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Diesel Bug and Marine 16 treatment - is it working?


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I test it every now and again by switching the fuel valve off with the engine running. If it stays on 0 you have a bad gauge or air leaks in the fuel system.

Note to gauge buyers - the liquid filled gauges have a rubber plug for shipping. You HAVE to put a hole in that plug or the gauge readings will be way off as the temperature changes, it will only be correct at the temp the gauge was when it got filled. Liquid is not needed on the vacuum side anyway, but this is what I had. Pressure side it helps a lot.

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I am a bit worried about responding because this subject does seem to goad some posters into calling me names . It seems to affect their equanimity in some way that I am not using magnets, removing th

I post this in a light hearted way   I think I did not even deserve to be (french)  toasted    I was merely  sharing the unfolding of an experiment I am uniquely positioned to carr

Has the flaming stopped yet?  

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  • 2 weeks later...
1 hour ago, 167149 said:

Haven't heard from you in a while Dylan, how's our motor/ diesel/ heater going

I am a bit worried about responding because this subject does seem to goad some posters into calling me names . It seems to affect their equanimity in some way that I am not using magnets, removing the engine, cutting the tank up, connecting a fuel filter backwards, creating an entirely new jerry can based fuel system  or paying a bloke to clean already clean fuel.

 

in short though...

I have enjoyed ten days of estuary fun. I have been out and about on the estuary every day. The boat is fantastic for warm birdwatching - they seem to ignore me and the boat until I come out of the  dangerous offset sliding patio door that leads to the afterdeck.

due to lock down I have not been out in the north sea to give the system a good shaking and we have not had an easterly through the moorings which stirs things up nicely. I am the only sailor in the village who is hoping that we will get one

However, engine has not missed a beat  over the five or six hours of engine time

no signs of accumulating gunge in the main filter water trap

the sediment that found its way from the severely contaminated heater header tank  to the heater water trap   is slowly "dissolving" if I can use such a phrase. It was once half full of sediment - that has now fallen away to a slim slight darkness on the bottom of the site glass - I regard this as a good sign.

of course this is mobile gunge not the gelatinous black stuff that presumably still clings to the inside of the tanks - or does it?

I have ordered replacements for everything from the tank fuel tap to the engine filter including a Racor "type" top loading filter.

 

all bought from the internet,        pipes, angles, filters, taps and site glass - all 10mm internal pipe fittings  . - so at least everything except the valve and short stub of copper exit pipe will be replaced with metric and I will have a racor type top loading filter.

This took ages to get all the components together via ebay - but I have been sailing while waiting rather than sitting in a windswept boatyard listening to the sound of slapping halyards and flapping tarps.

in the old days I would have gone out in the VW Polo and spent a morning going around the stores that sell pipes and valves for fuel lines and got it all together in one morning.

now it takes a long evening with the paypal account followed by ten days of regular arrivals of small padded bags.  I have now assembled everything except for a T piece for the site tube and am almost ready to spend a day down the engine hole removing the old fuel supply lines and filters and replacing them with the bag of new gubbins.

. I will curse like a pirate and ache like a bastard afterwards

The 6hp tohatsu is still on the stern  should something large dislodge  from the inside of the tank and  block a filter.

 

Dylan

 

 

 

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32 minutes ago, dylan winter said:

in the old days I would have gone out in the VW Polo and spent a morning going around the stores that sell pipes and valves for fuel lines and got it all together in one morning.

now it takes a long evening with the paypal account followed by ten days of regular arrivals of small padded bags.  I have now assembled everything except for a T piece for the site tube and am almost ready to spend a day down the engine hole removing the old fuel supply lines and filters and replacing them with the bag of new gubbins.

Yeah - I've a stream of small parcels arriving as the parts for 3 or 4 different boat projects arrive. I put each bit in its appropriate plastic bin and when all necessary bits are on hand, work can commence. Followed inevitably by finding out that I've overlooked something, of course.

Not letting that stop me using the boat either. It is summer after all. In theory anyway.

FKT

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32 minutes ago, dylan winter said:

I am a bit worried about responding because this subject does seem to goad some posters into calling me names . It seems to affect their equanimity in some way that I am not using magnets, removing the engine, cutting the tank up, connecting a fuel filter backwards, creating an entirely new jerry can based fuel system  or paying a bloke to clean already clean fuel.

 

in short though...

I have enjoyed ten days of estuary fun. I have been out and about on the estuary every day. The boat is fantastic for warm birdwatching - they seem to ignore me and the boat until I come out of the  dangerous offset sliding patio door that leads to the afterdeck.

due to lock down I have not been out in the north sea to give the system a good shaking and we have not had an easterly through the moorings which stirs things up nicely. I am the only sailor in the village who is hoping that we will get one

However, engine has not missed a beat  over the five or six hours of engine time

no signs of accumulating gunge in the main filter water trap

the sediment that found its way from the severely contaminated heater header tank  to the heater water trap   is slowly "dissolving" if I can use such a phrase. It was once half full of sediment - that has now fallen away to a slim slight darkness on the bottom of the site glass - I regard this as a good sign.

of course this is mobile gunge not the gelatinous black stuff that presumably still clings to the inside of the tanks - or does it?

I have ordered replacements for everything from the tank fuel tap to the engine filter including a Racor "type" top loading filter.

 

all bought from the internet,        pipes, angles, filters, taps and site glass - all 10mm internal pipe fittings  . - so at least everything except the valve and short stub of copper exit pipe will be replaced with metric and I will have a racor type top loading filter.

This took ages to get all the components together via ebay - but I have been sailing while waiting rather than sitting in a windswept boatyard listening to the sound of slapping halyards and flapping tarps.

in the old days I would have gone out in the VW Polo and spent a morning going around the stores that sell pipes and valves for fuel lines and got it all together in one morning.

now it takes a long evening with the paypal account followed by ten days of regular arrivals of small padded bags.  I have now assembled everything except for a T piece for the site tube and am almost ready to spend a day down the engine hole removing the old fuel supply lines and filters and replacing them with the bag of new gubbins.

. I will curse like a pirate and ache like a bastard afterwards

The 6hp tohatsu is still on the stern  should something large dislodge  from the inside of the tank and  block a filter.

