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When offered the Vaccine, will you take it?


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12 hours ago, EYESAILOR said:

Sickle Center Disease (SCD) who had not been vaccinated.

Are you guys only rolling out one version of CoCax ?

OZ has at least 2 , AZ for over 60's and now for those under who so desire and pfizer

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The private sector has embarked on a major campaign to reassure the public that they will not release a vaccine until they are confident it is safe and effective. We can expect a joint statement from

As many of you know I am right of center politically.  I dont think vaccines are a political issue or at least they should not be.  My family are all vaccinated. I tried to think of how I should

You are such a bag of shit wrapped in a thin veneer of pseudo self esteem. You are a walking around killer of strangers free riding on those who got vaccinated. Sponger.

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11 minutes ago, Mid said:

Are you guys only rolling out one version of CoCax ?

OZ has at least 2 , AZ for over 60's and now for those under who so desire and pfizer

We have 3. I think the point is the person with sickle cell is worried about all of them after a flu shot episode. Hopefully more data can help determine if the 2 mRNAs, a different kind of vaccine than used for flu shots, will be more benign for SCD. 

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3 hours ago, NeedAClew said:

We have 3. I think the point is the person with sickle cell is worried about all of them after a flu shot episode. Hopefully more data can help determine if the 2 mRNAs, a different kind of vaccine than used for flu shots, will be more benign for SCD. 

The best way to reassure SCD patients is for their own trusted organization provide independent advice. The SCDAA has a page devoted to covid. To their credit they have dedicated a section of the website to covid and the vaccine , and they have produced a webinar for their members which very carefully outlines the benefits and risks. They also have a Medical And Research Advisory Committee of 33 physicians and senior medical researchers expert in SCD who have produced a statement.   I admire the balanced and independent approach.  They conclude that patients should check that they are not allergic to Polyethylene Glycol (PEG) and otherwise they should get vaccinated. 

 

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4 hours ago, Mid said:

Are you guys only rolling out one version of CoCax ?

OZ has at least 2 , AZ for over 60's and now for those under who so desire and pfizer

We currently have 3 vaccines approved .  Pfizer, Moderna and J&J.  The Astra Zeneca/Oxford vaccine has not been approved n the US. The Novovax vaccine has not submitted its application yet but expects to shortly.    We have no shortages of vaccine. There is plenty available in USA. Our challenge is that 40% of the population has not signed up .

 

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I still think the very old over 75s should be getting mRNA in Australia, unless the plan is to give them mRNA as a "booster" before opening up and/or letting them out.  They are most at risk from getting covid.

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6 hours ago, NeedAClew said:

I still think the very old over 75s should be getting mRNA in Australia, unless the plan is to give them mRNA as a "booster" before opening up and/or letting them out.  They are most at risk from getting covid.

Australia has not been very efficient at vaccination. They did a better job than many with borders and localized shut downs.....but ultimately the only way out is vaccination because as long as Australia remains a global economy with an under vaccinated population it will remain vulnerable.

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9 hours ago, NeedAClew said:

I still think the very old over 75s should be getting mRNA in Australia, unless the plan is to give them mRNA as a "booster" before opening up and/or letting them out.  They are most at risk from getting covid.

There's talk of Moderna being the booster.....

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18 hours ago, EYESAILOR said:

We currently have 3 vaccines approved .  Pfizer, Moderna and J&J.  The Astra Zeneca/Oxford vaccine has not been approved n the US. The Novovax vaccine has not submitted its application yet but expects to shortly.    We have no shortages of vaccine. There is plenty available in USA. Our challenge is that 40% of the population has not signed up .

 

if it was announced that  excess will be given to some "shithole country" if no one else wants it, it would soon see those sleeves rolled up.

(that includes any country with excess)

If the old have had their chance of a Pfizer give it to the young and the vaccineless.

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17 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

if it was announced that  excess will be given to some "shithole country" if no one else wants it, it would soon see those sleeves rolled up.

(that includes any country with excess)

If the old have had their chance of a Pfizer give it to the young and the vaccineless.

The US has donated approximately 80 million doses. A large part of that was Astra/Oxford vaccine because we have vaccines approaching expiry date and the A/O vaccine has still not been approved in the US. 

This is a drop in the ocean vs the huge number of vaccines required to vaccinate Africa and Latin America.

We may suppress the disease in the developed world but the risk is that the virus continues to reside in a large populations in poorer less developed regions of the world , mutates and remerges as future waves/epidemics 

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18 minutes ago, IPLore said:

The US has donated approximately 80 million doses. A large part of that was Astra/Oxford vaccine because we have vaccines approaching expiry date and the A/O vaccine has still not been approved in the US. 

This is a drop in the ocean vs the huge number of vaccines required to vaccinate Africa and Latin America.

We may suppress the disease in the developed world but the risk is that the virus continues to reside in a large populations in poorer less developed regions of the world , mutates and remerges as future waves/epidemics 

I think you missed my point.

Some of those "hesitant" would have to choose.

Take the shot or give them away to Mooslims. 

You know which 30% I'm talking about
 

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1 minute ago, Shortforbob said:

I think you missed my point.

