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shes legit ... foil arm looks to be in the front end of the box ... opposite of all other teams ... what are we going to read into that?

ETNZ are probably favorites .....but win or lose....Team New Zealand have firmly established themselves as the all time great AC nation in the modern era.   From the time they first emerged, they have

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41 minutes ago, hoom said:

Longer low bow, maybe not as low, tapered sides aft like TNZ & LR & some form of belly/skeg.

I suspect this is going to look a lot like TNZ B2.

What’s that look like then? A bit like Ineos B2? 
 

I expect a lot of convergence when they are all out 

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3 hours ago, JALhazmat said:

What’s that look like then? A bit like Ineos B2? 

Somebody is paying attention lol.

Yeah I've been assuming TNZ will adapt a lowered bow, others will adapt TNZ/LR style stern & belly/skeg.

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https://twitter.com/Lloyd2Samantha/status/1295320027588177920/photo/1

here is the full size picture:

63230255_ukb2.thumb.jpg.08d2031010875d3d51054fe7682eb757.jpg

The front cradle looks to have a v-shaped cutout in the middle, the back cradle looks to have a sweeping, even curve.  

 

My guess is that is has a fine "keel" like fin similar to the modification they made to B1.  The hull look to be more rounded in the back and not as flat as B1.

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4 hours ago, The_Alchemist said:

https://twitter.com/Lloyd2Samantha/status/1295320027588177920/photo/1

here is the full size picture:

63230255_ukb2.thumb.jpg.08d2031010875d3d51054fe7682eb757.jpg

The front cradle looks to have a v-shaped cutout in the middle, the back cradle looks to have a sweeping, even curve.  

 

My guess is that is has a fine "keel" like fin similar to the modification they made to B1.  The hull look to be more rounded in the back and not as flat as B1.

Ah some logic being applied, now how fast is it ? 
 

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21 hours ago, Stingray~ said:

Any guesses about which Britannia will arrive in Auckland first? Rita 1 is apparently being shipped and Rita 2 being flown..

Somebody above suggested that by ship it takes 40 days and 40 nights? 

72 days from UK to NZ average shipping ATM. If you're going through Singapore then that can add a day or two depending on the backlog. 

So, end of Oct or first week Nov if it left today. 

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39 minutes ago, Carbon said:

I tried my hand at getting the two GBR boats the same size to compare shapes.  No doubt about it Rita 2 is a better shape than 1.  She looks more like Prada than the original Rita.

AC75_INEOS_Arrival_Edited.JPG

Wow sure brings me back, remember looking at the outline of Ineos1 and thinking how that couldn't possibly be what it looks like?

 

I know it's not, but I really want that big lump on the foredeck to be part of boat. Imagine, if you will, a world in which their B2 actually managed to be LESS aesthetically pleasing.  

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1 hour ago, Carbon said:

I tried my hand at getting the two GBR boats the same size to compare shapes.  No doubt about it Rita 2 is a better shape than 1.  She looks more like Prada than the original Rita.

AC75_INEOS_Arrival_Edited.JPG

Looking at them side by side it looks to me that pointy bit in front of the hump on the foredeck is for show.  And the hump on the foredeck is packing material covering the bow. And the way the sides of B1 angle forward to the bow is repeated on B2 but the bottom of B2 will be similar to the ENTZ and LR boats.  Which means it will be as odd looking as B1 is. 

WetHog  :ph34r:

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23 hours ago, Stingray~ said:

Cool shot!

If you squint after a good sip you can see the radical new horizontal trim-tab wing structure above the foredeck..


Mr Rum told me It’s called a Moustache mounting platform for small high-aspect-ratio canards add to that the Frackers have gone for a radical forward helm station.

679097D6-19B9-4F20-9BE2-726C78B24BD0.jpeg.a68730f28ed021fea9fd2482253db572.jpeg
 

 

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1 hour ago, Carbon said:

I tried my hand at getting the two GBR boats the same size to compare shapes.  No doubt about it Rita 2 is a better shape than 1.  She looks more like Prada than the original Rita.

AC75_INEOS_Arrival_Edited.JPG

Nice I failed to find my copy of this B1 pic.

 

Definitely longer low section forward.

Bow may be quite slender also?

This also shows how the chines have been lifted dramatically forward & aft of the foil box.

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25 minutes ago, Monkey said:

The crazy thing from at least the photo of B1, is that they did some of the worst camo work imaginable before wrapping the boat. They used to put effort into hiding the shapes. 

