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Construction of a Pogo 36


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Following in the footsteps of @shaggybaxter and his 12.50 thread and the new Pogo 50 thread by @tumbleweed314,  I'll be posting photos of the Pogo 36 build.

There wasn't a long process on deciding on the 36.  I had followed Pogo since they started producing the mini and have price sheets for the Pogo 2 and 40 somewhere on my computer.  When they came out with the 36 it was an easy "that's what I want for retirement."   I did look at other brands and the 30 and 12.50 but concluded that the 36 was the best option for what I wanted.  So I reserved a slot in June 2018 with delivery set for after I retired.  It will be used mainly for cruising but I have some friends in Charleston that wouldn't mind racing with wine in the fridge and a lasagna in the oven. 

My pre covid plan was to pick the boat in France and then sail around northern Europe until hurricane season is over before heading to Barbados and then working my way back home.  Depending how the vaccine works out, there is a slight chance it could  still happen.  If not,  I'll ship it to the east coast.

Attached is the final PDF with all the options.

CC001522.pdf

The contract was signed last week and they have already started the build.  Coralie sent me 2 photos on Nov 9th.  Here are the explanations.

The first photo shows the hull with the gelcoat and the first layer of fiber installed.  They do not install gelcoat on the bottom so they can do post infusion quality control checks.  The green you see is the mold.  The visible bumps in the hull create a recess to allow any though hull items to be installed flush with the hull. That’s Guillaume with the blue gloves and Bertrand at Pogo

2020_11_09_Fiber.thumb.jpg.bf5e7b6a6c55816581afba7d6caeeec6.jpg

Locating the exact center of the boat, in order to put the foam in symmetrical

1132078643_20201109CLlayout.thumb.jpg.58a5fce0d621d53777fed50309ce9265.jpg

 

 

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Hey Steve

You are a lucky guy. Visited Pogo Structures this summer to see the Pogo 44 close to completion. Coralie gave us a fantastic tour of the production facilities and their quality and accuracy is second to none. Bloody virus is stopping us ordering at the moment as business affected but really looking to be cheered up with your updates on progress!

Cheers from London (except all the bars are closed for another 2.5 weeks...)

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23 hours ago, svitale said:

The first photo shows the hull with the gelcoat and the first layer of fiber installed.  They do not install gelcoat on the bottom so they can do post infusion quality control checks.  The green you see is the mold.  

 

I screwed up the translation.  They use a clear gelcoat in the bottom of the boat and not just bare glass for quality control

 

Here a picture of today :
 
Drappage.jpg
 
There is the outside layer of glass fiber fabric, and you can spot the reinforcements with additional layers of fabric, for instance :
- where we will cut the windows
- for the shrouds
- for the rudders
- for the saildrive
The sticks of yellow foam are there to hold the foam planks that will be put soon.
 

 

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8 hours ago, Mais78 said:

Steve, from the list I see you got the shore power cable through the companionway, correct? Having seen both options, I think it is very practical to have the plug in the cockpit.

I have to change it out for the States to 120V when I get back.  Ultimately it will be in the cockpit.

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3 hours ago, svitale said:

They use a clear gelcoat in the bottom of the boat and not just bare glass for quality control

Needed for release, now I am wondering how a total clear gelcoat Pogo would look like :)

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  • 4 weeks later...

Latest update - The hull is out of the mold and is waiting on the fitting team to finish the previous boat.

I'll post the latest photo's when I receive them.

If you've been following the Corona thread, the quote from Sevenstar is in.  $17,203.40 from Southampton to Jacksonville.  Waiting on Gulfstream in La Rochelle for the quote to attend the sea trials and then deliver it the Southampton.

 

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I haven't followed the Corona threads but IMHO if you want to, you'll be able to pick up the boat next spring/summer. The vaccine will be there plus the virus is pretty ineffective during the European summer. Don't forget that the Azores are in the EU Schengen zone. IMHO, worst case scenario you have to land in Florida as the Carribean islands are still shut. 17000$ is a lot of beer money to enjoy the cruising!

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  • 1 month later...

I spent the day talking to Customs, EPA and Volvo Penta trying to make sure the paperwork is ready. The engine literature shows that it meets EPA Tier 3 but the paperwork that Pogo had only showed the EU standards.  It looks like Volvo can supply the certification. 