Some of those "hesitant" would have to choose.

Take the shot or give them away to Mooslims. 

You know which 30% I'm talking about
 

I did miss that point.

I dont think that strategy would work.  Those that believe the vaccine is either dangerous or carries nanochips so that the Government and Bill Gates can track you are probably fine with the doses going to Indonesia.

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11 minutes ago, IPLore said:

I did miss that point.

I dont think that strategy would work.  Those that believe the vaccine is either dangerous or carries nanochips so that the Government and Bill Gates can track you are probably fine with the doses going to Indonesia.

Or Palestine

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-57525252

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5 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

The Israeli / Palestinian conflict is incredibly depressing.  It has been ongoing news my entire adult life and is further from a solution than ever. I try to just ignore it.  Covid probably just highlights the problems and differences.    I guess we focus on rolling out the vaccine in our respective countries and hop that other countries do the same. 

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Today on Meet The Press (not available yet online, sorry) first up Dr. Fauci who once again patiently answers questions and explains in an easy to follow and understand manner.  Bottom line, it's a global pandemic and we are all in this together, the longer it continues to more chances of new and more dangerous variants i.e. Delta.   2nd guy - don't remember his name, Dr. Seth Rogan? jk, first name is Seth with Covax discussing the global situation with the pandemic, there are now 9 vaccines, soon to be 11 or 12, if the wealthy countries donate their excess to the poor countries how much faster it can be controlled, the US did just that for Honduras last week. 

Anyway, when this is available, it's half an hour, informative and everyone should watch it.

Lastly, I wish to thank the mods for cleaning up the covidiots in this space and making it where discussions can take place. Please keep politics out of it, there is an entire forum here for that.

Thanks,

Miss Management

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I agree that those who spread blatant misinformation and introduce politics should not be on this thread. We know who most of them are.

However, I think it is important not to silence the vaccine hesitant, because if we dont hear their concerns how can we respond to them.

We should also acknowledge that there will be bumps along the road to vaccination, and we should not be afraid to share bad news and adjust our views.

I have been fairly transparent.  I am a Republican voter who supports vaccination and my family have all chosen to be vaccinated.  I might disagree with many of my Democrat SA fellow sailors and posters about the best way to manage the economy and run the country but I hope we are all united in wanting to beat Covid 19.  I believe that the vaccine trials were thorough and extensive and the benefits of vaccination far outweigh the small risks.  Obviously we will know more about the disease and more about the vaccines in a year's time and more again a year after that.  But we cannot afford to wait for perfect knowledge. Medicine is not like that.....it is a journey. Cancer and heart disease will have better treatments in 10 years than we have now......but at this moment in time we must take advantage of the best treatments and best preventive medicine that we have available.

The best we have available for covid are the vaccines.  They significantly reduce the probability of catching covid, and if I do catch covid, the probability of severe covid is significantly reduced. So I and my peers are immunized via the vaccine.

I am not going to blindly admire vaccines.  I fully expect some of them to be discarded either because they turn out not to be as effective as the best vaccines or because they have more adverse effects than the best vaccines.   I dont think the first round of vaccinations will have many adverse events but going forward I suspect we will be taking booster shots for quite a few more years, so I hope research continues to distinguish the vaccines with the best safety record.

I hope we find some successful anti-virals to suppress a full viral attack for those who still catch covid.  But this thread is about the vaccine not anti-virals.

 

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On the good news front, the JNJ single shot vaccine is effective vs the Delta Variant and at the 8 month mark of the trial, it remains effective (antibodies have actually increased not diminished from the 29day mark)   JNJ-update  

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I have yet to hear any valid concerns about the 3 vaccines for the US, YMMV.  NeedaClew just nailed it. Dr. Fauci in the interview I mentioned above covers the concerns - also that there is no 100% vaccine so it's necessary to understand the risks especially in situations where there could be a substantial viral load.

The biggest threat is the asymptomatic spreaders, something not seen before and the major cause of the initial spread last year, now that we know there really is no excuse for being one.  In 6 months we have gone from bribing/scrambling to get it to those who just don't think it's worth it.

Science can be hard, so is math in understanding risks as demonstrated in our society.

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1 hour ago, d'ranger said:

 

The biggest threat is the asymptomatic spreaders, something not seen before and the major cause of the initial spread last year,

 

 

The concern with Covid 19 is that it can be transmitted by  pre-symptomatic and asymptomatic  hosts.

Viral studies suggest that SARS-CoV-2 production peaks before symptoms appear.

There has been a lot of research to see if this results in a majority of transmission prior to symptoms or from asymptomatic carriers. Initial studies suggested this might be the case.  It was also backed up by the simple fact that quarantining symptomatic covid cases did not work in containing the disease.

The research has mixed results and needs detailed follow up on contact tracing.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7310638/ 

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Indeed, yes.  I am not a doctor but did a JHU contact tracing course in 2020 and learned that.  That's why the whole temperature taking theater thing only weeds out the really sick who should know better, not the hapless unknowing spreaders. 

