Guvacine 23 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 For my long term retirement plans. What is the sweetest sailing old plastic for a windy place like The Bay? I don't mean fast or any of the usual yardsticks, but what boats give you that difficult-to-describe feeling of being a sweet and pleasurable sailor on all points. For my use it will be an oldish plastic boat 27 to 37 feet long, but I am curious about any "sweet sailing" design that I have been missing. It is important that it is "sweet" on all points - there are many boats that can point or run well, but not so many that do it all. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
carcrash 395 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Soling 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bruno 119 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 With reefed sails and a double bottom with a bilge pump and maybe more lead, ok, Solings aren't bad for singlehanding around the Bay if you never put a kite up but I would raise the boom and want a big window in the jib. The thin polyester layup tends to go soft so maintenance costs go up. Ntm wet. What about a Sonar? Or any fractional old Kirby? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sledracr 660 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 an 80s Ericson (especially 32-III, 34-II, 35-III) would be my choice. Well, technically, "is" my choice. I love my 32-III. Perfect combination of good sailing and comfort, and very well built. For the $, I don't think there's better. $.02 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Grande Mastere Dreade 2,292 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 why not get a moore 24... 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SloopJonB 8,583 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Any old Cal or non-IOR Ranger. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hitchhiker 907 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 What is the definition of “oldish?” For me, my “retirement” boat will be an Alerion Express 28. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Al Paca 366 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 A self tacking headsail should be in everyone’s retirement plan. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
steele 107 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 A Tartan 30 is worth a look. No bad habits, solid build and the tiller makes for good short handing. The usual 130 jib would be too much for the bay but you probably could not go small enough to self tack. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steam Flyer 5,286 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 7 hours ago, SloopJonB said: Any old Cal or non-IOR Ranger. Ranger 26 or 29. Great sailing, good looking, relatively well built, well rounded characteristics. I'm not as big a fan of the Cals but there's not much wrong with them either. I sailed the hell out of a Cal 34 back in the day FB- Doug 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mr Moab 86 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 Sweet sailing, hard to beat an Express 27 or Moore 24. With low freeboard they may be wetter than you like. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PaulinVictoria 99 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 C&C30 Mk1, good manners and very stiff. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
notallthere 39 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 Cal 29. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
alphafb552 516 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 A bit smallish perhaps, but a Folkboat fits your description to the letter. Add a good active fleet on the bay, and you have all you need for a lot of fun http://www.sfbayfolkboats.org/ https://www.sail-world.com/news/222940/Folkboat-International-Cup-in-San-Francisco 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guvacine 23 Posted January 5, 2020 Author Share Posted January 5, 2020 Thanks for all of the great suggestions. I'm not geriatric yet, so sweet sailing does not have to mean easy sailing, but they often go together, right. I have been a Folkboat fan for a long time, but might want to do some long distance offshore work too, so is not so well suited for that. The Ericson 32, Rangers and Cals (I've always thought the 29 was a sweet looking boat) give me lots to think about. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sledracr 660 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 52 minutes ago, Guvacine said: ... want to do some long distance offshore work too....Ericson 32... Previous owner sailed Ericson-32 to Kauai and return. Still says it was the best all-around boat he's ever owned. I might be biased, but I agree. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
notallthere 39 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Guvacine said: Thanks for all of the great suggestions. I'm not geriatric yet, so sweet sailing does not have to mean easy sailing, but they often go together, right. I have been a Folkboat fan for a long time, but might want to do some long distance offshore work too, so is not so well suited for that. The Ericson 32, Rangers and Cals (I've always thought the 29 was a sweet looking boat) give me lots to think about. We have a cal 34 and even though based in light air, mostly use a 108% jib for easy handling. When friends are motoring, we find she will sail just fine. Trick with the cals in particular is to not load them up with shit. They start squatting in the transom. I like the rangers, Ericsson, and some of the islanders, but the cals really tick all our boxes Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SloopJonB 8,583 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Guvacine said: Thanks for all of the great suggestions. I'm not geriatric yet, so sweet sailing does not have to mean easy sailing, but they often go together, right. I have been a Folkboat fan for a long time, but might want to do some long distance offshore work too, so is not so well suited for that. The Ericson 32, Rangers and Cals (I've always thought the 29 was a sweet looking boat) give me lots to think about. If you like the 29 you should look at the 34 - essentially the same boat but bigger and more comfortable. Looks the same, layout is the same, basic hull design is the same - just bigger. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hitchhiker 907 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 1 hour ago, notallthere said: We have a cal 34 and even though based in light air, mostly use a 108% jib for easy handling. When friends are motoring, we find she will sail just fine. Trick with the cals in particular is to not load them up with shit. They start squatting in the transom. I like the rangers, Ericsson, and some of the islanders, but the cals really tick all our boxes You got so lucky with that purchase! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