It looks like I'll be shipping it over this spring.  Choices are La Rochelle to Baltimore or Southampton to Jacksonville.  With Covid it might be easier to keep it all in France and avoid the UK. 

At least there is some good news - The deck went on today!

2021 01 21 whole.jpg

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11 hours ago, svitale said:

With Covid it might be easier to keep it all in France and avoid the UK. 

Yes, I wouldn't go through the UK as I would be to scared to end up dealing with some Brexit related red tape!

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On 1/16/2021 at 6:19 AM, svitale said:

Post Holiday photos arrived today.  The deck and hull are close to being bonded together

 

28947b10-c37e-4368-af19-c0c0a1c3c0b6.jpg

 

Why is there a hole in your deck? not centered? 

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On 1/22/2021 at 3:37 PM, badia420 said:

Why is there a hole in your deck? not centered? 

From front to back:  Chain locker offset for the sprit, V berth hatch, offset head hatch, salon hatch.

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On 1/22/2021 at 5:07 AM, Upp3 said:

From https://hts.usitc.gov/ 8903.91.00 Sailboats, with or without auxiliary motor 1.5%

Another bad part of COVID-19 is the tax.  Importing it directly from the builder means it’s new when it arrives.  Pre COVID-19, it would have been sailed a few thousand nm and I would have asked for a years depreciation. 
 

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2 minutes ago, Mais78 said:

Amazing! Here we pay 20% VAT!!

Mais78, VAT and customs tariffs are separate issues.  If you import a boat into the UK from the US, you pay tariff + VAT.

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1 minute ago, TwoLegged said:

Mais78, VAT and customs tariffs are separate issues.  If you import a boat into the UK from the US, you pay tariff + VAT.

Very separate for Usians as they don't have VAT.

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1 minute ago, Upp3 said:

Very separate for Usians as they don't have VAT.

They don't have VAT, but AIUI most states do have some form of sales tax, which is kinda similar to VAT

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Just now, TwoLegged said:

They don't have VAT, but AIUI most states do have some form of sales tax, which is kinda similar to VAT

You import your own boat. No sales to be taxed. Big difference ;)

Or at least that is how I understood it to go.

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8 minutes ago, TwoLegged said:

Mais78, VAT and customs tariffs are separate issues.  If you import a boat into the UK from the US, you pay tariff + VAT.

I know, my point is exactly that. If Pogo sells the boat for 100 in Europe it will cost 120, in the US 101.5. Unless you tell me that the US will add also VAT on top

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States have a use tax which is (coincidentally) the same as sales tax.  So if the boat comes from another state and you keep it in your home state you will pay whatever that rate is pulse any locality use/sales tax.  Sales tax if it’s new.  Use tax if it makes its home in whichever state it stays.  Range from roughly 5-10% on top of that 101.5.  Oh, plus property or excise tax every year based on value probably another 1-3k per year.  So we’re up to 101.5 + 8 (for example) + 2/yr and it’s already 111.5 for first year.  Some few states such as Rhodesia Island have no sales tax.   I purchased my last boat in Maine (5%) moved it to Washington and paid the difference from maine to Wa.  

If ya has ta ask.......

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On 1/26/2021 at 7:41 AM, Veeger said:

Some few states such as Rhodesia Island have no sales tax.

So you are telling me... I should "move" my boat to Rhodesia Island because

On 1/26/2021 at 7:41 AM, Veeger said:

use tax which is (coincidentally) the same as sales tax

?

In other words, I also just brought a boat back from the wrong coast and into WA.

It's trailerable, so of course, I could register it in my other house... In Rhodesia Island? (where the fu is Rhodesia Island...)

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On 1/22/2021 at 4:16 AM, svitale said:

It looks like I'll be shipping it over this spring.  Choices are La Rochelle to Baltimore or Southampton to Jacksonville.  With Covid it might be easier to keep it all in France and avoid the UK.

I would avoid UK not because of Covid but because of Brexit. It's a huge shitshow now with customs and not sure if it's sorted this spring.

 

 

Great build btw, you really went all-in on the optionsB)

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1 hour ago, Maus1983 said:

I would avoid UK not because of Covid but because of Brexit. It's a huge shitshow now with customs and not sure if it's sorted this spring.