Was also surprised to read in a Sydney paper (I get it in my news feed) that Australia is NOW shifint from a "droplet" to "aerosol" model of contagion prevention eg a couple of meters distancing not enough in poorly ventilated spaces.  Egad!  I forget when we were told that but it was long before the end of 2020. 

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10 hours ago, d'ranger said:

Today on Meet The Press (not available yet online, sorry) first up Dr. Fauci who once again patiently answers questions and explains in an easy to follow and understand manner.  Bottom line, it's a global pandemic and we are all in this together, the longer it continues to more chances of new and more dangerous variants i.e. Delta.   2nd guy - don't remember his name, Dr. Seth Rogan? jk, first name is Seth with Covax discussing the global situation with the pandemic, there are now 9 vaccines, soon to be 11 or 12, if the wealthy countries donate their excess to the poor countries how much faster it can be controlled, the US did just that for Honduras last week. 

Anyway, when this is available, it's half an hour, informative and everyone should watch it.

Lastly, I wish to thank the mods for cleaning up the covidiots in this space and making it where discussions can take place. Please keep politics out of it, there is an entire forum here for that.

Thanks,

Miss Management

The problems with a gravity well…..  our feet might not age as fast as our head, but….

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7 hours ago, NeedAClew said:

Was also surprised to read in a Sydney paper (I get it in my news feed) that Australia is NOW shifint from a "droplet" to "aerosol" model of contagion prevention eg a couple of meters distancing not enough in poorly ventilated spaces.  Egad!  I forget when we were told that but it was long before the end of 2020. 

Egad...Australia is so dumb that we've had 900 people die!! 900!!:rolleyes:

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9 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

Egad...Australia is so dumb that we've had 900 people die!! 900!!:rolleyes:

Australia has done a superb job in preventing a major outbreak and securing your borders vs Covid, especially since you were so close to the original source. 

I think it helped at the margin that it was summer when covid first started to spread globally, and gave you a bit more reaction time. But nonetheless it was a prompt response.

Having done well thus far, your challenge is now to get vaccinated. You dont have 10-20% of the population that is already partially immune due to catching covid.  I havent followed Australian news closely but hopefully you avoid the vaccine scare mongering that we have had in the USA and can get yourselves safe asap. 

 

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3 minutes ago, IPLore said:

Australia has done a superb job in preventing a major outbreak and securing your borders vs Covid, especially since you were so close to the original source. 

I think it helped at the margin that it was summer when covid first started to spread globally, and gave you a bit more reaction time. But nonetheless it was a prompt response.

Having done well thus far, your challenge is now to get vaccinated. You dont have 10-20% of the population that is already partially immune due to catching covid.  I havent followed Australian news closely but hopefully you avoid the vaccine scare mongering that we have had in the USA and can get yourselves safe asap. 

 

Currently Australia is lagging substantially in covid vaccination.  38/38 in OECD.   

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On 7/4/2021 at 7:47 PM, IPLore said:

It has been ongoing news my entire adult life and is further from a solution than ever

Bruh, the phrase "peace in the middle east" has been relevant for like 4000 years. It is only going to happen via 2 ways, an Adam Sandler movie featuring an Israeli Spy relocating to the USA the cut hair... or the decimation of every living person in the region from all but one faction.

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On 7/4/2021 at 11:53 AM, IPLore said:

I agree that those who spread blatant misinformation and introduce politics should not be on this thread. We know who most of them are.

However, I think it is important not to silence the vaccine hesitant, because if we dont hear their concerns how can we respond to them.

We should also acknowledge that there will be bumps along the road to vaccination, and we should not be afraid to share bad news and adjust our views.

I have been fairly transparent.  I am a Republican voter who supports vaccination and my family have all chosen to be vaccinated.  I might disagree with many of my Democrat SA fellow sailors and posters about the best way to manage the economy and run the country but I hope we are all united in wanting to beat Covid 19.  I believe that the vaccine trials were thorough and extensive and the benefits of vaccination far outweigh the small risks.  Obviously we will know more about the disease and more about the vaccines in a year's time and more again a year after that.  But we cannot afford to wait for perfect knowledge. Medicine is not like that.....it is a journey. Cancer and heart disease will have better treatments in 10 years than we have now......but at this moment in time we must take advantage of the best treatments and best preventive medicine that we have available.

The best we have available for covid are the vaccines.  They significantly reduce the probability of catching covid, and if I do catch covid, the probability of severe covid is significantly reduced. So I and my peers are immunized via the vaccine.

I am not going to blindly admire vaccines.  I fully expect some of them to be discarded either because they turn out not to be as effective as the best vaccines or because they have more adverse effects than the best vaccines.   I dont think the first round of vaccinations will have many adverse events but going forward I suspect we will be taking booster shots for quite a few more years, so I hope research continues to distinguish the vaccines with the best safety record.

I hope we find some successful anti-virals to suppress a full viral attack for those who still catch covid.  But this thread is about the vaccine not anti-virals.

 

 

On 7/4/2021 at 1:49 PM, EYESAILOR said:

 

The concern with Covid 19 is that it can be transmitted by  pre-symptomatic and asymptomatic  hosts.