axolotl 142 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 An Islander 36 should be on the the list, a 50 year old design but well balanced and should be quality boats at a good price point availability. They're slow (PHRF 144), but have generous interiors and were solid FG (glass over plywood decks) so don't break up with time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
notallthere 39 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 4 hours ago, Hitchhiker said: You got so lucky with that purchase! I was patient and waited for one that someone had already spent cash on the expensive shit. Honestly figured it to be a few years boat for us and then move up. We are still smitten with her! Really fits our needs well in a tidy package. Hell, we lived aboard (wife, me, 2 kids, and a dog) for 9 weeks this year while in between houses! She is headed to the yard later this month for a full paint job. Figure she deserves it for her 50th birthday this year... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steam Flyer 5,286 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 9 hours ago, SloopJonB said: 10 hours ago, Guvacine said: Thanks for all of the great suggestions. I'm not geriatric yet, so sweet sailing does not have to mean easy sailing, but they often go together, right. I have been a Folkboat fan for a long time, but might want to do some long distance offshore work too, so is not so well suited for that. The Ericson 32, Rangers and Cals (I've always thought the 29 was a sweet looking boat) give me lots to think about. If you like the 29 you should look at the 34 - essentially the same boat but bigger and more comfortable. Looks the same, layout is the same, basic hull design is the same - just bigger. If it's not an issue with dock/slip space, I'd say the same for the Ranger 29 vs Ranger 33. The 33 is -just- enough bigger that it feels quite comfy inside and solid sailing. And no more work to handle or keep up. I had a good friend with a Cal 34 that we sailed hard, all over. It was a really well mannered boat. I just think the Rangers are a little better looking! FB- Doug Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Unkle Krusty 81 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 Viking 33. Thomas 10.5 if you want to go wider. Agree with the Ericson suggestions and the C&C30 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
44forty 166 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 Farr 1106 if there are any in US ? Good downstairs and goes like stink uphill for an 80s plastic and doesn’t have random weird windows of various shapes and sizes common in old plastics Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Schakel 128 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 Swede 55 from Knut Reimers is still a head turner. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ROADKILL666 340 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 J35 or J37 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guvacine 23 Posted January 6, 2020 Author Share Posted January 6, 2020 22 hours ago, SloopJonB said: If you like the 29 you should look at the 34 - essentially the same boat but bigger and more comfortable. Looks the same, layout is the same, basic hull design is the same - just bigger. Are you referring to the 34 MK 1 (and 2)? It looks like the Mk 3 was a redesign. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guvacine 23 Posted January 6, 2020 Author Share Posted January 6, 2020 23 hours ago, sledracr said: Previous owner sailed Ericson-32 to Kauai and return. Still says it was the best all-around boat he's ever owned. I might be biased, but I agree. I loved this video when it came out! I assumed it was a bigger boat. Indeed looks like a pretty sweet sailor. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
notallthere 39 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 1 hour ago, Guvacine said: Are you referring to the 34 MK 1 (and 2)? It looks like the Mk 3 was a redesign. Mk1 had twin quarter berths and galley along st d side Mk2 has galley port and aft Mk3 is similar to the 2 if memory serves. It does have some changes on deck including anchor locker and taller rig Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shanghaisailor 1,415 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 Contessa 32, a real ‘get you home’ boat 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SloopJonB 8,583 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 1 hour ago, Guvacine said: Are you referring to the 34 MK 1 (and 2)? It looks like the Mk 3 was a redesign. Yes - the 2-29 and the original 34 both from the late 60's. The starboard side galley and dinette (California) layout works very well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Al Paca 366 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 On 1/5/2020 at 10:06 AM, SloopJonB said: Looks the same, layout is the same, basic hull design is the same - just bigger. All the Cals are the same, just longer or shorter. Except the 2-46, which has an extra station on one side of the hull. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