 

 

Great build btw, you really went all-in on the optionsB)

It is working well for me :-)

I am shopping (ex VAT) on UK websites and having shipped directly to the yard in France and so far customs have not asked for VAT

As long as it lasts...

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8 hours ago, Floating Duck said:

So you are telling me... I should "move" my boat to Rhodesia Island because

?

In other words, I also just brought a boat back from the wrong coast and into WA.

It's trailerable, so of course, I could register it in my other house... In Rhodesia Island? (where the fu is Rhodesia Island...)

All I can tell you is that ‘auto fill’ gets ya from time to time...  (Hint:  Rhode Island  might fit)

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Today's photos.  Pulpit and lifelines, windlass and hatches and then boxes over the winches with the rope clutches.

As a US registered vessel, I  can avoid the sales tax until it is in one state for over 180 days in a year.  Right now it looks like spring on the Chesapeake then heading to Maine, then South Carolina for 5 months before setting off to Europe to do the original tour i was going to do pre- Covid.   

 

 

 

2021 01 29 foredeck.jpg

2021 01 29 AFT.jpg

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8 minutes ago, svitale said:

As a US registered vessel, I  can avoid the sales tax until it is in one state for over 180 days in a year.  Right now it looks like spring on the Chesapeake then heading to Maine, then South Carolina for 5 months before setting off to Europe to do the original tour i was going to do pre- Covid.   

if you keep moving around, can you avoid sales tax indefinitely?

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The mechanism for triggering the sales tax is the first time it is registered in a state.  So you could keep moving (depending on each states laws) or register it in a no sales tax state first and then move the registration to another state.  When you register it you do have to start paying property tax.  This is one advantage of registering with the USCG.  That and you don't need to put the state number on the front just the sticker.

You can run in to registration problems if you go over the 180 days.  If you lived in Charleston, and registered your boat there, and then went to the Keys for a year, Florida would require you the register it and pay property tax. 

It works the same way for state income tax.  My first 8 years out of school living in hotel rooms while working on the road.  Since my payroll went through Atlanta, I paid taxes there even though my residence was in Maryland (I visited MD about 8 weekends a year).  Technically I should have paid income tax in each state I worked in but it was 19 different cities the first 4 years.  The next 4 were in Tennessee with no income tax and all I had to do to get a refund from GA was include a letter stating I was in TN. 

 

 

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Property tax is very state specific. Many do not assess it on boats at all (maryland, Rhode Island). Same with registration. Maryland is $12/year. So you pay 5% excise tax the first year and you are done other than the cheap registration.   Most states trigger local registration requirements at some point. 180 days is pretty common.  States with higher taxes are more militant on enforcing it.  Since Maryland’s 5% is on the low to middle, they aren’t too fussed to chase folks down unless they are obvious about it. 
 

 

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14 hours ago, Innocent Bystander said:

Property tax is very state specific. Many do not assess it on boats at all (maryland, Rhode Island). Same with registration. Maryland is $12/year. So you pay 5% excise tax the first year and you are done other than the cheap registration.   Most states trigger local registration requirements at some point. 180 days is pretty common.  States with higher taxes are more militant on enforcing it.  Since Maryland’s 5% is on the low to middle, they aren’t too fussed to chase folks down unless they are obvious about it. 
 

 

And in Maryland the excise tax is limited to a maximum of $15K.

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Steve did you agree the set up of your water maker?

Where will it be placed: under the bed or near the tank in the technical area?

Will you have a direct pipe to the water tank (the yard is against it) or just a jerrycan?

thanks

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On 1/30/2021 at 9:29 PM, svitale said:

The mechanism for triggering the sales tax is the first time it is registered in a state.  So you could keep moving (depending on each states laws) or register it in a no sales tax state first and then move the registration to another state.  When you register it you do have to start paying property tax.  This is one advantage of registering with the USCG.  That and you don't need to put the state number on the front just the sticker.

You can run in to registration problems if you go over the 180 days.  If you lived in Charleston, and registered your boat there, and then went to the Keys for a year, Florida would require you the register it and pay property tax. 

It works the same way for state income tax.  My first 8 years out of school living in hotel rooms while working on the road.  Since my payroll went through Atlanta, I paid taxes there even though my residence was in Maryland (I visited MD about 8 weekends a year).  Technically I should have paid income tax in each state I worked in but it was 19 different cities the first 4 years.  The next 4 were in Tennessee with no income tax and all I had to do to get a refund from GA was include a letter stating I was in TN. 