Viral studies suggest that SARS-CoV-2 production peaks before symptoms appear.

There has been a lot of research to see if this results in a majority of transmission prior to symptoms or from asymptomatic carriers. Initial studies suggested this might be the case.  It was also backed up by the simple fact that quarantining symptomatic covid cases did not work in containing the disease.

The research has mixed results and needs detailed follow up on contact tracing.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7310638/ 

OMG.  So what?!

At some point this comes down to the inescapable fact of you wanting somebody else to do something they don't want to do and take some risk that they don't want to take (for whatever reason that is none of your business) because you think you know better what is right for them... or even worse because you are scared for you and/or incapable of taking care of yourself.

Good grief.  You are vaccinated.  Viruses are part of life. 

How about just stop telling other people what to do and getting on with your life and getting out of theirs?  What is so hard about that?

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7 minutes ago, Wess said:

 

OMG.  So what?!

At some point this comes down to the inescapable fact of you wanting somebody else to do something they don't want to do and take some risk that they don't want to take (for whatever reason that is none of your business) because you think you know better what is right for them... or even worse because you are scared for you and/or incapable of taking care of yourself.

Good grief.  You are vaccinated.  Viruses are part of life. 

How about just stop telling other people what to do and getting on with your life and getting out of theirs?  What is so hard about that?

Wess.......

I assume you were referring to me.

You ask so what?    Someone posted that the virus was being transmitted by the asymptomatic .   I attached a research article which estimated how much was being transmitted by asymptomatic, pre-symptomatic and symptomatic.  The poster was partly right and partly wrong. I thought it would be helpful.

Then you post that I "want somebody else to do something they don't want to do and take some risk that they don't want to take"  .    So let me clarify.  I am sharing my view that I recommend folks get vaccinated. I am not shy about that. I am not telling someone what to do. 

I am fully aware that some people will not be taking the vaccine due to specific risks. However I am looking at the overall statistics. Approximately 40% of the US population has not been vaccinated.  The vaccine hesitant has a disproportionate number of ethnic minorities and less educated who are in many cases scared due to misinformation.  This SA thread will not reach that population but I think that people are entitled to make an educated decision about whether to get vaccinated, and I support efforts to explain the vaccine in an honest and open manner.

There are approximately three categories of people:

1. Those that actively support the vaccine protocol.  They encourage their friends to get vaccinated.  They push back on misinformation about the vaccine.  Some even generate misinformation themselves.

2. Those that dont care whether we get vaccinated or not .  (I think you fall into this category but I dont want to define your views...so maybe not) .  They think each individual can choose and nobody should tell or inform anyone else about what to do.

3. Those that are anti-covid vaccine for a range of reasons. They believe it is dangerous. They think the government is inserting microchips into our arms. They think a better alternative exists in Ivermectin. They believe the risks outweigh the benefits.  etc.   Some base their decisions on a balanced view of information. Some are subject to misinformation.

I fall into category 1.  I encourage people to get vaccinated . I dont mandate it. Currently  I will see patients who are not vaccinated.

I feel the same way about colonoscopy. I encourage people over 55 to have a colonoscopy and women to have mammograms.  Many choose not to.  I think it is foolish not to. Its my view and my recommendation.  

 

 

 

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I know. I heard. Like for the 200th time now. 

Saying it once, twice or three time maybe is expressing a view.

My view is once it exceeds 100 times it becomes preaching and likely does more harm (to your cause) than good.

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2 hours ago, Wess said:

 

OMG.  So what?!

At some point this comes down to the inescapable fact of you wanting somebody else to do something they don't want to do and take some risk that they don't want to take (for whatever reason that is none of your business) because you think you know better what is right for them... or even worse because you are scared for you and/or incapable of taking care of yourself.

Good grief.  You are vaccinated.  Viruses are part of life. 

How about just stop telling other people what to do and getting on with your life and getting out of theirs?  What is so hard about that?

You quoted me and Eye in the same post.  Yes, I have been vaccinated.

I posted that I was concerned if we censor the people who have chosen not to get vaccinated. I am open to hearing their POV, provided it does not include blatant disinformation.

I was happy to disclose that I have been vaccinated because I wanted to be clear that I am not anti-vaccine, I just like to hear both sides of the debate.

Question for you @Wess.  We go back a long way.  You argue consistently that your major stance is that each individual should be able to take their own decision. So my question is......what decision did you personally take?   The forum has assumed that you are not taking the vaccine and that you argue against preaching because you are anti-vaxx.  I'm not so sure. I notice that all you are saying is "freedom of choice" and you have not said "I choose not to get vaccinated". (Kate has said she will refuse vaccination)

So my question for you brother Wess is,  What decision did you make for yourself?  Did you get vaccinated for covid?  Will you get  vaccinated for covid?

That decision will not influence others, but it might let us understand where you are coming from in your "freedom of choice" debate.

 

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2 hours ago, Wess said:

... or even worse because you are scared for you and/or incapable of taking care of yourself.

...

Deconstructing this statement is important.

Your thesis is that people are getting the vaccine because they are scared of catching the virus and worried their immune system is not strong enough to fight it off.  

