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Washington 360 - Something interesting for next summer.


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21 minutes ago, Olyjeff said:

Would like to see a pic of a pedal drive.

What boat would you be racing(drifting) Roleur?

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^ custom pedal drive for R2AK. Worked well and allowed two people to pedal on one unit with one person pedaling forward and the other in reverse. If I was designing a new one I would want to have a simple gear shift mechanism and at least a high gear and a low gear. 5 or 6 speeds would be even better for "motor" sailing.

This is a far more effective solution then rowing for anyone that's not an experienced rower with perfect form. And it has the advantage of keeping your hands free. Even if you are a great rower, you still have to get the gearing right for a sailboat that's going to weigh 10X what a rowing shell weighs.

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I think the route MUST include Spokane and Walla Walla if you're going to call it a 360. Thus a fast tow vehicle and quick loading/unloading from trailer would start to matter more.

Maybe YOU can volunteer next time.

The ideal boat for this thing is definitely of the Swiss lake racer variety. As in ultra-light over-canvassed catamaran.  And sure, a fast monohull might stay in contact with a Farrier trimaran in the

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5 minutes ago, RandyM81 said:

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^ custom pedal drive for R2AK. Worked well and allowed two people to pedal on one unit with one person pedaling forward and the other in reverse. If I was designing a new one I would want to have a simple gear shift mechanism and at least a high gear and a low gear. 5 or 6 speeds would be even better for "motor" sailing.

This is a far more effective solution then rowing for anyone that's not an experienced rower with perfect form. And it has the advantage of keeping your hands free. Even if you are a great rower, you still have to get the gearing right for a sailboat that's going to weigh 10X what a rowing shell weighs.

These things are amazing, but my eyes always glaze over when I read "custom".  My wife and I have both won some hardware in cycling time trials.  We aren't afraid to pedal, but I don't have the time to design a system.

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37 minutes ago, Roleur said:

These things are amazing, but my eyes always glaze over when I read "custom".  My wife and I have both won some hardware in cycling time trials.  We aren't afraid to pedal, but I don't have the time to design a system.

I looked at the time and couldn't find anything off the shelf that I thought would work for my team. Once we got to the starting line it looked like everyone with a decent setup was sporting something custom. This was 5 years ago so maybe today there's something new.

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1 hour ago, Olyjeff said:

Hmm,  Puget Sound in June? 

Not saying the weather is always like this, but Dark Star did the Salish 200, 200nm from PT around the San Juans, down to Tacoma, and back to PT, in June in only 36 hours.  Double that for the distance and the slower going south of Tacoma and you get 3 days.  Cut their boat speed in half and you get 6 days.  

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1 hour ago, Roleur said:

Not saying the weather is always like this, but Dark Star did the Salish 200, 200nm from PT around the San Juans, down to Tacoma, and back to PT, in June in only 36 hours.  Double that for the distance and the slower going south of Tacoma and you get 3 days.  Cut their boat speed in half and you get 6 days.  

Maybe speak to a few of the ex R2AK mono's and see if they have the kit lying around?  There have been a few transom mounted recumbent or traditional bike setups made.   (Ocelot comes to mind).   There are some off the shelf peddle drive units around but this tends to be way outside their design criteria - SeaCycle for example, they have a lot of history but are quite heavy.  

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On 1/2/2021 at 12:44 PM, Amati said:

I keep hearing stories about boats going under that- precise tide timing, weight in the boat, air draft, etc.  One guy made it under by a purported six inches- there’s another story running around that a mast made it underneath but not the Windex.

Boatie sports! :lol:
 

And why is it that every time we go under a bridge it looks like the mast isn’t going to make it?  Even the Narrows Bridge! :blink:

I did a refit on a Marrowstone masthead hit once,  the top of the rig  casting cleared by about an inch, the B&G mount was two inches tall......... 

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10 minutes ago, Thread Killer said:

That thing is horrible. Bad efficiency, lots of wind-up and the cable flops around when you pedal.

Agreed, tried to make it work on the Multi 23, didn’t work. It works just fine for something like a canoe or Kayak. 

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If anyone has leads on a transom or outboard bracket mount pedal drive, send them my way.  I would like to find one rather than go through the full learning curve myself.