alphafb552 516 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 On 1/5/2020 at 5:34 PM, Guvacine said: ... I have been a Folkboat fan for a long time, but might want to do some long distance offshore work too, so is not so well suited for that... Well there are quite a few who disagree with that assessment, more than a few transatlantics and circumnavigations have been done on Folkboats! Probably not as comfortably as on some of the other suggestions I admit so that might be a factor to take into account, but the boat can handle it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
carcrash 395 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 The reasons I suggested a Soling: 0) They are beautiful. You don't need a boat, so you might as well have a beautiful one. 1) Very, very cheap or free 2) Easy to dry sail or keep in a slip 3) Self tacking jib 4) The sweetest helm of any monohull 5) Wonderful motion in a seaway 6) They haul ass downwind, they go to windward wonderfully. They are VERY fast and fun with trapeze! 7) As tweaky as you want to be, or completely simple and benign. 8) Only low loads, so safe for unskilled guests 9) No cabin! So you spend time sailing instead of cleaning the head, cushions, mildew, and all the other cabin sailboat work list items. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PaulK 400 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 32 minutes ago, carcrash said: The reasons I suggested a Soling: 0) They are beautiful. You don't need a boat, so you might as well have a beautiful one. 1) Very, very cheap or free 2) Easy to dry sail or keep in a slip 3) Self tacking jib 4) The sweetest helm of any monohull 5) Wonderful motion in a seaway 6) They haul ass downwind, they go to windward wonderfully. They are VERY fast and fun with trapeze! 7) As tweaky as you want to be, or completely simple and benign. 8) Only low loads, so safe for unskilled guests 9) No cabin! So you spend time sailing instead of cleaning the head, cushions, mildew, and all the other cabin sailboat work list items. All true, but hard to keep flat, and really wet. At C.O.R.K we set the spinnaker after the last race one day and planed the miles (seven?) back to the keelboat harbor. The three of us huddled aft next to the helmsman to keep the bow from submarining into the waves we were shooting through. A handful in 20+ knots of wind. Etchells might be a tad more relaxing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Snaggletooth 3,244 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 7 minutes ago, PaulK said: All true, but hard to keep flat, and really wet. At C.O.R.K we set the spinnaker after the last race one day and planed the miles (seven?) back to the keelboat harbor. The three of us huddled aft next to the helmsman to keep the bow from submarining into the waves we were shooting through. A handful in 20+ knots of wind. Etchells might be a tad more relaxing. Nope. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LB 15 4,986 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 On 1/5/2020 at 6:56 AM, Al Paca said: A self tacking headsail should be in everyone’s retirement plan. Or an agile trophy bride. The self tacker might be cheaper though. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SloopJonB 8,583 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 Might be? A handbag for a Trophy wife can cost as much as a suit of sails for a decent sized boat. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
casc27 126 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 14 hours ago, Snaggletooth said: Nope. Holy shit, Snaggs learned to spell?!??! Are you feeling alright there, buddy? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sadug 70 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 On 1/5/2020 at 9:28 AM, sledracr said: Previous owner sailed Ericson-32 to Kauai and return. Still says it was the best all-around boat he's ever owned. I might be biased, but I agree. Hadn't seen this in a while - but now it is playing, in a minimized screen, in my office.......well work can wait a bit Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Israel Hands 618 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 52 minutes ago, sadug said: Hadn't seen this in a while - but now it is playing, in a minimized screen, in my office.......well work can wait a bit So he moved up after that to a 38. Love his videos - perhaps my favorite series on the YTube. -------- Question for the group: How much of a concern is it that Ericsons and some of the other boats shown doing crossings do not have skeg-hung rudders? Would this be a deal-killer for you? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Meat Wad 602 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 At what age is a boat considered Old? My Zap 26 is the last known boat out of the molds in 1988. below the water it reflects everything a modern sport boat has. Above it has the old flared beam. I'd say it's a modern design built before it's time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wristwister 75 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 On 1/4/2020 at 5:27 PM, steele said: A Tartan 30 is worth a look. No bad habits, solid build and the tiller makes for good short handing. The usual 130 jib would be too much for the bay but you probably could not go small enough to self tack. I'll enthusiastically second the Tartan 30. I have owned one for years, and my daughter owns one down in the bay area. You haven't really said what you want to do with the boat. If it's to go fast on day sails and look pretty doing it, then maybe something like the Soling is more up your alley. But if you anticipate multi-day trips with friends and family, with the occasional foray out the bay, then the T30 is a great balance of comfort, performance, and prettiness. Something else to consider, are you going to keep her at a marina? For many marinas, slips for 30' and under are available and not too pricey. You go above 30' and you're typically talking waiting lists and big step up in cost. LOA of the T30 is exactly 30'. By the way, my daughter's Tartan 30 is currently for sale in Vallejo. It's a beauty. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
