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10 minutes ago, Xlot said:

You omitted the link in your OP.

 Attention to detail helps a lot to avoid confusion.

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The report pretty much disgusted me. We already knew that the Crown Prince okayed the killing, the report merely confirms that. Declaring that the US won't penalize the Crown Prince is a Biden act of cowardice. No one should be above the law in outright premeditated murder.

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Is this an example of "telling it like it is"? 

Trump told biographer Bob Woodward of the crown prince, "I saved his ass." Woodward wrote in his book "Rage" that in January 2020, Trump also boasted that "I was able to get Congress to leave him alone. I was able to get them to stop."

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6 minutes ago, Bus Driver said:

Is this an example of "telling it like it is"? 

Trump told biographer Bob Woodward of the crown prince, "I saved his ass." Woodward wrote in his book "Rage" that in January 2020, Trump also boasted that "I was able to get Congress to leave him alone. I was able to get them to stop."

Trump wanted to save his arms deal with the Saudis at all costs. Turning a blind eye to the atrocities in Yemen too.

Face it, if the Turks are OK with a murder in an embassy on their soil, then there's not much we can do. We don't have to hand out cookies though

- DSK

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28 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

Declaring that the US won't penalize the Crown Prince is a Biden act of cowardice. No one should be above the law in outright premeditated murder.

Hadn’t seen that. Don’t know why they bothered to raise the subject again, then

 

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The Saudi culture is Barbaric. In addition to Kashoggi’s murder they’ve kidnapped and disappeared their citizens around the world.  Here in the US when their scumbag citizens rape, assault or otherwise harm Americans they fly them out of the county on private Jets to avoid justice.

My reasonable solution?  Stop further arms sales to the RSA.  Embrace Iran.  End sanctions.  The Persian culture is old and magnificent,  and has made many scientific and cultural contributions to the world.  They are naturally aligned with the West if we only stop meddling with them.

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2 hours ago, Bus Driver said:

Is this an example of "telling it like it is"? 

Trump told biographer Bob Woodward of the crown prince, "I saved his ass." Woodward wrote in his book "Rage" that in January 2020, Trump also boasted that "I was able to get Congress to leave him alone. I was able to get them to stop."

Getting fish to bite the worm with a hook in it resembles a wonderful quality.  The Congress, if they had been taught to suck themselves off, they wouldn't need us.

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46 minutes ago, Fakenews said:

The Saudi culture is Barbaric. In addition to Kashoggi’s murder they’ve kidnapped and disappeared their citizens around the world.  Here in the US when their scumbag citizens rape, assault or otherwise harm Americans they fly them out of the county on private Jets to avoid justice.

My reasonable solution?  Stop further arms sales to the RSA.  Embrace Iran.  End sanctions.  The Persian culture is old and magnificent,  and has made many scientific and cultural contributions to the world.  They are naturally aligned with the West if we only stop meddling with them.

 

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1 hour ago, Xlot said:

Hadn’t seen that. Don’t know why they bothered to raise the subject again, then

 

They raised it because the Intelligence Community was going to release their confidential report. I don't know what equation the administration used to determine this conclusion, but it is one of the worst possible for a new admin.

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How many times must we watch Saudis kill Americans before we take action, or at least stop looking the other way?

we talk a good game about not appeasing dictators but we as a country sure appease the shit out of the Saudis, and one entire party appeases the shit out of their wanna be dictator. 
 

Fuck Saudi Arabia. Cut off all military support and/or sales. Debate severing all ties. 

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1 hour ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

How many times must we watch Saudis kill Americans before we take action, or at least stop looking the other way?

we talk a good game about not appeasing dictators but we as a country sure appease the shit out of the Saudis, and one entire party appeases the shit out of their wanna be dictator. 
 

Fuck Saudi Arabia. Cut off all military support and/or sales. Debate severing all ties. 

Because oil?

Because God says we must support Israel, no matter what?  ... oh wait

- DSK

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16 hours ago, badlatitude said:

No one should be above the law in outright premeditated murder.

So the murder was in Turkey, in  a Saudi embassy, so the US jurisdiction is .... ?

Should they call in a drone strike like they do for other criminals they execute without a trial?   Is that an option do you think?

Should the US continue to show the rest of the world what justice really is?

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2 minutes ago, Dog said:

So what's the Biden administration going to do now that we have this report?

Hey doggy, you lost.

