Tidal grids/drying out?

[Breamerly 85]

Curious if anyone has experience drying out on a tidal grid, especially with a fin keel.

There's still at least a couple around in my region and available for public use for zincs and throughhulls (no scraping/painting). And as one of those poor idiots who's attracted to the idea of self-sufficiency through the preservation of old-timey skills, it has an innate appeal. Aaaaand in theory supporting the keel alone should be fine because it's something like ~40-60% of the boat's weight, and also in theory even in the yard the vast majority of the boat's weight is on the blocks, not the stands anyway.....

That said, many a fine blooper video has started with a plan that included the word 'theoretically'.

[TJSoCal 162]

"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. But in practice there is."

No advice to offer, but how do others in the area do it?

[Breamerly 85]

Just now, TJSoCal said:

"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. But in practice there is."

No advice to offer, but how do others in the area do it?

I've asked around a bit. But they aren't used much. The Muni one I think mostly gets used by powerboats. The few sailors I've found around who've used them are traditional sorts who accordingly had boats with full or 3/4 keels, and haven't done it since the old days anyway (ie, usually not a huge amount of useful detail beyond 'we did it once and it went fine although boy was I nervous').

[Caecilian 823]

we use them all the time, as long as you have a decent fin you're sweet. Make sure that its in sheltered water, no wakes etc and tie the boat off with a fender or two. No worries.

[MRS OCTOPUS 141]

My old club had one.

Make sure you are heeling slightly toward the piles and tend the mooring lines until hard aground.

Be careful. Have seen some classic stuff ups from the club bar , that overlooked the careening piles. With a 7 meter tidal movement you don’t get time for a second chance.

[TJSoCal 162]

Some advice and a video here

[Breamerly 85]

35 minutes ago, TJSoCal said:

Some advice and a video here

Hey, that's great! Thank you!

[Breamerly 85]

45 minutes ago, TJSoCal said:

Some advice and a video here

One thing they mention that I was wondering about is supporting it fore and aft - he mentions potentially using a stand or something under the bow, although he doesn't actually do that (you can see it in the pics).

In theory you don't need to do this, I guess, because the center of gravity is inevitably very close to the center of the boat, fore-and-aft wise - but again, my deficit of experience means that's only theory, and we all know how I feel about that.

I assume you could get a good deal of f/a stability out of your lines, too, if you used quite heavy ones, and doubled them up. 

Again with the assuming though - even worse than theory.

[TJSoCal 162]

No experience but I think he was talking about rounded keels, I expect a fin keel with a flat bottom would tend to stand on her keel. But if it were me I think I'd make sure to keep weight out of the ends and not do a lot of jumping around topsides.

[Breamerly 85]

6 minutes ago, TJSoCal said:

No experience but I think he was talking about rounded keels, I expect a fin keel with a flat bottom would tend to stand on her keel. But if it were me I think I'd make sure to keep weight out of the ends and not do a lot of jumping around topsides.

Heh. Indeed with the topsides.

Here's another one, albeit on a besotted, awful venue haha:

https://www.sailnet.com/threads/the-delicate-art-of-careening.20121/

Mostly a sea tail but at least some useful bits

[European Bloke 512]

We used to do this a lot when I was a kid. Usually it was easy on occasions a ship went past as you were settling, the wake arrived and it all went a bit tits up...

[Innocent Bystander 960]

Done it a few time in the NW with careening piles on a community pier.  Conditions are key. Some pitch to the bottom is handy.  Survey at low time the day before.  Come in as late as you dare to minimize the  the time you are able to “bounce” as the tide comes back up be set to slide a boat length or so into deeper water as soon as you float. Always seemed that chop or wakes would show up just as you refloated. 

[Miffy 2,140]

Don’t forget to put a line around the mast to control the heel of the boat towards the piling. 

[Innocent Bystander 960]

Yep. I used bow line, stern line and 2 halyards to the pier. Halyards came off when I had about 4” left before refloating. 
 

[Breamerly 85]

11 hours ago, Innocent Bystander said:

Done it a few time in the NW with careening piles on a community pier.  Conditions are key. Some pitch to the bottom is handy.  Survey at low time the day before.  Come in as late as you dare to minimize the  the time you are able to “bounce” as the tide comes back up be set to slide a boat length or so into deeper water as soon as you float. Always seemed that chop or wakes would show up just as you refloated. 

All makes good sense. Was that on a fin keel?

 

Also have you ever used the grid(pilez on Bainbridge or at poulsbo?

[Panoramix 1,449]

I've done it along a concrete ramp several times. As long as the keel is not too narrow, it is easy. You get the crew to stand on the rail to induce a few degrees of heel toward the quay just before the keel touches the bottom so that the boat rests on its keel and its fenders. Halyard would be used as a safety but obviously you need to remove it (or secure it right along the edge which is not that effective) when people want to use the ramp. I saw one boat fall over but that was because they hadn't heeled her properly so were relying on a halyard plus the owner told his 12 year old son "please hold the halyard while I secure the other one!", came a gust and over she went! The travel lift operator was pressuring them to clear the path. He got himself one more job as the boat ended up leaking with broken floor ribs.

[Innocent Bystander 960]

9 hours ago, Breamerly said:

21 hours ago, Innocent Bystander said:

Done it a few time in the NW with careening piles on a community pier.  Conditions are key. Some pitch to the bottom is handy.  Survey at low time the day before.  Come in as late as you dare to minimize the  the time you are able to “bounce” as the tide comes back up be set to slide a boat length or so into deeper water as soon as you float. Always seemed that chop or wakes would show up just as you refloated. 

All makes good sense. Was that on a fin keel?

 

Also have you ever used the grid(pilez on Bainbridge or at poulsbo?

Fin keel. 5'6" draft.   10,500 # boat. 

I was in Brownsville Marina so used the Illahee Dock.  There used to be some  piles set proud of the face along the south side of that pier about 1/3 of the way out.  Don't know if they are still there or if you are allowed to use them.  Back then (1994) you could clean the prop, change zincs and do a light wipe but no scrubbing or painting.  I did prop, zinc and changed a through hull fitting that was weeping.