I am loving this thread and the new format race for this year.  It is a perfect proving ground for a couple of concepts I want to test out before making a full run to Ketchikan - very low likelyhood of pulling it off this year given the kiddo and pandemic - but a guy can dream right?

Working list of items to trick out the moore 24:

-bowsprit and code zero for light air

-already have the turbo assym setup for downwind - who needs to put a bigger kite on a moore right? :)

-pedal drive

-what do you all think of water ballast?  I can reasonably fit about 25 gallons a side and keep the pipe berths functional - longer discussion on how to get the extra weight we need on the rail and ditch one crewmember.

I don't care about class rules and PHRF ratings - just trying to make the boat go faster.

For the WA360, I am thinking its a 4+ day run on the moore with one or two other crazy people, and at least two or three pit stops along the way.  Probably go cruising class because we could be respectable (and no way we can compete with a fast 40' unless we get lucky in light air, but even then we don't have the crew numbers to pedal indefinitely).

 

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9 hours ago, fargoford said:

what do you all think of water ballast?

Yes. Absolutely. Especially if you don't care about ratings. Some of the fastest all around boats here in the PNW are water ballasted, and for good reason. As you know it's either 1kt... or 20kts. You have to be able to take advantage of both scenarios, which WB does better than any other type of dynamic RM solution. 

I'm currently in the process of fitting a system to my boat. 100gal per side for me. Just keep in mind the cost - You can go cheap, but it's a pain to use and slow, or spend some cash...

I'm right at $2.5 boat bucks for mine. Not sure how doable or logical that may be on a Moore 24 budget though. 

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On 1/5/2021 at 10:20 PM, 40Plus said:

Agreed, tried to make it work on the Multi 23, didn’t work. It works just fine for something like a canoe or Kayak. 

i have been eyeing that one for my lightning. Is it totally unusable? do you still have the one you tried to make work? 

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Lots of crazy pedal drives here: https://gougeon32.blogspot.com/2018/08/pedal-drives-on-2018-r2ak-boats.html

The one on Ptarmigan is my fave and it worked well.

Also, there's a thread on pedal power at Boat Design Forums that's 142 pages long. Might take a while, but there are some nuggets in there.

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On 1/4/2021 at 4:07 PM, Olyjeff said:

Hmmm, Oars on an Ultimate 20???  

 

Thoughts?

We used to do that.  #36. 2 up.  Paddles.   It was peaceful, but slow, took a while to get up to 2-3 knots, but then not too difficult to stay there.  Faster was not worth the effort.  Always thought oars would be pretty much the same.  Where would you put the oarlocks?  Row standing up?  Freeboard is kind of high for oars at least- we needed long paddles.  The kayaker always thought we were cool when we paddled. :)

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Pretty sure that those units were not working so hot at the end. Maybe someone knows more than I do, but pushing a little boat is different than pushing a big one. Seems like I saw a new style of unit advertised in Small Craft Adviser magazine that was designed for bigger boats. Maybe an e-mail to them would produce something. 

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14 minutes ago, Russell Brown said:

Pretty sure that those units were not working so hot at the end. Maybe someone knows more than I do, but pushing a little boat is different than pushing a big one. Seems like I saw a new style of unit advertised in Small Craft Adviser magazine that was designed for bigger boats. Maybe an e-mail to them would produce something. 

Let us know! 

We are currently looking for something off the shelf that sort of works for our little 25ft boat. 

I don't need a titanium spaceship, just need to get off the dock... Preferably for less than 1 boat buck. 

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I am still getting over the $550 entry fee...

It is fun to think about. How about this English Channel Paddle boat with a kite?

 

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3 hours ago, Russell Brown said:

Pretty sure that those units were not working so hot at the end. 

True, but surviving ~75 hrs pedaling (lass's estimate) is not too bad w/ 2 souls per drive.  We pedaled maybe 8-10 hrs on Jungle Kitty and our tandems were falling apart at the end, too.

Though all that speaks to nearly perfect engineering; anything more means too much weight, money, and/or mfg effort, right?!  (That's intended to be self-deprecating humor...)