Doggy, the supporter of terrorists who storm the Capital Building in an attempt to overturn an election.

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"will not sanction ..."

Just think about 'Sanction' for a bit.  How the US used that weapon to punish people that don't do what it says anywhere on the planet.  But when other countries dare to do something similar to the US they are branded as criminals.

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1 hour ago, Steam Flyer said:

Because oil?

Because God says we must support Israel, no matter what?  ... oh wait

- DSK

Energy independence would allow us to say FU. Not just oil but not excluding it either. Cultivate our independence. Of course that would not play well with the Best Americans, so the country’s interests can take a back seat. 

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56 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

Energy independence would allow us to say FU. Not just oil but not excluding it either. Cultivate our independence. Of course that would not play well with the Best Americans, so the country’s interests can take a back seat. 

The funny thing to me... well, it would be funny if not for the rank hypocrisy... the Best Americans are touting how we are now supposedly exporting fossil fuels, that we don't need no stinkin' renewable enviro-friendly energy etc etc, and at the same time they are ALSO in favor of pipelines from Canada to bring in fossil fuel.

Hello? Can we have just some tiny resemblance to something consistent, at least... we'll work on rational, later

- DSK

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3 hours ago, Dog said:

"The Biden administration will not sanction Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman over Jamal Khashoggi's murder in 2018 even though a declassified US intelligence assessment explicitly implicated him".

Biden will not sanction MBS over Khashoggi's killing despite US report implicating the Saudi leader (yahoo.com)

The enemy of my enemy is my friend.  Not sanctioning MBS has nothing to do with oil and everything to do with Iran.  

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20 hours ago, badlatitude said:

The report pretty much disgusted me. We already knew that the Crown Prince okayed the killing, the report merely confirms that. Declaring that the US won't penalize the Crown Prince is a Biden act of cowardice. No one should be above the law in outright premeditated murder.

Cowardice or Real Politik?

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20 hours ago, badlatitude said:

The report pretty much disgusted me. We already knew that the Crown Prince okayed the killing, the report merely confirms that. Declaring that the US won't penalize the Crown Prince is a Biden act of cowardice. No one should be above the law in outright premeditated murder.

Also, if that report disgusts you..... I presume that you refuse to buy any chinese made goods AND support the US and the West from completely cutting off china from any and all global trade and be sanctioned to the hilt.  Because the chinese human rights abuses and outright murders make MBS looks like Mary Mother of fucking Jesus! 

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19 hours ago, Fakenews said:

Stop further arms sales to the RSA.  

RSA?  Gaytor, You're even dumber than I gave you credit for.  

Note: R and K are not even close to each other on the keyboard.  

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12 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

Real politik for the world, cowardice for American values.

African-American Please!  I'm not saying you're wrong.  But when has "American values" ever gotten in the way of National Security or global strategery?  We overlook human rights abuses all the time when it serves (or doesn't serve) our interests.  That is one of the truly bipartisan traits we have.  It is one of the things we also share with the vast majority of our allies as well.  Does Manus Island ring any bells?  

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6 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

Also, if that report disgusts you..... I presume that you refuse to buy any chinese made goods AND support the US and the West from completely cutting off china from any and all global trade and be sanctioned to the hilt.  Because the chinese human rights abuses and outright murders make MBS looks like Mary Mother of fucking Jesus! 

I could't care less about China, if Biden want's to start something, it has my approval and support. The legions of my faithful followers don't follow me for advice about China.

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Just now, badlatitude said:

I could't care less about China, if Biden want's to start something, it has my approval and support. The legions of my faithful followers don't follow me for advice about China.

If you could not care less about Jhyna - then why does one saudi reporter bother you so much?

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It's complicated. However the reason behind it is that it is not a great stretch to say that the world's financial (at least our world's) system hinges on the existence of the US/Saudi petrodollar. 

 https://www.investopedia.com/articles/forex/072915/how-petrodollars-affect-us-dollar.asp

This is what made the US dollar the world's currency, and the total scope of the  benefits we reap from this are all but impossible to quantify. Blow this up and what happens to the US now that we have financialized out economy? Impossible to fathom.  

 

 On the OP,  there is nothing in common between Soleimani and Kashoggi. Nothing. 

 

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3 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

He lived and worked in the United States.

So?  I'm sure there are lots of chinese (hundreds if not thousands) who lived and worked in the US that are now dead or in "re-education" camps at the hands of a brutally oppressive regime.  Where are your crocodile tears for them?

