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Amateur couple rebuilds salvage cruiser


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On 12/26/2020 at 3:29 PM, SloopJonB said:

There's been a lot of discussion about the future sale-ability of this boat but one aspect has been overlooked.

Would you buy a boat that had been rebuilt by a guy with a man-bun?

gomer and squeeky did.

and i know.... rebuilt is a bit of a stretch in that case.

 

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Like watch it before commenting? Have you no respect for internet traditions?  

Sure I would. It's the Chevy of the seas, not a Pininfarina. If you drive it like a rental (Which it was) you'll get wear and tear like a rental. Hitting rocks with boats is bad, as I understand it th

To be fair, most keels are bolted on, the question is, what are they actually bolted TO...

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5 hours ago, eastern motors said:

It was touched on a little bit in the discussion on insurance/titles.  I bet all these videos get deleted right before they try to sell the boat.

I actually think the right idiot would be willing to pay a premium because they documented their repairs...

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1 hour ago, Will1073 said:

I actually think the right idiot would be willing to pay a premium because they documented their repairs...

The right idiot who does not care about getting insurance, and maybe just wants to sit at a slip or on a mooring and watch other boats go by. 

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1 minute ago, George Dewey said:

The right idiot who does not care about getting insurance, and maybe just wants to sit at a slip or on a mooring and watch other boats go by. 

Where are you guys that past repairs have any impact on getting insurance? Up here, you get a clean survey (involving at most a few hammer taps of that new laminate), then you go buy insurance. 

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31 minutes ago, andykane said:

Where are you guys that past repairs have any impact on getting insurance? Up here, you get a clean survey (involving at most a few hammer taps of that new laminate), then you go buy insurance. 

I'm in the process of getting insurance for an offshore capable boat right now. Working with a few brokers, all the applications have asked if the boat is a salvage. So anyone applying for insurance would have to disclose that, and I would expect the insurance company would want to know who did the repairs. Man bun or not, I would be surprised if the underwriters decide a couple of kids with no experience or credentials doing the repairs make them comfortable. I certainly could be wrong, and it would be good to hear from someone who actually sells insurance. Knowing the history of the boat I sure would not buy it. 

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Interesting - I double checked and none of the applications I've completed for various boats ever asked about that. I wonder if it's a hurricane belt thing? Around here a salvage boat isn't a common thing. Ultimately, the solution would be to document the repair, have the process/laminate schedule approved by a professional, and have the repair approved by a surveyor. They'd also want the surveyor to determine a market value so they're insured for the repaired value instead of their purchase price.

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40 minutes ago, andykane said:

Interesting - I double checked and none of the applications I've completed for various boats ever asked about that. I wonder if it's a hurricane belt thing? Around here a salvage boat isn't a common thing. Ultimately, the solution would be to document the repair, have the process/laminate schedule approved by a professional, and have the repair approved by a surveyor. They'd also want the surveyor to determine a market value so they're insured for the repaired value instead of their purchase price.

I would assume the repaired value would exceed purchase price.  Which means the insurance company is likely to insure at purchase price.

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1 hour ago, George Dewey said:

I'm in the process of getting insurance for an offshore capable boat right now. Working with a few brokers, all the applications have asked if the boat is a salvage. So anyone applying for insurance would have to disclose that, and I would expect the insurance company would want to know who did the repairs. Man bun or not, I would be surprised if the underwriters decide a couple of kids with no experience or credentials doing the repairs make them comfortable. I certainly could be wrong, and it would be good to hear from someone who actually sells insurance. Knowing the history of the boat I sure would not buy it. 

They( the insurance company) only want to know if it is salvage to ascertain the price that you paid for it as a salvage item. They will only insure it for your purchase price. $1,000,000 yacht bought for $3,500.00 salvage, whether you improve it or not is insured for $3,500.00

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2 things insurers ask,  “is it salvage and what did you pay for it?”. You may have just purchased a Hinckley 40 for cheap and want to insure it for $100,000+. They aren’t going to go for it even with a recent survey


I should clarify that if the boat is in good enough shape or less that 10 years old, insurers will insure the boat at market value.
 