floater 41 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 Where were you in 1976? 15 minutes ago, wristwister said: By the way, my daughter's Tartan 30 is currently for sale in Vallejo. It's a beauty. that thing is so old... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LionessRacing 572 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 I'm partial to the B-40, but your comfort will vary... Put on a Max Prop and enjoy. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wristwister 75 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 5 minutes ago, floater said: that thing is so old... Um ... yeah, the OP specifically said "old plastic". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
floater 41 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, wristwister said: Um ... yeah, the OP specifically said "old plastic". old metal. same age.. idk. but pretty much the boat to buy is the one you see a good deal on and kinda like.. my boat is old too, but more like this.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Israel Hands 618 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 What are you, a teenager? It's all in the build and care. Hard to find one of those B-40s from the '60s-70s for under $100k. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
floater 41 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 1974. 39K. this one did catch my eye.. https://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/77264 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hitchhiker 907 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 How about this: https://sailinganarchy.com/advert/gary-mull-30-half-tonner/ Ok, so not all plastic, but covered in plastic! Has got to be a sweet sailing boat! 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SloopJonB 8,583 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 4 hours ago, floater said: 1974. 39K. this one did catch my eye.. https://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/77264 Yeah - all it needs is a $50,000 deck job. Good advice. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
floater 41 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 idk. if you are to put effort into a boat - and any boat is always going to be some work. better to own some random production boat - or something with 'style'. PS: I was going to go out on a limb there with the word 'value' - but we all know that simply ain't true. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mr Moab 86 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 1 hour ago, SloopJonB said: Yeah - all it needs is a $50,000 deck job. Good advice. Interesting statement “Ideal candidate(s) would be knowledgeable and experienced sailor(s) that don't need inspections, history, etc.” Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bruno 119 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 Swan would be nice but overpriced, tempted to strip teak and redeck with foam or something. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Israel Hands 618 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 9 hours ago, Mr Moab said: Interesting statement “Ideal candidate(s) would be knowledgeable and experienced sailor(s) that don't need inspections, history, etc.” LOL that's priceless! In other words, sucker prospects preferred. Well, somebody bought it. I wonder what they paid for it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
floater 41 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 10 hours ago, Bruno said: Swan would be nice but overpriced, tempted to strip teak and redeck with foam or something. yes. There are plenty candidates for this - notably baltics and swans. one would think removing the teak would be a good thing - less weight too. However, on some boats the teak is part of the boat (deck) structure as well? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JPD 13 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 On 1/4/2020 at 11:04 PM, Steam Flyer said: Ranger 26 or 29. Great sailing, good looking, relatively well built, well rounded characteristics. I'm not as big a fan of the Cals but there's not much wrong with them either. I sailed the hell out of a Cal 34 back in the day FB- Doug The 33 is pretty decent also ...for a relic Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kinardly 201 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 Had a Yamaha 33 many years back that would check all your boxes. I used mine as R/C one time and a Cal 34 rammed me at the finish line. Tore the living crap out of the Cal. I had some minor gel coat damage that buffed right out (really). Great boat for SF Bay area but a real kelp catcher in SD. By far the best layout below in a 33 footer. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Schnick 23 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 C&C designed Viking 28 is a sweetheart that still handles well with a proper fin keel. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Schakel 128 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 Contessa 32, A Contessa 32 was the only yacht in the small boat class to finish the disastrous 1979 Fastnet race, in which 15 lives were lost. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contessa_32 They are still sold for good value: Contessa 32 Eur 29,500.= 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Santana20AE 211 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 We need to change the title of this thread to...”All the Good Boats We Missed When We were Young” 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
floater 41 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 or..."Which Old Relic Would You Wish To Spend the Next Few Years of Your Life Sorting Out" 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