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2 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

So?  I'm sure there are lots of chinese (hundreds if not thousands) who lived and worked in the US that are now dead or in "re-education" camps at the hands of a brutally oppressive regime.  Where are your crocodile tears for them?

Asked and answered.

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42 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

RSA?  Gaytor, You're even dumber than I gave you credit for.  

Note: R and K are not even close to each other on the keyboard.  

Was looking at a nice bottle of Riesling from RSA as I was typing.  It was very refreshing..

FN

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4 hours ago, Dog said:

So what's the Biden administration going to do now that we have this report?

Biden knows much more than the intelligence community. Belief me.

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1 hour ago, Burning Man said:

Does Manus Island ring any bells?  

Yes I have heard of Manus.

I have also heard of Guantanamo Bay is it?  Then there was that torture centre in Iraq.  That one too.  The ones we know of.

Then  there is DFG that no one wants to talk about, apparently.

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1 hour ago, Fakenews said:

Was looking at a nice bottle of Riesling from RSA as I was typing.  It was very refreshing..

FN

"Hello?  Yes Greta it did come from the other side of the wold when there are perfectly good wineries much nearer to me and really all I want is the alcohol."

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49 minutes ago, rantro said:

"Hello?  Yes Greta it did come from the other side of the wold when there are perfectly good wineries much nearer to me and really all I want is the alcohol."

Astro, yo ou ingorant slut,  good American Riesling is tough to find.   The best wines of that variety are from Germany and South Africa.  Similarly, I do not source Scotch from Kentucky.

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2 hours ago, Mark K said:

On the OP,  there is nothing in common between Soleimani and Kashoggi. Nothing. 

 

Hmm ... lured to an extrajudicial assassination in a third country ... you’re right, nothing in common

 

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7 hours ago, Dog said:

So what's the Biden administration going to do now that we have this report?

I don't recall your concern regarding The Former Guy's administration and what they did with the report.

In fact, he ran interference for MBS.  "I saved his ass.  I was able to get Congress to leave him alone. I was able to get them to stop."

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I can't decide if I'm more disappointed/disgusted with the Biden administration, or the entire rest of the world.

The USA can't be the only one to cut off relations with SA w/o support from many other countries, but we could step up and lead the effort.

The whole deal repulses me. Trump's non-action at the start, when it could have been dealt with swiftly, and efficiently (If not pretty) was abhorrent. Now Biden's abdication of action is just as bad.

 Why haven't the EU nations, the Chinese, the whole rest of the "civilized" world come down on MBS's head like a ton of bricks?

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22 minutes ago, Mrleft8 said:

I can't decide if I'm more disappointed/disgusted with the Biden administration, or the entire rest of the world.

The USA can't be the only one to cut off relations with SA w/o support from many other countries, but we could step up and lead the effort.

The whole deal repulses me. Trump's non-action at the start, when it could have been dealt with swiftly, and efficiently (If not pretty) was abhorrent. Now Biden's abdication of action is just as bad.

 Why haven't the EU nations, the Chinese, the whole rest of the "civilized" world come down on MBS's head like a ton of bricks?

The Chinese were too busy taking notes.

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38 minutes ago, Mrleft8 said:

 Why haven't the EU nations, the Chinese, the whole rest of the "civilized" world come down on MBS's head like a ton of bricks?

Because no one really cares about 1 reporter in the grand scheme of things when the country you want them to show outrage about is a strategic ally.  They have to posture for their audience at home to "show concern".  But that's as far as it goes.  

I'm sorry if that offends you, but that is the hard truth.  In fact the ONLY reason we do bother to occasionally press china on their human rights abuses is because they are a strategic adversary and competitor of ours and we use it as a stick to poke in their eye.  If either china or ksa was in some shithole region of the world like siberia or west africa with no oil or geographic consequence - no one would give two shits if they cut up one of their own citizens into bite size pieces.  Just saying.

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1 hour ago, Xlot said:

Hmm ... lured to an extrajudicial assassination in a third country ... you’re right, nothing in common

 

 

One was a US citizen, and one was a military General and sworn enemy, what's the connection?  You are comparing Apples to Artichokes....

 

EDIT...  Granted the MO was the same but the individuals and circumstances hardly similar....