 

 

Does a pogo 36 displace enough to be uscg documented?

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3 minutes ago, Schnappi said:

Does a pogo 36 displace enough to be uscg documented?

Yes, more than enough 'net tons'. What a wacky unit to use for recreational vessels.

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Boat is due to be complete on March 8th and should touch the waters of the Chesapeake by April 20. Hanging out there for about a month getting familiar with the boat and all the ysstems before heading to Maine for the summer.  Just need to figure out how many toys to take.  My last trip was for whitewater on the Dead, Kennebec and Rip Gorge plus the wave a Blue Hill that forms just after low tide.

Mais78 - I sent an email to Coralie on the Zen.  Will post the answer later. 

I also asked about getting some hatch insect screens from GIOIT.  Wouldn't want to go to Maine without them.

 

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Reply from Pogo on the watermaker

 
The ZEN 30, is installed in the aft starboard cabin, behind the wooden plank in the back.
It has its own through hull. We put a sophoscope valve that is retractable. see photo
So when you do not use it it is flush with the hull. When you  use it it is deep in the water, out of the bubbles,so you are sure of getting exclusively water. As you orientate the hole to the front of the boat, there is some pressure in the flow that helps the watermaker. 
 
Connection :
We are, of course, technically capable of plugging it to the water tank. Yet, this must be discussed. 
In case of a failure of the watermaker, salty water will get into the pipe, spoiling your fresh water tank. This is why you have a testing outlet, which you should taste each time you use it. 
On the 12.50 and the 44 there are 2 water tanks.  So there is no problem to connect the watermaker on one, keeping the other one safe.
On the 36 there is only 1 tank. In the installation manual of most brands of water makers, it is strictly written that you mustn't plug the watermaker to the single water tank of a boat. 
So, it depends of how you intend to use it. If you want your water maker to have some showers while anchoring nearby harbours, you can choose to plug it directly in the tank. In case of a failure, you just go to the harbour and flush the tank. If it is for long blue passages, it is safier not to plug it on the tank, but to fill cans.
We can also install a 3 ways valves and you choose each time if you fill up a can or the tank. But this is something to manage. 

image.png

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Thanks, more balanced answer than I got. I will definitely connect it to the water tank and decide from time to time where the water goes. 
What do they mean by “wooden plank”? Inside the technical area near the diesel tank or under then bed?

Been asking Chantal for a month but still did not get an answer.

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Congrats on the purchase!  

3 comments/questions: 

#1 

On 1/30/2021 at 8:29 PM, svitale said:

The mechanism for triggering the sales tax is the first time it is registered in a state.  So you could keep moving (depending on each states laws) or register it in a no sales tax state first and then move the registration to another state.  When you register it you do have to start paying property tax.  This is one advantage of registering with the USCG.  That and you don't need to put the state number on the front just the sticker.

All true.  Keep in mind that sales tax is paid on the value of the boat at the time it is triggered. Since boats depreciate rapidly in the first couple years, it's worth getting an appraisal by a third party and submitting that as a value to pay sales tax. Can lop off about 50%. 

#2: 

On 1/21/2021 at 9:16 PM, svitale said:

I spent the day talking to Customs, EPA and Volvo Penta trying to make sure the paperwork is ready. The engine literature shows that it meets EPA Tier 3 but the paperwork that Pogo had only showed the EU standards.  It looks like Volvo can supply the certification. 

Who did you talk to!?  I've been trying all sorts of agents to get someone to help with this stuff, and nobody calls me back!  Could you PM me with what you did here? I'm having a hell of a time getting my ducks in a row with this! 

 

#3

I imagine you're hoping to take a trip to the factory. If that happens to coincide with my boat splashing, I could always use a hand as I'm cruising Spain/Portugal (especially since I'll have a 6 year old with me) .  PM me if you want to set something up... keeping in mind that COVID/build times necessarily make this a moving target. 

