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After 12 years of making changes and experimenting with different rigging Ideas I finally got my 505 where I want it.  Close to the way it was when i got it from Holty but with some changes.  The boat was well rigged but looked like crap with old holes, some filled some not, touch up paint that didn't quite match the original, dents from crews climbing in and dragging the trapeze hook etc..... This project was originally scheduled for next winter but with our Flight Dept shut down until July and minimum flying after that now is the perfect time for this.

I took the boat down to the carbon fiber, made new bailer wells, filled old unused ones with new core material, filled faired sanded and made some other minor mods.  Today I put on a couple coats of West epoxy for a barrier coat.  Tomorrow sand and prime using Awlgrip.  I'll post the progress.

Pic of the boat a few years ago and today.

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I've been putting off doing this level of work to Waterat 7772.  It needs a full new deck re-paint.  Nice inspiration, great work!

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4 hours ago, 7111 said:

Amazing work !

Out of curiosity: what is the weight of the stripped down hull ?

I wish I knew but it's way lighter than before I started sanding. It's a VanMunster 8822.  They don't gelcoat they fair and paint.  The thing I discovered was there was a ton of fairing compound, I'm guessing  high build spray on and I'd bet between primer, paint and compound I removed at least 20 lbs.  It's substantially lighter than when i started for sure. Now I've added a few coats of epoxy most of which will be sanded off today then 3 coats of primer sanded between coats and then 2-3 coats of topcoat so quite a bit of weight will go back but I'm sure it will still be lighter.

I got rid of some corrector weight at the 2017 Worlds.  I may need to add some when I'm done.

I did the hull 4 years ago and it was waaay easier than this.  Unfortunately I cheaped out on the paint and used something advertised as "comparable to Awlgrip" and it wasn't close so I'll be redoing the hull as well.

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8 hours ago, another505er said:

That is an amazing amount of work!  This is from someone who repaired 8266 after it spent the night on Alcatraz, my project might be a cake walk in comparison with your project?

I need an after shot.

And a photo of the finished boat.

 

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Ouch.  Like to see the after.

 

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Just posting this since we're posting hull bottoms but this is 8266's sistership Waterat 8265 after Guck inc. cleaned up her gelcoat shortly after I got her.  She has since had an additional blister - which Andy Pimental (Jibe Tech) made quick work of.  They loved their pastels in the early 1990's! 

Tom

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12 minutes ago, Carbon said:

Just posting this since we're posting hull bottoms but this is 8266's sistership Waterat 8265 after Guck inc. cleaned up her gelcoat shortly after I got her.  She has since had an additional blister - which Andy Pimental (Jibe Tech) made quick work of.  They loved their pastels in the early 1990's! 

Tom

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This was mine when I re did it 4 years ago. 

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6 hours ago, Major Tom said:

Instead of Awlgrip have you thought about Awlcraft or Alexseal, both almost identical and able to be sanded and polished?

I'm using Awlcraft 2000 for that very reason.

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I saw some reviews on Alexseal and may use that when I do the bottom.  Can be rolled and tipped and be sanded and buffed.  I just don't want to get into the same situation as when I did the bottom last time.  The manufacturer claimed it could be rolled and tipped then sanded and buffed but the paint never levelled so It took forever to sand and buff but the paint isn't holding up. It scratches very easily and is chalky.

Last time I did an Awlgrip bottom it leveled perfectly and didn't need to be sanded or buffed.  12 years later it still looks new.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Things didn't go exactly as planned. I way underestimated the time it would take to roll and tip a coat.  I figured 2 hours and it took 6.  I mixed enough to do the entire boat,  it was hot and I suspect nearing the end of the pot life so the last 1/4 of the painting didn't come out great.  I was also working into the night and gnats were attracted to the lights and the boat.

So there's a window of between 16 & 24 hrs to re coat without sanding. Of course I had to sand anyway because of the Gnats and the lousy last quarter. When I took the boat outside to sand it I was blinded by the extreme gloss of the white paint and realized it would be painful to sail that way.