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8 minutes ago, billy backstay said:

 

One was a US citizen, and one was a military General and sworn enemy, what's the connection?  You are comparing Apples to Artichokes....

 

Bone saw boy was NOT a US citizen.  

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5 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

Bone saw boy was NOT a US citizen.  

 

Sorry, I guess I misunderstood when he was said to be a "US based reporter"?  Are you saying the incidents are alike??? 

You have probably spent more time in the sandbox, than anyone else here, so I am sincerely interested in your take, on both events?

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32 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

Because no one really cares about 1 reporter in the grand scheme of things when the country you want them to show outrage about is a strategic ally.  They have to posture for their audience at home to "show concern".  But that's as far as it goes.  

I'm sorry if that offends you, but that is the hard truth.  In fact the ONLY reason we do bother to occasionally press china on their human rights abuses is because they are a strategic adversary and competitor of ours and we use it as a stick to poke in their eye.  If either china or ksa was in some shithole region of the world like siberia or west africa with no oil or geographic consequence - no one would give two shits if they cut up one of their own citizens into bite size pieces.  Just saying.

The only fucking thing you are saying is that your sense of morality comes out of a cesspool.  Is that how you breath?

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1 minute ago, billy backstay said:

 

Sorry, I guess I misunderstood when he was said to be a "US based reporter"?  Are you saying the incidents are alike??? 

You have probably spent more time in the sandbox, than anyone else here, so I am sincerely interested in your take, on both events?

I never said the incidents are alike.  You are thinking of someone else.  And I've already said what I think about the khashoggi killing.  It's regrettable, but nothing to throw away decades of strategic chess over.  Besides Boeing and Pratt/Whitney need to eat too.  

As for solifuckimani.  Good riddance to bad trash.  It's a shame we didn't whack him sooner.  I'm hoping the RPA pilot and Sensor Operator are getting High Fives still.  I'm betting they would never pay for another beer in an Army or USMC bar ever again in their life - given the carnage Gen Iranian shitstain caused.  

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38 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

Because no one really cares about 1 reporter in the grand scheme of things when the country you want them to show outrage about is a strategic ally.  They have to posture for their audience at home to "show concern".  But that's as far as it goes.  

I'm sorry if that offends you, but that is the hard truth.  In fact the ONLY reason we do bother to occasionally press china on their human rights abuses is because they are a strategic adversary and competitor of ours and we use it as a stick to poke in their eye.  If either china or ksa was in some shithole region of the world like siberia or west africa with no oil or geographic consequence - no one would give two shits if they cut up one of their own citizens into bite size pieces.  Just saying.

So... The USA can bomb the shit out of Iraq, and claim that "They will pay for it with their oil", but we can't bomb the shit out of SA and have them pay with their oil? (Sure, I know Iraq never paid with their oil, but that was Rumsfeld, Cheney, Bush's claim)

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3 minutes ago, hasher said:

The only fucking thing you are saying is that your sense of morality comes out of a cesspool.  Is that how you breath?

No, sorry.  My sense of morality is well grounded and honed.  However, unlike you and seemingly  so many others here - I am able to disconnect how I "feel" about something and how the real world that exists around us.  My simply pointing out how things really work in the real world does not in any way imply that I agree with or condone it.  It is what it is.  

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2 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

I never said the incidents are alike.  You are thinking of someone else.  And I've already said what I think about the khashoggi killing.  It's regrettable, but nothing to throw away decades of strategic chess over.  Besides Boeing and Pratt/Whitney need to eat too.  

As for solifuckimani.  Good riddance to bad trash.  It's a shame we didn't whack him sooner.  I'm hoping the RPA pilot and Sensor Operator are getting High Fives still.  I'm betting they would never pay for another beer in an Army or USMC bar ever again in their life - given the carnage Gen Iranian shitstain caused.  

I'm quite certain that the same would be said in a Casablanca bar for anyone who blew up Bush 43, or Trump.

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1 minute ago, Burning Man said:

No, sorry.  My sense of morality is well grounded and honed.  However, unlike you and seemingly  so many others here - I am able to disconnect how I "feel" about something and how the real world that exists around us.  My simply pointing out how things really work in the real world does not in any way imply that I agree with or condone it.  It is what it is.  

What a pussy thing to say.

