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shes legit ... foil arm looks to be in the front end of the box ... opposite of all other teams ... what are we going to read into that?

ETNZ are probably favorites .....but win or lose....Team New Zealand have firmly established themselves as the all time great AC nation in the modern era.   From the time they first emerged, they have

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10 minutes ago, Grrr... said:

When did the ineos foils get that reverse-rake treatment on their trailing edge? 

image.png.29557b605a86088cbb2d92c793fe298e.png

Almost looks like they put the thing on backwards.

Optical illusion, discussed before 

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2 hours ago, terrafirma said:

But knowing it was only a matter of time before you got it back must of been comforting.! Now knowing you are almost unbeatable must also be good.!

Ummm, you reckon?

I was worried they would fold after San Francisco. Public sentiment towards them was pretty fucking dark here.

And you will pardon me if I reserve the enumeration of my poultry until after the cup.

Are ETNZ hot favourites? Sure, but one capsize like American Magic....

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8 hours ago, dullers said:

I think he would have foiled in the Cook straits west to east. Not only because the winds are ideal but he would have enjoyed the coincidence of it having the same name as him. 

And relying on his charts!

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36 minutes ago, jaysper said:

Ummm, you reckon?

I was worried they would fold after San Francisco. Public sentiment towards them was pretty fucking dark here.

And you will pardon me if I reserve the enumeration of my poultry until after the cup.

Are ETNZ hot favourites? Sure, but one capsize like American Magic....

Tough to be hard on them after SFO. Lots of dark stuff happened there but nobody could fault the effort and pride in the jersey. 
 

And sure, anything can happen so let’s hope every team gets a good crack at competing and we don’t have another American Magic moment. 

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13 minutes ago, chesirecat said:

And relying on his charts!

Most probably the worlds only up to date charts....

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20 minutes ago, chesirecat said:

None too shabby lee bow tack coming out good height with nice speed. Always good seeing improvements in this area.

 

I know it is hard to do because the camera stuffs up perspective but  in the first 30 seconds or so INEOS is going a lot faster than the war canoe. I might be wrong as we dont have the virtual eye going.

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32 minutes ago, chesirecat said:

None too shabby lee bow tack coming out good height with nice speed. Always good seeing improvements in this area.

 

Prada chase boat shadowing the INEOS support boat 

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1 hour ago, Paddywackery said:

Tough to be hard on them after SFO. Lots of dark stuff happened there but nobody could fault the effort and pride in the jersey. 
 

And sure, anything can happen so let’s hope every team gets a good crack at competing and we don’t have another American Magic moment. 

I agree. It seemed unreasonable to me also, but that's how it went down here.

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Long story, I was there for the entirety of the final and it was unspeakably cruel. It’s never easy taking on the Americans in their own back yard but this had many unsavoury aspects. No need to replay the saga but one thing that left an indelible mark on me ..... to this day ..... was the incredible courage and spirit of ETNZ. The pride they showed in their country was admirable. 
 

Yes, they lost but they fought with distinction and nobody could question their spirit. And I think if those at home who found fault had been there, they would feel ashamed for finding fault. 

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45 minutes ago, dullers said:

I know it is hard to do because the camera stuffs up perspective but  in the first 30 seconds or so INEOS is going a lot faster than the war canoe. I might be wrong as we dont have the virtual eye going.

Ineos is favourite ! no doubt.  We fans are shaking in our boats!

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Weather looks amazing on the pictures from Auckland. What change in weather will we see as we progress towards the final in March? I’m just wondering what you locals think. 

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Paddy have you heard of Climate Change?  We might be only a little affected by covid but our climate is changing rapidly.  One degree each year.

So weather, looking much drier, more windy? more monsoonal (more like Queensland's weather?) might get a cyclone in March?

But who knows? 

 

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10 minutes ago, Kiwing said:

Paddy have you heard of Climate Change?  We might be only a little affected by covid but our climate is changing rapidly.  One degree each year.

So weather, looking much drier, more windy? more monsoonal (more like Queensland's weather?) might get a cyclone in March?

But who knows? 

 

Yeah, we have that here, snow from Russia next week. I thought the winds might be lighter so that confirms I know little. 

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2 hours ago, jaysper said:

Ummm, you reckon?