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31 minutes ago, crashtack said:

Thoughts on the viability of a hobie 16 for this?

Perfectly viable. The boat that is.

Can the crew survive it? Well I hope you like pain. If you do (and I do...) then you could have a blast for very little money.

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1 hour ago, Floating Duck said:

Perfectly viable. The boat that is.

Can the crew survive it? Well I hope you like pain. If you do (and I do...) then you could have a blast for very little money.

didn't someone do the R2ak in a h16?

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4 minutes ago, crashtack said:

didn't someone do the R2ak in a h16?

Either a 16 or 18 can't remember. Had wings on it. 

They were some good looking strong boys. I.e. Still young and invincible.

If you are too, go for it! Especially if you can double trap off wings on the wrong side ("turbo wild thang") for 12-16hrs every day so you can get un-sticky in the lights airs of June. I would love to see that! 

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On 1/4/2021 at 8:06 PM, Roleur said:

Not saying the weather is always like this, but Dark Star did the Salish 200, 200nm from PT around the San Juans, down to Tacoma, and back to PT, in June in only 36 hours.  Double that for the distance and the slower going south of Tacoma and you get 3 days.  Cut their boat speed in half and you get 6 days.  

However, they did the first 100 miles in what? 14 hours or something?

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On 1/4/2021 at 7:15 PM, RandyM81 said:

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^ custom pedal drive for R2AK. Worked well and allowed two people to pedal on one unit with one person pedaling forward and the other in reverse. If I was designing a new one I would want to have a simple gear shift mechanism and at least a high gear and a low gear. 5 or 6 speeds would be even better for "motor" sailing.

This is a far more effective solution then rowing for anyone that's not an experienced rower with perfect form. And it has the advantage of keeping your hands free. Even if you are a great rower, you still have to get the gearing right for a sailboat that's going to weigh 10X what a rowing shell weighs.

In theory, pedaling is a lot more efficient than rowing. I don't think this is true in practice, especially in R2AK conditions. In 2019 we (Narwhal) had two sliding seat rowing stations and two pedal drives. They both propelled the boat to approximately the same speed at approximately the same level of effort. Personally I much preferred the rowing stations because it felt like my whole body was working, not just my legs. However, our pedal drives were "recumbent" which made them great for steering the boat but not so great for knee strain. In the cold drizzly conditions where you're pedaling (whether R2AK or past Vashon in June...), getting your entire body to move and work just felt so much better than sitting still in the cold and spinning your feet for an hour.

I feel like both of our propulsion systems were about as efficient as possible. Both were designed by engineers (not me). Our rowing station designer (and crew) made adjustable outriggers to compensate for different sea states and rower heights, and our pedal drive designer (also crew) used derailleurs, which gave us effectively 3 gears to avoid strain. (He also built a jet-powered bike which we elected not to use for R2AK).

Both systems were still working fine at the end of the race, although if I were going to do it again I would have tried to made the structure that held the pedal drives themselves smaller and lighter. We were not a light boat, for many reasons, and you start to think about what you could have left behind after a couple of hours pedaling or rowing.

 

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What I've always dreamed of is a rowing station, like you find at the gym... Connected to a pedal drive.

Your whole body moves, can be positioned forward for better weight distribution, and you get the efficiency of the prop.

Wet dreams. 

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Laser 2 with Hobie Mirage drive added for auxiliary(hopefully not primary propulsion). Besides the obvious challenge of convincing any buddies to join me in such a foolish sufferfest I cant think of any reasons why this wouldn't be a good race rig for this application. Shoot me down?

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The huge win is peddle sailing. No cost tacking, pinch in the puffs without worrying about speed loss, catch the back eddy, can double your VMG. But you don’t want the drag in good wind. Deployment / retraction time and ease of use are key. You also don’t want to fuck up the flow of air on the sails with yaw from paddling and need to actively trim to the apparent wind shifts. 

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On 1/3/2021 at 7:33 PM, Cirdan said:

I doubt any local 52's got rid of a sail for PHRF reasons ...

Got rid of the sail and removed the track and lived happily ever after.  Massive hit in both PHRF and ORC.  

Absolute killer sail for Puget Sound though.  For a couple of races a year.  