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2 minutes ago, Mrleft8 said:

So... The USA can bomb the shit out of Iraq, and claim that "They will pay for it with their oil", but we can't bomb the shit out of SA and have them pay with their oil? (Sure, I know Iraq never paid with their oil, but that was Rumsfeld, Cheney, Bush's claim)

Oh, I'm sure we could.  Are you saying we should be bombing KSA over khashoggi?  

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1 minute ago, Burning Man said:

No, sorry.  My sense of morality is well grounded and honed.  However, unlike you and seemingly  so many others here - I am able to disconnect how I "feel" about something and how the real world that exists around us.  My simply pointing out how things really work in the real world does not in any way imply that I agree with or condone it.  It is what it is.  

It is what it is.

 

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1 minute ago, Mrleft8 said:

I'm quite certain that the same would be said in a Casablanca bar for anyone who blew up Bush 43, or Trump.

Absolutely.  And don't leave obama out of that list as well.  He was the Drone Killer in chief.  He had far more drone strikes during his watch than shrub or the EPWSNBN did combined.  When GW was in charge, we used to have to sometimes get approval directly from the WH for many strikes.  Obama opened the floodgates on the remote killin'.  And no, I'm not exaggerating.  

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4 minutes ago, Mrleft8 said:
6 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

No, sorry.  My sense of morality is well grounded and honed.  However, unlike you and seemingly  so many others here - I am able to disconnect how I "feel" about something and how the real world that exists around us.  My simply pointing out how things really work in the real world does not in any way imply that I agree with or condone it.  It is what it is.  

What a pussy thing to say.

I'm sorry you do not like the truth.  Feel free to ignore me or scroll on by if my candidness upsets you and hurts your feelings.  It's honestly no skin off my nose. 

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3 hours ago, Xlot said:

Hmm ... lured to an extrajudicial assassination in a third country ... you’re right, nothing in common

 

You're spouting nonsense. Kashoggi was a Saudi citizen and the Iranians didn't lure Soleimani so we could kill him.  

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13 hours ago, Bus Driver said:

I don't recall your concern regarding The Former Guy's administration and what they did with the report.

In fact, he ran interference for MBS.  "I saved his ass.  I was able to get Congress to leave him alone. I was able to get them to stop."

How could I express concern over the administration's response to a report that had not been made public?

I don't see any daylight between the two administrations on this one.

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On 2/27/2021 at 10:13 AM, Fakenews said:

The Saudi culture is Barbaric. In addition to Kashoggi’s murder they’ve kidnapped and disappeared their citizens around the world.  Here in the US when their scumbag citizens rape, assault or otherwise harm Americans they fly them out of the county on private Jets to avoid justice.

My reasonable solution?  Stop further arms sales to the RSA.  Embrace Iran.  End sanctions.  The Persian culture is old and magnificent,  and has made many scientific and cultural contributions to the world.  They are naturally aligned with the West if we only stop meddling with them.

And the emperor has no clothes ducky.

well said.

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18 minutes ago, Dog said:

How could I express concern over the administration's response to a report that had not been made public?

I don't see any daylight between the two administrations on this one.

The report was supposed to have been released back in 2018.  The Former Guy blocked that.  Then, he did his best tom call into question the results of the report - "Maybe he did it, maybe he didn't."  

Quite a bit of daylight there.

For the record, President Biden is dead fucking wrong on his response to the report.

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The USA has been sheltering murderous thugs and dictators since forever. (as long as they are right wing dictators that is)

You've just dodged another 4 year bullet and your new guy has a bunch of home grown right wing thugs to contend with as well as a large portion of the population licking their "failed" MAGA wounds.

Biden cannot move the clock back 70 years. Supporting RW Dictators is what America does. Bullying small "socialist" countries is what it does. All to appease the top end of town and the saps that need to think "America great" means America "armed and eager".

You can start making America great after you make Americans civilised.

 

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5 hours ago, Bus Driver said:

For the record, President Biden is dead fucking wrong on his response to the report.

I don't completely disagree with you.  But things like this are never black & white.  Out of curiosity, what would you have liked him to do instead?  Game this out to the end of whatever "Actions" you want him to take.  

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11 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

The USA has been sheltering murderous thugs and dictators since forever. (as long as they are right wing dictators that is)

You've just dodged another 4 year bullet and your new guy has a bunch of home grown right wing thugs to contend with as well as a large portion of the population licking their "failed" MAGA wounds.

Biden cannot move the clock back 70 years. Supporting RW Dictators is what America does. Bullying small "socialist" countries is what it does. All to appease the top end of town and the saps that need to think "America great" means America "armed and eager".