I was worried they would fold after San Francisco. Public sentiment towards them was pretty fucking dark here.

And you will pardon me if I reserve the enumeration of my poultry until after the cup.

Are ETNZ hot favourites? Sure, but one capsize like American Magic....

ETNZ are probably favorites .....but win or lose....Team New Zealand have firmly established themselves as the all time great AC nation in the modern era.   From the time they first emerged, they have always been contenders. 

Eventually there will be a challenger that succeeds. The sheer weight of probability and resources says it must be so but the story of your small island nation taking on and beating some of the wealthiest nations in the planet will always be part of my life. Then if you look at the teams that were basically based on NZ talent, it is even more of an incredible story.

I will likely be rooting for Ineos, but honestly any of the three remaining teams truly have my heart.

ETNZ for the incredible story in my lifetime

Luna Rossa for the length of their involvement ...and itwould be so nice for EB to win it once while he is still alive

Ineos.....returning to the Isle of Wight after a century and a half.....how special would that be?

 

Hard to pick a team that I want to lose.  I dont want any of them to lose.

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But I would like to see some incredibly heart breaking close racing.

Imagine if Prada Cup came down to the last race and then AC final came down to the last race. Sadly, very unlikely.

 I think Ineos is close to having the talent to win Prada Cup. It will all depend if they have the same boat speed as LR.

I think that NZ currently has the package of boat speed and talent. If Ineos have really caught up since December then we would really have a cup to remember. But despite results of round robin, I fear that Ineos were so far behind in December, it is hard for me to believe they have caught up...........

When Ineos are finished I hope they explain what they did.

 

 

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1 hour ago, EYESAILOR said:

But I would like to see some incredibly heart breaking close racing.

Imagine if Prada Cup came down to the last race and then AC final came down to the last race. Sadly, very unlikely.

 I think Ineos is close to having the talent to win Prada Cup. It will all depend if they have the same boat speed as LR.

I think that NZ currently has the package of boat speed and talent. If Ineos have really caught up since December then we would really have a cup to remember. But despite results of round robin, I fear that Ineos were so far behind in December, it is hard for me to believe they have caught up...........

When Ineos are finished I hope they explain what they did.

 

 

The rate of development is crazy, don't forget that American magic beat ETNZ. If Ineos Raced against the boat ETNZ had in December it would be a thrashing. 

The problem is we don't know what gains ETNZ have made or what they kept secret.

I would put my money on Ineos over Luna Rossa, which way it goes between ETNZ  and Ineos is anyone call, we will be very lucky if we get any more close racing...

 

 

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3 hours ago, Kiwing said:

Paddy have you heard of Climate Change?  We might be only a little affected by covid but our climate is changing rapidly.  One degree each year.

So weather, looking much drier, more windy? more monsoonal (more like Queensland's weather?) might get a cyclone in March?

But who knows? 

 

I looked up the average temperature for Auckland in Feb and it is 24 degrees.  So someone who is born this year can expect a sunny Auckland day  to be about 54 degrees when they are aged 30? That will affect the racing on the harbour for sure. Some sort of sun shade will be needed.

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We stopped Covid in it's tracks and the world will control the climate change eventually, I hope.  So when I am 100 I hope the climate will only 5 degrees hotter here where I live.  I will probably move south before then.

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6 minutes ago, Kiwing said:

We stopped Covid in it's tracks and the world will control the climate change eventually, I hope.  So when I am 100 I hope the climate will only 5 degrees hotter here where I live.  I will probably move south before then.

Steady, we stopped it too. Lowest cases in Europe by October, and as a reward for good community behaviour, and in an act of humanity, we loosened the lock down for 3 weeks at Christmas and it bit us in the arse. The newer strain, visiting friends and family, an open border and 3 weeks later we became the worst in Europe. 
 

Much to admire in how you handled it and well done, it gives the rest of us much needed hope but careful as you go. 
 

Don’t know where you can move to and avoid climate change. 

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13 minutes ago, Kiwing said:

We stopped Covid in it's tracks and the world will control the climate change eventually, I hope.  So when I am 100 I hope the climate will only 5 degrees hotter here where I live.  I will probably move south before then.