 

Dylan

 

 

 

in answer to your first paragraph Dylan I wouldnt worry about it a jot, do your own thing in your own way and be happy with it just make sure it's faultless and purring when you drag Mum out (You Haven't mentioned if Jill has been for a spin yet)the rest is all in this thread for You to tackle if and when you feel like it, With regard to the diesel heater fuel tank, The boat I was on in alaska had a tank (quite high) that was fed by return excess fuel. fuel flowed in and filled to the spilloff that sent it back to the main tank...... all fuel to the heater was very very well filtered and gave no bother oh and that tank had a breather going up as well, Enough on that though just glad you're out and about doing it, hate to say it but more than a few of us are travelling with you for one reason or another, probably it;s to do with the way you pervey via your writing the places you go while we're stuck in the humdrum wishing we could. Tell me though, do you get any phospherescent up that way?

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7 minutes ago, 167149 said:

in answer to your first paragraph Dylan I wouldnt worry about it a jot, do your own thing in your own way and be happy with it just make sure it's faultless and purring when you drag Mum out (You Haven't mentioned if Jill has been for a spin yet)the rest is all in this thread for You to tackle if and when you feel like it, With regard to the diesel heater fuel tank, The boat I was on in alaska had a tank (quite high) that was fed by return excess fuel. fuel flowed in and filled to the spilloff that sent it back to the main tank...... all fuel to the heater was very very well filtered and gave no bother oh and that tank had a breather going up as well, Enough on that though just glad you're out and about doing it, hate to say it but more than a few of us are travelling with you for one reason or another, probably it;s to do with the way you pervey via your writing the places you go while we're stuck in the humdrum wishing we could. Tell me though, do you get any phospherescent up that way?

seen it in scotland and the irish sea

 

never down here

 

but then I sail in something that approximates to muligatawny soup -

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I hope it all works out for you. I got so used to "just in time" ordering of everything for every project the "new normal" where it can take 10-15 days to get a package mailed from 50 miles away has really been annoying.The fastest delivery of ANYTHING I have ordered in months was from Ireland to Kent Island in about 4 days.

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Good to see that your experiment is still working out ok, and I’m pretty sure that the naysayers and doom mongers amongst us only have your best interests and safety at heart.

You must have anti freeze for blood if you’re still out and about on the river, it’s bloody freezing.

 

all the best,

 

R

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a short yet image heavy report.

This is the old Delphi 286 bottom unloading fuel filter complete with lasagne drip tray. It is a bastard to get at.diesel-bug-fun-Still003.jpg

 

 

This was the filter paper I replaced three weeks ago - I was surprised at how bad it was and was beginning to doubt that the Marine 16 could do the job - on the bright side it showed that the gunge was on the move.

S5950001.jpg

 

I removed the top with a can opener - fekkin frightenin if you ask me.

 

S5950002.jpg

 

the paper spiral was bad too

S5950003.jpg

despite the crud the engine was running with no problems.  I replaced the above filter with a new one.

The plan, following advice on here, was to replace the hard to reach bottom unloading filter with a Racor type top-loader. So I got busy on ebay - I ordered a chinese knock off racor "type" for £35 as opposed to £200 for the real Racor. I ordered pipe-work, T pieces, fuel line sealant, not enough jubillee clips.  I am going to guess around £60 worth of gubbins.

I carried on sailing for about three weeks using around 10 litres of fuel per week. In the meantime I was waiting for the jiffy bags to arrive.

By Monday it was all here so I removed the Delphi filter system, associated mixed size pipework and eclectic connections.

We have had some pretty crap weather and the tank is about 3/4 full of fuel that has been over-dosed with  Marine 16 so plenty of scope for tank agitation on the mooring.

this is what the final delphi looked like after 30 litres of well doped and well agitated fuel passed through it. Pretty good I would say. Reasons to be cheerful.

diesel-bug-fun-Still001.jpg

so that might be progress.

In the old days it would have been a trip around the motor factors to assemble the bits. But I would have had everything in one morning. Now with Covid and ebay it all takes a lot longer.

There is a lot of packaging

 

 

diesel-bug-fun-Still006.jpg

 

I had to extend the bulkhead and move the electric pump for the taylor heater fuel supply to make room for the larger filter and its 10mm pipe-work.

this is the racor type filter in position bolted to the bulkhead extension.

diesel-bug-fun-Still011.jpg

 

diesel-bug-fun-Still007.jpg

I used a fuel line sealant on all the rubber to metal joints and nothing at all on the metal to metal joints.  The fuel tap on the bottom of the tank is imperial with some imperial copper pipe . I cut the copper pipe in an easy place and smeared fuel line sealant on it and then sleeved the metric rubber fuel pipe over the imperial copper pipe - I triple clipped the rubber fuel line to the copper. It seems to be fuel tight.

I have no fuel guage so I fitted a site tube

diesel-bug-fun-Still009.jpg

 

It is not pretty and is obviously not a temperature resitant pipe - but I have three fire extinguishers and now I know how much fuel is in the tank.

I spent two days doing engine bay pilates while rolling around on top of the engine compartment with my arms hanging down.

I am not proud of my workmanship - but then it is probably no worse than at least three of the eight blokes who have owned the fisher 25 before me.  I am sure that those elegant curves of fuel pipe will make excellent places for crud to settle.

So, I will run it like this until the spring when hopefully they will lower the covid regs and let me sleep on the boat.

Dylan

 

 

 

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Whaddya mean? Your work looks fine. It's as neat and tidy as can be managed in such a tight space, you've normalized all the fittings. You used sealant to reduce the risk of air leaks.

Just keep doing what you're doing- agitate the boat, check and change the filters until the crud is gone. It sounds like you may have already captured most of the crud with the old filter system. You'll get the last of it with your new setup.

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1 hour ago, dylan winter said:

So, I will run it like this until the spring when hopefully they will lower the covid regs and let me sleep on the boat.

Dylan

 

 

 

you can't sleep on the boat?

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1 hour ago, Ajax said:

Whaddya mean? Your work looks fine. It's as neat and tidy as can be managed in such a tight space, you've normalized all the fittings. You used sealant to reduce the risk of air leaks.

Just keep doing what you're doing- agitate the boat, check and change the filters until the crud is gone. It sounds like you may have already captured most of the crud with the old filter system. You'll get the last of it with your new setup.

Agreed. I like it, you can see clear space around all the joints and you can see the filter bowl much better. That tube under the filter bowl will be a PITA though.