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6 hours ago, svitale said:

Reply from Pogo on the watermaker

It has its own through hull. We put a sophoscope valve that is retractable. see photo
So when you do not use it it is flush with the hull. When you  use it it is deep in the water, out of the bubbles,so you are sure of getting exclusively water. As you orientate the hole to the front of the boat, there is some pressure in the flow that helps the watermaker. 
 
image.png

Does anyone know which manufacturer makes one of thse?  Google search on "sophoscope valve" turns up very limited info.

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20 hours ago, Ultraman said:

Does anyone know which manufacturer makes one of thse?  Google search on "sophoscope valve" turns up very limited info.

Or floods the boat faster - unless you turn it around which will be a nice emergency bilge pump

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On 2/5/2021 at 12:32 PM, LeoV said:

Got a quote and was 800 Euros for the small one not including shipping/duties/etc.  Anyone know of other options for a water maker or ballast tank intake?  I currently have my water maker T'd off the Saildrive intake, but am considering a direct source.

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16 minutes ago, Ultraman said:

Got a quote and was 800 Euros for the small one not including shipping/duties/etc.  Anyone know of other options for a water maker or ballast tank intake?  I currently have my water maker T'd off the Saildrive intake, but am considering a direct source.

Yyyyyup. 

That's the reason I went with an entire extra thru hull + pump for my water ballast system (different application, same concept) as it was half the price as a fancy sofomarine. As great as those things are...

I even went with the extra efficient "flush" thru hull from Forespar, and it was still cheaper...

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1 hour ago, Ultraman said:

I currently have my water maker T'd off the Saildrive intake, but am considering a direct source.

Have you had any problem with this set-up? Why change?

thanks

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 2/5/2021 at 1:48 PM, svitale said:

Reply from Pogo on the watermaker

 
The ZEN 30, is installed in the aft starboard cabin, behind the wooden plank in the back.
It has its own through hull. We put a sophoscope valve that is retractable. see photo
So when you do not use it it is flush with the hull. When you  use it it is deep in the water, out of the bubbles,so you are sure of getting exclusively water. As you orientate the hole to the front of the boat, there is some pressure in the flow that helps the watermaker. 
 

Steve, the construction of mine should start on or about 8 march, probably same team that is finalizing yours.

I sought clarifications for the watermaker installation and they say they will fit everything in the technical room (which is nice). Nothing will go behind the wooden plank (I assume this is the lateral storage?). 

Have you discussed this further with them? Got pictures of your installation?

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Quote

I even went with the extra efficient "flush" thru hull from Forespar, and it was still cheaper...

Flush through hulls can allow air into a water maker while underway.   We ended up making a retrofit kit for the Forespar to protrude out of the hull like the Sofo.   Haven't taken it to market yet but it's got a replacement plunger, cap, etc. to quickly install onto the stock Forespar.

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5 hours ago, svitale said:

Sending an email to them tonight.  Will ask for picks.

Thanks, I am curious to see if they will install it the same way or why not.

I assume we both got the stardard 60l fuel tank so space in the technical room should be the same.

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 Talked to Coralie today and she explained why some of the builds are a little different. 

When they design a car, they figure out where everything goes in a fully loaded model and then strip out options for the standard model.  When you order an option, it goes in the designated space.

With boats, they wait until the order is made and then figure out the best place to put all the options based on the space available.  So, if you order a boatwith options A & B and I only option B, they may decide that the space for option A is the best location for my option B.  

 

She also pointed out that they are constantly looking for better solutions, so if the first and last boat built have the same option list they may have different parts.  From my own experience, I have cut sheets for parts from three years ago that are no longer installed on the boat or the models have changed.  The standard boat has also changed as some old options became standard equipment

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Photos:

1 watermaker in the starboard berth

2: Tech Room. The filters of the watermaker are installed on the small added white plank on the left bottom of the picture.

3. Wet Locked between the starboard berth and the nav station

2021 02 23 star berth.png

2021_02_23_aft_comp.png

2021 02 23 star locker.png

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Thanks Steve. Today Chantal sent me the same pictures and told me it is not possible to have all in the tech room anymore.
What is the grey thing next to the diesel tank? 
Are they late with your boat? Does not look like it will be finished next week

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On 2/8/2021 at 3:16 PM, Mais78 said:

Have you had any problem with this set-up? Why change?

thanks

I've found small mussels, etc. growing in the sail drive on haul outs and it requires manually switching back and forth for engine cooling.  Must remember to switch before starting the engine..