We didn't stop Covid, we hid from it. Covid will be with us for a very long time, managing it will be the most important thing.

Climate hysteria has been with us since the 60's, with wild proclamation of impending doom, mini ice ages, warming, sea rises (an inconvenient truth - Los Angeles isn't under water yet) etc. All fail to materialise as predicted by flawed models. Anyone who trots out the "science us settled" line can fuck off, as they don't understand how science works. Banning BBQs in NZ won't save the planet.

 

 

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@Nutta I didn't see you as a denier? I guess you will continue until one day the Dutch dike builders working feverishly on the east coast of USA will come on to your horizon and they will start building the second story dikes.  I guess all the glaciers are disappearing into the air?

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6 hours ago, jaysper said:

Ummm, you reckon?

I was worried they would fold after San Francisco. Public sentiment towards them was pretty fucking dark here.

And you will pardon me if I reserve the enumeration of my poultry until after the cup.

Are ETNZ hot favourites? Sure, but one capsize like American Magic....

To comeback and win after San Fran was truly a feat of determination and a will to win. And based on form the only time NZ have lost is when half the team defected to Alinghi. NZ have capsized a few times but unless catastrophic I can't see this stopping them. And so to pick NZ to retain the cup is as much about their team as it is the competition. To beat them will take some form of design miracle that the home team will have overlooked. What's the chances of that happening? Who would have thought the bikes in Bermuda? It was laughed at initially too. NZ have always worked well with foils and I see their overall package ahead of both of the challengers. Boat speed will win.

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2 hours ago, Laurence said:

The rate of development is crazy, don't forget that American magic beat ETNZ. If Ineos Raced against the boat ETNZ had in December it would be a thrashing. 

The problem is we don't know what gains ETNZ have made or what they kept secret.

I would put my money on Ineos over Luna Rossa, which way it goes between ETNZ  and Ineos is anyone call, we will be very lucky if we get any more close racing...

 

 

I'm tipping no more close racing after the Prada Cup final. I'm also tipping NZ will be beating their challenger by at least 1 minute come the Cup. 

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19 minutes ago, terrafirma said:

I'm tipping no more close racing after the Prada Cup final. I'm also tipping NZ will be beating their challenger by at least 1 minute come the Cup. 

You are a bigger fan boy than us fanboys.  Complacency is the enemy of all leaders, let's hope...

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1 hour ago, Kiwing said:

@Nutta I didn't see you as a denier? I guess you will continue until one day the Dutch dike builders working feverishly on the east coast of USA will come on to your horizon and they will start building the second story dikes.  I guess all the glaciers are disappearing into the air?

Climate changes, no one's denying that. Scientific models don't match the change observed though, and haven't for decades.The alarmist predictions have never eventuated.

Labelling people as a "denier" is straight from the Cult of Climate Change playbook, by the way...  much easier to play the man, not the ball. Because despite claims that science is settled, it's not...

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8 minutes ago, Nutta said:

Climate changes, no one's denying that. Scientific models don't match the change observed though, and haven't for decades.The alarmist predictions have never eventuated.

Labelling people as a "denier" is straight from the Cult of Climate Change playbook, by the way...  much easier to play the man, not the ball. Because despite claims that science is settled, it's not...

Straight up there. We only need enough fuel and oxygen for our lifetimes. Showing any regard for future generations is stupid and an invention of idiots. Corporations have led by this example and we should follow it. We should only be interested in our own lives and fuck everybody over to make our lives better, capitalism's foundation is laid upon this. 

If you think this is crazy thinking, take a look around you. See that man in his 2mil boat, did he not make profit from another's labour and screw people for an unreasonable profit for his toys? 

Very few businesses are fair and reasonable when they can be market driven and grab what they can rather than what they need.

Kill or be killed. 

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1 hour ago, Kiwing said:

You are a bigger fan boy than us fanboys.  Complacency is the enemy of all leaders, let's hope...

I don’t think there is a gram of complacency in the ETNZ team.   

 

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54 minutes ago, mako23 said:

If there back, they sure look different, a lot less wetted surface. When was this photo taken ?

20 hours ago according to the link. Looks like " Stretchy" doing chores.

