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What boat would you take on a nonstop solo circumnavigation??


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Budget, time? Since this is the Ocean Racing thread, I assume racing?

Personally I wouldn’t go non stop singlehanded. Doublehanded with the right person, maybe. If so, I would probably go Class 40, but late gen pre-foiling IMOCA 60 if the budget allowed. These were fast, generally reliable boats designed for this purpose.

My other ramblings:

For crewed non-stop, Groupama 3. The new foilers are fantastic but Groupama 3 is bullet proof, fast and can be managed by experienced cat/tri sailors.

For crewed with 1 or 2 stops, it would be hard to beat a MOD70.

Personally I would like to see a VOR in MOD70’s or a return to the development of the Volvo 70, but that may be another thread.

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1 hour ago, JojoFruji said:

say $500,000

Class 40. Get a solid more recent one - get a rudder system reinforced & bring multiple rudders. Beef up silly shit that plague many in heavy seas like silly poorly secured hoses in the water ballast transfer system (so many skippers have dealt with them popping off and setting the boat). 

 

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The pilothouse 62 might be a good choice, looks dry, designed for SO work and well maintained.

Personally I would go for a Class 40 first though, simply for the speed potential over most of the course, plus they were built for this route and usually setup with twin autohelms.

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For me there's a rubber band around a number of tradeoffs....  I'd want

-- easily driven hull, but not too light
-- solidly built, but not too heavy
-- small enough to comfortably single-hand, but big enough to have room to live in amongst all the food/gear/etc

My initial thought is usually something along the lines of a Nordic-40, but... it's fun to ponder

With a 1/2M budget, a lot of other options open up, but ....

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Give me a Swan 65

Strong, sea kind and it will get you there, no matter what.

The bouganvilla 62 is a great boat but I wouldn't want to be beating for too long, off the breeze tradewinds it would be a winner.

Anything less than 60 would be a PITA-where are you gonna carry water food and spares for a non stop circle?

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7 hours ago, Navig8tor said:

Anything less than 60 would be a PITA-where are you gonna carry water food and spares for a non stop circle?

Being solo and 200 days non-stop very little in the way water, food and spares needs to be carried. Most heavy or bulky spares can be shipped in when you give up and enter a port. Watermaker. Food for a solo 200 days is not much: 2 kilos per day is 400 kilos, as very much a maximum.

40 feet is perfectly reasonable. Lotsa useless furniture in the typical Swan. 50 or 60 feet is far less exhausting due to stability.

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I certainly can’t solo handle the canvass of anything larger than 40 - ditto re watermaker. Carrying so much freshwater without it becoming fouled is hard - easier to have tankage for 200 buffer/emergency and watermaker. 

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On 4/12/2020 at 8:56 PM, samc99us said:

Budget, time? Since this is the Ocean Racing thread, I assume racing?

Personally I wouldn’t go non stop singlehanded. Doublehanded with the right person, maybe. If so, I would probably go Class 40, but late gen pre-foiling IMOCA 60 if the budget allowed. These were fast, generally reliable boats designed for this purpose.

My other ramblings:

For crewed non-stop, Groupama 3. The new foilers are fantastic but Groupama 3 is bullet proof, fast and can be managed by experienced cat/tri sailors.

For crewed with 1 or 2 stops, it would be hard to beat a MOD70.

Personally I would like to see a VOR in MOD70’s or a return to the development of the Volvo 70, but that may be another thread.

ditto...

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Just now, PIL66 - XL2 said:

Emirates... first class.... with my best drinking buddy 

Nothing goes upwind like a 747! :lol:

A regular talking point on more than one delivery trip and race! 

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10 minutes ago, mad said:

Nothing goes upwind like a 747! :lol:

A regular talking point on more than one delivery trip and race! 

Yep who hasn't had that chat on the rail while cold and wet
A380... And that isn't even the suit... apparently Singa's has a better one

emirates-first-class-a380.jpg

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2 hours ago, Hitchhiker said:

I always thought the SC 50 Another Girl would be a good candidate for something like this. Zero interest in pushing hard, and rigged for utmost ease of handling.

An SC50 would be an easy boat to manage single handed. But, there is very little helm protection.  And, boats have evolved. $500k is a tight budget.

But, if unlimited budget; Macif the Ultim would be my choice. Reality is I'm not gonna sail non stop single  handed around the world.

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47 minutes ago, 44forty said:
57 minutes ago, SCARECROW said:

Someone may do just that . It sold last week 

No, it did not, unfortunately. Still available.

I am sitting on her as I type this. Rather tough to show with the borders closed and all non-essential travel shut down!

But she certainly could make it around the world!

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Need something fast enough to get out of the way of vicious weather systems but solid enough to be able to handle getting thrashed by crashing waves. Some of the boats suggested would just get rolled by a mild front.