The solution was to add a flattening agent.  Awlgrip strongly suggests it NOT be rolled and tipped.  I looked at the spray recommendations and they recommended a 1.1 mm tip for a gravity feed gun.  I couldn't find a gun with that spec for under $500- even used!  I did find a touch up gun with a 1.0 tip for $48.00.  Worked perfectly and it's only 30-45 minutes between coats when spraying.  I sprayed under the deck, the CB cap and the thwarts one day and the rest of the boat the next.  I couldn't do it all at once because in order to get the tanks I needed to get into the boat.  The longest part of this part of the project was masking everything off to avoid over spray.  The actual spraying took 10-15 minutes per coat for the CB cap etc. and about 25 minutes for the rest of the boat.

Now 3 days to cure before I start rigging and 3 weeks before I turn it over to do the bottom.

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Edited by dburchfiel
forgot some info
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Looking very nice! Prep is what takes the time. We rolled Awlgrip with flattening agent on our deck (J/36) and they are right- it does come out with some shiny spots.  We can live with them.  Am planning to avoid painting the 505. Occasionally waxing the original gelcoat is much less work.

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That is a beautiful job, well done!

Thanks also for the details & info on the process and materials. My refinish jobs always come out short of what I'd like to do. Good move with the flattening agent, a lot of people never realize "shiny" is not good!

FB- Doug

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12 minutes ago, samc99us said:

Great job!

One thing that is unclear is when to apply topcoat over the 545 primer. Prime, then wait 24hrs, then sand with 320grit then shoot topcoat?

That's correct.  If I had to do it again however I'd use Awlcraft since it can be easily repaired and can be sanded and buffed.  I got Awlgrip because it could be rolled and tipped where Awlcraft can't.

I already have Alexseal for the bottom because it can be rolled and tipped and it can be sanded, buffed and repaired.  Of course now I'll spray it instead.

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Gotcha. Can you send a link to the touchup gun you shot with? That seems to be one of the "magic" bets with this stuff. I'll probably go with some Awlcraft on some projects here but am thinking Awlgrip makes more sense for boards and rudders as its stiffer/tougher.

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10 minutes ago, dburchfiel said:

https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200319461_200319461

The only drawback is the little cup.  I had to refill it 4 times for each coat.  Not a big deal since the plastic cover just pops off and you pour in more paint.

 

After doing a little research I also got a cheap regulator and disposable filter dryer to attach to the gun.  I turned the air control on the bottom of the handle full open and adjusted the pressure to 20#.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 7/21/2020 at 6:00 PM, olav said:

Nice work! 
 

8441 will want some TLC next winter..

Is that the Buick under cover? Hope you got the engine running again! 

Olav my friend,

How are things across the pond?  That is the Buick,  Rebuilt the engine, stock block, heads and intake. Ported and polished.  The rest new forged components, bigger turbo etc.  Now 659 hp! No more boat towing with it.

I've got 8822 about 20% re rigged. It's going slowly with the heat indexes 110 or so every day.  I hope to have it done this weekend.  It will be 3 weeks since it was sprayed and the paint will be fully cured.  Then I'll flip it and do the hull.

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Would you be so kind as to describe your paint setup?  I have a boat that is needing attention--and I don't want to do the after-sanding on a tip and roll.  What tank, nozzle, tip, PSI, etc?  

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Dave, looking great already, nice work!! 
cautiously optimistic over here but still taking physical distancing pretty seriously - 5oh-ing only with folks from the same household..
household prefers the lead carrier, so 8441 staying in the garage for the time being. Gel coat starting to peel in places, very thin and never stuck well to the epoxy I suppose. Not keen on painting her like Ethan did to 8715 tho, would rather try and repair the gel coat..