The Fareast28R I bought as salvage is insured for $60,000 agreed upon value. It was dismasted and the carbon fiber rudder was damaged. I replaced both, however, the insurance company specifically told me that they would not cover a dismasting or rudder damage in the future , which I find odd. I just spent $9,000 out of my pocket for those...

My wooden cutter is insured for liability only. If I don’t file any claim for a year they will value the boat at the surveyed amount, which is around $50,000. I let the insurance expire by accident...now I have wait the year out and hopefully nothing happens to it or I screwed myself.

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22 minutes ago, Sail4beer said:

The Fareast28R I bought as salvage is insured for $60,000 agreed upon value. It was dismasted and the carbon fiber rudder was damaged. I replaced both, however, the insurance company specifically told me that they would not cover a dismasting or rudder damage in the future , which I find odd. I just spent $9,000 out of my pocket for those...

Was it a used mast?

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 No,  new from Selden along with the standing and running rigging. 
 

Martin Robitaille from Fareast Canada got me set up. New tri radial sails and assym from a small loft, Eagle sails.

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2 hours ago, Sail4beer said:

The Fareast28R I bought as salvage is insured for $60,000 agreed upon value. It was dismasted and the carbon fiber rudder was damaged. I replaced both, however, the insurance company specifically told me that they would not cover a dismasting or rudder damage in the future , which I find odd. I just spent $9,000 out of my pocket for those...

That seems like pretty short money for a carbon mast... Or did you replace it with aluminum? 

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13 hours ago, Sail4beer said:

They( the insurance company) only want to know if it is salvage to ascertain the price that you paid for it as a salvage item. They will only insure it for your purchase price. $1,000,000 yacht bought for $3,500.00 salvage, whether you improve it or not is insured for $3,500.00

Up here in the GWN, the surveyor determines the market value of the boat.  That's what the boat is insured for, regardless of history.  If you can find an amenable surveyor you can insure anything for whatever value, as long as it isn't completely outrageous.

There are some insurance companies that are wise to this and have a list of acceptable surveyors.

I have insured two sailboats in the last 6 months, in no case did the insurance company ask what we paid for the boats.  They just wanted the surveys.

 

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The cutter was surveyed at $35,000 before I did a lot of restoration work on it. The value was based on what people in my area would pay for it. He said it would have been $50,000 if he were surveying it in Maine or Long Island Sound where there is a market for older wooden yachts.

1 hour ago, George Dewey said:

That seems like pretty short money for a carbon mast... Or did you replace it with aluminum? 

The rig is aluminum. Sorry for the confusion. Only the keel and rudder/tiller are carbon.
Fareast wanted to keep the costs down for the class and uses aluminum mast, boom and retractable bow sprit. 

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 12/15/2020 at 2:27 AM, chuso007 said:

Very interesting episode about them walking the dogs in the park...

Call me when she finally wears a bikini.

Tube top this week. Close enough?

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4 hours ago, TJSoCal said:

Tube top this week. Close enough?

Haha. You know it's (almost) never enough...

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On 12/28/2020 at 12:19 AM, andykane said:

Interesting - I double checked and none of the applications I've completed for various boats ever asked about that. I wonder if it's a hurricane belt thing? Around here a salvage boat isn't a common thing. Ultimately, the solution would be to document the repair, have the process/laminate schedule approved by a professional, and have the repair approved by a surveyor. They'd also want the surveyor to determine a market value so they're insured for the repaired value instead of their purchase price.

We've been asked the question everytime we've been quoted insurance:

Has the vessel proposed for insurance been subject to:-

(a) conversion? No (b) modification? No (c) amateur construction? No If ‘Yes’ give full details 

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So which part of the question picks up an amateur repair?

It's a fine line,  but it probably could be argued the the "construction" was professional.  (Professional does not have to mean good or even adequate).

Construction by one of the worlds biggest professional boat builders,  (major) repairs by amateurs.  Anything in this statement untrue?  

So that makes the answers, (a) No  (b) No  (c) No.  Fair probably not but untrue also probably not.  Poor question.  probably,  depending on whether the insurer really wants to know or is just covering themselves.

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8 hours ago, TUBBY said:

So which part of the question picks up an amateur repair?