On 1/4/2021 at 9:04 AM, .......................... said:

Correct - that is the primary reason they wont sail. 

12-14 crew actually.  And there is a loophole to exceed 5 for a team " "practicing" without an opposing team" that the Seahawks, Sounders and Mariners are using that the TPs are also reading closely.

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I thought I'd mention that the Northwest (USA) Multihull Association is having its monthly zoom meeting tonight.  We have scheduled WA360 race boss Daniel Evans to speak to us at 7pm Seattle time.  (We start our virtual potluck at 630).  I don't know why but Daniel is only scheduled for 15 minutes.  Usually our speakers spend a couple hours with us with lots of Q&A.  I don't know if much  Q&A will happen as we have another presenter (Tula the couple that got loaned a Corsair 880).   Anyway you are welcome to drop in and see what the Race Boss has to say.  Here is the thread with the zoom meeting link in it.

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  • 1 month later...

It turns out the Race Boss couldn't show up in February as an APB went out that evening for his community members to help search for a lost child.  They found him thankfully.  So Race Boss Daniel Evans is scheduled to talk to us this evening at 7pm Seattle time.  Anyone is welcome to drop in to our Northwest Multihull Zoom meeting.  Again it is just 15 minutes so probably not much chance for Q&A but you never know. 

Here is a link to the meeting announcement with the hookup to the zoom meeting.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I think they are announcing the entries under some cadence that suits them (keeping the social media drip going?).  We signed up early and I know of a number of others who aren't announced....

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My entry was added about 3 days after I paid. More worried that there will not be enough people and then they cancel it. But then, I can get my $550 back and just cruise the islands at my leisure.

a.k.a Team ACE

 

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I'm still on the fence about joining. 

For sure doing R2AK next year, so this could be good practice? But in reality, I've sailed around here in circles many many times as all of the local races and regattas are around these parts...

More importantly, not sure my new to me boat will be in shape to race 3 straight days! Still have to get my pooping bucket all set up. 

Who else is joining?

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On 1/20/2021 at 10:53 AM, wjquigs said:

In theory, pedaling is a lot more efficient than rowing.

Personally I much preferred the rowing stations because it felt like my whole body was working, not just my legs.

Interestingly one of my office mates is an Olympic medalist in rowing, and he said he'd far prefer pedaling for a longer race like this or the R2AK.  

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  • 2 weeks later...

I think they still have a few in their pocket as they are keeping a cadence on the info/marketing but I'm not sure...

 

Definitely less than it was looking like when they first announced it, but more races have opened up when it looked like they'd stay shut down so I'm not surprised!

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  • 5 weeks later...

So who are we picking for the winners? I haven't looked closely at the course but it seems more protected and potentially less windy. Does that shift the balance towards boats that row better?

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The Farr 40 (TEAM OLD SALTS) might be the fastest entry for the light winds of the summer. Although like in the R2AK, the fastest boat rarely wins.

However my money is on the custom designed cat, the 26ft Turn Point Design if the double handed team can push hard and keep it together. With that narrow beam it doesn't need much to fly a hull, but the limiting factor may be their shorthanded-ness.

Interested to see how the Tris do, but I wouldn't hold my breath except for maybe the C31. 

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Looking to sell these pedal drives I bought for R2AK 2020.  I am not looking to make any money, just sell them for what I paid $450 obo.  They are from a previous teams boat from 2018 or 2019 (I cant remember the name).  The original builder works at a machine shop and spent $5k making these things.  Extremely well built and all stainless and aluminum, sealed gears with oil.  The prop can be rotated all the way around just by loosening 4 bolts.  I hate to sell them, but just not going to be able to participate in R2AK anytime soon and these are taking up a lot of room in my small house.  They were originally built to span the middle of a catamaran and drop down with a quick turn of the levers.  With a bit of metal work they could be mounted to just about anything.  We had planned on putting them on the back of a monohull.  Hope this post is ok everyone, theres not anywhere to sell these easily.

20210522_140904.jpg

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  • 2 weeks later...

