SurleySailor 0 Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 Just found out that Pantaneus is exiting the US market and we need to find another insurer for our boat. Does anyone have any recommendations, we cruise LIS and race regularly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChuteFirst 7 Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 Just found out my Lloyds insurer thru Novamar (Mexican West coast & Sea of Cortez) is exiting as well, so no help from me. Let’s hope someone will respond here. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sail4beer 2,419 Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 Being a BOATUS member in NJ I have the option of either Geico or Progressive insurance. With Geico, my annual bill was reduced by 50%. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Commercial Boater 84 Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 I got my insurance in MA through Geico, which does it with BoatUS. I got a good discount because I already use Geico for car insurance. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisJD 100 Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 Went through this with Pantaenius back in the spring. FYI there's some good info in the thread about the finer points of some of the other providers. We ended up going with Chubb because I didn't want to worry about being depreciated out of coverage for a non-total loss, and on the recommendation of my yard from having worked with various insurers; I had to get a new survey, but apart from that the quote was reasonable and the agent (Mark Gargula at Gowrie in Newport) was a pleasure to work with. Geico's quote, interestingly, was actually higher than Chubb's, even though I got a lot of please-don't-use-Geicos from friends who've dealt with them on the claims side. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
efrank 95 Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 I've always had boat insurance through Allstate. Seemed pretty reasonable. Had an F-27 insured for $630/yr. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sail4beer 2,419 Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 On 8/11/2020 at 1:40 PM, ChrisJD said: Went through this with Pantaenius back in the spring. FYI there's some good info in the thread about the finer points of some of the other providers. We ended up going with Chubb because I didn't want to worry about being depreciated out of coverage for a non-total loss, and on the recommendation of my yard from having worked with various insurers; I had to get a new survey, but apart from that the quote was reasonable and the agent (Mark Gargula at Gowrie in Newport) was a pleasure to work with. Geico's quote, interestingly, was actually higher than Chubb's, even though I got a lot of please-don't-use-Geicos from friends who've dealt with them on the claims side. I have to follow up on a quote from Mark about my cutter, he’s a good guy to work with from a recommendation from WoodenBoat. Gowrie is a good choice for cruisers and one design sailors Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cristoforo 437 Posted August 13, 2020 Share Posted August 13, 2020 On 8/10/2020 at 11:41 PM, SurleySailor said: Just found out that Pantaneus is exiting the US market and we need to find another insurer for our boat. Does anyone have any recommendations, we cruise LIS and race regularly. Do you go offshore? Bermuda? If not Allstate, Progressive, Geico are fine. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sail69 117 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 On 8/11/2020 at 1:22 PM, Commercial Boater said: I got my insurance in MA through Geico, which does it with BoatUS. I got a good discount because I already use Geico for car insurance. I dropped Boat/US and Geico because of depreciated claims. Read the fine print. 20% of replacement costs on older boats does not work for me. And they did the carrier change without notice. Read the fine print. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Commercial Boater 84 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 1 hour ago, sail69 said: I dropped Boat/US and Geico because of depreciated claims. Read the fine print. 20% of replacement costs on older boats does not work for me. And they did the carrier change without notice. Read the fine print. I did read the fine print I only carry liability insurance as my boat is so small & cheap, and I am so young, that annual hull loss or replacement premiums are more than 25% of the boat's total value. Geico gave competitive coverage for the price (although it's always a question if they'll pay out, but I think all insurers try to shaft you this way) and they had already made the BoatUS switch by the time I got my policy. Reading the fine print is always good advice though! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jim in Halifax 270 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 It seems that insuring a vessel in the US is different than elsewhere? It sound more like you are insuring a car. In Canada the constructive total loss value of the policy is based on the survey and valuation provided by an accredited marine surveyor...if he/she determines your boat is worth $XXXXX, then that's the hull and machinery value in your policy is and the premium is based on that sum. If damage is less than that, the amount is determined by an adjusting surveyor and repair quotes. Not sure how the liability premium is calculated but I'm pretty sure that its also some % rate of the total liability coverage. WTF is with the depreciation on older hulls? Surely the surveyor takes age under consideration in his valuation... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Commercial Boater 84 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 54 minutes ago, Jim in Halifax said: It seems that insuring a vessel in the US is different than elsewhere? It sound more like you are insuring a car. In Canada the constructive total loss value of the policy is based on the survey and valuation provided by an accredited marine surveyor...if he/she determines your boat is worth $XXXXX, then that's the hull and machinery value in your policy is and the premium is based on that sum. If damage is less than that, the amount is determined by an adjusting surveyor and repair quotes. Not sure how the liability premium is calculated but I'm pretty sure that its also some % rate of the total liability coverage. WTF is with the depreciation on older hulls? Surely the surveyor takes age under consideration in his valuation... I'm far from an expert on insurance, much less the international insurance market, but I do know some things from recent experience and have several adjuster friends. My understanding is that, unlike car insurance where the massive market and high rate of owning insurance (200+ million cars in the US) means companies can make good profits on small margins, there are far fewer private boats than cars in the US and a much lower proportion carry insurance. As a result many boat companies don't care about old, relatively inexpensive boats (particularly sailboats which are generally cheaper than powerboats) because they make most of their money on insuring new or nearly new boats, or on commercial policies for working vessels. Companies' valuation algorithms are built to minimize losses insuring old, highly depreciated boats through providing tiny "actual cash value" (what a euphemism!) estimates which can differ hugely from purchase price or surveyed values. If you'd rather provide your own survey and name an "agreed-upon value", they're more than happy to triple your premium as a result. See the recent Pantaenius move to drop coverage of old boats, and Geico cutting its maritime insurance for BoatUS instead, as examples of how these economics play out. Specific to my case, since I'm an unmarried 24 y.o. man, my premiums are based more on my demographic risk of fucking up than the actual value of my Catalina 22. I was quoted $1,200 a year for replacement coverage based on "actual cash value" and refused coverage on an "agreed-upon value" basis. My liability policy premium is about one tenth of my quoted replacement policy premiums. This is despite my owning 2 boats, having more than 4000 hours at sea, having every credential short of a Captain's license, and having verifiably worked on boats for at least 1 decade! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zonker 2,984 Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 Many cheaper boats in Canada are insured on "actual cash value", especially if you go through a non-marine broker. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SASSAFRASS 611 Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 There are quite a few good threads on insurance in here. Still lots of good options out there Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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