60ft is big enough to handle waves well enough not not feel every ripple (hence IMOCA60's and Vo65's) being in that size range, plus you if set up properly, can be handled with minimal fuss (yeah you need your head screwed on though furling everything will make it easier.

Stuff being in a plastic tube getting thrown about doing 6 knots max speed waiting to get turned upside down because you cant get out of the way of a cold front.

 

 

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2 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

No, it did not, unfortunately. Still available.

I am sitting on her as I type this. Rather tough to show with the borders closed and all non-essential travel shut down!

But she certainly could make it around the world!

My neighbor is trapped in NZ. Are you still there?

The neighbor has a few acres here and a few on the shore somewhere in the Bay of Islands. He likes to drive his tractor and play gentleman farmer in both hemispheres.

He wants a boat near the size of yours but will never do it due to advanced age. 

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8 hours ago, Keith said:

This might have worked, :ph34r:

But not for me I'm a multihull sailor. 

 

image.png.942af603b0c9632f40c245e04e6cb838.png

Something along those lines is what I'd look at first.  That scary keel would have to go though.  A more conservative keel with rig changes to match. The water ballast could stay.

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Solo, professional racers and the hopelessly romantic or deluded aside, who would want to solo navigate the world, non-stop? 

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3 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

No, it did not, unfortunately. Still available.

I am sitting on her as I type this. Rather tough to show with the borders closed and all non-essential travel shut down!

But she certainly could make it around the world!

Nice boat, BJ.

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4 hours ago, Tom O'Keefe said:

An SC50 would be an easy boat to manage single handed. But, there is very little helm protection.  And, boats have evolved. $500k is a tight budget.

But, if unlimited budget; Macif the Ultim would be my choice. Reality is I'm not gonna sail non stop single  handed around the world.

No. Not an SC50.  The SC50 "Another Girl".  I've sailed several thousand miles on an SC50.  "Another Girl" is quite diffferent. Probably different name now. 

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1 hour ago, Autonomous said:

My neighbor is trapped in NZ. Are you still there?

The neighbor has a few acres here and a few on the shore somewhere in the Bay of Islands. He likes to drive his tractor and play gentleman farmer in both hemispheres.

He wants a boat near the size of yours but will never do it due to advanced age. 

We're in Whangarei, so not too far from him.

The boat's not that old! :D

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1 hour ago, Sailbydate said:

Solo, professional racers and the hopelessly romantic or deluded aside, who would want to solo navigate the world, non-stop? 

Personally I don't understand the attraction. The stopping is where the coolest bits happen, in my view.

Though the sailing is nice and beats the hell out of flying, it's not the end-all.

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2 minutes ago, Tanton Y_M said:

Me too!

Gardenia3-MH03-16.jpg

Gardenia6-MH03-16.jpg

Gardenia2-MH03-16.jpg

Gardenia10-MH04-16.jpg

That would sail backwards really well too . The stern would make a very efficient bow . Contender for solo round the world the wrong way !

 

bloody nice boat tho , too nice to sail solo and not share .

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2 hours ago, Hitchhiker said:

No. Not an SC50.  The SC50 "Another Girl".  I've sailed several thousand miles on an SC50.  "Another Girl" is quite diffferent. Probably different name now. 

May I ask your reasons why the SC50 and I assume the other ultra lights from that era would not be on your list?

Thanks.

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5 minutes ago, Hitchhiker said:

You can certainly ask my opinion on the SC50. As to other ultra lights. I may or may not have an opinion. Specificity would be necessary.

When you stated "No. Not an SC50" I assume you meant not for an around the world trip.  With your experience I wonder why.

Maybe I misunderstood you. Let's forget the rest of the UL fleet for now.

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10 hours ago, Hitchhiker said:

No. Not an SC50.  The SC50 "Another Girl".  I've sailed several thousand miles on an SC50.  "Another Girl" is quite diffferent. Probably different name now. 

I think you might be referring to Chas Mer the SC50 that was built to do the BOC?

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47 minutes ago, Tom O'Keefe said:

I think you might be referring to Chas Mer the SC50 that was built to do the BOC?

No. I copied and pasted below from an older listing. She used to be Orange, but was repainted and sold.

50' Santa Cruz '81 "Another Girl"

ANOTHER GIRL, is specifically rigged for short-handed sailing and cruising. Her custom Ballenger rig has modern, swept back spreaders which eliminate the need for runners. Her double ended mainsheet leads under deck and aft to the cockpit to a couple of large, self-tailing Barient winches. Plus, there is a pair of electric Barient winches that can be used for the jib sheets, mainsheet, main halyard and jib halyard. The winches are operated with foot control buttons at the helm.

Additionally, ANOTHER GIRL has a custom bulb keel, designed by naval architect, Bob Smith of Santa Cruz 52 fame, to reduces her draft from the standard ————————————-by designing a new keel with a bulb to allow performance and still get into more anchorages.

