnson made a pledge that Cornwall would not lose out on additional funding after Brexit.

However Mr Johnson today indicated that the lost funding would be made up through funding provided through schemes which are also available to all other parts of the UK, with no special allowance for Cornwall.

The visions of sunlit uplands and unicorns dancing through rainbows have just turned a bit monochrome.

Gullible shits!!!

 

https://www.cornwalllive.com/news/cornwall-news/prime-minister-boris-johnson-answers-5274076

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Laser, are you gong to vote ? Is there a difference with a settled status in voting rights for EU citizens in the UK ?

BTW;
Johnson said that if he concluded the Irish Sea trade checks were not working in the interests of the UK he would invoke article 16, which allows either London or Brussels to temporarily suspend the protocol, according to the BBC. The broadcaster has issued clips from the programme, which goes out on Tuesday night at 9pm.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/apr/20/boris-johnson-uk-trying-to-cut-ludicrous-northern-ireland-checks

 

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21 minutes ago, LeoV said:

Laser, are you gong to vote ? Is there a difference with a settled status in voting rights for EU citizens in the UK ?

Hi Leo,  us immigrants can vote in local elections. (not in national ones).

The snag is that we vote for local councilors on a municipal level and national politics is not on the agenda.  I had some leaflets through the door from some of those muppets and it is all about local parking charges, rubbish collection, policing and bus-routes.

Cornwall council are a bunch of money wasting dickheads anyway whether they are red, blue or yellow so although I can vote I haven't got a clue who for because none of them represents my interests.

The local cons. MP supported Brixshit although she is the wife of a fisherman, go figure.:wacko:  That cunt has to 'fight' for the livelihoods of the local shelfish (Oysters & mussels) industry that is bleeding to death.  Not gonna happen!

As I have said before national politics, covid and Prince Philip were/are a very useful distraction from Brexshit and apart from insignificant mentions like upstairs you do not hear anything.  

 

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Ah, thanks.

Yep, Brexit is done for must in the UK and EU.
But there is still a lot to sort out. I m curious how BJ will solve the NIP problems.
Normally first shout at the EU, then sign something he says he will not sign.

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6 hours ago, Laser1 said:

YCMTSU

So the same tactics that has been used in the UK EU talks :) let's insult the other side. Worked brilliantly...

And Gove is now the Global Britain propaganda guy, Truss was relieved of this job recently.

 

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Looks like some good news for NIP;

Trade groups have told the FT that, despite Johnson’s rhetoric, UK government officials are stepping up their efforts to implement the NI protocol — part of the 2019 Brexit divorce deal which requires all goods entering Northern Ireland from Great Britain to comply with EU customs rules. “Whitehall is throwing the kitchen sink at this thing,” said Stephen Kelly, chief executive of Manufacturing Northern Ireland. “I cannot remember ever seeing this level of engagement from right across the UK government. Officials are working their rear ends off to try and make it work.”
https://www.ft.com/content/ce89dea5-1217-45e6-9b79-5ea7321e7494

Seems they are trying to smooth trade hiccups with technology and easier administration.
Not all convinced it will be enough. But again the words from London are different then their actions.

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Honourable Members,

On this point of compliance, I know that there was some reluctance in different parts of the House on whether it is right to ratify this Agreement when existing commitments are not being respected by one side. I agree with you that this Agreement on paper is only as good as implementation and enforcement in practice. And I share the concerns you have on unilateral actions by the United Kingdom since the Agreement came into provisional application.

We have obviously seen a number of issues arise since then. Some were to be expected, others are teething issues and many are the consequence of the type of Brexit the UK chose. But regardless of the reasons, we need to focus on joint solutions. Unilateral decisions will get us nowhere.

And this is one of the reasons ratification is so important. It will give us the tools we need to ensure full and faithful compliance with the obligations, which both sides signed up to. And it will also focus minds on finding pragmatic solutions where they are needed – most urgently around the Protocol on Ireland and Northern Ireland.