You can start making America great after you make Americans civilised.

 

Bullshit. We do not support the KSA because they are medieval loons, we support it because they happen to be sitting on the world's largest known reserves of sweet crude. We could soooo completely clean them off that spot but don't. Think about it. Is that what you want us to do in the name of social justice? 

 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-19/australia-remains-vulnerable-to-running-out-of-fuel/11527492

 Looks to me Aussies have no problem with the regime. None of us can imagine our lives without oil. It's a harsh reality. 

 

 All that said, bear in mind we are breaking in a new King there. He's young and rash, he might mature. This adventure in Yemen should have taught him some humility, Bone Saw talked the King into that so he could "make his rep" and assured everyone he could end Yemen in two shakes of a lamb's tail. Well, that lamb had died of old age. Biden yanked US support for that shit, so there's that. The alternatives are not real viable. Bone Saw won't step down. Another harsh reality. 

  

 

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1 hour ago, Shortforbob said:

Was I talking about Saudi?:rolleyes:

Meli, no one here knows WTF you're talking about most days.  

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6 hours ago, Mark K said:

Bullshit. We do not support the KSA because they are medieval loons, we support it because they happen to be sitting on the world's largest known reserves of sweet crude.

I think you are confused. Oil was found. Conveniently medieval loons were already in charge of the place, alleviating the need to install some new ones of our choosing.

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On 2/27/2021 at 3:15 PM, Fakenews said:

Astro, yo ou ingorant slut,  good American Riesling is tough to find.   The best wines of that variety are from Germany and South Africa.  Similarly, I do not source Scotch from Kentucky.

Only two good things will ever come out of Kentucky: Bourbon and news of Mitch McConnell's death.

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On 2/28/2021 at 12:33 PM, Burning Man said:

I don't completely disagree with you.  But things like this are never black & white.  Out of curiosity, what would you have liked him to do instead?  Game this out to the end of whatever "Actions" you want him to take.  

I don't pretend to understand all the forces at play.  I will say I expect the President to keep his fucking word.

From the November 21, 2019 Democratic Debate -

MITCHELL: Mr. Vice President, the CIA has concluded that the leader of Saudi Arabia directed the murder of U.S.-based journalist Jamal Khashoggi. The State Department also says the Saudi government is responsible for executing nonviolent offenders and for torture. President Trump has not punished senior Saudi leaders. Would you?

BIDEN: Yes, and I said it at the time. Khashoggi was, in fact, murdered and dismembered, and I believe on the order of the crown prince. And I would make it very clear we were not going to, in fact, sell more weapons to them, we were going to, in fact, make them pay the price and make them, in fact, the pariah that they are. There's very little social redeeming value of the -- in the present government in Saudi Arabia.

Transcript: The November Democratic debate

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1 hour ago, Bus Driver said:

I don't pretend to understand all the forces at play.  I will say I expect the President to keep his fucking word.

From the November 21, 2019 Democratic Debate -

MITCHELL: Mr. Vice President, the CIA has concluded that the leader of Saudi Arabia directed the murder of U.S.-based journalist Jamal Khashoggi. The State Department also says the Saudi government is responsible for executing nonviolent offenders and for torture. President Trump has not punished senior Saudi leaders. Would you?

BIDEN: Yes, and I said it at the time. Khashoggi was, in fact, murdered and dismembered, and I believe on the order of the crown prince. And I would make it very clear we were not going to, in fact, sell more weapons to them, we were going to, in fact, make them pay the price and make them, in fact, the pariah that they are. There's very little social redeeming value of the -- in the present government in Saudi Arabia.

Transcript: The November Democratic debate

Heard something on NPR (I think it was) that the decision to keep selling weapons to KSA has to do with keeping China from filling that void.  Sounds like we use that excuse in a lot of places.

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4 minutes ago, bridhb said:

Heard something on NPR (I think it was) that the decision to keep selling weapons to KSA has to do with keeping China from filling that void.  Sounds like we use that excuse in a lot of places.

It is good to think that military contractors get to run the show.  What could be better?

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23 minutes ago, hasher said:

It is good to think that military contractors get to run the show.  What could be better?

Phony TV reality show grifters?

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21 minutes ago, Mrleft8 said:

Phony TV reality show grifters?

Some are entertaining but their pyrotechnics are not first class.

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