I submit that your thesis is incorrect.  People are getting the vaccine because the data shows that it is effective in preventing hospitalization and death.  The vanishingly small number of negative reactions to the vaccine vs. the significantly higher probability of a negative outcome from catching the virus makes the choice easy.  It is simply logical to get the vaccine. 

The real fear in this situation is being generated by misinformation about the vaccine.  The people who are truly afraid are those who have "heard something" online about the vaccine and focus on that, rather than the actual data.  Fear of the vaccine is a significant problem, and the low vaccination rate in the US is a consequence of that fear.  

It is important to understand why we keep responding to your posts.  Many believe that allowing the virus to continue in the wild will lead to more variants.  We want to see the virus stamped out as best we can.  We don't want to see more people's lives damaged by it.  So, it is important that we push back on anything that we believe may influence people to make what we consider to be a wrong decision.

 

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11 minutes ago, Rain Man said:

Deconstructing this statement is important.

Your thesis is that people are getting the vaccine because they are scared of catching the virus and worried their immune system is not strong enough to fight it off.  

I submit that your thesis is incorrect.  People are getting the vaccine because the data shows that it is effective in preventing hospitalization and death. 

 

 

Speaking for myself.

Scared/worried/concerned all sorta mean the same thing to me.  I dont scare easily but I am honest enough to admit I was  concerned not to get the virus so I got vaccinated.

In life, a healthy fear and respect of danger means taking the right precautions so that you can take the right risk.

I have been vaccinated before so that I can travel to exciting places in the world. Would it have been safer not to go at all? probably, but getting vaccinated made it safer .  A healthy respect for danger is a good thing. I see getting vaccinated in a similar light to safety lines on boats and being taking proper precautions before going hiking back country. 

Where I differ from Wess and where a covid vaccinatio is different to taking measures purely to mitigate my own risk, is that getting vaccinated has a community impact.  The nation has been negatively impacted by covid and I dont mind doing my bit.

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18 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

The poster who labels those who fear the virus as pussies is afraid to get the vaccine.

It is actually that simple.

^ this ^

First it was "reasonable doubt," then it was misinformation, then it was full-blown anti-vaxx hysteria, now it's pretensions to moral superiority and name-calling.

36 minutes ago, Rain Man said:
3 hours ago, Wess said:

... ...

...

It is important to understand why we keep responding to your posts.  ...

Because you're easily trolled.

Don't feel bad, I went a really really long way trying to provide calm factual explanations to these dumbasses. The one with real saintly patience is EYESAILOR.

But now I just shrug, the virus they insist is a hoax is killing them at a 99.2-to-1 ratio. And it's ramping up to kill more of both, which is the real tragedy.

- DSK

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17 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

The poster who labels those who fear the virus as pussies is afraid to get the vaccine.

It is actually that simple.

Do you really think that Wess is afraid to get the virus?

I dont!

I think he likes to provoke the pro-vaccine lobby!

Wess.....have you been vaccinated?

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1 hour ago, IPLore said:

Do you really think that Wess is afraid to get the virus   vaccine?

I dont!

I think he likes to provoke the pro-vaccine lobby!

Wess.....have you been vaccinated?

ooops typo on my part.

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None of your or anyone else's business.

And for those who can't read, I had the virus.

At some point you will have to get over the fact that you have no right to tell anyone else to get or not get vaccinated. 

But yes its fun to "poke the pussies."

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1 hour ago, Steam Flyer said:
1 hour ago, d'ranger said:

The poster who labels those who fear the virus as pussies is afraid to get the vaccine.

It is actually that simple.

^ this ^

First it was "reasonable doubt," then it was misinformation, then it was full-blown anti-vaxx hysteria, now it's pretensions to moral superiority and name-calling.

Perfect summary of this thread and its troll, if you're just joining us.

I hope, in my lifetime, to see us return to the age of reason.

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1 minute ago, Wess said:

None of your or anyone else's business.

And for those who can't read, I had the virus.

 

Hi Wess,

Obviously my first thought is that I am very glad that you recovered.

I cant help notice that you still avoid sharing your decision on vaccination.

A while back I predicted that if you had taken the vaccine, your response would be "none of your business". 

Part of this forum is sharing our experiences and how we took our decisions.  Kate has said he did not take the vaccine.  You have said it should be up to each individual.....which does not stop you taking the vaccine.  I was curious if you reached a decision or remain in no-mans land.

Anyway, I'm happy to be transparent.  I believe in the right of the individual. I exercised that right by getting vaccinated. I cannot offer anything like the same level of medical insight and data that others have on this forum so its not my place to advise others. 

Im grateful to those more knowledgeable who have shared articles but since my vaccine lasts at least a year, I dont have to take another decision .   The next big personal decision will be whether to have the booster shot or not.

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47 minutes ago, IPLore said:

Hi Wess,

Obviously my first thought is that I am very glad that you recovered.

I cant help notice that you still avoid sharing your decision on vaccination.

A while back I predicted that if you had taken the vaccine, your response would be "none of your business". 