 

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/speech_21_1967

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yep,overall feeling in the euro-parliament is (1)no question about the vote itself, it's yes (2) the UK have already tried to fuck us over on some points, so we'll have to watch carefully and cut it short if need be (3) still lots of work to be done, pragmaticism and building of trust will be ever so important

now cue the wayniacs to inform us it's the other way around, it's the EU fucking little england sideways B)

and in the meantime french fishermen were blocking Boulogne stopping fish from the UK claiming "if you want the have your sea for yourself, then you can keep your fish to yourself too", who'd have thunk this could happen ? grin

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Yep, last actions on the deal. After that the implementation. Which is not going to well in some aspects.
NIP and delayed border controls in the UK etc.

Going to be a funky year. Now Foster has a vote of no confidence.

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The Boulogne blockade is a typical French fuck up. They didn't actually read the small print of the deal regarding how they would need to prove their historic fishing in the UK 6-12 mile zone, and are up in arms because the UK are implementing exactly what was agreed rather the the spirit of the deal which the French believe in. Has always been this way, sign up to the idea and don't worry about the detail. There will be ways round it. Perhaps Boris thinks if they can try it, so can I ....

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1 hour ago, cms said:

The Boulogne blockade is a typical French fuck up. They didn't actually read the small print of the deal regarding how they would need to prove their historic fishing in the UK 6-12 mile zone, and are up in arms because the UK are implementing exactly what was agreed rather the the spirit of the deal which the French believe in. Has always been this way, sign up to the idea and don't worry about the detail. There will be ways round it. Perhaps Boris thinks if they can try it, so can I ....

hmmmmmm... dunno

big disclaimer, lots of IF's in what follows.... I'm just wondering

 

from what I have been reading the blockage was triggered by the fact that fishing licenses were late or not given because of fishermen not being able or late to prove by GPS data that for the last 5 years they had been fishing overthere, apparently a british demand to get a license.

now who on earth can produce 5 years old GPS data to that effect ?

but again, big IF ... if that was the deal, and if that was communicated and if that was possible at all those fishermen are on the wrong side, but me thinks that IF it was like that they were being fucked over anyhow, as technically speaking this is nonsense.

all above is iffy, grin, just from a couple of articles on the matter, these days one never knowzs

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8 hours ago, Albatros said:

from what I have been reading the blockage was triggered by the fact that fishing licenses were late or not given because of fishermen not being able or late to prove by GPS data that for the last 5 years they had been fishing overthere, apparently a british demand to get a license.

 

The UK government knows exactly who was fishing in their waters. Have seen list with all boats fishing in UK waters from Defra.  So asking for a decade old (2012 to 2016) gps track is a bit off.
And otherwise the Brexit claim about fish was a lie ?

Belgian fisherman have received their licenses a few weeks ago.

But if the French fished on a transfer of quota deal with an UK fisherman, that right is gone.
So probably the UK is slow in licensing, but the French want to many boats there.

Funny to see the UK parliament just announced that they have to rely on EU numbers as their own government is unwilling to share information.
-----------------------------------

These EU documents are politically important because:

  • they relate to UK fishing opportunities during 2021 and beyond; and
  • they demonstrate an emerging gap in the level of public information provided by the European Commission on the one hand and the UK Government on the other.

More in section 4.17.
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm5801/cmselect/cmeuleg/229-xxxviii/22906.htm#_idTextAnchor009

 

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The French fishermen are claiming very few licences issued, whereas quite a lot actually have been issued. The GPS data proof was in the small print of the deal.

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It is all in the details, curious how the text really is worded.
Expect a lot of access allowed on evidence based electronic data.
And quite a lot is not really satisfying for the ones who thought they would have access.
But would not be surprised if French fisherman will exaggerate.

In the meantime, TAC approved by EU parliament, 1 May it will be official in place.
UK, from partner to a competitor.

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