In other news, I just bought an air compressor sitting on top of a 20 gallon air flask. The drain at the bottom released about a gallon of bright red rusty water all over the seller's lawn... he didn't know it was there. Job one- ease the inlet fittings off, squirt half a can of WD40 down in there, re-assemble.

Systems that have devices for releasing crud from the system, have those devices there for a damn good reason!

FB- Doug

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If your RACOR copy is close enuff, there is a vacuum gauge that screws into the top of the filter (instead of the 'T' handle) Allows you to directly monitor how plugged up the filter is.  Hopefully those big lumps you're getting will now settle in the bowl before getting into the filter proper. They may not fit thru the drain valve at the bottom, if so, the entire drain valve will unscrew from the bowl (again, if it's a good copy) leaving a big hole

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8 hours ago, dylan winter said:

I am not proud of my workmanship - but then it is probably no worse than at least three of the eight blokes who have owned the fisher 25 before me.  I am sure that those elegant curves of fuel pipe will make excellent places for crud to settle.

It's fine - looks reasonably neat, you thought through what you wanted to achieve, you improved on what came before you and now you know where all the bodies are buried in that particular setup, so even if there are further problems, you know just where to look. Well done.

Funnily enough one of my bottom-loading CAV type filters has developed a small leak, most likely an o-ring gone bad. I suspect a couple of Racor types are going on the list for the next haulout. I don't like fuel leaks.

FKT

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8 hours ago, dylan winter said:

a short yet image heavy report.

This is the old Delphi 286 bottom unloading fuel filter complete with lasagne drip tray. It is a bastard to get at.diesel-bug-fun-Still003.jpg

 

 

This was the filter paper I replaced three weeks ago - I was surprised at how bad it was and was beginning to doubt that the Marine 16 could do the job - on the bright side it showed that the gunge was on the move.

S5950001.jpg

 

I removed the top with a can opener - fekkin frightenin if you ask me.

 

S5950002.jpg

 

the paper spiral was bad too

S5950003.jpg

despite the crud the engine was running with no problems.  I replaced the above filter with a new one.

The plan, following advice on here, was to replace the hard to reach bottom unloading filter with a Racor type top-loader. So I got busy on ebay - I ordered a chinese knock off racor "type" for £35 as opposed to £200 for the real Racor. I ordered pipe-work, T pieces, fuel line sealant, not enough jubillee clips.  I am going to guess around £60 worth of gubbins.

I carried on sailing for about three weeks using around 10 litres of fuel per week. In the meantime I was waiting for the jiffy bags to arrive.

By Monday it was all here so I removed the Delphi filter system, associated mixed size pipework and eclectic connections.

We have had some pretty crap weather and the tank is about 3/4 full of fuel that has been over-dosed with  Marine 16 so plenty of scope for tank agitation on the mooring.

this is what the final delphi looked like after 30 litres of well doped and well agitated fuel passed through it. Pretty good I would say. Reasons to be cheerful.

diesel-bug-fun-Still001.jpg

so that might be progress.

In the old days it would have been a trip around the motor factors to assemble the bits. But I would have had everything in one morning. Now with Covid and ebay it all takes a lot longer.

There is a lot of packaging

 

 

diesel-bug-fun-Still006.jpg

 

I had to extend the bulkhead and move the electric pump for the taylor heater fuel supply to make room for the larger filter and its 10mm pipe-work.

this is the racor type filter in position bolted to the bulkhead extension.

diesel-bug-fun-Still011.jpg

 

diesel-bug-fun-Still007.jpg

I used a fuel line sealant on all the rubber to metal joints and nothing at all on the metal to metal joints.  The fuel tap on the bottom of the tank is imperial with some imperial copper pipe . I cut the copper pipe in an easy place and smeared fuel line sealant on it and then sleeved the metric rubber fuel pipe over the imperial copper pipe - I triple clipped the rubber fuel line to the copper. It seems to be fuel tight.

I have no fuel guage so I fitted a site tube

diesel-bug-fun-Still009.jpg

 

It is not pretty and is obviously not a temperature resitant pipe - but I have three fire extinguishers and now I know how much fuel is in the tank.

I spent two days doing engine bay pilates while rolling around on top of the engine compartment with my arms hanging down.

I am not proud of my workmanship - but then it is probably no worse than at least three of the eight blokes who have owned the fisher 25 before me.  I am sure that those elegant curves of fuel pipe will make excellent places for crud to settle.

So, I will run it like this until the spring when hopefully they will lower the covid regs and let me sleep on the boat.

Dylan

 

 

 

In the future use this style hose clamp on fuel lines 

32DB6972-A53E-487F-9D67-77F3895B8660.jpeg

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On 1/20/2021 at 9:38 AM, dylan winter said:

not under current lockdown rules

 

due to be eased mid march(ish)

????????

I am utterly failing to connect sleeping on your boat and covid. Is there more to this story?

Maryland had some idiotic rules in the spring that you could not go sailing by yourself miles away from anyone else unless you were fishing for food to feed your family, so that got a lot fishing licenses sold :rolleyes:

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15 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

????????

I am utterly failing to connect sleeping on your boat and covid. Is there more to this story?

Maryland had some idiotic rules in the spring that you could not go sailing by yourself miles away from anyone else unless you were fishing for food to feed your family, so that got a lot fishing licenses sold :rolleyes:

They closed the holiday caravan parks Because of sharing shower blocks

But said it was okay to use your second home

Then people said that was elitist

So they  banned staying in second homes

then it emerged that sleeping on yachts was okay under the rules

Elitist

So they banned that too

It is all about a level playing field.... cricket fair play and all that

I rather like the idea of fairness

 

d

 

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1 hour ago, dylan winter said:

They closed the holiday caravan parks Because of sharing shower blocks

But said it was okay to use your second home

Then people said that was elitist

So they  banned staying in second homes

then it emerged that sleeping on yachts was okay under the rules

Elitist

So they banned that too

It is all about a level playing field.... cricket fair play and all that

I rather like the idea of fairness

 

d

 

That isn't fair, it is nuts. IMHO

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2 hours ago, dylan winter said:

They closed the holiday caravan parks Because of sharing shower blocks

But said it was okay to use your second home

Then people said that was elitist

So they  banned staying in second homes

then it emerged that sleeping on yachts was okay under the rules

Elitist

So they banned that too

It is all about a level playing field.... cricket fair play and all that

I rather like the idea of fairness

 

d

 

I prefer rules made on some basis of sanity. Fair is a matter of opinion only.