It's a fine line,  but it probably could be argued the the "construction" was professional.  (Professional does not have to mean good or even adequate).

Construction by one of the worlds biggest professional boat builders,  (major) repairs by amateurs.  Anything in this statement untrue? 

You are so right! "Professional does not have to mean good or even adequate."  

Case in point - any of the later builds by Barry Carroll/Careless Marine.  The wet cores  - and the rebuilds - are legendary.  And ongoing to this day. 

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1 hour ago, GABA said:

You are so right! "Professional does not have to mean good or even adequate."  

Case in point - any of the later builds by Barry Carroll/Careless Marine.  The wet cores  - and the rebuilds - are legendary.  And ongoing to this day. 

Those cores didn't start out wet.

Almost every cored boat is poorly built - the penetrations are never sealed properly.  Yet manufacturers tout their excellence in construction.  

Does any builder using cored hulls seal the factory penetrations properly?  We know that Carroll, J, Beneteau, Jeanneau, Santa Cruz and Catalina didn't, and probably still don't to this day.  Built in obsolescence unless the owners take care of it.

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  • 3 weeks later...
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1 minute ago, George Dewey said:

Are these two still around? 

Yes. there videos are about 8 months behind showing all the interior glasswork is done. 

Basically unwatchable.  She giggles more than Squeaky and has worse tits.  

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3 minutes ago, Cristoforo said:
7 minutes ago, George Dewey said:

Are these two still around? 

Yes. there videos are about 8 months behind showing all the interior glasswork is done. 

Basically unwatchable.  She giggles more than Squeaky and has worse tits.  

Thissis moire revealleng of you then annythinge ealse..........                 :)

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On 2/13/2021 at 8:06 PM, boatcat65 said:

Here's a guy having to make the same repair on a similar boat.  It's being done "professionally" in that he's paying a repair yard to carry out the work.  Aside from working a whole lot cleaner it looks like exactly the same approach.  Owner seems to know what he's doing- including the trade-offs, etc.

https://youtu.be/C3RzxLW7t1U

One thing that struck me about their repair work immediately was the lack of masking off on the rest of the boat. Even their TV and woodwork is covered in fiberglass dust. It's toxic and itchy and impossible to wipe / blow off as get all if it out. Why didn't they mask off their work area like this guy did. Seems so basic. No different than doing a drywall job in your house to stop the dust going everywhere!

boat repair.jpg

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29 minutes ago, stayoutofthemiddle said:

One thing that struck me about their repair work immediately was the lack of masking off on the rest of the boat. Even their TV and woodwork is covered in fiberglass dust. It's toxic and itchy and impossible to wipe / blow off as get all if it out. Why didn't they mask off their work area like this guy did. Seems so basic. No different than doing a drywall job in your house to stop the dust going everywhere!

Probably helps that this boat is being worked on in a shed - so it doesn't have to do double duty as storage for tools and materials.

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17 minutes ago, alphafb552 said:

Probably helps that this boat is being worked on in a shed - so it doesn't have to do double duty as storage for tools and materials.

Just saying, masking is the right way to do it. If you need to rent a storage trailer and park it by the boat so be it.

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2 hours ago, Marcjsmith said:

latest video is out,  looks pretty good.  except for Limber holes, more precisely,  lack of....  unless they plan to drill them out after the fact...

 

How many weeks and hours of 8 month old videos of people  fiberglassing a boat can a person watch? 

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On 3/2/2021 at 1:53 PM, GH41 said:

I worry about the dogs breathing all that shit in. Can you imagine how much heavy metal is on the ground at a boatyard?? 

Yeah, that may affect how they taste when the yard workers eat them  on their weekly  Friday  BBQs  

https://www.brazzil.com/11419-brazilian-police-shut-down-slaughterhouse-selling-dog-and-cat-meat/

https://www.scmp.com/news/world/americas/article/3042371/man-eat-dog-brazil-police-bust-barbaric-dogfighting-ring-bbq

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3 hours ago, Marcjsmith said:

latest video is out,  looks pretty good.  except for Limber holes, more precisely,  lack of....  unless they plan to drill them out after the fact...

Good?  As predicted, nearly every piece of structural wood is rotted and being ripped out.