So a question for the systems department here. Would they need a complete separate system (mechanical/electrical for each foil design,  re-flight  control as there is a strict upper weight limit to take into account?

https://www.instagram.com/p/CK54Djnrk2V/

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4 hours ago, Kiwing said:

@Nutta I didn't see you as a denier? I guess you will continue until one day the Dutch dike builders working feverishly on the east coast of USA will come on to your horizon and they will start building the second story dikes.  I guess all the glaciers are disappearing into the air?

I thought it was weird when my ice cubes started to simply "disappear" over time in the freezer.

Wait until those that don't believe in climate change discover a new word... sublimation!

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2 hours ago, NeedAClew said:

Uh, some alarmist predictions look on track. Looked at corals lately?

"Always look on the bright side of life... da-dum..."

If the sea level rises far enough, Brian and us Aussies could host an AC in Lake Eyre.

Assuming we got back in the game and won a series of course.

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3 hours ago, NZL3481 said:

Are ze German foils back?

Surprised if these are back on. one week to trial, confirm or reject and revert. Did they run the two different foils?

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39 minutes ago, Chris UK said:

Surprised if these are back on. one week to trial, confirm or reject and revert. Did they run the two different foils?

Given how well the other foils have been going, there is either something in it and they think these will be better or it’s to fuck with Prada introducing an unknown into the equation.

or more likely it’s an out of context photo  put on Instagram long after it was actually taken

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Priscilla, these film of Fred from the 60s/70s are something else and there are plenty of them. The one I am always amazed by has Fred showing you the whole process, from ladders on the floor to a completed platform......all done with metal pegs/wedges, and short lengths of rope. The level of skill and trust in his work is breathtaking. There's a section in another video where he draws free hard how the platform is constructed and his sketch is very good...........

 

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17 hours ago, Paddywackery said:

I’m not convinced that more operators delivers better stability. Then again, I know jackshit about the technicalities involved. 

So far they have been about the most stable of boats. It might have to do with more controllers or it might just be a relatively stable design.

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8 hours ago, Salty Seacock said:

Straight up there. We only need enough fuel and oxygen for our lifetimes. Showing any regard for future generations is stupid and an invention of idiots. Corporations have led by this example and we should follow it. We should only be interested in our own lives and fuck everybody over to make our lives better, capitalism's foundation is laid upon this. 

If you think this is crazy thinking, take a look around you. See that man in his 2mil boat, did he not make profit from another's labour and screw people for an unreasonable profit for his toys? 

Very few businesses are fair and reasonable when they can be market driven and grab what they can rather than what they need.

Kill or be killed. 

Businesses simply do what their clients demand of them. If they raised wages and therefore raised prices their sales would drop because you and I simply buy the least expensive option most of the time. If consumers gave any weight to more environmentally responsible practices WITH THEIR MONEY, companies would swiftly respond. 

I believe governments are the same. We elect governments and reward the biggest liars with our votes for the most part.

I am not casting stones at you Salty, merely observing that the people around you can drive the bus in a better direction with their decisions and that is who we should be informing and criticizing. 

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10 hours ago, Kiwing said:

We stopped Covid in it's tracks and the world will control the climate change eventually, I hope.  So when I am 100 I hope the climate will only 5 degrees hotter here where I live.  I will probably move south before then.

You dont stop viruses, you have delayed it that is all. It is an endemic. I hope you have the vaccine soon which will mean it will be easier to control.

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Just now, jaysper said:

Fuck that 

100%agreed. Once Fred died you've got to think that the cost of maintenance went through the roof and condemned those chimneys.  

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8 hours ago, Nutta said:

Climate changes, no one's denying that. Scientific models don't match the change observed though, and haven't for decades.The alarmist predictions have never eventuated.

Labelling people as a "denier" is straight from the Cult of Climate Change playbook, by the way...  much easier to play the man, not the ball. Because despite claims that science is settled, it's not...

The term "denier " is used to try and group you in with the holocaust deniers, vaccine  deniers and flat earth  believers. It is a lazy form of argument to hide the fact that the evidence is as you said is still up for grabs. As you have said the models have not matched the hysteria. Kiwiwing also claimed a 1 degree temperature rise per year in New Zealand. If you are born today you will be in really big trouble by the time you are 50.