Sleeping aboard your boat doesn't violate any covid quarantine issues unless you're transiting public spaces unnecessarily to get there. So I suppose there's a case for banning access to vessels in marinas but not out the front of your own property. But that's too nuanced for political policy so - shrug.

Fortunately they didn't do that last year here so we decamped to one of our moorings in a small bay until things settled.

FKT

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56 minutes ago, dylan winter said:

Disagree

But I am a british socialist

D

Dylan,  by your logic owning a yacht is elitist. Not everyone can afford one.  

I urge you to be more fair, sell your yacht and give up this elitist quest to sail around the UK.

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15 minutes ago, Ajax said:

Dylan,  by your logic owning a yacht is elitist. Not everyone can afford one.  

I urge you to be more fair, sell your yacht and give up this elitist quest to sail around the UK.

Righto

D

Ps with covid we are all in this together

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1 hour ago, dylan winter said:

Disagree

But I am a british socialist

D

I'm not a socialist and I still agree with the rule. It has to be clear and unambiguous. You have to stay at home, you have to sleep at home. Not at a mate's house, not in your caravan, not in your boat, not in your other house.

Some parts of the rule don't stand up to logic, but too much wiggle room and it all goes to shit. Keep it simple.

Three attached explains why we can't rely on logic.

 

 

IMG-20200508-WA0006.jpg

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1 hour ago, dylan winter said:

Righto

D

Ps with covid we are all in this together

I hear this a lot.  I would say: We're all in the same storm.  We're not all in the same boat. 

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Rules that make  no sense lead to contempt for authority and ALL rules. So I go to my boat - OK so far, and stay until 2200 and drive home. All good. But if I fall asleep on my boat - all alone away from anyone - and drive home at 0600 suddenly I am a Covid Criminal? I would be more than annoyed to do some weird kabuki dance to make poor people feel better about not having boats. It would make vastly more sense to just ban boating, not boating after dinner but before breakfast :rolleyes:

Maryland tried dumb nonsensical shit like this and mainly pissed everyone off. They have not attempted it again. For awhile a canoe was good, a Laser was bad. Sailing was bad unless you were fishing, then it was good. Taking my Boston Whaler to Annapolis by myself not within a mile of anyone was bad if I didn't have fishing gear, but going on a charter fishing trip in close quarters with strangers was fine :unsure::wacko:

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People have to make rules to try to deal with this. Some of them will be stupid because well they are made up by people. But if two homes or a boat are elitist because some don't have them, is even one home elitist because some people ,way to many, don't even have that? Where does this end?

Not directed at you Dylan, I love your threads and the fact that you share your solutions to problems.

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The three most important things about the rules for lockdowns or other pandemic restrictions are that they are

  1. are sufficient to keep the R number low
  2. have massive support, so that nearly everyone thinks they are fair and will comply
  3. simple and clear, so that people can readily understand them

Objectives 2 & 3 can be in tension, because adding detail to cater for every exception makes the rules very complex.  They could easily run to many pages, and thereby lose the attention a lot of people.  OTOH, omitting detail creates apparent absurdities.  Hence the tendency to avoid exceptions.

There have been problems with some of the second-wave restrictions in the UK, as the number of levels and the regional variations on those levels left some people unclear what they should be doing.  That doesn't help.

There were fairness problems in the first wave in the UK, when the Prime Minister's adviser flagrantly broke the rules and was not punished.  The Cummings scandal was huge news, and plenty of rule-breakers started citing it as evidence that the rules were a hypocritical scam.   Same in Ireland, where the Golfgate scandal brought down three senior politicians (a cabinet minister, the head of the senate, and the European commissioner), and there was a subsequent rise in rule-breaking as well as a huge diversion of political energy.  In both cases, the public rage was huge.

In both Ireland and the UK, there is a strong sense of a need for fairness, and for a common purpose to involve common effort and common sacrifice.  If people feel that the rules are unfair, they are less likely to comply.  Some of the comments here suggest that those values of fairness and common purpose are less prevalent on the other side of the Atlantic.

As to the overnight rules, it would of course be possible to write a legalistic rule covering lots of exceptions and the exceptions to the exceptions, e.g. 

spend the night at home, unless you are staying at 1) in a second home owned by you, which is within x miles from home, and is used exclusively by you; 2) a short-term rented home or holiday let, which is within x miles from home, and has not been entered by anyone else within z days; 3) a caravan or static caravan owned and used exclusively by you, and which has a direct water supply and wholly self-contained sanitary arrangements per the Caravan Sewage regulations 1975 section 4.5; 4) a yacht or boat which is anchored or moored at least x feet from any other vessel, and in which all waste water and sewage is stored in a holding tank which may not be discharged until at least z days after last usage; 5) motor caravan as defined by the asdfgh regulations) in which waste water and sewage is ........   zzzzz.

That's just too complex, and too lawyerly.  People deciding what to do will get lost in the detail, and cops trying to enforce it will have a tough time explaining it, and a tough time explaining all the nuances of why person A has been sent home, but not person B. 

Much better to just say "spend the night at home".  Everyone can get that, and nobody feels left out.

And to those who feel annoyed that they can't stay in their second home or boat or caravan or RV or favourite holiday rental: enjoy it when this is over, if you are one of the lucky survivors.

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3 hours ago, kent_island_sailor said:

Rules that make  no sense lead to contempt for authority and ALL rules. So I go to my boat - OK so far, and stay until 2200 and drive home. All good. But if I fall asleep on my boat - all alone away from anyone - and drive home at 0600 suddenly I am a Covid Criminal? I would be more than annoyed to do some weird kabuki dance to make poor people feel better about not having boats. It would make vastly more sense to just ban boating, not boating after dinner but before breakfast :rolleyes:

Maryland tried dumb nonsensical shit like this and mainly pissed everyone off. They have not attempted it again. For awhile a canoe was good, a Laser was bad. Sailing was bad unless you were fishing, then it was good. Taking my Boston Whaler to Annapolis by myself not within a mile of anyone was bad if I didn't have fishing gear, but going on a charter fishing trip in close quarters with strangers was fine :unsure::wacko:

KIS, those are some great example of what happens when govts try to make the rules accommodate exceptions.  Each case requires its own exceptions and qualifications, and each one of those exceptions creates its own absurdities and anomalies.  So you end up with a massively complex nest of regulations which confuse anyone who isn't a lawyer, and still have absurdities like the fishing issue.