European Bloke 489 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 5 hours ago, Schakel said: Contessa 32, A Contessa 32 was the only yacht in the small boat class to finish the disastrous 1979 Fastnet race, in which 15 lives were lost. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contessa_32 They are still sold for good value: Contessa 32 Eur 29,500.= That raises an interesting point. The Contessa 32 is cirtainly a classic, but as an old boat it's slow and has less room in than I can describe, the Mrs would do her nut. Also as a cult boat it's frankly overpriced. So back to the OP's original question what's sweet and what's currently viable? To make the point the Contessa33 may not be a classic, but it's a fantastic yacht. Much quicker, much more space, half the price. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Israel Hands 618 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 33 minutes ago, European Bloke said: That raises an interesting point. The Contessa 32 is cirtainly a classic, but as an old boat it's slow and has less room in than I can describe, the Mrs would do her nut. Also as a cult boat it's frankly overpriced. So back to the OP's original question what's sweet and what's currently viable? To make the point the Contessa33 may not be a classic, but it's a fantastic yacht. Much quicker, much more space, half the price. There's a Contessa 35 sitting in Ontario advertised at $19k. Might make a good first project boat for somebody. https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1977/contessa-35-3497186/ (bet it's very negotiable, since the owner didn't even take the trouble to remove the dirty dishes from the sink to make his photos.) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SloopJonB 8,583 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 They seldom do. At least they didn't leave a turd in the toilet - I've seen that in a boat with an asking price in the $20's. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Santana20AE 211 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 3 hours ago, floater said: or..."Which Old Relic Would You Wish To Spend the Next Few Years of Your Life Sorting Out" Adding, “or The Rest of Your Life, Sorting Out” Quote Link to post Share on other sites
floater 41 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 10 minutes ago, Santana20AE said: Adding, “or The Rest of Your Life, Sorting Out” that's right. its not so much which boat you pick - but which boat picks you. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kirwan 324 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 One to add to the list; Islander 28. Perry design, sails well, they made lots, there are a bunch in the bay. (including mine). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Al Paca 366 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 3 hours ago, SloopJonB said: They seldom do. At least they didn't leave a turd in the toilet - I've seen that in a boat with an asking price in the $20's. Pics or it didn’t happen. I’ll get my coat. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Santana20AE 211 Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 6 hours ago, floater said: that's right. its not so much which boat you pick - but which boat picks you. Far too many years ago, a Santana 20 picked me. (A sailor who really only knew and had sailed on ILYA Scows). I wasn’t sure it was a boat our family needed or a boat I really wanted but in the end, I am surely glad the little boat found its way in our family. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sugarbird 98 Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 Per the OP, "For my use it will be an oldish plastic boat 27 to 37 feet long". A Tartan 37 might fill the bill at the upper end of your size specs. 486 built from 1976 until 1989, pretty S&S design, decent build quality, many have been loved, maintained and upgraded. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guvacine 23 Posted January 11, 2020 Author Share Posted January 11, 2020 The S&S Tartan 37 indeed looks sweet. Love the low freeboard with the centerboard. Unfortunately it looks to be an East Coast creature. It brings home that the left coast/right coast thing is real and that some boats are kind of out of the question by location. Many boats here that I would never have thought of - if you don't know, you don't know. Such as the Islander 28, both local and a Perry design. Thanks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
carcrash 395 Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Any Ian Farrier trimaran. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Left Shift 2,841 Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 On 1/9/2020 at 7:34 PM, Schnick said: C&C designed Viking 28 is a sweetheart that still handles well with a proper fin keel. The 70's C&C's were very nice boats for their time. Well made. Cruised a CC 29' that was a delight as a family boat for 4. The Viking 33 was also solid. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sail69 117 Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 35 minutes ago, Left Shift said: The 70's C&C's were very nice boats for their time. Well made. Cruised a CC 29' that was a delight as a family boat for 4. The Viking 33 was also solid. This. The 80's too. Except for a few notable exceptions, your hard pressed to make a mistake with a C & C. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cal20sailor 2,433 Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 6 hours ago, sail69 said: This. The 80's too. Except for a few notable exceptions, your hard pressed to make a mistake with a C & C. To be a nit, the Viking28 was built by Ontario Yachts. My dad had one for five or six years and it was a boat that could win in any condition and any point of sail. Forerunner to C&C's Long Line series 35-1, 43, 30, etc. The boat was two years ahead of its time coming out in '68. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sledracr 660 Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 On 1/16/2020 at 1:30 PM, sail69 said: This. The 80's too. Except for a few notable exceptions, your hard pressed to make a mistake with a C & C. I looked hard at some C&Cs. The thing that waved me off was the cored hull most of them have. ymmv Quote Link to post Share on other sites