Part of this forum is sharing our experiences and how we took our decisions.  Kate has said he did not take the vaccine.  You have said it should be up to each individual.....which does not stop you taking the vaccine.  I was curious if you reached a decision or remain in no-mans land.

Anyway, I'm happy to be transparent.  I believe in the right of the individual. I exercised that right by getting vaccinated. I cannot offer anything like the same level of medical insight and data that others have on this forum so its not my place to advise others. 

Im grateful to those more knowledgeable who have shared articles but since my vaccine lasts at least a year, I dont have to take another decision .   The next big personal decision will be whether to have the booster shot or not.

So its clear I really don't care about true friends knowing my vaccine status (they all know).  But I equally believe in health care - actually all aspects of life - privacy rights, so I will not answer here.  Give a shout on PM if it somehow matters and I will answer so long as you agree to not put it here.

But yes I reached a decision. Multiple times LOL.  Because of what I do I could have gotten it very early.  My no thanks then was simply a matter of not before those including my parents who needed it.  Could not even conceive of doing that.   Then I had covid so it was rather pointless (bit more to this but not going into it here but I was at near zero risk of anything covid related).  I do laugh at "glad that you recovered" because it was a complete non event.  Not saying hoax.  But for the dozens I personally know that got it, it was the same, and the stats bear this out... if you are young and healthy you are at such low covid mortality risk that its almost certain you are doing something else in normal life that puts you are greater risk of death.  But eventually me getting vaccinated would not block anyone else getting it and so another decision... which I am not sharing here (PM if you like). 

Bottom line is that I believe health care is personal choice.  And that those who push this are far bigger scum than anyone opting to not take it for whatever reason they decide. 

The ones that really crack me up are those who think others should do it for the common good... which really translates to their own scared of their shadow good.  Same overweight couch potato sissies that can't run a few miles, do a few push-ups or live a healthy lifestyle.  They ain't my problem.

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Wess said:

The ones that really crack me up are those who think others should do it for the common good... which really translates to their own scared of their shadow good.  Same overweight couch potato pussies that can't run a few miles, do a few push-ups or live a healthy lifestyle.  They ain't my problem.

For that combination of poor reasoning and selfishness you deserve a custom vaccination

In defence of branding cattle: Albertan ranchers on a burning tradition -  The Globe and Mail

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11 minutes ago, Wess said:

So its clear I really don't care about true friends knowing my vaccine status (they all know).  But I equally believe in health care - actually all aspects of life - privacy rights, so I will not answer here.  Give a shout on PM if it somehow matters and I will answer so long as you agree to not put it here.

But yes I reached a decision. Multiple times LOL.  Because of what I do I could have gotten it very early.  My no thanks then was simply a matter of not before those including my parents who needed it.  Could not even conceive of doing that.   Then I had covid so it was rather pointless (bit more to this but not going into it here but I was at near zero risk of anything covid related).  I do laugh at "glad that you recovered" because it was a complete non event.  Not saying hoax.     ....   ...

Earlier, you did say it was a hoax. When I asked what you meant by that, no answer.

Glad you didn't die, more than 600,000 Americans were not so lucky. And many many many of them were younger and healthier than you; furthermore (as cited many times) younger healthier people have long term... probably life-long... health complications such as heart/lung or liver damage.

So yeah, can't do math... just here to troll the libtards.... got it

- DSK

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5 minutes ago, Wess said:

So its clear I really don't care about true friends knowing my vaccine status (they all know).  But I equally believe in health care - actually all aspects of life - privacy rights, so I will not answer here.  Give a shout on PM if it somehow matters and I will answer so long as you agree to not put it here.

But yes I reached a decision. Multiple times LOL.  Because of what I do I could have gotten it very early.  My no thanks then was simply a matter of not before those including my parents who needed it.  Could not even conceive of doing that.   Then I had covid so it was rather pointless (bit more to this but not going into it here but I was at near zero risk of anything covid related).  I do laugh at "glad that you recovered" because it was a complete non event.  Not saying hoax.  But for the dozens I personally know that got it, it was the same, and the stats bear this out... if you are young and healthy you are at such low covid mortality risk that its almost certain you are doing something else in normal life that puts you are greater risk of death.  But eventually me getting vaccinated would not block anyone else getting it and so another decision... which I am not sharing here (PM if you like). 

Bottom line is that I believe health care is personal choice.  And that those who push this are far bigger scum than anyone opting to not take it for whatever reason they decide. 

The ones that really crack me up are those who think others should do it for the common good... which really translates to their own scared of their shadow good.  Same overweight couch potato sissies that can't run a few miles, do a few push-ups or live a healthy lifestyle.  They ain't my problem.

 

 

 

Wess,

Healthcare involves many personal decisions.  Many of those decisions involve asking for and receiving advice on the options .   Mostly I hope that people making the vaccinate/Dont vaccinate decision make an informed decision and get their advice from the right place.

SA is not the right place.

However I dont think this thread is so much about personal advice , one to another, it is debating the various pros and cons of vaccination that we read about .  We challenge misinformation from both sides.

Its all good.

 

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20 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

Earlier, you did say it was a hoax. When I asked what you meant by that, no answer.