As you say, much simpler to just say "no boating".

And while I understand your annoyance at a no=boating rule to avoid irritating people who don't have a boat, the bottom line is that the lockdown rules only work if they have overwhelming support. The vast majority of people are non-boaters, and if those non-boaters feel aggrieved about the exemptions and resentfully decide to ignore other restrictions, everyone loses, including the boaters.

When this is over, we boaters will still have our boats, and the non-boaters still won't have boats.  But if the death rates and long covid rates dont come down fast, the distinction will be moot.

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Early in in the COVID mess, when we had restrictions, we were allowed to use our boats as long as we returned them to their home anchorage at night. We were allowed to stay aboard.

Crew was restricted to a household plus one.

That seemed pretty reasonable, given it was early days and people weren’t quite sure how this was going to pan out.

Of course, Tassie has no community COVID now, so we have no restrictions. 

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2 hours ago, olaf hart said:

Early in in the COVID mess, when we had restrictions, we were allowed to use our boats as long as we returned them to their home anchorage at night. We were allowed to stay aboard.

Crew was restricted to a household plus one.

That seemed pretty reasonable, given it was early days and people weren’t quite sure how this was going to pan out.

Of course, Tassie has no community COVID now, so we have no restrictions. 

When I came back from the mainland a few months back I had to self-isolate for 2 weeks. No problems there. I asked one of the officials if, seeing as my property ran down to the water and my boat was out the front, it'd be all right to go out to it for maintenance etc. The answer was, as long as I wasn't in contact with anyone else, they couldn't see a problem with that. As they'd already come by, checked that I was home and seen how/where I lived, I'd probably get at most a followup call and just make sure to answer the phone.

That struck me as a sensible application of rules & sense. I didn't go out to the boat but it was nice to know that I could have if necessary.

The home anchorage one was interesting. My boat has 3 home anchorages/registered moorings.

FKT

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Good work on the filter replacement, looks perfectly fine to me. I’m guessing the strong winds we’ve been having over the last few days should certainly stir up some crud and put your filter to the test.

I hope it works out ok for you, Diesel Bug is a royal pain in the arse but it looks like you’re on top of it now so let’s hope all your hard work, aching back, buggered knees and scraped knuckles was worth it !

 

as for sleeping on the boat.... are you nuts ?? It’s bloody freezing out there !!
 

R

 

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37 minutes ago, Applescruffs said:

as for sleeping on the boat.... are you nuts ?? It’s bloody freezing out there !!

Dylan's new boat has a diesel heater for its relatively small cabin, so I reckon he will be nicely snug in his boat.

As the Siberian winds blow snow from the east, Dylan will be waking up to a warm cabin munching his egg banjos in that heated wheelhouse, still in his pyjamas as he looks out on the peace of a winter wonderland estuary.  Nuts?  I reckon the nutters are the rest of us who haven't prepared a similar boating nirvana for when lockdown ends.

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8 hours ago, olaf hart said:

Of course, Tassie has no community COVID now, so we have no restrictions. 

I hadn't been following the course of the pandemic down under, so that comment prompted me to go to Wikipedia for the statistics of the COVID-19 pandemic in Australia.

Wow!  Near-zero new cases. That's almost a perfect contrast to the massive spikes we have in Ireland, the UK, and the USA.  Well done Oz!

A friend in Dublin had to go to A&E this week with a bone fracture.  Cases like hers were now directed to a side entrance, as the main entrance had been dedicated to covid cases.  There was a stash of covid ambulances queued up, three of them unloading at a time, as the poor divils were rushed in to get oxygen.

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12 hours ago, ride2live said:

People have to make rules to try to deal with this. Some of them will be stupid because well they are made up by people. But if two homes or a boat are elitist because some don't have them, is even one home elitist because some people ,way to many, don't even have that? Where does this end?

Not directed at you Dylan, I love your threads and the fact that you share your solutions to problems.

Public policy is a blunt instrument. 

We've seen enough Covid idiots in the US Congress to keep us 'mericans from being judgmental about UK officials breaking the rules.

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10 minutes ago, SemiSalt said:

Public policy is a blunt instrument. 

We've seen enough Covid idiots in the US Congress to keep us 'mericans from being judgmental about UK officials breaking the rules.

Thanks to ignorance from the top, we've been chasing Covid from the start in the US. The vaccine may prove to have been a waste of time. 

1090154336_ScreenShot2021-01-24at8_42_53AM.thumb.png.0c734a34285c907ef7e119cb60ec16e5.png

Here in Lala land, not that much has, or will happen. We are the definition of 'social distancing'. Folks in our area have listened to the evidence and made up their minds.

Unless you're a fool(which thankfully we have few in our county), and go looking for a super spreader event (we have plenty of those around the state), you just grab a mask and go about life as usual.

 

We didn't miss a minute of sailing time. In fact, on the water in my sailing grounds, is even better social distancing. I hardly even touch the mainland spending weeks on the boat, less than 20 miles from my home. 

52548371_GeorgesHeadisland_.thumb.jpg.5db42d6bd62118e859cc0803e1564648.jpg

And so it will go in season 2021. I haven't heard any clue as to when any of us (in our county), outside of the caregivers that truly need it, as to a vaccination date.

 

 

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South Africa recently had a classic example of some people thinking they should be exceptions to covid rules.

The government closed all beaches in the Western Cape over the holidays to prevent the massive crowds that traditionally go to the beaches on Christmas and New Years, plus weekends. Some kitesurfers thought this should not apply to them and went kiting. It does not help that the kiters are all white and rich, while the beach masses are almost all black and poor. So the police rounded up some of the kitesurfers.

 

80799dc0-surfer-level-3-lockdown.jpg

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1 hour ago, Kris Cringle said:

Thanks to ignorance from the top, we've been chasing Covid from the start in the US. The vaccine may prove to have been a waste of time. 

1090154336_ScreenShot2021-01-24at8_42_53AM.thumb.png.0c734a34285c907ef7e119cb60ec16e5.png

Here in Lala land, not that much has, or will happen. We are the definition of 'social distancing'. Folks in our area have listened to the evidence and made up their minds.