Like the quality job ALL the other teams did where it was totally impossible to get an idea of the shape...

 

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27 minutes ago, Monkey said:

The crazy thing from at least the photo of B1, is that they did some of the worst camo work imaginable before wrapping the boat. They used to put effort into hiding the shapes. 

I know! Totally my point that lots of us looked at the shape-which turned out to be the actual shape-and figured it was foam blocks and packing material. "Nah, can't actually look like that, right? Right?"

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7 minutes ago, JALhazmat said:

Like the quality job ALL the other teams did where it was totally impossible to get an idea of the shape...

 

In Cup’s past, it was never that easy. I think RMac nailed it.  The hull was so freakish looking we all assumed the weird shapes were foam. Nope. They just shrink wrapped the thing. 

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6 hours ago, WetHog said:

Looking at them side by side it looks to me that pointy bit in front of the hump on the foredeck is for show.  And the hump on the foredeck is packing material covering the bow. And the way the sides of B1 angle forward to the bow is repeated on B2 but the bottom of B2 will be similar to the ENTZ and LR boats.  Which means it will be as odd looking as B1 is. 

WetHog  :ph34r:

The hump is a fender locker, essential equipment when Ben is driving...

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On 8/19/2020 at 11:25 PM, NZK said:

If this is B2 then it seems we still have a lower foredeck and raised sides but with a taper towards the transom...

Can't see much detail on the hull to speculate about a bustle.

 

INEOS B2.jpeg

I can’t tell, is that B2 on top, or on the bottom?

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5 hours ago, OldWoodenShip said:

Refresh rates heavily upgraded to cope with dataflows, better customization and durability.

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14 hours ago, Carbon said:

I tried my hand at getting the two GBR boats the same size to compare shapes.  No doubt about it Rita 2 is a better shape than 1.  She looks more like Prada than the original Rita.

AC75_INEOS_Arrival_Edited.JPG

She looks similar to Te Aihe at the back end but still retains her low bow.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTzitXzCuIaUBz9jRhnl2g

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On 8/19/2020 at 11:00 PM, JALhazmat said:

Pretty spot on.
Oooh the mystery of what’s underneath though ;-) 

Putting my money on the Bow Lump being a Counter Weight to allow flatter crane pickups when no Rig weight or foils........

Wihout either of those items - all the winch and hydraulic equipment will make her stern heavy.

 

12 hours ago, Laurence said:

I wonder if anyone else will have the low bow.. I would love an explanation how the aero in that area  works. 

Think about it. Low profile frontal area is lower drag, and shaped to scoop air at the Rig. Smaller panel size allows overall lighter construction weight - just dont chase it too far - still need a I-Beam depth to maintain longitudinal axis stiffness.

I suggested months ago that B2's may be a mix up of Ineos Deck and Luna Rossa Hull underneath. Seems they are going LR/ETNZ rear rear deck aero. And is it too early to suggest that the Bustle/Skeg will truncate (stop) just forward of rear cradle? So expect lots of Nose down flyingWhilst trying to seal the whole rig/boat package to the water surface.

Whatever we will actually see; Ineos are pleased enough with the foredeck aero to have another crack with it. Just hope it is more ETNZ Bowed than Scowbowed. So will we see Ineos style foredeck treatments on other Team's B2's? That'll scare the aesthetes......

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On 8/15/2020 at 5:14 PM, buckdouger said:

What foil section is he holding though? The scale and structure and asymmetry rule out a few things. AC33 boards? Non sailing?

It looks to be a laminar flow section about the right size for a sailplane.

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3 hours ago, Lickindip said:

image.png.21a882d07cf83a2d450a7753d38ef897.png

shes legit ... foil arm looks to be in the front end of the box ... opposite of all other teams ... what are we going to read into that?

Foil in fwd position, Obvious she's scared to go down the mine

When will they take the white tarp off the top and show the deck shape?

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Just now, gungabow said:

Foil in fwd position, Obvious she's scared to go down the mine

When will they take the white tarp off the top and show the deck shape?

ahh they had me fooled, I thought it was a new head/mainsail combination.

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4 hours ago, Lickindip said:

image.png.21a882d07cf83a2d450a7753d38ef897.png

shes legit ... foil arm looks to be in the front end of the box ... opposite of all other teams ... what are we going to read into that?

All True. Check out the forward placed Helm station - very innovative.

And not only that, but she seems to be taking cues provided by Airbus and her Seppo Cousins on Aero treatments. 