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Above I have posted a video of INEOS sailing,,,,,,flying! past LR and no one comments, no one cares!!!!!! We have spent the past week asking, "who will be faster" er....etc. And above we ave our first evidence in 1 week......(i need to go lie down).

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1 minute ago, JALhazmat said:

Parallax, LR clearly faster 

So in the absence of a seagull wielding a yellow marker pen we have to give LR the benefit of the doubt? I guess chase boats have domesticated gulls/pens.

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I wouldn’t give Prada a bloody thing personally. 
Prada only came back when the foil was dropped on INEOS for  the tack it seemed 

I so want that to be legit pace, the final  to be a 7-0 shit kicking, 

competitive series be damned. 

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3 minutes ago, JALhazmat said:

I wouldn’t give Prada a bloody thing personally. 
Prada only came back when the foil was dropped on INEOS for  the tack it seemed 

I so want that to be legit pace, the final  to be a 7-0 shit kicking, 

competitive series be damned. 

I have got out my special "LR calculator".........and from eye it looks like INEOS have found............20%!!!!!!

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32 minutes ago, JALhazmat said:

Parallax, LR clearly faster ;-)

Thanks be fair, there is enough parallax there that I don't think we can make any assessment of who is fastest. The telephoto lense distorts our perception of distance so it's hard to tell.

 

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1 minute ago, kiwin said:

Uh... smallpox?

I agree you are totally correct. (I would add it is unique.)Now how about you answer my questions with a straight bat?

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1 hour ago, Chris UK said:

Above I have posted a video of INEOS sailing,,,,,,flying! past LR and no one comments, no one cares!!!!!! We have spent the past week asking, "who will be faster" er....etc. And above we ave our first evidence in 1 week......(i need to go lie down).

I agree. At the 21 second mark it is not parallax.

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2 minutes ago, dullers said:

Now how about you answer my questions with a straight bat?

No. Because you are a cunt.

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1 hour ago, enigmatically2 said:

Annoyingly the video stopped before we could tell which foils GB had on. I'm intrigued as to whether they are testing Ws again.

From other recent videos it is clear that they have not reverted. Still flying with the stealth bombers.

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2 hours ago, Chris UK said:

Above I have posted a video of INEOS sailing,,,,,,flying! past LR and no one comments, no one cares!!!!!! We have spent the past week asking, "who will be faster" er....etc. And above we ave our first evidence in 1 week......(i need to go lie down).

We won't have a fucking clue who is faster until the weekend.

Recent history has proven that anything that happens before the race is irrelevant.

As the old saying goes: "when the flag drops the bullshit stops."

I for one suspect that LR will have the faster boat but will lose due to inferior tactics.

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4 minutes ago, jaysper said:

We won't have a fucking clue who is faster until the weekend.

Recent history has proven that anything that happens before the race is irrelevant.

As the old saying goes: "when the flag drops the bullshit stops."

I for one suspect that LR will have the faster boat but will lose due to inferior tactics.

Certainly the speed difference in that video is wishful thinking. I expect them to be within a very small amount of each other,  with one quicker upwind, the other downwind, one better in light, one heavy etc...Hopefully we'll have a spread of conditions.  

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1 minute ago, Chris UK said:

Certainly the speed difference in that video is wishful thinking. I expect them to be within a very small amount of each other,  with one quicker upwind, the other downwind, one better in light, one heavy etc...Hopefully we'll have a spread of conditions.  

I don't really care who wins as long as we don't see another awful incident like Patriot.

That was fucking crap.

I hope like hell ETNZ wins this thing, but wouldn't want that to be the way they win it.

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4 hours ago, dullers said:

hide the fact that the evidence is as you said is still up for grabs. As you have said the models have not matched the hysteria

Which bit of the evidence isn't compelling enough for you. It seems that were are experiencing exactly the sort of climate change that's been predicted for a long time - increased wild fires, hurricanes, melting polar ice, thawing of permafrost, acidification of the oceans. Or is it the measurement of atmospheric CO2 that you think is corrupt and the data is false? Or that you don't believe CO2 is that cause of global warming despite it being based upon a pretty straightforward physics and the correlation between rapid global temperature rise and atmospheric CO2. To claim the models are wrong is disingenuous. The overwhelming majority of climate scientists are in agreement, but you can choose to put your head in the sand if you sleep better at night. As with all climate change deniers, I help but feel if you were presented with irrefutable evidence of man made climate change you'd still shrug your shoulders, and say 'Ah fuck it. Let it burn and let's see where we get to' rather than actually trying to do something about it...