ANOTHER GIRL has been lightly used her whole life and has never been raced. Her layout below from the salon aft is standard but moving forward, she has a second head and a custom double berth for the master stateroom also designed by Bob Smith.

 

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Chasch Mer is hull number 1.  I think it still lives at Kaneohe Yacht club, but not totally sure. Possibly a short handed candidate. But, I think one would have to substantially re-rig to simplify. The shorter length cabin trunk might be an issue for the cruising aspect of long distance sailing.

http://www.chaschmer.com/

 

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Finally, the singlehanded SC50 was Hal Roth’s American Flag, later Sebago. Hull 28. IIRC, it was the second to last 50 built.  Did a BOC round the world race plus some other events.  Later went to the bay as Sundowner.  Was in NPB too for a while I think.

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12 hours ago, Hitchhiker said:

SC50

Which one was the... for lack of a better phrase... "bootleg SC50"?  IIRC, it was the SC50 lines but built more heavily, and maybe some other mods.  "Anomaly" or something.

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18 hours ago, ronnie_simpson said:

What kind of boat is that? She's rad. That's what i would want for a 500k self funded solo non stop lap.

That's the boat that holds the round the world record East to West on the "jules vernes route" (in 122 days), so really up wind oriented.

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On 4/12/2020 at 5:35 PM, JojoFruji said:

Nonstop solo under 200 days

So just slightly faster than a Rustler 36?   (211 days Jean-Luc Van Den Heede, 2018-19)? Not exactly challenging.

Hal Roth did it in 171 days on a Santa Cruz 50 at age 59-60. And I think he capsized with all the hassles that might entain.

Nowadays I'd go Open 40.

 

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On 4/14/2020 at 3:10 AM, Navig8tor said:

Give me a Swan 65

Strong, sea kind and it will get you there, no matter what.

The bouganvilla 62 is a great boat but I wouldn't want to be beating for too long, off the breeze tradewinds it would be a winner.

Anything less than 60 would be a PITA-where are you gonna carry water food and spares for a non stop circle?

Swan 65 ketch any day.  Assuming you can find one for the price.  It will take you through anything, especially to windward if you need to.  Which you will. 

There's a huge storage volume, as the engine and generator are under the saloon floor and there's tons of stowage elsewhere.

And when it blows hard, the best rig is jib and jigger. Drop the mainsail, bung a reef in the mizzen, and just a staysail.  An easy rig to tack or gybe.

I would get a carbon pole from somewhere, as those original Nautor ones are cast-iron bastards to move around solo.

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19 minutes ago, P_Wop said:

Swan 65 ketch any day.  Assuming you can find one for the price.  It will take you through anything, especially to windward if you need to.  Which you will. 

There's a huge storage volume, as the engine and generator are under the saloon floor and there's tons of stowage elsewhere.

And when it blows hard, the best rig is jib and jigger. Drop the mainsail, bung a reef in the mizzen, and just a staysail.  An easy rig to tack or gybe.

I would get a carbon pole from somewhere, as those original Nautor ones are cast-iron bastards to move around solo.

 

^^^^^ This

P_Wop you forgot to mention you can bounce bullets of the staysail and they are heavy, best to have it hanked on before you leave, bag it and connect the sheets when you need too.

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On 4/15/2020 at 7:49 AM, PIL66 - XL2 said:

Yep who hasn't had that chat on the rail while cold and wet
A380... And that isn't even the suit... apparently Singa's has a better one

emirates-first-class-a380.jpg

I was happy with Emirates 1st class. Having a shower before landing was a strange feeling.

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On 4/18/2020 at 3:29 AM, P_Wop said:

Swan 65 ketch any day.  Assuming you can find one for the price.  It will take you through anything, especially to windward if you need to.  Which you will. 

There's a huge storage volume, as the engine and generator are under the saloon floor and there's tons of stowage elsewhere.

And when it blows hard, the best rig is jib and jigger. Drop the mainsail, bung a reef in the mizzen, and just a staysail.  An easy rig to tack or gybe.

I would get a carbon pole from somewhere, as those original Nautor ones are cast-iron bastards to move around solo.

On a close reach, this boat R0CKZ! Stright donwnwind, well, ... Ummm, I crossed the Atlanic on one. We did the barefoot route which was 99% straight downwind. No mizzen, main reefed, genoa poled out to leeward, and a big Yankee set flying opposite of the Genoa. She still neeeded a lot of input from the autopilot, and rolled like a log for the whole 12 days. It can really get on your nerves. The huge bridgedeck wasn't my cup of tea either. Alone on watch at nigt, I falways felt a little unsafe walking from the companionway to the tiny cockpit over that huge, flat, and frighteningly high area. Under deck she was shipshape as can be, more than enough points to hold onto in a seaway. But up on that fucking bridgedeck, there was nothing. Stanchions? They were below it on the sidedecks! If you tripped, you went for a swim. OTOH, she was strong, everything overbuilt, solid laminate etc... A bit like a Mercedes from the 1970s. I mean even the toerails looked like you could hang up the whole boat upon them! I can understand why there's a cult about these boats but I am not part of that cult.