Low wind the first 12 hours.  Perfect human powered conditions.  A sculler is in the lead, a kayaker and a cat rower are nearby.  Farrier Tris are threatening.  Someone is lost in Hood Canal.  Get over to the tracker page

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3 hours ago, jdazey said:

Turn Point Design retired? No movement on tracker and well back.

Unfortunately yes - we had issues with the new mast that weren’t resolvable during the race.

 

Bummed to drop out after so much work, but such a fun series of races, racers and organizers!

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Too bad Nige.

This tracker seems different and more awkward than previous r2ak trackers, or I'm older and even more stupid.  Only 6 boats have rounded the Olympia buoy:  It appears that those Bend boys are crushing it off Restoration Point on Bainbridge Is.  Miles ahead of #2 Wave forager a single scull who's been deservedly resting at Southworth for several hours.  Then #3 tandem kayak, Boogie Barge, half way up Vashon Is.  Next, off Boston Harbor is the first real boat in #4 place, Trickster the F28R.  They're local racers out of Olympia so a little local knowledge involved.  Close to Trickster is #5, Pacific Boys.  #6 is F31R Broderna just about to round the Olympia buoy.  Many boats are knotted up near Olympia still south bound.  The whole race has been slower wind than a typical June, IMHO.  Must be frustrating for all those sailors.  Doesn't look any better for the next couple days.  Given a southerly blow like on Friday the rag boats would catch up to the kayaks in a matter of hours.  Paddlers are looking good for this year.  But it ain't over.

Does anyone have a list of web cams that we might be able to see competitors in real time.   The was kind of fun for R2ak.  There were a number of them for that race, including near the finish. 

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I don't remember any portage out of Hood Canal so I looked on google earth.  It doesn't look likely.  Maybe wheels on a kayak, jogging along hiway 3 for a few miles......  Or renting a packer's horse and buggy, (non motorized and available to anyone.  Does that make it "legal"?)

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2 hours ago, eric1207 said:

I don't remember any portage out of Hood Canal so I looked on google earth.  It doesn't look likely.  Maybe wheels on a kayak, jogging along hiway 3 for a few miles......  Or renting a packer's horse and buggy, (non motorized and available to anyone.  Does that make it "legal"?)

A mere three miles of highway with a couple hundred feet of elevation gain.  Decent rural scenery for most of it, though a fair bit of traffic.  Worth a try, if you're daft enough to take on this race in the first place, and want it to last longer. 

 

791505912_ScreenShot2021-06-08at2_52_50PM.png

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2 hours ago, eric1207 said:

Too bad Nige.

This tracker seems different and more awkward than previous r2ak trackers, or I'm older and even more stupid.  Only 6 boats have rounded the Olympia buoy:  It appears that those Bend boys are crushing it off Restoration Point on Bainbridge Is.  Miles ahead of #2 Wave forager a single scull who's been deservedly resting at Southworth for several hours.  Then #3 tandem kayak, Boogie Barge, half way up Vashon Is.  Next, off Boston Harbor is the first real boat in #4 place, Trickster the F28R.  They're local racers out of Olympia so a little local knowledge involved.  Close to Trickster is #5, Pacific Boys.  #6 is F31R Broderna just about to round the Olympia buoy.  Many boats are knotted up near Olympia still south bound.  The whole race has been slower wind than a typical June, IMHO.  Must be frustrating for all those sailors.  Doesn't look any better for the next couple days.  Given a southerly blow like on Friday the rag boats would catch up to the kayaks in a matter of hours.  Paddlers are looking good for this year.  But it ain't over.

Does anyone have a list of web cams that we might be able to see competitors in real time.   The was kind of fun for R2ak.  There were a number of them for that race, including near the finish. 

Ruf Duck in "action" off Seattle.

1033503850_RufDuckWA3604.thumb.jpg.9856894dac513c2012799fbefa8813cd.jpg

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Wow, looks like a whole lot of nothing coming on the wind front. Is this going to be an overall win for a Kayak? That would be amazing!

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Very light and spotty zephers all afternoon & on into dusk at Shilshole today.  A couple light thunder showers passed by before dark so a bit of wind here and there.  At 1030 pm the 2 double kayaks are still ahead near Mukilteo, amazing.  Broderna at Edmonds is leading the real boats, next is Trickster near Port Madison.  Early leader Wave Forager is till at Southworth but tracker is hours behind.   Will be interesting to see where they all are in the morning.