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4 minutes ago, Living_in_a_box said:

Which bit of the evidence isn't compelling enough for you. It seems that were are experiencing exactly the sort of climate change that's been predicted for a long time - increased wild fires, hurricanes, melting polar ice, thawing of permafrost, acidification of the oceans. Or is it the measurement of atmospheric CO2 that you think is corrupt and the data is false? Or that you don't believe CO2 is that cause of global warming despite it being based upon a pretty straightforward physics and the correlation between rapid global temperature rise and atmospheric CO2. To claim the models are wrong is disingenuous. The overwhelming majority of climate scientists are in agreement, but you can choose to put your head in the sand if you sleep better at night. As with all climate change deniers, I help but feel if you were presented with irrefutable evidence of man made climate change you'd still shrug your shoulders, and say 'Ah fuck it. Let it burn and let's see where we get to' rather than actually trying to do something about it...

I have never denied climate change. The hysteria and the hype dont meet with real life.  So piss off  with your self righteous take on this and read the posts properly. For your edification.  https://cei.org/blog/wrong-again-50-years-of-failed-eco-pocalyptic-predictions/

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In other news. Do you think INEOS has changed the shape of her skeg...keel thingy. It looks a bit flatter to me?

Screenshot (1855).png

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2 hours ago, jaysper said:

I don't really care who wins as long as we don't see another awful incident like Patriot.

That was fucking crap.

I hope like hell ETNZ wins this thing, but wouldn't want that to be the way they win it.

We all hope our teams win in good competitive racing.

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8 minutes ago, dullers said:

In other news. Do you think INEOS has changed the shape of her skeg...keel thingy. It looks a bit flatter to me?

Screenshot (1855).png

I don't think so. It always had that flat spot.

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3 hours ago, jaysper said:

I don't really care who wins as long as we don't see another awful incident like Patriot.

That was fucking crap.

I hope like hell ETNZ wins this thing, but wouldn't want that to be the way they win it.

Or lose it...

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8 hours ago, dullers said:

You dont stop viruses, you have delayed it that is all. It is an endemic. I hope you have the vaccine soon which will mean it will be easier to control.

If my house is on fire, and I put it out, then I stopped it, even if yours is still burning... there's over 111k people who used to live in yours that would have appreciated that delay you imply is so trivial....

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4 hours ago, dullers said:

I have never denied climate change. The hysteria and the hype dont meet with real life.  So piss off  with your self righteous take on this and read the posts properly. For your edification.  https://cei.org/blog/wrong-again-50-years-of-failed-eco-pocalyptic-predictions/

You cite CEI, the Competitive Enterprise Institute, which is a Washington lobbying group financed by the fossil fuel industry and other big business interests. Their purpose is to discredit climate change science and to oppose any government action on climate change and environmental protection. I'm not sure I would look to them for advice on climate change. They have also acted for the tobacco industry. Do you remember when the tobacco industry spent a lot of money and effort discrediting physicians and the WHO, and trying to persuade us that there was no link between smoking and lung cancer?

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6 hours ago, jaysper said:

We won't have a fucking clue who is faster until the weekend.

Recent history has proven that anything that happens before the race is irrelevant.

As the old saying goes: "when the flag drops the bullshit stops."

I for one suspect that LR will have the faster boat but will lose due to inferior tactics.

Yes I would back Giles in an even race.

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6 minutes ago, marlowe said:

You cite CEI, the Competitive Enterprise Institute, which is a Washington lobbying group financed by the fossil fuel industry and other big business interests. Their purpose is to discredit climate change science and to oppose any government action on climate change and environmental protection. I'm not sure I would look to them for advice on climate change. They have also acted for the tobacco industry. Do you remember when the tobacco industry spent a lot of money and effort discrediting physicians and the WHO, and trying to persuade us that there was no link between smoking and lung cancer?

No i just went to a site that showed newspaper articles and the media hysteria that has been going on for 40 years. Yet again i made no points about climate change and my views on it. 

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