 

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1 hour ago, TwoLegged said:

Good?  As predicted, nearly every piece of structural wood is rotted and being ripped out.

 

Its all good fun until the money runs out.  Then they are screwed.  Actually, they are already screwed.  

This is, however, making my mast step rebuild and rigging replacement project look like just a wee spot of bother.   

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2 hours ago, Rain Man said:

Its all good fun until the money runs out.  Then they are screwed.  Actually, they are already screwed.  

This is, however, making my mast step rebuild and rigging replacement project look like just a wee spot of bother.   

Like you shook your dick and one drop of piss made it to the floor. Nothing to worry about in the grand scheme of things compared to their problems. 

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Kudos for their enthusiasm and persistence, but I find it hard to believe that they didn't have someone there in the yard tell them about the true scope of the project up front.  That boat was clearly a rotten mess- it should have been obvious when they took the keel out.  Or took some of the bottom planks off.  Or started to replace the floors. Or....??  Liars, cheaters, and thieves all around.  And, as we all know- when done the boat won't be anywhere close to being worth what they have "invested."  

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39 minutes ago, boatcat65 said:

Kudos for their enthusiasm and persistence, but I find it hard to believe that they didn't have someone there in the yard tell them about the true scope of the project up front.  That boat was clearly a rotten mess- it should have been obvious when they took the keel out.  Or took some of the bottom planks off.  Or started to replace the floors. Or....??  Liars, cheaters, and thieves all around.  And, as we all know- when done the boat won't be anywhere close to being worth what they have "invested."  

A friend knows them and showed me their first video when it came out.

They specifically stated that "everyone told them not to do it" that "it cannot be done" and "that it would be a waste of time" "given the boat is past it's life expectancy" and "that the boat is scrap and it would be easier and cheaper to build a new one from scratch".

They are specifically doing it to spite those people and save this once great vessel.

Ironically, it was never great, they are just idiots. 

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14 hours ago, Cristoforo said:

How many weeks and hours of 8 month old videos of people  fiberglassing a boat can a person watch? 

For me, Mostly background noise at work.  Among all the YouTube sailing vids.  

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1 hour ago, Alaris said:

I will never understand why they felt it necessary to fair and sand the bilge.

mmmmmhhhhhhhh..... i'm going to sand the bildge on my boat, too... and then i'm going to put this stuf on it (also on the keel structure (not the bolts)): 

International Primocon primer voor boten

 

it will be smooth, metal will be protected from (salt) water and it will be easy to clean...

 

and it's not expensive...!

 

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9 hours ago, darth reapius said:

A friend knows them and showed me their first video when it came out.

They specifically stated that "everyone told them not to do it" that "it cannot be done" and "that it would be a waste of time" "given the boat is past it's life expectancy" and "that the boat is scrap and it would be easier and cheaper to build a new one from scratch".

They are specifically doing it to spite those people and save this once great vessel.

Ironically, it was never great, they are just idiots. 

There is nothing wrong with a little wealth transfer from a pair of clueless idiots to the hardworking yard staff who tried to warn them. Darwinian philanthropy at its finest.

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1 hour ago, IStream said:

There is nothing wrong with a little large wealth transfer from a pair of clueless idiots to the hardworking yard staff who tried to warn them. Darwinian philanthropy at its finest.

FIFY

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On 3/2/2021 at 6:12 PM, stayoutofthemiddle said:

Just saying, masking is the right way to do it. If you need to rent a storage trailer and park it by the boat so be it.

I tried this when I did my chainplate project last year. 
It still got absolutely everywhere, and if I stuck it with masking tape it pulled away, especially when running power tools that exhaust a lot of air. 
If I used stronger tape then I could never reuse the plastic & it left lots of residue. 

A year on & I'm still finding seams of fibreglass dust! 

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They should run away as fast and as far as they can even at this point, a can of gas and a match is the only fitting end to that POS.  Where the fuck is there money coming from? Talk about pissing up a rope.  Surprised they yard crew are willing to risk their lives working under it, at some point it going to collapse into a pile of rubble.  Would be better than reducing it to pile of rubble one small rotten piece at a time.

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