Unless you're a fool(which thankfully we have few in our county), and go looking for a super spreader event (we have plenty of those around the state), you just grab a mask and go about life as usual.

 

We didn't miss a minute of sailing time. In fact, on the water in my sailing grounds, is even better social distancing. I hardly even touch the mainland spending weeks on the boat, less than 20 miles from my home. 

52548371_GeorgesHeadisland_.thumb.jpg.5db42d6bd62118e859cc0803e1564648.jpg

And so it will go in season 2021. I haven't heard any clue as to when any of us (in our county), outside of the caregivers that truly need it, as to a vaccination date.

 

 

I think we have at least another 12 months in the US and then after that there are the emerging countries who have been pushed to the back of the vaccine queue.  Sadly certain morans have made a bad situation much worse. 

ACtC-3dMuzPeCbWxrNlP9hmJvBI4cGGHwQr-QQQM

With sensible precautions we had a great season last year and I have my mooring for next season.

Here is some contrasting cruising styles. Cut me some slack on the main halyard tension, I hadn't put together my cunninham. I did that at the next anchorage. 

ACtC-3deHG5nDu_F7ydkI6HK0xB2i5iXnkcoJHJC

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2 hours ago, Kris Cringle said:

The vaccine may prove to have been a waste of time. 

I disagree with this statement. Studies are indicating that the vaccine will protect against several strains and for a longer period whereas natural immunity tends to protect only against one strain and for a more limited time.

"Experts" have been saying since the beginning that this could be a recurring virus like the flu so a vaccine is good for stopping recurrences as well.

I'll gladly take the vaccine. What I don't like, is politicians making unguided decisions such as delaying the booster shot in the name of increasing initial doses or mixing vaccines "a la" Moderna for the first shot and Astra-Zeneca for the booster.  I want my vaccine administered in the manner in which it was tested and as the manufacturer recommends, not what is most expedient for politicians' images.

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5 minutes ago, Ajax said:

I disagree with this statement. Studies are indicating that the vaccine will protect against several strains and for a longer period whereas natural immunity tends to protect only against one strain and for a more limited time.

"Experts" have been saying since the beginning that this could be a recurring virus like the flu so a vaccine is good for stopping recurrences as well.

I'll gladly take the vaccine. What I don't like, is politicians making unguided decisions such as delaying the booster shot in the name of increasing initial doses or mixing vaccines "a la" Moderna for the first shot and Astra-Zeneca for the booster.  I want my vaccine administered in the manner in which it was tested and as the manufacturer recommends, not what is most expedient for politicians' images.

Hopefully things will settle down, there was a lot of "we have plenty more on the way so give it all out" and then "well we kinda don't actually have that much, my bad, sorry :rolleyes:"

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6 minutes ago, Ajax said:

I disagree with this statement. Studies are indicating that the vaccine will protect against several strains and for a longer period whereas natural immunity tends to protect only against one strain and for a more limited time.

"Experts" have been saying since the beginning that this could be a recurring virus like the flu so a vaccine is good for stopping recurrences as well.

I'll gladly take the vaccine. What I don't like, is politicians making unguided decisions such as delaying the booster shot in the name of increasing initial doses or mixing vaccines "a la" Moderna for the first shot and Astra-Zeneca for the booster.  I want my vaccine administered in the manner in which it was tested and as the manufacturer recommends, not what is most expedient for politicians' images.

I think there's a reasonable discussion to be had over whether it's better to give the first dose to twice as many people and give each ~75% protection versus doubling the time it takes to give everyone the standard two-dose regimen.

I also don't like to paint politicians with a broad brush or put "experts" in quotes either. There are many, many politicians and experts in government who are trying to do what's best for the country as a whole in good faith, some noteable exceptions notwithstanding. 

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Sure, it's a reasonable discussion to be had.  Have the pharma companies perform some tests and get back to me. I won't do it on the say-so of a non-expert politician.

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12 minutes ago, Ajax said:

Sure, it's a reasonable discussion to be had.  Have the pharma companies perform some tests and get back to me. I won't do it on the say-so of a non-expert politician.

Figures I've seen recently: the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines have been trialed on ~ 400,000 people. They went far out of their way to include a wide variety of variations in people. The testing really has not been short-changed.

The problems in distribution were unconscionable... but let's not get into the politics other than to say that we're PAYing for competent gov't and we should expect our leaders to produce it or get replaced. That's supposed to be the underlying strength of democracy as a system.

FB- Doug

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47 minutes ago, Elegua said:

If only they had a vaccine for diesel bug. 

There is one. I put BioBor in my diesel car, many a diesel boat, and kerosene fueled airplanes. It actually is very much like a vaccine, it stops you from getting sick. It will not cure you once you have the illness, dead bugs still clog everything up.

Here is something from the airport that was kind of useful:

https://www.biobor.com/products/hum-bug-kit/

 

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1 hour ago, Steam Flyer said:

Figures I've seen recently: the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines have been trialed on ~ 400,000 people. They went far out of their way to include a wide variety of variations in people. The testing really has not been short-changed.

The problems in distribution were unconscionable... but let's not get into the politics other than to say that we're PAYing for competent gov't and we should expect our leaders to produce it or get replaced. That's supposed to be the underlying strength of democracy as a system.

FB- Doug

No one that I know of tested mixing and matching between the companies, I too will stick to the way it was designed to be used.

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2 hours ago, Ajax said:

I disagree with this statement. Studies are indicating that the vaccine will protect against several strains and for a longer period whereas natural immunity tends to protect only against one strain and for a more limited time.

"Experts" have been saying since the beginning that this could be a recurring virus like the flu so a vaccine is good for stopping recurrences as well.

I'll gladly take the vaccine. What I don't like, is politicians making unguided decisions such as delaying the booster shot in the name of increasing initial doses or mixing vaccines "a la" Moderna for the first shot and Astra-Zeneca for the booster.  I want my vaccine administered in the manner in which it was tested and as the manufacturer recommends, not what is most expedient for politicians' images.

There's no disputing the effectiveness of the vaccine (unless you don't believe in science), the point is that without basic prevention - and lifting those measures too early - you'll do nothing to stop the pandemics oncoming spike(s), especially to places that insist on living super spreader large.

It's the same old thing, we all wait around and waste precious time as the teacher disciplines the class clown. 