Glad you didn't die, more than 600,000 Americans were not so lucky. And many many many of them were younger and healthier than you; furthermore (as cited many times) younger healthier people have long term... probably life-long... health complications such as heart/lung or liver damage.

So yeah, can't do math... just here to troll the libtards.... got it

- DSK

Prove that and I will apologize.  If not you are a lying sack of shit.  I have never to the best of my recall ever called covid a hoax because its not. Overblown?  Yes.  Press and socialist democrat gold mine?  Yes.  Chinese?  Yes.  Hoax?  No.  

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13 minutes ago, EYESAILOR said:

Mostly I hope that people making the vaccinate/Dont vaccinate decision make an informed decision and get their advice from the right place.

The right place is wherever and whatever and whenever THEY want.  They don't have to drink your flavor of Kool Aid just because you like it and think its best.  Maybe they like beer instead of Kool Aid.

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If fit people don't get the virus, why have professional athletes had it? 

Do people seriously think that a "strong immune system" prevents someone from getting covid? From infecting others? Or is it that they think it results in asymptomatic covid for that person? What about asymptomatic infection?

What data do they have to prove eating right, being fit, whatever keeps covid away?  

 

 

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You need a clew on how to read. Who said healthy people don’t get it? Idiot. 

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27 minutes ago, Wess said:

Prove that and I will apologize.  If not you are a lying sack of shit.  I have never to the best of my recall ever called covid a hoax because its not. Overblown?  Yes.  Press and socialist democrat gold mine?  Yes.  Chinese?  Yes.  Hoax?  No.  

I apologize for my incorrectly accusing you of saying it was a hoax, you have said a couple of times that it was NOT a hoax (but overblown, scare tactics, etc... not the same thing)

This is not an excuse, but there is another poster using very similar rhetoric who has specifically used the "H" word and I confused you for them, and I am sorry to have done so.

- DSK

 

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1 minute ago, Steam Flyer said:

I apologize for my incorrectly accusing you of saying it was a hoax, you have said a couple of times that it was NOT a hoax (but overblown, scare tactics, etc... not the same thing)

This is not an excuse, but there is another poster using very similar rhetoric who has specifically used the "H" word and I confused you for them, and I am sorry to have done so.

- DSK

 

No worries. 

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26 minutes ago, Wess said:

Prove that and I will apologize.  If not you are a lying sack of shit.  I have never to the best of my recall ever called covid a hoax because its not. Overblown?  Yes.  Press and socialist democrat gold mine?  Yes.  Chinese?  Yes.  Hoax?  No.  

Hoax : No

Political Gold mine :  Sadly Yes. It should not be. Both sides of the extreme spectrum have mined covid.   I have become disgusted by the political tenor that has accompanied what should have been a public health crisis ....and I point fingers at both sides.

Chinese origin : Yes. Lab escape or transfer from animals? Unknown.

Overblown :   No.   Oh cummon Wess.   Over 600,000 Americans have died from Covid.  Over 4 million globally have died from Covid.  The economy was affected. Lives disrupted.  I recall when the pandemic first arrived in the USA, there were some on SA predicting it would be no worse than a bad flu season and saying it was all "overblown".

 

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Come on nothing. People die. Especially old and fat people. If this was contained to and only happening in Africa none of you would even give a shit no matter what the number.

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17 minutes ago, Wess said:

The right place is wherever and whatever and whenever THEY want.  They don't have to drink your flavor of Kool Aid just because you like it and think its best.  Maybe they like beer instead of Kool Aid.

You are naive .  There is some very bad advice out there than postures as expert medical advice.  There are bad actors giving bad financial advice.  Why do we have a lower hurdle for medical advice than we do for financial advice.

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1 minute ago, Wess said:

Come on nothing. People die. Especially old and fat people. If this was contained to and only happening in Africa none of you would even give a shit no matter what the number.

This is not limited to old , fat people.

I am pushing back because that is misleading.

People are entitled to stay fit and enjoy being older. 

We have a friend who lost his super fit 54 year old wife to covid. It was not overblown to him. It was a staggering setback.

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9 minutes ago, Wess said:

There you go again… more Kool Aid.

Apologies.  I have tried to avoid using personal examples because a sample of one is irrelevant.

So let me be more factual. Covid 19 mortality and long term effects are not limited to old people or obese people.

 

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Yellow journalism. Technically true statement that obscures and undermines the broader truth. And naturally biased toward your sky is falling get a vaccine and save me POV. Kool Aid. And my gosh you do go on. My macro is done running so I need to get back to work so feel free to blather on with more BS.

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3 minutes ago, Wess said:

My macro is done running so I need to get back to work so feel free to blather on with more BS.

That's what happens when someone gets fucked over by facts.

giphy.gif

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Please. You are the weakest link of all these morons. Yea sure the old and fat have nothing  extra to worry about from covid. You are a special type of stupid.

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5 minutes ago, EYESAILOR said:

Apologies.

Don't bother.  You'll never get a rational response from irrational people.

30 minutes ago, EYESAILOR said:

Both sides of the extreme spectrum have mined covid.