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13 minutes ago, 10thTonner said:

On a close reach, this boat R0CKZ! Stright donwnwind, well, ... Ummm, I crossed the Atlanic on one. We did the barefoot route which was 99% straight downwind. ...

...but I am not part of that cult.

Me neither. Slow overweight rolly furniture wagons.

However, I'm always a bit astonished when cruisers complain a route is DDW. The Atlantic is not a canal, right? Any clever skipper that can find the COURSE buttons on the A/P can set a sweet deep reach. Probably arrive about the same time, if not sooner, well rested and fit.

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1 hour ago, El Boracho said:

However, I'm always a bit astonished when cruisers complain a route is DDW. The Atlantic is not a canal, right? Any clever skipper that can find the COURSE buttons on the A/P can set a sweet deep reach. Probably arrive about the same time, if not sooner, well rested and fit.

Yes.  Absolutely. 

Sail the angles, and those "accidental" gybes just go away.  The load falls off "Otto" the autopilot, and you don't destroy your sails and rigging. 

Or your sleep. Or slosh the lime out of your Mount Gay and tonic.

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2 hours ago, El Boracho said:

Me neither. Slow overweight rolly furniture wagons.

However, I'm always a bit astonished when cruisers complain a route is DDW. The Atlantic is not a canal, right? Any clever skipper that can find the COURSE buttons on the A/P can set a sweet deep reach. Probably arrive about the same time, if not sooner, well rested and fit.

Most cruisers have put in more time researching what nesting pot they should have than actually learning how to trim sails  

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9 hours ago, El Boracho said:

Me neither. Slow overweight rolly furniture wagons.

However, I'm always a bit astonished when cruisers complain a route is DDW. The Atlantic is not a canal, right? Any clever skipper that can find the COURSE buttons on the A/P can set a sweet deep reach. Probably arrive about the same time, if not sooner, well rested and fit.

Believe me, this is not the boat to go downwind tacking in hot angles. DDW was fastest and we were on a delivery. We sailed about 160 to 170 degrees AWA to avoid those sudden gybes, but that did not stop the rolling.  (What was more important was caredul weather routing to avoid the holes of dead calm right in the middle of the pond.) 

I am not saying it is a bad boat. As fast as you can get in a 50 year old design, comfy below, and built like a tank. The kind of yacht that doesn’t let you worry too much about icebergs. floating containers or the Venezuelan navy. 

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On 4/15/2020 at 9:03 PM, sledracr said:

Which one was the... for lack of a better phrase... "bootleg SC50"?  IIRC, it was the SC50 lines but built more heavily, and maybe some other mods.  "Anomaly" or something.

Are you referring to Adrenalin, the South African build 50?

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16 hours ago, Raz'r said:

Are you referring to Adrenalin, the South African build 50?

Thank you!! I could not think of the name. That was the one that was in NPB SoCal for a while.

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35 minutes ago, Hitchhiker said:

Thank you!! I could not think of the name. That was the one that was in NPB SoCal for a while.

I co-owned it for a bit culminating in the 2015 Transpac. A very active, experienced racing couple bought it up here in NorCal as a "Fast boat with furniture" - they've tricked her out nicely.

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They had a blog going for a while but looks like it hasn't been updated in a couple of years.

https://adrenalinsc50.wordpress.com/

The understanding I have is that it is a SC50, but the only one not built in Santa Cruz.  How'd that happen?  Did the Wizard sell/license a set of drawings, or license a builder to build one it elsewhere, or....? 

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2 hours ago, sledracr said:

They had a blog going for a while but looks like it hasn't been updated in a couple of years.

https://adrenalinsc50.wordpress.com/

The understanding I have is that it is a SC50, but the only one not built in Santa Cruz.  How'd that happen?  Did the Wizard sell/license a set of drawings, or license a builder to build one it elsewhere, or....? 

My chat with Bill Lee (I asked him if he was OK if we registered in regattas as an SC50) was that he was fine with it, as the builder in South Africa did pay for the plans. I spoke with the builder as well, he was excited to hear how far the boat had come, and he mentioned he had built it to sail a bi-annual Cape Town to St Helena race. She was named Nina at the time. IIRC Nina did that race twice, was first to finish in '96, 2nd in '98. The builder lamented that while he's gone more modern and extreme with boats, he liked that one the best. Loved it's upwind performance (she had a more IMS bulb-keel than the original 50s)

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