 

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1 hour ago, kent_island_sailor said:

There is one. I put BioBor in my diesel car, many a diesel boat, and kerosene fueled airplanes. It actually is very much like a vaccine, it stops you from getting sick. It will not cure you once you have the illness, dead bugs still clog everything up.

Here is something from the airport that was kind of useful:

https://www.biobor.com/products/hum-bug-kit/

 

Diesel bug seems a more dramatic issue in airplanes than for boats. 

Most problems in boat thankfully seem to resemble this.

 

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1 hour ago, TwoLegged said:

Ah, but they do have a vaccine for diesel bug. It's called electric motor ;) 

At least for me, the electric thread has confirmed my understanding that apart from a few edge cases, not really. Or maybe more accurately, not yet and maybe never. 

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2 hours ago, TwoLegged said:

Ah, but they do have a vaccine for diesel bug. It's called electric motor ;) 

The only times my diesel wouldn't start was due to electrical problems.  So the vaccine would have been a hand starter.

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1 hour ago, slap said:

The only times my diesel wouldn't start was due to electrical problems.  So the vaccine would have been a hand starter.

Ah, but if you weren't so busy changing the engine oil, checking the impeller, polishing the fuel and replacing filters, you'd have had more time to keep your electrics in top shape :

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3 hours ago, kent_island_sailor said:
4 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

Figures I've seen recently: the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines have been trialed on ~ 400,000 people. They went far out of their way to include a wide variety of variations in people. The testing really has not been short-changed.

The problems in distribution were unconscionable... but let's not get into the politics other than to say that we're PAYing for competent gov't and we should expect our leaders to produce it or get replaced. That's supposed to be the underlying strength of democracy as a system.

 

No one that I know of tested mixing and matching between the companies, I too will stick to the way it was designed to be used.

Correct... and I apologize, I was not intending to say that different vaccines from different companies had been testing in combination with each other.

FB- Doug

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7 minutes ago, Applescruffs said:

Isn’t there a dedicated Corona forum for all this? 
 

here’s Dylan sharing his trials and tribulations with Diesel Bug and that seems to be forgotten now. 
 

just saying ...

One of the finest aspects of SA is the epic Fred drift

I think that it is Appropriate for a sailing forum that drifting is all part of the game

D

ps   engine is humming along nicely

I am optimistic that marine 16 has vanquished the beast as I see no crud accumulating in the easy to access filter

From here on in it will be my biocide of choice

Pps

Sadly the gear box is eating oil

it drips into the bilge from an as yet undiscovered location

I am about to strategically deploy the lasagna trays and kitchen roll during my next session of engine bay pilates in the hope that I can find where and when it is escaping

 

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2 hours ago, dylan winter said:

................I am optimistic that marine 16 has vanquished the beast as I see no crud accumulating in the easy to access filter

From here on in it will be my biocide of choice............

 

In the review in PBO's test:

https://www.pbo.co.uk/gear/12-diesel-bug-treatments-tested-43353

The M_16 scored well.   I like the look of the results of some of the other additives that disperse the particles such as Fuel Set.

The old tried and true method in this part of the world was just Methyl Alcohol 1 part per 1000 which got rid of the water in the system quite effectively. Now they use a modified alcohol (Alkoxy Propanols ) that works a little better. 

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Glad to hear that the crud has been out processed. 

How difficult is it to access the gear box? I just replaced mine. It wasn't horrible as far as boat jobs go. It's all about the access.

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6 hours ago, dylan winter said:

One of the finest aspects of SA is the epic Fred drift

I think that it is Appropriate for a sailing forum that drifting is all part of the game

D

ps   engine is humming along nicely

I am optimistic that marine 16 has vanquished the beast as I see no crud accumulating in the easy to access filter

From here on in it will be my biocide of choice

Pps

Sadly the gear box is eating oil

it drips into the bilge from an as yet undiscovered location

I am about to strategically deploy the lasagna trays and kitchen roll during my next session of engine bay pilates in the hope that I can find where and when it is escaping

 

With luck, it'll just be the drain plug gasket, assuming there's a plug and, if so, assuming there's a gasket.

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12 hours ago, dylan winter said:

One of the finest aspects of SA is the epic Fred drift

I think that it is Appropriate for a sailing forum that drifting is all part of the game

D

ps   engine is humming along nicely

I am optimistic that marine 16 has vanquished the beast as I see no crud accumulating in the easy to access filter

From here on in it will be my biocide of choice

Pps

Sadly the gear box is eating oil

it drips into the bilge from an as yet undiscovered location

I am about to strategically deploy the lasagna trays and kitchen roll during my next session of engine bay pilates in the hope that I can find where and when it is escaping

 

Ahh, Dylan....   I remember when I bought my first sailboat with an inboard diesel.  I had finally ‘arrived’ to a true yacht. (All 25’ of her). Of course spending 20-25% of the boat’s (falling) value on a rebuild in the first year dampened my enthusiasm somewhat.  It is what it is.....

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1 hour ago, Veeger said:

Ahh, Dylan....   I remember when I bought my first sailboat with an inboard diesel.  I had finally ‘arrived’ to a true yacht. (All 25’ of her). Of course spending 20-25% of the boat’s (falling) value on a rebuild in the first year dampened my enthusiasm somewhat.  It is what it is.....

You can't count money spent on a boat as anything but totally discretionary income that you have no other use for.

I look at it the same way as I do going out and buying dinner or some decent wine. The pleasure is in the consumption and tomorrow it'll all be gone without trace.

As long as I stay away from the Malaysian place in Moonah and avoid their prawn dish, anyway.

FKT

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16 hours ago, dylan winter said:

it drips into the bilge from an as yet undiscovered location

Input shaft

Output shaft

Case halves (middle bolted connection)

Shift lever

Dipstick at top which is often the fill port.

Naturally it will be the input shaft because that is the bigger pain in the ass. Does your bell housing have a slot where you can see teeth on the flywheel? Are any of them oily with transmission oil?

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16 minutes ago, Zonker said:

Naturally it will be the input shaft because that is the bigger pain in the ass.

Always bet on Murphy because it's most likely to come up. If there are 5 possibilities, it'll be the one most difficult to rectify.

Got a similar issue myself, preparing repair bits/processes for next haulout.

FKT

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17 minutes ago, Zonker said:
17 hours ago, dylan winter said:

it drips into the bilge from an as yet undiscovered location

Input shaft

Output shaft

Case halves (middle bolted connection)

Shift lever

Dipstick at top which is often the fill port.