Inaccurate and unfair.  Responding to the Trump crowd is not the same as being one of them.  Not at all.

A week ago you "swore off this thread because the debate seems to go in circles covering the same points."  Yet you can't seem to resist trying to persuade people who have their heads up their asses.  Give up on fighting belligerent covidiots. They are hostile to knowledge and don't respect you so let them die.

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12 minutes ago, Wess said:

Please. You are the weakest link of all these morons. Yea sure the old and fat have nothing  extra to worry about from covid. You are a special type of stupid.

You still here?

giphy.gif

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1 hour ago, Wess said:

The ones that really crack me up are those who think others should do it for the common good... which really translates to their own scared of their shadow good. 

Because you are such a selfish cunt, you cannot understand the concept of "common good".  In order to process it you have to convert it to selfish terms, you decide they are really just scared.

What a sad cunt you are.  Must suck to be you.

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I know. You are right.  It does suck to be me. It’s miserable I tell you. You would not like my life at all. :P

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Thin, fit, young, brave libertarians understand negative externalities. 

Not being one, some on here hold up being available as a variant breeding ground as a virtue. 

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5 hours ago, Wess said:

Yellow journalism. Technically true statement that obscures and undermines the broader truth. And naturally biased toward your sky is falling get a vaccine and save me POV. Kool Aid. And my gosh you do go on. My macro is done running so I need to get back to work so feel free to blather on with more BS.

Like many, you have created your on-line persona as the person you would like to be, rather than the person you actually are.  

Otherwise, there would be no need for the boasts and the put-downs.  

My goodness, you know what a macro is!  Yet another attempt to impress.  What exactly is your insecurity that makes you do this?  Actually, we don't care.

It is fine that you mistakenly credit your fitness as the reason you recovered from covid.  That is forgiveable ignorance.  Going against the advice of a knowledgeable physician who has taken the time (for free!) to try to educate you on the good reasons for getting the vaccine even if you have had the virus - somewhat less forgiveable, but it is still your choice.  

However, when you assert that only sissies, weaklings, old, fat and fearful people get the vaccine, you cross the line into asshole territory.  It doesn't take a huge effort to not be an asshole.  Try it sometime.

 

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This can help if pushed into anti vax bubble;
Short COVID: More to worry about via the LA Times: “Can COVID-19 cause lasting erectile dysfunction? This is now the topic of some discussion among doctors and health experts as they try to better understand the effects of the coronavirus. The problem has been observed in some patients, but experts agree more study is needed to form any conclusions.”

My body, my choice, but maybe a risk of a dangling willy.

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I think this thread should try and focus on exchanging information on reasons for taking the vaccine and possible downsides rather than ad hominem attacks.

I personally think that someone who is certain they had covid has less urgency to get vaccinated but should certainly consider having at least one booster shot.  If the case was very mild, then even more reason to get fully vaccinated.  

However a prior severe covid patient should consult their PCP, At the very least you want to be monitored.

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I think this thread should focus on why others think they should be able to tell someone else what to do.

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5 hours ago, Wess said:

I think this thread should focus on why others think they should be able to tell someone else what to do.

SMH.  When you are offered advice, especially advice from someone whose professional responsibility is advising people on their health, it is not "telling you what to do".  It is offering advice.  Take it or leave it.  

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I wonder if Wess knows how many other people he infected, and how many others they infected, and how many others they infected. Of course he doesn't, how could he, and of course he doesn't care, because in his view the only folk who really suffered are the old and fat. What a charming point of view.

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8 minutes ago, TheDragon said:

I wonder if Wess knows how many other people he infected

If @Wess was symptomatic then, if I recall the statistic correctly, he may have infected between 1.7 and 2 other people.  However that is dependent on where he lives and his mobility.

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@Kate short for Bob

So it was a week in the naughty corner?

Let's hope it's more permanent next time.  I feel a meme coming on ...

847eed2503bf544f997b97a76a573cde.gif

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I love the is place. So many so easily triggered little sissies. 

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6 minutes ago, Wess said:

I love the is place. So many so easily triggered little sissies. 

If your mission is trolling, you ain't shit.  Go get some lessons from @LB 15

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No time for that. At the moment I am studying how teens have learned to fake a positive covid tests and testing to see if it works. Ah to be young again.

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On 7/7/2021 at 4:24 AM, Wess said:

At some point you will have to get over the fact that you have no right to tell anyone else to get or not get vaccinated. 

when you live as Robinson Crusoe , yes

 

whilst you share the same space NO.

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31 minutes ago, Mid said:

when you live as Robinson Crusoe , yes

 

whilst you share the same space NO.

Too bad.  So sad.  NOT!

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9 minutes ago, Wess said:

Too bad.  So sad.  NOT!

and with that you have effectively exposed yourself as the selfish ignorant fool I suspected you are .

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2 hours ago, Mid said:

and with that you have effectively exposed yourself as the selfish ignorant fool I suspected you are .

how many posts does wess need to make to be suspected of being a selfish, ignorant fool?

 

i would have thought 2, maybe 3 at the most.

 

i mean 5 posts would surely prove it.

 

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