That said, the less thru-hulls in the boat, the better IMO.

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On 2/21/2021 at 8:38 PM, solosailor said:

Flush through hulls can allow air into a water maker while underway.   We ended up making a retrofit kit for the Forespar to protrude out of the hull like the Sofo.   Haven't taken it to market yet but it's got a replacement plunger, cap, etc. to quickly install onto the stock Forespar.

If you do end up with a product to sell, I'd be interested.

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On 2/24/2021 at 10:28 PM, bigrpowr said:

when is target date for delivery? boat looks beautiful my dude!

March 10th for comletion

March 10 -25 for sea trails and delivery to La Rochelle

March 25 to April 10 for loading on Sevenstar.

7 to 10 days for the trip and off loading

I have a slip at Jabin's reserved for two months starting mid april.

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On 1/26/2021 at 7:02 AM, Upp3 said:

You import your own boat. No sales to be taxed. Big difference ;)

Or at least that is how I understood it to go.

In whose dreamworld?

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Sea Trials bumped up to Tuesday.  I hired Gulf Steam out of La Rochelle to act as my agent and then deliver it to Sevenstar in La Rochelle.

I'll post more pics and information as I get them tomorrow.  By Wednesday when the paperwork and final wire transfer is complete, it should be mine.

 

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It's like microsoft.  you have to leave the thread to post more pics.

Sorry for the rotated photos.  They open correctly in my emails and other applications but rotate on SA

2021_03_08_dock_3.jpg

2021_03_08_dock_5.jpg

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Hey,

Is there room under the watermaker filters for a small basin or bucket to catch the spillage when you change filters?

On my boat I had a 3 way valve to divert product water to a spigot in the head sink. Fill a cup with product water, test with a little TDS test meter you put in the cup. If OK then YOU turn the 3 way valve to send it to fresh water tank. Our watermaker had no electronics, solenoid valves etc. Just this:
image.png.3186f3dfcaf3548b76b21031af4d7379.png

Measuring the TDS every time is good practice. I also tasted the product water. You can taste salt at 800 while 500 is considered 'acceptable' by WHO. 500 is not good tasting however. I'd turn the valve around 350, knowing it would drop slightly during production. It would take about 2 or 3 minutes to drop from 800 to 350.

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6 hours ago, Mais78 said:

Congrats Steve. What is that NKE pad under the graphic display?

 

It controls the mast displays.  Since they are vertical you can have 1-4 lines per unit,  You need to set the pages but you have one for the pilot plus another 10.  NKE offers 52 different numbers you can display.

They may be a little too much for a cruising boat but I'd rather shift my eyes to the mast than look down in the cockpit.  It will be useful if sailing single handed as the pilot will be driving and you'll be spending a lot of time at the winches.

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7 hours ago, svitale said:

It controls the mast displays.  Since they are vertical you can have 1-4 lines per unit,  You need to set the pages but you have one for the pilot plus another 10.  NKE offers 52 different numbers you can display.

They may be a little too much for a cruising boat but I'd rather shift my eyes to the mast than look down in the cockpit.  It will be useful if sailing single handed as the pilot will be driving and you'll be spending a lot of time at the winches.

Thanks, I noticed also no chartplotter and no additional bulkhead to separate front cabin. What was your thinking on those?

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4 hours ago, Mais78 said:

Thanks, I noticed also no chartplotter and no additional bulkhead to separate front cabin. What was your thinking on those?

Decided to forgo the chart plotter as I've always been a good navigator and don't need to constantly look at a map. 

I was going to consider the bulkhead if there was a performance advantage but it is just to separate the v berth from the head.  On this size boat if someone gets up in the middle of the night to used the head, your going to hear them move around so I didn't add it in.  It will also make it easier to move sails through one door as I could have the spin, gen and staysail up there.

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Only two small problems during the inspection.  We made a late change on the shore power unit and swapped the starter battery to lithium so both would have the same charging profile.   Apparently they continued with the original build sheet.  Both will be swapped out.  Due to a storm in the area the boat will depart St, Marine for La Rochelle on Monday

These are the first sailing pics

 

 

2021 03 09 st sail 1_00001.jpg

2021 03 09 st sail 2_00001.jpg

2021 03 09 st sail 4_00001.jpg

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