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The "Boogie Barge" (at the front with the double kayak) is a 3-person pedal powered catamaran. it's rough as guts but with nicely designed (long) hulls with a tandem bike frame mounted on in the middle. One of the three can sleep and rest. this is the beginning of day 3 and two human powered boats are in the lead. 

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A little compression of the fleet last night.  Russ, it looks like the Bend boys are ahead now, half way up the Swinomish slough.  Boogie cat looks about to go under the bridge and enter the slough.  F31R Broderna behind several miles by Oak Harbor and F28R Trickster a mile or so behind them off the north side of Camano Is.   Then the Girls another mile or so behind with a bunch of monohulls and 2 Farrier tris (Ruf Duck F9 & the Lk Pend Oreille F27) strung along Saratoga Passage.   I'd say Its still up for grabs if the wind comes up in the right places and the Deception Pass tides line up, but the paddle boats are looking good awesome.

Uff Da!   I just checked the Deception Pass tides:  Low at 10:12 (-1.2 )and High at 18:27 (+7.6).  I don't think Broderna can make that as the boat speeds are in the 3 knot range.  The large Skagit river mouth must affect the local water flow too.  I'm too lazy to find my old current atlas and too dumb to do that on a phone nav app.  I don't know how the tide flows in the Swinomish but I'm sure its tricky (its not fast, but which way and when I image is the tricky part).  Whatever, peddling a big boat thru that won't be fun.  Its narrow with some occasional big boat traffic.  This makes the two paddler's lead look pretty solid.  Wind will be the only hope to catch them and that doesn't look good.

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Did Bend racing take a very smart shortcut, or break the rules? The rules say "pass within 1nm of Goat Island." Most sailors would naturally take this to mean rounding it like a mark, but this isnt a sailboat race.  

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1 minute ago, Mizzmo said:

pass within 1nm of Goat Island

This wording very clearly avoids specifying a side so they are in the clear. Obviously that option isn't available to any craft you can't carry over a breakwater/jetty but that's the beauty of this type of race: do it if you can!

 

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Anyone know the story on early leader Wave Forager/  His tracker is stuck at Southworth 16 hours ago.  Did he break the scull and pull out there or is he in dark mode, scurrying along the shore leading the pack?   Nah, I don't see how a single handed boat can compete with crewed ones.  OTOH you could not get a better multiday weather window than this week for him.  

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34 minutes ago, Mizzmo said:

Did Bend racing take a very smart shortcut, or break the rules? The rules say "pass within 1nm of Goat Island." Most sailors would naturally take this to mean rounding it like a mark, but this isnt a sailboat race.  

No, they made it clear in the skippers meeting it means exactly that, you don’t need to round it….

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Looks like everyone is parking up on the hip of Whidbey Is, Polnell Point?.  Tide is starting to push them back I suppose.  No wind on the app I have.  Anchor fest time for the sailors or hunt the eddies to creep up to Deception Pass entrance for the the next tide gate?

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55 minutes ago, Airwick said:

that option isn't available to any craft you can't carry over a breakwater/jetty

Google earth shows a gap in the jetty near its east end.  They label it "Hole in the Wall".  Certainly could portage easily there.  Maybe its floatable in a low draft boat at high tide which was 230 am last night.  You'd have to navigate thru the sand flats to that "hole" at highish tide too.  Cunning people them. 

 Someone did something similar in an early r2ak amongst some islands half way to AK.   IIRC they dragged an Fboat thru a longish rocky narrow winding channel for a short cut.

 

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1 hour ago, eric1207 said:

A little compression of the fleet last night.  Russ, it looks like the Bend boys are ahead now, half way up the Swinomish slough.  Boogie cat looks about to go under the bridge and enter the slough.  F31R Broderna behind several miles by Oak Harbor and F28R Trickster a mile or so behind them off the north side of Camano Is.   Then the Girls another mile or so behind with a bunch of monohulls and 2 Farrier tris (Ruf Duck F9 & the Lk Pend Oreille F27) strung along Saratoga Passage.   I'd say Its still up for grabs if the wind comes up in the right places and the Deception Pass tides line up, but the paddle boats are looking good awesome.