blurocketsmate 86 Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 On 1/5/2020 at 12:58 AM, PaulinVictoria said: C&C30 Mk1, good manners and very stiff. There was a decent looking one for sale here that went for $2800 on eBay. I regret not buying it. If you're thinking Tartan 30, the Yankee 30 is similar, and had a fleet on the Bay. I think it's better looking, and maybe better sailing. I've sailed the Yankee but not the Tartan. The Yankee will claw upwind in over 30kt. So can a Folkboat. Wauquiez Pretorien and Gladiateur. Another vote for old Cals and Rangers. I would choose an old Cal over an early Ericson, but a later Ericson -- Mk3 or the Ron Holland ones -- over any Cal. Those RH Ericsons may need rail meat though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cruiser2B 51 Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 On 1/4/2020 at 2:18 PM, Guvacine said: For my long term retirement plans. What is the sweetest sailing old plastic for a windy place like The Bay? I don't mean fast or any of the usual yardsticks, but what boats give you that difficult-to-describe feeling of being a sweet and pleasurable sailor on all points. For my use it will be an oldish plastic boat 27 to 37 feet long, but I am curious about any "sweet sailing" design that I have been missing. It is important that it is "sweet" on all points - there are many boats that can point or run well, but not so many that do it all. A sweet sailing boat....I'm partial to Alberg designs, great for SF bay. Very comfortable motion...a bit tender, not fast by any stretch of the imagination...but sweet sailing and very pleasing to the eye. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sail69 117 Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 On 1/17/2020 at 10:20 PM, sledracr said: I looked hard at some C&Cs. The thing that waved me off was the cored hull most of them have. ymmv Sorry...but that is a red herring for a vast majority of C & Cs. There are other more real problems with other manufacturers runs. Dont let it scare you. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sean 2,257 Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 On 1/8/2020 at 5:01 PM, JPD said: The 33 is pretty decent also ...for a relic I used to own one, loved it! Added bonus is it’s PHRF racing potential, we did quite well with her. I now have a Tartan 38, which is a “racing” version of the 37. I’d recommend the 37 for the top end of the size range. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Slowboat 17 Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Swede 55! I had a folkboat, a Hinckley, and then the Swede. Awesome boat, and very easy to single hand. The boat makes you look like a better sailor every day. This is a shot from a 35-50knot day. Had a blast! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SloopJonB 8,583 Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Looks like you were overdue for a reef. I always call for one when the sheet winches go underwater. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Pokey uh da LBC 59 Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 Saw this nice looking Tartan 34 on Craig's List Los Angeles. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Left Shift 2,841 Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 On 1/21/2020 at 5:31 AM, Slowboat said: Swede 55! I had a folkboat, a Hinckley, and then the Swede. Awesome boat, and very easy to single hand. The boat makes you look like a better sailor every day. This is a shot from a 35-50knot day. Had a blast! No one "has a blast" sailing in 35-50 knot winds. Well, not in the vernacular use of that term. Especially short handed and if they aren't able to keep the boat on its feet. Sailing with your winches in the water is usually not the sign of being in control. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TUBBY 314 Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 How else do you clean the winches? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steam Flyer 5,286 Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 8 hours ago, Left Shift said: No one "has a blast" sailing in 35-50 knot winds. Well, not in the vernacular use of that term. Especially short handed and if they aren't able to keep the boat on its feet. Sailing with your winches in the water is usually not the sign of being in control. The Swede is somewhat of a different style of boat: long narrow hull, doesn't build up excessive weather helm nor lift the rudder out of the water until heel goes WAY out of control; rig inboard and balanced to keep the boat driving not stalling. I have not sailed a Swede 55 but a few of it's smaller cousins and they don't reward handling them like a modern racing boat, they don't power up until the point of heel long past a modern boat would be stalled and probably unsteerable. I raced a 6-Meter for a while and it was similar in handling (except that it probably didn't steer as well, the helm was almost irrelevant to that thing). The pic looks like she's only at 30 degrees or so, our 6 used to peg the fun-meter at 45 for long stretches. The winches were bit further inboard though FB- Doug Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Somebody Else 650 Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 5 hours ago, Steam Flyer said: The pic looks like she's only at 30 degrees or so, our 6 used to peg the fun-meter at 45 for long stretches. The winches were bit further inboard though FB- Doug I hope you're not an engineer or an artist. It's heeled about 44 degrees. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
European Bloke 489 Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 If the Swede 55 is a bit much boat for you then the Aphrodite 101 is similar but smaller. Not much room down below, but sails beautifully, and much quicker than you'd expect. https://www.ott-yacht.de/photos_aphrodite101_en.html 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steam Flyer 5,286 Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 5 hours ago, Somebody Else said: 11 hours ago, Steam Flyer said: The pic looks like she's only at 30 degrees or so, our 6 used to peg the fun-meter at 45 for long stretches. The winches were bit further inboard though FB- Doug I hope you're not an engineer or an artist. It's heeled about 44 degrees. I
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