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16 hours ago, Coquina012 said:

Would you be so kind as to describe your paint setup?  I have a boat that is needing attention--and I don't want to do the after-sanding on a tip and roll.  What tank, nozzle, tip, PSI, etc?  

ingersoll Rand compressor. https://www.autobodytoolmart.com/product/ingersoll-rand-2hp-garage-mate-single-stage-20-gallon-compressor-p15iu-a9/air-compressors-tools?gclid=Cj0KCQjwjer4BRCZARIsABK4QeWL1sLsTtq26qhsbuNokBWPQMueYjC7yugw5WRnSTM1ZYzwl1yJpx0aAnOeEALw_wcB.     20 psi at the gun. Cheap touch up gun from from Northern tool with a 1.0 tip.

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15 hours ago, olav said:

Dave, looking great already, nice work!! 
cautiously optimistic over here but still taking physical distancing pretty seriously - 5oh-ing only with folks from the same household..
household prefers the lead carrier, so 8441 staying in the garage for the time being. Gel coat starting to peel in places, very thin and never stuck well to the epoxy I suppose. Not keen on painting her like Ethan did to 8715 tho, would rather try and repair the gel coat..

Thanks Olav,

In February my schedule showed 4 trips to Europe and 3 to London by July.  I thought I would have been sailing the Solent with you guys but when Covid hit we shut down.  I've flown 3 times since February, just takeoffs and landings for currency.  Luckily I'm getting my full salary to sit at home and fix the boat.

I'm also looking for a live aboard in the 40-50' range.  I'm planning on retiring next summer and becoming a nomad!

I'd think hard about fixing the gel coat on epoxy.  I think you'll be chasing a continuing problem.

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When I had WitchCraft 505, we fixed up a few older 505s with gelcoat problems.  The customers who asked for spot repairs had to come back for more. The people who did what Dave did, still have gorgeous boats to this day. I think it's worth it go for it and never have to do it again.

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14 hours ago, Fasterdamnit! said:

Cf 505 AND a GN. Well done!

I feel the need for speed.

I like fast planes, fast cars, fast boats and fast women!! Here they are fastest to slowest. The thing is the slowest feels the fastest and the fastest the slowest. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...

I had 3 fairly large repairs to do.  2 on the gunwales where it sits on the dolly and one on the very front of the bow.  Won't talk about how that happened. The core was replaced in those areas and everything vacuum bagged. :o I thought I'd never get the fairing done on this thing.  Cant tell you how many times I needed to fill and longboard and kept finding more to do. 

Finally done with 3 coats of West Epoxy.  Most of the epoxy sanded off and ready to be primed. Primed.

Final sanding and painting this week.

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Painted. Following feedback on this thread and doing quite a bit of research I decided to go with Alexseal on the hull since it can be rolled or sprayed and can be sanded and buffed as well as easily repaired. 

The original plan was to roll and tip but seeing I had bought a gun and sprayed the interior, tanks and deck  (using Awlgrip) with great results, it was easy to spray and leveled incredibly well.  I figured I'd spray the hull as well. The Alexseal did not spray as well. It ran and sagged and didn't level nearly as well as the Awlgrip. That being said the results were ok but I will be sanding and buffing to get the desired results.

I did roll Alexseal on a cover under the bow and the results were spetacular. I mean absolutely perfect!  i guess i should have rolled the hull as originally planned!  All applications were completed in strict compliance with the applicable application guides.

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  • 3 weeks later...
57 minutes ago, Dart96 said:

Thanks, good to hear your experience.

The other option is to use a long piece of batten that goes most of the length of your boat.  If you have the old measurements from before you started the work, you measure down the from the gunwale, put some marks on the hull, and then hold a long batten up with the help of a friend or two, and trace the line.

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  • 1 month later...
On 8/27/2020 at 8:45 AM, Steam Flyer said:

WOW indeed!

That's beautiful Dave! Looks slippery too!

FB- Doug

Difference between a 505 sailor and a J70 sailor: "I ain't afraid of being over early!"
....
(but there is a technical difference of course...)

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12 hours ago, fastyacht said:

Difference between a 505 sailor and a J70 sailor: "I ain't afraid of being over early!"
....
(but there is a technical difference of course...)

I know, I know.... I'm the guy that used to have a purple Lightning.....

FB- Doug

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