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5 hours ago, Lickindip said:

image.png.21a882d07cf83a2d450a7753d38ef897.png

shes legit ... foil arm looks to be in the front end of the box ... opposite of all other teams ... what are we going to read into that?

 

Obviously a very stable platform, therefore according to some, must be super fast!

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34 minutes ago, The_Alchemist said:

Obviously designed to use ground effect.

But beware. Ground effect can have disastrous, unintended consequences with these craft.

images-1.jpeg

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1 minute ago, Sailbydate said:

But beware. Ground effect can have disastrous, unintended consequences with these craft.

images-1.jpeg

2nd capsize of an AC75 ... looks like the foil arm fell off, poor 1 design components, been saying this every day these things will never get harbormaster to sign off to race. lucky INEOS has extra flotation in this design else they would have killed half of auckland

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17 hours ago, Lickindip said:

image.png.21a882d07cf83a2d450a7753d38ef897.png

shes legit ... foil arm looks to be in the front end of the box ... opposite of all other teams ... what are we going to read into that?

It's nice how they've rounded the front and back ends to reduce Aerodynamic coefficient of the boat... 

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6 hours ago, Lickindip said:

2nd capsize of an AC75 ... looks like the foil arm fell off, poor 1 design components, been saying this every day these things will never get harbormaster to sign off to race. lucky INEOS has extra flotation in this design else they would have killed half of auckland

They should have kept the outriggers they used on the test boat.

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I think it's got a taller / finer bow like Luna Rossa and New Zealand and moved away from the blunter scow type design. I also think it's being delivered with bowsprit installed this time rather than a deliberate attempt to disguise the bow shape. 

I don't think it has a bustle on (yet). Either because the hull mould was made before they had decided or because they always thought it would be easy to 'glue on' later. 

I'd say it will keep the flares that come up to create the high sides at midships but then taper away to stern. 

 

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2 hours ago, Mozzy Sails said:

I think it's got a taller / finer bow like Luna Rossa and New Zealand and moved away from the blunter scow type design. I also think it's being delivered with bowsprit installed this time rather than a deliberate attempt to disguise the bow shape. 

I don't think it has a bustle on (yet). Either because the hull mould was made before they had decided or because they always thought it would be easy to 'glue on' later. 

I'd say it will keep the flares that come up to create the high sides at midships but then taper away to stern. 

 

Having a long fin would help considerably off foils. An AC75 would be a pig to turn in those conditions at the lower end of the wind limit, especially trying to get the apparent going.  Hard rails would help as well.

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2 hours ago, chesirecat said:

Having a long fin would help considerably off foils. An AC75 would be a pig to turn in those conditions at the lower end of the wind limit, especially trying to get the apparent going.  Hard rails would help as well.

Isn’t that one of the reason U.K. added it to B1, to help turn if it touches the water during maneuvers?

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6 hours ago, The_Alchemist said:

Isn’t that one of the reason U.K. added it to B1, to help turn if it touches the water during maneuvers?

They learnt quite a bit in Sardina when hit with a double header gust

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  • 2 weeks later...

Shirley has a new podcast up interviewing Grant Simmer. It's a good interview, with some interesting insights into all the campaigns he's been involved with. With regards to this cycle he hints they've been done some blind alleys - he might be referring to the interesting shape of Britannia. Says he happy with B2 and where they are now.

http://shirleyrobertson.com/podcast/ 

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Simmer's thoughts on Bermuda were interesting as well. They knew they were in trouble before ETNZ left NZ. They'd already identified that the Kiwis had a better control system. The lower windage of the bikes, and the more aggressive boards and rudders.

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21 minutes ago, Horn Rock said:

Shirley has a new podcast up interviewing Grant Simmer. It's a good interview, with some interesting insights into all the campaigns he's been involved with. With regards to this cycle he hints they've been done some blind alleys - he might be referring to the interesting shape of Britannia. Says he happy with B2 and where they are now.

http://shirleyrobertson.com/podcast/ 

I think the blind alley refers to the hull shape, no bustle/skeg,  rather than the frontal treatment of the bow as that has been retained as has a reduced version of the high sides plus appendage underneath 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, JALhazmat said:

I think the blind alley refers to the hull shape, no bustle/skeg,

I agree. He does say ETNZ/LR had quite a head start on the design due to formulating the rule, thus their boats being quite similar and different to the other two.

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There was some oblique references with B2 being described as "racier" than B1, and much different. Grant also said that he had to make some difficult changes - maybe referring to some of the disquiet rumored to have occurred within the team.

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