Naturally it will be the input shaft because that is the bigger pain in the ass. Does your bell housing have a slot where you can see teeth on the flywheel? Are any of them oily with transmission oil?

My favourite: stripped threads on the drain plug. Discovered that all the gearbox oil had leaked into a nice collection of oil-absorbent mats just before weighing anchor in Grace Harbour. Many hours of hilarity ensued. 

 

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On 1/23/2021 at 10:19 PM, dylan winter said:

Disagree

But I am a british socialist

D

Over here in spring, sailing was allowed, but the club and marina areas were shut. All you could legally do was go to a public beach and swim to your docked boat from there. That wasn’t socialism, fairness, or reasonable, that was pure, uncut bureaucratic idiocy. 

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14 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

You can't count money spent on a boat as anything but totally discretionary income that you have no other use for.

I look at it the same way as I do going out and buying dinner or some decent wine. The pleasure is in the consumption and tomorrow it'll all be gone without trace.

As long as I stay away from the Malaysian place in Moonah and avoid their prawn dish, anyway.

FKT

Yes, I’ve always understood that boat money was Monopoly money (only after it came out of my bank account the first time....). My above related experience served primarily as a ‘you knew this but now your really, really KNOW this’ watershed moment.

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7 hours ago, 10thTonner said:

Over here in spring, sailing was allowed, but the club and marina areas were shut. All you could legally do was go to a public beach and swim to your docked boat from there. That wasn’t socialism, fairness, or reasonable, that was pure, uncut bureaucratic idiocy. 

Our club was closed for sailing, but open for "exercise".  Getting a canoe or kayak off the rack and paddling around was fine, but getting a Laser off the rack was not deemed exercise worthy :rolleyes: Not sure why, the Lasers are heavier.

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1 hour ago, kent_island_sailor said:

Our club was closed for sailing, but open for "exercise".  Getting a canoe or kayak off the rack and paddling around was fine, but getting a Laser off the rack was not deemed exercise worthy :rolleyes: Not sure why, the Lasers are heavier.

Isolation mandates should have focused on distance and exposure time rather than regulating specific activities."  Politicians nationwide and at every level bungled this. It caused endless rants of the type above. Well, it's too late now.

I'm just waiting around for my vaccine. I told a Fire/EMS friend of mine that I felt guilty about being eligible for an earlier dose due to my work status. He told me that my dose would go to waste if I held off, so I'll go as soon as I'm eligible.

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Sorry Dylan, this thread drifted off into all kinds of bugs, not just diesel ones. I still would try and get a cheap camera down there, you might be clean or have a big mess that hasn't come unglued yet.

* is this "cheap camera" a USA thing? We seem to be able to get about ANYTHING off Amazon or FleaBay for $20.

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12 minutes ago, Ajax said:

Isolation mandates should have focused on distance and exposure time rather than regulating specific activities."  Politicians nationwide and at every level bungled this. It caused endless rants of the type above. Well, it's too late now.

I'm just waiting around for my vaccine. I told a Fire/EMS friend of mine that I felt guilty about being eligible for an earlier dose due to my work status. He told me that my dose would go to waste if I held off, so I'll go as soon as I'm eligible.

One thing I have done is stay out of the marina head and showers. At first it was to protect the live-aboards that have no other option, and then after seeing their maskless close camaraderie over the summer it was to protect ME. One knock-on effect is my wife insists the next boat will have nice hot water shower, she wants no more part of public accommodations at all.

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4 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

One thing I have done is stay out of the marina head and showers. At first it was to protect the live-aboards that have no other option, and then after seeing their maskless close camaraderie over the summer it was to protect ME. One knock-on effect is my wife insists the next boat will have nice hot water shower, she wants no more part of public accommodations at all.

Don't you have a 35 footer? I thought all the C&C 35's had showers?  I won't lie, I love my hot water shower and if the marina bath house is a mess, I'll chose to shower onboard and just refill the water tank.

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6 minutes ago, Ajax said:

Don't you have a 35 footer? I thought all the C&C 35's had showers?  I won't lie, I love my hot water shower and if the marina bath house is a mess, I'll chose to shower onboard and just refill the water tank.

The "shower" is just a shower nozzle on a hose in the head, it makes a mess and the water heater died decades ago and never got all that hot anyway unless on shore power.

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Given the amount of time I spend trying to keep water from getting down below, I have real difficulty with the idea of using the shower in the head. 

Although we have hot pressure water, we shower in the cockpit Japanese sauna style with a small stool, a dipper and stock pot of hot water.  Weather cloths and a dodger keep the neighbors from going blind.  But then we also like to shower outdoors in Maine until it starts getting cold enough to freeze the pipes and the run-off water.

iPhone endoscopes/borescopes are a life saver. 

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1 hour ago, kent_island_sailor said:

The "shower" is just a shower nozzle on a hose in the head, it makes a mess and the water heater died decades ago and never got all that hot anyway unless on shore power.

Well, the nozzle and hose is what I have. I'm going to attach a clip to the overhead to hold the nozzle during use. My water heater will scald you alive if you're not careful. I have a curtain on a track so the mess isn't too bad.

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My last boat had a nice, separate shower stall with a seat and shower curtain, next to the WC. In the 18 years we had the boat, we might have used the shower twenty times. The combination of a six gallon HW heater and 90 gallons of potable water on board did not really make for long, satisfying showers, so we'd take a marina shower if we could. Also was not a fan of adding to the damp below decks. On my present boat I am planning to install a HW heater, more than anything for doing dishes or having a sploosh in the wash basin. I think a hand shower in the cockpit would probably get more use than one down below...a quick FW rinse after a swim...a proper shower 'au naturel' in an isolated anchorage...

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2 hours ago, Elegua said:

Given the amount of time I spend trying to keep water from getting down below, I have real difficulty with the idea of using the shower in the head. 

Although we have hot pressure water, we shower in the cockpit Japanese sauna style with a small stool, a dipper and stock pot of hot water.  Weather cloths and a dodger keep the neighbors from going blind.  But then we also like to shower outdoors in Maine until it starts getting cold enough to freeze the pipes and the run-off water.

iPhone endoscopes/borescopes are a life saver. 

We have a hot water transom shower. It's great for bathing and hosing down after getting out of the frigid, salty, Puget Sound.

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