Uff Da!   I just checked the Deception Pass tides:  Low at 10:12 (-1.2 )and High at 18:27 (+7.6).  I don't think Broderna can make that as the boat speeds are in the 3 knot range.  The large Skagit river mouth must affect the local water flow too.  I'm too lazy to find my old current atlas and too dumb to do that on a phone nav app.  I don't know how the tide flows in the Swinomish but I'm sure its tricky (its not fast, but which way and when I image is the tricky part).  Whatever, peddling a big boat thru that won't be fun.  Its narrow with some occasional big boat traffic.  This makes the two paddler's lead look pretty solid.  Wind will be the only hope to catch them and that doesn't look good.

There are no published current predictions for Swinomish slough. As you noted, the outflow of the skagit river makes it too variable to write predictions.  "These general rules will help you predict slack water and current direction in La Conner:

• Slack water occurs 2.5-4 hours after high or low tide

• The current flows north from 2.5-4 hours before high tide to 2.5-4 hours after high tide

• The current flows south from 2.5-4 hours before low tide to 2.5-4 hours after low tide

The tugboat operators base their estimate on the tide tables. Slack water at La Conner Landing occurs between 2.5 and 4 hours after high or low water. For example, if High Water at La Conner occurs at 5 a.m., slack will be sometime between 7:30 a.m. and 9 a.m. At periods of a minor tide change, the slack will occur closer to 2 hours after the predicted high or low. When there is a large change in tide, the current turns almost 4 hours later."

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10 minutes ago, eric1207 said:

Google earth shows a gap in the jetty near its east end

At first I though they were further W, but you are right they did go through the "hole in wall" according to their track:
image.png.8a82499acbe3bee3cee9972412330088.png

4 minutes ago, eric1207 said:

 Someone did something similar in an early r2ak amongst some islands half way to AK.   IIRC they dragged an Fboat thru a longish rocky narrow winding channel for a short cut.

Yes, at the South end of Lohbrunner Island, N of Bella Bella... I think it was MOB and I think another team as well?
https://www.google.ca/maps/@52.4772835,-128.7574847,5662m/data=!3m1!1e3

image.png.8adce6979cd4a141514ed27e1fa7b544.png

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Baldur,  Noaa gives a tide reading for La Conner.  Is that the reference you are referring too?

Airwick, thanks for pulling up that detail.  My google fu is low.

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3 hours ago, eric1207 said:

Baldur,  Noaa gives a tide reading for La Conner.  Is that the reference you are referring too?

Airwick, thanks for pulling up that detail.  My google fu is low.

Well, some references say apply to the above to the tide at la Conner. One I read this morning said to use the Seattle tides and add 30min to the above numbers.  Whatever, I don't think it matters since it is such a wide spread anyway. I always use la Conner tides with the above corrections and it seems to be doing what I expect when I get there.

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1 hour ago, Airwick said:

No takers for deception pass yet...
Makes sense since it appears to be peak flood (~6kt) now, slack around 4:30!

It looks like two are heading that way and maybe a couple of others.  Looks like they missed the northerly flood up Swinomish.  Hoping to get flushed out then picking up a westerly to scoot up to Bellingham.  But they still have to fight the ebb coming down Rosario.  

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webcam for bellingham bay. the outfall buoy is round about in the middle somewheres.

https://faithlife.com/webcam

Heading out for an afternoon sail shortly, I'll send pics if I see anyone.

 

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Dark horse rounded the Outfall buoy about 730pm. Sorry for the bad pic. $500 phone and my son still can't take a good one. 

received_344500493776093.jpeg

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9 hours ago, Baldur said:

Dark horse rounded the Outfall buoy about 730pm. Sorry for the bad pic. $500 phone and my son still can't take a good one. 

received_344500493776093.jpeg

As I'm sure he'll tell you when you mention it, the pictures will get a lot better when you buy him an $800 phone.

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4 minutes ago, IStream said:

As I'm sure he'll tell you when you mention it, the pictures will get a lot better when you buy him an $800 phone.

He is 36, he buys his own phones.

 

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